On 04/04/2017 11:21 AM, Frank wrote:
Got no real Linux experience but when my Vista computer went south a few
years ago my son could not fix it with even a wipe and Vista reinstall
but got it working with Linux. This was on his either net at his home
but we could not get the wifi hooked up to in my home. I need to know
computers for my consulting work but don't want to spend all my time
working on computers. Bad enough dealing with software problems that
have to be worked on.

I'm not trying to sell Linux but it has gotten a lot better. The curve
worked out well for me. Linux got to the point where you didn't have to
screw around with it about the same time that I got thoroughly sick of
screwing around with Linux.

On Tue, 4 Apr 2017 17:17:49 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Tuesday, April 4, 2017 at 1:51:32 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tue, 4 Apr 2017 08:40:29 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

it's that XP is obsolete and over

Only if your needs change significantly.

If by "needs", you mean being able to access many of the common websites
that many people visit today, as opposed to what was in existence 15 years
ago, then the typical desktop user's needs have changed. He did say
desktop as opposed to dedicated PC that he uses to run a couple pieces
of particular software. Also, whatever he's doing, he obviously wants
more performance, that's a change in needs that suggests whatever he's
doing, it isn't doing it well enough today. And like I said before,
IDK of any browser supplier that still supports XP. It seems very odd
to me to be spending money on a new CPU, memory, HD, etc to upgrade an XP
system that you're going to use as a typical desktop PC at this point,
with the lack of a supported browser being a big point.


The thing I notice having Flash turned off and running an old browser
is I see far fewer ads.

The thing I've seen is that more and more websites either won't work
at all, work but then have a problem at some point or just don't work
well with an old browser. You can use Ad Block or similar to block ads.

I have a lot more trouble with ad blockers on web sites than I do
because Firefox won't open them. In fact I have not had that problem
at all.

On 04/04/2017 08:07 PM, wrote:
If younare using it as an industrial controller or just reading
e-mail, XP is fine (Heck, windows98 will do the job) but


If thatsall younare lookinfer thengiv Linux Mintashot.

On Tuesday, April 4, 2017 at 11:03:21 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tue, 4 Apr 2017 17:17:49 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Tuesday, April 4, 2017 at 1:51:32 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tue, 4 Apr 2017 08:40:29 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

it's that XP is obsolete and over

Only if your needs change significantly.

If by "needs", you mean being able to access many of the common websites
that many people visit today, as opposed to what was in existence 15 years
ago, then the typical desktop user's needs have changed. He did say
desktop as opposed to dedicated PC that he uses to run a couple pieces
of particular software. Also, whatever he's doing, he obviously wants
more performance, that's a change in needs that suggests whatever he's
doing, it isn't doing it well enough today. And like I said before,
IDK of any browser supplier that still supports XP. It seems very odd
to me to be spending money on a new CPU, memory, HD, etc to upgrade an XP
system that you're going to use as a typical desktop PC at this point,
with the lack of a supported browser being a big point.


The thing I notice having Flash turned off and running an old browser
is I see far fewer ads.

The thing I've seen is that more and more websites either won't work
at all, work but then have a problem at some point or just don't work
well with an old browser. You can use Ad Block or similar to block ads.

I have a lot more trouble with ad blockers on web sites than I do
because Firefox won't open them. In fact I have not had that problem
at all.

Experience will of course vary depending on what browser you're using.
I use Chrome mostly, with Pale Moon on the spare XP notebook. And with
whatever version of Chrome still worked on XP, I was starting to see
websites where it would not work. My main
point here is that whatever you're using, IDK of any browser that is
still being updated on XP and as we move forward, it seems odd to be
upgrading a system with the intention of running XP as a general purpose,
typical desktop going forward. It's not going to get more compatible,
only less so.

On Wed, 5 Apr 2017 08:25:36 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Tuesday, April 4, 2017 at 11:03:21 PM UTC-4, wrote:

I have a lot more trouble with ad blockers on web sites than I do
because Firefox won't open them. In fact I have not had that problem
at all.

Experience will of course vary depending on what browser you're using.
I use Chrome mostly, with Pale Moon on the spare XP notebook. And with
whatever version of Chrome still worked on XP, I was starting to see
websites where it would not work. My main
point here is that whatever you're using, IDK of any browser that is
still being updated on XP and as we move forward, it seems odd to be
upgrading a system with the intention of running XP as a general purpose,
typical desktop going forward. It's not going to get more compatible,
only less so.

I have not found anything that Firefox would not open but more and
more are rejecting Adblock.
I just loaded XP on an i5 laptop that came without any COA for 7 (the
system it was sold with). It is working OK. One tip, if you do not
load SP3, microsoft will not talk to it. SP2 just says, "cannot
connect". Once you get up on SP3 it flies through and I got 155
updates that night.
They do not seem to be doing the hardware checks either. If you have a
valid number, it goes even if you just used that one yesterday on
another system.
I saw an article that said, analysing internet logons, there are over
100 million XP systems still running out there (7-8% of all PCs). That
does not include imbedded systems and machines that are not on the
internet like all of those industrial applications (ATMs, cash
registers, CnC controllers etc)

On 04/04/2017 07:02 PM, Oren wrote:

[snip]

BTW, I have used 32-bit Linux on a system with 32GB RAM, and it
recognized it all.

IF I understand it, UEFI doesn't need to read the HDD boot sector,
where the BIOS does. I'll know more later :-)


"Boot sector" would be the MBR. I don't know if UEFI always checks that,
even when booting from GPT (which comes after the MBR on disk).


-- Win10, 8GB RAM & 1 TB drive.



--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"The day Microsoft makes something that doesn't suck is probably the day
they start making vacuum cleaners." -- Ernst Jan Plugge

On 04/05/2017 10:25 AM, trader_4 wrote:

[snip]

Experience will of course vary depending on what browser you're using.
I use Chrome mostly, with Pale Moon on the spare XP notebook. And with
whatever version of Chrome still worked on XP, I was starting to see
websites where it would not work. My main
point here is that whatever you're using, IDK of any browser that is
still being updated on XP and as we move forward, it seems odd to be
upgrading a system with the intention of running XP as a general purpose,
typical desktop going forward. It's not going to get more compatible,
only less so.


The current version of Firefox is supported on XP, although it's the
last version to be supported.

FF52 is an "Extended support" version. IIRC, they're providing updates
until fall 2017.

--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"The day Microsoft makes something that doesn't suck is probably the day
they start making vacuum cleaners." -- Ernst Jan Plugge

On Tue, 4 Apr 2017 20:44:50 -0600, rbowman wrote:

On 04/04/2017 11:21 AM, Frank wrote:
Got no real Linux experience but when my Vista computer went south a few
years ago my son could not fix it with even a wipe and Vista reinstall
but got it working with Linux. This was on his either net at his home
but we could not get the wifi hooked up to in my home. I need to know
computers for my consulting work but don't want to spend all my time
working on computers. Bad enough dealing with software problems that
have to be worked on.

I'm not trying to sell Linux but it has gotten a lot better. The curve
worked out well for me. Linux got to the point where you didn't have to
screw around with it about the same time that I got thoroughly sick of
screwing around with Linux.


I tried Red Hat maybe 20 years ago. It lasted a few days until I blew
it off the drive. I'm not interested in learning a new vocabulary
glossary. Tood has pointed to Fedora & its GUI a few times here.
Perhaps things are better. Aw. Can't be true :-)

On Wed, 5 Apr 2017 12:54:56 -0500, Mark Lloyd
wrote:

On 04/04/2017 07:02 PM, Oren wrote:

[snip]

BTW, I have used 32-bit Linux on a system with 32GB RAM, and it
recognized it all.

IF I understand it, UEFI doesn't need to read the HDD boot sector,
where the BIOS does. I'll know more later :-)


"Boot sector" would be the MBR. I don't know if UEFI always checks that,
even when booting from GPT (which comes after the MBR on disk).


-- Win10, 8GB RAM & 1 TB drive.


Unless I read things wrong, UEFI doesn't look for or need the MBR.

On Wed, 05 Apr 2017 12:19:57 -0700, Oren wrote:

On Wed, 5 Apr 2017 12:54:56 -0500, Mark Lloyd
wrote:

On 04/04/2017 07:02 PM, Oren wrote:

[snip]

BTW, I have used 32-bit Linux on a system with 32GB RAM, and it
recognized it all.

IF I understand it, UEFI doesn't need to read the HDD boot sector,
where the BIOS does. I'll know more later :-)


"Boot sector" would be the MBR. I don't know if UEFI always checks that,
even when booting from GPT (which comes after the MBR on disk).


-- Win10, 8GB RAM & 1 TB drive.


Unless I read things wrong, UEFI doesn't look for or need the MBR.
No MBR on a GPT disk, for sure.

On 04/05/2017 03:05 PM, wrote:

[snip]

Unless I read things wrong, UEFI doesn't look for or need the MBR.
No MBR on a GPT disk, for sure.


There IS a MBR. If nothing else, it has one unknown partition for the
whole drive (up to 2TB) to protect against old utilities. I don't know
if UEFI ever checks this unless you try to do a "legacy boot". This
would fail if only the protective partition is listed.

--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"The day Microsoft makes something that doesn't suck is probably the day
they start making vacuum cleaners." -- Ernst Jan Plugge

On Wed, 5 Apr 2017 16:13:44 -0500, Mark Lloyd
wrote:

On 04/05/2017 03:05 PM, wrote:

[snip]

Unless I read things wrong, UEFI doesn't look for or need the MBR.
No MBR on a GPT disk, for sure.


There IS a MBR. If nothing else, it has one unknown partition for the
whole drive (up to 2TB) to protect against old utilities. I don't know
if UEFI ever checks this unless you try to do a "legacy boot". This
would fail if only the protective partition is listed.

GPT drives tend to include a “protective MBR.” This type of MBR says
that the GPT drive has a single partition that extends across the
entire drive. If you try to manage a GPT disk with an old tool that
can only read MBRs, it will see a single partition that extends across
the entire drive. This protective MBR ensures the old tools won’t
mistake the GPT drive for an unpartitioned drive and overwrite its GPT
data with a new MBR. In other words, the protective MBR protects the
GPT data from being overwritten.

Note it says "tend to have" - it is not required and some OEM
installs do not have an MBR - if the drive is installed in a non-uefi
machine, the drive IS seen as unformatted..

Been there, wore out the Tee Shirt.

Frank "frank news Apr 2017 17:21:10 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

Got no real Linux experience but when my Vista computer went south
a few years ago my son could not fix it with even a wipe and Vista
reinstall but got it working with Linux. This was on his either
net at his home but we could not get the wifi hooked up to in my
home. I need to know computers for my consulting work but don't
want to spend all my time working on computers. Bad enough
dealing with software problems that have to be worked on.

Hmm. Sounds like it may have been a driver issue. If it was actually
hardware related, linux should have failed to work as well.

When things slow down, I always up grade memory. Hardest I did on
TRS80 upgrading from 16k to 64k where some diodes had to be
snipped. Now you can buy 4gigs for about the same price and just
snap them in.

I had the coco3. [g] I did purchase the 512k expansion board.
Installed it myself. Wasn't difficult, mind you. The only slight pain
in the ass I remember about the setup was the FD-502 double deck
floppy drive. If you added the secondary drive, you had to snip a
resistor free. Otherwise, it wasn't a bad machine.

My Vista was maxed out and I ended up tossing it.

Pending no serious hardware issues, and a reasonable cpu (you didn't
provide specs, so...), I would have likely repurposed it with another
os for a dedicated task. Say a file server for the local network. Or,
perhaps an audio/video playback machine. Like, a jukebox.




--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

Oren
Tue, 04 Apr 2017
18:02:35 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

I'm planning to pull the HDD from my bride's old Vista PC and make
an external drive. Buy a cable and box for the drive. And use it
to backup her Win10 machine. The drive is still good. Then sell
or donate the PC. So far no complaints from her on Win10. Just
some slight learning her way around. Me too.

So you're both okay with the telemetry and key logging it performs?
You can turn some of it off, but, not all. And, at any time, a
'windows update' may reset the settings back to default. IE: spyware
functions restored. You may want to take a closer look
at the service agreement you accepted as part of the installation
process.

http://www.networkworld.com/article/...agreement.html

And then you have seperate issues with the new 'edge' browser.

http://blog.trendmicro.com/trendlabs...lso-new-risks/

https://www.howtogeek.com/269331/how...n-advertising/

Do you really like the idea of advertising built into your OS? Free
upgrade or paid edition makes no difference...I personally think we
deal with enough advertising in our faces just by surfing the web.

I've been using Linux Mint locally for nearly a year now and it
hasn't foist a single piece of advertising on me yet. Most of the
computers on my network now run Linux in one flavor or another. I'm
about to build another box for file serving needs of the network.
I may run Cent7 for that one.

I also have various flavers (versions) of Windows running in VM so
that I can continue providing tech support without actually having
to purpose a specific machine for the task. I'm not trying to
convert you or anyone else though, Despite the stabiliy offered with
Linux Mint that has ben missing from MS offers for years.



You don't need to go thru all that hassle to use the drive
externally. I have several USB based drive connection kits that
allow me to take IDE and sata as well as the laptop interface
version of the same and turn the drive into an external. They come
in quite handy for diagnostics and repair outside of the machine,
itself. Especially useful for malware and data recovery. Without the
host OS being operational to try and thwart my efforts, depending on
the malware in question.



--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

rbowman
Wed, 05 Apr 2017 02:44:50 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On 04/04/2017 11:21 AM, Frank wrote:
Got no real Linux experience but when my Vista computer went
south a few years ago my son could not fix it with even a wipe
and Vista reinstall but got it working with Linux. This was on
his either net at his home but we could not get the wifi hooked
up to in my home. I need to know computers for my consulting
work but don't want to spend all my time working on computers.
Bad enough dealing with software problems that have to be worked
on.

I'm not trying to sell Linux but it has gotten a lot better. The
curve worked out well for me. Linux got to the point where you
didn't have to screw around with it about the same time that I got
thoroughly sick of screwing around with Linux.

Some years ago, I had a local box running an older copy of Redhat. It
required some knowledge to get it to do much of anything a typical
Windows user would want to do.

Things have improved greatly when comparing Linux Mint 17.3 to that
experience. Nearly everything just worked, right out of the box. I had
to tweak samba a bit and add additional firewall rules to ensure only
some computers on the LAN could access my shares, but, otherwise, it's
been a pleasant experience.


--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

Oren
Wed, 05 Apr 2017
19:07:19 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Tue, 4 Apr 2017 20:44:50 -0600, rbowman
wrote:

On 04/04/2017 11:21 AM, Frank wrote:
Got no real Linux experience but when my Vista computer went
south a few years ago my son could not fix it with even a wipe
and Vista reinstall but got it working with Linux. This was on
his either net at his home but we could not get the wifi hooked
up to in my home. I need to know computers for my consulting
work but don't want to spend all my time working on computers.
Bad enough dealing with software problems that have to be worked
on.

I'm not trying to sell Linux but it has gotten a lot better. The
curve worked out well for me. Linux got to the point where you
didn't have to screw around with it about the same time that I got
thoroughly sick of screwing around with Linux.


I tried Red Hat maybe 20 years ago. It lasted a few days until I
blew it off the drive. I'm not interested in learning a new
vocabulary glossary. Tood has pointed to Fedora & its GUI a few
times here. Perhaps things are better. Aw. Can't be true :-)

If you're basing your opinion on Linux from a distro 20 years ago,
things have improved considerbly! I've downloaded the lastest Fedora
ISO to play with, when I have the time. But, I doubt I'll switch
over, unless Linux Mint 18 as it matures doesn't do what I want it to
do. for starters, theres no full codec already available version to
download; they have to be installed afterwards, online. That's a bit
of a turn off, and I'm hoping they go back to the way 17.3 is with
that; you had the choice to download an iso without them or one with
them.



--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

Tue,
04 Apr 2017 17:50:55 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Tue, 4 Apr 2017 08:40:29 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

it's that XP is obsolete and over

Only if your needs change significantly.
The thing I notice having Flash turned off and running an old browser
is I see far fewer ads. I just see "advertisement" and a blank space.
99,9% of the content I am looking for still comes through just fine.
It seems a lot of programmers just want to use every bell and whistle
in the new OS without actually making the content any better. Most of
the stuff I am looking for could be presented in flat text with a few
pictures and *maybe* an AVI file.


I'm loathe to call the majority programmers when script kiddie is a
more appropriate term.


--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

rbowman
Wed, 05 Apr 2017 02:16:52 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On 04/04/2017 10:06 AM, Diesel wrote:
You're only delaying the inevitable going to Windows 7 from XP.

Support lifecycle

http://www.techrepublic.com/article/...nesses-still-r
unning-windows-xp-despite-support-ending-in-2014/

I'm running one XP box at work. It runs just as well as it did 10
years ago so I have no burning need to upgrade it. The
applications I build on it run on 7 and 10. They probably run on
Vista and 8 too but we don't have any of those pigs around to
test.

I have one XP box here. The only box that still runs Windows native.
It's a dual cpu p3. When it finally dies, and, it will; the replacement
machine will be native linux with various flavors of Windows in VM for
tech support/program testing purposes. Windows has turned into a
spyware pile of **** that only seems to be getting worse. I'm not going
to keep playing that game for a daily OS.


--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

trader_4
Tue, 04
Apr 2017 15:34:34 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

IDK of any browser company that is still doing updates of any
browsers for XP.

You must not know much about the subject, then. Firefox will still
support XP until 2017. And firefox isn't exactly a 'niche' browser.


And each month, what's left gets further and
further away from working with websites that are updated. I have
an old notebook that I keep as a spare, it has XP on it and I put
Pale Moon on it, that was the last one I know of that was still
supported and they ended support for it last year too.

Can you cite any SPECIFIC websites that I could test with? I surf a
lot of different technical sites primarily and some news sites.. they
all still work. And, I'm not even running v52 series firefox on this
machine. It's using 45.8.0ESR

You may have to go to win 10 to get programs that will work at
speed. One reason I put a computer on win 10 is because Turbo
Tax said they would not support win xp after last year.


Another example.

Not exactly a worthy reason to change out the entire OS. Not when
other options exist, anyhow.

Like others have said, before buying a new CPU, memory, etc, I'd
look at what a used PC goes for on Ebay. He also said he was
going to update the BIOS. Unless I was having a problem or needed
to do it for some particular reason, I would not screw with that
either. IMO, it's very unlikely to make a performance difference.

I dunno about going the ebay route. I picked up a used dual core p4
with 1tb sata hd, 2gigs ram, etc. for under 2 bills at a local pc
shop I spent ten years of my life working in. I'd rather support
local.

It came with windows 10. Windows 10 remained on the machine for about
twenty minutes or so. It's running Linux Mint 17.3 KDE just fine now.
Does quite well as a media server for my network.

As for upgrading the BIOS. that's not something you should do unless
you have a real need to do it. If everything is working, the BIOS
shouldn't be ****ed with in that regard. It's like upgrading the
linux kernel just to be upgrading it. Don't! Unless, you've got a
specific reason/need to do so.

--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

Oren
news 16:58:39 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Tue, 4 Apr 2017 08:34:34 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

He also said he was going to update
the BIOS. Unless I was having a problem or needed to do it for
some particular reason, I would not screw with that either. IMO,
it's very unlikely to make a performance difference.

I agree. My Gigabyte mobo ( from 2012) has a dual BIOS. I did
flash one when I put this box together, but left the other with
the factory default. If needed I could boot to the original.

You may want to take a closer look at that board. Or, provide exact
board specs and I'll be happy to check it out for you. Most of the
time, the secondary bios isn't a full fledged one. it has enough code
to boot the machine so you can reflash the primary bios in the event of
a corruption issue. It won't on it's own, function as a complete backup
in the event the primary bios is down.

If it an't broke don't fix it.

So true.




--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

Mark Lloyd
Tue, 04 Apr 2017 19:32:52 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On 04/04/2017 11:06 AM, Diesel wrote:

news 01:10:09 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

As far as UEFI and BIOS, you can't switch between them. I have
not

Umm.. Yes, you can in many cases. Generally speaking, UEFI
capable computers do offer 'legacy mode' Er, what you used to
call the BIOS. [g]


A lot of people may be confusing firmware type (BIOS, UEFI) with
disk structure (MBR, GPT).

Some people here seem to be confusing many things concerning
computers and are providing bad advice, to say the least.

As to another limitation, nearly all modern Intel-compatible CPUs
allow access to 64GB RAM in 32-bit mode. It's 32-bit Windows that
REFUSES to use more than about 3.5GB. I've heard of people fixing
that, but it isn't easy.

Yep, it's more of a tech hack or workaround. It's not easy and it's
not that reliable, either.

BTW, I have used 32-bit Linux on a system with 32GB RAM, and it
recognized it all.

Same.




--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

Mark Lloyd
Wed, 05 Apr 2017 17:54:56 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On 04/04/2017 07:02 PM, Oren wrote:

[snip]

BTW, I have used 32-bit Linux on a system with 32GB RAM, and it
recognized it all.

IF I understand it, UEFI doesn't need to read the HDD boot
sector, where the BIOS does. I'll know more later :-)


"Boot sector" would be the MBR. I don't know if UEFI always checks
that, even when booting from GPT (which comes after the MBR on
disk).

And, as you well know, HDD isn't the only host for a 'boot sector'.
Floppies can have them, as can USB memory sticks.



--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

Mark Lloyd
Wed, 05 Apr 2017 21:13:44 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On 04/05/2017 03:05 PM, wrote:

[snip]

Unless I read things wrong, UEFI doesn't look for or need the
MBR.
No MBR on a GPT disk, for sure.


There IS a MBR. If nothing else, it has one unknown partition for
the whole drive (up to 2TB) to protect against old utilities. I
don't know if UEFI ever checks this unless you try to do a "legacy
boot". This would fail if only the protective partition is listed.

See what I meant Mark? Wannabe IT advice is being offered in this
newsgroup. [g]




--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

Wed, 05 Apr 2017 21:38:33 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Wed, 5 Apr 2017 16:13:44 -0500, Mark Lloyd
wrote:

On 04/05/2017 03:05 PM, wrote:

[snip]

Unless I read things wrong, UEFI doesn't look for or need the
MBR.
No MBR on a GPT disk, for sure.


There IS a MBR. If nothing else, it has one unknown partition for
the whole drive (up to 2TB) to protect against old utilities. I
don't know if UEFI ever checks this unless you try to do a "legacy
boot". This would fail if only the protective partition is listed.

GPT drives tend to include a “protective MBR.” This type of MBR
says that the GPT drive has a single partition that extends across
the entire drive. If you try to manage a GPT disk with an old tool
that can only read MBRs, it will see a single partition that
extends across the entire drive. This protective MBR ensures the
old tools won’t mistake the GPT drive for an unpartitioned drive
and overwrite its GPT data with a new MBR. In other words, the
protective MBR protects the GPT data from being overwritten.

Note it says "tend to have" - it is not required and some OEM
installs do not have an MBR - if the drive is installed in a
non-uefi machine, the drive IS seen as unformatted..

Been there, wore out the Tee Shirt.

So you stated there was no MBR on a GPT formatted disk for what
reason, then?




--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
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rbowman
Wed, 05 Apr 2017 02:41:22 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On 04/04/2017 11:59 AM, wrote:
CE3 an subset of the IBM "E" text editor is very powerful if you
are manipulating text and it runs under XP.

If you can't do it in gVim is isn't worth doing... I think there
still are binaries that would run on an Amiga if you could find an
Amiga that could run.

Don't need an actual Amiga for that, either. Emulation. You may want to
check it out. I'm playing Mike tysons superpunchout on one of my linux
laptops as I write this (I'm between rounds. lol). My linux box
obviously isn't actually an original 8bit Nintendo; which is what this
game was originally developed for, and thinks! it's running on. [g]


--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

On Wed, 5 Apr 2017 08:25:36 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote in


I have a lot more trouble with ad blockers on web sites than I do
because Firefox won't open them. In fact I have not had that problem
at all.

Instead of an adblocker, try using a modified HOSTS file
see http://winhelp2002.mvps.org/hosts.htm for info.
--
Web based forums are like subscribing to 10 different newspapers
and having to visit 10 different news stands to pickup each one.
Email list-server groups and USENET are like having all of those
newspapers delivered to your door every morning.

On 04/06/2017 12:42 AM, Diesel wrote:
Some years ago, I had a local box running an older copy of Redhat. It
required some knowledge to get it to do much of anything a typical
Windows user would want to do.

I haven't used RedHat since in the early 2000's when their release
included a tweaked gcc and Python that broke stuff. If you wanted to
build a kernel you had to get another compiler.

fwiw, I read yesterday that Ubuntu has given up on the Unity desktop and
are going back to Gnome. Their phone/tablet version is also dead.
Shuttlesworth drank the Windows 8 KoolAid but the users weren't buying it.

On 04/06/2017 12:42 AM, Diesel wrote:
Don't need an actual Amiga for that, either. Emulation. You may want to
check it out. I'm playing Mike tysons superpunchout on one of my linux
laptops as I write this (I'm between rounds. lol). My linux box
obviously isn't actually an original 8bit Nintendo; which is what this
game was originally developed for, and thinks! it's running on. [g]

I've run a CP/M emulator but never had an Amiga so I have no interest
there. Apparently CP/M is easier to emulate than Android; that emulator
used to be a real slug.

T wrote:
On 04/02/2017 07:58 PM, Terry Coombs wrote:
I'm still searching for more speed from this desktop , and have
plans to upgrade to a Phenom X4 CPU and go to 64 bit XP Pro . I know
that the processor upgrade and BIOS update won't affect my programs
and all that , but what about the 64 bit upgrade ? Am I going to
have to rebuild this whole set of programs , address books ,
bookmarks , etc ? Not that I don't have all the software , but it's
a pain in the ass and time consuming to do all that .


Hi Terry,

I have never noticed a speed difference between 32 bit and
64 bit Windows. On Linux yes, it blow your head off, but not
crappy old windows. Windows is poorly written.

Also 64 bit XP was really, really badly done. Most
of everything will stop working correctly for you. 64 bit did
not start okay till Vista and came into its own on Windows 7.

If you a speed increase, trying cloning you
hard drive over to an SSD drive. You will be impressed.

:-)

-T

Looks like I've opened a can of worms here ... I have purchased a COA and
disk for 7Pro /64 , which is what the wife's laptop (Lenovo/I5) is running .
The only thing I'll lose with that OS is Outlook Express , which I really
really like . I may move to Outlook if it will run in 7 ... That copy of
XP/64 is probably going in a new build on an Asus N68C-GS4FX motherboard
with a Phenom X4 2.3Ghz . That box will become my media server , the current
media server will either be a backup or I may give it to my grandson .
--
Snag

On Thursday, April 6, 2017 at 1:06:25 AM UTC-4, Diesel wrote:
Oren
Tue, 04 Apr 2017
18:02:35 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

I'm planning to pull the HDD from my bride's old Vista PC and make
an external drive. Buy a cable and box for the drive. And use it
to backup her Win10 machine. The drive is still good. Then sell
or donate the PC. So far no complaints from her on Win10. Just
some slight learning her way around. Me too.

So you're both okay with the telemetry and key logging it performs?
You can turn some of it off, but, not all. And, at any time, a
'windows update' may reset the settings back to default. IE: spyware
functions restored. You may want to take a closer look
at the service agreement you accepted as part of the installation
process.


Whatever they are logging, it's no worse than what goes on with a
smartphone and most of us live with that.



http://www.networkworld.com/article/...agreement.html

And then you have seperate issues with the new 'edge' browser.


You don't have to use the Edge browser, you can use whatever you want.
The Edge browser is half-baked, I use Chrome instead.



http://blog.trendmicro.com/trendlabs...lso-new-risks/

https://www.howtogeek.com/269331/how...n-advertising/

Do you really like the idea of advertising built into your OS?

What advertising? I don't see any more or any less advertising
than I did with Win 7. And what's there comes up in Chrome, not
Win 10.


Free
upgrade or paid edition makes no difference...I personally think we
deal with enough advertising in our faces just by surfing the web.


And that's all I see with Win 10 too.

On Wednesday, April 5, 2017 at 2:00:30 PM UTC-4, Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 04/05/2017 10:25 AM, trader_4 wrote:

[snip]

Experience will of course vary depending on what browser you're using.
I use Chrome mostly, with Pale Moon on the spare XP notebook. And with
whatever version of Chrome still worked on XP, I was starting to see
websites where it would not work. My main
point here is that whatever you're using, IDK of any browser that is
still being updated on XP and as we move forward, it seems odd to be
upgrading a system with the intention of running XP as a general purpose,
typical desktop going forward. It's not going to get more compatible,
only less so.


The current version of Firefox is supported on XP, although it's the
last version to be supported.

FF52 is an "Extended support" version. IIRC, they're providing updates
until fall 2017.

--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/



Depends on your definition of "supported". Firefox says you get
security updates until Sept. And again, this is in the
context of *upgrading* the hardware and/or software on an XP
system with the intention of continuing to run it for the future.


https://support.mozilla.org/t5/Insta...sta/ta-p/31270


Important - Firefox is ending support for Windows XP and Vista

"Why is Firefox support ending for Windows XP and Vista users?
Firefox is one of the only browsers to offer any support for Windows XP and Vista. Microsoft itself ended support for Windows XP in 2014 and will end support for Windows Vista in 2017. Unsupported operating systems receive no security updates, have known exploits, and can be dangerous to use, which makes it difficult to maintain Firefox on those versions.
Firefox security updates for XP and Vista users will continue until September 2017, although new features will not be offered. In mid-2017, a final support end date will be announced based on the number of users still on Windows XP and Vista.

On Thursday, April 6, 2017 at 2:45:58 AM UTC-4, Diesel wrote:
trader_4
Tue, 04
Apr 2017 15:34:34 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

IDK of any browser company that is still doing updates of any
browsers for XP.

You must not know much about the subject, then. Firefox will still
support XP until 2017. And firefox isn't exactly a 'niche' browser.


You must not know much about calendars, it's already 2017.


"Important - Firefox is ending support for Windows XP and Vista

Why is Firefox support ending for Windows XP and Vista users?
Firefox is one of the only browsers to offer any support for Windows XP and Vista. Microsoft itself ended support for Windows XP in 2014 and will end support for Windows Vista in 2017. Unsupported operating systems receive no security updates, have known exploits, and can be dangerous to use, which makes it difficult to maintain Firefox on those versions.
Firefox security updates for XP and Vista users will continue until September 2017, although new features will not be offered. In mid-2017, a final support end date will be announced based on the number of users still on Windows XP and Vista."


I guess if that's reassuring to you, makes you want to invest in
upgrading and running an XP system into the future, be my guest.


And each month, what's left gets further and
further away from working with websites that are updated. I have
an old notebook that I keep as a spare, it has XP on it and I put
Pale Moon on it, that was the last one I know of that was still
supported and they ended support for it last year too.

Can you cite any SPECIFIC websites that I could test with? I surf a
lot of different technical sites primarily and some news sites.. they
all still work. And, I'm not even running v52 series firefox on this
machine. It's using 45.8.0ESR

I was speaking of browsers in general. I've had plenty of experience
with older browsers over the years no longer working with various websites.
I'm running Win 10 and Chrome 99% of the time. I have seen problems with
Chrome on XP on a spare notebook that I use once in awhile. But that
was a year ago, I don't keep a log of which websites it was. But I
switched to Pale Moon on that notebook, because of issues of compatibility and speed.




You may have to go to win 10 to get programs that will work at
speed. One reason I put a computer on win 10 is because Turbo
Tax said they would not support win xp after last year.


Another example.

Not exactly a worthy reason to change out the entire OS. Not when
other options exist, anyhow.


The original context here was *upgrading* a system with a new CPU,
memory, etc with the intention of running XP for the future. That's
a bit different than just changing out the entire OS just to change the
entire OS.

rbowman wrote:
....
I've run a CP/M emulator but never had an Amiga so I have no interest
there. Apparently CP/M is easier to emulate than Android; that emulator
used to be a real slug.

if you need a dos emulator on linux dosemu
has worked for me just fine when i've needed
to run an ancient program (multiplan spreadsheet).

*goes and looks*

just fired it up, still works, but i don't really
need it any more since i moved the spreadsheets
to something more recent.


songbird

Wayne Boatwright wrote:
On Thu 06 Apr 2017 07:26:20a, Terry Coombs told us...


Clearly you are just playing games with all the old crap that you've
accumulated, new "build" or not.

I have no sympathy for folks like you.

And I have no sypmathy for people who put everything on a computer with an
OS that's KNOWN to spy on everything you do . I don't do cloud storage , I'd
like to keep my info MY info instead of putting it out there for anybody
with the skills to hack . I don't have a "smart" TV for the same reasons ...
--
Snag

On Thursday, April 6, 2017 at 11:38:02 AM UTC-4, Wayne Boatwright wrote:
On Thu 06 Apr 2017 08:29:06a, Terry Coombs told us...

Wayne Boatwright wrote:
On Thu 06 Apr 2017 07:26:20a, Terry Coombs told us...


Clearly you are just playing games with all the old crap that
you've accumulated, new "build" or not.

I have no sympathy for folks like you.

And I have no sypmathy for people who put everything on a
computer with an
OS that's KNOWN to spy on everything you do . I don't do cloud
storage , I'd like to keep my info MY info instead of putting it
out there for anybody with the skills to hack . I don't have a
"smart" TV for the same reasons ...

my computer is extremely well protected and I don't do cloud storage,
either. There are numerous way to prevent a computer from sending
ANYTHING back to Microsoft, or any other place. It just takes know-how
and the proper software. Since my first computer in the 1980s I have
never had a virus, or cookies or other software that transmit unwanted
data outside of my machine.

There are many people with computers that are riddled with virus's and
other malware, spyware, etc. I have no pity for them.


He mentions hackers getting into a system. Seems that hackers have
gotten into and can get into just about anything that's connected
to the internet. I doubt his 15 year old XP is any different or
that a Win 10 system with AV software is any more vulnerable.
I mentioned that IDK of any browser that's still supported on XP,
you can probably add antivirus software to the list of things where
less and less companies are supporting it too. I'm sure he'll reply
and say that he has something that's still supported, but the list
is rapidly diminishing.

The privacy issue, I too have turned off the settings available on Win 10
to decrease what MSFT has access to. Wonder if he has a smartphone?
Seems to me that Win 10 is no worse than a smartphone and even on
XP, if you use the typical search engines, etc, that is already sharing
a lot of your info, eg what you're viewing, searching for, etc.

On 2017-04-06, rbowman wrote:

Their phone/tablet version is also dead.

Sorry to hear it. Is any other entity trying to create/push a Linux
cell phone?

nb

On Thu, 6 Apr 2017 09:01:15 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

The privacy issue, I too have turned off the settings available on Win 10
to decrease what MSFT has access to. Wonder if he has a smartphone?
Seems to me that Win 10 is no worse than a smartphone and even on
XP, if you use the typical search engines, etc, that is already sharing
a lot of your info, eg what you're viewing, searching for, etc.

There is no such thing as privacy anymore. Government and corporations
are data miners. Everything about you is already stored somewhere, for
sure. They cow is out of the gate and there is no way to close the
gate.

On 4/6/2017 11:29 AM, Terry Coombs wrote:
Wayne Boatwright wrote:
On Thu 06 Apr 2017 07:26:20a, Terry Coombs told us...


Clearly you are just playing games with all the old crap that you've
accumulated, new "build" or not.

I have no sympathy for folks like you.

And I have no sypmathy for people who put everything on a computer with an
OS that's KNOWN to spy on everything you do . I don't do cloud storage , I'd
like to keep my info MY info instead of putting it out there for anybody
with the skills to hack . I don't have a "smart" TV for the same reasons ...


I don't do cloud storage either and turned off all the data that MS
wanted to collect in Win10 as it slowed shutdown considerably.

I don't see a microphone or camera on my smart TV and if there were a
camera it is easily covered. I like it for Netflix and now find Comcast
X1 system will work through wifi and brings Netflix to sets that are not
smart.

I want to master the technology, not let it master me. As Wayne points
out the only sure thing you can do is not to go online.

On Thu, 6 Apr 2017 10:29:06 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

Wayne Boatwright wrote:
On Thu 06 Apr 2017 07:26:20a, Terry Coombs told us...


Clearly you are just playing games with all the old crap that you've
accumulated, new "build" or not.

I have no sympathy for folks like you.

And I have no sypmathy for people who put everything on a computer with an
OS that's KNOWN to spy on everything you do . I don't do cloud storage , I'd
like to keep my info MY info instead of putting it out there for anybody
with the skills to hack . I don't have a "smart" TV for the same reasons ...
None of my windows 7 or 10 installs use cloud storage, and my Windows
10 installs do not "call home" or share any information with Microsoft
or other users on the network - unless I say so.

They can both be every bit as secure as Win XP or 98.

On Thu, 06 Apr 2017 15:47:17 GMT, Wayne Boatwright
wrote:

On Thu 06 Apr 2017 08:29:06a, Terry Coombs told us...

Wayne Boatwright wrote:
On Thu 06 Apr 2017 07:26:20a, Terry Coombs told us...


Clearly you are just playing games with all the old crap that
you've accumulated, new "build" or not.

I have no sympathy for folks like you.

And I have no sypmathy for people who put everything on a
computer with an
OS that's KNOWN to spy on everything you do . I don't do cloud
storage , I'd like to keep my info MY info instead of putting it
out there for anybody with the skills to hack . I don't have a
"smart" TV for the same reasons ...

In that case, you should probably never connect anything to the
Internet.
Most definitely NOT without a router. Connecting directly to a simple
modem is just begging for trouble - particularly if youleave it
connected, You want a minimum of a NAS translator between your
computer and the interweb.