On 04/06/2017 10:21 PM, Terry Coombs wrote:

[snip]


I know , but it did include an email client . We use Tbird on the wife's
laptop because Windows Mail sucks a big green one . My new desktop will too
when it's finished .


It'll suck? -)

--
"The evaporation of 4 million [people] who believe in this crap
[Christian Rapture] would leave the world a better place." -- Andrei
Codrescu, on the NPR program "All Things Considered", Dec 19 1995

On 04/07/2017 05:17 AM, Diesel wrote:

[snip]

I just bought another one a couple of weeks ago, activation went off
without any issues, no ID requested. I paid cash for it, I pay cash for
the cards that reload it. Without showing ID or creating any account
that requires verification...Perhaps I'm just not buying the right
phone?

THAT was a good thing to be wrong about.

--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

God: The Immutable Chameleon; whenever the need is felt by one of his
followers, He obligingly recreates himself to suit the occasion.

On Thu, 06 Apr 2017 18:52:01 -0700
Vic Smith wrote:

FYI, Win 10 doesn't snoop through any user files.

There is no proof for that.

On Fri, 7 Apr 2017 09:25:55 -0500, Mark Lloyd
wrote:

On 04/06/2017 08:52 PM, Vic Smith wrote:

[snip]

FYI, Win 10 doesn't snoop through any user files.
Of course you can believe what you wish.

Maybe so, but with "automatic updates" they could start any time they
want to.


Anybody can disable the Window Update service is they choose to.
Mine is disabled.
But if Windows 10 was actually doing even 1% of the "spying" the
tinfoil hat crowd claims they're doing, they'd have some proof, and
have MS in court. They don't.

On Fri, 7 Apr 2017 07:42:34 -0600, rbowman wrote:

On 04/07/2017 07:30 AM, Vic Smith wrote:
Here's a very recent article about Win 10 "spying."
http://www.laptopmag.com/articles/mi...ata-collection
It includes links to descriptions and names of what is collected.
I used the following search argument is Google.
"2017 windows 10 microsoft data collection"


https://technet.microsoft.com/itpro/...nts-and-fields

Did you read the entire list? Did you understand what they are
collecting? Do you realize this is just the 'basic' list?

Sure. SdbBlockUpgradeCanReinstall and HashAlgId concern me.
Not.
Once I quit BAL programming I quit caring about registers and op
codes. "Basic" is what my Windows 10 is set at.
Hey, I'm not asking anybody to run Windows 10.

On 2017-04-07 6:17 AM, Diesel wrote:
Mark Lloyd
Fri, 07 Apr 2017 00:48:48 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On 04/06/2017 06:54 PM, Diesel wrote:

[snip]

USB sticks usually do have a MBR, although I've heard of
formatting one as a floppy (no MBR).

Aye. I don't see much point in having partitions on a usb stick
myself, but.. to each his own.

You must mean "more than one", since with no partitions a MBR
drive is useless.

Yep.

I've heard that Windows will not access more than one partition,
but other OSes will.

I believe that is correct. AFAIK, Only one can be 'active'. If that's
what you mean. I don't think Linux follows this erm, rule, so...Someone
more knowledgable than myself with linux could confirm that.

Linux needs a minimum of three partitions just to function, /boot, /,
and a swap.

--
Froz....

hah wrote:
On 04/06/2017 10:21 PM, Terry Coombs wrote:

[snip]


I know , but it did include an email client . We use Tbird on the
wife's laptop because Windows Mail sucks a big green one . My new
desktop will too when it's finished .


It'll suck? -)

You obvoiusly didn't read my follow up to that post . Shame on you !
sfsf
--
Snag



---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com

On Thursday, April 6, 2017 at 7:57:22 PM UTC-4, Diesel wrote:
trader_4
Thu, 06
Apr 2017 20:04:16 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Thursday, April 6, 2017 at 1:00:49 PM UTC-4, Diesel wrote:
trader_4
Thu,
06 Apr 2017 14:52:31 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Thursday, April 6, 2017 at 2:45:58 AM UTC-4, Diesel wrote:
trader_4

Tue, 04 Apr 2017 15:34:34 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

IDK of any browser company that is still doing updates of
any browsers for XP.

You must not know much about the subject, then. Firefox will
still support XP until 2017. And firefox isn't exactly a
'niche' browser.


You must not know much about calendars, it's already 2017.

Nice try.

Nice try at what? It is in fact already 2017.

Last time I checked, it was still April.

Do you know what ESR means?

https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefo...nizations/faq/

But, you specifically wrote that you didn't know of any
browser company still doing updates for XP, and, obviously,
that's not true. September is still a few months away, too.

What I wrote is true. Firefox has announced end of support and
they are only doing *security updates* for 5 more months. That
means they aren't going to do bug fixes, compatibility fixes. In
my world, that means it's no longer being supported. From
Mozilla:

security updates, ARE infact, updates.


They are just one part of normal product updates during a product's
lifecycle. Security updates are not bug fixes, improvements, changes
made to keep things compatible with new web softwar, to support
new features, etc.
Security updates are the LAST part of a product's life. And again,
Mozilla has said that security updates will end in just FIVE months.
So, again, WTF is your point? The context here was upgrading a
system now to use FOR THE FUTURE. Five months of security updates
and then even that support ends, that is reassuring, a path
you recommend users be on? Good grief!



Regardless. So, what you
wrote isn't true. Your personal opinion aside.


It's absolutely true. Here again from Mozilla:

"Important - Firefox is ending support for Windows XP and Vista
Firefox version 52 will be the last complete update for Windows XP and Windows Vista. Security updates will be released, but no new features.
Why is Firefox support ending for Windows XP and Vista users?

Firefox is one of the only browsers to offer any support for Windows XP and Vista. Microsoft itself ended support for Windows XP in 2014 and will end support for Windows Vista in 2017. Unsupported operating systems receive no security updates, have known exploits, and can be dangerous to use, which makes it difficult to maintain Firefox on those versions."


And right there Mozilla says what I said, that IDK of any browser that
is still supporting XP. You want to argue that contrary to what M
clearly says, they are indeed still "supporting" it because they are
still offering security updates for another 5 months. So, based on
that and in the context of this thread, you think counting on using
Firefox on an XP system you are about to invest in for the future is
smart?




That's directly from Mozilla, so, WTF is your point? That a
browser that is not being supported with updates other than for
security fixes and that only for 5 months, is a browser that one
should plan on using for the future?

I thought my point was self explanatory.

Yes, your point was that it's not 2017 and that Firefox is still
fully supported on XP and a wise choice for the future.



https://blog.mozilla.org/futurerelea...-xp-and-vista/

n approximately March, 2017, Windows XP and Vista users will
automatically be moved to the Firefox Extended Support Release
(ESR).

Firefox is one of the few browsers that continues to support Windows
XP and Vista, and we expect to continue to provide security updates
for users until September 2017. Users do not need to take additional
action to receive those updates. In mid-2017, user numbers on
Windows XP and Vista will be reassessed and a final support end date
will be announced.

Mozilla hasn't set September 2017 for EOL XP/Vista users in stone,
yet. things are still subject to change, based on the amount of
XP/vista users still using those oses with firefox ESR releases.


And again, you see that as something the poster who's upgrading an
XP system for the future should hang his hat on to use as a browser?
This is about as dumb as it gets.

On Fri, 7 Apr 2017 12:24:27 -0700 (PDT)
trader_4 wrote:

new web softwar,


That would be without Cruise Missiles then?

On Thursday, April 6, 2017 at 8:40:01 PM UTC-4, Sam E wrote:
On 04/06/2017 03:04 PM, trader_4 wrote:

[snip]

You must not know much about the subject, then. Firefox will
still support XP until 2017. And firefox isn't exactly a 'niche'
browser.


You must not know much about calendars, it's already 2017.

Nice try.

Nice try at what? It is in fact already 2017.

It's not fall 2017 yet (when Firefox support ends).

[snip]

Sept 2017 is when the LAST of the support for Firefox ends.
Security updates are just one part of support and all other
support has ended. Are you guys totally retarded? This thread
is in the context of someone investing in hardware upgrades with
the intention of running XP into the future. I pointed out that
IDK of any browsers that are supported on XP. If you go to Mozilla,
they clearly state:

Important - Firefox is ending support for Windows XP and Vista
Firefox version 52 will be the last complete update for Windows XP and Windows Vista. Security updates will be released, but no new features.
Why is Firefox support ending for Windows XP and Vista users?
Firefox is one of the only browsers to offer any support for Windows XP and Vista. Microsoft itself ended support for Windows XP in 2014 and will end support for Windows Vista in 2017. Unsupported operating systems receive no security updates, have known exploits, and can be dangerous to use, which makes it difficult to maintain Firefox on those versions.
Firefox security updates for XP and Vista users will continue until September 2017, although new features will not be offered. In mid-2017, a final support end date will be announced based on the number of users still on Windows XP and Vista."

What I said is correct. And what you're arguing, in the context of this
thread, is beyond stupid. You have someone upgrading hardware on an XP system,
intending to run XP XP for the future, and you claim because Firefox will
still have security updates for 5 months, it makes sense to count of FF
for browser?

On Friday, April 7, 2017 at 6:20:47 AM UTC-4, Diesel wrote:
trader_4
Thu, 06
Apr 2017 19:54:15 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

Nice job at taking something out of context in an attempt to
deceive. You just cut it off, right in the middle of a sentence.

No, *I* didn't.

http://www.networkworld.com/article/...agreement.html


But there are worse offenders. Microsoft's service agreement is a
monstrous 12,000 words in length, about the size of a novella. And
who reads those, right? Well, here's one excerpt from Microsoft's
terms of use that you might want to read:

We will access, disclose and preserve personal data, including
your content (such as the content of your emails, other private
communications or files in private folders), when we have a good
faith belief that doing so is necessary to.

Check the url for yourself. What I pasted is EXACTLY what's there. I
didn't cut off a damn thing! You just jumped the gun and falsely
accused me of doing something *I* did NOT do.


So you're foolish enough to take quotes and repost them when it's
very obvious that they left off the whole last part of a sentence.
You don't care about the rest, because what you saw supports your beliefs.
And about this your bragging?





And, it gets even better. See he

https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-US/...nd-privacy-faq

Turning on the Speech recognition setting allows Microsoft to
collect and use your voice recordings to provide you with
cloud-based speech recognition services in Cortana, in supported
Store apps, and, over time, in other parts of Windows. As part of
that service, we also collect information from the user dictionary
created on your device. This user dictionary stores unique words
like names you write, which helps you type and ink more accurately.
Both the voice data and the user dictionary are used in the
aggregate to help improve our ability to correctly recognize all
users' speech.


Wow, imagine that. Smartphones have been doing similar for years now.
You don't want a smartphone? Don't want Win 10? Don't use it!
Just stop bitching.

On Friday, April 7, 2017 at 6:20:48 AM UTC-4, Diesel wrote:
Sam E Fri, 07 Apr 2017 00:39:54 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On 04/06/2017 03:04 PM, trader_4 wrote:

[snip]

You must not know much about the subject, then. Firefox will
still support XP until 2017. And firefox isn't exactly a 'niche'
browser.


You must not know much about calendars, it's already 2017.

Nice try.

Nice try at what? It is in fact already 2017.

It's not fall 2017 yet (when Firefox support ends).

When it might, possibly, end.

https://blog.mozilla.org/futurerelea...-xp-and-vista/

In approximately March, 2017, Windows XP and Vista users will
automatically be moved to the Firefox Extended Support Release
(ESR).

Firefox is one of the few browsers that continues to support Windows
XP and Vista, and we expect to continue to provide security updates
for users until September 2017. Users do not need to take additional
action to receive those updates. In mid-2017, user numbers on
Windows XP and Vista will be reassessed and a final support end date
will be announced.

--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

Again, the context of the thread was upgrading hardware on an XP
system with the intention of using it into the future. So, let's
get this right. Based on the above, it's your professional opinion
that relying on Firefox as a browser that will run on XP for the
future is a sound decision? Is that what you'd tell a customer?
A client? That while Mozilla has said they have already discontinued
all support except for security updates, that because they have said
they will continue to provide only security updates for 5 months,
that means it's supported and a swell choice? WTF?

FrozenNorth wrote:
....
Linux needs a minimum of three partitions just to function, /boot, /,
and a swap.

interesting, considering i booted a single
partition USB stick the other day with linux
on it...


songbird

rbowman wrote:
On 04/06/2017 09:30 PM, songbird wrote:
rbowman wrote:
...
The first spreadsheet I ran into was Supercalc that came bundled with
the Osborne 1 CP/M box. I never figured out how to use in. Fast forward
about 35 years and I have a spreadsheet in Libre Office. I still haven't
figured out how to use the damn things.

not too hard, c'mon, formulas in cells...
did you flunk algebra?

libreoffice calc is quite a step up from mp
(after 30yrs i'd hope so).

the thing is that databases have things
going for them that spreadsheets do not
and vice-versa. luckily you can tie them
together when needed.

I am a C/C++/C# programmer so if I want anything done I fire up gVim and
start coding. I've personally never run into a problem that a
spreadsheet would solve.

heh, well, i've written plenty of C myself,
but sometimes it really is simpler to use
something else. often i'll use unix tools
before having to resort to coding it by hand.

in this particular case i already had the
spreadsheet done so it only took me a while
to redo it in oocalc and the nice thing about
bringing it up to date was that it could go
grab stuff from the internet so i wouldn't
have to add them by hand any longer. i felt
i had properly made it to the 21st century
at last when i got that to work.


Most of my interaction with spreadsheets is because someone has
submitted documentation in an xlsx file. The sad thing is there is no
algebra or any other calculation involved. They just fill in the rows
and columns with descriptions.

eww... that's just brain dead...


songbird

On Fri, 7 Apr 2017 09:28:42 -0500, hah
wrote:

On 04/06/2017 10:21 PM, Terry Coombs wrote:

[snip]


I know , but it did include an email client . We use Tbird on the wife's
laptop because Windows Mail sucks a big green one . My new desktop will too
when it's finished .


It'll suck? -)
Would alyou clowns with your anti-christian bigotry in your
signatures PLEASErefrain from showing your religious jealousness?
You don't see the Christians pushing their beliefs on every post,
regardless of subject.

Cut it out and act like sane adults

On Fri, 07 Apr 2017 16:59:15 -0400, wrote:

Would alyou clowns with your anti-christian bigotry in your
signatures PLEASErefrain from showing your religious jealousness?
You don't see the Christians pushing their beliefs on every post,
regardless of subject.

Cut it out and act like sane adults

+3

Vic Smith
Fri, 07 Apr 2017
13:30:07 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Fri, 7 Apr 2017 10:17:41 -0000 (UTC), Diesel
wrote:


One hell of a scary article from an unreliable source, isn't it?
BFG

Not much sense in arguing with you. You actually believe this.

There's no point in trying to 'argue' about something YOU don't know
anything about, no.

Why do you post links that show you how to turn data collection
off, then complain about data collection? If you're not willing
to take the simple steps required, shame on you.

That isn't why I posted the article, and, I doubt you're that stupid,
either. If you are, it's on me for assuming your more intelligent
then I've given you credit for. The issue I have is that the OS
shouldn't require me to turn those 'features' off in the first place.
They SHOULDN'T be there. I don't run Windows 10, I won't run Windows
10 native on any machine I own, either. I don't believe in giving up
my privacy for new eye candy and possible locked hardware down the
road. It's another reason I'm converting ALL of these machines to
Linux. I've tolerated Microsofts bull**** for years, but, I don't
have to tolerate Win**** 10 OR it's spyware habits on my own personal
machines. My files stored locally are MY FILES, nobody elses.


--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

Vic Smith
Fri, 07 Apr 2017
15:13:27 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Fri, 7 Apr 2017 09:25:55 -0500, Mark Lloyd
wrote:

On 04/06/2017 08:52 PM, Vic Smith wrote:

[snip]

FYI, Win 10 doesn't snoop through any user files.
Of course you can believe what you wish.

Maybe so, but with "automatic updates" they could start any time
they want to.


Anybody can disable the Window Update service is they choose to.
Mine is disabled.

So you think. Again, you not only believe in ignorance, you share your
ignorance about the subject with us all.

But if Windows 10 was actually doing even 1% of the "spying" the
tinfoil hat crowd claims they're doing, they'd have some proof,
and have MS in court. They don't.

You think everybody is making it up then? We're all just out to get MS,
is that right?


--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

trader_4
Fri, 07
Apr 2017 19:38:22 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Friday, April 7, 2017 at 6:20:47 AM UTC-4, Diesel wrote:
trader_4
Thu,
06 Apr 2017 19:54:15 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

Nice job at taking something out of context in an attempt to
deceive. You just cut it off, right in the middle of a
sentence.

No, *I* didn't.

http://www.networkworld.com/article/...t-subnet/windo
ws-10-privacy-spyware-settings-user-agreement.html


But there are worse offenders. Microsoft's service agreement is a
monstrous 12,000 words in length, about the size of a novella.
And who reads those, right? Well, here's one excerpt from
Microsoft's terms of use that you might want to read:

We will access, disclose and preserve personal data,
including your content (such as the content of your emails,
other private communications or files in private folders),
when we have a good faith belief that doing so is necessary
to.

Check the url for yourself. What I pasted is EXACTLY what's
there. I didn't cut off a damn thing! You just jumped the gun and
falsely accused me of doing something *I* did NOT do.


So you're foolish enough to take quotes and repost them when it's
very obvious that they left off the whole last part of a sentence.
You don't care about the rest, because what you saw supports your
beliefs. And about this your bragging?

While I find your efforts to excuse your false accusation against me
rather amusing, it doesn't change what you did. They specifically
quoted an 'excerpt'. Are you familiar with the word?

And, it gets even better. See he

https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-US/...h-inking-typin
g-and-privacy-faq

Turning on the Speech recognition setting allows Microsoft to
collect and use your voice recordings to provide you with
cloud-based speech recognition services in Cortana, in supported
Store apps, and, over time, in other parts of Windows. As part of
that service, we also collect information from the user
dictionary created on your device. This user dictionary stores
unique words like names you write, which helps you type and ink
more accurately. Both the voice data and the user dictionary are
used in the aggregate to help improve our ability to correctly
recognize all users' speech.


Wow, imagine that. Smartphones have been doing similar for years
now. You don't want a smartphone? Don't want Win 10? Don't use
it! Just stop bitching.

Which smartphones specifically are keeping copies of my conversations
and submitting them elsewhere? Go ahead, take your time to form a
reasonable and believable reply. I'll wait.

In the meantime, you owe me an apology.



--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

trader_4
Fri, 07
Apr 2017 19:24:27 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Thursday, April 6, 2017 at 7:57:22 PM UTC-4, Diesel wrote:
trader_4
Thu,
06 Apr 2017 20:04:16 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Thursday, April 6, 2017 at 1:00:49 PM UTC-4, Diesel wrote:
trader_4

Thu, 06 Apr 2017 14:52:31 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Thursday, April 6, 2017 at 2:45:58 AM UTC-4, Diesel
wrote:
trader_4

Tue, 04 Apr 2017 15:34:34 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

IDK of any browser company that is still doing updates of
any browsers for XP.

You must not know much about the subject, then. Firefox
will still support XP until 2017. And firefox isn't exactly
a 'niche' browser.


You must not know much about calendars, it's already 2017.

Nice try.

Nice try at what? It is in fact already 2017.

Last time I checked, it was still April.

Do you know what ESR means?

https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefo...nizations/faq/

But, you specifically wrote that you didn't know of any
browser company still doing updates for XP, and, obviously,
that's not true. September is still a few months away, too.

What I wrote is true. Firefox has announced end of support and
they are only doing *security updates* for 5 more months. That
means they aren't going to do bug fixes, compatibility fixes.
In my world, that means it's no longer being supported. From
Mozilla:

security updates, ARE infact, updates.


They are just one part of normal product updates during a
product's lifecycle. Security updates are not bug fixes,
improvements, changes made to keep things compatible with new web
softwar, to support new features, etc.

You're really going to continue trying to talk down to me? Seriously?


Security updates are the LAST part of a product's life. And
again, Mozilla has said that security updates will end in just
FIVE months. So, again, WTF is your point? The context here was
upgrading a system now to use FOR THE FUTURE. Five months of
security updates and then even that support ends, that is
reassuring, a path you recommend users be on? Good grief!

Security updates are not the last part or the middle part or any
other part of it's life cycle specifically. They are security
updates, issued whenever a problem is discovered. That has nothing
whatsoever to do with the age of the app or it's near end of support
status.

It's absolutely true. Here again from Mozilla:

You're stretching a bit here. And, you aren't dumb enough not to know
that.

Firefox is one of the only browsers to offer any support for
Windows XP and Vista. Microsoft itself ended support for Windows
XP in 2014 and will end support for Windows Vista in 2017.
Unsupported operating systems receive no security updates, have
known exploits, and can be dangerous to use, which makes it
difficult to maintain Firefox on those versions."

cite specific exploits in XP that are still unpatched and being used
in some way to 0wn an XP box. I've read scare mongering stories about
the reason for leaving it behind for awhile now, yet, nobody seems
able to provide an actual example. Btw, I'm going to go ahead and
disclose that i've been a member of various 0day exploit sites going
back a decade or more. If something comes up, I'd be one of the first
to not only know about it, but have viable proof of concept code
demonstrating it, too. I already disclosed a bit about myself. I've
been in the hacking scene since I was a kiddo. Although I'm a grayhat
these days, I still maintain contact with all my friends from the
blackhat days. it's prudent for me to do so, obviously.

I thought my point was self explanatory.

Yes, your point was that it's not 2017 and that Firefox is still
fully supported on XP and a wise choice for the future.

Ehh. Not quite. Now, you're actually putting words in my mouth. I
didn't say XP was a wise choice for the future, infact, I haven't
even given my opinion concerning XP and remaining with it, except to
state that the OP is essentially wasting his/her time running XP
64bit or Windows 7 for that matter, in so far as the future is
concerned. I suggested a viable alternative to Windows 10; Linux.

Mozilla hasn't set September 2017 for EOL XP/Vista users in
stone, yet. things are still subject to change, based on the
amount of XP/vista users still using those oses with firefox ESR
releases.


And again, you see that as something the poster who's upgrading an
XP system for the future should hang his hat on to use as a
browser? This is about as dumb as it gets.

You're putting words in my mouth again, Trader. See above.


--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

trader_4
Fri, 07
Apr 2017 19:43:08 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Friday, April 7, 2017 at 6:20:48 AM UTC-4, Diesel wrote:
Sam E
Fri, 07 Apr 2017 00:39:54 GMT in
alt.home.repair, wrote:

On 04/06/2017 03:04 PM, trader_4 wrote:

[snip]

You must not know much about the subject, then. Firefox
will still support XP until 2017. And firefox isn't exactly
a 'niche' browser.


You must not know much about calendars, it's already 2017.

Nice try.

Nice try at what? It is in fact already 2017.

It's not fall 2017 yet (when Firefox support ends).

When it might, possibly, end.

https://blog.mozilla.org/futurerelea...irefox-support
-for-xp-and-vista/

In approximately March, 2017, Windows XP and Vista users will
automatically be moved to the Firefox Extended Support Release
(ESR).

Firefox is one of the few browsers that continues to support
Windows XP and Vista, and we expect to continue to provide
security updates for users until September 2017. Users do not
need to take additional action to receive those updates. In
mid-2017, user numbers on Windows XP and Vista will be reassessed
and a final support end date will be announced.

--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

Again, the context of the thread was upgrading hardware on an XP
system with the intention of using it into the future.

True so far.

So, let's get this right. Based on the above, it's your
professional opinion that relying on Firefox as a browser that
will run on XP for the future is a sound decision?

That's not what I wrote, Trader. Infact, I advised the OP not to
pursue XP 64bit or 'upgrade' to Windows 7, either; for the same
reason. He's only delaying the inevitable. If he wants to run modern
hardware, he should go with a modern OS. Such as Linux, not Win****
10.

Is that what you'd tell a customer? A client?

That depends entirely on what the machine in question is being used
for. If it's running a CNC or plasma cutter in his shop, there's no
reason to 'upgrade' the OS. It might infact, disable the CNC machine
and/or plasma cutter.

That while Mozilla has said they have already
discontinued all support except for security updates, that because
they have said they will continue to provide only security updates
for 5 months, that means it's supported and a swell choice? WTF?

Er, not quite, no. Still supported, yes. Swell choice? Depends on the
situation. For the OP, I don't believe using XP 64bit or Windows 7 is
a sound decision to be making. And, I've stated that. They are
comfortable with XP, they'd be comfortable with Linux Mint. I base
this entirely on my test subjects who aren't tech savvy and couldn't
tell you what OS is present on their machine. I switched them to
Linux Mint, no complaints, significant reduction in what I believe
are unnecessary tech support calls/emails for me. If they can run
linux, so can the OP and his wife.

--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

songbird Fri,
07 Apr 2017 19:57:56 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

FrozenNorth wrote:
...
Linux needs a minimum of three partitions just to function,
/boot, /, and a swap.

interesting, considering i booted a single
partition USB stick the other day with linux
on it...


songbird


Live right? That's not quite the same thing as an installed version.


--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

Mark Lloyd
Fri, 07 Apr 2017 14:33:48 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On 04/07/2017 05:17 AM, Diesel wrote:

[snip]

I just bought another one a couple of weeks ago, activation went
off without any issues, no ID requested. I paid cash for it, I
pay cash for the cards that reload it. Without showing ID or
creating any account that requires verification...Perhaps I'm
just not buying the right phone?

THAT was a good thing to be wrong about.


[g]


--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

On Fri, 07 Apr 2017 14:43:07 -0700, Oren wrote:

On Fri, 07 Apr 2017 16:59:15 -0400, wrote:

Would alyou clowns with your anti-christian bigotry in your
signatures PLEASErefrain from showing your religious jealousness?
You don't see the Christians pushing their beliefs on every post,
regardless of subject.

Cut it out and act like sane adults

+3
Make that Zealousness

On Fri, 07 Apr 2017 06:30:07 -0700, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Fri, 7 Apr 2017 10:17:41 -0000 (UTC), Diesel
wrote:


One hell of a scary article from an unreliable source, isn't it? BFG

Not much sense in arguing with you. You actually believe this.
Why do you post links that show you how to turn data collection off,
then complain about data collection? If you're not willing to take
the simple steps required, shame on you.
Here's a very recent article about Win 10 "spying."
http://www.laptopmag.com/articles/mi...ata-collection
It includes links to descriptions and names of what is collected.
I used the following search argument is Google.
"2017 windows 10 microsoft data collection"

The same guy that said NT didn't have 16 bit code? He wants to argue
about how smart he is.

On 04/07/2017 09:13 AM, Vic Smith wrote:
Anybody can disable the Window Update service is they choose to.
Mine is disabled.

That's news to the world unless you're on a limited data plan.
Enterprise users can defer the updates for a few months until the
general public/beta testers have done their job but the home users are
going to get updated.

On 04/07/2017 02:26 PM, songbird wrote:
Most of my interaction with spreadsheets is because someone has
submitted documentation in an xlsx file. The sad thing is there is no
algebra or any other calculation involved. They just fill in the rows
and columns with descriptions.
eww... that's just brain dead...

Yeah, I'd probably be impressed if I saw a spreadsheet someone actually
used as a spreadsheet rather than a half-assed attempt at project
documentation.

On Sat, 8 Apr 2017 00:44:23 -0000 (UTC), Diesel
wrote:

Vic Smith
Fri, 07 Apr 2017
15:13:27 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Fri, 7 Apr 2017 09:25:55 -0500, Mark Lloyd
wrote:

On 04/06/2017 08:52 PM, Vic Smith wrote:

[snip]

FYI, Win 10 doesn't snoop through any user files.
Of course you can believe what you wish.

Maybe so, but with "automatic updates" they could start any time
they want to.


Anybody can disable the Window Update service is they choose to.
Mine is disabled.

So you think. Again, you not only believe in ignorance, you share your
ignorance about the subject with us all.


So I know. And you don't. There goes your credibility on this
issue. That's ok. You've stated you have no experience with it.

But if Windows 10 was actually doing even 1% of the "spying" the
tinfoil hat crowd claims they're doing, they'd have some proof,
and have MS in court. They don't.

You think everybody is making it up then? We're all just out to get MS,
is that right?

"All?" No, as I stated, only "the tinfoil hat crowd."
Of course you can make me a believer. With proof.
Should be easy, if all you say is fact.

On Sat, 8 Apr 2017 00:44:22 -0000 (UTC), Diesel
wrote:

Vic Smith
Fri, 07 Apr 2017
13:30:07 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Fri, 7 Apr 2017 10:17:41 -0000 (UTC), Diesel
wrote:


One hell of a scary article from an unreliable source, isn't it?
BFG

Not much sense in arguing with you. You actually believe this.

There's no point in trying to 'argue' about something YOU don't know
anything about, no.

Why do you post links that show you how to turn data collection
off, then complain about data collection? If you're not willing
to take the simple steps required, shame on you.

That isn't why I posted the article, and, I doubt you're that stupid,
either. If you are, it's on me for assuming your more intelligent
then I've given you credit for. The issue I have is that the OS
shouldn't require me to turn those 'features' off in the first place.
They SHOULDN'T be there. I don't run Windows 10, I won't run Windows
10 native on any machine I own, either. I don't believe in giving up
my privacy for new eye candy and possible locked hardware down the
road. It's another reason I'm converting ALL of these machines to
Linux. I've tolerated Microsofts bull**** for years, but, I don't
have to tolerate Win**** 10 OR it's spyware habits on my own personal
machines. My files stored locally are MY FILES, nobody elses.

I've seen a hundred similar articles. Old news. I don't exactly love
turning all that **** off either, but see it as necessary maintenance.
I don't care what OS you use. But I learn what I need to know about
the OS I'm using.

On Fri, 7 Apr 2017 20:05:54 -0600, rbowman wrote:

On 04/07/2017 09:13 AM, Vic Smith wrote:
Anybody can disable the Window Update service is they choose to.
Mine is disabled.

That's news to the world unless you're on a limited data plan.
Enterprise users can defer the updates for a few months until the
general public/beta testers have done their job but the home users are
going to get updated.

Not if they disable the Window Update service. You can run an
elevated command prompt, with the correct arg, or use the Win 10 UI.
Control PanelSystem and SecurityAdmin ToolsComponent SevicesLocal
Or run services.msc and double click Windows Update to get right to
properties. Or right click and select properties.
On startup type dropdown list select disabled.
It's only news to the world who don't know about it.
I restore an OS image about once a month and only do updates then.
Then it gets turned off. So I get updates only when I choose to.

On 04/07/2017 10:30 AM, FrozenNorth wrote:

[snip]


Linux needs a minimum of three partitions just to function, /boot, /,
and a swap.


Including the partition required for GPT booting. For MBR it's just two.
And last I checked you CAN disable swap.

--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

God: The Immutable Chameleon; whenever the need is felt by one of his
followers, He obligingly recreates himself to suit the occasion.

On 04/07/2017 02:57 PM, songbird wrote:
FrozenNorth wrote:
...
Linux needs a minimum of three partitions just to function, /boot, /,
and a swap.

interesting, considering i booted a single
partition USB stick the other day with linux
on it...


songbird


The "three partitions" is only for the system drive.

--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

God: The Immutable Chameleon; whenever the need is felt by one of his
followers, He obligingly recreates himself to suit the occasion.

On Fri, 07 Apr 2017 19:51:24 -0700, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Fri, 7 Apr 2017 20:05:54 -0600, rbowman wrote:

On 04/07/2017 09:13 AM, Vic Smith wrote:
Anybody can disable the Window Update service is they choose to.
Mine is disabled.

That's news to the world unless you're on a limited data plan.
Enterprise users can defer the updates for a few months until the
general public/beta testers have done their job but the home users are
going to get updated.

Not if they disable the Window Update service. You can run an
elevated command prompt, with the correct arg, or use the Win 10 UI.
Control PanelSystem and SecurityAdmin ToolsComponent SevicesLocal
Or run services.msc and double click Windows Update to get right to
properties. Or right click and select properties.
On startup type dropdown list select disabled.
It's only news to the world who don't know about it.
I restore an OS image about once a month and only do updates then.
Then it gets turned off. So I get updates only when I choose to.
Why do you restore an OS image once a month??? Just wondering

Vic Smith
Sat, 08 Apr 2017
02:19:23 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Sat, 8 Apr 2017 00:44:22 -0000 (UTC), Diesel
wrote:

Vic Smith
m Fri, 07 Apr 2017
13:30:07 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Fri, 7 Apr 2017 10:17:41 -0000 (UTC), Diesel
wrote:


One hell of a scary article from an unreliable source, isn't it?
BFG

Not much sense in arguing with you. You actually believe this.

There's no point in trying to 'argue' about something YOU don't
know anything about, no.

Why do you post links that show you how to turn data collection
off, then complain about data collection? If you're not willing
to take the simple steps required, shame on you.

That isn't why I posted the article, and, I doubt you're that
stupid, either. If you are, it's on me for assuming your more
intelligent then I've given you credit for. The issue I have is
that the OS shouldn't require me to turn those 'features' off in
the first place. They SHOULDN'T be there. I don't run Windows 10,
I won't run Windows 10 native on any machine I own, either. I
don't believe in giving up my privacy for new eye candy and
possible locked hardware down the road. It's another reason I'm
converting ALL of these machines to Linux. I've tolerated
Microsofts bull**** for years, but, I don't have to tolerate
Win**** 10 OR it's spyware habits on my own personal machines. My
files stored locally are MY FILES, nobody elses.

I've seen a hundred similar articles. Old news. I don't exactly
love turning all that **** off either, but see it as necessary
maintenance. I don't care what OS you use. But I learn what I
need to know about the OS I'm using.


necessary maintenance? You've got be ****ing kidding me. It is old
news from the viewpoint that the pre-release copies of Windows 10
also did it, but, that's really beside the point. Your OS shouldn't
need to send audio recordings of you anyplace, without you telling it
to do so. In fact, it shouldn't be retaining copies of that stuff,
long term unless you opted to save the audio recordings yourself. Nor
should it be keeping copies of whatever you type on the keyboard
either. Who the hell wants a built in keylogger?


--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

Oren
Sat, 08 Apr 2017
01:11:31 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Fri, 07 Apr 2017 06:30:07 -0700, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Fri, 7 Apr 2017 10:17:41 -0000 (UTC), Diesel
wrote:


One hell of a scary article from an unreliable source, isn't it?
BFG

Not much sense in arguing with you. You actually believe this.
Why do you post links that show you how to turn data collection
off, then complain about data collection? If you're not willing
to take the simple steps required, shame on you.
Here's a very recent article about Win 10 "spying."
http://www.laptopmag.com/articles/mi...0-data-collect
ion It includes links to descriptions and names of what is
collected. I used the following search argument is Google.
"2017 windows 10 microsoft data collection"

The same guy that said NT didn't have 16 bit code? He wants to
argue about how smart he is.


Do you understand that NT isn't windows 9x? 16bit code is emulated
under NT.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_NT
NT was the first purely 32-bit version of Windows, whereas its
consumer-oriented counterparts, Windows 3.1x and Windows 9x, were 16-
bit/32-bit hybrids. It is a multi-architecture operating system.
Initially, it supported several CPU architectures, including IA-32,
MIPS, DEC Alpha, PowerPC and later Itanium. The latest versions
support x86 (more specifically IA-32 and x64) and ARM. Major features
of the Windows NT family include Windows Shell, Windows API, Native
API, Active Directory, Group Policy, Hardware Abstraction Layer,
NTFS, BitLocker, Windows Store, Windows Update, and Hyper-V.

There's no native 16bit code in NT. The fact you can run 16bit code
on 32bit versions of NT does NOT mean NT actually has 16bit code
present. It's EMULATED. Do you understand what emulated means?



--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

Vic Smith
Sat, 08 Apr 2017
02:19:18 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:


"All?" No, as I stated, only "the tinfoil hat crowd."
Of course you can make me a believer. With proof.
Should be easy, if all you say is fact.

Are you ignoring the urls I've shared previously?
Did you miss the one from privacy.microsoft.com specifically?



--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

Vic Smith
Sat, 08 Apr 2017
02:19:18 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Sat, 8 Apr 2017 00:44:23 -0000 (UTC), Diesel
wrote:

Vic Smith
m Fri, 07 Apr 2017
15:13:27 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Fri, 7 Apr 2017 09:25:55 -0500, Mark Lloyd
wrote:

On 04/06/2017 08:52 PM, Vic Smith wrote:

[snip]

FYI, Win 10 doesn't snoop through any user files.
Of course you can believe what you wish.

Maybe so, but with "automatic updates" they could start any time
they want to.


Anybody can disable the Window Update service is they choose to.
Mine is disabled.

So you think. Again, you not only believe in ignorance, you share
your ignorance about the subject with us all.


So I know. And you don't. There goes your credibility on this
issue. That's ok. You've stated you have no experience with it.

I didn't know my credibility was being called into question. I don't
run windows 10 myself, and when I checked last, only enterprise
users could 'defer' windows updates. I remember reading someplace
that even if you did disable the windows update service, it doesn't
remain disabled forever, unless you use a group policy setting,
power shell script, etc. Home users don't have a group policy editor
though, so they are semi ****ed in that respect.

You might want to shut the service down and wait a couple of months,
without restoring from image to see if Windows turns it back on, for
you. You might be surprised.

"All?" No, as I stated, only "the tinfoil hat crowd."
Of course you can make me a believer. With proof.
Should be easy, if all you say is fact.

https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-US/...nd-privacy-faq

Turning on the Speech recognition setting allows Microsoft to
collect and use your voice recordings to provide you with
cloud-based speech recognition services in Cortana, in supported
Store apps, and, over time, in other parts of Windows. As part of
that service, we also collect information from the user dictionary
created on your device. This user dictionary stores unique words
like names you write, which helps you type and ink more accurately.
Both the voice data and the user dictionary are used in the
aggregate to help improve our ability to correctly recognize all
users' speech.


http://www.networkworld.com/article/...agreement.html

Well, here's one excerpt from Microsoft's terms of use that you
might want to read:

We will access, disclose and preserve personal data, including
your content (such as the content of your emails, other private
communications or files in private folders), when we have a good
faith belief that doing so is necessary to protect our customers or
enforce the terms governing the use of the services.

I'm really not sure how much more clear it can be there. You agree
to this when you install the software, so you don't have much legal
recourse here, but, I'm not lawyer. so...



--
I would like to apologize for not having offended you yet.
Please be patient. I will get to you shortly.

On 04/07/2017 10:09 PM, rbowman wrote:
On 04/07/2017 02:26 PM, songbird wrote:
Most of my interaction with spreadsheets is because someone has
submitted documentation in an xlsx file. The sad thing is there is no
algebra or any other calculation involved. They just fill in the rows
and columns with descriptions.
eww... that's just brain dead...

Yeah, I'd probably be impressed if I saw a spreadsheet someone
actually used as a spreadsheet rather than a half-assed attempt at
project documentation.



Agreed! Few individuals/corporations want to spend money on a
user-friendly database so data gets stuffed into the rows and columns of
a spreadsheet.

And FWIW, I'll take data any way I can get it just as long as it's not
created with some ****ing Google ****App and stored on ****ing
Google****Drive.

On Fri, 07 Apr 2017 23:26:43 -0400, wrote:


Why do you restore an OS image once a month??? Just wondering

Usually to clean off test software, unneeded software (eg Turbotax),
or to add software to my base image. Sometimes because of suspected
malware. Looking at my image archive, it seems to actually average
about every 45 days. It normally takes from 10 to 30 minutes.
Depends on how many updates I have to do.
That includes restoring my base image, updating, creating new base
image. My OS is on a small SSD (64gb) dedicated to it.
Bottom line is it's normal system maintenance for me.
Started imaging with XP, which was easy to break. I prefer to install
my OS one time only.

On Sat, 8 Apr 2017 11:26:55 -0000 (UTC), Diesel
wrote:

necessary maintenance? You've got be ****ing kidding me. It is old
news from the viewpoint that the pre-release copies of Windows 10
also did it, but, that's really beside the point. Your OS shouldn't
need to send audio recordings of you anyplace, without you telling it
to do so. In fact, it shouldn't be retaining copies of that stuff,
long term unless you opted to save the audio recordings yourself. Nor
should it be keeping copies of whatever you type on the keyboard
either. Who the hell wants a built in keylogger?

Let's not go in circles. You despise Windows 10. That's fine.
I just work around its "issues." I already told you I resent having
to turn the so-called "spyware" off. But I turn it off.
It's just a trade-off in using Win 10.
BTW, at least 50% of my PC use is gaming. There's no substitute for
Win 10.