Purchased a nice chainsaw via internet like most of all my tools.

Saw had a brake problem with the chain and I called the local service center
for warranty work and they said come on down.
Once they found out I purchased it on the internet at the shop they refused
to work on it as a warranty job since I didnt buy it from them. They cited
low pay from Husky on warranty work and were not willing to do it if they
didnt make the sale.

I called Husqvarna about the problem and they told me that "I need to
understand the dealers perspective" and they have the right to refuse
service, even warranty work when they are an authorized dealer/repair
center.

Most likely it is a simple fix as far as adjusting the brake band on the
clutch but it seems the local dealers are fighting back and I am caught in
the middle.

Who cares about me, they all got my money and in the mean time I have
useless, expensive, orange boat anchor with Husqvarna written on the side.

Anyway be advised if your buying mail order chainsaws.

Rich

In article ,
says...

I called Husqvarna about the problem and they told me that "I need to
understand the dealers perspective" and they have the right to refuse
service, even warranty work when they are an authorized dealer/repair
center.

Simple. Take the bucks you saved by buying off the internet and pay
the dealer to fix it. Live and learn.

This has been a huge debate in boards that deal with topics like this. Where'd
you buy it online? Did you get an actual warranty? Dealers don't like
Electrolux's (owner of Husky) bid to put their saws in box stores and
whosalers, but a good dealer should service anything that has a real warranty.
Maybe it won't be at the front of the line, but they should service it. Find a
dealer who's less of an asshole.

In general it's always better to develop a reliationship with a dealer when you
get something like this. They'll give you freebies, will promply work on stuff
you've bought from them, might give you loaners, free instructions, parts, etc.

GTO(John)

Purchased a nice chainsaw via internet like most of all my tools.

Saw had a brake problem with the chain and I called the local service center
for warranty work and they said come on down.
Once they found out I purchased it on the internet at the shop they refused
to work on it as a warranty job since I didnt buy it from them. They cited
low pay from Husky on warranty work and were not willing to do it if they
didnt make the sale.

I called Husqvarna about the problem and they told me that "I need to
understand the dealers perspective" and they have the right to refuse
service, even warranty work when they are an authorized dealer/repair
center.

Most likely it is a simple fix as far as adjusting the brake band on the
clutch but it seems the local dealers are fighting back and I am caught in
the middle.

Who cares about me, they all got my money and in the mean time I have
useless, expensive, orange boat anchor with Husqvarna written on the side.

Anyway be advised if your buying mail order chainsaws.

Rich

GTO69RA4 wrote:

In general it's always better to develop a reliationship with a dealer when you
get something like this. They'll give you freebies, will promply work on stuff
you've bought from them, might give you loaners, free instructions, parts, etc.

Not where I live...

"GTO69RA4" wrote in message
...
Maybe it won't be at the front of the line, but they should service it.
Find a
dealer who's less of an asshole.

In general it's always better to develop a reliationship with a dealer
when you
get something like this. They'll give you freebies, will promply work on
stuff
you've bought from them, might give you loaners, free instructions, parts,
etc.

FWIW about 20 years ago, driving around town, was this new Ford Van with
"This vehicle is a lemon and I bought it from Joe XXX Ford" and all such
painted, quite neatly, on the van. "They will not honor their warrantee"
and such other statements were there also.

Larry

I have never found anything on the net that I couldn't buy almost as cheaply
in my local market area. All I do is compare the price locally and on the
net then I factor in just the cost of shipping the item back for repair or
exchange just once. In my opinion and experience it's almost all ways
cheaper to buy locally if the item is something that could possibly need
service or repair under warrantee.

Maybe it's just my 30 years of experience running a small service business
because I can almost always find an honest reputable local dealer willing to
make me a competitive deal and I never even mention that I'm expecting them
to match a mail order price. On tehrare occassion I purchase something
that not up to spec and the dealer causing me grieve I can deal with them in
much easier than I can a company I delt with over the internet. Example
Home depot really screwed up on a $750.00 special order I placed before
christmas and I got a $200.00 discount and a 10% discount on any purchase I
make up to $2000.00 and they removed to time limit from the discount coupon.

For those Canadian's on the group I 'm always shocked by what looks like a
real cheap US price then I find the same item in Canada for the same price
or less in Canadain dollars.

Doesn't matter if your American or Canadian in my opinion when ever possible
you should always try to support your local businesses because in my
experience they in turn they will support you.


My rant for the day

Jimbo




"Lawrence L'Hote" wrote in message
news:8oWPb.126901$na.135369@attbi_s04...

"GTO69RA4" wrote in message
...
Maybe it won't be at the front of the line, but they should service it.
Find a
dealer who's less of an asshole.

In general it's always better to develop a reliationship with a dealer
when you
get something like this. They'll give you freebies, will promply work on
stuff
you've bought from them, might give you loaners, free instructions,
parts,
etc.

FWIW about 20 years ago, driving around town, was this new Ford Van with
"This vehicle is a lemon and I bought it from Joe XXX Ford" and all such
painted, quite neatly, on the van. "They will not honor their warrantee"
and such other statements were there also.

Larry

In article ,
says...
Purchased a nice chainsaw via internet like most of all my tools.

Saw had a brake problem with the chain and I called the local service center
for warranty work and they said come on down.
Once they found out I purchased it on the internet at the shop they refused
to work on it as a warranty job since I didnt buy it from them. They cited
low pay from Husky on warranty work and were not willing to do it if they
didnt make the sale.

I called Husqvarna about the problem and they told me that "I need to
understand the dealers perspective" and they have the right to refuse
service, even warranty work when they are an authorized dealer/repair
center.

Most likely it is a simple fix as far as adjusting the brake band on the
clutch but it seems the local dealers are fighting back and I am caught in
the middle.

Who cares about me, they all got my money and in the mean time I have
useless, expensive, orange boat anchor with Husqvarna written on the side.

Anyway be advised if your buying mail order chainsaws.

Rich



What a crock. I suppose if you told them you got it as a Christmas
present from your father in law across the country they wouldn't service
it either?

You buy the product, you buy the company, and you should get the
warranty. Period. If Husky says that a local dealer can refuse you
service, then Husky should service the machine themselves.

Take it to the next level at Husky.
--
Regards,

Rick

(Remove the HIGH SPOTS for e-mail)

When I was in the business of servicing printing presses one of my suppliers
had us sign a contract protecting our local territories. I didn't like the
idea at first but the following incident sure made me a believer.

A smart assed dealer some where out in the boon docks decided to sell the
$2000.00 attachments at a discounted price by mail order. This was a very
sensitive peace of equipment that required a lot of skill to install.

Customer tried to install them and they didn't work properly ergo the
manufacturer flew a service person from head office out to repair the
attachment and billed the selling dealer, and that bill was usually around
$1500.00 to $2500.00. As you can imagine nobody tried selling outside
their normal service area again.

Jimbo

"Rick Chamberlain" wrote in message
...
In article ,
says...
Purchased a nice chainsaw via internet like most of all my tools.

Saw had a brake problem with the chain and I called the local service
center
for warranty work and they said come on down.
Once they found out I purchased it on the internet at the shop they
refused
to work on it as a warranty job since I didnt buy it from them. They
cited
low pay from Husky on warranty work and were not willing to do it if
they
didnt make the sale.

I called Husqvarna about the problem and they told me that "I need to
understand the dealers perspective" and they have the right to refuse
service, even warranty work when they are an authorized dealer/repair
center.

Most likely it is a simple fix as far as adjusting the brake band on the
clutch but it seems the local dealers are fighting back and I am caught
in
the middle.

Who cares about me, they all got my money and in the mean time I have
useless, expensive, orange boat anchor with Husqvarna written on the
side.

Anyway be advised if your buying mail order chainsaws.

Rich



What a crock. I suppose if you told them you got it as a Christmas
present from your father in law across the country they wouldn't service
it either?

You buy the product, you buy the company, and you should get the
warranty. Period. If Husky says that a local dealer can refuse you
service, then Husky should service the machine themselves.

Take it to the next level at Husky.
--
Regards,

Rick

(Remove the HIGH SPOTS for e-mail)

On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 19:45:01 GMT, "Rich"
wrote:

Purchased a nice chainsaw via internet like most of all my tools.

Saw had a brake problem with the chain and I called the local service center
for warranty work and they said come on down.
Once they found out I purchased it on the internet at the shop they refused
to work on it as a warranty job since I didnt buy it from them. They cited
low pay from Husky on warranty work and were not willing to do it if they
didnt make the sale.

I called Husqvarna about the problem and they told me that "I need to
understand the dealers perspective" and they have the right to refuse
service, even warranty work when they are an authorized dealer/repair
center.

Most likely it is a simple fix as far as adjusting the brake band on the
clutch but it seems the local dealers are fighting back and I am caught in
the middle.

Who cares about me, they all got my money and in the mean time I have
useless, expensive, orange boat anchor with Husqvarna written on the side.

Anyway be advised if your buying mail order chainsaws.

Rich


I'm with the dealer. We sell power equipment our thought is if you
bought from some internet site, then that's where you should have it
fixed.
On the other side of that, we tend to hand out demo loaners to our
customers if the shop can't fix the machine in a couple of days. Bet
the internet sales site doesn't do that.

Equipment dealers are independent businesses and they don't profit
from warranty work- warranty repair is a neccessary evil.

So how much did you 'save' (and don't forget shipping) by shortcutting
the local dealer?

-Carl

I'm with Carl all the way. If a dealer makes a profit selling a product why
should another dealer have to service it at a loss? If the internet
dealer had to service the unit and pay shipping to and from his shop he'd
have to very quickly up his prices well above what your local dealer would
charge. Yes they make a smaller profit it but they have no risk.

Jimbo
"Carl Byrns" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 19:45:01 GMT, "Rich"
wrote:

Purchased a nice chainsaw via internet like most of all my tools.

Saw had a brake problem with the chain and I called the local service
center
for warranty work and they said come on down.
Once they found out I purchased it on the internet at the shop they
refused
to work on it as a warranty job since I didnt buy it from them. They
cited
low pay from Husky on warranty work and were not willing to do it if they
didnt make the sale.

I called Husqvarna about the problem and they told me that "I need to
understand the dealers perspective" and they have the right to refuse
service, even warranty work when they are an authorized dealer/repair
center.

Most likely it is a simple fix as far as adjusting the brake band on the
clutch but it seems the local dealers are fighting back and I am caught
in
the middle.

Who cares about me, they all got my money and in the mean time I have
useless, expensive, orange boat anchor with Husqvarna written on the
side.

Anyway be advised if your buying mail order chainsaws.

Rich


I'm with the dealer. We sell power equipment our thought is if you
bought from some internet site, then that's where you should have it
fixed.
On the other side of that, we tend to hand out demo loaners to our
customers if the shop can't fix the machine in a couple of days. Bet
the internet sales site doesn't do that.

Equipment dealers are independent businesses and they don't profit
from warranty work- warranty repair is a neccessary evil.

So how much did you 'save' (and don't forget shipping) by shortcutting
the local dealer?

-Carl

Carl Byrns wrote:
On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 19:45:01 GMT, "Rich"
wrote:


Purchased a nice chainsaw via internet like most of all my tools.

Saw had a brake problem with the chain and I called the local service center
for warranty work and they said come on down.
Once they found out I purchased it on the internet at the shop they refused
to work on it as a warranty job since I didnt buy it from them. They cited
low pay from Husky on warranty work and were not willing to do it if they
didnt make the sale.

I called Husqvarna about the problem and they told me that "I need to
understand the dealers perspective" and they have the right to refuse
service, even warranty work when they are an authorized dealer/repair
center.

Most likely it is a simple fix as far as adjusting the brake band on the
clutch but it seems the local dealers are fighting back and I am caught in
the middle.

Who cares about me, they all got my money and in the mean time I have
useless, expensive, orange boat anchor with Husqvarna written on the side.

Anyway be advised if your buying mail order chainsaws.

Rich



I'm with the dealer. We sell power equipment our thought is if you
bought from some internet site, then that's where you should have it
fixed.
On the other side of that, we tend to hand out demo loaners to our
customers if the shop can't fix the machine in a couple of days. Bet
the internet sales site doesn't do that.

Equipment dealers are independent businesses and they don't profit
from warranty work- warranty repair is a neccessary evil.

So how much did you 'save' (and don't forget shipping) by shortcutting
the local dealer?

So I assume that your dealer agreement allows you
to decline warranty repair jobs on products not
purchased from you?

In article , .
says...
When I was in the business of servicing printing presses one of my suppliers
had us sign a contract protecting our local territories. I didn't like the
idea at first but the following incident sure made me a believer.

A smart assed dealer some where out in the boon docks decided to sell the
$2000.00 attachments at a discounted price by mail order. This was a very
sensitive peace of equipment that required a lot of skill to install.

Customer tried to install them and they didn't work properly ergo the
manufacturer flew a service person from head office out to repair the
attachment and billed the selling dealer, and that bill was usually around
$1500.00 to $2500.00. As you can imagine nobody tried selling outside
their normal service area again.

Jimbo

Jimbo,

What you are talking about doesn't compare with a retail commodity item.
A better analogy might be a washer and dryer. Let's say you buy a new
set, and within the next 2 months your company relocates you. Are you
saying that you expect your machines to now be out of warranty because
you took them with you?

Selling service contracts is completely different because the price is
separated. Husky did not give Rich the option of buying the chainsaw
without a warranty for a reduced price. I don't know of their warranty
language, but unless Rich violated a clause in the warranty, he is
entitled to service.

Sorry for the rant, but these local dealers make their own bed when they
sign up to be service centers. I can't imagine any of these places sign
up for warranty service to lose money.

--
Regards,

Rick

(Remove the HIGH SPOTS for e-mail)

In article ,
says...
On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 19:45:01 GMT, "Rich"
wrote:

Purchased a nice chainsaw via internet like most of all my tools.

Saw had a brake problem with the chain and I called the local service center
for warranty work and they said come on down.
Once they found out I purchased it on the internet at the shop they refused
to work on it as a warranty job since I didnt buy it from them. They cited
low pay from Husky on warranty work and were not willing to do it if they
didnt make the sale.

I called Husqvarna about the problem and they told me that "I need to
understand the dealers perspective" and they have the right to refuse
service, even warranty work when they are an authorized dealer/repair
center.

Most likely it is a simple fix as far as adjusting the brake band on the
clutch but it seems the local dealers are fighting back and I am caught in
the middle.

Who cares about me, they all got my money and in the mean time I have
useless, expensive, orange boat anchor with Husqvarna written on the side.

Anyway be advised if your buying mail order chainsaws.

Rich


I'm with the dealer. We sell power equipment our thought is if you
bought from some internet site, then that's where you should have it
fixed.
On the other side of that, we tend to hand out demo loaners to our
customers if the shop can't fix the machine in a couple of days. Bet
the internet sales site doesn't do that.

Equipment dealers are independent businesses and they don't profit
from warranty work- warranty repair is a neccessary evil.

So how much did you 'save' (and don't forget shipping) by shortcutting
the local dealer?

-Carl

So help me with this hypothetical Carl. I am a traveling lumberjack,
and I happen to have my spanking new Husky break on me while in your
area. I come to your shop, and because I didn't buy the unit from you,
you're going to deny me service?

If that's the case, I'll never buy another Husky again, and I'll be
damned sure to tell my friends about it too. Pretty soon, you won't be
able to give them away.
--
Regards,

Rick

(Remove the HIGH SPOTS for e-mail)

In article , Carl Byrns says...

Equipment dealers are independent businesses and they don't profit
from warranty work- warranty repair is a neccessary evil.

Unfortunately this is true, even if you *do* buy
your stuff from a local dealer. They still hate doing
the warranty repair because it is $$$ out of their
pocket.

I've seen cases, locally, where the standard approach
to warranty repair is the "sunshine treatment" which
means the item or vehicle is simply left out in the
sunshine with the hopes that the magic solar rays
will fix it.

This goes on until the customer gets fed up and goes
elsewhere. Because of this practice you now see
lemon laws, they do that three times and they just
bought back your car.

This flip side is why I'm not shedding too many tears
for a dealer who is contractually required to do
a warranty repair, gets stuck with this sort of thing.
Consider: if the dealer's price were more in line with
the internet price, the entire thing could be avoided...

Jim

==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================

Question:

Was the original seller of the chain saw an authorized dealer? A lot of
the stuff people buy off the net are not be sold by authorized dealers. The
sellers are just discounters who buy old stock from bankrupcies etc. and
resell it cheap to unsuspecting buyers.

Rick:
You make some very good points and the manufacturer would be a fool not to
check the serial numbers of the equipment before turning down a warrantee
claim on either the chain saw or the washer dryer.

Grey market products are flooding the market place and a lot of consumer
don't realize they are not covered by the manufacturers warrantee. My
advise to anyone buying on line or through mail order would be to ask for a
model number and serial number before purchasing. Then they should call the
manufacturer and find out date of manufacture and the warrantee status of
the product.

If the product was sold by an authorized dealer there is no way the
manufacturer can legally refuse to service it. Whether or not the local
dealer is obligated to fix it is another story because we don't know what
kind of contract the manufacturer has with the repair depot.

I'm retired now but this business of people buying stuff off the net and
expecting a local company to repair it under a warrantee for well below the
regular shop rate really upset me.


Jimbo


"Rick Chamberlain" wrote in message
...
In article ,
says...
On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 19:45:01 GMT, "Rich"
wrote:

Purchased a nice chainsaw via internet like most of all my tools.

Saw had a brake problem with the chain and I called the local service
center
for warranty work and they said come on down.
Once they found out I purchased it on the internet at the shop they
refused
to work on it as a warranty job since I didnt buy it from them. They
cited
low pay from Husky on warranty work and were not willing to do it if
they
didnt make the sale.

I called Husqvarna about the problem and they told me that "I need to
understand the dealers perspective" and they have the right to refuse
service, even warranty work when they are an authorized dealer/repair
center.

Most likely it is a simple fix as far as adjusting the brake band on
the
clutch but it seems the local dealers are fighting back and I am caught
in
the middle.

Who cares about me, they all got my money and in the mean time I have
useless, expensive, orange boat anchor with Husqvarna written on the
side.

Anyway be advised if your buying mail order chainsaws.

Rich


I'm with the dealer. We sell power equipment our thought is if you
bought from some internet site, then that's where you should have it
fixed.
On the other side of that, we tend to hand out demo loaners to our
customers if the shop can't fix the machine in a couple of days. Bet
the internet sales site doesn't do that.

Equipment dealers are independent businesses and they don't profit
from warranty work- warranty repair is a neccessary evil.

So how much did you 'save' (and don't forget shipping) by shortcutting
the local dealer?

-Carl

So help me with this hypothetical Carl. I am a traveling lumberjack,
and I happen to have my spanking new Husky break on me while in your
area. I come to your shop, and because I didn't buy the unit from you,
you're going to deny me service?

If that's the case, I'll never buy another Husky again, and I'll be
damned sure to tell my friends about it too. Pretty soon, you won't be
able to give them away.
--
Regards,

Rick

(Remove the HIGH SPOTS for e-mail)

In article , .
says...
Question:

Was the original seller of the chain saw an authorized dealer? A lot of
the stuff people buy off the net are not be sold by authorized dealers. The
sellers are just discounters who buy old stock from bankrupcies etc. and
resell it cheap to unsuspecting buyers.

Rick:
You make some very good points and the manufacturer would be a fool not to
check the serial numbers of the equipment before turning down a warrantee
claim on either the chain saw or the washer dryer.

Grey market products are flooding the market place and a lot of consumer
don't realize they are not covered by the manufacturers warrantee. My
advise to anyone buying on line or through mail order would be to ask for a
model number and serial number before purchasing. Then they should call the
manufacturer and find out date of manufacture and the warrantee status of
the product.

If the product was sold by an authorized dealer there is no way the
manufacturer can legally refuse to service it. Whether or not the local
dealer is obligated to fix it is another story because we don't know what
kind of contract the manufacturer has with the repair depot.

I'm retired now but this business of people buying stuff off the net and
expecting a local company to repair it under a warrantee for well below the
regular shop rate really upset me.

Jimbo,

The flip side of this is that many manufacturers actually pay a higher
reimbursement for those items serviced at a dealer when the item was not
purchased there. Not sure if this applies to Husky, but it sure does
for Toro and Ariens.

I agree about the authorized dealer part though, and if Rich bought gray
market then he's on his own. I also know that part of the problem with
Husky is that they now sell through chain stores, although their models
are a bit different than the ones in the dealer's storefront.

Perhaps I was rash and maybe we're not hearing the whole story from
Rich. I still can't understand the argument that a dealer - in business
to make money - would ever take on service work that would cost him
money.
--
Regards,

Rick

(Remove the HIGH SPOTS for e-mail)

Jimbo wrote:
Question:

Was the original seller of the chain saw an authorized dealer? A lot of
the stuff people buy off the net are not be sold by authorized dealers. The
sellers are just discounters who buy old stock from bankrupcies etc. and
resell it cheap to unsuspecting buyers.

Rick:
You make some very good points and the manufacturer would be a fool not to
check the serial numbers of the equipment before turning down a warrantee
claim on either the chain saw or the washer dryer.

Grey market products are flooding the market place and a lot of consumer
don't realize they are not covered by the manufacturers warrantee. My
advise to anyone buying on line or through mail order would be to ask for a
model number and serial number before purchasing. Then they should call the
manufacturer and find out date of manufacture and the warrantee status of
the product.

If the product was sold by an authorized dealer there is no way the
manufacturer can legally refuse to service it. Whether or not the local
dealer is obligated to fix it is another story because we don't know what
kind of contract the manufacturer has with the repair depot.

I'm retired now but this business of people buying stuff off the net and
expecting a local company to repair it under a warrantee for well below the
regular shop rate really upset me.

You have a right to be upset. But I'm not clear
who you should be upset with. I can recall my
dad's anger 40 years ago. He signed up as a dealer
for DuMont televisions and on his first warranty
repair, he was reimbursed $.40 for finding and
replacing a defective capacitor (condenser then).

So the problem is not new. Clearly, dealers should
be reimbursed at a profitable labor rate, but short
of legal action I don't think it's going to happen.

On the other hand, the dealer signed the dealer's
agreement and agreed to provide warranty support.
I suspect this includes products purchased elsewhere.
If not, the manufacturer should make it known to
Joe Consumer *before* he purchases the product.

I believe there was a huge lawsuit involving Ford
and whether or not a consumer could take his car
to an arbitrary dealer for warranty service. The
verdict was yes.

Ultimately, this is a dispute between the manufacturer
and the dealer. As long as neither bother to inform
the consumer of his status before he purchases the
product, he is not to blame.

"Rick Chamberlain" wrote in message
Perhaps I was rash and maybe we're not hearing the whole story from
Rich. I still can't understand the argument that a dealer - in business
to make money - would ever take on service work that would cost him
money.
--



Perhaps the amount the dealer gets reimbursed on warranty repairs is much
less than his normal shop rate? I owned a small engine repair shop. Warranty
sucked eggs as far as I was concerned. More paper work, we had to retain the
replaced parts just in case the manufacturer wanted the parts back, no
profit on parts, and then the best paying manufacturer was reimburseing a
bit better than 50% our normal shop rate, many were paying less than 50%!
More work involved, less payback! I did warranty for anyone reguardless
where the item was purchased, but hated every minute of it!
Greg

I really be interested to know how much Rich paid for his chain saw
including taxes and shipping? Then I'd like him to tell us what his local
dealership was asking for the same exact unit? Then I would like him to
post the model and serial number of the saw so that some knowledgable person
on this group can tell all of us what a fair price would be for the same
unit purchased through a local dealer.

I'd almost be willing to bet the difference in price won't add up to any
more than it will cost him for 1 hours service at full shop rate to get the
saw running properly.

Jimbo




"jim rozen" wrote in message
...
In article , Carl Byrns
says...

Equipment dealers are independent businesses and they don't profit
from warranty work- warranty repair is a neccessary evil.

Unfortunately this is true, even if you *do* buy
your stuff from a local dealer. They still hate doing
the warranty repair because it is $$$ out of their
pocket.

I've seen cases, locally, where the standard approach
to warranty repair is the "sunshine treatment" which
means the item or vehicle is simply left out in the
sunshine with the hopes that the magic solar rays
will fix it.

This goes on until the customer gets fed up and goes
elsewhere. Because of this practice you now see
lemon laws, they do that three times and they just
bought back your car.

This flip side is why I'm not shedding too many tears
for a dealer who is contractually required to do
a warranty repair, gets stuck with this sort of thing.
Consider: if the dealer's price were more in line with
the internet price, the entire thing could be avoided...

Jim

==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================

Jimbo wrote:
I really be interested to know how much Rich paid for his chain saw
including taxes and shipping? Then I'd like him to tell us what his local
dealership was asking for the same exact unit? Then I would like him to
post the model and serial number of the saw so that some knowledgable person
on this group can tell all of us what a fair price would be for the same
unit purchased through a local dealer.

I'd almost be willing to bet the difference in price won't add up to any
more than it will cost him for 1 hours service at full shop rate to get the
saw running properly.

The point is that he should not have to pay for
an hour's labor. He bought a new saw. It doesn't
work.

It's not his fault the saw is defective.

The issue is whether or not he should have to
send it back for warranty repair or get the
local dealer to do it.

Mail order has been around for decades. The
internet is just enhanced mail order. It's
not going to go away.

What I want to know is whether the dealer has
a contractual obligation to the manufacturer
to repair a product purchased elsewhere.

I saw this in two other groups. Are you just out to bash? Are you actually
reading the replies?


No I just post for fun and profit. hehe.

I am not bashing Husqvarna but I am posting to my 3 favorite groups. It
would be 4 groups but I dont think that alt.bread.recipes cares about 9hp
chainsaws.

If I was more aware of the dealer / mfgr situation I would of bought locally
on this purchase as this saw could require alot of service. I am using it to
mill lumber with an alaskan jig. But in the end I am glad I did not buy from
the dealer as he is really a jerk to deal with. I called the owner
personally and we had an amiable discussion but he still had the opinion
that I was just out to wreck his business by buying over the cursed
internet. I've since called other dealers and they are happy to look at it
or work on it warranty if it needs it. Only difference is I have to drive 20
miles instead of 2.

Personally I would rather have the dealer prove himself worthy of my future
business than lip service and still get bad service after buying at dealer
prices. That happened to me with John Deere.

For that I'll take the discount online, if all I have is thieves and liars
to deal with then I'll take the lowest price, just like at the car dealer.
hehe.

Rich

PS( My Lowes Poulon 49cc 20 inch saw is kicking butt. I've cut down about 19
palm trees, 1 oak and 1 hackberry plus other trimming jobs etc and I am
amazed it works so well. I did not expect much out of it so I guess I am
happy with whatever I get!)

"Jimbo" . wrote in message
...
I really be interested to know how much Rich paid for his chain saw
including taxes and shipping? Then I'd like him to tell us what his local
dealership was asking for the same exact unit? Then I would like him to
post the model and serial number of the saw so that some knowledgable
person
on this group can tell all of us what a fair price would be for the same
unit purchased through a local dealer.

I'd almost be willing to bet the difference in price won't add up to any
more than it will cost him for 1 hours service at full shop rate to get
the
saw running properly.

So I drive my Ford to Disneyland and having an under warranty transmission
problem have it serviced. I pay the dealer the difference between the
Arizona vehicle price and the California price for the repair?

Joel. phx


Jimbo




"jim rozen" wrote in message
...
In article , Carl Byrns
says...

Equipment dealers are independent businesses and they don't profit
from warranty work- warranty repair is a neccessary evil.

Unfortunately this is true, even if you *do* buy
your stuff from a local dealer. They still hate doing
the warranty repair because it is $$$ out of their
pocket.

I've seen cases, locally, where the standard approach
to warranty repair is the "sunshine treatment" which
means the item or vehicle is simply left out in the
sunshine with the hopes that the magic solar rays
will fix it.

This goes on until the customer gets fed up and goes
elsewhere. Because of this practice you now see
lemon laws, they do that three times and they just
bought back your car.

This flip side is why I'm not shedding too many tears
for a dealer who is contractually required to do
a warranty repair, gets stuck with this sort of thing.
Consider: if the dealer's price were more in line with
the internet price, the entire thing could be avoided...

Jim

==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================

"Rich" wrote in message
om...

Personally I would rather have the dealer prove himself worthy of my
future
business than lip service and still get bad service after buying at dealer
prices. That happened to me with John Deere.

For that I'll take the discount online, if all I have is thieves and liars
to deal with then I'll take the lowest price, just like at the car dealer.
hehe.

If all you have locally is thieves and liars then ship it
http://www.baileys-online.com they obviously do a big business both in
servicing and selling Husky saws by mail order / internet.

I'm lucky to have a local shop that I trust and that takes good care of me,
happens to be a Stihl shop so I am a "stihl" person. If they weren't here
I'd have bought a Husky from Baileys rather than deal with the local
alternatives.

Bob

With all due respect I did not mean he should have to pay one hours labour.
All I was trying to say was the cost to buy the thing locally probably
wouldn't have been no more than one hours labour and he would be going
through all this trouble. On top of that the local dealer would probably
have fixed it under warrantee if he hadn't pulled the carb apart. If the
dealer wouldn't fixed it under warrantee he could have taken them to small
claims court. The fact that he has done some work on the carb has probably
voided any warrantee that might have been on the unit.

Your right mail order houses have been around for years but the internet and
E-Bay in particular have attracted a new form of mail order business that
doesn't exactly market after sales service as a selling point. I have one
friend who is getting excellent after sales service from a New York Camera
store but everything he has bought has had to be returned at least twice and
still after 3 month they haven't solved all the problems with defective
merchandise.

IMHO to save money in the long shop locally or suffer the consequences.

Jimbo


"Jim Stewart" wrote in message
...
Jimbo wrote:
I really be interested to know how much Rich paid for his chain saw
including taxes and shipping? Then I'd like him to tell us what his
local
dealership was asking for the same exact unit? Then I would like him to
post the model and serial number of the saw so that some knowledgable
person
on this group can tell all of us what a fair price would be for the same
unit purchased through a local dealer.

I'd almost be willing to bet the difference in price won't add up to any
more than it will cost him for 1 hours service at full shop rate to get
the
saw running properly.

The point is that he should not have to pay for
an hour's labor. He bought a new saw. It doesn't
work.

It's not his fault the saw is defective.

The issue is whether or not he should have to
send it back for warranty repair or get the
local dealer to do it.

Mail order has been around for decades. The
internet is just enhanced mail order. It's
not going to go away.

What I want to know is whether the dealer has
a contractual obligation to the manufacturer
to repair a product purchased elsewhere.

In article ,
says...

"Rick Chamberlain" wrote in message
Perhaps I was rash and maybe we're not hearing the whole story from
Rich. I still can't understand the argument that a dealer - in business
to make money - would ever take on service work that would cost him
money.
--



Perhaps the amount the dealer gets reimbursed on warranty repairs is much
less than his normal shop rate? I owned a small engine repair shop. Warranty
sucked eggs as far as I was concerned. More paper work, we had to retain the
replaced parts just in case the manufacturer wanted the parts back, no
profit on parts, and then the best paying manufacturer was reimburseing a
bit better than 50% our normal shop rate, many were paying less than 50%!
More work involved, less payback! I did warranty for anyone reguardless
where the item was purchased, but hated every minute of it!
Greg


This has nothing to do with reimbursement rates. If the shop doesn't
make money doing warranty work, then why do it?

Also, the warranty is between the manufacturer and the consumer,
executed by authorized service centers. I don't personally care if the
shop makes nothing - they agreed to be an agent of the company and honor
the warranty.

That said, this shop had a chance to convert a non-customer into one,
and failed miserably. The shop owner didn't look at potential future
business, only that Rich didn't buy the saw from him, so screw him.

I'm glad you personally chose to honor warranty work from people who
didn't purchase from you, but fail to see why you would take 50% of your
normal rate for it.
--
Regards,

Rick

(Remove the HIGH SPOTS for e-mail)

Joel Corwith:

No Joel that's not what I mean.

Buying from a company that is part of the dealer network protects you from
that. If the seller is not part of that dealer network or a Grey Market
dealer your not in the dealer network anymore.

Nikon USA does not give warrantee coverage on cameras that do not have a
serial numbers proving they where legally imported into the USA for sale as
new camera's. However a tourist or any other person with a broken camera
can get their camera repaied N/C in the USA or any other country by proving
it was purchased from a licenced dealer any where in the world. It all
comes down to buying from an authorized dealer not some guy who buys up
bankrucy stock or out of date models and sells them cheap.

Jimbo
"Joel Corwith" wrote in message
...

"Jimbo" . wrote in message
...
I really be interested to know how much Rich paid for his chain saw
including taxes and shipping? Then I'd like him to tell us what his
local
dealership was asking for the same exact unit? Then I would like him to
post the model and serial number of the saw so that some knowledgable
person
on this group can tell all of us what a fair price would be for the same
unit purchased through a local dealer.

I'd almost be willing to bet the difference in price won't add up to any
more than it will cost him for 1 hours service at full shop rate to get
the
saw running properly.

So I drive my Ford to Disneyland and having an under warranty transmission
problem have it serviced. I pay the dealer the difference between the
Arizona vehicle price and the California price for the repair?

Joel. phx


Jimbo




"jim rozen" wrote in message
...
In article , Carl Byrns
says...

Equipment dealers are independent businesses and they don't profit
from warranty work- warranty repair is a neccessary evil.

Unfortunately this is true, even if you *do* buy
your stuff from a local dealer. They still hate doing
the warranty repair because it is $$$ out of their
pocket.

I've seen cases, locally, where the standard approach
to warranty repair is the "sunshine treatment" which
means the item or vehicle is simply left out in the
sunshine with the hopes that the magic solar rays
will fix it.

This goes on until the customer gets fed up and goes
elsewhere. Because of this practice you now see
lemon laws, they do that three times and they just
bought back your car.

This flip side is why I'm not shedding too many tears
for a dealer who is contractually required to do
a warranty repair, gets stuck with this sort of thing.
Consider: if the dealer's price were more in line with
the internet price, the entire thing could be avoided...

Jim

==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================

On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 17:44:34 -0600, Rick Chamberlain
wrote:

In article , .
says...
Question:

Was the original seller of the chain saw an authorized dealer? A lot of
the stuff people buy off the net are not be sold by authorized dealers. The
sellers are just discounters who buy old stock from bankrupcies etc. and
resell it cheap to unsuspecting buyers.


Worse yet, a LARGE percentage are "reconditioned". Part and parcel of
dealing with the big box stores where no-one knows squat about the
product. Customer isn't happy? Take it back. Send it back to Husky,
or whoever. They send all the stuff to some "recoditioner" in Mexico
who cleans them up, tests them and reboxes them. They then end up at
liquidators with NO FACTORY WARRANTY.
Any company who wants to keep their reputation for producing excellent
products and providing exemplary service needs to avoid the WalMarts
and Home Depots of the world like the plague.
In electronics and computers in particular, put Office Place, Office
Depot, Best buy, and suchlike on the same list.


Rick:
You make some very good points and the manufacturer would be a fool not to
check the serial numbers of the equipment before turning down a warrantee
claim on either the chain saw or the washer dryer.

Grey market products are flooding the market place and a lot of consumer
don't realize they are not covered by the manufacturers warrantee. My
advise to anyone buying on line or through mail order would be to ask for a
model number and serial number before purchasing. Then they should call the
manufacturer and find out date of manufacture and the warrantee status of
the product.

If the product was sold by an authorized dealer there is no way the
manufacturer can legally refuse to service it. Whether or not the local
dealer is obligated to fix it is another story because we don't know what
kind of contract the manufacturer has with the repair depot.

I'm retired now but this business of people buying stuff off the net and
expecting a local company to repair it under a warrantee for well below the
regular shop rate really upset me.

Jimbo,

The flip side of this is that many manufacturers actually pay a higher
reimbursement for those items serviced at a dealer when the item was not
purchased there. Not sure if this applies to Husky, but it sure does
for Toro and Ariens.

I agree about the authorized dealer part though, and if Rich bought gray
market then he's on his own. I also know that part of the problem with
Husky is that they now sell through chain stores, although their models
are a bit different than the ones in the dealer's storefront.

Perhaps I was rash and maybe we're not hearing the whole story from
Rich. I still can't understand the argument that a dealer - in business
to make money - would ever take on service work that would cost him
money.

In article , Jimbo says...

I really be interested to know how much Rich paid for his chain saw
including taxes and shipping? Then I'd like him to tell us what his local
dealership was asking for the same exact unit? Then I would like him to
post the model and serial number of the saw so that some knowledgable person
on this group can tell all of us what a fair price would be for the same
unit purchased through a local dealer.

Local, *where*?

If the dealers only honor warranties from local purchases,
then the notion of a price from a local dealer is moot.

It does him no good if he lives in NYC, and your price
is only good in Yuma, Arizona.

Jim

==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================

"Rick Chamberlain" wrote in message
I'm glad you personally chose to honor warranty work from people who
didn't purchase from you, but fail to see why you would take 50% of your
normal rate for it.


I did not set the warranty labor rate, the manufacturer did. As a servicing
dealer I felt I was obligated to do warranty work. I may have had a choice
to refuse some jobs, I don't know. In the long run it possibly paid off,
getting more regular sevice from previous warranty customers. I was doing
what I felt best to increase my bussiness, I may have been wrong!
(considering I went broke doing it!)
Greg

On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 17:01:20 -0600, Rick Chamberlain
wrote:


So help me with this hypothetical Carl. I am a traveling lumberjack,
and I happen to have my spanking new Husky break on me while in your
area. I come to your shop, and because I didn't buy the unit from you,
you're going to deny me service?

Not at all.
If you have a bill of sale from an authorized dealer, then we'll honor
the warranty.

If you bought it from a non-authorized reseller, then it's you break
it, we fix it, you pay for it and then you submit a claim to the
reseller.

If that's the case, I'll never buy another Husky again, and I'll be
damned sure to tell my friends about it too. Pretty soon, you won't be
able to give them away.

We don't sell Husky.

-Carl

On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 17:44:34 -0600, Rick Chamberlain
wrote:



The flip side of this is that many manufacturers actually pay a higher
reimbursement for those items serviced at a dealer when the item was not
purchased there. Not sure if this applies to Husky, but it sure does
for Toro

Bull****.
Toro _Authorized_ dealers can turn warranty work away on items they
did not sell, and because they tend to be mom-n-pop hardware stores,
they do.
Toro _Master Service_ dealers cannot turn work away because they are
primarily power equipment dealers and have enough employees to handle
the service work.

In either case, Toro does not pay a higher labor or parts rate.

-Carl (who works for a Toro distributor)

On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 19:45:01 GMT, "Rich"
wrote:

===Purchased a nice chainsaw via internet like most of all my tools.
===
===Saw had a brake problem with the chain and I called the local service center
===for warranty work and they said come on down.
===Once they found out I purchased it on the internet at the shop they refused
===to work on it as a warranty job since I didnt buy it from them. They cited
===low pay from Husky on warranty work and were not willing to do it if they
===didnt make the sale.
===
===I called Husqvarna about the problem and they told me that "I need to
===understand the dealers perspective" and they have the right to refuse
===service, even warranty work when they are an authorized dealer/repair
===center.
===
===Most likely it is a simple fix as far as adjusting the brake band on the
===clutch but it seems the local dealers are fighting back and I am caught in
===the middle.
===
===Who cares about me, they all got my money and in the mean time I have
===useless, expensive, orange boat anchor with Husqvarna written on the side.
===
===Anyway be advised if your buying mail order chainsaws.
===
===Rich
===


I see now differenc ein if you bought a saw and then moved 1000 miles
away to another town and had problems, Husky has to honor their
warranty no matter where or how you gopt youor saw. Sure it may not be
given first priority but if its actually warranted a Husky dealer
should fix it. Find a Husky dealer thats not a jerk and don't tell em
you bought it cheaper off the internet. I think I would be putting me
up a website dedicated to Husky if I did not get any satisfaction out
of them. I did it with Crapsman Sears and got their attention after I
sent them an email pointing them to what I had on the website it did
not take long until I got a call from the local service manager who
was then more than eager to remedy my troubles.
Visit my website: http://www.frugalmachinist.com
Opinions expressed are those of my wifes,
I had no input whatsoever.
Remove "nospam" from email addy.

On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 22:20:00 GMT, Carl Byrns
wrote:

===On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 19:45:01 GMT, "Rich"
===wrote:
===
===Purchased a nice chainsaw via internet like most of all my tools.
===
===Saw had a brake problem with the chain and I called the local service center
===for warranty work and they said come on down.
===Once they found out I purchased it on the internet at the shop they refused
===to work on it as a warranty job since I didnt buy it from them. They cited
===low pay from Husky on warranty work and were not willing to do it if they
===didnt make the sale.
===
===I called Husqvarna about the problem and they told me that "I need to
===understand the dealers perspective" and they have the right to refuse
===service, even warranty work when they are an authorized dealer/repair
===center.
===
===Most likely it is a simple fix as far as adjusting the brake band on the
===clutch but it seems the local dealers are fighting back and I am caught in
===the middle.
===
===Who cares about me, they all got my money and in the mean time I have
===useless, expensive, orange boat anchor with Husqvarna written on the side.
===
===Anyway be advised if your buying mail order chainsaws.
===
===Rich
===
===
===I'm with the dealer. We sell power equipment our thought is if you
===bought from some internet site, then that's where you should have it
===fixed.
===On the other side of that, we tend to hand out demo loaners to our
===customers if the shop can't fix the machine in a couple of days. Bet
===the internet sales site doesn't do that.
===
===Equipment dealers are independent businesses and they don't profit
===from warranty work- warranty repair is a neccessary evil.
===
===So how much did you 'save' (and don't forget shipping) by shortcutting
===the local dealer?
===
===-Carl


Refusing warranty because you did ot sell it is pure bull****! If its
warranted then it should be serviced by any authorized dealer no
matter where it was purchased.
Visit my website: http://www.frugalmachinist.com
Opinions expressed are those of my wifes,
I had no input whatsoever.
Remove "nospam" from email addy.

On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 16:49:12 -0600, Rick Chamberlain
wrote:

Husky did not give Rich the option of buying the chainsaw
without a warranty for a reduced price. I don't know of their warranty
language, but unless Rich violated a clause in the warranty, he is
entitled to service.


How do you know Rich bought the saw new?
He said he bought it on the internet- maybe from eBay?
Or an outfit like Northern that sells 'factory serviced' returned
units that don't have a warranty, or have a very limited one.

Sorry for the rant, but these local dealers make their own bed when they
sign up to be service centers. I can't imagine any of these places sign
up for warranty service to lose money.

I don't know what you do for living, but I doubt your employer would
be thrilled if I bought a bunch of his (broken) products from some
secondary market and then demanded he fix them for free. Of course, if
he refuses, I'd bitch about it on a bunch of newsgroups.
Sounds fair?

-Carl

In article ,
says...
On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 17:01:20 -0600, Rick Chamberlain
wrote:


So help me with this hypothetical Carl. I am a traveling lumberjack,
and I happen to have my spanking new Husky break on me while in your
area. I come to your shop, and because I didn't buy the unit from you,
you're going to deny me service?

Not at all.
If you have a bill of sale from an authorized dealer, then we'll honor
the warranty.

How many traveling lumberjacks carry the receipt for their chainsaw with
them?

If you bought it from a non-authorized reseller, then it's you break
it, we fix it, you pay for it and then you submit a claim to the
reseller.

Fair enough. Never said I had a problem with that. Now, what about
those who buy from an authorized dealer but can't produce a receipt for
you? Like when I travel to my cottage - I don't take my chainsaw
receipt with me "just in case".

If that's the case, I'll never buy another Husky again, and I'll be
damned sure to tell my friends about it too. Pretty soon, you won't be
able to give them away.

We don't sell Husky.

Perhaps you're just too obtuse to see the point.

--
Regards,

Rick

(Remove the HIGH SPOTS for e-mail)

On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 16:54:23 -0800, Jim Stewart
wrote:


The point is that he should not have to pay for
an hour's labor. He bought a new saw. It doesn't
work.

We don't know that. He bought a saw- it might be new old stock (sat on
the shelf for three years) or some 'factory reconditioned' machine.

What I want to know is whether the dealer has
a contractual obligation to the manufacturer
to repair a product purchased elsewhere.

Depends on the company.

As I noted in another post:
Toro _Authorized_ dealers can turn warranty work away on items they
did not sell, and because they tend to be mom-n-pop hardware stores,
they do.
This is to protect the small dealer from being swamped by work from a
big-box store (BTW, most warranty problems are caused by the
customer).

Toro _Master Service_ dealers cannot turn work away because they are
primarily power equipment dealers and have enough employees to handle
the service work.

-Carl (who works for a Toro distributor)

In article ,
says...
On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 17:44:34 -0600, Rick Chamberlain
wrote:



The flip side of this is that many manufacturers actually pay a higher
reimbursement for those items serviced at a dealer when the item was not
purchased there. Not sure if this applies to Husky, but it sure does
for Toro

Bull****.
Toro _Authorized_ dealers can turn warranty work away on items they
did not sell, and because they tend to be mom-n-pop hardware stores,
they do.
Toro _Master Service_ dealers cannot turn work away because they are
primarily power equipment dealers and have enough employees to handle
the service work.

In either case, Toro does not pay a higher labor or parts rate.

-Carl (who works for a Toro distributor)

Good for you Carl. So tell that to my Toro dealer who told me point
blank that he does get a higher rate for those items he doesn't sell.
Perhaps he's a master service dealer?
--
Regards,

Rick

(Remove the HIGH SPOTS for e-mail)

In article ,
says...
On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 16:49:12 -0600, Rick Chamberlain
wrote:

Husky did not give Rich the option of buying the chainsaw
without a warranty for a reduced price. I don't know of their warranty
language, but unless Rich violated a clause in the warranty, he is
entitled to service.


How do you know Rich bought the saw new?
He said he bought it on the internet- maybe from eBay?
Or an outfit like Northern that sells 'factory serviced' returned
units that don't have a warranty, or have a very limited one.

Are you trying to tell me that dealers have no way to check on serial
numbers to see when they were manufactured? At the very least, you can
figure out if the warranty is going to be iffy and call the manufacturer
on behalf of the customer.

Sorry for the rant, but these local dealers make their own bed when they
sign up to be service centers. I can't imagine any of these places sign
up for warranty service to lose money.

I don't know what you do for living, but I doubt your employer would
be thrilled if I bought a bunch of his (broken) products from some
secondary market and then demanded he fix them for free. Of course, if
he refuses, I'd bitch about it on a bunch of newsgroups.
Sounds fair?

Yes, it is. If it is under warranty and you are an agent of the company
who provides that warranty, you are under oblation to fix the item.

If you can prove the item is out of warranty, or there was neglect or
abuse that voided the warranty, then you have no obligation to fix the
item.

The dealer fixes nothing for free when it is warranty work, so please
don't imply that it costs you to perform warranty service. Because if
that is true, then you are truly in the wrong line of work.

You know, if you were a true businessman, you'd see this as an
opportunity to win future business away from another vendor instead as
seeing it as a burden.

--
Regards,

Rick

(Remove the HIGH SPOTS for e-mail)

On Fri, 23 Jan 2004 04:26:50 GMT, Rick Chamberlain
wrote:


Good for you Carl. So tell that to my Toro dealer who told me point
blank that he does get a higher rate for those items he doesn't sell.
Perhaps he's a master service dealer?

Good question. I'll ask my consumer products service rep- I work in
commercial.

-Carl

Hmmm....

Well, I'm not a lawyer and don't play one on TV, but I'll bet some set
of laws in one of the states involved cover "merchantability" and
"implied warranty" and some other things that they can't get out of
even under contract. By all means have a word with Husqvarna...

Aside - 20 years ago a friend wore a hat that said "Husqvarna Repair
Team" and I said "how did you get that" and he said "you buy a
Husqvarna chain saw, you are on the repair team". Right. Check.
Don't ever buy one of those.

As for the internet versus local shop debate, it's quite clear to me
that some internet shops will take returns much more liberally than my
locals will (or can afford.) There are some products that are hard to
find locally. And there are some products (cameras, notably) that
seem to be the same price at every reputable dealer, and a different
same price at every shady one.