The Daring Dufas wrote:

On 9/27/2010 5:54 PM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Grumpy wrote:

Perhaps some of you do not know difference going back to finish job
or getting call back, now we are going on subject of warrantees

I had one call back in apx. 20 years, and the reason that I had that
because of manufacturing screwed up which I windup paying for it
That is also because I did not go by my own instinct but lessoning
to some else big mistake that will not happen again!!!


Sigh. What a load. A 'callback' on some of my jobs would require it
to be scheduled on one of NASA's launches to the ISS. A lot of the work
I've done was mission critical. There was no room for mistakes. Only
when working as a TV tech when I was still in high school were the
standards low enough to see the occasional callback. Of course, tube
TVs needed a lot more maintenance than modern electronics.


Being a perfectionist causes high blood pressure, hair loss and
resentment from those who can't differentiate their anus from an
excavation. Do it right, do it once is my philosophy. In HVAC
and refrigeration work, a little extra time can guarantee a no
leak situation. It never ceases to amaze me at what I find on
some of the service calls I go on where I was not the first to
fondle a pristine piece of equipment. 8-)


Be careful. Some of the quacks do more than fondle the hardware.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

Stormin Mormon wrote:

My experience with smokers has not been good. I prefer not to work
with them. Of course, my allergies help make that decision.


They also tend to disappear whenever the work starts, too.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

wrote:

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 18:54:09 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


Grumpy wrote:

Perhaps some of you do not know difference going back to finish job
or getting call back, now we are going on subject of warrantees

I had one call back in apx. 20 years, and the reason that I had that
because of manufacturing screwed up which I windup paying for it
That is also because I did not go by my own instinct but lessoning
to some else big mistake that will not happen again!!!


Sigh. What a load. A 'callback' on some of my jobs would require it
to be scheduled on one of NASA's launches to the ISS. A lot of the work
I've done was mission critical. There was no room for mistakes. Only
when working as a TV tech when I was still in high school were the
standards low enough to see the occasional callback. Of course, tube
TVs needed a lot more maintenance than modern electronics.

So - the supply house carries maybe 10,000 items in stock.
They have maybe another 40,000 or 100,000 they can order. You want
the HVAC guy should carry one of each on his truck ?



Sigh. What a moron. How hard is it to ask what brand you will be
servicing, or even better, you keep records of what eqyuiipment each
customer owns? I carred close to 10,000 parts in my service truck for
electronics. I rarely ever took anything back to the shop, except when
some 'bucther' (a so-called tech that uses a meat cleaver to take things
apart) had really screwed it up.



A quick check at some random parts site

http://americanhvacparts.com/Merchan...egory_Code=ele

Shows 24 TEV's for just one manufacturer. They are not
interchangeable. They list 29 other manufacturers with TEV's as well.


And you never have a clue what you are going to work on?


You figure the HVAC guy should carry 700 TEV's on his truck ? And
that's just one part among hundreds that are common.

Now try doing the work outside, at night, in the rain, or in a
blizzard, or in the blazing sun on a 98 degree humid day. Try having
to go up and down a 32 foot ladder and then walk ~ 1/4 mile across a
white roof in the sun to get to the unit. And back again for each
tool or part you need.


try working outside at -40


If you happen to need a 50 lb tank of gas, or a 30 lb torch, or a 20
lb vacumn up there - get to humpin' it. Then bring it all down again.


Try hauling ANY torch up a broadcast tower.


And you better get 4 or 5 calls done, minimum, on a slow day.

TV repairmen are wusses.


Yawn. Electronics repair takes real troubleshooting skills. All you
need are bull****ting skils.



--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 19:54:21 -0400, wrote:
....

If you happen to need a 50 lb tank of gas, or a 30 lb torch, or a 20
lb vacumn up there - get to humpin' it. Then bring it all down again.

And you better get 4 or 5 calls done, minimum, on a slow day.

TV repairmen are wusses.

TV repairmen are extinct. Nobody is going to pay $500 to fix a $500 TV.
There was a while when some shops could stay in business fixing big
screen (40"+) tv's but that was only while such TV's cost $5000. Those
days are pretty much gone.

wrote:

Michael A. Terrell wrote:

No kidding. I've worked 20 hour days to get a job done on time, rather
than make return trips.

Then you're an idiot.


Yawn. Exactly what I'd expect from some lazy ass like you. A good
customer has an emergency. They offer to pay for the overtime, so you
sk the crew if they want the work. When they say yes, you do the job.
Some where scheduled, but waiting for all the parts to arrive before we
started the job.

I routinely worked two 20 hour days every other weekend while I was
in the US Army. It's something that real men can handle.


My crew brought their lunch, and the only
breaks we took were for the restrooms.

And for pushing you in front of the truck, no doubt.



Not at all. We finished a week's work in two days, then had five days
off. It let the customer stay on schedule, and they sent a lot more
work to us.


One firm rule was no smokers were ever hired, since a
lot of work was in schools.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

AZ Nomad wrote:

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 19:54:21 -0400, wrote:
...

If you happen to need a 50 lb tank of gas, or a 30 lb torch, or a 20
lb vacumn up there - get to humpin' it. Then bring it all down again.

And you better get 4 or 5 calls done, minimum, on a slow day.

TV repairmen are wusses.

TV repairmen are extinct. Nobody is going to pay $500 to fix a $500 TV.
There was a while when some shops could stay in business fixing big
screen (40"+) tv's but that was only while such TV's cost $5000. Those
days are pretty much gone.


There are only a couple TV shops left around here, and most of their
work is installing home theaters.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

Yep, I certainly do. If you are not properly equipped to fix the
problem, you charge extra for your incompetence.

Not everybody uses a warehouse sized semi for a service truck. I carry
enough parts on my truck to be able to effect permanant repairs 24/7 90% of
the time. If I get called out at oh-dark thirty, on a Sunday, or holiday,
your damn tootin I am gonna charge the OT service call just to come out, and
charge 'em for the regular service call if I have to go back with parts I
had to get from the supply house.

As a rule, if I don't have a part on the truck for the repair durning normal
work hours, I don't charge to go to the supply house to get it, and I don't
charge for a second service call.

I do *EVERYTHING* on flat rate, and the customer knows up front what its
going to cost before I make any repairs. The only variable is the
refrigerant charge. I can't tell them in that in advance until the system is
running and I put the thermometers, and gauges to it to see if the
refrigerant charge is correctly balanced.

Steve wrote:

Yep, I certainly do. If you are not properly equipped to fix the
problem, you charge extra for your incompetence.

Not everybody uses a warehouse sized semi for a service truck.


I used a stepvan for field work. It saved me a lot of time, and I
could do a couple more jobs per day because of it.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

On 9/27/2010 6:19 PM, Steve B wrote:
You can interpret any way you like but that is not what I said!
What I siad and meant is or was
If I have all material that is require and I was able to complete the work
charge is minimum 4 hours!
If I don't have all material require and I need to go back then
first trip would be 3 hours and second trip will be also min. 3 hours
unless it takes longer! Do you understand now!
I know that my english is not perfect but perhaps I should drow you a
picture?

I'm one of the ones you'll have to drow (sic) a picture for. Are you saying
that you are a service person, and IF you do not have the materials on your
truck, that the client is responsible for you to go and get it?

I was a contractor for nearly ten years. I prided myself in running trucks
that were STOCKED. On slow days, or when we had new personnel, their job
was to go through EVERY truck and make sure that EVERY bin of nuts, bolts,
widgets and wuzzits was full. When they learned how to do this, and they
got out into the field, they would understand what it was like to go into an
empty bin.

Sounds like you needed more time in the shop stocking trucks.

Now, that does not go for every trade. Like the HVAC guys. They cannot be
expected to carry everything they need. They only need to carry the
essentials like an AmProbe, tick tracer, beer opener, and minimal tools.
Everything else requires a trip to the local supplier and 4 hours pay. A
GOOD HVAC guy carries only what will fit into a lawyer's brief case.


I've got no problem with a tech, and maybe his trainee, making a recon
trip if they don't know what major parts will be needed. Of course they
should have the common small stuff on the truck, but, but once you get
past 80/20 rule, no truck is big enough. I try to be fair with tradesmen
that come out to the house, but I'm not gonna trust them to be here
while I am at work any more. I'm not an expert on all stuff house
related, but I did grow up in the business, and it irritates me when
they try to BS their way through something that I do know about.

--
aem sends..,

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 20:09:58 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


AZ Nomad wrote:

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 19:54:21 -0400, wrote:
...

If you happen to need a 50 lb tank of gas, or a 30 lb torch, or a 20
lb vacumn up there - get to humpin' it. Then bring it all down again.

And you better get 4 or 5 calls done, minimum, on a slow day.

TV repairmen are wusses.

TV repairmen are extinct. Nobody is going to pay $500 to fix a $500 TV.
There was a while when some shops could stay in business fixing big
screen (40"+) tv's but that was only while such TV's cost $5000. Those
days are pretty much gone.


There are only a couple TV shops left around here, and most of their
work is installing home theaters.

I had a service tech out to work on my 46" plasma set. Panasonic covered it
completely under their warranty, even though it expired a year before (seems
they know they have a power supply problem). The tech had to come from
Columbus GA, so there aren't many around here either, though the service
manager at work has a side business repairing electronics.

"Grumpy" wrote in message
...
Perhaps some of you do not know difference going back to finish job
or getting call back, now we are going on subject of warrantees

I had one call back in apx. 20 years, and the reason that I had that
because of manufacturing screwed up which I windup paying for it
That is also because I did not go by my own instinct but lessoning
to some else big mistake that will not happen again!!!



"Michael A. Terrell" wrote in message
m...

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" wrote:

"Grumpy" fired this volley in news:i7oa08$qa8$1
@news.eternal-september.org:

NO I charge minimum 3 hours plus 0.80 per mile plus tolls
if I need to go back and 4 hour if I don't need to go back

So, you're saying if you screw up, or you can't fix it on the first
call,
you charge more?

That's certainly in keeping with the "j.m" types I am familiar with.

In my business, if we screw up, we eat the sale, and replace the goods
at
no charge.


The same as when I was in the industrail electronics repair
business. If our tech missed a problem, all the customer paid for was
any additional parts. Id didn't make a lot of difference, since the
callback rate was under 1%.

My call back rate was also very low. That was because when I left, I was
100% sure that everything was done 100% right. I did not achieve 100%, as
there were human errors, but call backs will kill you, especially if they
are something that you should have done in the course of doing it right the
first time. Half to a whole day shot. And Zero income for it.

Steve

fired this volley in
:


Now try doing the work outside, at night, in the rain, or in a
blizzard, or in the blazing sun on a 98 degree humid day. Try having
to go up and down a 32 foot ladder and then walk ~ 1/4 mile across a
white roof in the sun to get to the unit. And back again for each
tool or part you need.

If you happen to need a 50 lb tank of gas, or a 30 lb torch, or a 20
lb vacumn up there - get to humpin' it. Then bring it all down again.

And you better get 4 or 5 calls done, minimum, on a slow day.

TV repairmen are wusses.

Awww... Poor BABY! Try setting up and shooting ONE fireworks show on the
4th in San Antonio. Then, do three on three consecutive nights.

You wouldn't last through 1/2 of the first day's setup -- 104F actual
O.A.T, 82%RH, and twenty hours of work for the first show. Then you tear
down, re-rig, and get the next one up in 9 hours, and the next...

And 6" racks (of mortars, goof) weigh 80lb each, and you "only" have to
lug about 80 of them, and 100+ 5" racks, and a couple of hundred 4" and
3" racks.

YOU are not only a thief, but a pussy, too. I have even less sympathy
for your lazy ass than ever before.

LLoyd

"Michael A. Terrell" fired this volley in
:

Sigh. What a moron. How hard is it to ask what brand you will be
servicing, or even better, you keep records of what eqyuiipment each
customer owns? I carred close to 10,000 parts in my service truck for
electronics. I rarely ever took anything back to the shop, except when
some 'bucther' (a so-called tech that uses a meat cleaver to take
things
apart) had really screwed it up.

Not only, Michael, but when WE get a trouble call, we closely refine what
it is the customer has, what he DOESN'T have, what we need, and what we
MIGHT need. Then we pack up the whole lot that might be necessary for
the call. And we do it on the first visit.

Alt.Hvac thieves don't... they WANT that second... third... fourth call
at scale.

LLoyd

"Steve B" fired this volley in
:

call backs will kill you, especially if they
are something that you should have done in the course of doing it
right the first time. Half to a whole day shot. And Zero income for
it.

OH, NO! According to .p.jm. you should charge another minimum 4 hours for
your screw-up! C'mon, Steve! G

LLoyd

fired this volley in
:

Bet you wished you hired a helper, huh ? Must be tough on a
guy moving 6,400 pounds all by himself.

Heh! That's the funny part. You think that's an extraordinary amount of
work. I see 5000lb in a day to be a reasonable amount for a _skilled_
worker to handle, along with the technical details -- like coercing the
electricians to do their job properly by actually KNOWING how to do it
better than they do... by "encouraging" the A/V guys to figure out which
channel is sync, and which is house audio, because they don't know, and I
do... by talking through the stadium audio delays with the booth
personnel, because they know what the delays are FOR, but not how they
work... by explaining the law to the local fire marshal, because he's
never actually read it himself... by... naw... you get the picture.

I actually USE more disciplines in a single day on a shoot site than
you'll exercise in your whole career... and I _understand_ all of them
(including how to build electronics on-site from "crap and bubblegum"
when they're needed), while you barely understand that the high pressure
line needs to be hooked up to the high pressure gauge.

LLoyd

fired this volley in
:

You're either a liar, an asshole, or both.

Or... I've got YOU pegged, for sure! Besides, your reputation precedes
you.

You are a thie.. um... HVAC "professional".

LLoyd

wrote:

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 20:03:10 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


wrote:

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 18:54:09 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


Grumpy wrote:

Perhaps some of you do not know difference going back to finish job
or getting call back, now we are going on subject of warrantees

I had one call back in apx. 20 years, and the reason that I had that
because of manufacturing screwed up which I windup paying for it
That is also because I did not go by my own instinct but lessoning
to some else big mistake that will not happen again!!!


Sigh. What a load. A 'callback' on some of my jobs would require it
to be scheduled on one of NASA's launches to the ISS. A lot of the work
I've done was mission critical. There was no room for mistakes. Only
when working as a TV tech when I was still in high school were the
standards low enough to see the occasional callback. Of course, tube
TVs needed a lot more maintenance than modern electronics.

So - the supply house carries maybe 10,000 items in stock.
They have maybe another 40,000 or 100,000 they can order. You want
the HVAC guy should carry one of each on his truck ?



Sigh. What a moron. How hard is it to ask what brand you will be
servicing, or even better, you keep records of what eqyuiipment each
customer owns? I carred close to 10,000 parts in my service truck for

Bull**** you did. BTW, that bag or tray of 10 or 100
resistors of a certain value doesn't count as '100 parts', it counts
as 'one'.


Yawn. You know nothing about electronic repair. The E24 range has a
lot of different values. Then they come in multiple wattages, and
specail applications. Fusible reistors used to be very common, and there
were a lot of different versions.

Capacitors come in values from picfards to microfards, in a lot of
different voltages and dielectrics. Then there were tubes, transistors,
ICs, switches, controls and hardware. There was probably over a half
million different parts made over the years, but you usually only saw
about a dozen or so brands in an area. I'm sure that the wolsalers of
your junk don't carry every brand of equipment, so you are using a
pathetic strawman.


Moron.

1 ) you assume it's a prior customer, where there would BE
records of what's there.


If the HVAC industry wasn't full of theives you'd have customer
loyalty.


2 ) you assume they KNOW what kind of unit it is, or can find
out ( hint - maybe SOMETIMES in residential, almost NEVER in
commercial work ).

3 ) You imply that the service guy is going to go back to the
shop and custom-stock his truck for a particular brand.


Maybe, if the company is run by idiots. We had a fleet of trucks,
equipped for different brands

electronics. I rarely ever took anything back to the shop, except when
some 'bucther' (a so-called tech that uses a meat cleaver to take things
apart) had really screwed it up.

Yah, HVAC guys rarely take the unit back to the shop either.
Except Stormy, who only works on window units.


About the only things I took back to the shop were entire intercom
consoles, and only after some idiot left it in an unsafe condition.




A quick check at some random parts site

http://americanhvacparts.com/Merchan...egory_Code=ele

Shows 24 TEV's for just one manufacturer. They are not
interchangeable. They list 29 other manufacturers with TEV's as well.


And you never have a clue what you are going to work on?

'An AC unit' is usually the only info. And yeh, for a repeat
customer, I know they have all XYZ brand on the roof - 100 - 200 units
maybe. Maybe 10 different sizes and configurations.

And I have a clue that that's only one of the calls I have to
take that day. The call is some other brand, equipment type,
whatever. You think the tech goes back to the shop to load up for
'XYZ' brand for one call ? You think he takes 100 + parts off his
truck and puts a different 100 + on, based on what brand of unit he's
headed to ? Moron.


You're repating yourerself. You need to up your medication.



You figure the HVAC guy should carry 700 TEV's on his truck ? And
that's just one part among hundreds that are common.

Now try doing the work outside, at night, in the rain, or in a
blizzard, or in the blazing sun on a 98 degree humid day. Try having
to go up and down a 32 foot ladder and then walk ~ 1/4 mile across a
white roof in the sun to get to the unit. And back again for each
tool or part you need.


try working outside at -40

Been there, done that. Try doing it INSIDE at -40, too.


Yawn. I lived in Alaska for a while. Try driving a ground rod
through permafrost when it's -40 outside.



Try hauling ANY torch up a broadcast tower.

WTF would you do with it up there ? Splice co-ax ?


You would probably try, except for the fact that you don't use coax
on a TV broadcast tower. You use waveguide. 1/2" thick, and quite
heavy. There are rubber seals between the flanges so it can be
pressurized. Sometimes you have to cut off a damaged mounting bracket
or a damaged bolt in a tower leg. Work you would never understand, with
your Radio Shack crimper and rusty flea marked 'F' fittings.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

wrote:

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 19:06:14 -0500, AZ Nomad
wrote:

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 19:54:21 -0400, wrote:
...

If you happen to need a 50 lb tank of gas, or a 30 lb torch, or a 20
lb vacumn up there - get to humpin' it. Then bring it all down again.

And you better get 4 or 5 calls done, minimum, on a slow day.

TV repairmen are wusses.

TV repairmen are extinct. Nobody is going to pay $500 to fix a $500 TV.
There was a while when some shops could stay in business fixing big
screen (40"+) tv's but that was only while such TV's cost $5000. Those
days are pretty much gone.

Yep. And the models change so often, you couldn't get parts
anyway.


You would try to use duct tape and scrap thermostat wire, so what do
you know?

--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

"Lloyd E. "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" wrote:

fired this volley in
:


Now try doing the work outside, at night, in the rain, or in a
blizzard, or in the blazing sun on a 98 degree humid day. Try having
to go up and down a 32 foot ladder and then walk ~ 1/4 mile across a
white roof in the sun to get to the unit. And back again for each
tool or part you need.

If you happen to need a 50 lb tank of gas, or a 30 lb torch, or a 20
lb vacumn up there - get to humpin' it. Then bring it all down again.

And you better get 4 or 5 calls done, minimum, on a slow day.

TV repairmen are wusses.

Awww... Poor BABY! Try setting up and shooting ONE fireworks show on the
4th in San Antonio. Then, do three on three consecutive nights.

You wouldn't last through 1/2 of the first day's setup -- 104F actual
O.A.T, 82%RH, and twenty hours of work for the first show. Then you tear
down, re-rig, and get the next one up in 9 hours, and the next...

And 6" racks (of mortars, goof) weigh 80lb each, and you "only" have to
lug about 80 of them, and 100+ 5" racks, and a couple of hundred 4" and
3" racks.

YOU are not only a thief, but a pussy, too. I have even less sympathy
for your lazy ass than ever before.

LLoyd

" wrote:

fired this volley in
:


Now try doing the work outside, at night, in the rain, or in a
blizzard, or in the blazing sun on a 98 degree humid day. Try having
to go up and down a 32 foot ladder and then walk ~ 1/4 mile across a
white roof in the sun to get to the unit. And back again for each
tool or part you need.

If you happen to need a 50 lb tank of gas, or a 30 lb torch, or a 20
lb vacumn up there - get to humpin' it. Then bring it all down again.

And you better get 4 or 5 calls done, minimum, on a slow day.

TV repairmen are wusses.

Awww... Poor BABY! Try setting up and shooting ONE fireworks show on the
4th in San Antonio. Then, do three on three consecutive nights.

You wouldn't last through 1/2 of the first day's setup -- 104F actual
O.A.T, 82%RH, and twenty hours of work for the first show. Then you tear
down, re-rig, and get the next one up in 9 hours, and the next...

And 6" racks (of mortars, goof) weigh 80lb each, and you "only" have to
lug about 80 of them, and 100+ 5" racks, and a couple of hundred 4" and
3" racks.

YOU are not only a thief, but a pussy, too. I have even less sympathy
for your lazy ass than ever before.


Or set up and run the sound systems for three graduation ceremonies
in three different cities in one day.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

Steve B wrote:

"Grumpy" wrote in message
...
Perhaps some of you do not know difference going back to finish job
or getting call back, now we are going on subject of warrantees

I had one call back in apx. 20 years, and the reason that I had that
because of manufacturing screwed up which I windup paying for it
That is also because I did not go by my own instinct but lessoning
to some else big mistake that will not happen again!!!



"Michael A. Terrell" wrote in message
m...

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" wrote:

"Grumpy" fired this volley in news:i7oa08$qa8$1
@news.eternal-september.org:

NO I charge minimum 3 hours plus 0.80 per mile plus tolls
if I need to go back and 4 hour if I don't need to go back

So, you're saying if you screw up, or you can't fix it on the first
call,
you charge more?

That's certainly in keeping with the "j.m" types I am familiar with.

In my business, if we screw up, we eat the sale, and replace the goods
at
no charge.


The same as when I was in the industrail electronics repair
business. If our tech missed a problem, all the customer paid for was
any additional parts. Id didn't make a lot of difference, since the
callback rate was under 1%.

My call back rate was also very low. That was because when I left, I was
100% sure that everything was done 100% right. I did not achieve 100%, as
there were human errors, but call backs will kill you, especially if they
are something that you should have done in the course of doing it right the
first time. Half to a whole day shot. And Zero income for it.


Most were cause by infant mortality in a replacement part, which was
covered by the initial service charge.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" wrote:

"Steve B" fired this volley in
:

call backs will kill you, especially if they
are something that you should have done in the course of doing it
right the first time. Half to a whole day shot. And Zero income for
it.

OH, NO! According to .p.jm. you should charge another minimum 4 hours for
your screw-up! C'mon, Steve! G


Some people are honest. Others work in HVAC.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

wrote:

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 20:08:55 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


wrote:

Michael A. Terrell wrote:

No kidding. I've worked 20 hour days to get a job done on time, rather
than make return trips.

Then you're an idiot.


Yawn. Exactly what I'd expect from some lazy ass like you. A good
customer has an emergency. They offer to pay for the overtime, so you
sk the crew if they want the work. When they say yes, you do the job.
Some where scheduled, but waiting for all the parts to arrive before we
started the job.

Fine. That's not what you said. You said 'rather than make
return trips', which is bull****.

And if you want to talk 'extreme' - I've had compressors (
there was exactly one in existence in the country ) flown in overnight
on a chartered Lear jet, met at the airport by a truck, driven to the
jobsite where a crane and crew and me were waiting at 6 AM.

When a cleanroom costs $ 50,000 / hour in downtime, you don't
**** around, or worry about the chump change.


Whine, whine whine. $50,000? Big deal.

I talked a scientist in Antarctica through a repair procedure on a
piece of equipment they had damaged to keep them from losing data on a
two year project.

I built a KU band communications system that is a permanent part of
the International Space Station. It is used for voice, video and data
uplinks. The downlink was done with some of our standard equipment, but
the ISS only has 48 VDC power and the equipment has to be built into one
of their fancy low G aluminum rack modules.

I built the earth station that NOAA uses to control their LEO (Low
Earth Orbit) weather satellites, and to receive the weather sat photos.

I built two earth stations for Italy, for their part in the European
Space Agency. One fixed site, the other in an european style military
trailer.


You huff freon and pretend to know what you're doing.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote in message
. 3.70...
"Steve B" fired this volley in
:

call backs will kill you, especially if they
are something that you should have done in the course of doing it
right the first time. Half to a whole day shot. And Zero income for
it.

OH, NO! According to .p.jm. you should charge another minimum 4 hours for
your screw-up! C'mon, Steve! G

LLoyd

Don't know what .p.jm. does, but for me, callbacks were no charge IF it was
something I did, and not further damage after I left. I make no suggestions
as to what others "should" do. AND I didn't say I'd be back next week.
They were first on the list. I hate doing business with companies that when
you have a problem, they tell you it's going to be next week before they can
get a guy out there "because they're busy."

I do know that when I sold the business, I had 278 rock solid accounts that
no other company in town could take away from me. And that was because I
did the right thing in those circumstances. Over the time, if I felt it was
due to their abuse or negligence and not from something I did, I always had
the chance to pick up some of the loss, if not all.

Business was good, and it was rare that I did that. And if someone was a
pain, I'd just decline the work and say I was too busy. Same with slow pay.

Steve

Heart surgery pending?
Read up and prepare.
Learn how to care for a friend.
http://cabgbypasssurgery.com

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 13:29:52 -0400,
wrote:


Here's a picture of his 'service van'

http://jalopnik.com/assets/resources...into_Rr_LH.jpg

And a picture of the average "tech" from alt.hvac

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=...el-moore-2.jpg

So your point is?



I am the Sword of my Family
and the Shield of my Nation.
If sent, I will crush everything you have built,
burn everything you love,
and kill every one of you.
(Hebrew quote)

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 14:51:33 -0700, "Grumpy"
wrote:


"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote in message
.3.70...
"Grumpy" fired this volley in news:i7oa08$qa8$1
@news.eternal-september.org:

NO I charge minimum 3 hours plus 0.80 per mile plus tolls
if I need to go back and 4 hour if I don't need to go back

So, you're saying if you screw up, or you can't fix it on the first call,
you charge more?

You can interpret any way you like but that is not what I said!
What I siad and meant is or was
If I have all material that is require and I was able to complete the work
charge is minimum 4 hours!
If I don't have all material require and I need to go back then
first trip would be 3 hours and second trip will be also min. 3 hours
unless it takes longer! Do you understand now!
I know that my english is not perfect but perhaps I should drow you a
picture?

So you are saying that you are going to rip off the client if you have
the parts..and if you dont have the parts..you are going to make them
wait..and then rip them off for an additional 2 hours.

Is that your admission?

Gunner




That's certainly in keeping with the "j.m" types I am familiar with.

In my business, if we screw up, we eat the sale, and replace the goods at
no charge.



LLoyd



I am the Sword of my Family
and the Shield of my Nation.
If sent, I will crush everything you have built,
burn everything you love,
and kill every one of you.
(Hebrew quote)

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 19:56:21 -0400,
wrote:

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 18:56:33 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" wrote:

"Grumpy" fired this volley in news:i7r3l9$h48$1
@news.eternal-september.org:

If I don't have all material require and I need to go back then
first trip would be 3 hours and second trip will be also min. 3 hours
unless it takes longer! Do you understand now!

Yep, I certainly do. If you are not properly equipped to fix the
problem, you charge extra for your incompetence.

Yeah... I got it. I got it from all the ALT.HVAC "pros" I've dealt with.

Honest businessmen don't work that way. If they are the reason for the
failure to perform, they suck it up.


No kidding. I've worked 20 hour days to get a job done on time, rather
than make return trips.

Then you're an idiot.

Only a lazy cur would make that statement.

My crew brought their lunch, and the only
breaks we took were for the restrooms.

And for pushing you in front of the truck, no doubt.

His crews are not lazy curs.



One firm rule was no smokers
were ever hired, since a lot of work was in schools.


I am the Sword of my Family
and the Shield of my Nation.
If sent, I will crush everything you have built,
burn everything you love,
and kill every one of you.
(Hebrew quote)

Stormin Mormon wrote:
My experience with smokers has not been good. I prefer not to work
with them. Of course, my allergies help make that decision.


You can get shots to alleviate your allergies.

Did that, through my high school and college years. I doubt that any
injection will help with tobacco smoke, though. Not that I'd want to.
My allergies help prevent me from harm.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"HeyBub" wrote in message
m...
Stormin Mormon wrote:
My experience with smokers has not been good. I prefer not to work
with them. Of course, my allergies help make that decision.


You can get shots to alleviate your allergies.

On 9/27/2010 6:54 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 18:54:09 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


Grumpy wrote:

Perhaps some of you do not know difference going back to finish job
or getting call back, now we are going on subject of warrantees

I had one call back in apx. 20 years, and the reason that I had that
because of manufacturing screwed up which I windup paying for it
That is also because I did not go by my own instinct but lessoning
to some else big mistake that will not happen again!!!


Sigh. What a load. A 'callback' on some of my jobs would require it
to be scheduled on one of NASA's launches to the ISS. A lot of the work
I've done was mission critical. There was no room for mistakes. Only
when working as a TV tech when I was still in high school were the
standards low enough to see the occasional callback. Of course, tube
TVs needed a lot more maintenance than modern electronics.

So - the supply house carries maybe 10,000 items in stock.
They have maybe another 40,000 or 100,000 they can order. You want
the HVAC guy should carry one of each on his truck ?

A quick check at some random parts site

http://americanhvacparts.com/Merchan...egory_Code=ele

Shows 24 TEV's for just one manufacturer. They are not
interchangeable. They list 29 other manufacturers with TEV's as well.

You figure the HVAC guy should carry 700 TEV's on his truck ? And
that's just one part among hundreds that are common.

Now try doing the work outside, at night, in the rain, or in a
blizzard, or in the blazing sun on a 98 degree humid day. Try having
to go up and down a 32 foot ladder and then walk ~ 1/4 mile across a
white roof in the sun to get to the unit. And back again for each
tool or part you need.

If you happen to need a 50 lb tank of gas, or a 30 lb torch, or a 20
lb vacumn up there - get to humpin' it. Then bring it all down again.

And you better get 4 or 5 calls done, minimum, on a slow day.

TV repairmen are wusses.




There are TXV kits that allow for putting one together on site. A
universal blower and condenser fan motor is available too as are
universal oil filled capacitors. The problem with them is cost,
the universal capacitor that has muli-taps costs $50-$60 wholesale,
where a standard value costs as little as five bucks. As for TV
repairmen being wusses, 35 years ago I managed a TV repair/sales
shop and there was nothing wussy about carrying a 300lb console
TV up a flight of stairs or climbing on a roof to install a 50 foot
mast. giant antenna and rotator. These days, some of the flat screen
TV's I've come across weigh more than a fat woman. Back in the day,
TV repairmen did a lot of climbing and spent time in attics installing
twin lead and coax cable. Of course, when I was involved, CB radio
was a big thing with another set of antennas and cables to run.

TDD

On 9/27/2010 10:02 PM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

wrote:

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 20:03:10 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


wrote:

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 18:54:09 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


Grumpy wrote:

Perhaps some of you do not know difference going back to finish job
or getting call back, now we are going on subject of warrantees

I had one call back in apx. 20 years, and the reason that I had that
because of manufacturing screwed up which I windup paying for it
That is also because I did not go by my own instinct but lessoning
to some else big mistake that will not happen again!!!


Sigh. What a load. A 'callback' on some of my jobs would require it
to be scheduled on one of NASA's launches to the ISS. A lot of the work
I've done was mission critical. There was no room for mistakes. Only
when working as a TV tech when I was still in high school were the
standards low enough to see the occasional callback. Of course, tube
TVs needed a lot more maintenance than modern electronics.

So - the supply house carries maybe 10,000 items in stock.
They have maybe another 40,000 or 100,000 they can order. You want
the HVAC guy should carry one of each on his truck ?



Sigh. What a moron. How hard is it to ask what brand you will be
servicing, or even better, you keep records of what eqyuiipment each
customer owns? I carred close to 10,000 parts in my service truck for

Bull**** you did. BTW, that bag or tray of 10 or 100
resistors of a certain value doesn't count as '100 parts', it counts
as 'one'.


Yawn. You know nothing about electronic repair. The E24 range has a
lot of different values. Then they come in multiple wattages, and
specail applications. Fusible reistors used to be very common, and there
were a lot of different versions.

Capacitors come in values from picfards to microfards, in a lot of
different voltages and dielectrics. Then there were tubes, transistors,
ICs, switches, controls and hardware. There was probably over a half
million different parts made over the years, but you usually only saw
about a dozen or so brands in an area. I'm sure that the wolsalers of
your junk don't carry every brand of equipment, so you are using a
pathetic strawman.


Moron.

1 ) you assume it's a prior customer, where there would BE
records of what's there.


If the HVAC industry wasn't full of theives you'd have customer
loyalty.


2 ) you assume they KNOW what kind of unit it is, or can find
out ( hint - maybe SOMETIMES in residential, almost NEVER in
commercial work ).

3 ) You imply that the service guy is going to go back to the
shop and custom-stock his truck for a particular brand.


Maybe, if the company is run by idiots. We had a fleet of trucks,
equipped for different brands

electronics. I rarely ever took anything back to the shop, except when
some 'bucther' (a so-called tech that uses a meat cleaver to take things
apart) had really screwed it up.

Yah, HVAC guys rarely take the unit back to the shop either.
Except Stormy, who only works on window units.


About the only things I took back to the shop were entire intercom
consoles, and only after some idiot left it in an unsafe condition.




A quick check at some random parts site

http://americanhvacparts.com/Merchan...egory_Code=ele

Shows 24 TEV's for just one manufacturer. They are not
interchangeable. They list 29 other manufacturers with TEV's as well.


And you never have a clue what you are going to work on?

'An AC unit' is usually the only info. And yeh, for a repeat
customer, I know they have all XYZ brand on the roof - 100 - 200 units
maybe. Maybe 10 different sizes and configurations.

And I have a clue that that's only one of the calls I have to
take that day. The call is some other brand, equipment type,
whatever. You think the tech goes back to the shop to load up for
'XYZ' brand for one call ? You think he takes 100 + parts off his
truck and puts a different 100 + on, based on what brand of unit he's
headed to ? Moron.


You're repating yourerself. You need to up your medication.



You figure the HVAC guy should carry 700 TEV's on his truck ? And
that's just one part among hundreds that are common.

Now try doing the work outside, at night, in the rain, or in a
blizzard, or in the blazing sun on a 98 degree humid day. Try having
to go up and down a 32 foot ladder and then walk ~ 1/4 mile across a
white roof in the sun to get to the unit. And back again for each
tool or part you need.


try working outside at -40

Been there, done that. Try doing it INSIDE at -40, too.


Yawn. I lived in Alaska for a while. Try driving a ground rod
through permafrost when it's -40 outside.



Try hauling ANY torch up a broadcast tower.

WTF would you do with it up there ? Splice co-ax ?


You would probably try, except for the fact that you don't use coax
on a TV broadcast tower. You use waveguide. 1/2" thick, and quite
heavy. There are rubber seals between the flanges so it can be
pressurized. Sometimes you have to cut off a damaged mounting bracket
or a damaged bolt in a tower leg. Work you would never understand, with
your Radio Shack crimper and rusty flea marked 'F' fittings.



When I worked at the missile range, a backhoe operator dug up a $30,000
piece of hard-line coax going to one of the towers. He wasn't to blame
because he was digging where both the Army and Core of Engineers said
was clear. I can't imagine what that piece of coax would cost today.

TDD

wrote the following:
On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 23:02:05 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:



2 ) you assume they KNOW what kind of unit it is, or can find
out ( hint - maybe SOMETIMES in residential, almost NEVER in
commercial work ).

3 ) You imply that the service guy is going to go back to the
shop and custom-stock his truck for a particular brand.

Maybe, if the company is run by idiots. We had a fleet of trucks,
equipped for different brands


HVAC don't work like that. You don't schedule your work by
'what brands of equipment are waiting for service'.



Been there, done that. Try doing it INSIDE at -40, too.

Yawn. I lived in Alaska for a while. Try driving a ground rod
through permafrost when it's -40 outside.


Hell, try taking a pee out there ! ;-)

I spent a couple of days in New Hampshire around Christmas some years ago.
One night my friend and I drove out to his lab to pick up some work he
needed at home.
It was -30 F (-22 C) out. We had had a few beers at home before leaving.
On the way to the lab I had to take a leak and we stopped alongside the
road.
My weenie refused to come out of my pants and I had to force it out.
That's when I confirmed the rumors that it does have its own brain. :-)


--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

On 9/27/2010 7:06 PM, AZ Nomad wrote:
On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 19:54:21 -0400, wrote:
...

If you happen to need a 50 lb tank of gas, or a 30 lb torch, or a 20
lb vacumn up there - get to humpin' it. Then bring it all down again.

And you better get 4 or 5 calls done, minimum, on a slow day.

TV repairmen are wusses.

TV repairmen are extinct. Nobody is going to pay $500 to fix a $500 TV.
There was a while when some shops could stay in business fixing big
screen (40"+) tv's but that was only while such TV's cost $5000. Those
days are pretty much gone.

You might have a better chance getting a TV repaired by an outfit that
sells audio visual gear to schools and other institutions. Most of the
TV repair companies have diversified in to general electronic repair
outfits. I know one guy who is repairing sewer cams and video games in
addition to televisions.

TDD

On 9/27/2010 8:57 PM, Steve B wrote:
wrote in message
...
Perhaps some of you do not know difference going back to finish job
or getting call back, now we are going on subject of warrantees

I had one call back in apx. 20 years, and the reason that I had that
because of manufacturing screwed up which I windup paying for it
That is also because I did not go by my own instinct but lessoning
to some else big mistake that will not happen again!!!



"Michael A. wrote in message
m...

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" wrote:

fired this volley in news:i7oa08$qa8$1
@news.eternal-september.org:

NO I charge minimum 3 hours plus 0.80 per mile plus tolls
if I need to go back and 4 hour if I don't need to go back

So, you're saying if you screw up, or you can't fix it on the first
call,
you charge more?

That's certainly in keeping with the "j.m" types I am familiar with.

In my business, if we screw up, we eat the sale, and replace the goods
at
no charge.


The same as when I was in the industrail electronics repair
business. If our tech missed a problem, all the customer paid for was
any additional parts. Id didn't make a lot of difference, since the
callback rate was under 1%.

My call back rate was also very low. That was because when I left, I was
100% sure that everything was done 100% right. I did not achieve 100%, as
there were human errors, but call backs will kill you, especially if they
are something that you should have done in the course of doing it right the
first time. Half to a whole day shot. And Zero income for it.

Steve



You know, if you tell the customer it was your fault and fix it, they'll
have more respect for you and call you back because you were honest with
them. I see guys try to pull the wool over the customer's eyes and they
will lose out when they get caught. I repaired a system for a friend's
elderly mother when a couple of guys came out and shorted out the
compressor for one of her AC units. They told her it would be $5000.00
to replace the whole system because it was all bad. The crooks are being
sued and I explained to the attorney what they did to destroy her
AC system. Such assholes are universally despised by most of the other
repair techs in the business because it tends to give everyone a bad
name. "Oh yea. all of those XXXX are crooks" is the impression that all
people will wind up with and it happens in all the trades.

TDD

On 9/27/2010 11:41 PM, Steve B wrote:
"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote in message
. 3.70...
"Steve fired this volley in
:

call backs will kill you, especially if they
are something that you should have done in the course of doing it
right the first time. Half to a whole day shot. And Zero income for
it.

OH, NO! According to .p.jm. you should charge another minimum 4 hours for
your screw-up! C'mon, Steve!G

LLoyd

Don't know what .p.jm. does, but for me, callbacks were no charge IF it was
something I did, and not further damage after I left. I make no suggestions
as to what others "should" do. AND I didn't say I'd be back next week.
They were first on the list. I hate doing business with companies that when
you have a problem, they tell you it's going to be next week before they can
get a guy out there "because they're busy."

I do know that when I sold the business, I had 278 rock solid accounts that
no other company in town could take away from me. And that was because I
did the right thing in those circumstances. Over the time, if I felt it was
due to their abuse or negligence and not from something I did, I always had
the chance to pick up some of the loss, if not all.

Business was good, and it was rare that I did that. And if someone was a
pain, I'd just decline the work and say I was too busy. Same with slow pay.

Steve


I have a magic trick I can do, I disappear whenever I hear the words,
"I'm not gonna pay for......". 8-)

TDD

On 9/28/2010 7:27 AM, HeyBub wrote:
Stormin Mormon wrote:
My experience with smokers has not been good. I prefer not to work
with them. Of course, my allergies help make that decision.


You can get shots to alleviate your allergies.



You can also shoot a smoker in the head. 8-)

TDD

On 9/27/2010 8:14 PM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Steve wrote:

Yep, I certainly do. If you are not properly equipped to fix the
problem, you charge extra for your incompetence.

Not everybody uses a warehouse sized semi for a service truck.


I used a stepvan for field work. It saved me a lot of time, and I
could do a couple more jobs per day because of it.



My dream is to own one of those Sprinter vans, they're nice.

TDD

On Tue, 28 Sep 2010 10:51:31 -0500, The Daring Dufas wrote:
You know, if you tell the customer it was your fault and fix it, they'll
have more respect for you and call you back because you were honest with
them. I see guys try to pull the wool over the customer's eyes and they
will lose out when they get caught. I repaired a system for a friend's
elderly mother when a couple of guys came out and shorted out the
compressor for one of her AC units. They told her it would be $5000.00
to replace the whole system because it was all bad. The crooks are being
sued and I explained to the attorney what they did to destroy her
AC system. Such assholes are universally despised by most of the other
repair techs in the business because it tends to give everyone a bad
name. "Oh yea. all of those XXXX are crooks" is the impression that all
people will wind up with and it happens in all the trades.

I got a referrel for a mobile mechanic and had him replace timing belt and
struts. On the strut job, he caught a rear seatbelt behind the seat and left a
clunking noise in the front end. They the joy began. He came by said there
were worn out spring retaining rings and he'd have to order them. Went on
vacation and upon returning found out that the part would still be in on
"thursday", but it was the week after he had originally said. Scheduled him for
friday. No show. Scheduled for monday. Got jerked along all day, scheduled
for tuesday; jerked along again and no show on wednesday. I didn't even bother
staying home that day, figured I'd wait for his call (which never came). This
went on for weeks. I have a job where I can work from home when I have to, but
there are limits! Finally I gave up, took it to a garage mechanic who
discovered a loose sway bar mounting bracket, fixed it and the seat belt for
$65.

Needless to say, I won't be using that mobile mechanic again. Too bad. If he
wasn't such a jerk about finishing his work, he'd have future business.
I had recommended him earlier to coworkers; I've of course now warned them
to avoid him.

Usually said with a note of disgust. "I'm not going to pay $$$
for...." as in, the price is too high. I had one of those a couple
months ago.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in message
...

Business was good, and it was rare that I did that. And if someone
was a
pain, I'd just decline the work and say I was too busy. Same with
slow pay.

Steve


I have a magic trick I can do, I disappear whenever I hear the words,
"I'm not gonna pay for......". 8-)

TDD

Is that prescription, in your state?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in message
...


You can get shots to alleviate your allergies.



You can also shoot a smoker in the head. 8-)

TDD

The Daring Dufas wrote:

On 9/27/2010 10:02 PM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

wrote:

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 20:03:10 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


wrote:

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 18:54:09 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


Grumpy wrote:

Perhaps some of you do not know difference going back to finish job
or getting call back, now we are going on subject of warrantees

I had one call back in apx. 20 years, and the reason that I had that
because of manufacturing screwed up which I windup paying for it
That is also because I did not go by my own instinct but lessoning
to some else big mistake that will not happen again!!!


Sigh. What a load. A 'callback' on some of my jobs would require it
to be scheduled on one of NASA's launches to the ISS. A lot of the work
I've done was mission critical. There was no room for mistakes. Only
when working as a TV tech when I was still in high school were the
standards low enough to see the occasional callback. Of course, tube
TVs needed a lot more maintenance than modern electronics.

So - the supply house carries maybe 10,000 items in stock.
They have maybe another 40,000 or 100,000 they can order. You want
the HVAC guy should carry one of each on his truck ?



Sigh. What a moron. How hard is it to ask what brand you will be
servicing, or even better, you keep records of what eqyuiipment each
customer owns? I carred close to 10,000 parts in my service truck for

Bull**** you did. BTW, that bag or tray of 10 or 100
resistors of a certain value doesn't count as '100 parts', it counts
as 'one'.


Yawn. You know nothing about electronic repair. The E24 range has a
lot of different values. Then they come in multiple wattages, and
specail applications. Fusible reistors used to be very common, and there
were a lot of different versions.

Capacitors come in values from picfards to microfards, in a lot of
different voltages and dielectrics. Then there were tubes, transistors,
ICs, switches, controls and hardware. There was probably over a half
million different parts made over the years, but you usually only saw
about a dozen or so brands in an area. I'm sure that the wolsalers of
your junk don't carry every brand of equipment, so you are using a
pathetic strawman.


Moron.

1 ) you assume it's a prior customer, where there would BE
records of what's there.


If the HVAC industry wasn't full of theives you'd have customer
loyalty.


2 ) you assume they KNOW what kind of unit it is, or can find
out ( hint - maybe SOMETIMES in residential, almost NEVER in
commercial work ).

3 ) You imply that the service guy is going to go back to the
shop and custom-stock his truck for a particular brand.


Maybe, if the company is run by idiots. We had a fleet of trucks,
equipped for different brands

electronics. I rarely ever took anything back to the shop, except when
some 'bucther' (a so-called tech that uses a meat cleaver to take things
apart) had really screwed it up.

Yah, HVAC guys rarely take the unit back to the shop either.
Except Stormy, who only works on window units.


About the only things I took back to the shop were entire intercom
consoles, and only after some idiot left it in an unsafe condition.




A quick check at some random parts site

http://americanhvacparts.com/Merchan...egory_Code=ele

Shows 24 TEV's for just one manufacturer. They are not
interchangeable. They list 29 other manufacturers with TEV's as well.


And you never have a clue what you are going to work on?

'An AC unit' is usually the only info. And yeh, for a repeat
customer, I know they have all XYZ brand on the roof - 100 - 200 units
maybe. Maybe 10 different sizes and configurations.

And I have a clue that that's only one of the calls I have to
take that day. The call is some other brand, equipment type,
whatever. You think the tech goes back to the shop to load up for
'XYZ' brand for one call ? You think he takes 100 + parts off his
truck and puts a different 100 + on, based on what brand of unit he's
headed to ? Moron.


You're repating yourerself. You need to up your medication.



You figure the HVAC guy should carry 700 TEV's on his truck ? And
that's just one part among hundreds that are common.

Now try doing the work outside, at night, in the rain, or in a
blizzard, or in the blazing sun on a 98 degree humid day. Try having
to go up and down a 32 foot ladder and then walk ~ 1/4 mile across a
white roof in the sun to get to the unit. And back again for each
tool or part you need.


try working outside at -40

Been there, done that. Try doing it INSIDE at -40, too.


Yawn. I lived in Alaska for a while. Try driving a ground rod
through permafrost when it's -40 outside.



Try hauling ANY torch up a broadcast tower.

WTF would you do with it up there ? Splice co-ax ?


You would probably try, except for the fact that you don't use coax
on a TV broadcast tower. You use waveguide. 1/2" thick, and quite
heavy. There are rubber seals between the flanges so it can be
pressurized. Sometimes you have to cut off a damaged mounting bracket
or a damaged bolt in a tower leg. Work you would never understand, with
your Radio Shack crimper and rusty flea marked 'F' fittings.



When I worked at the missile range, a backhoe operator dug up a $30,000
piece of hard-line coax going to one of the towers. He wasn't to blame
because he was digging where both the Army and Core of Engineers said
was clear. I can't imagine what that piece of coax would cost today.



That sounds like 'Heliax' in the 3" range that was used for microwave
& c-band sat dishes.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.