wrote:
Immigrants whether illegal or legal have to realize that
english IS the common language here. If they want to
get ANYWHERE they need to speak it fluently. Otherwise
they'll ALWAYS be illegal workers that'll eventually
be a burden on the US TAX PAYER.

How do you figure that? I don't recall a law to that effect.


Business here is done in english, simple as that.

You need to get out more often. It is done in English, Spanish, French
Japanese and many other languages.

BTW, how do you feel about Native American languages. It was there
country long before the English came.


Offering educations in various languages without
priority given to english will screw lots of kids as
they grow up.

It does?? How? I had one kid working for me some years ago who could
speak 5 languages well. He was screwed up, but I assure you it had nothing
to do with language.

Its good that colleges dont have to
obey the same crap public schools do.

I would love to see a Harvard professor have to translate
a lesson to paco because he cant speak english! BAHAHA

Speak your native tounge at home with your siblings/elders.
When out in public, talk the native language.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

Steve B wrote:
wrote in message
ups.com...
Immigrants whether illegal or legal have to realize that
english IS the common language here. If they want to
get ANYWHERE they need to speak it fluently. Otherwise
they'll ALWAYS be illegal workers that'll eventually
be a burden on the US TAX PAYER.

Business here is done in english, simple as that.
Offering educations in various languages without
priority given to english will screw lots of kids as
they grow up. Its good that colleges dont have to
obey the same crap public schools do.

I would love to see a Harvard professor have to translate
a lesson to paco because he cant speak english! BAHAHA

Speak your native tounge at home with your siblings/elders.
When out in public, talk the native language.


I am 57 years old. I have heard story after story of people (mostly
my father's generation) of kids that were punished for speaking
anything but English. The parents would learn from their children
bringing English into the homes. They wanted their children to be
AMERICANS. Not HYPHEN-AMERICANS!

My grandparents in Ireland were punished for not speaking English in
schools in their own country. Was that just? Sound not the parents and the
individual have the choice? Why do people feel that they must make the
decision for others.

In real life, most all of the people in the US are going to learn
English. But why do some people feel so threatened by those who don't that
they want to force it on others?




Steve

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

JerryL wrote:
The best way to learn is through immersion -
being dumped right into a new language environment where you have no
choice.

Exactly. Right now we are giving a choice and they are taking the
easy way out by only speaking their native tongue.

And that hurts you exactly how?

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

wrote in message
ups.com...

Speak your native tounge at home with your siblings/elders.
When out in public, talk the native language.


I know at least a half dozen recent immigrants who can spell "tongue".

Kurt Ullman wrote:
In article ,
"Joseph Meehan" wrote:

JerryL wrote:
...


This is America. English is spoken here. You want to speak your
native language, speak it at home amongst your friends and
relatives.

So are many other languages spoken here. Why do you think only
English should be spoken here?

Because if people don't speak AT LEAST English, then they have more
problems getting around, communicating with people, etc. Heck even in
China, they are teaching almost everyone English as it is the language
of business and commerce.
Don't have any problem with people speaking Esperanto if they want
to amongst their friends, relatives, etc. But English is still the
main language and for assimilation purposes, people need to speak it.

But why does it concern you? If they think it makes life easier to
them, they will learn. What other things would you want to change about
them? I wonder what they might want to change about you? IMO Diversity is
one thing that makes a great country. The fear and hate of diversity is what
makes a terrible country.



So what did they do before they learned English? Most Spanish
speakers in the US are learning or already know English. However I
see no reason to demand it. It should be their choice. I believe
the US is known as the land of the free. That freedom I would guess
should also include freedom of
speech and I don't recall the freedom of speech being restricted
to English.
How you get that, from the constitution, is beyond
comprehension,.


Why do we have to pay for
bilingual teachers to accomadate them when we can't afford to hire
English speaking teachers to educate our children?

That does sound hateful.
There are a number of studies showing that getting non-English
speaking kids out of bilingual classes and into English only schools
increases their grades, etc. Bilingual teaching is a method of
ghettoization.

I might suggest that the question was about signs at Home Depot.

I think that the question of public education should be reviewed.

I might also remind you of the treatment of Native Americans in this
country and forcing their children to not only learn English, but punishing
them for using their native languages. To me that was a truly ugly part of
our history. I see much of the same attitudes showing up here.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

"Joseph Meehan" wrote in message
. ..

But why do some people feel so threatened by those who don't that they
want to force it on others?

Their lives suck, and they need to lash out at someone. Today, Mexicans.
Yesterday, Jews, blacks, Germans, Irish, Italians, native Americans blah
blah blah. It's pathetic.

"Joseph Meehan" wrote in message
. ..
Doug Kanter wrote:
"JerryL" wrote in message
...

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...
"JerryL" wrote in message
...

My parents, their families and millions of others came here many
years ago. They had to learn the language and went to night
schools to do so.

While they were learning, did they have servants to venture out
into the world for them to buy food, or did they find merchants who
spoke their native language?

In those days, people with similar languages or that came from
similar countries used to settle in certain areas so that you could
always find someone that spoke your language. I remember as a kid
going into stores and when the storekeeper starting speaking their
native tongue to my mother, she would reply "Speak English or we
will never learn how to".

Sadly, there are no Hispanic people like that. None. Absolutely none.
Zip.

Spoken like a true bigot.

--
Joseph Meehan

Joseph, I was being sarcastic. Taking things to the absurd, if you will.

Doug Kanter wrote:
"Joseph Meehan" wrote in message
. ..
Doug Kanter wrote:
"JerryL" wrote in message
...

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...
"JerryL" wrote in message
...

My parents, their families and millions of others came here many
years ago. They had to learn the language and went to night
schools to do so.

While they were learning, did they have servants to venture out
into the world for them to buy food, or did they find merchants
who spoke their native language?

In those days, people with similar languages or that came from
similar countries used to settle in certain areas so that you could
always find someone that spoke your language. I remember as a kid
going into stores and when the storekeeper starting speaking their
native tongue to my mother, she would reply "Speak English or we
will never learn how to".

Sadly, there are no Hispanic people like that. None. Absolutely
none. Zip.

Spoken like a true bigot.

--
Joseph Meehan

Joseph, I was being sarcastic. Taking things to the absurd, if you
will.

It's too bad that we live in a country where it is not obvious that you
were being sarcastic. There are too many people who believe it.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

"Joseph Meehan" wrote in message
. ..
Doug Kanter wrote:
"Joseph Meehan" wrote in message
. ..
Doug Kanter wrote:
"JerryL" wrote in message
...

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...
"JerryL" wrote in message
...

My parents, their families and millions of others came here many
years ago. They had to learn the language and went to night
schools to do so.

While they were learning, did they have servants to venture out
into the world for them to buy food, or did they find merchants
who spoke their native language?

In those days, people with similar languages or that came from
similar countries used to settle in certain areas so that you could
always find someone that spoke your language. I remember as a kid
going into stores and when the storekeeper starting speaking their
native tongue to my mother, she would reply "Speak English or we
will never learn how to".

Sadly, there are no Hispanic people like that. None. Absolutely
none. Zip.

Spoken like a true bigot.

--
Joseph Meehan

Joseph, I was being sarcastic. Taking things to the absurd, if you
will.

It's too bad that we live in a country where it is not obvious that you
were being sarcastic. There are too many people who believe it.
Joseph Meehan


Left turn! Last week, NPR was interviewing people in Washington DC -
protesters on both sides of the new immigration law issue. One guy was
especially interesting - a construction worker originally from Mexico. He
said (in perfect English) "I never finished school, but I still read a lot
of history. From what I can figure out, NOBODY came here legally in the
beginning!"

grabbitt wrote:
"JerryL" wrote in message
...

This is America. English is spoken here.


the Latinos that come here to the US are from "America". South America,
Central America. They speak other languages. I agree English is spoken
mostly in the US but we [US] don't own the word "America". We are all
"Americans" [yes that includes Canadians]
[soapbox mode off]



Not true and you know it. America is an
abbreviation of the United States of America. No
other country in North, Central, or South American
have "American" in the title of the country. So
it is quite clear when when says "America" they
mean the USA. If you don't want to believe that
you are just being obtuse.

George E. Cawthon wrote:
grabbitt wrote:

"JerryL" wrote in message
...

This is America. English is spoken here.



the Latinos that come here to the US are from "America". South
America, Central America. They speak other languages. I agree
English is spoken mostly in the US but we [US] don't own the word
"America". We are all "Americans" [yes that includes Canadians]
[soapbox mode off]


Not true and you know it.

no I don't

America is an abbreviation of the United
States of America.

no it is not

No other country in North, Central, or South
American have "American" in the title of the country. So it is quite
clear when when says "America" they mean the USA.

not to anyone in the rest of the "Americas" outside of the US

If you don't want to
believe that you are just being obtuse.

United States of "America" is one of many countries in the "Americas".
Try telling someone from any other country in the "Americas" that they
are not "American" and see how far you get with them. You are the one
that is obtuse and US centric. We are all "Americans" whether you like
it or not

In article ,
"Joseph Meehan" wrote:


But why does it concern you? If they think it makes life easier to
them, they will learn. What other things would you want to change about
them? I wonder what they might want to change about you? IMO Diversity is
one thing that makes a great country. The fear and hate of diversity is what
makes a terrible country.


It concerns me because it makes for a permanent underclass. As I
mentioned, they can retain the old ways (like the Chinese, Irish and
other number of previous waves of immigration over the years). But they
ALSO need to learn Spanish to function in the society.


I might suggest that the question was about signs at Home Depot.

You might suggest that, and I would have to agree originally. But the
discussion has evolved into the rest of it.

I think that the question of public education should be reviewed.

I might also remind you of the treatment of Native Americans in this
country and forcing their children to not only learn English, but punishing
them for using their native languages. To me that was a truly ugly part of
our history. I see much of the same attitudes showing up here.
I don't. There is no punishment, aside from self-inflicted, in
this case. The studies show that the punishment (by not assimilating,
having problems communicating, limiting advancement, etc) is more subtle
and inflicted on them by those trying to "help" them.

"Spike2" wrote in message
.. .


United States of "America" is one of many countries in the "Americas". Try
telling someone from any other country in the "Americas" that they are not
"American" and see how far you get with them. You are the one that is
obtuse and US centric. We are all "Americans" whether you like it or not

There's a big difference between what's correct in terms of geography, and
saying someone is "American", which indicates nationality, political
loyalties and certain ways of thinking. Do *not* try and claim that the
second half of that sentence applies in any way outside of the USA.

Doug Kanter wrote:
"Spike2" wrote in message
.. .



United States of "America" is one of many countries in the "Americas". Try
telling someone from any other country in the "Americas" that they are not
"American" and see how far you get with them. You are the one that is
obtuse and US centric. We are all "Americans" whether you like it or not


There's a big difference between what's correct in terms of geography, and
saying someone is "American", which indicates nationality, political
loyalties and certain ways of thinking.

no to me

Do *not* try and claim that the
second half of that sentence applies in any way outside of the USA.




You are confused. A person from florida is a floridian. A person from
Texas is a Texan. They may be a democrat or a republican. A person
from the anywhere in the "Americas" is an "American" Do *not* try to
use your US political correctness to redefine words used by the rest of
the world because that only works in your little xenophobic reality
while the internet crosses those boundaries and that is where you are
postulating now.

"Spike2" wrote in message
...
Doug Kanter wrote:
"Spike2" wrote in message
.. .



United States of "America" is one of many countries in the "Americas".
Try telling someone from any other country in the "Americas" that they
are not "American" and see how far you get with them. You are the one
that is obtuse and US centric. We are all "Americans" whether you like
it or not


There's a big difference between what's correct in terms of geography,
and saying someone is "American", which indicates nationality, political
loyalties and certain ways of thinking.

no to me


You think someone from Bolivia has the same nationality and political
loyalties as we do, because Bolivia is on a continent called South
America??? Yes, or no.




Do *not* try and claim that the second half of that sentence applies in
any way outside of the USA.


You are confused. A person from florida is a floridian. A person from
Texas is a Texan. They may be a democrat or a republican. A person from
the anywhere in the "Americas" is an "American" Do *not* try to use your
US political correctness to redefine words used by the rest of the world
because that only works in your little xenophobic reality while the
internet crosses those boundaries and that is where you are postulating
now.

Now you're naming states which ARE in this country. But above, you claimed
that people from other COUNTRIES in the Americas were the subject here.
Which is it?

"Mys Terry" wrote in message
...

You think someone from Bolivia has the same nationality and political
loyalties as we do, because Bolivia is on a continent called South
America??? Yes, or no.


No, because he is not a citizen of the "United States of America"which
is located on the continent of North America, and is a country, not a
continent. In fact, Some of the "United States of America" is not even
located in America at all. Nonetheless, someone who is a citizen of
Bolivia is an American.

I'm quite sure you'd be laughed at if you said that to a Bolivian,
especially at this point in time.

Doug Kanter wrote:
"Spike2" wrote in message
...

Doug Kanter wrote:

"Spike2" wrote in message
t...




United States of "America" is one of many countries in the "Americas".
Try telling someone from any other country in the "Americas" that they
are not "American" and see how far you get with them. You are the one
that is obtuse and US centric. We are all "Americans" whether you like
it or not


There's a big difference between what's correct in terms of geography,
and saying someone is "American", which indicates nationality, political
loyalties and certain ways of thinking.

no to me



You think someone from Bolivia has the same nationality and political
loyalties as we do, because Bolivia is on a continent called South
America??? Yes, or no.

there you go again, trying to redefine the word "American" to fit your
US "political" definition. You are on the 'worldwide internet' where
your parochial re definitions are not understood. America is a
geographical description of the land masses of South and North America.






Do *not* try and claim that the second half of that sentence applies in
any way outside of the USA.


You are confused. A person from florida is a floridian. A person from
Texas is a Texan. They may be a democrat or a republican. A person from
the anywhere in the "Americas" is an "American" Do *not* try to use your
US political correctness to redefine words used by the rest of the world
because that only works in your little xenophobic reality while the
internet crosses those boundaries and that is where you are postulating
now.


Now you're naming states which ARE in this country. But above, you claimed
that people from other COUNTRIES in the Americas were the subject here.
Which is it?



you are obviously being intentionally obtuse. The point was where you
are from determines what you are called. If you are from America [ N or
S] then you are American. If you are from the US and you want someone
to know where you are from you would say " I am from the US". If you
say I am an "American" [which is true,although imprecise] you could be
from any number of countries in the Americas.
You stated it had something to do with politics, but it is a geographic
identifier.

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...
"twfsa" wrote in message
newszsYf.4594$fS6.3135@dukeread11...
Its bad enough those *******s are here illegally, and now we have to
cater to them because there to ****in lazy to lean the language.

Tom

Would you or your children be interested in picking vegetables for four or
five bucks an hour? How about cleaning hotel rooms, or washing dishes in
restaurant kitchens for minimum wage (if you're lucky)?

If I had no other way to feed my family, yes I'd work for 4 or 5 bucks an
hour. No, it's better a portion of our society has the mentality not to work
for minimum wages so they sponge off the rest of the taxpayers by collecting
welfare. If they were told they have to do these jobs before they received
all the freebies they get then we'd have people to do those jobs.

Let's start over. Earlier, I said this:

"There's a big difference between what's correct in terms of geography, and
saying someone is "American", which indicates nationality, political
loyalties and certain ways of thinking."

You responded by saying:

"no to me"


Go back. Do you understand the difference between a place on a map, and the
political entities within those places?

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...

"JerryL" wrote in message
...

The best way to learn is through immersion -
being dumped right into a new language environment where you have no
choice.

Exactly. Right now we are giving a choice and they are taking the easy
way out by only speaking their native tongue.


Of course, that's an inaccurate observation, since you don't like these
people, so YOU don't interact with them at all.
Where in any of my posts did I say I do not like them? Stop making this
crap up to try and win a point. We have many Mexicans working down here
doing landscaping. I have invited families to break bread with us. I have
given them clothes, used and new. I bring out drinks when they are working
in our community. Who the hell do you think you are to tell me I don't like
these people?

"Joseph Meehan" wrote in
:

JerryL wrote:
...


This is America. English is spoken here. You want to speak your
native language, speak it at home amongst your friends and relatives.

So are many other languages spoken here. Why do you think only
English
should be spoken here?


Because language is a Major unifying factor.
And English is THE language of business and science.


It's F-ing RUDE to move to a new country to live and expect them to
accomodate YOUR language instead of learning their language.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

wrote in
oups.com:

Business here is done in english, simple as that.
This is not very true for South Florida

Its not just in SOUTH Florida,Central Florida is becoming heavily
Hispanic,and it's becoming Balkanized.I've lived here 20 years and watched
it happen.There are entire neighborhoods where people only speak
Spanish,and if YOU don't,you get ostracised.


where Hispanics are in
majority. One poster mentioned HD in Hialeah; they still can't speak
English there, and they don't need to. There are stores with signs that
say "We speak English"

It's been reported that Hispanics will become the majority in U.S. in
not-so distant feature.

Only due to illegal immigration.


It's going to be interesting to see if English
is still going to be the dominant language then...


Only because we sat on our thumbs and allowed it to happen.



--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

"JerryL" wrote in message
...

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...
"twfsa" wrote in message
newszsYf.4594$fS6.3135@dukeread11...
Its bad enough those *******s are here illegally, and now we have to
cater to them because there to ****in lazy to lean the language.

Tom

Would you or your children be interested in picking vegetables for four
or five bucks an hour? How about cleaning hotel rooms, or washing dishes
in restaurant kitchens for minimum wage (if you're lucky)?

If I had no other way to feed my family, yes I'd work for 4 or 5 bucks an
hour. No, it's better a portion of our society has the mentality not to
work for minimum wages so they sponge off the rest of the taxpayers by
collecting welfare. If they were told they have to do these jobs before
they received all the freebies they get then we'd have people to do those
jobs.


If, by some miracle, all "illegal" immigrants were stopped at border, or
deported, you and/or your kids would have no choice but to take these farm
jobs, eventually, unless you thing cucumbers are going to dance into baskets
without help. THAT is the point here. Give most teens the choice of working
in a nice air conditioned supermarket, or breaking their backs in a field,
and I'm pretty sure they'll choose the supermarket (or mall, etc).

"Joseph Meehan" wrote in
:

JerryL wrote:
The best way to learn is through immersion -
being dumped right into a new language environment where you have no
choice.

Exactly. Right now we are giving a choice and they are taking the
easy way out by only speaking their native tongue.

And that hurts you exactly how?


If you can't communicate with people,then you can't understand them,cannot
come to common ground.
Just get in a collision with a person who speaks no English,how can you
determine if they are hurt,or get DL and insurance data?
(if they have it at all,chances are that they won't.)

I've had to deal with enough Hispanics with little or no English.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

If I had no other way to feed my family, yes I'd work for 4 or 5 bucks an
hour. No, it's better a portion of our society has the mentality not to
work for minimum wages so they sponge off the rest of the taxpayers by
collecting welfare. If they were told they have to do these jobs before
they received all the freebies they get then we'd have people to do those
jobs.


If, by some miracle, all "illegal" immigrants were stopped at border, or
deported, you and/or your kids would have no choice but to take these farm
jobs, eventually, unless you thing cucumbers are going to dance into
baskets without help. THAT is the point here. Give most teens the choice
of working in a nice air conditioned supermarket, or breaking their backs
in a field, and I'm pretty sure they'll choose the supermarket (or mall,
etc).

And what about the people on the public dole? Many of them are physically
able to work but don't because the checks keep coming in. What if you told
them they had to work the fields in order to get the handouts? They'd have
no choice if the checks stopped. And no, I'm not talking about sick,
handicapped, mentally ill, etc. I'm talking about able people who do nothing
but milk the system.

"JerryL" wrote in message
...

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...

"JerryL" wrote in message
...

The best way to learn is through immersion -
being dumped right into a new language environment where you have no
choice.

Exactly. Right now we are giving a choice and they are taking the easy
way out by only speaking their native tongue.


Of course, that's an inaccurate observation, since you don't like these
people, so YOU don't interact with them at all.
Where in any of my posts did I say I do not like them? Stop making this
crap up to try and win a point. We have many Mexicans working down here
doing landscaping. I have invited families to break bread with us. I have
given them clothes, used and new. I bring out drinks when they are working
in our community. Who the hell do you think you are to tell me I don't
like these people?



A comment like this doesn't suggest warm fuzzy feelings about people:

"Right now we are giving a choice and they are taking the easy
way out by only speaking their native tongue."

"JerryL" wrote in message
...



If I had no other way to feed my family, yes I'd work for 4 or 5 bucks
an hour. No, it's better a portion of our society has the mentality not
to work for minimum wages so they sponge off the rest of the taxpayers
by collecting welfare. If they were told they have to do these jobs
before they received all the freebies they get then we'd have people to
do those jobs.


If, by some miracle, all "illegal" immigrants were stopped at border, or
deported, you and/or your kids would have no choice but to take these
farm jobs, eventually, unless you thing cucumbers are going to dance into
baskets without help. THAT is the point here. Give most teens the choice
of working in a nice air conditioned supermarket, or breaking their backs
in a field, and I'm pretty sure they'll choose the supermarket (or mall,
etc).

And what about the people on the public dole? Many of them are physically
able to work but don't because the checks keep coming in. What if you
told them they had to work the fields in order to get the handouts? They'd
have no choice if the checks stopped. And no, I'm not talking about sick,
handicapped, mentally ill, etc. I'm talking about able people who do
nothing but milk the system.


Maybe.

Doug Kanter wrote:
Let's start over. Earlier, I said this:

"There's a big difference between what's correct in terms of geography, and
saying someone is "American", which indicates nationality, political
loyalties and certain ways of thinking."

You responded by saying:

"no to me"


Go back. Do you understand the difference between a place on a map, and the
political entities within those places?



the question is do you?

"Spike2" wrote in message
...
Doug Kanter wrote:
Let's start over. Earlier, I said this:

"There's a big difference between what's correct in terms of geography,
and
saying someone is "American", which indicates nationality, political
loyalties and certain ways of thinking."

You responded by saying:

"no to me"


Go back. Do you understand the difference between a place on a map, and
the political entities within those places?



the question is do you?


I think you may be eating too much tuna. The mercury's affecting your short
term memory.

Doug Kanter wrote:
"Spike2" wrote in message
...

Doug Kanter wrote:

Let's start over. Earlier, I said this:

"There's a big difference between what's correct in terms of geography,
and
saying someone is "American", which indicates nationality, political
loyalties and certain ways of thinking."

You responded by saying:

"no to me"


Go back. Do you understand the difference between a place on a map, and
the political entities within those places?



the question is do you?



I think you may be eating too much tuna. The mercury's affecting your short
term memory.



that's funny. coming from someone who thinks being born in the Americas
means that person is NOT an American. But being in the political
culture of the US is being an American!?

Jim Yanik wrote:
"Joseph Meehan" wrote in
:

JerryL wrote:
The best way to learn is through immersion -
being dumped right into a new language environment where you have
no choice.

Exactly. Right now we are giving a choice and they are taking the
easy way out by only speaking their native tongue.

And that hurts you exactly how?


If you can't communicate with people,then you can't understand
them,cannot come to common ground.
Just get in a collision with a person who speaks no English,how can
you determine if they are hurt,or get DL and insurance data?
(if they have it at all,chances are that they won't.)

I've had to deal with enough Hispanics with little or no English.

Funny, that has never happened to me. I have never consider it a
problem when I have been in countries where I did not understand the local
language. I have always managed to get by.

I would be far more worried about getting in an accident with someone
who was high on something and while they might be a life long English
speaker, they can't communicate in any language. (Yea, that one did
happened to me)

How often has that happened to you? :-)

Really, you are stretching.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

Kurt Ullman wrote:
In article ,
"Joseph Meehan" wrote:


But why does it concern you? If they think it makes life easier
to them, they will learn. What other things would you want to
change about them? I wonder what they might want to change about
you? IMO Diversity is one thing that makes a great country. The
fear and hate of diversity is what makes a terrible country.


It concerns me because it makes for a permanent underclass.

How so?

As I
mentioned, they can retain the old ways (like the Chinese, Irish and
other number of previous waves of immigration over the years). But
they ALSO need to learn Spanish to function in the society.


I might suggest that the question was about signs at Home Depot.

You might suggest that, and I would have to agree originally. But
the discussion has evolved into the rest of it.

I think that the question of public education should be reviewed.

I might also remind you of the treatment of Native Americans in
this country and forcing their children to not only learn English,
but punishing them for using their native languages. To me that was
a truly ugly part of our history. I see much of the same attitudes
showing up here.
I don't. There is no punishment, aside from self-inflicted,
in this case. The studies show that the punishment (by not
assimilating, having problems communicating, limiting advancement,
etc) is more subtle and inflicted on them by those trying to "help"
them.

The comments I have read in this thread are not subtle. They show fear
and hate, but mostly a lack of understanding.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

Jim Yanik wrote:
"Joseph Meehan" wrote in
:

JerryL wrote:
...


This is America. English is spoken here. You want to speak your
native language, speak it at home amongst your friends and
relatives.

So are many other languages spoken here. Why do you think only
English
should be spoken here?


Because language is a Major unifying factor.
And English is THE language of business and science.

Religion is a unifying factor, do you also suggest that we should make
religious requirements? How about what sports we like, that is also a
unifying factor, let's outlaw rowing (too English).



It's F-ing RUDE to move to a new country to live and expect them to
accomodate YOUR language instead of learning their language.

I don't see that anyone is asking that you accommodate anyone. I
suspect that most would prefer that you keep out of their business totally.

The question was about HD who put bilingual signs in their store. The
only apparent reason was to increase their sales and profit. BTW I have
seen it in many other stores.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

In article ,
Mys Terry wrote:

On Tue, 04 Apr 2006 19:48:43 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

"Mys Terry" wrote in message
.. .

You think someone from Bolivia has the same nationality and political
loyalties as we do, because Bolivia is on a continent called South
America??? Yes, or no.


No, because he is not a citizen of the "United States of America"which
is located on the continent of North America, and is a country, not a
continent. In fact, Some of the "United States of America" is not even
located in America at all. Nonetheless, someone who is a citizen of
Bolivia is an American.

I'm quite sure you'd be laughed at if you said that to a Bolivian,
especially at this point in time.


Doesn't matter in the least. It's still a fact, and not an opinion.

Sez you....

Doug Kanter wrote:
"Joseph Meehan" wrote in message
. ..
Doug Kanter wrote:
"Joseph Meehan" wrote in message
. ..
Doug Kanter wrote:
"JerryL" wrote in message
...

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...
"JerryL" wrote in message
...

My parents, their families and millions of others came here
many years ago. They had to learn the language and went to
night schools to do so.

While they were learning, did they have servants to venture out
into the world for them to buy food, or did they find merchants
who spoke their native language?

In those days, people with similar languages or that came from
similar countries used to settle in certain areas so that you
could always find someone that spoke your language. I remember
as a kid going into stores and when the storekeeper starting
speaking their native tongue to my mother, she would reply
"Speak English or we will never learn how to".

Sadly, there are no Hispanic people like that. None. Absolutely
none. Zip.

Spoken like a true bigot.

--
Joseph Meehan

Joseph, I was being sarcastic. Taking things to the absurd, if you
will.

It's too bad that we live in a country where it is not obvious
that you were being sarcastic. There are too many people who believe
it. Joseph Meehan


Left turn! Last week, NPR was interviewing people in Washington DC -
protesters on both sides of the new immigration law issue. One guy was
especially interesting - a construction worker originally from
Mexico. He said (in perfect English) "I never finished school, but I
still read a lot of history. From what I can figure out, NOBODY came
here legally in the beginning!"

Maybe the ones who came 5 thousand years ago.

I wonder how many of those who are making the biggest fuss have
ancestors who came over illegally.

" Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe
free, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless,
tempest-tossed, to me. I lift my lamp beside the golden door." (As long as
they speak English) ...

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

In article .com,
says...

Look on a lot of products now...Ive seen major appliances heating and
air equipment...everything from these major items down to a bar of soap
with spanish on them.'

That also makes it a lot easier to export products south of the border.
Similarly, you'll find plenty of consumer goods with directions and
labeling in French, so they can be exported to Canada with the same
labeling. My new U.S.-made double oven even has installation
instructions in Japanese, not that we have lots of illegal Japanese
labor in the U.S., but because Japan is a major export market.

Despite all the rhetoric to the contrary, the U.S. is still a huge
manufacturing power that exports all over the world.

--
is Joshua Putnam
http://www.phred.org/~josh/
Braze your own bicycle frames. See
http://www.phred.org/~josh/build/build.html

In article ,
says...
"Joseph Meehan" wrote in message
. ..
Doug Kanter wrote:
"Joseph Meehan" wrote in message
. ..
Doug Kanter wrote:
"JerryL" wrote in message
...

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...
"JerryL" wrote in message
...

My parents, their families and millions of others came here many
years ago. They had to learn the language and went to night
schools to do so.

While they were learning, did they have servants to venture out
into the world for them to buy food, or did they find merchants
who spoke their native language?

In those days, people with similar languages or that came from
similar countries used to settle in certain areas so that you could
always find someone that spoke your language. I remember as a kid
going into stores and when the storekeeper starting speaking their
native tongue to my mother, she would reply "Speak English or we
will never learn how to".

Sadly, there are no Hispanic people like that. None. Absolutely
none. Zip.

Spoken like a true bigot.

--
Joseph Meehan

Joseph, I was being sarcastic. Taking things to the absurd, if you
will.

It's too bad that we live in a country where it is not obvious that you
were being sarcastic. There are too many people who believe it.
Joseph Meehan


Left turn! Last week, NPR was interviewing people in Washington DC -
protesters on both sides of the new immigration law issue. One guy was
especially interesting - a construction worker originally from Mexico. He
said (in perfect English) "I never finished school, but I still read a lot
of history. From what I can figure out, NOBODY came here legally in the
beginning!"

Umm, "in the beginning" there were no immigration laws so it would
be *impossible* for them to have come here illegally, "in the
beginning".

--
Keith

Funny, that has never happened to me. I have never consider it a
problem when I have been in countries where I did not understand the local
language. I have always managed to get by.
You trying to live in these areas or did you try to get by in the
hotels and tourist sections? BIG difference.

In article ,
"Joseph Meehan" wrote:

Kurt Ullman wrote:
In article ,
"Joseph Meehan" wrote:


But why does it concern you? If they think it makes life easier
to them, they will learn. What other things would you want to
change about them? I wonder what they might want to change about
you? IMO Diversity is one thing that makes a great country. The
fear and hate of diversity is what makes a terrible country.


It concerns me because it makes for a permanent underclass.

How so?

By not being able to get higher paying jobs, harder to get higher
education, etc. You gonna tell me you know many successful people in the
US who speak ONLY Spanish.



The comments I have read in this thread are not subtle. They show fear
and hate, but mostly a lack of understanding.
Yeah, but I still hold out some hope for you...

In article ,
"JosEnglish is THE language of business and science.

Religion is a unifying factor, do you also suggest that we should make
religious requirements? How about what sports we like, that is also a
unifying factor, let's outlaw rowing (too English).

That's BS. There never has been one overriding religion that everyone
needed to adhere to.