On Jul 10, 7:38*pm, Bill wrote:
RonB wrote:
Comments or suggestions welcome. *In fact, all I seek is a simple nod..
Thank you again to those of you who helped me to reach this point (of
understanding)!

Dear Bill:

566 (excuse me 567) posts.

Have your reached a point of understanding yet?

Does anyone else have the patience to click back to this original post
to see what the topic was?

Ron

I believe I actually started the thread originally and then restarted it
a few months later. *I think the main question you should ask yourself
is: Did you learn anything or were you just counting?

Bill

I was not being critical. It just amazed me that a post could draw
this many posts.

RonB

RonB wrote:

I was not being critical. It just amazed me that a post could draw
this many posts.

Cool! A nice non-critical post is nice to read! : )


RonB

On Jul 10, 8:12*pm, Bill wrote:
RonB wrote:
I was not being critical. *It just amazed me that a post could draw
this many posts.

Cool! * A nice non-critical post is nice to read! * : )



RonB

I know. I am on old fart but I'm behaving at the moment. The other
interesting thing about this string is it seems to be staying close to
topic (with a few excursions of course).


RonB

Bill wrote:


I believe I actually started the thread originally and then restarted
it a few months later. I think the main question you should ask
yourself is: Did you learn anything or were you just counting?


Or learning to count.

On Jul 11, 6:31*pm, "HeyBub" wrote:
Bill wrote:

I believe I actually started the thread originally and then restarted
it a few months later. *I think the main question you should ask
yourself is: Did you learn anything or were you just counting?

Or learning to count.

Lord you guys are sensitive. Or just eager to keep a long string
going.

RonB

Bill wrote:


I believe I actually started the thread originally and then restarted
it a few months later. I think the main question you should ask
yourself is: Did you learn anything or were you just counting?


Come on Bill - that's not even close to a right question. Why tell another
poster what they should be asking themselves, when you are the one asking
all the questions?

--

-Mike-

Mike Marlow wrote:
Bill wrote:


I believe I actually started the thread originally and then restarted
it a few months later. I think the main question you should ask
yourself is: Did you learn anything or were you just counting?


Come on Bill - that's not even close to a right question. Why tell another
poster what they should be asking themselves, when you are the one asking
all the questions?

Well, when I wrote what I did, I thought I was defending myself. And in
replying to your post, I feel like I am again. Isn't the forum more
interesting place when someone asks questions, and someone answers,
etc.? This message is mostly a void too--it's a shame to have to spend
time defending myself. I'd rather go back to participating in an
interesting dialog. Asking good questions and providing good answers is
thoughtful work. Posting attacks is the work of trolls.

Bill

Mike Marlow wrote:
Bill wrote:


I believe I actually started the thread originally and then restarted
it a few months later. I think the main question you should ask
yourself is: Did you learn anything or were you just counting?


Come on Bill - that's not even close to a right question.

I suppose that you think the right question is "How well does Bill
understand?". If you really want to know, maybe you could ask Doug?
Doug mentioned the other day that Bill is careful about "playing with
fire" (my words), and that is a fair statement. I even play with fire
in the right shoes! You might ask Doug about what I had done Before he
arrived.

If I incorrectly guessed what you think is the right question, you'll
have to tell me (I can't read your mind..).

Bill




Why tell another
poster what they should be asking themselves, when you are the one asking
all the questions?

Bill wrote:
Mike Marlow wrote:
Bill wrote:


I believe I actually started the thread originally and then
restarted it a few months later. I think the main question you
should ask yourself is: Did you learn anything or were you just
counting?

Come on Bill - that's not even close to a right question. Why tell
another poster what they should be asking themselves, when you are
the one asking all the questions?

Well, when I wrote what I did, I thought I was defending myself. And
in replying to your post, I feel like I am again. Isn't the forum more
interesting place when someone asks questions, and someone answers,
etc.? This message is mostly a void too--it's a shame to have to
spend time defending myself. I'd rather go back to participating in
an interesting dialog. Asking good questions and providing good
answers is thoughtful work. Posting attacks is the work of trolls.

Bill

Don't feel too defensive - it's kind of like a couple of guys sitting around
talking. Nothing of an attack.

--

-Mike-

Bill wrote:
Mike Marlow wrote:
Bill wrote:


I believe I actually started the thread originally and then
restarted it a few months later. I think the main question you
should ask yourself is: Did you learn anything or were you just
counting?

Come on Bill - that's not even close to a right question.

I suppose that you think the right question is "How well does Bill
understand?". If you really want to know, maybe you could ask Doug?
Doug mentioned the other day that Bill is careful about "playing with
fire" (my words), and that is a fair statement. I even play with fire
in the right shoes! You might ask Doug about what I had done Before
he arrived.

Nope - don't think that at all.


If I incorrectly guessed what you think is the right question, you'll
have to tell me (I can't read your mind..).


I wasn't saying that I thought there was a right question, Bill.

--

-Mike-

Bill

Don't feel too defensive - it's kind of like a couple of guys sitting around
talking. *Nothing of an attack.

--

-Mike-


That is kinda what I thought when I made my original comment. I'll
butt out now.

And if you look at my profile I AM NOT a troll. Been hanging around
here for 8-10 years and have contributed.

Keep the string going.


RonB

"Troll" is in the eyes and ears of the claimer.

Somebody disagreeing does not make them a troll.

Somebody contributing does not not make them a troll, either


"RonB" wrote in message
...
That is kinda what I thought when I made my original comment. I'll
butt out now.

And if you look at my profile I AM NOT a troll. Been hanging around
here for 8-10 years and have contributed.

Keep the string going.


RonB

RonB wrote:

And if you look at my profile I AM NOT a troll.

No one called anyone a troll. I think we are above denigrating
each other, but it was getting close there for an evening! : )

If you're not sure what "denigrating" means, here is a link:
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/denigrate
I looked it up before I used it above to make sure I was writing
what I intended.

RobB: After reading 567 messages in this thread, did you note any
unresolved issues that you are still uncertain about?

Bill

I shouldn't have the least worry about threading a 12-2 romex cable
through 3/4" holes, and back through the same holes, should I?
Nothing else will be in the holes. The issue that bothered me (a
little) is knowing that both cables would always be used at the same
time. I'm going to try out my new auger bits tonight--starting off by
making some bit props to get the holes lined up..should be fun. : )

Bill

On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 19:52:37 -0400, Bill wrote:

I shouldn't have the least worry about threading a 12-2 romex cable
through 3/4" holes, and back through the same holes, should I?

You should be able to use 5/8" holes.

Nothing else will be in the holes. The issue that bothered me (a
little) is knowing that both cables would always be used at the same
time. I'm going to try out my new auger bits tonight--starting off by
making some bit props to get the holes lined up..should be fun. : )

One thing you might do is put the wire on a stick so it comes off straight,
without kinks. It makes it a *lot* easier to thread through the holes, if
it's straight and not all loopy.

zzzzzzzzzz wrote:

One thing you might do is put the wire on a stick so it comes off straight,
without kinks. It makes it a *lot* easier to thread through the holes, if
it's straight and not all loopy.

Hey, thanks! I noticed a few "twists" in the wire I've uncoiled so far.
I'll devise something (I hope the top rail comes off of my wife's quilt
rack!).

Bill

On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 20:24:07 -0400, Bill wrote:

wrote:

One thing you might do is put the wire on a stick so it comes off straight,
without kinks. It makes it a *lot* easier to thread through the holes, if
it's straight and not all loopy.

Looks nicer, too!

Hey, thanks! I noticed a few "twists" in the wire I've uncoiled so far.
I'll devise something (I hope the top rail comes off of my wife's quilt
rack!).

Don't do that! You'll likely break it and there goes your toy, er, tool
money. I generally use a clamp (or two) on the wall studs on the other side
of the room. Play around with it a little and you'll find a your fav way to
do it.

On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 20:15:49 -0500, "
wrote:

On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 20:24:07 -0400, Bill wrote:

wrote:

One thing you might do is put the wire on a stick so it comes off straight,
without kinks. It makes it a *lot* easier to thread through the holes, if
it's straight and not all loopy.

Looks nicer, too!

Hey, thanks! I noticed a few "twists" in the wire I've uncoiled so far.
I'll devise something (I hope the top rail comes off of my wife's quilt
rack!).

Don't do that! You'll likely break it and there goes your toy, er, tool
money. I generally use a clamp (or two) on the wall studs on the other side
of the room. Play around with it a little and you'll find a your fav way to
do it.

Find a milk crate a piece of pipe of your choice, loop the coil around
the pipe a sand bag might help too.

Works real well with reel stuff in pulling in conduit, but romex can
need a bit more attention.

Mark

In article , Bill wrote:
I shouldn't have the least worry about threading a 12-2 romex cable
through 3/4" holes, and back through the same holes, should I?

Not at all. That's plenty of room. 5/8 is probably enough.

Nothing else will be in the holes. The issue that bothered me (a
little) is knowing that both cables would always be used at the same
time.

That won't matter, it really won't. Pros do that all the time.

I'm going to try out my new auger bits tonight--starting off by
making some bit props to get the holes lined up..should be fun. : )

Don't spend too much time getting the holes lined up exactly. The cable is
flexible enough to tolerate even a fairly gross misalignment, and once the
drywall is up, nobody but you will ever know.

zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 20:24:07 -0400, wrote:

zzzzzzzzzz wrote:

One thing you might do is put the wire on a stick so it comes off straight,
without kinks. It makes it a *lot* easier to thread through the holes, if
it's straight and not all loopy.

Looks nicer, too!

Hey, thanks! I noticed a few "twists" in the wire I've uncoiled so far.
I'll devise something (I hope the top rail comes off of my wife's quilt
rack!).

Don't do that! You'll likely break it and there goes your toy, er, tool
money. I generally use a clamp (or two) on the wall studs on the other side
of the room.


Inspired by Doug Miller's collection of exotics (bits to put on the end
of a drill), I bought Stanley's 62-piece set today for 12.99 at Menards.
It turned out to contain a large torx bit, just what I needed to take
apart the quilt rack. I asked permission first, and SWMBO thought it was
fine that I use it the way I explained (turns out this item which is
taking up valuable space in the shop area is not as meaningful a piece
of memorabilia as I might have guessed). I put a piece of padding
underneath my 250' rolls of 10-2 and 12-2 romex to protect my wire from
the hollow square steel frame. The roll of 10-2 is fairly heavy as most
everyone here but me has known for years.

Nuther story. Directions on my new 3/4" auger bit suggested using a
corded drill. Okay, I have 3. The B&D my dad gave me, which was old in
1989 when he gave it to me, was the only one that would fit between the
studs with a bit. According to the label, it is a 5 Amp drill. In my
test efforts, the bit got stuck in the wood (3x) before I was able to
get though a stud--and I mean stuck in the sense that the drill stopped
moving, smoked, and I had to remove the bit from the chuck and from the
wood with a wrench, stuck. I tried a 3/4" spade bit with much better
results, if not quite as smooth an exit hole. I'll take back my new
7/8" auger bit and trade it for a spade bit of the same size.

This makes me curious as to what it takes to drive an auger bit (the
salesman at Home Depot spoke so highly of them). Would a 8 Amp Dewalt
drill have handled this much better. How about a 14.4 cordless? It
would probably be a day in the park for the Dewalt 10 Amp drill (if it
would fit). This experience will make me more careful about getting the
Amps/HP I need in a DP. Seeing your drill bit stuck in a piece of wood
is just an ugly sight you don't want to have to see.

I drilled all of the holes I need at the 23" level, perhaps 15, and
found another stud I want to reinforce (by screwing a length of 2by4 on
each side of it with plenty of 2 1/2" screws). Looks like it could be
old ant or termite damage. I'll start there tomorrow before I drill
(the rest of) the holes at the 61" level. Turns out the prop is only
good for getting the height right. My eye is fine for the rest.
Occasionally, after I start I measure and restart, adjusting if
necessary. I'm taking my time so I don't burn up the drill.

Bill

Bill wrote:

This makes me curious as to what it takes to drive an auger bit (the
salesman at Home Depot spoke so highly of them).


By the way, this is the bit I used. Maybe not an auger bit depending on
your definition:

http://www.irwin.com/tools/drill-bit...max-spade-bits

I think I would have had this problem with any bit having screw-threads
on the tip (which make it eager to bite).

On 7/13/2010 1:49 AM, Bill wrote:
zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 20:24:07 -0400, wrote:

zzzzzzzzzz wrote:

One thing you might do is put the wire on a stick so it comes off
straight,
without kinks. It makes it a *lot* easier to thread through the
holes, if
it's straight and not all loopy.

Looks nicer, too!

Hey, thanks! I noticed a few "twists" in the wire I've uncoiled so far.
I'll devise something (I hope the top rail comes off of my wife's quilt
rack!).

Don't do that! You'll likely break it and there goes your toy, er, tool
money. I generally use a clamp (or two) on the wall studs on the other
side
of the room.


Inspired by Doug Miller's collection of exotics (bits to put on the end
of a drill), I bought Stanley's 62-piece set today for 12.99 at Menards.
It turned out to contain a large torx bit, just what I needed to take
apart the quilt rack. I asked permission first, and SWMBO thought it was
fine that I use it the way I explained (turns out this item which is
taking up valuable space in the shop area is not as meaningful a piece
of memorabilia as I might have guessed). I put a piece of padding
underneath my 250' rolls of 10-2 and 12-2 romex to protect my wire from
the hollow square steel frame. The roll of 10-2 is fairly heavy as most
everyone here but me has known for years.

Nuther story. Directions on my new 3/4" auger bit suggested using a
corded drill. Okay, I have 3. The B&D my dad gave me, which was old in
1989 when he gave it to me, was the only one that would fit between the
studs with a bit. According to the label, it is a 5 Amp drill. In my
test efforts, the bit got stuck in the wood (3x) before I was able to
get though a stud--and I mean stuck in the sense that the drill stopped
moving, smoked, and I had to remove the bit from the chuck and from the
wood with a wrench, stuck. I tried a 3/4" spade bit with much better
results, if not quite as smooth an exit hole. I'll take back my new 7/8"
auger bit and trade it for a spade bit of the same size.

Trick with spade bits--put a piece of tape or something on it so that
you can gage how deep you're going, stop when the point is through, then
drill from the other side and you'll avoid the tearout.

Also, electricians often just drill the hole at an angle rather than
trying to fit a drill between studs. Lets them use as powerful a drill
as they need, the wire doesn't care, and it's all hidden when the wall
is closed.

This makes me curious as to what it takes to drive an auger bit (the
salesman at Home Depot spoke so highly of them). Would a 8 Amp Dewalt
drill have handled this much better. How about a 14.4 cordless? It would
probably be a day in the park for the Dewalt 10 Amp drill (if it would
fit). This experience will make me more careful about getting the
Amps/HP I need in a DP. Seeing your drill bit stuck in a piece of wood
is just an ugly sight you don't want to have to see.

If you're getting a cordless, get an 18v. You'll be glad you did. The
DeWalts have the advantage that their 18v drills can use any 18v dewalt
battery pack, NiCd, NiMH, or Lithium Ion. Nice thing about them is the
multispeed gearbox that lets you gear them down for big bits or run at
high RPM for small ones). I've had mine since 18v drills first came out
and it's been a workhorse.

Or, since you seem well fixed for drills, get an impact driver--they'll
handle spade bits just fine and if the bit hangs up they pound on it
until it unhangs or you give up--then reverse it and it _will_ whack the
bit loose. Downside is that they have 1/4" hex chucks, not regular
drill chucks, but the Irwin bit you have has a 1/4" hex chuck anyway so
it will fit right in. And impact drivers are _short_--I have a right
angle drill intended to get into stud-spaces and the like but I haven't
needed it since I got the impact driver. The Makita BTP140 is a really
nice one, but expensive. Any decent brand (deWalt, Bosch, Makita,
Milwaukee, etc) will do the job though.

I drilled all of the holes I need at the 23" level, perhaps 15, and
found another stud I want to reinforce (by screwing a length of 2by4 on
each side of it with plenty of 2 1/2" screws). Looks like it could be
old ant or termite damage. I'll start there tomorrow before I drill (the
rest of) the holes at the 61" level. Turns out the prop is only good for
getting the height right. My eye is fine for the rest. Occasionally,
after I start I measure and restart, adjusting if necessary. I'm taking
my time so I don't burn up the drill.

My 18v dewalt cordless that I've had since 18v drills first came out
would have handled it with no problem and the new ones are supposed to
be better. Normally holes for wiring you angle a little because the
drill won't fit between joists or studs--the wire doesn't care.

Spade bits give a rough cut but don't take a lot of power, they're
perfectly adequate for rough carpentry. Those particular Irwin bits
that you have I've never used but reading the reviews on Amazon they
seem to be known for the problem you're experiencing.

Bill wrote:
I shouldn't have the least worry about threading a 12-2 romex cable
through 3/4" holes, and back through the same holes, should I?
Nothing else will be in the holes. The issue that bothered me (a
little) is knowing that both cables would always be used at the same
time. I'm going to try out my new auger bits tonight--starting off by
making some bit props to get the holes lined up..should be fun. : )

Bill

No issues with 2 runs of 12/2 in a 3/4 hole Bill.

--

-Mike-

zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 19:52:37 -0400, Bill wrote:

I shouldn't have the least worry about threading a 12-2 romex cable
through 3/4" holes, and back through the same holes, should I?

You should be able to use 5/8" holes.

Nothing else will be in the holes. The issue that bothered me (a
little) is knowing that both cables would always be used at the same
time. I'm going to try out my new auger bits tonight--starting off by
making some bit props to get the holes lined up..should be fun. : )

One thing you might do is put the wire on a stick so it comes off
straight, without kinks. It makes it a *lot* easier to thread
through the holes, if it's straight and not all loopy.

Agreed. You can fab up a simple stand that you can mount the entire coil of
12/2 on and then spool it off as you need it. Much easier and neater than
fighting with pull what you need from a coil on the floor, and then trying
to get it to pull through straight. You don't want to pull kinks into your
wire, and spooling it off really makes a nice pull easier. HD used to sell
a little stand, but I don't think they do now. Maybe Lowes, or one of the
others still do. It was somewhere around $30. It's worth looking around a
bit.

--

-Mike-

On Jul 13, 12:49*am, Bill wrote:
wrote:
On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 20:24:07 -0400, *wrote:

wrote:

One thing you might do is put the wire on a stick so it comes off straight,
without kinks. *It makes it a *lot* easier to thread through the holes, if
it's straight and not all loopy.

Looks nicer, too!

Hey, thanks! *I noticed a few "twists" in the wire I've uncoiled so far.
I'll devise something (I hope the top rail comes off of my wife's quilt
rack!).

Don't do that! *You'll likely break it and there goes your toy, er, tool
money. *I generally use a clamp (or two) on the wall studs on the other side
of the room.

Inspired by Doug Miller's collection of exotics (bits to put on the end
of a drill), I bought Stanley's 62-piece set today for 12.99 at Menards.
It turned out to contain a large torx bit, just what I needed to take
apart the quilt rack. I asked permission first, and SWMBO thought it was
fine that I use it the way I explained (turns out this item which is
taking up valuable space in the shop area is not as meaningful a piece
of memorabilia as I might have guessed). *I put a piece of padding
underneath my 250' rolls of 10-2 and 12-2 romex to protect my wire from
the hollow square steel frame. The roll of 10-2 is fairly heavy as most
everyone here but me has known for years.

Nuther story. *Directions on my new 3/4" auger bit suggested using a
corded drill. *Okay, I have 3. The B&D my dad gave me, which was old in
1989 when he gave it to me, was the only one that would fit between the
studs with a bit. According to the label, it is a 5 Amp drill. In my
test efforts, the bit got stuck in the wood (3x) before I was able to
get though a stud--and I mean stuck in the sense that the drill stopped
moving, smoked, and I had to remove the bit from the chuck and from the
wood with a wrench, stuck. *I tried a 3/4" spade bit with much better
results, if not quite as smooth an exit hole. *I'll take back my new
7/8" auger bit and trade it for a spade bit of the same size.

The drill was obviously undersized for the purpose and may be past its
prime. No smoke should have come out of any drill under normal
circumstances, even stalled for a short time (it was a short time,
right?). You should have gotten a "stubby" bit for this purpose.
Irwin makes some really nice tri-augers for this purpose. I bought a
set a while back. I think the five (six?) were about $30.

This makes me curious as to what it takes to drive an auger bit (the
salesman at Home Depot spoke so highly of them). Would a 8 Amp Dewalt
drill have handled this much better. How about a 14.4 cordless? *It
would probably be a day in the park for the Dewalt 10 Amp drill (if it
would fit). *This experience will make me more careful about getting the
Amps/HP I need in a DP. *Seeing your drill bit stuck in a piece of wood
is just an ugly sight you don't want to have to see.

I haven't used a corded drill for years. My only corded drill is a
hammer drill I bought for cement (both drilling and mixing). A 14.4V
drill should work fine but I normally use an 18V Dewalt. Like
anything, use sharp tools. They make work easier and SAFER.

I drilled all of the holes I need at the 23" level, perhaps 15, and
found another stud I want to reinforce (by screwing a length of 2by4 on
each side of it with plenty of 2 1/2" screws). Looks like it could be
old ant or termite damage. *I'll start there tomorrow before I drill
(the rest of) the holes at the 61" level. Turns out the prop is only
good for getting the height right. My eye is fine for the rest.
Occasionally, after I start I measure and restart, adjusting if
necessary. *I'm taking my time so I don't burn up the drill.

Sounds like that is a real possibility. Use another drill (with a
stubby bit, if necessary).

On Jul 13, 1:41*am, Bill wrote:
Bill wrote:
This makes me curious as to what it takes to drive an auger bit (the
salesman at Home Depot spoke so highly of them).

By the way, this is the bit I used. *Maybe not an auger bit depending on
your definition:

http://www.irwin.com/tools/drill-bit...peedbor-max-sp...

That's the longer version of what I use.

I think I would have had this problem with any bit having screw-threads
on the tip (which make it eager to bite).

Your problem is the drill. You need new tool! Yippie!

Bill wrote in :

Bill wrote:

This makes me curious as to what it takes to drive an auger bit (the
salesman at Home Depot spoke so highly of them).


By the way, this is the bit I used. Maybe not an auger bit depending
on your definition:

http://www.irwin.com/tools/drill-bit...edbor-max-spad
e-bits

I think I would have had this problem with any bit having
screw-threads on the tip (which make it eager to bite).


I've found that some of those screw tips pull the bit through the wood
way too aggressively and the cutting head doesn't have time to keep up.
A bit actually *needs* to slip to deal with changes in the wood.

Puckdropper
--
Never teach your apprentice everything you know.

J. Clarke wrote:

If you're getting a cordless, get an 18v. You'll be glad you did. The
DeWalts have the advantage that their 18v drills can use any 18v dewalt
battery pack, NiCd, NiMH, or Lithium Ion. Nice thing about them is the
multispeed gearbox that lets you gear them down for big bits or run at
high RPM for small ones). I've had mine since 18v drills first came out
and it's been a workhorse.

Or, since you seem well fixed for drills, get an impact driver--they'll
handle spade bits just fine and if the bit hangs up they pound on it
until it unhangs or you give up--then reverse it and it _will_ whack the
bit loose. Downside is that they have 1/4" hex chucks, not regular drill
chucks, but the Irwin bit you have has a 1/4" hex chuck anyway so it
will fit right in. And impact drivers are _short_--I have a right angle
drill intended to get into stud-spaces and the like but I haven't needed
it since I got the impact driver. The Makita BTP140 is a really nice
one, but expensive. Any decent brand (deWalt, Bosch, Makita, Milwaukee,
etc) will do the job though.


Mr. Clarke, That's a very helpful perspective/overview/explanation.
Thanks!
:::: Looking under the cushions for $400, or so, of drill money :::

J. Clarke wrote:

Trick with spade bits--put a piece of tape or something on it so that
you can gage how deep you're going, stop when the point is through, then
drill from the other side and you'll avoid the tearout.

I had read this before, but thanks for reminding me. I want to (try to)
do this for a hole close to the eave where pulling my 6-3 cable will be
awkward enough as it is. "The cable you save today will be the cable
you don't have to utter disparaging remarks over tomorrow!"

Bill

On 13 Jul 2010 17:24:31 GMT, Puckdropper puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

Bill wrote in :

Bill wrote:

This makes me curious as to what it takes to drive an auger bit (the
salesman at Home Depot spoke so highly of them).


By the way, this is the bit I used. Maybe not an auger bit depending
on your definition:

http://www.irwin.com/tools/drill-bit...edbor-max-spad
e-bits

I think I would have had this problem with any bit having
screw-threads on the tip (which make it eager to bite).


I've found that some of those screw tips pull the bit through the wood
way too aggressively and the cutting head doesn't have time to keep up.
A bit actually *needs* to slip to deal with changes in the wood.

I've found they work great for this application. This is about the only
application I'd use them in, though.

In article , Bill wrote:
wrote:
On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 20:24:07 -0400, wrote:

zzzzzzzzzz wrote:

One thing you might do is put the wire on a stick so it comes off straight,
without kinks. It makes it a *lot* easier to thread through the holes, if
it's straight and not all loopy.

Looks nicer, too!

Hey, thanks! I noticed a few "twists" in the wire I've uncoiled so far.
I'll devise something (I hope the top rail comes off of my wife's quilt
rack!).

Don't do that! You'll likely break it and there goes your toy, er, tool
money. I generally use a clamp (or two) on the wall studs on the other side
of the room.


Inspired by Doug Miller's collection of exotics (bits to put on the end
of a drill), I bought Stanley's 62-piece set today for 12.99 at Menards.
It turned out to contain a large torx bit, just what I needed to take
apart the quilt rack. I asked permission first, and SWMBO thought it was
fine that I use it the way I explained (turns out this item which is
taking up valuable space in the shop area is not as meaningful a piece
of memorabilia as I might have guessed). I put a piece of padding
underneath my 250' rolls of 10-2 and 12-2 romex to protect my wire from
the hollow square steel frame. The roll of 10-2 is fairly heavy as most
everyone here but me has known for years.

Nuther story. Directions on my new 3/4" auger bit suggested using a
corded drill. Okay, I have 3. The B&D my dad gave me, which was old in
1989 when he gave it to me, was the only one that would fit between the
studs with a bit. According to the label, it is a 5 Amp drill. In my
test efforts, the bit got stuck in the wood (3x) before I was able to
get though a stud--and I mean stuck in the sense that the drill stopped
moving, smoked, and I had to remove the bit from the chuck and from the
wood with a wrench, stuck. I tried a 3/4" spade bit with much better
results, if not quite as smooth an exit hole. I'll take back my new
7/8" auger bit and trade it for a spade bit of the same size.

This makes me curious as to what it takes to drive an auger bit (the
salesman at Home Depot spoke so highly of them).

It depends on how big a bit, and through what kind of wood.

That said, a Milwaukee "Hole Hawg" will go through about anything.

In tight quarters, a right-angle drive adapter is a _big_ help,
As is a geared speed-reducer (if you can _find_ one of those, these
days).

I've been thinking and reading about finishing my project.
Having one of those "homemade stucco" finishes on the ceiling, made out
of joint compound, I left about 4 inches of drywall at the top of one
wall and about 18 inches at the top of another when I removed it.

This leaves me facing almost wall-length "butt joints". I presume that
with some patience (layering) and appropriate drywall compounds I can
make it look decent. Please tell me if you would suggest approaching it
any differently, in particular, by removing the wallboard to the
ceiling. My intuition tells me to stick with my original plan (the butt
joints), but I think this is a good time to ask.

Bill

In article , Bill wrote:
I've been thinking and reading about finishing my project.
Having one of those "homemade stucco" finishes on the ceiling, made out
of joint compound, I left about 4 inches of drywall at the top of one
wall and about 18 inches at the top of another when I removed it.

This leaves me facing almost wall-length "butt joints". I presume that
with some patience (layering) and appropriate drywall compounds I can
make it look decent. Please tell me if you would suggest approaching it
any differently, in particular, by removing the wallboard to the
ceiling. My intuition tells me to stick with my original plan (the butt
joints), but I think this is a good time to ask.

I'd leave it the way it is, Bill. If you remove it all the way to the top,
you're still going to have to use some joint compound at the seam, but you're
going to have a much harder time of it due to the textured ceiling.

Bill wrote:
I've been thinking and reading about finishing my project.
Having one of those "homemade stucco" finishes on the ceiling, made
out of joint compound, I left about 4 inches of drywall at the top of
one wall and about 18 inches at the top of another when I removed it.

This leaves me facing almost wall-length "butt joints". I presume
that with some patience (layering) and appropriate drywall compounds
I can make it look decent. Please tell me if you would suggest
approaching it any differently, in particular, by removing the
wallboard to the ceiling. My intuition tells me to stick with my
original plan (the butt joints), but I think this is a good time to
ask.

I'd leave it as it is Bill. You can finish the butt joints in the normal
way, and you don't have to worry about affecting the finish at or near the
textured ceiling. A less than perfect butt joint that is 4" from the
ceiling isn't going to be all that visible.

--

-Mike-

On Tue, 13 Jul 2010 08:49:14 -0400, "Mike Marlow"
wrote the following:

wrote:
On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 19:52:37 -0400, Bill wrote:

I shouldn't have the least worry about threading a 12-2 romex cable
through 3/4" holes, and back through the same holes, should I?

You should be able to use 5/8" holes.

Nothing else will be in the holes. The issue that bothered me (a
little) is knowing that both cables would always be used at the same
time. I'm going to try out my new auger bits tonight--starting off by
making some bit props to get the holes lined up..should be fun. : )

One thing you might do is put the wire on a stick so it comes off
straight, without kinks. It makes it a *lot* easier to thread
through the holes, if it's straight and not all loopy.

Agreed. You can fab up a simple stand that you can mount the entire coil of
12/2 on and then spool it off as you need it. Much easier and neater than
fighting with pull what you need from a coil on the floor, and then trying
to get it to pull through straight. You don't want to pull kinks into your
wire, and spooling it off really makes a nice pull easier. HD used to sell
a little stand, but I don't think they do now. Maybe Lowes, or one of the
others still do. It was somewhere around $30. It's worth looking around a
bit.

Amen. Put it on a reel or spooling holder. It's a beast to work with
otherwise.

http://wacdu.com/ or
http://www.idealtruevalue.com/servlet/the-133406/Detail mounted on a
tubafore base to hold it vertically. Use something to keep it from
entirely freewheeling and spilling cable when it's yanked while in
use.

--

EXPLETIVE: A balm, usually applied verbally in hindsight,
which somehow eases those pains and indignities following
our every deficiency in foresight.

On 13 Jul 2010 17:24:31 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote the following:

Bill wrote in :

Bill wrote:

This makes me curious as to what it takes to drive an auger bit (the
salesman at Home Depot spoke so highly of them).


By the way, this is the bit I used. Maybe not an auger bit depending
on your definition:

http://www.irwin.com/tools/drill-bit...edbor-max-spad
e-bits

I think I would have had this problem with any bit having
screw-threads on the tip (which make it eager to bite).


I've found that some of those screw tips pull the bit through the wood
way too aggressively and the cutting head doesn't have time to keep up.
A bit actually *needs* to slip to deal with changes in the wood.

Try a hardwood auger instead of one for softwood, Pucky. The feed
screw rate is finer/slower. Our forebears weren't dummies.

--

EXPLETIVE: A balm, usually applied verbally in hindsight,
which somehow eases those pains and indignities following
our every deficiency in foresight.

On Wed, 14 Jul 2010 03:38:11 -0400, Bill wrote the
following:

I've been thinking and reading about finishing my project.
Having one of those "homemade stucco" finishes on the ceiling, made out
of joint compound, I left about 4 inches of drywall at the top of one
wall and about 18 inches at the top of another when I removed it.

This leaves me facing almost wall-length "butt joints". I presume that
with some patience (layering) and appropriate drywall compounds I can
make it look decent. Please tell me if you would suggest approaching it
any differently, in particular, by removing the wallboard to the
ceiling. My intuition tells me to stick with my original plan (the butt
joints), but I think this is a good time to ask.

Drywall is tapered at the edges to give you a smooth finish when 2
pieces are butted together. Either crush the edges of cut drywall (to
give you that taper) or use fresh rock where possible. At $5 a sheet
vs a whole lot of hassle, new rock is cheaper, IMHO.

Grab a copy of this book. It has helped me improve my taping and
mudding techniques immensely. http://fwd4.me/Wvp

--

EXPLETIVE: A balm, usually applied verbally in hindsight,
which somehow eases those pains and indignities following
our every deficiency in foresight.

In article , "Mike Marlow" wrote:

I'd leave it as it is Bill. You can finish the butt joints in the normal
way, and you don't have to worry about affecting the finish at or near the
textured ceiling. A less than perfect butt joint that is 4" from the
ceiling isn't going to be all that visible.

Besides which, it's in the garage, not the living room. :-)

Doug Miller wrote:
In , "Mike wrote:

I'd leave it as it is Bill. You can finish the butt joints in the normal
way, and you don't have to worry about affecting the finish at or near the
textured ceiling. A less than perfect butt joint that is 4" from the
ceiling isn't going to be all that visible.

Besides which, it's in the garage, not the living room. :-)


Yes, This is affording me what I consider a good opportunity to
"practice" for later work inside the house. Thank you all, for the
replies you gave.

Bill

Doug Miller wrote:
In , "Mike wrote:

I'd leave it as it is Bill. You can finish the butt joints in the normal
way, and you don't have to worry about affecting the finish at or near the
textured ceiling. A less than perfect butt joint that is 4" from the
ceiling isn't going to be all that visible.

Besides which, it's in the garage, not the living room. :-)

(Definition) Garage:
1. a building or indoor area for parking or storing motor vehicles.
2. a commercial establishment for repairing and servicing motor vehicles.

I don't have one of those! : )

Bill