Greetings:

I have a Hunter Digital Thermostat [Set and Save 110], and the relay
makes a "click" noise every time the unit calls for heat. Their help
department tells me that this is a normal function of this unit.

Is this a standard operation of all digital thermostats? If not, I
will be making a change. I have an office setup within 15 feet of the
unit, and the sound can distracting. Suggestions on a good replacement
would be appreciated - heat only, for hot water baseboards.

Thanks,

Dave

my digital clicks

There are a few that use solid-state components to activate the HVAC
equipment, and these may be described as having battery backup, but running
on the voltage provided by the HVAC equipment. But most of the units are
more universal in their design, so they work on the majority of control
systems used on HVAC equipment.

Unfortunately, the best and most universal way to activate the HVAC
equipment is with dry contacts, the kind that small relays have. Being an
electro-mechanical device, when the contacts activate, there is some noise
associated with that action. Some are noisier than others. The relays are
small, the contacts are small, so to make a good connection they must really
"snap" into position.

After a while, either you get used to it, or you move the thermostat around
the corner to a room or space where you can't hear it anymore, and hope that
the resulting temperature is still within your comfort zone.

The original Honeywell round thermostats use a mercury switch inside that's
totally silent as it makes the connection, but this kind of unit is not
digital and can't be programmed. I would not be surprised however to find
that the Honeywell units are very quiet, if not silent, so it may be worth
buying one and trying it out. If there's no improvement, or it's too noisy,
you should be able to return it to the store where you purchased it.

Bob M.
======
"Dave Gallant" wrote in message
om...
Greetings:

I have a Hunter Digital Thermostat [Set and Save 110], and the relay
makes a "click" noise every time the unit calls for heat. Their help
department tells me that this is a normal function of this unit.

Is this a standard operation of all digital thermostats? If not, I
will be making a change. I have an office setup within 15 feet of the
unit, and the sound can distracting. Suggestions on a good replacement
would be appreciated - heat only, for hot water baseboards.

Thanks,

Dave

"Dave Gallant" wrote in message
om...
Greetings:

I have a Hunter Digital Thermostat [Set and Save 110], and the relay
makes a "click" noise every time the unit calls for heat. Their help
department tells me that this is a normal function of this unit.

Problem #1..Hunter and Lux, Cheapest of the Cheap. Garbage. Total complete,
utter crap.

Yes, its normal for those to sound like a door being slammed shut.


Is this a standard operation of all digital thermostats?

Pretty much. Honeywell makes a few high end units that you cant just run out
and buy that are fairly silent, but all use relays now of some sort...at
least one on the board, and what you call distracting, most will not notice.


If not, I
will be making a change. I have an office setup within 15 feet of the
unit, and the sound can distracting. Suggestions on a good replacement
would be appreciated - heat only, for hot water baseboards.

You might look at a Honeywell T8195 B 1009. It has setback provisions, a
clock for allowing to setback the unit, and a fixed anticipator. It is also
a mercury switch unit and is totally silent.
It is very hard to locate outside of CA, but we use them all the time here
in NC. Perhaps, one of the best mercury units other than the old T87F
Honeywell, also known as The Round One.


Thanks,

Dave

Yeah, I had a Hunter for 17 years, and it was crap. Yeah, it was
terrible how much that unit saved me, I even installed it at a house
I rented.
The only reason I replaced it was its problem of making transition
from heating to cooling. So after my mother was so pleased with
how easy it was to use the Lux I had installed over three years ago,
I replaced my Hunter with a Lux. I still use the Honeywell as a
digital thermometer on the back porch.
I also recently replaced a failed Honeywell with a Lux at the local
United Way center.

Yep, they're crap. Not a lot of markup for the installers, either. I can
see why they wouldn't like them.

George Wenzel wrote in message
...
In article ,
says...
Problem #1..Hunter and Lux, Cheapest of the Cheap. Garbage. Total
complete,
utter crap.

Can you provide some more info? I have a Lux, and haven't had any
problems with it (thus far). It's never made a noticeable click, to my
knowledge.

Regards,

George Wenzel
--
George Wenzel, B.A. (Criminology)
E-mail: lid
E-mail address is munged. Instead of dot invalid, use dot net

George Wenzel wrote:

In article ,
says...
Problem #1..Hunter and Lux, Cheapest of the Cheap. Garbage. Total complete,
utter crap.

Can you provide some more info? I have a Lux, and haven't had any
problems with it (thus far). It's never made a noticeable click, to my
knowledge.

Don't worry much, that was just the rantings of a "pro" who has been
conditioned to disparage anything a DIYer might use. It helps them
protect their markups.

"Dave Gallant" wrote in message
om...
Greetings:

I have a Hunter Digital Thermostat [Set and Save 110], and the relay
makes a "click" noise every time the unit calls for heat. Their help
department tells me that this is a normal function of this unit.

Is this a standard operation of all digital thermostats? If not, I
will be making a change. I have an office setup within 15 feet of the
unit, and the sound can distracting. Suggestions on a good replacement
would be appreciated - heat only, for hot water baseboards.

Thanks,

Dave

This is Turtle.

The Clicking noise on digital thermostats are normal in this way. the upper
end of the quality scale of thermostats really rarely make any Clicking
noise. now the lower end of the digital thermostat quality scale will click
on most all the models. Now all brands make low end equipment and high end
equipment except Hunter, Lux, and Jade, which does not make high end
equipment.

Now to Hunter, jade, and Lux being of any quality or not. They are just one
of the boys down at the low end of the quality scale and it seems to me to
have more trouble out of low end equipment at the lower end of the equipment
scale. Now Honeywell, White Rogers, and Robert Shaw do make equipment in
this low end equipment scale and i do see trouble out of them too, but not
as much as Hunter, jade, and Lux with problems. This is my take on the
thermostat game.

Now to the ideal of hvac people putting down Hunter, Jade, and Lux for they
can be bought at any hardware stores all over and the hvac people wanting to
sell you Honeywell, White Rogers, and Robert Shaw because you can't buy them
and there is a better mark up on them. that is a bunch of bull for any major
hardware stores [ Lowes, home depot, Southerlands, HobbyLobby, Ace, and
Office Max ] all sell the honeywell, Robert Shaw, or White Rogers. What I'm
tring to tell you is if your going to buy your own thermostat to put on
yourself. Get the Honeywell, Robert Shaw, or White Rogers in the place of
the Hunter, Jade, and Lux for just getting less trouble and i did not say no
trouble. In my hvac business I see bad thermostats or malifuctioning
thermostats as the years go by and 80% of these will be hunter, jade, or Lux
and 20% will be Honeywell, Robert shaw, or White Rogers. now one note here
and that is i see the least trouble out of Honeywell than any other brand.
Now your going to have to pay about $5.00 to $10.00 more for a Honeywell but
i think it is worth it.

TURTLE

George Wenzel wrote in message
...
In article ,
says...
Problem #1..Hunter and Lux, Cheapest of the Cheap. Garbage. Total
complete,
utter crap.

Can you provide some more info? I have a Lux, and haven't had any
problems with it (thus far). It's never made a noticeable click, to my
knowledge.

CBHvac is a licensed HVAC guy. He hates anything that allows a
homeowner to do something on their own, since if you can go out and buy your
own thermostat and install it yourself he won't be able to charge you $300
for the stat + $120 to install it. In addition he won't be able to get a
foot in your door to sell you new equipment you probably don't need.

I have a Hunter stat myself for over 2 years now, haven't even had to
replace the batteries yet. My folks have had a Lux for at least 3 years
now. Never a problem. I have however seen a Honeywell fail (that's why I
have a Hunter stat now).

If CBHVAC had his way, you wouldn't even be able to buy air filters at
the local hardware sto You'd be hiring and paying him $300 every three
months to do the job.

Want proof? Look how most of the technical trades have "Apprenticeship"
systems in place: It doesn't take 5-7 years to learn a trade like
Electrical, Plumbing, HVAC, etc ... unless you're mentally retarded. The
apprenticeship system is really just a regulator of sorts to keep supply and
demand in check within the workforce under the guise that it somehow
improves safety. Sadly, people who would otherwise be brilliant working
certain trades are turned off by having to work under sub-standard wages for
such a lengthy time.

Here in Ontario one has to go through 5 years of an Electrical
Apprenticeship to get their license. By contrast to get their gas and oil
licenses, they need only take a 4 week course (full time) and pass a test
(50% is considered a pass, as I understand it). The instructors of these
courses know what's going to be on the exam, and train the students only on
that content since failures can get them fired. Why is gas and oil like
this in Ontario, and Electrical is not? Because the labour rates in HVAC
here were going through the roof. Electrical rates are on the rise too --
BUT they have a strong union here.

Sorry if these seems like a rant, but the constant self-serving whining
by some of these so-called pros about how homeowners should just sit on
their hands and do nothing really gets to me some times.

jim

"SuperJim" wrote in message
.. .

Here in Ontario one has to go through 5 years of an Electrical
Apprenticeship to get their license.

if you study for 4 years you'll become an electrical engineer
the material related to electrical work is covered in 2 or 3 courses
(circuits,power and electromagnetics)

it's ridiculous that you have to be an apprentice for 5 years to learn the
electrical code.

Hi George, hope you are having a nice day

On 21-Dec-03 At About 00:04:06, George E. Cawthon wrote to All
Subject: Digital Thermostat Click

GEC From: "George E. Cawthon"

GEC You are right, there was no click with my digital Honeywell
GEC thermostat. Can't really imagine there would be one with any kind
GEC of electronic thermostat, wouldn't they all use a solid state
GEC switch. Why would anyone put the mechanical relay, if there is one,
GEC in the thermostat instead of at the furnace. There may be a click
GEC at my furnace but there is so much other noise when it start that
GEC you couldn't hear a click without having the furnace cover off. A
GEC mechanical relay in a digital thermostat sounds like a real design
GEC flaw.

There are several models with mechanical relays. there are several reasons
for this. one is to make it compatible with millivolt systems. the other one
is to keep the bleed through down which causes some unit circuit boards
problem so it isn't a design flaw. it is a plus.


-= HvacTech2 =-


... Of course there's a God. What else explains Speedos?

___ TagDude 0.92á+[DM]
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ +++++++++++
spam protection measure, Please remove the 33 to send e-mail

"George Wenzel" wrote in message
...
In article ,
says...
Problem #1..Hunter and Lux, Cheapest of the Cheap. Garbage. Total
complete,
utter crap.

Can you provide some more info? I have a Lux, and haven't had any
problems with it (thus far). It's never made a noticeable click, to my
knowledge.


Replace over 10 a month...
Honeywell...0.

What kind of information do you want? Why they fail?

Easy...many are due to simple installer error. The homeowner goes to Lowes
and buys one and crosses C to W and smoke...
They are also made as cheaply as can be. Open one up and you will find not a
1/3rd of what is in a honeywell....Robertshaw, or any other real stat.
They are the most basic of off and on switches, and while many have good
luck, and I cant see every unit ever put in, we replace on average 90% more
Lux and Hunter stats than any other for reasons like:
Blower wont cut off, normally the switch that controls it breaks inside.
Unit will not maintain set temp: Thermister is reading wrong.
Unit temp varies wildly: Same as above
Unit will not come on: Either installer error, or just plain failure.



Regards,

George Wenzel
--
George Wenzel, B.A. (Criminology)
E-mail: lid
E-mail address is munged. Instead of dot invalid, use dot net

George Wenzel wrote:

In article , C G
says...
Don't worry much, that was just the rantings of a "pro" who has been
conditioned to disparage anything a DIYer might use. It helps them
protect their markups.

Perhaps. I just had a humidifier installed on my furnace, and the
installer mentioned that they had a thermostat/humidistat made by Lennox
that could control everything in one place. Thankfully they weren't at
all pushy in recommending it - they only mentioned that it was available.
I nearly crapped my pants when they said it cost $450CDN.

I think I'll stick with the $45CDN Lux that I bought at Home Depot. It
seems to be working just fine for me. :-)

And even if it dies in a couple years, you can replace it 9 times before
you get to the price of that wonderstat recommended by your installer.

On 21 Dec 2003 03:21:37 -0800, (Dave Gallant)
wrote:

Greetings:

I have a Hunter Digital Thermostat [Set and Save 110], and the relay
makes a "click" noise every time the unit calls for heat. Their help
department tells me that this is a normal function of this unit.

Is this a standard operation of all digital thermostats? If not, I
will be making a change. I have an office setup within 15 feet of the
unit, and the sound can distracting. Suggestions on a good replacement
would be appreciated - heat only, for hot water baseboards.

Thanks,

Dave

Not all. I had one that did that (cant remember the name, something
with an L) then I bought a Honeywell which is silent.

"C G" wrote in message
.com...
George Wenzel wrote:

In article ,
says...
Problem #1..Hunter and Lux, Cheapest of the Cheap. Garbage. Total
complete,
utter crap.

Can you provide some more info? I have a Lux, and haven't had any
problems with it (thus far). It's never made a noticeable click, to my
knowledge.

Don't worry much, that was just the rantings of a "pro" who has been
conditioned to disparage anything a DIYer might use. It helps them
protect their markups.

No...it was not a ranting...a ranting is this...

Start of example:

You stupid ****er...You paid for that Hunter and Lux what I can install a
real thermostat for....Lowes sells Honeywells Chronotherm 3s for what?? 89
on special?
Funny...we install them for less....thats parts and labor.

End of example.

Now, what I WAS trying to do was give you real world advice from someone
that sees more in a day than you might EVER see.
I also offered to help you out, and had you asked, I would have offered to
send you a decent stat for less than you can get it for at Lowes...BTW...my
markup..LOL...I wish you could see the markup...its much less than you
think, but if you knew what real wholesale was, and not what you see on the
internet, then you might understand how bad you get screwed at Lowes, and
Home Depot, and the like.
BTW, I just installed a 94% gas furnace for under $1000 for a customer...the
next closest bid was $3400....think about that for a moment, and then, ask
yourself why I bother in here when advice in person isnt free.
When you want to slam someone, thats trying to help, get your damn facts
clear, and complete before you make a fool of yourself.

Now....freeze or deal with the click.

Oh...and I just happen to have one of the thermostats I mentioned to you
that was a good unit. Now, if you want it, the markup is 0. You can have it
at cost, but the asshole fee for shipping will kill ya.

Sigh....another homeowner that thinks we are all out to get em...sad
fella..real sad.

On Sun, 21 Dec 2003 10:29:02 -0500, "Michael Baugh"
wrote:


Yeah, I had a Hunter for 17 years, and it was crap. Yeah, it was
terrible how much that unit saved me, I even installed it at a house
I rented.
The only reason I replaced it was its problem of making transition
from heating to cooling. So after my mother was so pleased with
how easy it was to use the Lux I had installed over three years ago,
I replaced my Hunter with a Lux. I still use the Honeywell as a
digital thermometer on the back porch.
I also recently replaced a failed Honeywell with a Lux at the local
United Way center.

Yep, they're crap. Not a lot of markup for the installers, either. I can
see why they wouldn't like them.

George Wenzel wrote in message
m...
In article ,
says...
Problem #1..Hunter and Lux, Cheapest of the Cheap. Garbage. Total
complete,
utter crap.

Can you provide some more info? I have a Lux, and haven't had any
problems with it (thus far). It's never made a noticeable click, to my
knowledge.

Regards,

George Wenzel
--
George Wenzel, B.A. (Criminology)
E-mail: lid
E-mail address is munged. Instead of dot invalid, use dot net



Yes that's it..Lux. I had a Lux which I actually loved and it worked
great, BUT that click was annoying as my thermostat is in the hall
right outside of my bedroom and I am a light sleeper. I actually did
prefer the setup and ease of use of the Lux much better than the
Honeywell I currently have.

"TURTLE" wrote in message
...


Snip



Watch out Turtle...you will get called a pro defending his turf, even though
you and I both have talked about it being ok for a person to do all the work
he wants, since we are not threatened by the DIY...besides, without them, we
would lose so much work in the way of fixing screwups..

Sigh...another idiot opens his mouth and inserts his foot..


"SuperJim" wrote in message
.. .
George Wenzel wrote in message
...
In article ,
says...
Problem #1..Hunter and Lux, Cheapest of the Cheap. Garbage. Total
complete,
utter crap.

Can you provide some more info? I have a Lux, and haven't had any
problems with it (thus far). It's never made a noticeable click, to my
knowledge.

CBHvac is a licensed HVAC guy. He hates anything that allows a
homeowner to do something on their own, since if you can go out and buy
your
own thermostat and install it yourself he won't be able to charge you $300
for the stat + $120 to install it. In addition he won't be able to get a
foot in your door to sell you new equipment you probably don't need.

Let me explain something....I am licenced, because its the law here. Do I
agree with it? Nope. Do you think I enjoy forking over what it takes to keep
that damn licence and insurance each and every year?
The answer, is no.

Do I feel that I am more qualified to give an answer in regards to matters
like this than you or some electrical engineer? Damn right.


I have a Hunter stat myself for over 2 years now, haven't even had to
replace the batteries yet. My folks have had a Lux for at least 3 years
now. Never a problem. I have however seen a Honeywell fail (that's why I
have a Hunter stat now).

If CBHVAC had his way, you wouldn't even be able to buy air filters at
the local hardware sto You'd be hiring and paying him $300 every three
months to do the job.

Sigh...shows how little you know....

We sell filters, lets take 20X20X1...a very common size..for fifty freaking
cents....you want a CASE? Thats 25 BTW...
Pleated paper in the same size? about a buck. Labor to install....zero. You
got it bubba...someone wants a filter changed out each month...(yea...its
ever 30 days done correctly in this enviroment) we just work it into the
work schedule and swing over and put it in...
I cant tell you how many older folks we install them for at the first of
each month....for free...I think I can afford a few bucks back to the people
that have spent money with us, and trust us..


Want proof? Look how most of the technical trades have
"Apprenticeship"
systems in place: It doesn't take 5-7 years to learn a trade like
Electrical, Plumbing, HVAC, etc ... unless you're mentally retarded.

Funny thing is, it does not take that long to get a degree in
HVAC...sorry...
Anyone can do it...its finding someone to do it right, and take a bit of
pride in it.

Sorry you havent found that kind of person yet.


The
apprenticeship system is really just a regulator of sorts to keep supply
and
demand in check within the workforce under the guise that it somehow
improves safety. Sadly, people who would otherwise be brilliant working
certain trades are turned off by having to work under sub-standard wages
for
such a lengthy time.

Umm...no. In NYC for example, the only licence you must have is the EPA.
There is no licence needed to work in the field.
There are tons of hacks up there that will kindly take your money. Stormin
Mormon is one.



Here in Ontario one has to go through 5 years of an Electrical
Apprenticeship to get their license. By contrast to get their gas and oil
licenses, they need only take a 4 week course (full time) and pass a test
(50% is considered a pass, as I understand it). The instructors of these
courses know what's going to be on the exam, and train the students only
on
that content since failures can get them fired. Why is gas and oil like
this in Ontario, and Electrical is not? Because the labour rates in HVAC
here were going through the roof. Electrical rates are on the rise too --
BUT they have a strong union here.

I am anti union too...but if you had known anything about me, you would know
that.


Sorry if these seems like a rant, but the constant self-serving
whining
by some of these so-called pros about how homeowners should just sit on
their hands and do nothing really gets to me some times.

Good. It should. Really.
You know what rips me? When some idiot thinks he knows what I do based on a
couple of posts.
Let me ask you something....did you work today? Seriously. Did you? I did.
Ran 4 calls, and made zero. Why? Because it was all heat pump calls, except
one, an oil unit that needed about 60 seconds of adjustment. The other 3
took a combined total of about 2 minutes to fix, and 20 each to set back up.
It wasnt in my interest to charge them for that.....
Thats how I work. I also installed 3 furnaces last month for folks that
could not afford them, and when it came time to pay, I told them to have a
great Christmas and went on...sorry...but when I tell someone to get a
professional to look at it, it is for a reason.

Do I charge? Sure I do. I have to.
Do I charge as much as the next guy? Not even.
I have pics on my site right now, that proves why I say, HIRE A PRO...down
on the bottom of the pics page, there is an installation that we were asked
to look at....I am going to rip it all out, and replace it with new
everything, CORRECTLY, for about half of what he was charged for an illegal
and unsafe installation.
Will I make money? Sure I will....but before you condem me for charging,
when was the last time you worked for a couple of months, spent your own
money on others, and did if for free? When you can say you gave your
neighbor a furnace comepletely installed with permits and inpections and
code updates for no reason other than they needed it and cant afford it,
then you can blast me...till then, kiss my ass.


jim

C G posted for all of us....

George Wenzel wrote:

In article ,
says...
Problem #1..Hunter and Lux, Cheapest of the Cheap. Garbage. Total complete,
utter crap.

Can you provide some more info? I have a Lux, and haven't had any
problems with it (thus far). It's never made a noticeable click, to my
knowledge.

Don't worry much, that was just the rantings of a "pro" who has been
conditioned to disparage anything a DIYer might use. It helps them
protect their markups.

Go away, it's his opinion. It's as valid as yours; in fact more so because
he's gonna see many more than you will. Oh yeh tell me what mark up he
makes on this? Like nothing? Just giving his time & effort to answer.

I repeat -- go away.
--
Tekkie

Politicians & diapers are filled with it & both should be changed regularly.

You are right, there was no click with my digital Honeywell
thermostat. Can't really imagine there would be one with
any kind of electronic thermostat, wouldn't they all use a
solid state switch. Why would anyone put the mechanical
relay, if there is one, in the thermostat instead of at the
furnace. There may be a click at my furnace but there is so
much other noise when it start that you couldn't hear a
click without having the furnace cover off. A mechanical
relay in a digital thermostat sounds like a real design
flaw.

"Bob M." wrote:

There are a few that use solid-state components to activate the HVAC
equipment, and these may be described as having battery backup, but running
on the voltage provided by the HVAC equipment. But most of the units are
more universal in their design, so they work on the majority of control
systems used on HVAC equipment.

Unfortunately, the best and most universal way to activate the HVAC
equipment is with dry contacts, the kind that small relays have. Being an
electro-mechanical device, when the contacts activate, there is some noise
associated with that action. Some are noisier than others. The relays are
small, the contacts are small, so to make a good connection they must really
"snap" into position.

After a while, either you get used to it, or you move the thermostat around
the corner to a room or space where you can't hear it anymore, and hope that
the resulting temperature is still within your comfort zone.

The original Honeywell round thermostats use a mercury switch inside that's
totally silent as it makes the connection, but this kind of unit is not
digital and can't be programmed. I would not be surprised however to find
that the Honeywell units are very quiet, if not silent, so it may be worth
buying one and trying it out. If there's no improvement, or it's too noisy,
you should be able to return it to the store where you purchased it.

Bob M.
======
"Dave Gallant" wrote in message
om...
Greetings:

I have a Hunter Digital Thermostat [Set and Save 110], and the relay
makes a "click" noise every time the unit calls for heat. Their help
department tells me that this is a normal function of this unit.

Is this a standard operation of all digital thermostats? If not, I
will be making a change. I have an office setup within 15 feet of the
unit, and the sound can distracting. Suggestions on a good replacement
would be appreciated - heat only, for hot water baseboards.

Thanks,

Dave

"Tekkie" wrote in message
ganews.com...
C G posted for all of us....

George Wenzel wrote:

In article ,
says...
Problem #1..Hunter and Lux, Cheapest of the Cheap. Garbage. Total
complete,
utter crap.

Can you provide some more info? I have a Lux, and haven't had any
problems with it (thus far). It's never made a noticeable click, to
my
knowledge.

Don't worry much, that was just the rantings of a "pro" who has been
conditioned to disparage anything a DIYer might use. It helps them
protect their markups.

Go away, it's his opinion. It's as valid as yours; in fact more so because
he's gonna see many more than you will. Oh yeh tell me what mark up he
makes on this? Like nothing? Just giving his time & effort to answer.

I repeat -- go away.
--
Tekkie

Politicians & diapers are filled with it & both should be changed
regularly.


Man..its pointless...if I was not in the trade, and just a homeowner, and
gave that advice, it would have been treated like wow...
But let someone that is in the trade, that might actually know what the hell
he is talking about offer some time in here, and you get treated like a
crimminal..
They are scared I might actually rip em off..for free...wow...isnt that
amazing? And then they wonder why in the other group we bitch about
em....screw it...its his system...he prob owns something like a Lexus and
uses Quality Mart branded oil in it...LOL..and the filter? You mean its got
to be changed??? Get the point?
First he got screwed buying an overpriced Toyota, and then...GASP! You mean
there is more to keep up on it? Those damn tires should have lasted another
4 years...and 200,000 miles. Then he goes to Sams Club or someplace and
thinks that hes getting a deal, while he could have asked and found the same
tire for less..but GOD HELP if someone from Firestone offers advice...then
hes looking to get the biz...
Screw it....let him figure it out....
I got an oil furnace down the road he can go work on too...hes so smurt!

TURTLE wrote:

"Dave Gallant" wrote in message
om...
Greetings:

I have a Hunter Digital Thermostat [Set and Save 110], and the relay
makes a "click" noise every time the unit calls for heat. Their help
department tells me that this is a normal function of this unit.

Is this a standard operation of all digital thermostats? If not, I
will be making a change. I have an office setup within 15 feet of the
unit, and the sound can distracting. Suggestions on a good replacement
would be appreciated - heat only, for hot water baseboards.

Thanks,

Dave

This is Turtle.

The Clicking noise on digital thermostats are normal in this way. the upper
end of the quality scale of thermostats really rarely make any Clicking
noise. now the lower end of the digital thermostat quality scale will click
on most all the models. Now all brands make low end equipment and high end
equipment except Hunter, Lux, and Jade, which does not make high end
equipment.

Now to Hunter, jade, and Lux being of any quality or not. They are just one
of the boys down at the low end of the quality scale and it seems to me to
have more trouble out of low end equipment at the lower end of the equipment
scale. Now Honeywell, White Rogers, and Robert Shaw do make equipment in
this low end equipment scale and i do see trouble out of them too, but not
as much as Hunter, jade, and Lux with problems. This is my take on the
thermostat game.

Now to the ideal of hvac people putting down Hunter, Jade, and Lux for they
can be bought at any hardware stores all over and the hvac people wanting to
sell you Honeywell, White Rogers, and Robert Shaw because you can't buy them
and there is a better mark up on them. that is a bunch of bull for any major
hardware stores [ Lowes, home depot, Southerlands, HobbyLobby, Ace, and
Office Max ] all sell the honeywell, Robert Shaw, or White Rogers. What I'm
tring to tell you is if your going to buy your own thermostat to put on
yourself. Get the Honeywell, Robert Shaw, or White Rogers in the place of
the Hunter, Jade, and Lux for just getting less trouble and i did not say no
trouble. In my hvac business I see bad thermostats or malifuctioning
thermostats as the years go by and 80% of these will be hunter, jade, or Lux
and 20% will be Honeywell, Robert shaw, or White Rogers. now one note here
and that is i see the least trouble out of Honeywell than any other brand.
Now your going to have to pay about $5.00 to $10.00 more for a Honeywell but
i think it is worth it.

TURTLE

I read what you said and what CBhvac said about clicking
being normal. That may be true but if there was much of a
click I would hear it as mine is in the hall with a straight
shot of about 12 feet to my ear. So after saying that my
Honeywell doesn't click, I decided to check further. I put
my ear about 1 inch from the thermostat and raised the
desired temperature 4 degrees. The furnace came on. No
click, no noise of any kind at the thermostat. My honeywell
does not click! The diagram in the thermostat manual for
hooking up the wires indicates that the wires from the
thermostat go to a relay(s) that are not part of the
thermostat.

Maybe I'm just lucky getting the Honeywell thermostat that I
have. Personally, I would take back any electronic
thermostat that made any noise for any reason other than
programmed beeps.

CBhvac wrote:

"C G" wrote in message
.com...
George Wenzel wrote:

In article ,
says...
Problem #1..Hunter and Lux, Cheapest of the Cheap. Garbage. Total
complete,
utter crap.

Can you provide some more info? I have a Lux, and haven't had any
problems with it (thus far). It's never made a noticeable click, to my
knowledge.

Don't worry much, that was just the rantings of a "pro" who has been
conditioned to disparage anything a DIYer might use. It helps them
protect their markups.

No...it was not a ranting...a ranting is this...

Start of example:

You stupid ****er...You paid for that Hunter and Lux what I can install a
real thermostat for....Lowes sells Honeywells Chronotherm 3s for what?? 89
on special?
Funny...we install them for less....thats parts and labor.

End of example.

Now, what I WAS trying to do was give you real world advice from someone
that sees more in a day than you might EVER see.
I also offered to help you out, and had you asked, I would have offered to
send you a decent stat for less than you can get it for at Lowes...BTW...my
markup..LOL...I wish you could see the markup...its much less than you
think, but if you knew what real wholesale was, and not what you see on the
internet, then you might understand how bad you get screwed at Lowes, and
Home Depot, and the like.
BTW, I just installed a 94% gas furnace for under $1000 for a customer...the
next closest bid was $3400....think about that for a moment, and then, ask
yourself why I bother in here when advice in person isnt free.
When you want to slam someone, thats trying to help, get your damn facts
clear, and complete before you make a fool of yourself.

Now....freeze or deal with the click.

Oh...and I just happen to have one of the thermostats I mentioned to you
that was a good unit. Now, if you want it, the markup is 0. You can have it
at cost, but the asshole fee for shipping will kill ya.

Sigh....another homeowner that thinks we are all out to get em...sad
fella..real sad.


Damn. You ought to be here. My gas Amana furnace started
acting up last week and we had a guy come out (from the same
people that installed the furnace). It would come on an
burn for a while and then the burner would shut off, but
most of the time the burner would come back on before the
main fan went off. Still, it took forever to get the temp
up from overnight to the daytime settin. Figured it was
something wrong on the inductor circuit, and it was. But it
wasn't the fan itself or an electrical or vacuum switch. The
vacuum was too low because the inductor fan housing lost the
seal to the box. Still under warranty, so it didn't cost
anything. Because the guy mentioned that I was lucky it
wasn't the fan itsiel, I asked what the cost of the inductor
fan was and he says straight faced, $600 (may have included
labor but installation would only take 15 minutes--that's
about how long he took to take it off, clean the base, add a
calk seal, and screw it back into place). You are right, it
must be some markup!

By the way, this guy did know what he was doing and was
willing to explain what he was doing and why, when I asked.

I have 3 Sears digital thermostats in my house all top rated by
Consumer Reports many years ago. Don't know who makes them. They all
have a slight click. I am very adverse to noise but they are not loud
enuf to be annoying.


"George E. Cawthon" wrote in message
...
You are right, there was no click with my digital Honeywell
thermostat. Can't really imagine there would be one with
any kind of electronic thermostat, wouldn't they all use a
solid state switch. Why would anyone put the mechanical
relay, if there is one, in the thermostat instead of at the
furnace. There may be a click at my furnace but there is so
much other noise when it start that you couldn't hear a
click without having the furnace cover off. A mechanical
relay in a digital thermostat sounds like a real design
flaw.

"Bob M." wrote:

There are a few that use solid-state components to activate the
HVAC
equipment, and these may be described as having battery backup,
but running
on the voltage provided by the HVAC equipment. But most of the
units are
more universal in their design, so they work on the majority of
control
systems used on HVAC equipment.

Unfortunately, the best and most universal way to activate the
HVAC
equipment is with dry contacts, the kind that small relays have.
Being an
electro-mechanical device, when the contacts activate, there is
some noise
associated with that action. Some are noisier than others. The
relays are
small, the contacts are small, so to make a good connection they
must really
"snap" into position.

After a while, either you get used to it, or you move the
thermostat around
the corner to a room or space where you can't hear it anymore, and
hope that
the resulting temperature is still within your comfort zone.

The original Honeywell round thermostats use a mercury switch
inside that's
totally silent as it makes the connection, but this kind of unit
is not
digital and can't be programmed. I would not be surprised however
to find
that the Honeywell units are very quiet, if not silent, so it may
be worth
buying one and trying it out. If there's no improvement, or it's
too noisy,
you should be able to return it to the store where you purchased
it.

Bob M.
======
"Dave Gallant" wrote in message
om...
Greetings:

I have a Hunter Digital Thermostat [Set and Save 110], and the
relay
makes a "click" noise every time the unit calls for heat. Their
help
department tells me that this is a normal function of this unit.

Is this a standard operation of all digital thermostats? If not,
I
will be making a change. I have an office setup within 15 feet
of the
unit, and the sound can distracting. Suggestions on a good
replacement
would be appreciated - heat only, for hot water baseboards.

Thanks,

Dave

My parents house has a digital lux and it has a very slight click.


"jtees4" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 21 Dec 2003 10:29:02 -0500, "Michael Baugh"
wrote:


Yeah, I had a Hunter for 17 years, and it was crap. Yeah, it was
terrible how much that unit saved me, I even installed it at a
house
I rented.
The only reason I replaced it was its problem of making transition
from heating to cooling. So after my mother was so pleased with
how easy it was to use the Lux I had installed over three years
ago,
I replaced my Hunter with a Lux. I still use the Honeywell as a
digital thermometer on the back porch.
I also recently replaced a failed Honeywell with a Lux at the local
United Way center.

Yep, they're crap. Not a lot of markup for the installers, either.
I can
see why they wouldn't like them.

George Wenzel wrote in
message
m...
In article ,
says...
Problem #1..Hunter and Lux, Cheapest of the Cheap. Garbage.
Total
complete,
utter crap.

Can you provide some more info? I have a Lux, and haven't had
any
problems with it (thus far). It's never made a noticeable click,
to my
knowledge.

Regards,

George Wenzel
--
George Wenzel, B.A. (Criminology)
E-mail: lid
E-mail address is munged. Instead of dot invalid, use dot net



Yes that's it..Lux. I had a Lux which I actually loved and it worked
great, BUT that click was annoying as my thermostat is in the hall
right outside of my bedroom and I am a light sleeper. I actually did
prefer the setup and ease of use of the Lux much better than the
Honeywell I currently have.

I bought a Robert Shaw at Ace and it crapped out after a few years.
Meanwhile a Lux and 3 Sears (not sure who makes the Sears) have lasted
much longer. All had a slight click. The RobertShaw was about $125.
The others were about half that.



"TURTLE" wrote in message
...

"Dave Gallant" wrote in message
om...
Greetings:

I have a Hunter Digital Thermostat [Set and Save 110], and the
relay
makes a "click" noise every time the unit calls for heat. Their
help
department tells me that this is a normal function of this unit.

Is this a standard operation of all digital thermostats? If not, I
will be making a change. I have an office setup within 15 feet of
the
unit, and the sound can distracting. Suggestions on a good
replacement
would be appreciated - heat only, for hot water baseboards.

Thanks,

Dave

This is Turtle.

The Clicking noise on digital thermostats are normal in this way.
the upper
end of the quality scale of thermostats really rarely make any
Clicking
noise. now the lower end of the digital thermostat quality scale
will click
on most all the models. Now all brands make low end equipment and
high end
equipment except Hunter, Lux, and Jade, which does not make high end
equipment.

Now to Hunter, jade, and Lux being of any quality or not. They are
just one
of the boys down at the low end of the quality scale and it seems to
me to
have more trouble out of low end equipment at the lower end of the
equipment
scale. Now Honeywell, White Rogers, and Robert Shaw do make
equipment in
this low end equipment scale and i do see trouble out of them too,
but not
as much as Hunter, jade, and Lux with problems. This is my take on
the
thermostat game.

Now to the ideal of hvac people putting down Hunter, Jade, and Lux
for they
can be bought at any hardware stores all over and the hvac people
wanting to
sell you Honeywell, White Rogers, and Robert Shaw because you can't
buy them
and there is a better mark up on them. that is a bunch of bull for
any major
hardware stores [ Lowes, home depot, Southerlands, HobbyLobby, Ace,
and
Office Max ] all sell the honeywell, Robert Shaw, or White Rogers.
What I'm
tring to tell you is if your going to buy your own thermostat to put
on
yourself. Get the Honeywell, Robert Shaw, or White Rogers in the
place of
the Hunter, Jade, and Lux for just getting less trouble and i did
not say no
trouble. In my hvac business I see bad thermostats or malifuctioning
thermostats as the years go by and 80% of these will be hunter,
jade, or Lux
and 20% will be Honeywell, Robert shaw, or White Rogers. now one
note here
and that is i see the least trouble out of Honeywell than any other
brand.
Now your going to have to pay about $5.00 to $10.00 more for a
Honeywell but
i think it is worth it.

TURTLE

"George E. Cawthon" wrote in message
...

I read what you said and what CBhvac said about clicking
being normal. That may be true but if there was much of a
click I would hear it as mine is in the hall with a straight
shot of about 12 feet to my ear. So after saying that my
Honeywell doesn't click, I decided to check further. I put
my ear about 1 inch from the thermostat and raised the
desired temperature 4 degrees. The furnace came on. No
click, no noise of any kind at the thermostat. My honeywell
does not click!

look, this is simple
there are many different kinds of heating systems and they use different
voltages.
My thermostat doesn't click either but it only works with 12 volts.
there are thermostats that work with 120V and a mechanical relay can drive
more current than a transistor

"Art Begun" wrote in message
nk.net...
I bought a Robert Shaw at Ace and it crapped out after a few years.
Meanwhile a Lux and 3 Sears (not sure who makes the Sears) have lasted
much longer. All had a slight click. The RobertShaw was about $125.
The others were about half that.

The older Sears, since you didnt state when , or a model number, were made
by either Robertshaw, or Honeywell for the most part.
If you pull the front cover off, and there is a sticker still there that you
can read, or a imprint, or a number, manytimes you can tell that way...




"TURTLE" wrote in message
...

"Dave Gallant" wrote in message
om...
Greetings:

I have a Hunter Digital Thermostat [Set and Save 110], and the
relay
makes a "click" noise every time the unit calls for heat. Their
help
department tells me that this is a normal function of this unit.

Is this a standard operation of all digital thermostats? If not, I
will be making a change. I have an office setup within 15 feet of
the
unit, and the sound can distracting. Suggestions on a good
replacement
would be appreciated - heat only, for hot water baseboards.

Thanks,

Dave

This is Turtle.

The Clicking noise on digital thermostats are normal in this way.
the upper
end of the quality scale of thermostats really rarely make any
Clicking
noise. now the lower end of the digital thermostat quality scale
will click
on most all the models. Now all brands make low end equipment and
high end
equipment except Hunter, Lux, and Jade, which does not make high end
equipment.

Now to Hunter, jade, and Lux being of any quality or not. They are
just one
of the boys down at the low end of the quality scale and it seems to
me to
have more trouble out of low end equipment at the lower end of the
equipment
scale. Now Honeywell, White Rogers, and Robert Shaw do make
equipment in
this low end equipment scale and i do see trouble out of them too,
but not
as much as Hunter, jade, and Lux with problems. This is my take on
the
thermostat game.

Now to the ideal of hvac people putting down Hunter, Jade, and Lux
for they
can be bought at any hardware stores all over and the hvac people
wanting to
sell you Honeywell, White Rogers, and Robert Shaw because you can't
buy them
and there is a better mark up on them. that is a bunch of bull for
any major
hardware stores [ Lowes, home depot, Southerlands, HobbyLobby, Ace,
and
Office Max ] all sell the honeywell, Robert Shaw, or White Rogers.
What I'm
tring to tell you is if your going to buy your own thermostat to put
on
yourself. Get the Honeywell, Robert Shaw, or White Rogers in the
place of
the Hunter, Jade, and Lux for just getting less trouble and i did
not say no
trouble. In my hvac business I see bad thermostats or malifuctioning
thermostats as the years go by and 80% of these will be hunter,
jade, or Lux
and 20% will be Honeywell, Robert shaw, or White Rogers. now one
note here
and that is i see the least trouble out of Honeywell than any other
brand.
Now your going to have to pay about $5.00 to $10.00 more for a
Honeywell but
i think it is worth it.

TURTLE

"Art Begun" wrote in message
nk.net...
I bought a Robert Shaw at Ace and it crapped out after a few years.
Meanwhile a Lux and 3 Sears (not sure who makes the Sears) have lasted
much longer. All had a slight click. The RobertShaw was about $125.
The others were about half that.


This is Turtle.

first Art , Robert Shaw has nothing sold to the public worth $125.00 but
maybe Ace thought it should be worth that. You can buy anything Robert Shaw
will sell to the public from Ace or others for about $75.00 is the retail
price of the best Ace can get from Robert Shaw. Robert Shaw sells a 5 day/ 2
day and a 7 day programiable thermostat for retail outlets like ace but the
suggested retail on them is $75.00 + Tax. Now robert shaw does make some
High end models like these for about $100.00 to $200.00 but robert Shaw will
only sell to contractors and not the public. These require a little
knownledge to put them in for they can be burnt up if your not careful
there. they only sell the worm proof model to the public and the screwiable
up models to contractor. They don't like to eat thermostats that are burnt
up in the first day of service.

Secondly, If it clicks , It's not high end equipment , Period. Usely the
$50.00 or less models all click $50.00 to $99.00 models will click but you
got to listen to really hear it, and you hear no clicking at $100.00 or
above on the Honeywell, White Rogers, or Robert Shaw.

Third, if you want a good high end thermostat , get you a Honeywell and get
it over with.

Forth, Sears buys thermostat from the lowest bidder that year. It can be any
brand on the market.

Fifth, Here is a list of the Good High end thermostats in the way of quality
rating of mine.

Honeywell
White Rogers
..
..
Robert Shaw / Maple Chase -- their rating dropped when Maple chase bought
them out.
..
..
..
..
Lux / Lux Pro
Jade
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
Hunter

TURTLE

"jtees4" wrote in message
...
On 21 Dec 2003 03:21:37 -0800, (Dave Gallant)
wrote:

Greetings:

I have a Hunter Digital Thermostat [Set and Save 110], and the relay
makes a "click" noise every time the unit calls for heat. Their help
department tells me that this is a normal function of this unit.

Is this a standard operation of all digital thermostats? If not, I
will be making a change. I have an office setup within 15 feet of the
unit, and the sound can distracting. Suggestions on a good replacement
would be appreciated - heat only, for hot water baseboards.

Thanks,

Dave

Not all. I had one that did that (cant remember the name, something
with an L) then I bought a Honeywell which is silent.

This is Turtle.

Read my reply to Art.

Now about the Hunter Clicking here. If a Hunter did not click , i would
think it maybe something wrong. A hunter is going to click but maybe not as
loud as what you say.

TURTLE

On 21-Dec-2003, "CBhvac" stephenaddressscfrewedonpurpose@carolinabreezehva c.com wrote:

Can you provide some more info? I have a Lux, and haven't had any
problems with it (thus far). It's never made a noticeable click, to my
knowledge.


Replace over 10 a month...
Honeywell...0.

I've installed a bunch of Lux 1500 (IIRC) units over the years and I've
never seen one fail. I replaced the Honeywell in my home with a Lux.
It's been works fine for almost five years now. YMMV.

The user interface of the Honeywell sucks big time. The Lux is much
simpler and better.

Easy...many are due to simple installer error.

That clearly is the fault of the manufacturer - no?

Mike

"j j" wrote in message
.. .

"George E. Cawthon" wrote in message
...

I read what you said and what CBhvac said about clicking
being normal. That may be true but if there was much of a
click I would hear it as mine is in the hall with a straight
shot of about 12 feet to my ear. So after saying that my
Honeywell doesn't click, I decided to check further. I put
my ear about 1 inch from the thermostat and raised the
desired temperature 4 degrees. The furnace came on. No
click, no noise of any kind at the thermostat. My honeywell
does not click!

look, this is simple
there are many different kinds of heating systems and they use different
voltages.
My thermostat doesn't click either but it only works with 12 volts.
there are thermostats that work with 120V and a mechanical relay can drive
more current than a transistor

This is Turtle.

JJ , we are talking about clicking and not voltages. We are talking about
residentiual hvac system and the voltage are limited to 24 volts or less to
control with. If it comes under commercial you can get the 120 volt
thermostats / Line voltage thermostats. Most line voltage thermostats will
click for they have heavy terminals to call for the 120 volts on the
controls. The 24 volt thermostat don't need to click for there is maybe at
most 1 amp of power to turn on.

Clicking on residentiual equipment has nothing to do with the voltage to
choose operate at but more of the quality of the thermostat you have.

You have me on the 12 volt control of your system. i would like to know what
type uses this 12 volts to control with. I know 250 mill-volts to 750
mill-volts , 24 volts, 120 volt, 220 volts, and 480 volt but 12 volts just
gets by me here.

TURTLE

Tekkie wrote:

C G posted for all of us....

George Wenzel wrote:

In article ,
says...
Problem #1..Hunter and Lux, Cheapest of the Cheap. Garbage. Total complete,
utter crap.

Can you provide some more info? I have a Lux, and haven't had any
problems with it (thus far). It's never made a noticeable click, to my
knowledge.

Don't worry much, that was just the rantings of a "pro" who has been
conditioned to disparage anything a DIYer might use. It helps them
protect their markups.

Go away, it's his opinion. It's as valid as yours; in fact more so because
he's gonna see many more than you will. Oh yeh tell me what mark up he
makes on this? Like nothing? Just giving his time & effort to answer.

Hmmm, let's see if I understand what you are saying. You are telling me
that it's ok for one person to post his opinion, but it's not ok for
someone else to post a counter opinion? Who appointed you the moderator
of a.h.r? Oh, wait, there is no moderator.


I repeat -- go away.

Perhaps some day you will learn to take your own advice.

"Michael Baugh" wrote in message
...

Yeah, I had a Hunter for 17 years, and it was crap. Yeah, it was
terrible how much that unit saved me, I even installed it at a house
I rented.
The only reason I replaced it was its problem of making transition
from heating to cooling. So after my mother was so pleased with
how easy it was to use the Lux I had installed over three years ago,
I replaced my Hunter with a Lux. I still use the Honeywell as a
digital thermometer on the back porch.
I also recently replaced a failed Honeywell with a Lux at the local
United Way center.

Yep, they're crap. Not a lot of markup for the installers, either. I can
see why they wouldn't like them.

Mark up??

LOL

How about the (LUX) stat locking into the heat mode?
(not turning the heat off)

Yep, that's a good stat........they are garbage..........

As far as the mark-up goes........try labor cost for replacing them.........
.........go for it.......they make us money. :-)

--
kjpro
_-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-_

( kjpro @ starband . net ) remove spaces to e-mail

Want it done yesterday? Or done right today, to save money tomorrow!!

_________________________ __

"C G" wrote in message
.com...
George Wenzel wrote:

In article ,
says...
Problem #1..Hunter and Lux, Cheapest of the Cheap. Garbage. Total
complete,
utter crap.

Can you provide some more info? I have a Lux, and haven't had any
problems with it (thus far). It's never made a noticeable click, to my
knowledge.

Don't worry much, that was just the rantings of a "pro" who has been
conditioned to disparage anything a DIYer might use. It helps them
protect their markups.

Don't care what you use....
....we make money on replacing them when they go bad. :-)

--
kjpro
_-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-_

( kjpro @ starband . net ) remove spaces to e-mail

Want it done yesterday? Or done right today, to save money tomorrow!!

_________________________ __

"C G" wrote in message
.com...
George Wenzel wrote:

In article , C G
says...
Don't worry much, that was just the rantings of a "pro" who has been
conditioned to disparage anything a DIYer might use. It helps them
protect their markups.

Perhaps. I just had a humidifier installed on my furnace, and the
installer mentioned that they had a thermostat/humidistat made by Lennox
that could control everything in one place. Thankfully they weren't at
all pushy in recommending it - they only mentioned that it was
available.
I nearly crapped my pants when they said it cost $450CDN.

I think I'll stick with the $45CDN Lux that I bought at Home Depot. It
seems to be working just fine for me. :-)

And even if it dies in a couple years, you can replace it 9 times before
you get to the price of that wonderstat recommended by your installer.

You are really clueless........

The thermidistat his installer suggested is a thermostat and a humidistat
all in one.
It's for comfort...........something you don't understand.

It controls several different things on the system as a whole.

--
kjpro
_-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-_

( kjpro @ starband . net ) remove spaces to e-mail

Want it done yesterday? Or done right today, to save money tomorrow!!

_________________________ __

HvacTech2 wrote:

Hi George, hope you are having a nice day

On 21-Dec-03 At About 00:04:06, George E. Cawthon wrote to All
Subject: Digital Thermostat Click

GEC From: "George E. Cawthon"

GEC You are right, there was no click with my digital Honeywell
GEC thermostat. Can't really imagine there would be one with any kind
GEC of electronic thermostat, wouldn't they all use a solid state
GEC switch. Why would anyone put the mechanical relay, if there is one,
GEC in the thermostat instead of at the furnace. There may be a click
GEC at my furnace but there is so much other noise when it start that
GEC you couldn't hear a click without having the furnace cover off. A
GEC mechanical relay in a digital thermostat sounds like a real design
GEC flaw.

There are several models with mechanical relays. there are several reasons
for this. one is to make it compatible with millivolt systems. the other one
is to keep the bleed through down which causes some unit circuit boards
problem so it isn't a design flaw. it is a plus.

-= HvacTech2 =-

.. Of course there's a God. What else explains Speedos?

___ TagDude 0.92á+[DM]
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ +++++++++++
spam protection measure, Please remove the 33 to send e-mail

Thanks for the explanation. I understand the need for
clicks in mechanical systems. BUT, we live in a computer
and semiconductor age. I'm no electronics guy so don't know
much about bleed through.
My computer turns all sort of stuff on and off inside the
case, and except for a grunting hard disk, there are no
click like noises; lots of motor whine, doors opening and
closing, but I don't hear clicks except those I make with
the keyboard and mouse. If my computer were operating
peripherals about the house, I would put the relays, if
needed, in the peripheral. I can understand relay noise
with heavy amperage, but there is no reason to have high
amperage within an electronic thermostat. Maybe it isn't a
design flaw, just a design that cheap or fails to take
advantage of newer technology, but I can't see it as a plus,
unless simplicity, univeral applications, low cost, or some
other think is the primary purpose.

I get really ****ed at extraneous and unknow cause noises.
I don't even like clicks from light switches; that's why I
use silent or mercury switches. Lots of electronic stuff
burps, buzzes, vibrates, but it most cases it because of
poorly made or poorly installed parts (too tight, too loose,
or failure to use an insulator.

My Amana gas heater ****es me off with the noise it makes
when it turns on. I'm told there is nothing they can do.
The noise goes straight into the plenum and then to a
bedroom bath where is much louder than standing right 1 foot
from the furnace. It's a high pitched whine which could be
either electrical or mechanical. It starts just before or
at the same time as the inducer fan starts, before the
burner comes on, and before the main blower starts. It is
not the inducer fan--with the cover panel off the inducer
fan runs very quitely. Whatever it is, it is the first
thing and continues until the inducer fan shuts off, but the
whine is masked when the burner comes on.

"SuperJim" wrote in message
.. .
George Wenzel wrote in message
...
In article ,
says...
Problem #1..Hunter and Lux, Cheapest of the Cheap. Garbage. Total
complete,
utter crap.

Can you provide some more info? I have a Lux, and haven't had any
problems with it (thus far). It's never made a noticeable click, to my
knowledge.

CBHvac is a licensed HVAC guy. He hates anything that allows a
homeowner to do something on their own, since if you can go out and buy
your
own thermostat and install it yourself he won't be able to charge you $300
for the stat + $120 to install it. In addition he won't be able to get a
foot in your door to sell you new equipment you probably don't need.

If, you knew CB, he's not like that.............are you??

I have a Hunter stat myself for over 2 years now, haven't even had to
replace the batteries yet. My folks have had a Lux for at least 3 years
now. Never a problem. I have however seen a Honeywell fail (that's why I
have a Hunter stat now).

If CBHVAC had his way, you wouldn't even be able to buy air filters at
the local hardware sto You'd be hiring and paying him $300 every three
months to do the job.

$300 every 3 months??

Damn man what kind of filter do you have?
Most people need to replace their filter monthly.
(unless they have a special media filter)
But, even then it depends on the conditions.

Want proof? Look how most of the technical trades have
"Apprenticeship"
systems in place: It doesn't take 5-7 years to learn a trade like
Electrical, Plumbing, HVAC, etc ... unless you're mentally retarded. The
apprenticeship system is really just a regulator of sorts to keep supply
and
demand in check within the workforce under the guise that it somehow
improves safety. Sadly, people who would otherwise be brilliant working
certain trades are turned off by having to work under sub-standard wages
for
such a lengthy time.

Here in Ontario one has to go through 5 years of an Electrical
Apprenticeship to get their license. By contrast to get their gas and oil
licenses, they need only take a 4 week course (full time) and pass a test
(50% is considered a pass, as I understand it). The instructors of these
courses know what's going to be on the exam, and train the students only
on
that content since failures can get them fired. Why is gas and oil like
this in Ontario, and Electrical is not? Because the labour rates in HVAC
here were going through the roof. Electrical rates are on the rise too --
BUT they have a strong union here.

Sorry if these seems like a rant, but the constant self-serving
whining
by some of these so-called pros about how homeowners should just sit on
their hands and do nothing really gets to me some times.

jim

Sorry that you are so damn CLUELESS!!

--
kjpro
_-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-_

( kjpro @ starband . net ) remove spaces to e-mail

Want it done yesterday? Or done right today, to save money tomorrow!!

_________________________ __

"George E. Cawthon" wrote in message
...


HvacTech2 wrote:

Hi George, hope you are having a nice day

On 21-Dec-03 At About 00:04:06, George E. Cawthon wrote to All
Subject: Digital Thermostat Click

GEC From: "George E. Cawthon"

GEC You are right, there was no click with my digital Honeywell
GEC thermostat. Can't really imagine there would be one with any kind
GEC of electronic thermostat, wouldn't they all use a solid state
GEC switch. Why would anyone put the mechanical relay, if there is
one,
GEC in the thermostat instead of at the furnace. There may be a click
GEC at my furnace but there is so much other noise when it start that
GEC you couldn't hear a click without having the furnace cover off. A
GEC mechanical relay in a digital thermostat sounds like a real design
GEC flaw.

There are several models with mechanical relays. there are several
reasons
for this. one is to make it compatible with millivolt systems. the other
one
is to keep the bleed through down which causes some unit circuit boards
problem so it isn't a design flaw. it is a plus.

-= HvacTech2 =-

.. Of course there's a God. What else explains Speedos?

___ TagDude 0.92á+[DM]
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ +++++++++++
spam protection measure, Please remove the 33 to send e-mail

Thanks for the explanation. I understand the need for
clicks in mechanical systems. BUT, we live in a computer
and semiconductor age. I'm no electronics guy so don't know
much about bleed through.
My computer turns all sort of stuff on and off inside the
case, and except for a grunting hard disk, there are no
click like noises; lots of motor whine, doors opening and
closing, but I don't hear clicks except those I make with
the keyboard and mouse. If my computer were operating
peripherals about the house, I would put the relays, if
needed, in the peripheral. I can understand relay noise
with heavy amperage, but there is no reason to have high
amperage within an electronic thermostat. Maybe it isn't a
design flaw, just a design that cheap or fails to take
advantage of newer technology, but I can't see it as a plus,
unless simplicity, univeral applications, low cost, or some
other think is the primary purpose.

I get really ****ed at extraneous and unknow cause noises.
I don't even like clicks from light switches; that's why I
use silent or mercury switches. Lots of electronic stuff
burps, buzzes, vibrates, but it most cases it because of
poorly made or poorly installed parts (too tight, too loose,
or failure to use an insulator.

My Amana gas heater ****es me off with the noise it makes
when it turns on. I'm told there is nothing they can do.
The noise goes straight into the plenum and then to a
bedroom bath where is much louder than standing right 1 foot
from the furnace. It's a high pitched whine which could be
either electrical or mechanical. It starts just before or
at the same time as the inducer fan starts, before the
burner comes on, and before the main blower starts. It is
not the inducer fan--with the cover panel off the inducer
fan runs very quitely. Whatever it is, it is the first
thing and continues until the inducer fan shuts off, but the
whine is masked when the burner comes on.

That's what you get for buying an AMANA.

--
kjpro
_-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-__-~-_

( kjpro @ starband . net ) remove spaces to e-mail

Want it done yesterday? Or done right today, to save money tomorrow!!

_________________________ __

kjpro wrote:

"C G" wrote in message
.com...
George Wenzel wrote:

In article , C G
says...
Don't worry much, that was just the rantings of a "pro" who has been
conditioned to disparage anything a DIYer might use. It helps them
protect their markups.

Perhaps. I just had a humidifier installed on my furnace, and the
installer mentioned that they had a thermostat/humidistat made by Lennox
that could control everything in one place. Thankfully they weren't at
all pushy in recommending it - they only mentioned that it was
available.
I nearly crapped my pants when they said it cost $450CDN.

I think I'll stick with the $45CDN Lux that I bought at Home Depot. It
seems to be working just fine for me. :-)

And even if it dies in a couple years, you can replace it 9 times before
you get to the price of that wonderstat recommended by your installer.

You are really clueless........

Actually, it seems you are.


The thermidistat his installer suggested is a thermostat and a humidistat
all in one.

So?

It's for comfort...........something you don't understand.

No, the heater and humidifier provide the comfort. The control is
allegedly for the convenience of having everything in one place, at a
rather high price. It seems you can't accept other people's financial
priorities without resorting to insults.


It controls several different things on the system as a whole.

At $450 it should wash the dishes and take care of the kids.

kjpro wrote:

"C G" wrote in message
.com...
George Wenzel wrote:

In article ,
says...
Problem #1..Hunter and Lux, Cheapest of the Cheap. Garbage. Total
complete,
utter crap.

Can you provide some more info? I have a Lux, and haven't had any
problems with it (thus far). It's never made a noticeable click, to my
knowledge.

Don't worry much, that was just the rantings of a "pro" who has been
conditioned to disparage anything a DIYer might use. It helps them
protect their markups.

Don't care what you use....
...we make money on replacing them when they go bad. :-)

What on earth makes you think I would call someone as arrogant as you to
do anything in my house?