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Default OT: Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?

A while back (start of Covid) I asked here about experiences re online
prescription deliveries and started using the Boots service because:

1) They were our local / normal pharmacist.

2) Someone suggested they used them and they had been fine.

I think I also remember someone saying they were hopeless and I think
I may now be leaning that way. ;-(

However, it may be down to expectation so I just wanted to check here.

Assuming I don't have the full login to the medical system (I think
I'm supposed to present my photo ID at my doctors to get 'signed up'
and as I don't have any I didn't take that any further ...) I may have
only been able to 'request' Boots online fulfil my prescription by
requesting authority from my doctor?

Now, they have been sending them though monthly (just 1 box x 5mG
Amlodopine) but it seems I have to 'request' them monthly, not what I
thought I was going to have to do.

Unfortunately their email-reminder ends up in my spam folder so unless
I check I can miss the reminder and run out.

So, can anyone confirm if I should be able to get at least say 1 years
worth of prescriptions delivered (monthly presumably) *without* having
to keep requesting them please?

Boots Online customer service seem worse than useless. ;-(

Cheers, T i m

p.s. And why the fcuk do they have to put the box of tablets, in a
plastic bag, in a box ... so big that won't go though the fairly large
letter box. And her Paracetamols must be dispatched by Amazon in boxes
big enough for a pair of shoes! ;-(
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Default OT: Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?

On 04/06/2021 11:55, T i m wrote:
A while back (start of Covid) I asked here about experiences re online
prescription deliveries and started using the Boots service because:

1) They were our local / normal pharmacist.

2) Someone suggested they used them and they had been fine.

I think I also remember someone saying they were hopeless and I think
I may now be leaning that way. ;-(

However, it may be down to expectation so I just wanted to check here.

Assuming I don't have the full login to the medical system (I think
I'm supposed to present my photo ID at my doctors to get 'signed up'
and as I don't have any I didn't take that any further ...) I may have
only been able to 'request' Boots online fulfil my prescription by
requesting authority from my doctor?

Now, they have been sending them though monthly (just 1 box x 5mG
Amlodopine) but it seems I have to 'request' them monthly, not what I
thought I was going to have to do.

Unfortunately their email-reminder ends up in my spam folder so unless
I check I can miss the reminder and run out.

So, can anyone confirm if I should be able to get at least say 1 years
worth of prescriptions delivered (monthly presumably) *without* having
to keep requesting them please?

Boots Online customer service seem worse than useless. ;-(


The online pharmacy service isn't really part of the main Boots online
presence, AFAICS. I think it's really more like a big pharmacy branch
that has some boxes to post stuff in. They have their own phone number,
which is only manned a few hours a day, but which does get answered.

I don't leave them to do the repeat prescriptions, but order stuff from
the GP myself when I need it, and the GP's system has the correct Boots
branch on their records. No complaints.

I suggest that you ring the Boots online pharmacy number and discuss the
issue with them.



Cheers, T i m

p.s. And why the fcuk do they have to put the box of tablets, in a
plastic bag, in a box ... so big that won't go though the fairly large
letter box.


Same here. I guess it's easier for them that way.

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Default OT: Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?

T i m wrote:
Assuming I don't have the full login to the medical system (I think
I'm supposed to present my photo ID at my doctors to get 'signed up'
and as I don't have any I didn't take that any further ...) I may have
only been able to 'request' Boots online fulfil my prescription by
requesting authority from my doctor?


I believe the pharmacy only do what the GP tells them to do. So it's up to
the GP to push repeat prescriptions at them. It's down to the GP's system
as to how you request this - via an app, or stuffing a bit of paper in the
letter box, or whatever. The GP surgery have to approve the requests so
it's not 'push button for a year', at least IMX. They may employ someone
who can do short-term repeats without having to defer to a doctor (eg if the
GP says 'review every 3 months' they can push the repeats for months 1 and
2 but month 3 needs the GP to confirm)

It gets messy when you have eg prescription #1 which is renewed every 28
days and #2 every month, and they gradually get out of sync.

So, can anyone confirm if I should be able to get at least say 1 years
worth of prescriptions delivered (monthly presumably) *without* having
to keep requesting them please?

Boots Online customer service seem worse than useless. ;-(


This is the problem. When it goes wrong (and it will) you want somebody you
can talk to who can sort it there and then and hand out the right thing,
rather than having to call-centre and then wait 3 days for the post - not
fun when you've run out of something important.

p.s. And why the fcuk do they have to put the box of tablets, in a
plastic bag, in a box ... so big that won't go though the fairly large
letter box. And her Paracetamols must be dispatched by Amazon in boxes
big enough for a pair of shoes! ;-(


One of the online pharmacies (can't remember which) sends tablets like
paracetamol in letterbox sized packages, by dint of removing the tablets
from the box and putting the tablet foils and flattened box in a thinner
package. Truly thinking outside the box

Theo
(who is getting very fed up with the amount of cardboard Amazon generates
and having to take trips to the tip purely for that)
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Default OT: Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?

T i m wrote:

Now, they have been sending them though monthly (just 1 box x 5mG
Amlodopine) but it seems I have to 'request' them monthly, not what I
thought I was going to have to do.

I think that's the way it works, I assume there are government/NHS
guidelines that say doctors can't prescribe for more than a month at a
time.


Unfortunately their email-reminder ends up in my spam folder so unless
I check I can miss the reminder and run out.

Don't you notice you only have (say) a week's worth left? That's how
I get reminded - when there's only 7 pills left I get on-line and
order more.


So, can anyone confirm if I should be able to get at least say 1 years
worth of prescriptions delivered (monthly presumably) *without* having
to keep requesting them please?

I think you're not going to get what you want!

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Default OT: Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?

On Fri, 4 Jun 2021 12:11:21 +0100, GB
wrote:

snip

So, can anyone confirm if I should be able to get at least say 1 years
worth of prescriptions delivered (monthly presumably) *without* having
to keep requesting them please?

Boots Online customer service seem worse than useless. ;-(


The online pharmacy service isn't really part of the main Boots online
presence, AFAICS. I think it's really more like a big pharmacy branch
that has some boxes to post stuff in.


;-)

They have their own phone number,
which is only manned a few hours a day, but which does get answered.


Ok, I might give that a try as the 'Computer says no' email is less
than helpful:

" Thank you for choosing the Boots Online Prescription Service.
Unfortunately, we cannot complete your order at this time for one or
more of the following reasons:

* the GP has not approved your order:

o within 48 hours
o because a review of your medication may be required, or
o your prescription is not yet due

Please contact the GP as soon as possible to discuss this order, so
that you can get the medication on time."

Except it's a PITA to contact my local GP and I really can't see why
(in 2021) they can't sort it all out between them?

eg, I have a regular (and single) prescription and until that changes
or I die, it just needs to carry on doesn't it? And it's not like it's
one of those 2000 a packet jobs? ;-(

I don't leave them to do the repeat prescriptions, but order stuff from
the GP myself when I need it,


My Mrs was a bit like that (for some reason I never bothered to ask)
keeping the repeat prescription at the local branch and then
submitting it some days before it was due?

and the GP's system has the correct Boots
branch on their records. No complaints.


Yes, that old 'manual' system seemed to work ok, just that it was
recommended we go 'keep away' during the main lockdown.

I suggest that you ring the Boots online pharmacy number and discuss the
issue with them.


I'll give it a go.

p.s. And why the fcuk do they have to put the box of tablets, in a
plastic bag, in a box ... so big that won't go though the fairly large
letter box.


Same here. I guess it's easier for them that way.


But surely there could be a 'small packet' that would contain most
basic 1 month prescription of tablets? I mean, they are already
individually contain within foil / blister packs, wrapped with paper
(instructions), in a strong postal spec bag ... they would be fine in
just the bag?

I wonder how much a years worth (of 5mg Amlodopine) would cost and how
much the system would save in admin and postal costs to send me a
years worth up front?

Cheers, T i m


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Default OT: Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?

On 04 Jun 2021 12:19:57 +0100 (BST), Theo
wrote:

T i m wrote:
Assuming I don't have the full login to the medical system (I think
I'm supposed to present my photo ID at my doctors to get 'signed up'
and as I don't have any I didn't take that any further ...) I may have
only been able to 'request' Boots online fulfil my prescription by
requesting authority from my doctor?


I believe the pharmacy only do what the GP tells them to do. So it's up to
the GP to push repeat prescriptions at them.


I got this from them:

"Unfortunately, we cannot complete your order at this time for one or
more of the following reasons:

* the GP has not approved your order:

o within 48 hours
o because a review of your medication may be required, or
o your prescription is not yet due"

So it looks like Boots may ping the Doctor for an 'ok' to dispatch but
that message really could outline the most extreme of conditions (from
'Give it another go' to 'you aren't getting anything till you have
jumped though all the hoops')?

It's down to the GP's system
as to how you request this - via an app, or stuffing a bit of paper in the
letter box, or whatever. The GP surgery have to approve the requests so
it's not 'push button for a year', at least IMX.


That seems to be what the reply above suggests and it may be that 1
year is up and a 'review' needed? Unfortunately that means phoning the
surgery, being on hold for 30+ mins to see if I can get a telephone
callback appointment for them to call me back to say yes you can carry
on having your tablets? ;-(

They may employ someone
who can do short-term repeats without having to defer to a doctor (eg if the
GP says 'review every 3 months' they can push the repeats for months 1 and
2 but month 3 needs the GP to confirm)


Ok. I believe I get a 'Your repeat order is due' email, if I spot it
in the spam (set as spam by Tradewinds or whoever handles VM emails).

It gets messy when you have eg prescription #1 which is renewed every 28
days and #2 every month, and they gradually get out of sync.


Understood, but this one has got to be about as simple as it gets.

So, can anyone confirm if I should be able to get at least say 1 years
worth of prescriptions delivered (monthly presumably) *without* having
to keep requesting them please?

Boots Online customer service seem worse than useless. ;-(


This is the problem. When it goes wrong (and it will) you want somebody you
can talk to who can sort it there and then and hand out the right thing,
rather than having to call-centre and then wait 3 days for the post - not
fun when you've run out of something important.


Quite. It has (and seemingly more 'of late') come to waiting for the
postman on the day I run out to get my fix. ;-(

p.s. And why the fcuk do they have to put the box of tablets, in a
plastic bag, in a box ... so big that won't go though the fairly large
letter box. And her Paracetamols must be dispatched by Amazon in boxes
big enough for a pair of shoes! ;-(


One of the online pharmacies (can't remember which) sends tablets like
paracetamol in letterbox sized packages, by dint of removing the tablets
from the box and putting the tablet foils and flattened box in a thinner
package. Truly thinking outside the box


;-)

I have wondered why that wasn't done more commonly (given many eBay
suppliers seem able to do it) but in the case of Boots Online (and
Amazon etc) they seem to go the other way? ;-(

Theo
(who is getting very fed up with the amount of cardboard Amazon generates
and having to take trips to the tip purely for that)


And there is that (more the waste of resources than any effort on my
part (our cardboard recycling collection is pretty good).

I have emailed Online CS re the packaging and get a template 'sorry'
(but no explanation about it being 'the rules' or any such) but
nothing actually changes.

If we could find out who it is breaks the packages down I'd make the
effort to give them a go (the fewer opportunities for the dog to
attack the postman the better etc). ;-)

Cheers, T i m
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Default OT: Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?

On Fri, 4 Jun 2021 13:05:54 +0100, Chris Green wrote:

T i m wrote:

Now, they have been sending them though monthly (just 1 box x 5mG
Amlodopine) but it seems I have to 'request' them monthly, not what I
thought I was going to have to do.

I think that's the way it works, I assume there are government/NHS
guidelines that say doctors can't prescribe for more than a month at a
time.


You may be right Chris (crazy though it seems (and especially
considering the cost (time / additional packaging) 'mail order') in
these circumstances). ;-(


Unfortunately their email-reminder ends up in my spam folder so unless
I check I can miss the reminder and run out.

Don't you notice you only have (say) a week's worth left? That's how
I get reminded - when there's only 7 pills left I get on-line and
order more.


I guess I could 'take closer notice' of that and sort of do yes ()so
haven't *actually* gone without yet). I think is that I thought
(believe I was told) that I could sign up to an online-pharmacy and
'just' be sent them every interval? After all, they have a pulldown
on the online site (that it seems to have to go to, every month)
asking when you would like the next reminder and I thought that would
be something I could do the once? Don't change it unless things change
sorta thing?


So, can anyone confirm if I should be able to get at least say 1 years
worth of prescriptions delivered (monthly presumably) *without* having
to keep requesting them please?

I think you're not going to get what you want!


Yes, from this and the other replies I think you may be right. ;-(

As I am back to doing the shopping and thinking of all the 'waste'
(postage costs and packaging) this online service seems to generate, I
might just go back to collecting it in person. ;-(

And there was me thinking it was 2021. ;-)

Cheers, T i m

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Default Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?

Yes Boots now charge to deliver, even to little old ladies as far as I can
see none of them seem to be any good at getting the repeats in in good time
local or postal. I have moved to a local independent pharmacy, who at least
you can talk t and get some sense.
Brian

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This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"T i m" wrote in message
...
A while back (start of Covid) I asked here about experiences re online
prescription deliveries and started using the Boots service because:

1) They were our local / normal pharmacist.

2) Someone suggested they used them and they had been fine.

I think I also remember someone saying they were hopeless and I think
I may now be leaning that way. ;-(

However, it may be down to expectation so I just wanted to check here.

Assuming I don't have the full login to the medical system (I think
I'm supposed to present my photo ID at my doctors to get 'signed up'
and as I don't have any I didn't take that any further ...) I may have
only been able to 'request' Boots online fulfil my prescription by
requesting authority from my doctor?

Now, they have been sending them though monthly (just 1 box x 5mG
Amlodopine) but it seems I have to 'request' them monthly, not what I
thought I was going to have to do.

Unfortunately their email-reminder ends up in my spam folder so unless
I check I can miss the reminder and run out.

So, can anyone confirm if I should be able to get at least say 1 years
worth of prescriptions delivered (monthly presumably) *without* having
to keep requesting them please?

Boots Online customer service seem worse than useless. ;-(

Cheers, T i m

p.s. And why the fcuk do they have to put the box of tablets, in a
plastic bag, in a box ... so big that won't go though the fairly large
letter box. And her Paracetamols must be dispatched by Amazon in boxes
big enough for a pair of shoes! ;-(



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Default Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?

On Fri, 4 Jun 2021 14:01:57 +0100, "Brian Gaff \(Sofa\)"
wrote:

Yes Boots now charge to deliver,


Do you mean 'from the local branch' or their / the central
distribution system?

even to little old ladies as far as I can
see


This big old man isn't being charged?

none of them seem to be any good at getting the repeats in in good time
local or postal.


To be fair, they have been good as far as that goes, as long as I have
jumped though the hoops I didn't think I would need to. Even when I've
missed their reminder text and left it to the last second, they have
got here with a couple of days?

I have moved to a local independent pharmacy, who at least
you can talk t and get some sense.


Well there is that and something I might go back to.

Cheers, T i m
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Default OT: Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?

On 04/06/2021 12:19, Theo wrote:
T i m wrote:
Assuming I don't have the full login to the medical system (I think
I'm supposed to present my photo ID at my doctors to get 'signed up'
and as I don't have any I didn't take that any further ...) I may have
only been able to 'request' Boots online fulfil my prescription by
requesting authority from my doctor?


I believe the pharmacy only do what the GP tells them to do.


Yes, but pharmacies can request repeat prescriptions for you, which the
GP can then issue back to them. Our local pharmacy not only does this,
but requests further repeats without us having to ask them and we just
drop in while visiting the shop next-door and see if there are any
prescriptions waiting for us (it's easier than trying to keep track, as
I have prescriptions supplied at two different times, my wife has
asthma, osteo-arthritis, rheumatoid-arthritis, high blood pressure and
tachycardia and has things arriving at all sorts of times!)

So it's up to
the GP to push repeat prescriptions at them. It's down to the GP's system
as to how you request this - via an app, or stuffing a bit of paper in the
letter box, or whatever. The GP surgery have to approve the requests so
it's not 'push button for a year', at least IMX. They may employ someone
who can do short-term repeats without having to defer to a doctor (eg if the
GP says 'review every 3 months' they can push the repeats for months 1 and
2 but month 3 needs the GP to confirm)


Just ask the pharmacist if they can arrange ongoing repeats for you - we
didn't even ask, we just popped in for something and found that meds
were waiting!

It gets messy when you have eg prescription #1 which is renewed every 28
days and #2 every month, and they gradually get out of sync.


Even more so when the 28 day supply consists of one or more foils, plus
a part foil - just make it a calendar month at a time, so prescriptions
are always due on the same date.

So, can anyone confirm if I should be able to get at least say 1 years
worth of prescriptions delivered (monthly presumably) *without* having
to keep requesting them please?

Boots Online customer service seem worse than useless. ;-(


This is the problem. When it goes wrong (and it will) you want somebody you
can talk to who can sort it there and then and hand out the right thing,
rather than having to call-centre and then wait 3 days for the post - not
fun when you've run out of something important.


Our local pharmacy is open 8:30 to 23:00, 7 days a week, so there is
always someone to talk to.

p.s. And why the fcuk do they have to put the box of tablets, in a
plastic bag, in a box ... so big that won't go though the fairly large
letter box. And her Paracetamols must be dispatched by Amazon in boxes
big enough for a pair of shoes! ;-(


One of the online pharmacies (can't remember which) sends tablets like
paracetamol in letterbox sized packages, by dint of removing the tablets
from the box and putting the tablet foils and flattened box in a thinner
package. Truly thinking outside the box


The local hospital supplies rheumatoid-arthritis related tablets, that
can only be prescribed by a consultant and issued by a hospital, in
child-proof containers that no RA sufferer can possible open!


Theo
(who is getting very fed up with the amount of cardboard Amazon generates
and having to take trips to the tip purely for that)


I have on occasion resorted to burning excess cardboard in the
incinerator that I bought for burning confidential work paperwork during
lockdown.


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Default OT: Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?

On Fri, 04 Jun 2021 13:21:28 +0100, T i m wrote:

On Fri, 4 Jun 2021 12:11:21 +0100, GB
wrote:

snip

So, can anyone confirm if I should be able to get at least say 1 years
worth of prescriptions delivered (monthly presumably) *without* having
to keep requesting them please?

Boots Online customer service seem worse than useless. ;-(


The online pharmacy service isn't really part of the main Boots online
presence, AFAICS. I think it's really more like a big pharmacy branch
that has some boxes to post stuff in.


;-)

They have their own phone number,
which is only manned a few hours a day, but which does get answered.


Ok, I might give that a try as the 'Computer says no' email is less
than helpful:

" Thank you for choosing the Boots Online Prescription Service.
Unfortunately, we cannot complete your order at this time for one or
more of the following reasons:

* the GP has not approved your order:

o within 48 hours
o because a review of your medication may be required, or
o your prescription is not yet due

Please contact the GP as soon as possible to discuss this order, so
that you can get the medication on time."

Except it's a PITA to contact my local GP and I really can't see why
(in 2021) they can't sort it all out between them?

eg, I have a regular (and single) prescription and until that changes
or I die, it just needs to carry on doesn't it? And it's not like it's
one of those 2000 a packet jobs? ;-(

I don't leave them to do the repeat prescriptions, but order stuff from
the GP myself when I need it,


My Mrs was a bit like that (for some reason I never bothered to ask)
keeping the repeat prescription at the local branch and then
submitting it some days before it was due?

and the GP's system has the correct Boots
branch on their records. No complaints.


Yes, that old 'manual' system seemed to work ok, just that it was
recommended we go 'keep away' during the main lockdown.

I suggest that you ring the Boots online pharmacy number and discuss the
issue with them.


I'll give it a go.

p.s. And why the fcuk do they have to put the box of tablets, in a
plastic bag, in a box ... so big that won't go though the fairly large
letter box.


Same here. I guess it's easier for them that way.


But surely there could be a 'small packet' that would contain most
basic 1 month prescription of tablets? I mean, they are already
individually contain within foil / blister packs, wrapped with paper
(instructions), in a strong postal spec bag ... they would be fine in
just the bag?

I wonder how much a years worth (of 5mg Amlodopine) would cost and how
much the system would save in admin and postal costs to send me a
years worth up front?

Cheers, T i m



Here in Somerset my surgery has two ways in which I can order online
and I suspect they are both available England wide (and maybe
nationwide).

The first I signed up to was "Patient Access"
(https://www.patientaccess.com/). The other is the NHS "App" - not the
NHS Covid App but the more generic one.

In both cases there is a registration process. I don't remember having
to visit my surgery for patientaccess and I definitely didn't have to
with NHS App.

However, both work on the basis that you have to manage your own life
by logging on and requesting medication. Once approved it goes to your
chosen, local, pharmacy. I'm quite happy with that arrangement and I
cannot remember whether the use of some form of postal delivery was an
option. Prior to Covid that worked rather well for me because I could
do things like order a week early if we were going away and the
reorder fell in the "away" period - I just added a note to explain.
These days I simply know that as the end of the month arrives it's
time to reorder.

Out of interest I looked at some of the online/postal services. They
ALL require you to register and they all require you to initiate an
order as far as I can see.

Having said they need you to manage your own life/orders I was
reminded that hereabouts my GP and local Boots have an automatic
reorder service but when my wife was using that she still had to
remember to go and get it.

My advice would be to phone your surgery (at a quiet time, not first
thing) and ask them what options they offer/suggest.
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Default OT: Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?

On 04/06/2021 13:05, Chris Green wrote:
T i m wrote:

Now, they have been sending them though monthly (just 1 box x 5mG
Amlodopine) but it seems I have to 'request' them monthly, not what I
thought I was going to have to do.

I think that's the way it works, I assume there are government/NHS
guidelines that say doctors can't prescribe for more than a month at a
time.


I got mine up to every 2 months some years ago, simply by telling the GP
that I was working away a lot and it was difficult for me to get there
to pick up the prescription.

They can go up to 3 months.

Unfortunately their email-reminder ends up in my spam folder so unless
I check I can miss the reminder and run out.

Don't you notice you only have (say) a week's worth left? That's how
I get reminded - when there's only 7 pills left I get on-line and
order more.


When you have numerous boxes of meds, its very easy to think that you
still have another box of a particular one.

So, can anyone confirm if I should be able to get at least say 1 years
worth of prescriptions delivered (monthly presumably) *without* having
to keep requesting them please?

I think you're not going to get what you want!


Of course he can, he just needs to speak to his local pharmacy and they
can arrange delivery and arrange a repeat prescription request to the GP
each month. That's exactly what we do with our meds.
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Tim Streater wrote:
On 04 Jun 2021 at 12:19:57 BST, Theo
wrote:

Theo
(who is getting very fed up with the amount of cardboard Amazon generates
and having to take trips to the tip purely for that)


Doesn't it go out with your normal recycling?


The recycling wheelie bin is already full with other things. Amazon sending
multiple-cubic-feet boxes of scrunched up brown paper (which can't be trivially
compressed) means they rapidly fill any remain space in the bin (which being
tall and narrow isn't really designed for cardboard and so lots of space is
wasted).

The LA will take extra cardboard adjacent to the bin if roughly the same
shape and tied together, but won't take wet cardboard. So no good if it
might rain overnight, nor if windy. And storing it for two weeks is a
problem (can't store outside as it'll get rained on).

Theo
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In article ,
T i m wrote:
So, can anyone confirm if I should be able to get at least say 1 years
worth of prescriptions delivered (monthly presumably) *without* having
to keep requesting them please?


My GP told me the maximum she can prescribe (for my blood pressure
tablets) is a two month's supply.

Could be to do with shelf life. And to prevent waste. If someone stops
needing the prescription [if only by dying ;-) ] or it has to be changed.

I registered with EMIS patient access - the one promoted at my surgery.
Don't remember it being a problem to register, and I can order repeat
prescriptions easily online. Never bothered having them delivered - I just
collect from my local nominated chemist.

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T i m wrote:
Yes, from this and the other replies I think you may be right. ;-(

As I am back to doing the shopping and thinking of all the 'waste'
(postage costs and packaging) this online service seems to generate, I
might just go back to collecting it in person. ;-(


We used to be with a dispensing practice, where the pharmacy was physically
part of the GP surgery (no actual pharmacy shops for miles around). The
pharmacist would do double duty as the GP receptionist when short staffed.
The GP would prescribe something, and the pharmacist would have it ready by
the time you'd walked the length of the corridor to the front desk

The current one is a separate shop in the same building. I note the number
for the prescribing person at the GP practice is at the top of the
pharmacists' whiteboard, so the link is still fairly close.

In both cases they would still mess it up, often by the GP actioning the
wrong repeats or something. But at least they were local to sort it out.

And there was me thinking it was 2021. ;-)


I think 'local' beats 'distant global megacorp' here

Theo


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On 04 Jun 2021 14:41:54 +0100 (BST), Theo
wrote:

snip

The recycling wheelie bin is already full with other things. Amazon sending
multiple-cubic-feet boxes of scrunched up brown paper (which can't be trivially
compressed)


I un scrunch it and take it back to sheets that then seem to disappear
in with the ordinary cardboard / paper?

means they rapidly fill any remain space in the bin (which being
tall and narrow isn't really designed for cardboard and so lots of space is
wasted).


It might hold more if torn into squares the area of the section? Might
be quicker than the alternatives?

The LA will take extra cardboard adjacent to the bin if roughly the same
shape and tied together, but won't take wet cardboard. So no good if it
might rain overnight, nor if windy. And storing it for two weeks is a
problem (can't store outside as it'll get rained on).


You must be getting quite a few large deliveries then?

We get a few and initially they (the smaller ones) are de-taped and
labeled, flatpacked and put into a 'Bag for life' indoors with any
paper or cereal boxes etc. Once full it gets put in the recycling bin
outside.

Cheers, T i m

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On Fri, 04 Jun 2021 13:05:54 +0100, Chris Green wrote:

I think that's the way it works, I assume there are government/NHS
guidelines that say doctors can't prescribe for more than a month at a
time.


I think 'it depends'. On, for example, how stable the patient's needs
are, and whether they can be trusted not to overdose, etc.

For as long as I can remember, I've got 3 months at a time. As it
happens, that includes amlodipine.

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On Fri, 04 Jun 2021 14:41:54 +0100, Theo wrote:

The recycling wheelie bin is already full with other things. Amazon
sending multiple-cubic-feet boxes of scrunched up brown paper (which
can't be trivially compressed) means they rapidly fill any remain space
in the bin (which being tall and narrow isn't really designed for
cardboard and so lots of space is wasted).


I keep a Stanley knife nearby, and spend a minute or two slicing the
boxes into conveniently-sized rectangles that fill the bin efficiently.
But I agree about the scrunched-up paper.

We give all the bubble wrap to a friend who is an artist in glass.



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On 04/06/2021 11:55, T i m wrote:
A while back (start of Covid) I asked here about experiences re online
prescription deliveries and started using the Boots service because:

1) They were our local / normal pharmacist.

2) Someone suggested they used them and they had been fine.

I think I also remember someone saying they were hopeless and I think
I may now be leaning that way. ;-(

However, it may be down to expectation so I just wanted to check here.

Assuming I don't have the full login to the medical system (I think
I'm supposed to present my photo ID at my doctors to get 'signed up'
and as I don't have any I didn't take that any further ...) I may have
only been able to 'request' Boots online fulfil my prescription by
requesting authority from my doctor?

Now, they have been sending them though monthly (just 1 box x 5mG
Amlodopine) but it seems I have to 'request' them monthly, not what I
thought I was going to have to do.

Unfortunately their email-reminder ends up in my spam folder so unless
I check I can miss the reminder and run out.

So, can anyone confirm if I should be able to get at least say 1 years
worth of prescriptions delivered (monthly presumably) *without* having
to keep requesting them please?

Boots Online customer service seem worse than useless. ;-(

Cheers, T i m

p.s. And why the fcuk do they have to put the box of tablets, in a
plastic bag, in a box ... so big that won't go though the fairly large
letter box. And her Paracetamols must be dispatched by Amazon in boxes
big enough for a pair of shoes! ;-(


I use Pharmacy2U. The box of tablets comes through the letter box. I get
the correct tablets but often a different brand. There was a recent
change about the way the surgery issued the prescriptions.
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On Friday, 4 June 2021 at 11:55:20 UTC+1, T i m wrote:
A while back (start of Covid) I asked here about experiences re online
prescription deliveries and started using the Boots service because:

1) They were our local / normal pharmacist.

2) Someone suggested they used them and they had been fine.

I think I also remember someone saying they were hopeless and I think
I may now be leaning that way. ;-(

However, it may be down to expectation so I just wanted to check here.

Assuming I don't have the full login to the medical system (I think
I'm supposed to present my photo ID at my doctors to get 'signed up'
and as I don't have any I didn't take that any further ...) I may have
only been able to 'request' Boots online fulfil my prescription by
requesting authority from my doctor?

Now, they have been sending them though monthly (just 1 box x 5mG
Amlodopine) but it seems I have to 'request' them monthly, not what I
thought I was going to have to do.

Unfortunately their email-reminder ends up in my spam folder so unless
I check I can miss the reminder and run out.

So, can anyone confirm if I should be able to get at least say 1 years
worth of prescriptions delivered (monthly presumably) *without* having
to keep requesting them please?

Boots Online customer service seem worse than useless. ;-(

Cheers, T i m

p.s. And why the fcuk do they have to put the box of tablets, in a
plastic bag, in a box ... so big that won't go though the fairly large
letter box. And her Paracetamols must be dispatched by Amazon in boxes
big enough for a pair of shoes! ;-(


I go to my local pharmacy and pick up the medicine I get on repeat. A significant part of my choice to do that is to ensure that we continue to have local pharmacies.

Another part is that I always check the dispensed medicine before leaving the counter. Thus, if there are any issues, I can at least start to get them resolved there and then. Issues like switching makes, and expiry dates.


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"Theo" wrote in message
...
T i m wrote:
Assuming I don't have the full login to the medical system (I think
I'm supposed to present my photo ID at my doctors to get 'signed up'
and as I don't have any I didn't take that any further ...) I may have
only been able to 'request' Boots online fulfil my prescription by
requesting authority from my doctor?


I believe the pharmacy only do what the GP tells them to do. So it's up
to
the GP to push repeat prescriptions at them. It's down to the GP's system
as to how you request this - via an app, or stuffing a bit of paper in the
letter box, or whatever. The GP surgery have to approve the requests so
it's not 'push button for a year', at least IMX. They may employ someone
who can do short-term repeats without having to defer to a doctor (eg if
the
GP says 'review every 3 months' they can push the repeats for months 1 and
2 but month 3 needs the GP to confirm)


It's right that each individual script has to be confirmed by the GP, and
that in the vast majority of cases the script will be for 1 or at most 2
months

But even in the old days, before we had electronic scripts and postal
delivery, your chosen pharmacy would manage the repeat process for you by
keeping the "tick box" from from the previous script and walking it to the
surgery for authorisation (collecting it 2 or 3 days later), ready for you
to pick up the meds by simply visiting the pharmacy (rinse an repeat each
month).

I see no reason why the pharmacy can't push the electronic repeat request to
the GP and wait for the electronic reply each month so that they can send
out your meds monthly. And my pharmacist does make remote requests for me
when I ask for a repeat of something that he has supplied to me before that
isn't on my electronic repeat list saving me a trip to the doctor to get
this.

As to 3 month reviews, most repeat meds are for rest of life conditions and
you will be lucky to get 24 month reviews unless you make an effort to
request them. Many's the time that a patient will have become unresponsive
to a medication without anybody noticing. BTDTGTTS


It gets messy when you have eg prescription #1 which is renewed every 28
days and #2 every month, and they gradually get out of sync.


My GP has a box to fill in to ask them to synchronise your medications

So, can anyone confirm if I should be able to get at least say 1 years
worth of prescriptions delivered (monthly presumably) *without* having
to keep requesting them please?

Boots Online customer service seem worse than useless. ;-(


This is the problem. When it goes wrong (and it will) you want somebody
you
can talk to who can sort it there and then and hand out the right thing,
rather than having to call-centre and then wait 3 days for the post - not
fun when you've run out of something important.


I always like to make sure that what's in my cupboard and when my next
script is due are out of sync, so that I always have 3-4 weeks float.

Takes a few months to get there, but it is possible

p.s. And why the fcuk do they have to put the box of tablets, in a
plastic bag, in a box ... so big that won't go though the fairly large
letter box. And her Paracetamols must be dispatched by Amazon in boxes
big enough for a pair of shoes! ;-(


One of the online pharmacies (can't remember which) sends tablets like
paracetamol in letterbox sized packages, by dint of removing the tablets
from the box and putting the tablet foils and flattened box in a thinner
package. Truly thinking outside the box


given the new requirement to send out meds in "original" sealed packets, I
wonder if that's now allowed




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"T i m" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 4 Jun 2021 14:01:57 +0100, "Brian Gaff \(Sofa\)"
wrote:

Yes Boots now charge to deliver,


Do you mean 'from the local branch' or their / the central
distribution system?


he means hand delivery from the local branch (a service that they used to
offer free to qualifying customers). Not sticking it in a package for Royal
Mail to deliver, which anybody can now get free (from other Pharmacists if
Boots don't do it)



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On Fri, 4 Jun 2021 15:50:14 +0100, Michael Chare
wrote:

snip

p.s. And why the fcuk do they have to put the box of tablets, in a
plastic bag, in a box ... so big that won't go though the fairly large
letter box. And her Paracetamols must be dispatched by Amazon in boxes
big enough for a pair of shoes! ;-(


I use Pharmacy2U.


Ok, thanks.

The box of tablets comes through the letter box.


Cool.

I get
the correct tablets but often a different brand.


I don't think I care about the brand.

There was a recent
change about the way the surgery issued the prescriptions.


Ah, I wonder if that has caused my latest hiccup (if it's a national
thing)?

Cheers, T i m
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On 4 Jun 2021 14:41:59 GMT, Bob Eager wrote:

On Fri, 04 Jun 2021 13:05:54 +0100, Chris Green wrote:

I think that's the way it works, I assume there are government/NHS
guidelines that say doctors can't prescribe for more than a month at a
time.


I think 'it depends'. On, for example, how stable the patient's needs
are,


In this case it's just the same 5mg Amlodopine all the time (for ever
presumably)?

and whether they can be trusted not to overdose, etc.


Can you on Amlodopine? ;-)

For as long as I can remember, I've got 3 months at a time. As it
happens, that includes amlodipine.


Well that would be better as at least it would justify the packaging
'Pass the parcel' from Boots. ;-)

I get these things might have a shelf life and we might not last a
whole year at a time but for something as mundane as a low dose blood
pressure tablet I would have thought 3 month batches would be the
minimum they would do?

Cheers, T i m

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On 04/06/2021 13:21, T i m wrote:

I wonder how much a years worth (of 5mg Amlodopine) would cost and how
much the system would save in admin and postal costs to send me a
years worth up front?


https://bnf.nice.org.uk/medicinal-forms/amlodipine.html

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On 4 Jun 2021 17:57:11 GMT, Tim Streater
wrote:

snip

The scrunched up brown paper is a pain here too.


The two types of recyclable dunnage I see most are what looks like
partly shredded cardboard (that looks like a grass skirt) or lengths
of brown paper that is dispensed and formed slightly though a nozzle
to give it bulk to pad out lighter things in bigger boxes.

The latter is fairly trivial to open back out into a flat sheet and
then fold / roll up like any other flat / plain paper and then takes
up little room in the recycling (and partly why I believe they use
it).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2juZGznfck

Cheers, T i m
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On 4 Jun 2021 at 14:41:54 BST, "Theo"
wrote:

Tim Streater wrote:
On 04 Jun 2021 at 12:19:57 BST, Theo
wrote:

Theo
(who is getting very fed up with the amount of cardboard Amazon generates
and having to take trips to the tip purely for that)


Doesn't it go out with your normal recycling?


The recycling wheelie bin is already full with other things. Amazon sending
multiple-cubic-feet boxes of scrunched up brown paper (which can't be
trivially
compressed) means they rapidly fill any remain space in the bin (which being
tall and narrow isn't really designed for cardboard and so lots of space is
wasted).


An only moderately obsessive person can stretch, flatten and refold the
scrunched paper fairly quickly and end up with a tenth of the volume.




The LA will take extra cardboard adjacent to the bin if roughly the same
shape and tied together, but won't take wet cardboard. So no good if it
might rain overnight, nor if windy. And storing it for two weeks is a
problem (can't store outside as it'll get rained on).

Theo



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My local pharmacy has a man who drives round the local area
delivering prescriptions.

I can phone them up and they are always very helpful.

Usually I get 4 weeks worth at a time. The manufacturer of the generic
medication varies each time. One time there were 30 or so doses in a
box: it had been opened and the blister pack cut so that I only got the
usual 28. I can only assume that after a while someone is going to get a
box full of offcuts.

--
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On 4 Jun 2021 18:51:38 GMT, Roger Hayter wrote:

snip

An only moderately obsessive person can stretch, flatten and refold the
scrunched paper fairly quickly and end up with a tenth of the volume.

Far from it (assuming reasonable mobility / dexterity) and it's
certainly quicker, easier and less polluting than driving it, still
scrunched up to the recycling centre (and where it will still take up
more space than necessary).

It's no more 'obsessive' than de-plastic-taping a cardboard box (so as
not to contaminate and so reduce the recycling value), removing any
address labels (plastic / identity protection), rinsing out food
containers or crushing cans?

Cheers, T i m

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On Fri, 04 Jun 2021 14:48:59 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
T i m wrote:
So, can anyone confirm if I should be able to get at least say 1 years
worth of prescriptions delivered (monthly presumably) *without* having
to keep requesting them please?


My GP told me the maximum she can prescribe (for my blood pressure
tablets) is a two month's supply.


Ok, well at least that halves the number of transactions required to
get them.

Could be to do with shelf life.


Not in this case I don't think. On my latest pack of Amlodopine it
says 07/2023.

And to prevent waste. If someone stops
needing the prescription [if only by dying ;-) ] or it has to be changed.


Well, there is that but I think there is currently more 'waste' in the
postal delivery method than (worst case) a years worth of unused
tablets (assuming Amlodopine are cheap to produce etc).

I registered with EMIS patient access - the one promoted at my surgery.
Don't remember it being a problem to register,


Ah, but you may have been able to provide a photo ID? (And I really
didn't want to visit the practice at the beginning of the lockdown).

"To register for our online services you will need to visit the
practice, bringing with you two forms of identification. One of these
items should include your photograph e.g. Passport or Driving Licence.
The other should be recent and show your current address."

The strange thing is that I have been going there as long as the
surgery has been there (so at least 40 years) and they accept my face
and details as me when I go in there in normal circumstances?

and I can order repeat
prescriptions easily online.


Yeah, it looks like a handy feature (mostly for the other stuff as I
have the EPS covered).

https://digital.nhs.uk/services/elec...#about-phase-4

Never bothered having them delivered - I just
collect from my local nominated chemist.


I've re-submitted my delivery order to see what happens. I thought I
was reacting to their 'Time to re-request your prescription emails so
it will be interesting to see what happens if it get's cancelled
again.

Cheers, T i m


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On Fri, 4 Jun 2021 07:57:27 -0700 (PDT), polygonum_on_google
wrote:

snip

I go to my local pharmacy and pick up the medicine I get on repeat.


As we did prior Covid and can't say we generally had any major issues.
There was the odd time where the pharmacy was closed for lunch so if
we weren't also shopping nearby we would walk home and go again
another day or the odd 'not sure where it is did you put the
prescription in' type thing but that was generally resolved pretty
quickly. Not sure if the tin of chocolates we generally give them at
xmyth helps but ... ;-)

A significant part of my choice to do that is to ensure that we continue to have local pharmacies.


Do you think they could survive dispensing 'free' medicines alone? I
ask because we rarely *buy* anything from them, even though they sell
a fair range of products (it's a reasonably big branch).

We probably have 5 pharmacies within a 1 minute walk between them so
if any one went the others would pick up the slack.

If all but one went the chances are the remaining one would be
unlikely to go. ;-)

Another part is that I always check the dispensed medicine before leaving the counter.


Ah, I rarely do (my prescription is very simple and not immediately
life threatening (low dose blood pressure tablets) but the Mrs might
check if she's added some of the 'extra' stuff she needs now and
again.

Thus, if there are any issues, I can at least start to get them resolved there and then.


Makes sense.

Issues like switching makes, and expiry dates.


That must make things more complicated (having to check for such
stuff). I / we never have AFAIR. The right chemical formulation / drug
yes, not the other things (because they probably aren't time limited
*anyway*)?

Cheers, T i m



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On Fri, 04 Jun 2021 20:08:10 +0100, (Alan J. Wylie)
wrote:


My local pharmacy has a man who drives round the local area
delivering prescriptions.


I think I have seen such round here but not sure if it's only for
special customers and if it's a volunteer type service?

I can phone them up and they are always very helpful.


It's nearly as quick to walk to ours. ;-)

Usually I get 4 weeks worth at a time.


Same here but time seems to fly and given they seem to have a long
shelf life and are likely less cost for one years worth than some meds
are for one dose ... ?

The manufacturer of the generic
medication varies each time.


Unless the box looks different when I might check it's the right
stuff, I don't generally check. She might though.

One time there were 30 or so doses in a
box: it had been opened and the blister pack cut so that I only got the
usual 28. I can only assume that after a while someone is going to get a
box full of offcuts.


LOL!

Again, given many 'routine' "You probably don't need these but they
can offer other protection / benefits so you might as well keep taking
them' things are probably pretty cheap ... and given there are often
more than 28 days in a month ...(if you are given 'a months worth')
and given you sometimes drop / lose them, a few spares wouldn't go
amiss and again, when taken for non 'life critical' situations, much
less administrative load on the doctors / chemists if they gave say 3
months worth (minimum)?

I mean there could be a list of cheap, long shelf life (where they
would all still be in date by the time you got round to taking them),
drugs that could be dispensed to people who weren't predicted to not
last the year in bigger batches to save money and time. It could be
that even 2 'human interactions' re prescribing and dispensing a
tablet cost more than a whole years worth of tablets?

And they could even make a box of tablets that contained a years
worth, rather than having to have 12 packets etc?

I would be the one who got the years worth of 'offcuts' though (and
wouldn't care). ;-)

Cheers, T i m



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On 04/06/2021 10:55, T i m wrote:

A while back (start of Covid) I asked here about experiences re online
prescription deliveries and started using the Boots service because:


1) They were our local / normal pharmacist.
2) Someone suggested they used them and they had been fine.


Assuming I don't have the full login to the medical system I may have
only been able to 'request' Boots online fulfil my prescription by
requesting authority from my doctor but it seems I have to 'request'
them monthly, not what I thought I was going to have to do.


However did you get that impression?

You, or someone acting on your behalf such as a friend or relative, or
an organisation, has to request the GP to issue a prescription. This can
be automated, but the sanctioning of the request has to be carried out
by the person responsible for your medical care. They in turn are
governed by regulations regarding these matters.

Unfortunately their email-reminder ends up in my spam folder so unless
I check I can miss the reminder and run out.


That's sheer carelessness on your behalf. Adding their email address to
your Address Book is so trivial a matter.

So, can anyone confirm if I should be able to get at least say 1 years
worth of prescriptions delivered (monthly presumably) *without* having
to keep requesting them please?


Yes. I can confirm that the system the GP works under doesn't allow that.

Boots Online customer service seem worse than useless. ;-(


Boots Online seem to work well for many,

p.s. And why the fcuk do they have to put the box of tablets, in a
plastic bag, in a box ... so big that won't go though the fairly large
letter box. And her Paracetamols must be dispatched by Amazon in boxes
big enough for a pair of shoes! ;-(


For someone who has automated his home for no particular reason or
benefit other that it was technically possible but not necessarily a
good idea, you seem to have very little idea about something that
affects your possibility of your ceasing to exist (with consequent
benefit to pollution and GWGHGs). I put your post down to a 'look at me
me me' attitude rather than a genuine plea for help.


--
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In article ,
T i m wrote:
I've re-submitted my delivery order to see what happens. I thought I
was reacting to their 'Time to re-request your prescription emails so
it will be interesting to see what happens if it get's cancelled
again.


Before using the web service, I could just phone my surgery for a repeat
prescription (but of course phones can be busy) or email them. And they
sent the prescription (electronically, I'd guess) to the chemist of my
choice. Which they kept on file as my preferred one.

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Default OT: Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?



"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
T i m wrote:
I've re-submitted my delivery order to see what happens. I thought I
was reacting to their 'Time to re-request your prescription emails so
it will be interesting to see what happens if it get's cancelled
again.


Before using the web service,


before using what web service?

an online delivery company?

I could just phone my surgery for a repeat
prescription (but of course phones can be busy) or email them. And they
sent the prescription (electronically, I'd guess) to the chemist of my
choice. Which they kept on file as my preferred one.


which is as it still is.

the online delivery company are now your preferred chemist





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Default OT: Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?

On Sat, 05 Jun 2021 16:13:54 +0100, tim... wrote:



"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
T i m wrote:
I've re-submitted my delivery order to see what happens. I thought I
was reacting to their 'Time to re-request your prescription emails so
it will be interesting to see what happens if it get's cancelled
again.


Before using the web service,


before using what web service?

an online delivery company?


He mentioned EMIS - a web interface used by a lot of GPs. It's part of an
integrated IT system for general practice. It allows you to book
appointments, get prescriptions, etc. I use mine quite a bit.

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Default OT: Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?

On Saturday, 5 June 2021 at 12:34:04 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Before using the web service, I could just phone my surgery for a repeat
prescription (but of course phones can be busy) or email them. And they
sent the prescription (electronically, I'd guess) to the chemist of my
choice. Which they kept on file as my preferred one.

That guess might be true, but might not. The four National Health Services across the four nations have different ways of handling these things. Some still handle physical paper prescriptions.
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Default OT: Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?

In article ,
polygonum_on_google wrote:
On Saturday, 5 June 2021 at 12:34:04 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:


Before using the web service, I could just phone my surgery for a
repeat prescription (but of course phones can be busy) or email them.
And they sent the prescription (electronically, I'd guess) to the
chemist of my choice. Which they kept on file as my preferred one.

That guess might be true, but might not. The four National Health
Services across the four nations have different ways of handling these
things. Some still handle physical paper prescriptions.


Do you mean if you need a repeat prescription, you have to go to your
surgery to pick it up, as once was the case? Which of the four still need
that?

If only paper, a repeat would have to be posted to the chemist of your
choice. With more cost and delay.

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Default OT: Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?

In article ,
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
polygonum_on_google wrote:
On Saturday, 5 June 2021 at 12:34:04 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:


Before using the web service, I could just phone my surgery for a
repeat prescription (but of course phones can be busy) or email them.
And they sent the prescription (electronically, I'd guess) to the
chemist of my choice. Which they kept on file as my preferred one.

That guess might be true, but might not. The four National Health
Services across the four nations have different ways of handling these
things. Some still handle physical paper prescriptions.


Do you mean if you need a repeat prescription, you have to go to your
surgery to pick it up, as once was the case? Which of the four still need
that?


If only paper, a repeat would have to be posted to the chemist of your
choice. With more cost and delay.


it depends. The chemist in our village has been unable to dispence
prescription since the pharmacist has left. Repeat prescriptions have been
buildingb up. SWMO had to call at the medical centre to get a paper
prescription to take to the next village.

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Default OT: Online prescriptions. Better than Boots?

On Fri, 4 Jun 2021 18:33:48 +0100, Jeff Layman
wrote:

On 04/06/2021 13:21, T i m wrote:

I wonder how much a years worth (of 5mg Amlodopine) would cost and how
much the system would save in admin and postal costs to send me a
years worth up front?


https://bnf.nice.org.uk/medicinal-forms/amlodipine.html


Thanks for that Jeff, interesting.

So mine are "Amlodipine 5mg tablets (Almus Pharmaceuticals Ltd)" and
if I read that right, cost 1GBP/box of 28?

So I reckon if you take into account the time of the doctors signing
such a thing off every month, plus the pharmacist checking them though
and taking the time to book them out to me (checking my details etc)
and the cost of 12 small boxes and instructions versus one yearly one,
I'd say all that's likely to cost way more than 12 quid a year?

If I carry on with the (free) postal service it would be even worse
(as you still need all the above plus all the extra packaging and
postal costs)?

I get that they might not be so keen to supply the Mrs with a years
worth of Paracetamols but we could probably go out for day and buy a
years worth if we wanted in any case?

100 x Paracetamol 500mg caplets (Crescent Pharma Ltd):

NHS indicative price, 4.50
Drug tariff price, 3.06
?

If she takes 4 a day (average) a box would last 25 days (it generally
lasts longer).

Cheers, T i m
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