On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 22:06:33 -0700, Tony Hwang wrote:

Leave that door open for now and tape down the switch. You may have a
intermittent ignitor.

I've been playing with it for a while, and, can't seem to fully reproduce
my success. I'm going to hit the sack and attack it again in the daylight.

Seems to me all those *timers* are making a clean starting point difficult,
particularly the thing called a "lockout timer"...
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5518/1...27d0a8ef_o.gif

I'm starting to wonder if it's a bad thing that the wife loves to turn the
thermostat off and on constantly all day, as if *she* is the automatic
control!

On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 22:14:03 -0600, The Daring Dufas wrote:

Yep, that's a limit but look to see if there's a little push button
reset between the 1/4" Faston terminals where the wires plug on to the
switch. Some of them have a manual reset that will click when it is
pushed in to reset it. ^_^

I found this picture on the net of the little red push button:
http://www.justanswer.com/uploads/Ou...nual_reset.jpg

So now that I know what to look for, I can see that same button
in my limit switch, only mine is black:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7371/1...90f0e3a7_o.gif

Now the only safety switch I haven't found is the VSSS Vent safety
shutoff switch.

On 12/10/2013 7:38 PM, Daring Dufas : A Sock Of Killer Loon wrote:
... is the furnace even on?


Killer Loon, living proof that human females should never have sex with
farm animals. ^_^

TDD

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 05:27:17 +0000, Danny D'Amico wrote:

Now the only safety switch I haven't found is the VSSS Vent safety
shutoff switch.

After googling for a while, I think the reason I can't see the VSSS
is because it's *inside* the plenum!

I think it's attached to the brown board, like this from the net:
http://www.justanswer.com/uploads/Ou...high_limit.jpg

So, the VSSS would then be on the other side of *this* brown board:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7323/1...56224304_o.gif

Is that correct?

On 12/10/2013 11:27 PM, Danny D'Amico wrote:
On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 22:14:03 -0600, The Daring Dufas wrote:

Yep, that's a limit but look to see if there's a little push button
reset between the 1/4" Faston terminals where the wires plug on to the
switch. Some of them have a manual reset that will click when it is
pushed in to reset it. ^_^

I found this picture on the net of the little red push button:
http://www.justanswer.com/uploads/Ou...nual_reset.jpg

So now that I know what to look for, I can see that same button
in my limit switch, only mine is black:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7371/1...90f0e3a7_o.gif

Now the only safety switch I haven't found is the VSSS Vent safety
shutoff switch.


When that trips, it's in series with all the other safeties and will cut
the 24vac control voltage to the furnace. If it isn't an automatic
reset, you have to find the little buttons and push them in to reset
the control circuit. Like a circuit breaker, it tripped for a reason
so you need to investigate the cause. This is where experience comes
into play. Perhaps a friendly service tech will show you what's wrong
and answer questions about it. I had a little old lady crawl under her
house with me so I could show her what was wrong with her furnace and
what needed to be done to repair it. ^_^

TDD

On 12/10/2013 11:32 PM, Danny D'Amico wrote:
On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 05:27:17 +0000, Danny D'Amico wrote:

Now the only safety switch I haven't found is the VSSS Vent safety
shutoff switch.

After googling for a while, I think the reason I can't see the VSSS
is because it's *inside* the plenum!

I think it's attached to the brown board, like this from the net:
http://www.justanswer.com/uploads/Ou...high_limit.jpg

So, the VSSS would then be on the other side of *this* brown board:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7323/1...56224304_o.gif

Is that correct?


The small cylindrical thing with a red tip on one of the wires is a "one
shot" thermal fuse and if temps get too high it will pop. It's in series
with all the other safeties and will kill the control voltage. ^_^

TDD

"mike" wrote in message ...

The electrical code in the US demands that the furnace have
a permanent connection to the power source...no plugs allowed.
But when I asked the electrical inspector if I could put a plug
on it so I could run it from a generator, he said, "no problem".
The electrical code is very strict...except when it isn't.

Now, but when the unit was installed? I know of two units that are
operated that way.

I am not saying that it is right, just that is how they were installed.

Danny D'Amico wrote:
On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 22:06:33 -0700, Tony Hwang wrote:

Leave that door open for now and tape down the switch. You may have a
intermittent ignitor.

I've been playing with it for a while, and, can't seem to fully reproduce
my success. I'm going to hit the sack and attack it again in the daylight.

Seems to me all those *timers* are making a clean starting point difficult,
particularly the thing called a "lockout timer"...
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5518/1...27d0a8ef_o.gif

I'm starting to wonder if it's a bad thing that the wife loves to turn the
thermostat off and on constantly all day, as if *she* is the automatic
control!

That 'stat is old work horse using wet mercury bulb switch. It is
tilting up/down by temp. sensitive bimetal coil. Just leave it at about
75 deg during trouble shooting(to make it call for heat) Leave it alone
and adjust it when problem is fixed.

Don't worry about lock up timer it only starts when safety issue arises
like over heating triggering over heat limit sensor. This is
kind of thermostat for fixed temp sensing. There are few in there for
different functions/purposes. If you want to reset the lock out timer
just power cycle the furnace,(resetting control board) Hope it is not
cold there. It is -18C up here tonight.

You in Silicon valley? In San Jose area? There I have a good friend of
mine who runs company called K.Y. systems. His back is EE like me.
He may may not help you if you call him and mention my name,
Tony(VE6CGX). His name is Young Kim. He goes out of country often on
business.

Danny D'Amico wrote:
On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 22:14:03 -0600, The Daring Dufas wrote:

Yep, that's a limit but look to see if there's a little push button
reset between the 1/4" Faston terminals where the wires plug on to the
switch. Some of them have a manual reset that will click when it is
pushed in to reset it. ^_^

I found this picture on the net of the little red push button:
http://www.justanswer.com/uploads/Ou...nual_reset.jpg

So now that I know what to look for, I can see that same button
in my limit switch, only mine is black:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7371/1...90f0e3a7_o.gif

Now the only safety switch I haven't found is the VSSS Vent safety
shutoff switch.

Hi,
That is located inside the flue. You took a pic. of it. Sqare bakelite
lo0king thing with two wires mounted on the flue. The sensor is inserted
into flue to detect vent gas temp. This is one of couple safety thing
when triggered furnace will shut down pronto and lockout timer starts.
You can't see the lockout timer counting pulse w/o 'scope.

On 12/10/2013 11:18 PM, Danny D'Amico wrote:

I accidentally hit the door switch while I was trying to measure voltages,
so the whole thing shut down - and I couldn't reproduce the success - but -
I'll try again tomorrow when I have more light to work with (and it will
be warmer besides, as it's going to be at freezing tonight).


How are you heating, now, with the furnace broken?

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On 12/10/2013 11:24 PM, Danny D'Amico wrote:
On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 23:02:31 -0500, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Oh, heck. The most expensive appliance in your
house, and you're crossing wires cause "someone"
said?

I haven't actually "jumped" any wires yet, mainly for that reason
(that I don't know what I'm doing yet).

I *did* read the entire PDF sent to me by the Carrier company,
which explained how the system works by connecting "red" 24VAC
power to Red to "call for heating".

It was interesting that the fan (green wire) is actually controlled
by the furnace fan-control PCB board. Apparently the green on the
thermostat merely sets whether the fan is always on or whether it's
controlled by the furnace PCB board.

And, it was interesting that the fan speed is typically set to low
for heating and to high for air conditioning.

I also learned the size of my system is "036065", which means it's
80,000 BTU/hour for heating and 1220CFM for cooling.

Is that a pretty normal home heating and cooling system?


Normal is based on the size of the house, climate,
windows, insullation, occupancy, how often the
doors are opened, trees, sunshine, price of fuel,
and a couple other things. Normal isn't the same
for everyone.

Yep, connect red to red, to call for heating.
Sigh. (shakes head)

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On 12/11/2013 12:07 AM, Danny D'Amico wrote:

This is very interesting.

My wife constantly turns the thermostat off and back on.

Should we be more, shall I say, "graceful" about adjusting the thermostat?h


Replace wife. Problem solved.

Get the brand new, high efficiency wife. Works in the
cold, uses 30% less power, leaves toilet seat up, never
runs out of milk or sugar, and is EPA compliant for
ozone emissions.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 08:03:44 -0500, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Yep, connect red to red, to call for heating.
Sigh. (shakes head)

Mea culpa.
That was (just) a typo.
I had corrected it a few minutes after I had posted (but you responded
to the original).
Sorry. That was my mistake.

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 08:00:17 -0500, Stormin Mormon wrote:

How are you heating, now, with the furnace broken?

California weather is so moderate that you can live the entire year
sans hear or air conditioning ...

It's only around 32 degrees for a very short while, just a few hours
in the early morning; and then it's back up to 50 or 60 during the day.

We don't even drain the garden hoses ...

On 12/11/2013 10:13 AM, Danny D'Amico wrote:
On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 08:03:44 -0500, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Yep, connect red to red, to call for heating.
Sigh. (shakes head)

Mea culpa.
That was (just) a typo.
I had corrected it a few minutes after I had posted (but you responded
to the original).
Sorry. That was my mistake.

Very well, my son. Please recite ten Book of
Mormons, twenty Angel Moronis, and go and sin
no more.

Hope you get your heat running, safely, soon.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On 12/11/2013 10:15 AM, Danny D'Amico wrote:
On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 08:00:17 -0500, Stormin Mormon wrote:

How are you heating, now, with the furnace broken?

California weather is so moderate that you can live the entire year
sans hear or air conditioning ...

It's only around 32 degrees for a very short while, just a few hours
in the early morning; and then it's back up to 50 or 60 during the day.

We don't even drain the garden hoses ...

I'd live there. Except for the politics.


--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Wednesday, December 11, 2013 12:26:46 PM UTC-5, Stormin Mormon wrote:
On 12/11/2013 10:13 AM, Danny D'Amico wrote:

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 08:03:44 -0500, Stormin Mormon wrote:



Yep, connect red to red, to call for heating.

Sigh. (shakes head)



Mea culpa.

That was (just) a typo.

I had corrected it a few minutes after I had posted (but you responded

to the original).

Sorry. That was my mistake.



Very well, my son. Please recite ten Book of

Mormons, twenty Angel Moronis, and go and sin

no more.



Hope you get your heat running, safely, soon.



More likely there will be a pile of disasembled parts
all over the place. He seems to prefer that to focusing
on the obvious. So, the furnace doesn't fire up. Who
starts by taking apart the tstat, asking 100 questions about
how to debug it, without going to look at the furnace and
seeing that the blower door is off, that he took off a few
months ago? Good grief.

I have to give him credit for the longest threads, the most
pics, etc. IMO, he should just call a tech.

"Tony Hwang" wrote in message ...

called K.Y. systems. His back is EE like me.

*cough* Sorry...

K.Y. and Easy Entry? :-)

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ...
On 12/11/2013 12:07 AM, Danny D'Amico wrote:

This is very interesting.

My wife constantly turns the thermostat off and back on.

Should we be more, shall I say, "graceful" about adjusting the thermostat?h


Replace wife. Problem solved.

Get the brand new, high efficiency wife. Works in the
cold, uses 30% less power, leaves toilet seat up, never
runs out of milk or sugar, and is EPA compliant for
ozone emissions.

--
.
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

Best add "makes a sandwich" and brings a "beer".

wrote in message ...

More likely there will be a pile of disasembled parts
all over the place. He seems to prefer that to focusing
on the obvious. So, the furnace doesn't fire up. Who
starts by taking apart the tstat, asking 100 questions about
how to debug it, without going to look at the furnace and
seeing that the blower door is off, that he took off a few
months ago? Good grief.

I have to give him credit for the longest threads, the most
pics, etc. IMO, he should just call a tech.

He definitely needs to slow down a bit and wait for a few more
TSR tips to show up.

Trouble shooting starts with the basics, not what one suspects
unless the symptoms are a known, recurring event. By setting
up the system for a normal start sequence, and waiting the
appropriate amount of time, all of the issues with the T-stat
would not have been.

If the system was reset and things were started over again I
would wager that the unit would work again. This time, do
the test with the cover in place. Check for normal operation,
first, then find out why things are not working. Find the path
of electricity (hence, the logic of the circuit), and follow
it until the path stops. Just bumping the interlock would not
cause any of the other safeties to engage, and would restart
the start up sequence.

Just as with physics, observation with repeatable results is
necessary to figure out what is going wrong. As for his AC, I
wonder if there is a blown fuse out in the fusible disconnect
outside.

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 04:45:40 +0000 (UTC), Danny D'Amico
wrote:

The PDF doesn't describe the lockout timer; but there is a schematic
pasted on the inside of the furnace door that purports to describe it:
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5518/1...27d0a8ef_o.gif

I'm still not sure how it works though - but maybe it is the culprit...

I'm of no help here.

That says this is Auxiliary wiring (LP Kit), which I presume is not
covered in the PDF.

I agree that the mercury T-stats is likely not the problem.

See:

There are three major elements to a non-digital or analog thermostat:

•Bimetallic Strip or Coil
•Contact
•Heat Anticipator

http://homerepair.about.com/od/heatingcoolingrepair/ss/thermostat_2.htm

(back to lurking mode)

On 12/11/2013 12:33 PM, wrote:


Hope you get your heat running, safely, soon.



More likely there will be a pile of disasembled parts
all over the place. He seems to prefer that to focusing
on the obvious. So, the furnace doesn't fire up. Who
starts by taking apart the tstat, asking 100 questions about
how to debug it, without going to look at the furnace and
seeing that the blower door is off, that he took off a few
months ago? Good grief.

I have to give him credit for the longest threads, the most
pics, etc. IMO, he should just call a tech.

In one of the Scott Adams "Dilbert" books, he tells
of a company that called a copier repairman. The
engineers had dissembled (dismembered) the machine,
and written notebooks of theories on why it wasn't
working. The problem was someone put toner in the
imager container. Normally a half hour diagnosis and
fix. To reassemble the copier and reset all the timing
gears took several days.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 13:12:37 -0500, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Normally a half hour diagnosis and
fix. To reassemble the copier and reset all the
timing gears took several days.

A *lot* of things get fixed, simply by throwing parts at
the problem. Nothing wrong with that. Sometimes the person
throwing the parts actually knows what they're doing; sometimes
not.

Take the oft-cited case of vibration when braking? Must be "warp",
right? The rotors must be warped like a potato chip. Solution?
Replace (or turn) the rotors. Right? Everyone knows this, right?

When *I* had vibration while braking, I tried to measure this
so-called "warp". You can't measure it on the car (that would
be runout), so, I measured it off the car. Hmmmm.... there was
no warp. Huh?

Turns out, for normal people (not racing braking systems), warp
just doesn't really happen. While a ton of suspension components
can cause vibration at various speeds, the classic brake-related
vibration at speed is caused, usually, by disk thickness variation
caused, most often, by braking deposits, building up over time.

The solution, once you *understand* that, is to change your
braking habits (so as not to build up those deposits).

Yet, if you don't bother to understand what causes the vibration,
and you simply replace the rotors, you'll solve the problem
quickly, but it will eventually return. And, most importantly,
you'll be solving the problem without understanding the cause,
which means you'll think your entire life that your rotors
are warping. You might even vainly try to buy beefier rotors
in the hope that they won't "warp" as much. Which means you'll
be solving the problem with the right solution but for the wrong
reasons.

Anyway, same thing with just jumping the red wire to the white
wire. If I didn't understand first what the red wire was supposed
to do, and what voltage it was supposed to have, and what effect
it was supposed to have on the furnace, etc., then I would be
remiss.

Of course, had I just disassembled everything and reassembled
it, in this case, I would have solved the problem sooner, as
now it's all working after I disconnected *every* wire, and
reconnected them after cleaning them. I also tapped ever solenoid
and relay I could find and blew the whole thing out with
compressed air.

At the moment, it's working! Thanks to everyone! I very
much appreciate the help.

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5525/1...e7fcbdf4_o.gif

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 09:55:24 -0800, Oren wrote:

I'm of no help here.

I was wondering where you were!

Normally, your huckleberries are spot on the mark!

Luckily, with the team's help, the problem is resolved!
(I think.)

It's running now ... after I pulled the plug (yes, it has
a plug) and then disconnected *every* wire and cleaned
them up and reassembled them (one by one, so as not to
make a mistake).

I blew compressed air around everything; and I tapped
with a screwdriver on all the relays (I guess for good
luck as much as anything else).

Wouldn't you know it ... the darn thing is now working!
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5505/1...67c99f78_o.gif

Will update in a couple of days, to see if it *stays*
working!

(Reminder to self: Tell wife to stop shutting it off and on
constantly!)

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 11:49:18 -0600, Irreverent Maximus wrote:

If the system was reset and things were started over again
I would wager that the unit would work again. This time,
do the test with the cover in place.

This morning, I pulled the plug, and then, one by one,
disconnected *every* wire I could, and cleaned the contact
surfaces, and reconnected them.

I also blew compressed air over the boards, and tapped on
each solenoid of the gas valve and relays in the fan-control
PCB.

This took about an hour. When I powered it back up, I heard
a click click click, and then a small whoosh, and then after
a while, a bigger whoosh, and finally the blower.

The house is toasty right now - but it has only been working
for a couple of hours. Thanks for all the help & advice!
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7370/1...9b2434e2_o.gif

I'll report back, to let you know how it progresses along
over the next day or three ...

On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 23:08:39 -0700, Tony Hwang wrote:

That is located inside the flue. You took a pic. of it.
Sqare bakelite lo0king thing with two wires mounted
on the flue.

I see it. Thanks. This is the backside of the thing:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7323/1...56224304_o.gif

So that makes four safety switches to debug next time:

1. The fusible link (also visible in that picture above)
2. The vent safety shutoff switch (also in that picture above)
3. The lockout timer (also in that picture above)
4. The limit switch (visible in the picture below)
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2814/1...0de1c8bd_o.gif

The only one of those four that I don't understand is the
lockout timer. Googling for the part number 990-141-1, I find
it's a $200 24VAC 60HZ SPST switch:
http://technicalhotandcoldparts.com/...r-control.html

This PDF purports to explain what it does:
http://www.lennoxproducts.com/wp-con.../HH72CH003.pdf

It seems to have a "pickup time" of 7 seconds, and a "dropout time"
of 5 minutes.

Since it's hooked in series with the pilot light and spark igniter,
it has something do do with stopping that circuitry after about
five minutes. But, I'm not sure what controls it, unless it's a
pure timer.

Is that what it is? A timer to interrupt current to the pilot
switch after five minutes?

On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 23:02:10 -0700, Tony Hwang wrote:

Don't worry about lock up timer it only starts when safety issue arises
like over heating triggering over heat limit sensor. This is
kind of thermostat for fixed temp sensing. There are few in there for
different functions/purposes. If you want to reset the lock out timer
just power cycle the furnace,(resetting control board)

Just as an aside, the $279 lockout timer appears to be a normally open
switch, based on these two descriptions:
http://www.furnacepartsource.com/dls015.html
https://acpartsdistributors.com/inde...ducts_id=59920

It is called a "Combustion Safety Control Lockout Timer" (whatever that
is supposed to mean) over here, also sold for $279:
http://www.bestbuyheatingandaircondi...Code=r-lockout

So, it seems to be an expensive normally opened timed switch.

It seems to have a timer of about five minutes.
After five minutes, presumably it closes the SPST switch.
I'm still trying to figure out what it's supposed to do.

It's hooked up *before* the pilot, so, being normally open is
odd.
http://technicalhotandcoldparts.com/...r-control.html

On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 23:56:54 -0600, Irreverent Maximus wrote:

The electrical code in the US demands that the furnace have
a permanent connection to the power source...no plugs allowed.
But when I asked the electrical inspector if I could put a plug
on it so I could run it from a generator, he said, "no problem".
The electrical code is very strict...except when it isn't.

Now, but when the unit was installed? I know of two units that are
operated that way.

I must apologize for having never even looked before this
morning to see how to turn off the furnace (I just hit the
breakers up until now).

Following the power cord with a flashlight in the dark mouse-infested
recesses, I see it terminates on an inaccessible back wall, in a
normal 120V three-pronged power cord:
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5477/1...6604d692_o.gif

I pulled the plug this morning, and wished that I had not,
since it's a bear to get back on the wall, because of the
ductwork in the crawl space.

So, next time, unless it's an emergency, I'm gonna flip
the breaker.

If I ever get a round to it, I'll see if I can hook up
a switch on the outside of the furnace, where that wire
enters at the door switch.

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 20:00:29 +0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

It is called a "Combustion Safety Control Lockout Timer" (whatever that
is supposed to mean) over here, also sold for $279:
http://www.bestbuyheatingandaircondi...Code=r-lockout

So, it seems to be an expensive normally opened timed switch.

It seems to have a timer of about five minutes.
After five minutes, presumably it closes the SPST switch.
I'm still trying to figure out what it's supposed to do.

It's hooked up *before* the pilot, so, being normally open is
odd.
http://technicalhotandcoldparts.com/...r-control.html


Um, "Ignition Lockout Timer"? Isn't it to turn off the gas for a
duration when the furnace fails to fire? Reduces gas from filling the
space - until gas has dissipated, so you don't blown the roof off the
house?

Something like that

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 19:36:02 +0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

(Reminder to self: Tell wife to stop shutting it off and on
constantly!)

....you might be well off to leave her alone, if she is experiencing
menopause (hot/cold Jekyll/Hyde)

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 12:20:35 -0800, Oren wrote:

...you might be well off to leave her alone,

Well, she's running hot now:
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3832/1...8c974a9b_o.gif

On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 23:46:25 -0600, The Daring Dufas wrote:

The small cylindrical thing with a red tip on one of the wires is a "one
shot" thermal fuse and if temps get too high it will pop. It's in series
with all the other safeties and will kill the control voltage. ^_^

Thanks. I've identified four safeties:
1. The lockout timer (still not sure what its specific role is)
2. The fusible link
3. The vent safety shutoff switch
4. The limit switch

Luckily, all four must be working fine, since the heat is on!
Woo hoo!
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5538/1...e1b81768_o.gif

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 12:15:35 -0800, Oren wrote:

Um, "Ignition Lockout Timer"? Isn't it to turn off the gas for a
duration when the furnace fails to fire? Reduces gas from filling the
space - until gas has dissipated, so you don't blown the roof off the
house?

I don't understand *what* it does yet.
Sure, it's called a "lockout timer", so it locks out the gas, I guess.
But, how does it figure out when/if to lock out?

All I can tell, so far, is that it's a normally open SPST switch.
http://www.lennoxproducts.com/wp-con.../HH72CH003.pdf

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 00:26:39 +0000, Danny D'Amico wrote:

There is no furnace switch, that I know of.
The wires come directly into the furnace from the outside.
Of course, I can shut off a breaker ...

I apologize for not having looked far enough into the
mouse-infested recesses of the ductwork to provide the
answer sooner...

There is no power switch; but, there is a power cord,
which is plugged directly into a wall outlet, *behind*
the furnace (and to the side):
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5477/1...6604d692_o.gif

I made the mistake today of unplugging it, and then
regretted that since I had to get covered in insulation
and mouse poop in order to plug it back in.

Next time, I'll just hit the circuit breaker!

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 03:54:03 +0000, Danny D'Amico wrote:

I'll look again tomorrow, by following the power wires, to see
where they go - and if there is a shutoff switch that I didn't
see yet.

No shutoff switch.
And the breaker is on another floor.
So, most of the time, I leave it powered up.

I made the mistake of unplugging, this morning, and wished that
I hadn't (since it's really not easy to put the plug back):
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5477/1...6604d692_o.gif

So, when I have the inclination, I'll see if I can put
a normal 120V switch mounted on the side of the furnace.

I hate it when installers save a buck ... (their buck) ... as
I agree; it should have a switch mounted on the side of the furnace.

On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 20:01:40 -0800, mike wrote:

The electrical code in the US demands that the furnace have
a permanent connection to the power source...no plugs allowed.

Mine is in California. Built in the 1980s. It's plugged
into the wall ...
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5477/1...6604d692_o.gif

On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 20:54:12 -0600, Irreverent Maximus wrote:

Some units will use a cord plugged into a receptacle. Usually
this is only for control voltage, but in his case the control
power supply also powers the blower. He might have a disconnect
that he has not noticed. Usually this is required, but if in
eyesight of the panel I don't think it is in this case.

As far as I can tell, there is no switch.
Just a power cord plugged into the wall.
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5477/1...6604d692_o.gif

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 09:33:50 -0800 (PST), "
wrote:

Hope you get your heat running, safely, soon.

More likely there will be a pile of disasembled parts
all over the place. He seems to prefer that to focusing
on the obvious. So, the furnace doesn't fire up. Who
starts by taking apart the tstat, asking 100 questions about
how to debug it, without going to look at the furnace and
seeing that the blower door is off, that he took off a few
months ago? Good grief.


An Accountant. Danny is a bean counter and things have to add up.
That is his training and is in his DNA.

I have to give him credit for the longest threads, the most
pics, etc. IMO, he should just call a tech.

I've learned some things in his long threads, before. Frustration is
when he wants to wonder off into the wilderness and not follow-up on
some simple suggestions. (GDO header drywall - pool pump)... you
remember

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 12:26:46 -0500, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

Hope you get your heat running, safely, soon.

A good news story here.

"RENO — A desperate search for a couple and four children missing for
two days in the below-zero cold of Northern Nevada’s rugged mountains
turned jubilant Tuesday when rescuers found them alive and well near
their overturned Jeep.

- See more at:
http://www.reviewjournal.com/news/6-missing-two-days-freezing-northern-nevada-found-safe#sthash.umXCi46M.dpuf

The man burned his spare tire, heated rocks and kept the family warm
in his overturned vehicle.

On 12/11/2013 12:34 PM, Irreverent Maximus wrote:

"Tony Hwang" wrote in message
...

called K.Y. systems. His back is EE like me.

*cough* Sorry...

K.Y. and Easy Entry? :-)

That could be the butt of jokes.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..