"RicodJour" wrote in message
...
On Oct 25, 8:24 am, "Robert Green" wrote:
A question for the locksmiths he

Would a locksmith be able to get me started if I somehow lost the RF
chipped
key that starts my car? This is a 2002 Chrysler minivan with a device
in
the steering column called an "immobilser" (and spelled that way, too)
that
will turn the starter but not engage the engine unless the chipped key
is
near the steering column. Do they have the tools to re-create that kind
of
key on-site or what? I know locksmiths can duplicate the key, but they
have
the original to start with.

I want to figure out if it's worth buying and hiding a spare key for
inside
the van somewhere (far enough away not to activate the immobilizer).

If misplacing things is a problem, going without that car for a while
until the key can be replaced would be an issue, and your travel
patterns would make your retrieval problematic, getting a spare makes
sense. It's insurance, right? Peace of mind.

http://www.brandtlocksmiths.com/doc/DOcAC.htm

R

I had two keys, got only one replacement when the car was broken into, add
to that with a Tru-Value key and am now trying to decide whether a third key
is necessary or just a non-chipped copy and a code number that I may be able
to get from TruValue reading the key they made for me last year.

Maybe even four keys won't be enough considering the lost checkbook that
showed up in the attic!

--
Bobby G.

"Tony Hwang" wrote in message
...


Robert Green wrote:
A question for the locksmiths he

Would a locksmith be able to get me started if I somehow lost the RF
chipped
key that starts my car? This is a 2002 Chrysler minivan with a device
in
the steering column called an "immobilser" (and spelled that way, too)
that
will turn the starter but not engage the engine unless the chipped key
is
near the steering column. Do they have the tools to re-create that kind
of
key on-site or what? I know locksmiths can duplicate the key, but they
have
the original to start with.

I want to figure out if it's worth buying and hiding a spare key for
inside
the van somewhere (far enough away not to activate the immobilizer).

TIA,

--
Bobby G.

Hi,
You can buy a blank key with virgin chip. Having it cut is easy but
programming is done by a dealer. I don't know locksmith have something
to program it.

Thanks for your input!

--
Bobby G.

"Pete C." wrote in message
.com...

Tony Hwang wrote:

Robert Green wrote:
A question for the locksmiths he

Would a locksmith be able to get me started if I somehow lost the RF
chipped
key that starts my car? This is a 2002 Chrysler minivan with a device
in
the steering column called an "immobilser" (and spelled that way, too)
that
will turn the starter but not engage the engine unless the chipped key
is
near the steering column. Do they have the tools to re-create that
kind of
key on-site or what? I know locksmiths can duplicate the key, but
they have
the original to start with.

I want to figure out if it's worth buying and hiding a spare key for
inside
the van somewhere (far enough away not to activate the immobilizer).

TIA,

--
Bobby G.

Hi,
You can buy a blank key with virgin chip. Having it cut is easy but
programming is done by a dealer. I don't know locksmith have something
to program it.

Some locksmiths are equipped to program chip keys. On some vehicles you
are able to program new chip keys yourself as long as you have two
working chip keys to use in the process. It's a *really* good idea to
get extra keys when you get the vehicle and put a couple away somewhere
safe.

Got two keys now, am thinking of getting a third, or at least a non-chipped
key and the code number.

Thanks for your input!

--
Bobby G.

"Kurt Ullman" wrote in message
m...
In article ,
"Stormin Mormon" wrote:

Some locksmiths, mostly in cities, have that capability. I'd
open the yellow pages, call several locksmiths in the city
(cities) near you.


But don't you need at least one active key to program it from?

That seems to be the preferred starting point for avoiding a trip to the
dealer and getting a cheaper key made at a TruValue or HoPo.

--
Bobby G.

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
...
On Oct 25, 3:31 pm, Kurt Ullman wrote:
In article ,
"Stormin Mormon" wrote:

Some locksmiths, mostly in cities, have that capability. I'd
open the yellow pages, call several locksmiths in the city
(cities) near you.

But don't you need at least one active key to program it from?

--
People thought cybersex was a safe alternative,
until patients started presenting with sexually
acquired carpal tunnel syndrome.-Howard Berkowitz

Just a guess:

Hook the programmer up to the car's computer and download the code
required to program the key.

If the original key was required, then I doubt *anyone*, including the
dealer, would be able to duplicate the key.

Here's a related, and somewhat humorous, story.

I coach Girl's Softball. The team met in the high school parking lot
and we all boarded the bus. A few minutes down the road our short
stop's cell phone rang. Turns out Mom has one of those push-button-
start cars where all you have to do is have the key nearby, like in a
pocket, to start it. It also turns out that Mom had let the daughter
drive the car to the school with Mom in the passenger seat. Guess who
still had the keys in their pocket? The girl on the bus!

Mom was worried that the car was going to stall on the way home and
wanted us to come back. Even though it was still running, she assumed
that it wouldn't stay running without the key nearby. We weren't about
to turn around, so she took a chance and drove home (about a mile).
She made it home, moved her husband's car out of the driveway so she
didn't block it in and then shut her car down, leaving it sit until
late that night when we got back from our game.

I guess they'll stay running even if the key is moved away from the
vehicle.
===============================================

That's an interesting test. I think I am going to hide the spare key
somewhere in the vehicle - just where might have to be decided by testing.
Might have to put it a metal box like a magnetic key holder. Thanks for the
information!

--
Bobby G.

"George" wrote in message
...
On 10/25/2011 4:22 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Oct 25, 3:31 pm, Kurt wrote:
In ,
"Stormin wrote:

Some locksmiths, mostly in cities, have that capability. I'd
open the yellow pages, call several locksmiths in the city
(cities) near you.

But don't you need at least one active key to program it from?

--
People thought cybersex was a safe alternative,
until patients started presenting with sexually
acquired carpal tunnel syndrome.-Howard Berkowitz

Just a guess:

Hook the programmer up to the car's computer and download the code
required to program the key.

If the original key was required, then I doubt *anyone*, including the
dealer, would be able to duplicate the key.

Why not? You always have to design in a method just for such events. I
have only seen it done once and the dealer had to contact the
manufacturer for some sort of hash that they entered via their
diagnostic unit.

When the car's steering wheel lock was popped, the dealer ended up having to
give me a new chip - the old keys opened the door but wouldn't start the
car.

--
Bobby G.

"RickH" wrote in message
...
On Oct 25, 7:24 am, "Robert Green" wrote:
A question for the locksmiths he

Would a locksmith be able to get me started if I somehow lost the RF
chipped
key that starts my car? This is a 2002 Chrysler minivan with a device in
the steering column called an "immobilser" (and spelled that way, too)
that
will turn the starter but not engage the engine unless the chipped key is
near the steering column. Do they have the tools to re-create that kind of
key on-site or what? I know locksmiths can duplicate the key, but they
have
the original to start with.

I want to figure out if it's worth buying and hiding a spare key for
inside
the van somewhere (far enough away not to activate the immobilizer).

TIA,

--
Bobby G.

I carry a spare un-chipped key in my wallet that will get me into the
car. To start it I have a spare chipped key well hidden inside the
car. Ace hardware will make a chip key for around $75 (which is a
bargain over the dealer). Carrying a spare chiped key in the wallet
hurts my ass because they are so thick.

Sounds like a plan. I've always carried a wallet spare but those huge RF
heads can sit you so off center it throws your back out of whack. The
hidden key with a bunch of non-chipped entry keys in various places with
maybe even the code, if the TruValue guy will give it to me.

--
Bobby G.

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
...
I've never done one. And it's been years since I read any
articles in the locksmith magazines I get. I wouldn't want
to try and answer specifics. I'd be sure to get it wrong.

Thanks for not guessing! (-;

FWIW, I read an article a while back that said out-of-town referral
companies were gaming Google and were "muscling in" on the city locksmith
trade by implying they were local when they were really an hour or more
away. They did it by buying telephone numbers in different areas of the
city to give them recognizable exchanges that people would call believing
they were in that very area. The catch was that they were all remote call
forwarded to the one location the guy had in town that sometimes was very
far away. I believe I read it in the SF Chronicle when checking on whether
they really could pass a law making baby weenie whacking (circumcision)
against the law. Now that's really nanny-state thinking.

Anyway that was a few months ago and when I went to the Yellow pages tonight
to call a locksmith (as I believe you suggested!) I saw a suspicious series
of ads and realized I was probably seeing the same thing in the Yellow Pages
that article described: One locksmith that was working hard to appear that
he was local and close by to answer the call when he really wasn't. That's
close to fraud, IMHO, and just shows you have to know what questions to ask.

I always ask call center people what country there are in. Many refuse,
some are proud to say (mostly India), more are saying "America" than there
used to be and some don't understand any question that is not on their menu.
If they fail that test, I ask directly "Are you located in America?" When
you introduce a language complication into an already difficult technical
support situation, it almost never gets any better.

--
Bobby G.

Steve Barker wrote:
or just get a car that doesn't have that ****. sigh

If I had a car with a chipped key, the first thing I would learn to do is
how to bypass the chip reading circuit in the case of a malfunction.

Jon

In article ,
"Robert Green" wrote:

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
...
I doubt it. I'm not sure if the electronic hooplah is
mandated by our nanny government, or if it's what the car
makers want to put in. In any case, probably can't find a
simple vehicle any more.

I have to say that when I was in a serious crash, spinning around at over
55mph, watching the doors blow open and everything in the car lifting up in
the air in slow motion, flying out of the car from centrifical force, I was
sure glad to have those damn nanny-mandated automatic seat and shoulder
belts keeping me from joining my briefcase, sunglasses, tissue box and
under-seat tire iron as they levitate upward and outward. (-:


Seems to be interfering unneccesarily with Darwin. Anybody any more
who is dumb enough to not buckle up probably gets what they deserve.

--
People thought cybersex was a safe alternative,
until patients started presenting with sexually
acquired carpal tunnel syndrome.-Howard Berkowitz

Just google for "Car Thieves R Us". The bypass techniques
have to be on the internet, like the recipe for a Nagasaki
bomb, and how to make nerve gas.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Jon Danniken" wrote
in message ...
Steve Barker wrote:
or just get a car that doesn't have that ****. sigh

If I had a car with a chipped key, the first thing I would
learn to do is
how to bypass the chip reading circuit in the case of a
malfunction.

Jon

Pre-internet quote "a police officer said to me he's never
unbuckled a dead man".

Speaking only on very limited data sample. I can remember
three traffic wrecks I've been in. One totalled the other
guy's car. Sometime in 1986. Second one totalled both, I
was in a two door Ford Ranger pickup. Ten years later, Oct
26, 1996. Third was the time Dec 01, 2010, when I was
driving a four door Chevrolet Blazer, and got hit from
behind by a semi. Fish tailed, and then the Blazer flipped
onto the passenger side, and slid some more. Total loss.

All three, I was wearing my seat belt with shoulder strap.
Some glass cuts on my face, in the Ranger. Which blew out
the drivers side window. Blazer wreck, my eye glasses flew
off, and were found days later. Other than that, no
injuries.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Kurt Ullman" wrote in message
m...

Seems to be interfering unneccesarily with Darwin.
Anybody any more
who is dumb enough to not buckle up probably gets what they
deserve.

--
People thought cybersex was a safe alternative,
until patients started presenting with sexually
acquired carpal tunnel syndrome.-Howard Berkowitz

Robert Green wrote:

"Reed" wrote in message
...
On 10/25/11 3:31 PM, Kurt Ullman wrote:
In ,
"Stormin wrote:

Some locksmiths, mostly in cities, have that capability. I'd
open the yellow pages, call several locksmiths in the city
(cities) near you.


But don't you need at least one active key to program it from?


It is a common mis-understanding that what gets "programmed" is the
key. Wrong. The car's computer is programmed to accept that specific
new key (or keys) individual PIN code, which any new key is provided
with in it's packaging.

Same for remote controls, which is why the used ones people buy on
eBay etc (and don't get a code) end up being paperweights.

When I worked at a dealer, we had many cases of people losing their
last key, and car had to be towed to nearest dealership for
programming a new key.

Also re these new remote keys, we did have a case where guy went to
airport, got out of car, it kept running til it ran out of gas while
he was gone.

Okay. $75 isn't a bad 1-time insurance premium to pay to make sure I've
always got an original. That seems to be the "key" to the whole chipped key
problem. Life is *probably* going to be easier if you either have the code
number and a plain metal key or a spare chipped key - or both. Thanks!

--
Bobby G.

When I got extra chip keys when I got my F350 I paid $8/ea cut by the
dealer and I did the programming.

Larry W wrote:

In article ,
Pete C. wrote:

Kurt Ullman wrote:

In article ,
"Stormin Mormon" wrote:

Some locksmiths, mostly in cities, have that capability. I'd
open the yellow pages, call several locksmiths in the city
(cities) near you.


But don't you need at least one active key to program it from?

Depends on the vehicle I would think. If you or the locksmith have the
"real" factory scan/diag unit you can normally program new keys without
any current keys.

Just wanted to add, on many vehicles, the _key_ is not programmable.
rather, the scan tool or key replacment procedure programs the
vehicle ECM (computer) to recognize the key. What's more, certain
make/models have ECM with a limit on the number of keys they will recognize,
and no way to "free" a key code no longer used; IOW, once you've
programmed the vehicle for new keys 10 times (typically, might be more/less)
that particular vehicle will not be able to have any more new keys added
without a new ECM too. Good luck with that.

On some Fords at least you get something like 8 active keys max by
default, but the dealer or someone else with the VCM/IDS laptop can set
the PCM to unlimited mode which is intended for fleet use.

On Tue, 25 Oct 2011 21:49:36 -0400, "Robert Green"
wrote:

"HeyBub" wrote in message
om...
Robert Green wrote:
A question for the locksmiths he

Would a locksmith be able to get me started if I somehow lost the RF
chipped key that starts my car? This is a 2002 Chrysler minivan with
a device in the steering column called an "immobilser" (and spelled
that way, too) that will turn the starter but not engage the engine
unless the chipped key is near the steering column. Do they have the
tools to re-create that kind of key on-site or what? I know
locksmiths can duplicate the key, but they have the original to start
with.

I want to figure out if it's worth buying and hiding a spare key for
inside the van somewhere (far enough away not to activate the
immobilizer).


Before you go to the dealership for the spare key, try the BORG. On my
last
trip to HD, they had a selection of chipped key replacements in the
$40-$60
range.

Tru-Value did it for $75 for a Cripesler, other cars were in the same range
you mention. Still others even Tru-Value wanted $100+ for.

Thanks for your input!

I got one at a Ford dealer for $30 and a couple more for $20 one at a Lincoln
dealer (I now have four keys for each of two vehicles). I programmed the
computer, though. It was ~$50, each, to have the dealership program them.

"Pete C." wrote in message news:4ea802d9$0$28453

stuff snipped

On some Fords at least you get something like 8 active keys max by
default, but the dealer or someone else with the VCM/IDS laptop can set
the PCM to unlimited mode which is intended for fleet use.

That makes sense. I also realized that if you had your key off to a valet
parker for more than an hour or two that THEY could easily clone the key,
toss the car looking for an address and pick up your car a few weeks later,
easy as pie.

Yesterday, my dentist gave my wife's phone number to some guy who alleged
she banged into her car in the parking lot and didn't leave a note. They
didn't step outside to look at the "alleged" damage, they didn't say "call
the cops and we'll give it to them, not you" or even "We'll call her and ask
her to call you." She's fuming mad and so am I. You'd think that even a
phone number would be privileged information under the Federal medical
privacy laws.

My wife, who's been going to the same dentist for 25 years is more steamed
that the dentist/staff would believe she's a "hit and run" artist. I'm
tempted to call my lawyer buddy and ask if they can give out a patient's
phone number to anyone, even someone they know (we haven't established who
this person is or if someone on the staff knew them).

Most peculiar and really upsetting to my wife who thinks that the dental
office should now pay to have her phone number changed (we still keep a
landline each). This is a publicly listed land line, too, so now this
cretin has our address. Time to clean and oil the Glock.

On other front in the war on privacy, I bought a pair of shoes yesterday at
Payless and the clerk asked for my phone number, to which I just said "No"
so he just took my cash and rang me up. At the bottom of the receipt its
says: "Good news, Payless has settled the text messaging class action
lawsuit. If you received a text message from us . . . you may be eligible
for a $25 credit."

What's going ON with this world? The right to privacy is slowly but surely
being erased.

--
Bobby G.

"Pete C." wrote in message news:4ea80250$0$28458

stuff snipped

When I got extra chip keys when I got my F350 I paid $8/ea cut by the
dealer and I did the programming.

What do you program a key with? I have a lot of slots on my PC, but no car
keyholes. (-:

I'd prefer to pay $8 instead of $80, obviously, but it depends on what a
programmer costs. What's the deal?

Thanks for your input!

--
Bobby G.

"Robert Green" wrote in message
...
"Pete C." wrote in message news:4ea80250$0$28458
.

What do you program a key with? I have a lot of slots on my PC, but no
car
keyholes. (-:

I'd prefer to pay $8 instead of $80, obviously, but it depends on what a
programmer costs. What's the deal?



The vehicle itself does the programming with you inserting the two
programmed keys, and then the new, unprogrammed key. Here's a video showing
how:

http://fullerisford.wordpress.com/20...ord-pats-keys/

In article ,
"Robert Green" wrote:


her to call you." She's fuming mad and so am I. You'd think that even a
phone number would be privileged information under the Federal medical
privacy laws.

Unlike docs not all dentists are automatically covered under HIPAA.
Mostly has to do with whether they submit claims via computers and even
that isn't total.
A phone # would be covered *IF* the jawbreaker is covered.



--
People thought cybersex was a safe alternative,
until patients started presenting with sexually
acquired carpal tunnel syndrome.-Howard Berkowitz

In article ,
"Robert Green" wrote:


I was not specific enough. I was talking about having seat belts to buckle
up in the first place, a mandate from the Feds a long, long time ago. The
fact that I had a shoulder and lap belt to save me didn't come about easily.
Growing up, my mother's right hand was my "seat belt." I remember in the
early 60's hearing the usual Detroit cries of "it will make our cars too
expensive if we HAVE to put them in EVERY car.

Different in the way we grew up, I guess. We had seatbelts even when
they were still optional equipment. Can't remember EVER turning the key
until we were all buckled.

--
People thought cybersex was a safe alternative,
until patients started presenting with sexually
acquired carpal tunnel syndrome.-Howard Berkowitz

"Kurt Ullman" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"Robert Green" wrote:


her to call you." She's fuming mad and so am I. You'd think that even
a
phone number would be privileged information under the Federal medical
privacy laws.

Unlike docs not all dentists are automatically covered under HIPAA.
Mostly has to do with whether they submit claims via computers and even
that isn't total.
A phone # would be covered *IF* the jawbreaker is covered.

I just called her at work to tell her that. Now she's even MORE fuming mad
that before. Red nitric acid fuming. Maybe there's a state law that covers
it. I'll have to check. It's probably time for a new dentist who gets a
transposed phone number or a pre-paid cell number or something.

Thanks for the info even if it's not what I wanted to hear.

--
Bobby G.

In article ,
"Robert Green" wrote:

"Ku

Unlike docs not all dentists are automatically covered under HIPAA.
Mostly has to do with whether they submit claims via computers and even
that isn't total.
A phone # would be covered *IF* the jawbreaker is covered.

I just called her at work to tell her that. Now she's even MORE fuming mad
that before. Red nitric acid fuming. Maybe there's a state law that covers
it. I'll have to check. It's probably time for a new dentist who gets a
transposed phone number or a pre-paid cell number or something.

Thanks for the info even if it's not what I wanted to hear.

I said they were not AUTOMATICALLY covered. They may be depending on
how and who they bill and myriad other things. Might be worth your while
to find out for sure.

--
People thought cybersex was a safe alternative,
until patients started presenting with sexually
acquired carpal tunnel syndrome.-Howard Berkowitz

Robert Green wrote:
A question for the locksmiths he

Would a locksmith be able to get me started if I somehow lost the RF
chipped key that starts my car? This is a 2002 Chrysler minivan with
a device in the steering column called an "immobilser" (and spelled
that way, too) that will turn the starter but not engage the engine
unless the chipped key is near the steering column. Do they have the
tools to re-create that kind of key on-site or what? I know
locksmiths can duplicate the key, but they have the original to start
with.

I want to figure out if it's worth buying and hiding a spare key for
inside the van somewhere (far enough away not to activate the
immobilizer).


Well, don't lose the "chipped" key. Instead, have one or more non-chipped
duplicates made for $2 each. Take the original chipped key and glue it under
the dash or somewhere close so the anti-theft mechanism can pick up the RFID
signal when you attempt to start the car with a non-chipped key.

Hey, it only costs two bucks to TRY it.

In article ,
Robert Green wrote:

... sad and disturbing storey snipped...

What's going ON with this world? The right to privacy is slowly but surely
being erased.


Not as slowly as I'd like.

--
There are no stupid questions, but there are lots of stupid answers.

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar. org

On Wed, 26 Oct 2011 10:32:55 -0400, "Robert Green"
wrote:

"Pete C." wrote in message news:4ea802d9$0$28453

stuff snipped

On some Fords at least you get something like 8 active keys max by
default, but the dealer or someone else with the VCM/IDS laptop can set
the PCM to unlimited mode which is intended for fleet use.

That makes sense. I also realized that if you had your key off to a valet
parker for more than an hour or two that THEY could easily clone the key,
toss the car looking for an address and pick up your car a few weeks later,
easy as pie.

Only if the valet has the dealer's programmer, otherwise he would need two
keys.

On 10/25/2011 6:13 PM, Kurt Ullman wrote:
In ,
wrote:


Why not? You always have to design in a method just for such events. I
have only seen it done once and the dealer had to contact the
manufacturer for some sort of hash that they entered via their
diagnostic unit.


I kept the number that was on the keys when I got it. Non-chipped, I
just read the numbers to the dealer and they made a new key. I wonder if
the numbers are all I need with a chipped key.


No, but the dealer can make "non chipped" keys without you furnishing
the number (assuming no one has changed the cylinders to a different keying)

On 10/26/2011 4:30 PM, Kurt Ullman wrote:
In ,
"Robert wrote:

"Ku

Unlike docs not all dentists are automatically covered under HIPAA.
Mostly has to do with whether they submit claims via computers and even
that isn't total.
A phone # would be covered *IF* the jawbreaker is covered.

I just called her at work to tell her that. Now she's even MORE fuming mad
that before. Red nitric acid fuming. Maybe there's a state law that covers
it. I'll have to check. It's probably time for a new dentist who gets a
transposed phone number or a pre-paid cell number or something.

Thanks for the info even if it's not what I wanted to hear.

I said they were not AUTOMATICALLY covered. They may be depending on
how and who they bill and myriad other things. Might be worth your while
to find out for sure.

All providers must comply with at least the HIPAA privacy rules. Other
parts of HIPAA have to do with billing electronically but in many cases
insurers only accept electronic billing.

On 10/26/2011 10:32 AM, Robert Green wrote:
"Pete wrote in message news:4ea802d9$0$28453

stuff snipped

On some Fords at least you get something like 8 active keys max by
default, but the dealer or someone else with the VCM/IDS laptop can set
the PCM to unlimited mode which is intended for fleet use.

That makes sense. I also realized that if you had your key off to a valet
parker for more than an hour or two that THEY could easily clone the key,
toss the car looking for an address and pick up your car a few weeks later,
easy as pie.

Yesterday, my dentist gave my wife's phone number to some guy who alleged
she banged into her car in the parking lot and didn't leave a note. They
didn't step outside to look at the "alleged" damage, they didn't say "call
the cops and we'll give it to them, not you" or even "We'll call her and ask
her to call you." She's fuming mad and so am I. You'd think that even a
phone number would be privileged information under the Federal medical
privacy laws.

My wife, who's been going to the same dentist for 25 years is more steamed
that the dentist/staff would believe she's a "hit and run" artist. I'm
tempted to call my lawyer buddy and ask if they can give out a patient's
phone number to anyone, even someone they know (we haven't established who
this person is or if someone on the staff knew them).

Most peculiar and really upsetting to my wife who thinks that the dental
office should now pay to have her phone number changed (we still keep a
landline each). This is a publicly listed land line, too, so now this
cretin has our address. Time to clean and oil the Glock.

On other front in the war on privacy, I bought a pair of shoes yesterday at
Payless and the clerk asked for my phone number, to which I just said "No"
so he just took my cash and rang me up. At the bottom of the receipt its
says: "Good news, Payless has settled the text messaging class action
lawsuit. If you received a text message from us . . . you may be eligible
for a $25 credit."

What's going ON with this world? The right to privacy is slowly but surely
being erased.


I heard about that but I am pretty sure it doesn't exist.

Got an email from Verizon Wireless last week. "Dear xxxxxx, WE VALUE
YOUR PRIVACY, so we are informing you that we record all URLs you visit,
all searches you make and the results of those searches and the location
of your device.

We are allowing you to OPT OUT of the use of this information to build
reports."

Nice way to show how they value my privacy. What honest company records
all activities of their paying customers? What honest company uses opt out?

I called and the "executive assistant" person couldn't understand why
anyone would be offended. Then another person called back to let me know
that "at&t" does it too...




--
Bobby G.

On 10/25/2011 6:07 PM, Reed wrote:
On 10/25/11 3:31 PM, Kurt Ullman wrote:
In ,
"Stormin wrote:

Some locksmiths, mostly in cities, have that capability. I'd
open the yellow pages, call several locksmiths in the city
(cities) near you.


But don't you need at least one active key to program it from?


It is a common mis-understanding that what gets "programmed" is the key.
Wrong. The car's computer is programmed to accept that specific new key
(or keys) individual PIN code, which any new key is provided with in
it's packaging.

I think that applies for sure for "standard" replacement keys.

There are key chip programmers that can clone a key. The local ACE has
one right at the CS desk.


Same for remote controls, which is why the used ones people buy on eBay
etc (and don't get a code) end up being paperweights.

When I worked at a dealer, we had many cases of people losing their last
key, and car had to be towed to nearest dealership for programming a new
key.

Also re these new remote keys, we did have a case where guy went to
airport, got out of car, it kept running til it ran out of gas while he
was gone.

"Larry W" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Robert Green wrote:

... sad and disturbing storey snipped...

What's going ON with this world? The right to privacy is slowly but
surely
being erased.


Not as slowly as I'd like.

--
There are no stupid questions, but there are lots of stupid answers.

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar. org

Hey, I couldn't find your tax returns posted on the net. I'm concerned you
might have underpaid a bit and cheated us all and I'd like to check them
over. Just to be sure. Still think privacy's not worth protecting?

(-:

--
Bobby G.

"HeyBub" wrote in message
m...
stuff snipped

Well, don't lose the "chipped" key. Instead, have one or more non-chipped
duplicates made for $2 each. Take the original chipped key and glue it
under
the dash or somewhere close so the anti-theft mechanism can pick up the
RFID
signal when you attempt to start the car with a non-chipped key.

Hey, it only costs two bucks to TRY it.

Why would I disable a system that saved my van from being joy-riden, smashed
up or stripped by the three punks that tried hard to steal it? They stopped
only when my neighbor and I came out and scared them away. I still hear my
wife reminding me "you can't shoot kids in the back for NOT stealing your
car." (-:

I could have at least taken out one of them that night. The immobilizer
turned a potential $25K loss into a thousand dollar problem. Disabling that
system would be like de-barking a dog that had just scared away burglars.
Wouldn't be prudent.

The point is to hide the key in the van and for my wife and I to have a
chipped key each. She's often out of town so doing what a few others here
do would seem to be ideal. Stow a chipped key in the van, AWAY from the
column and have a spare, non-chipped key in the wallet. Lose the main
chipped key and I'd still have a way into the car (wallet key) and a way to
start the car (hidden chipped key). It will be interesting to see what it
takes to "blind" the immobilzer to the chipped key hidden in the van.
Probably enclosing it in HD aluminum foil would be all it takes.

--
Bobby G.

"George" wrote in message
...
On 10/26/2011 4:30 PM, Kurt Ullman wrote:
In ,
"Robert wrote:

"Ku

Unlike docs not all dentists are automatically covered under HIPAA.
Mostly has to do with whether they submit claims via computers and
even
that isn't total.
A phone # would be covered *IF* the jawbreaker is covered.

I just called her at work to tell her that. Now she's even MORE fuming
mad
that before. Red nitric acid fuming. Maybe there's a state law that
covers
it. I'll have to check. It's probably time for a new dentist who gets
a
transposed phone number or a pre-paid cell number or something.

Thanks for the info even if it's not what I wanted to hear.

I said they were not AUTOMATICALLY covered. They may be depending on
how and who they bill and myriad other things. Might be worth your while
to find out for sure.

All providers must comply with at least the HIPAA privacy rules. Other
parts of HIPAA have to do with billing electronically but in many cases
insurers only accept electronic billing.

This is a backwards office that still uses typewriters and a paper
appointment book. How can I figure out if they're bound by HIPAA without
asking the dentist directly? It's clear I'm going to have to address this
and I'd like to follow the rule of being forewarned and forearmed when I
talk to them.

--
Bobby G.

"George" wrote in message
...
On 10/26/2011 10:32 AM, Robert Green wrote:
"Pete wrote in message news:4ea802d9$0$28453

stuff snipped

On some Fords at least you get something like 8 active keys max by
default, but the dealer or someone else with the VCM/IDS laptop can set
the PCM to unlimited mode which is intended for fleet use.

That makes sense. I also realized that if you had your key off to a
valet
parker for more than an hour or two that THEY could easily clone the
key,
toss the car looking for an address and pick up your car a few weeks
later,
easy as pie.

Yesterday, my dentist gave my wife's phone number to some guy who
alleged
she banged into her car in the parking lot and didn't leave a note.
They
didn't step outside to look at the "alleged" damage, they didn't say
"call
the cops and we'll give it to them, not you" or even "We'll call her and
ask
her to call you." She's fuming mad and so am I. You'd think that even
a
phone number would be privileged information under the Federal medical
privacy laws.

My wife, who's been going to the same dentist for 25 years is more
steamed
that the dentist/staff would believe she's a "hit and run" artist. I'm
tempted to call my lawyer buddy and ask if they can give out a patient's
phone number to anyone, even someone they know (we haven't established
who
this person is or if someone on the staff knew them).

Most peculiar and really upsetting to my wife who thinks that the dental
office should now pay to have her phone number changed (we still keep a
landline each). This is a publicly listed land line, too, so now this
cretin has our address. Time to clean and oil the Glock.

On other front in the war on privacy, I bought a pair of shoes yesterday
at
Payless and the clerk asked for my phone number, to which I just said
"No"
so he just took my cash and rang me up. At the bottom of the receipt
its
says: "Good news, Payless has settled the text messaging class action
lawsuit. If you received a text message from us . . . you may be
eligible
for a $25 credit."

What's going ON with this world? The right to privacy is slowly but
surely
being erased.


I heard about that but I am pretty sure it doesn't exist.

Got an email from Verizon Wireless last week. "Dear xxxxxx, WE VALUE
YOUR PRIVACY,

Yeah, SURE they do.

so we are informing you that we record all URLs you visit,
all searches you make and the results of those searches and the location
of your device.

We are allowing you to OPT OUT of the use of this information to build
reports."

Note that you can't opt out of them collecting it, just *using* it to "build
reports."

Nice way to show how they value my privacy. What honest company records
all activities of their paying customers? What honest company uses opt
out?

When our businesses and politicians see how well the Chinese internet model
suppresses dissent, we'll move more and more towards it.

I called and the "executive assistant" person couldn't understand why
anyone would be offended. Then another person called back to let me know
that "at&t" does it too...

Yes. I just called Verizon about getting faster internet and they offered
me a "special price" that was the same as the ad in the county free
newspaper. Most young'uns seem AOK with having their position and every
their every activity tracked by Big Brother. Not me.

--
Bobby G.

"SRN" wrote in message
...

"Robert Green" wrote in message
...
"Pete C." wrote in message news:4ea80250$0$28458
.

What do you program a key with? I have a lot of slots on my PC, but no
car
keyholes. (-:

I'd prefer to pay $8 instead of $80, obviously, but it depends on what a
programmer costs. What's the deal?



The vehicle itself does the programming with you inserting the two
programmed keys, and then the new, unprogrammed key. Here's a video
showing
how:


http://fullerisford.wordpress.com/20...ord-pats-keys/

Way cool. I have no idea if that works for a 2002 Chrysler or where I'd
get a blank from, but it does give me a good idea of what to look for.
Thanks!

--
Bobby G.

Robert Green wrote:

"Pete C." wrote in message news:4ea80250$0$28458

stuff snipped

When I got extra chip keys when I got my F350 I paid $8/ea cut by the
dealer and I did the programming.

What do you program a key with? I have a lot of slots on my PC, but no car
keyholes. (-:

I'd prefer to pay $8 instead of $80, obviously, but it depends on what a
programmer costs. What's the deal?

Thanks for your input!

--
Bobby G.

The programming procedure has you inserting various current and new
keys, turning them on / off, tapping the brake and standing on your head
You need two current active keys to perform the process, but it
doesn't require any special tools.

"Pete C." wrote in message
.com...

Robert Green wrote:

"Pete C." wrote in message news:4ea80250$0$28458

stuff snipped

When I got extra chip keys when I got my F350 I paid $8/ea cut by the
dealer and I did the programming.

What do you program a key with? I have a lot of slots on my PC, but no
car
keyholes. (-:

I'd prefer to pay $8 instead of $80, obviously, but it depends on what
a
programmer costs. What's the deal?

Thanks for your input!

--
Bobby G.

The programming procedure has you inserting various current and new
keys, turning them on / off, tapping the brake and standing on your head
You need two current active keys to perform the process, but it
doesn't require any special tools.

Thanks! Where does one acquire the blanks? I don't see any reason for
TruValue to sell me a blank chipped key when they could make much more by
insisting on programming it themselves. I wonder if two keys are required
simply to make it harder for a parking valet to dupe your key inside your
own car since they typically have access to only one key at a time?

--
Bobby G.

Robert Green wrote:

"Pete C." wrote in message
.com...

Robert Green wrote:

"Pete C." wrote in message news:4ea80250$0$28458

stuff snipped

When I got extra chip keys when I got my F350 I paid $8/ea cut by the
dealer and I did the programming.

What do you program a key with? I have a lot of slots on my PC, but no
car
keyholes. (-:

I'd prefer to pay $8 instead of $80, obviously, but it depends on what
a
programmer costs. What's the deal?

Thanks for your input!

--
Bobby G.

The programming procedure has you inserting various current and new
keys, turning them on / off, tapping the brake and standing on your head
You need two current active keys to perform the process, but it
doesn't require any special tools.

Thanks! Where does one acquire the blanks? I don't see any reason for
TruValue to sell me a blank chipped key when they could make much more by
insisting on programming it themselves.

I got my extra keys from the dealer where I got the truck, they cut them
and I programmed them.

I wonder if two keys are required
simply to make it harder for a parking valet to dupe your key inside your
own car since they typically have access to only one key at a time?

Yes. The alternate procedure with the dealer's VCM/IDS setup which does
not require any active keys even has a 15 minute waiting period before
you can program new keys after connecting.

Robert Green wrote:
"HeyBub" wrote in message
m...
stuff snipped

Well, don't lose the "chipped" key. Instead, have one or more
non-chipped duplicates made for $2 each. Take the original chipped
key and glue it under the dash or somewhere close so the anti-theft
mechanism can pick up the RFID signal when you attempt to start the
car with a non-chipped key.

Hey, it only costs two bucks to TRY it.

Why would I disable a system that saved my van from being joy-riden,
smashed up or stripped by the three punks that tried hard to steal
it? They stopped only when my neighbor and I came out and scared
them away. I still hear my wife reminding me "you can't shoot kids
in the back for NOT stealing your car." (-:

"I shouted HALT! One of them turned in my direction with what I believed was
a weapon. In fear of my life, I discharged my weapon."

"Yeah, how'd it hit him in the back?"

"Just lucky, I guess."

As to why you'd disable a system, so doing might save you several hundred
dollars to have a locksmith come to your disabled car, on a dark, rainy
night, in a disreputable part of town, to let you in. In the alternative,
call a wrecker and have your car towed to your destination while you ride
safe and warm with the wrecker. You can then deal with the problem at your
convenience.


I could have at least taken out one of them that night. The
immobilizer turned a potential $25K loss into a thousand dollar
problem. Disabling that system would be like de-barking a dog that
had just scared away burglars. Wouldn't be prudent.

Good point. The proposed solutions aren't for everyone. You have to consider
whether living in a slum where you are constantly plagued with car thieves
and burglars outweighs the cost and aggravation of a lost key.

MY spare key is bolted behind the license plate (shhh! don't tell anyone).

"Robert Green" wrote in message
...
"SRN" wrote in message
...

"Robert Green" wrote in message
...
"Pete C." wrote in message news:4ea80250$0$28458
.

What do you program a key with? I have a lot of slots on my PC, but no
car
keyholes. (-:

I'd prefer to pay $8 instead of $80, obviously, but it depends on what
a
programmer costs. What's the deal?



The vehicle itself does the programming with you inserting the two
programmed keys, and then the new, unprogrammed key. Here's a video
showing
how:


http://fullerisford.wordpress.com/20...ord-pats-keys/

Way cool. I have no idea if that works for a 2002 Chrysler or where I'd
get a blank from, but it does give me a good idea of what to look for.
Thanks!


It's almost identical for Chrysler & Jeep - very easy - but you have to do
it exactly as described. Sometimes, it will take several tries before you
get it right - Been There Done That

http://www.ehow.com/how_7177296_prog...nder-keys.html

There are several sellers on Ebay that sell Chrysler/Jeep security keys

On Oct 25, 8:24*am, "Robert Green" wrote:
A question for the locksmiths he

Would a locksmith be able to get me started if I somehow lost the RF chipped
key that starts my car? *This is a 2002 Chrysler minivan with a device in
the steering column called an "immobilser" (and spelled that way, too) that
will turn the starter but not engage the engine unless the chipped key is
near the steering column. *Do they have the tools to re-create that kind of
key on-site or what? *I know locksmiths can duplicate the key, but they have
the original to start with.

I want to figure out if it's worth buying and hiding a spare key for inside
the van somewhere (far enough away not to activate the immobilizer).

TIA,

--
Bobby G.

If you are concerned get a spare now and hide it in your car. I think
the only place you can get them is from the dealer.You can get a key
made that doesnt have the chip that can open the door almost anywhere.
If you dont have the no chip spare a locksmith can still pick the door
locks fairly easily to get you in the car. The chip has to be very
close to the lock for it to work.

Jimmie