Date: Sunday, May 04, 2003 7:40 AM

Ice Storm 2003
NYS, USA
Lessons Learned

April 03, Thursday, 2003
News radio people were talking about freezing rain coming.
I decided I wasn't going to go any where, the weather was
actually pretty good until dark. I could hear the rain
all night.
** Lesson: When the radio people talk about weather, go
immediately to buy groceries and gas up the vehicle. And
the gas cans. Better than that is to keep groceries at
home, and couple gallons gas in the shed.

April 04, Friday, 2003
Freezing rain and mixed rain at night. Went out in the
morning, it was slippery on the porch and steps. I threw down
some salt, that helped a lot. Took a long time to scrape
the ice off my truck. I have power.

Called my parents. Their power had gone out about 2 AM last
night. Which really surprises me. I'm out in the country, they
are in a suburb. They seldom have power cuts. Dad had put his
big lantern flash light on the kitchen table, and pointed it
towards the ceiling for light. He also went to the cellar
to wire the generator into the furnace. Dad got the generator
out, and had it running for a moment or two. And
then the motor jammed, and the pull cord won't pull. He decided
about 6 PM that it was cold enough to need a fire in the
fireplace, and about that moment the power came back on.
** Lesson: Run the generator every year, even if you're sure
it works fine.

Got a call from Jason, a bachelor friend of mine. Jason is blind,
so he wasn't sure if the lights were out. I suggested he try the
microwave, and the fan over the stove. Both of them dead.
His power is out. But the natural gas was OK. He was low
on groceries, so we planned to go for lunch and shopping.
** Lesson: Keep groceries in the house. Shop before you run out.

I called a bunch of people from church, and other friends.
Several people were without power, but they were all "doing OK".
Radio news guys say about 50,000 people without power.
** Lesson: Call a few people and get the word out. But don't
spend
all day on the telephone trying to be nice to people. You're
wasting your time.

I thought to call the restaurant. The diner Jason and I
usually go to was without power. Saved a trip. since the
phone is working, much easier to call and ask if they have
power. I did manage to find a grocery store which had power.
And an eat in cafe.
** Lesson: During power cuts, telephone to see if the restaurant
or stores are open.


I loaded bags of salt and gravel into the back of my truck,
figured that would be the major need. I took out my heating and
AC tools. I drove to Jason's. The trip took about twice as long
as usual, I drive very slow in bad weather. Many traffic lights
were out. But regardless of anything else, the State Thruway had
power, and was still collecting tolls. Hmm.
** Lesson: Travel takes twice as long in storms. And the State
still wants their highway tolls.


The parking lot was very slippery. And we got freezing rained on.
But it was nice to get him home with groceries. We got food that
would cook on a gas range, the microwave won't work without
power.
He also bought four submarine sandwiches, which was a great idea.
"no cook" food.

We got back to Jason's house, and his dad suggested that he go to
the firehall, they have power there, and Jason could be safe and
warm. I headed for home. By this time, I was cold and tired from
braving the weather.

I headed home, very slowly. As I was coming into the trailer
park, it sure did look darker than usual. I mean, totally dark.
Arrived home 7 PM to find that the power had gone out at 5:53. I
have an old Westclox mechanical dial face plug in clock. I keep
this old retro clock so that I know when the power goes out. The
hands stop. This may be old technology, but it's very useful.
** Lesson: Just because you have power NOW doesn't mean you will
have power LATER. And others may have power now, but not later.
Keep a written list when you make phonecalls to check on people.
Leave lots of space next to or between their names on the list
for
updates Things change, and you will want to revise your notes.

My neighbor Al was standing out by the street, watching
everything.
He had a 2D Eveready flash light which was growing very dim. I
offered him a couple batteries, but he didn't want them. Al told
me
the neighborhood news. There was a branch down behind our
trailers,
and we went out to look. The branch was balanced on the power
wires.
I realize that Al is the "Neighborhood Watchman". He is the man
who
knows who has power, and so on.
** Lesson: Most neighborhoods have a Watchman who wants to know
everyone's business. This surprised me, I thought Ernie was our
watchman, but he stayed indoors and out of sight most of the
time.

Across the street, I visited Ursula, who is elderly. Kenny (who
lives
across the street from me) was also visiting. He and his wife are
doing OK with a couple burners on the stove. Kenny wishes he
still
had his kerosene heater. I considered the problem. The Spirit
said
it didn't matter if I offered to loan him one of mine. I didn't.

Ursula, elderly and frail, was very cold. I visited briefly.
Ursula
was wrapped in a blanket, white and shivering. She was worried
about
carbon monoxide from the burners on the stove, but more worried
about it being cold. I offered to run her furnace off my
generator,
but she didn't want that. Seemed to her to be too dangerous. She
aparently doesn't know much about electric.

Ernie, on the other side of me, had a coleman lantern, and was
doing
fairly well. Coleman fuel is supposed to pour out monoxide,
nearly
as bad as charcoal. He lived to tell about it, though. He said he
had a generator coming from the fire hall. He wasn't going to
wire
it into the furnace, he was going to run an electric space
heater
with the generator. Wow, that's guaranteed to drink gasoline for
the generator. 1500 watt space heater instead of a 700 watt
furnace blower.

Skip, the truck driver, wasn't home at the moment.

I went home to work the phone. Everyone seems to be OK. One gal I
talked to started a sentence "if it gets too cold" and I expected
her to say "you can come over here". But to my disappointement,
she just reminded me that we had a couple church meetings
tomorrow, and
I could go to the church to warm up. Dan's house is covered in
ice, and
so he's out in the garage assembling the generator they bought in
March
1999. Needs something to do.
** Lesson: Not everyone out there welcomes you, and wants to
invite
you over. Remember who invites you over, they are your friends.
Remember who calls YOU, because they are really your friends.

More telephone calls. I reminded a lot of people "have generator
will
travel" but no one was interested.
** Lesson: Don't waste a lot of time on the phone offering to
give
your services away.

I lit my kerosene heater, and went to bed. I listned at the back
door
for a few minutes. The darkness combined with the sound of
branches
cracking and popping around the neighborhood. It was spooky.
** Lesson: No matter how comfortable you are, Mother Nature is
still
very powerful.


Saturday April 05, 2003
Woke up to the sound of branches popping. I looked out the door,
and
realzie that a lot of the noise was pieces of ice falling off the
trees. It was 60F in my bedroom. Not bad, at all. I use my
setback
thermostat to run it down to 64 at night, so I'm used to that.
Got up,
and pour the bath tub full of warm water, and warm up that way.
Gas water
heater is a good thing to have. Natural gas is very dependable
around
here. Breakfast. Still have milk and some ice cubes.
** Lesson: Ice cubes and refrigeration are wondeful. In the
winter you
can put your milk out on the back step.

Radio says 67K people without power. Someone found a creative way
to
warm the house. He hooked a garden hose to his laundry sink, and
snaked
the hose indoors, through the rooms of his house. Ran hot water
slowly
through the hose, and into a drain. The hot water hose helped
warm the
house. Very clever. Must remember that.

I had breakfast, and decided to try to find something useful to
do.
At about 7:30 AM, the tree guys came down the street. Saw up
branches,
and feed them into the chipper behind the truck. One of my
neighbors
had a branch fall through the back window of the son's car. I had
no
damage to my trailer or vehicles.

I talked to Skip today. He had a battery radio, but no batteries.
He
also has a gas range, but no pots or pans. I went home, and got
him
a pan out of my camping kit, and some batteries for his radio.

I mentioned gasoline to Skip, and he told me which gas stations
had
power today. The van was low on gas, so I threw two gascans in
the back
and took them along. I found a gas station which had power, and
long
lines of cars waiting to gas up. I got in line. At 1.73, I was
able to
fill the two gascans, and then put some in the tank before the
pump shut
me down at $50. But it sure is nice to have some gasoline. But
fifty
bucks! Wow!

I made a few more calls, and found one friend of mine who had
borrowed a Honda generator from his brother, and the generator
refused to start. Went there, and it started with a shot of ether
on the air cleaner. Can't kill a Honda. It was very quiet, too.
He had sent his son to go fill up the gascan, and the Suburban.
His son came back much later, there was a very long line of cars
waiting to buy gasoline.
** Lesson: Stock several cans of ether starting spray at home.
You may need it.

I learn that the reason he needed a generator is because the
cellar had about two inches water. Rain coming in, and the sump
pump won't work without electric. They were able to move some of
the water by buckets, but that the water was coming in faster
than
they could carry it out. Another friend let them use a 12 volt
sump
pump which wasn't doing much good. The fire department came down
the street at that moment. They let us plug into their generator
to run the sump. Finally, we did get cellar pumped. They also
have a
Bissel carpet cleaner which we used to extract water out of the
cellar
carpet. The carpet is a total loss, no surprise.

While in the dark cellar, I blew the bulb on my 2AA minimag. Had
to find my way out of the cellar, and up to the truck to get
another
bulb. I've been considering the Opalec conversion, to make my
mini mag
work on LED light bulbs.
[It was daytime, so I had enough light to get out. I did try the
Opalec,
which at $28 is much the same as Nite Ize that is now at Walmart
for
$4.97. It is better than filament bulbs. Less light, but more
dependable.
Since then, I got the Terra-Lux conversion which is far superior
to
either the filament bulbs or the LED conversion. But more pricey
$30]

I also wired a plug into the furnace wiring, and they can now run
the furnace on the generator.
** Lesson: Even if the home owner has tools, go get your own tool
box. Sure is faster if you know what tools you have, and all the
wirenuts and parts.

About this time, some friends came over. Their house has power on
one leg
of the incoming. The furnace is on the dead side. I went to go
exchange
a couple breakers, and put the furnace onto the power.

We did get a dinner invite with one of his sons, whose family has
power. That was much appreciated.

I came home and tried using a fluorescent lantern that takes 6 D
cells.
I learn that recharged carbon batteries are near to useless, they
only
last a couple hours. Resolved to buy only alkaline batteries.

Sunday April 06, 2003
Decided to go to the city to attend church. One of the chapels
had
power. Many traffic lights are without power. People are mostly
courteous, and treating them all as four way stops (as the law
requires). Stopped at my parents to use the computer and wash
laundry.
I made a couple phone calls, and it turns out my lunch invite had
been
delayed. The Spirit said to visit a couple friends. I did, and
found
them cold in the house, it was 40F in his living room. He was
wearing
his winter coat indoors.

Radio says that up to 145,000 people are without power. Three or
four
counties have been declared "state of emergency, no unnecessary
travel".

Went to my dinner invite, which was wonderful. And then went home
to get my generator. And no big surprise, my generator wouldn't
start.
I'd bought it in early 1999, and had run it, and then put it in
the
box and had not run it since then. I gave it a shot of ether, on
the
air filter, and it ran for one second. So, several shots of ether
later, the carb diaphram started to deliver gas.

Went to Scott's and wired the generator into his furnace. About
an
hour's run time, and the living room and rest of the house came
up
from 40F to 69F, which was major improvement.

I got home about 11 PM to find my own house about 47. I lit the
kerosene, and it was about 52 in my bedroom by the time I went to
bed.
I didn't want to run my generator at 11 PM and wake the
neighbors.
I tried to heat the house by running the shower on full hot with
the
bathroom door open. it was nice, but I set off the smoke
detector, and
had to take the battery out for about an hour. It is a 2001 dated
battery, I've got to change that some day.

Monday April 07, 2003
Woke to find it very cold in the trailer. I decided that if I
could
run the generator for others, I could run it for myself, too. I
got
my box of electrical tools, and wired the furnace. I put the
generator
out on the porch, and chained it to the railing. An hour of
generator
allowed me to check my email, and also to warm the house a bit.

I went to ask the neighbors if they would like me to wire into
their
funaces, and warm them up. Al had a kerosene heater, and said his
trailer was warm from end to end. I notice though that he didn't
at
any point ask if I was OK, and would I like to come in and get
warm.
Ursula said she didn't want a wire across the street. Ernie said
he
had a generator from the firehall, and he was OK. Skip had gone
to go find a warm mall to visit.

The generator runs for about an hour and a half on a tank of gas.
It was long enough to warm the house, but not that it was running
all
night.

The friend with the 40F house where I was last night didn't have
a
telphone. I considered whether to drive up, the Spirit said that
it
was personal choice, but not needed. So, I drove up there to see
if
he was OK. I found a note on the door, they had gone to a
shelter,
and weren't home. Well, that explains the promptings.

I pulled out the cell phone, and made a few more calls. Didn't
find
anyone else who wanted use of a generator.

Went home, and powered up the furnace for my night sleep.


Tues April 08, 2003
This AM, decided to go to the bank, and a couple stores. I found
the Dollar Tree had sold out of D, and AA batteries. But they had
plenty of 9 volt and C cells.
** Lesson: Keep batteries at home. Also, buy some flash lights
that
run on C-cells, since they don't sell out as fast. Mag and Kel
have
lights that run on C-cells, and American Science and Surplus used
to have C-cell flash lights ( www.sciplus.com ).

I had a sense that I oughta plug the furnace back into the house
power
before I left to go to the store. I got home, and was about to
pour
gas into the generator when Skip came home and cheered. The power
is
back on. I plugged the furnace back into the power, and got back
on
the computer.


This writing is public domian, and may be copied, distributed,
etc.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
www.mormons.org
..
..

During the 2003 power cut, I found one of my major shortcomings
was air movement. The gas range did a nice job heating the
kitchen, but not any of the rest of the trailer. Since then I've
got a trolling battery, and an inverter. So that I can run some
low wattage lights, and also fans to move the heat around.

--

Christopher A. Young
You can't shout down a troll.
You have to starve them.
..

"Jim Rusling" wrote in message
g...
:
: I have two deep cycle batteries with small inverters that will
run the
: TV and computer for several hours. I also have a 4 KW
generator that
: will take care of the heat, refrigerator, and freezer; as well
as the
: neighbors.
: --
: Jim Rusling
: More or Less Retired
: Mustang, OK
: http://www.rusling.org

I'd not thought of washing laundry before the storm. But you're
right, that needs electric.

Normally I carry a flash light in my pocket, and have one or two
in the house where I know I can find them in the dark.

--

Christopher A. Young
You can't shout down a troll.
You have to starve them.
..

"Janet Baraclough" wrote in message
...
:
: Because that bad storm was forecast, before it started I'd
run the
: laundry through the machine, made sure we had spare radio and
torch
: batteries, fitted fresh candles into their holders, and fetched
the gas
: camp stoves into the kitchen. If we get blacked out by
surprise, all
: those are always kept in the same place so we can find them in
pitch
: dark. I have oil lamps too but seldom bother with those. We
normally use
: those radio phones which don't work in a power cut, but the old
plug-in
: one does so I got that out and plugged it in.
:
:
: Janet.
:
:

I'm with you, that the first two days of my power cut were an
adventure in camping in. By the third day, the coldness had
soaked into the very center of my trailer, and it was really
getting miserable. If I'd not had the generator to run the
furnace, I would have had to move my matress into the kitchen and
live there.

Interesting about the summer and winter LPG. Much the same with
diesel road fuel, I've heard. A trucker going north with a tank
full of summer fuel might have jelly in the fuel lines when he
gets to some place cold.

--

Christopher A. Young
You can't shout down a troll.
You have to starve them.
..

"John Gilmer" wrote in message
...
:
:
: Oh, the first 48 hours is almost (and, in some respects,
literally) a
: picnic.
:
: It's the second and the start of the THIRD 48 hours when it
beings to get
: "old."
:
: That's what happened to us in the "Northern Neck" of VA when
Isabel hit the
: fan.
:
: We get 4-6 hour outages every time there are high winds or
significant snow.
: Ice storms can put out "off the grid" for a day.
:
: Unfortunately, our generator is just about impossible to start
when it's
: below 32F.
:
: And yes, we need electricity for our water and heat. We have
"back up" LPG
: heaters. Next on the "wish list" is a kerosene heater that
will also
: provide some light.
:
: AND we found out that hard way that LPG comes in a "winter mix"
and a
: "summer mix." The difference is that the "summer mix" only
provides
: enough gas pressure to make the regulator work when the tank is
over 70F.
:
: NB: LPG isn't necessarily pure propane. It's often a mixture
of propane
: and butane and "whatever."
:
:

Sounds like the old pot style oil heater. I've heard those are
dangerous.

Wall heaters (propane fuel) might not need electric. Harbor
Freight has some vented or not-vented wall heaters that use LP,
but not electric.

--

Christopher A. Young
You can't shout down a troll.
You have to starve them.
..

"Dean Hoffman" wrote in message
...
:
: What type of heater that does not need power?
:
: My parents had a Siegler stove in the living room of
their old
: farmhouse. It burned kerosene. No fan. I think one just
threw a bit
: of wadded up newspaper in the bottom to light it.
: I had a natural gas floor furnace in one house. No fan.
The
: thermostat ran off a thermocoupler type device, I think. It
looked
: like this: http://tinyurl.com/2zeweo
:
: Dean
:

On Sun, 25 Feb 2007 20:44:10 +0000 (UTC), Jonathan Grobe
wrote:

We just had a ice storm and I had no electricity for 22 hours. I
was mostly unprepared and didn't like the experience at all.

What are you doing to prepare for this?

Thanks.

I find this and the various responses fascinating. We went through
weeks without mains power after hurricane Wilma without any problem,
keeping the refrigerator powered, fans at night, hot water,
clotheswasher, electric chainsaw, lights, tv, etc. Didn't need AC,
but coulda had that too. I didn't even bother to go to a gas station
for a couple of weeks. Had planned for the event years ago.

When I lived up north, a barrel stove that I had made and installed in
the house served during power outages and was largely what kept us
toasty for all winter. The stuff in my car alone could have made
reasonable survival possible for at least a couple of days.

I must just be wired differently, I can't even consider the
possibility of not prepping for basic stuff like this.

Gather together a few basics:
a gallon of distilled water per person (it'll keep longer and can be
used to cleanse wounds)
a couple days worth of canned food - canned beef stew can be eaten
cold or hot and heated in the can. Peanut butter lasts a long time
and is high calorie
a good strong hunting knife
a blanket and/or space blanket
a good book (can also be used to start fires or as tp)
waterproof matches or lighter
a change of warm clothing - sometimes clothing gets wet
a half dozen candles for heating water and food, light, and starting
fires
any medicines
whatever else floats your boat.

I'll admit to being surprised. After reading your common sense
posts for so long on this group, I would have figured you for the
most prepared guy on the list.

OTOH, knowing your priorities demonstrates wisdom, which is a far
greater trait.

--

Christopher A. Young
You can't shout down a troll.
You have to starve them.
..

"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
...
:
: I keep some candles, flashlights, kerosene lamps around, I keep
the propane
: bottles filled so we can grill if we want, but since we have a
gas range,
: only the oven is affected. City water is not a problem either.
If I lived
: in a very rural area I'd have a generator. In my entire life,
only after
: Hurricane Gloria were we without power for about 30 hours.
Longest time
: otherwise is maybe an hour. Give that 60 year history I can't
justify
: spending a lot of money for equipment.
:
:

I've been noticing that power cuts are ever so much more common.
That may very well be why. I'd not thought of that. Thank you.

--

Christopher A. Young
You can't shout down a troll.
You have to starve them.
..

"Frank" wrote in message
oups.com...

: My house has a well and sump pump which are critical. First
thing I did
: when I bought the house 18 months ago was to buy a 6 kW
gasoline powered
: generator, and had an electrician install a 10 breaker panel
in my basement
: and an external outlet to connect the generator to the panel.
I selected
: the 10 most critical circuits to run on the generator,
including the well
: pump, the sump pump, the fridge, and my oil furnace. I also
keep 10 gallons
: of gas in the garage. Haven't had an outage yet, but I can
sleep at night.
:
:
: I did same. Generator and panel have been in place one year
and used
: 3 times with longest outage 20 hours. It is my opinion that
the power
: infrastructure has been deteriorating over the years. We live
in a
: treed area and power company has been saving money on tree
cutting.
: Just about whole neighborhood has generators.
:
: Frank
:

Then how do you fill the tub after the power goes out?

--
Steve Barker




"betsyb" wrote in message
...
Yes it does. We live in a mobile home park, "God's Waitingroom"

--
"Anybody can have more birthdays, but it takes balls to get old!"

BetsyB

4 hours!? you're kidding, right? We have those monthly. No action
required.

--
Steve Barker




"BR" wrote in message
...
Jonathan Grobe wrote:
We just had a ice storm and I had no electricity for 22 hours. I
was mostly unprepared and didn't like the experience at all.

What are you doing to prepare for this?

Thanks.


Where I live, we have 4 hour outages nearly every year. Not long enough
to lose food in the freezer, but long enough to be annoying, so I
installed a 15 KVA diesel generator, complete with automatic transfer
switch, which runs off the same #2 fuel oil that the "conventional"
heating system runs on. The longest that I had to be on backup power was
24 hours. In theory, I could run off the generator for a month before
needing more fuel delivered.

Before I had the generator, I would use the old "spring box" which was the
water supply for the place before the deep well was installed for a water
backup. You have to boil the spring box water before drinking, but it's
OK as it is for flushing toilets and the like.
--
Remove the TOS star ship captain to reply.

gas floor furnace,
oil stove
kerosene heater
wood stove
bon fire

--
Steve Barker




"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
t...

"Shawn Hirn" wrote in message

Heating where I live is by oil, so I don't need
power to have my heat,

What type of heater that does not need power?

In article ,
says...
On Sun, 25 Feb 2007 18:47:13 -0600, Mark Lloyd
wrote:

BTW, a corded phone helped too (that was not out).


Good point!
Most of my phones say "Western Electric" on the handset and they work
fine in the dark.


Let me guess... Black? Rotary dial? With a non-coiled wire to
the handset? The kind of phone that will still function even
after a noo-cu-ler war?


--
Get Credit Where Credit Is Due
http://www.cardreport.com/
Credit Tools, Reference, and Forum

In article ,
says...

"Jonathan Grobe" wrote in message
...
We just had a ice storm and I had no electricity for 22 hours. I
was mostly unprepared and didn't like the experience at all.

What are you doing to prepare for this?

The first thing to do is to decide what you need to have (light, heat,
refrigerator, television, airconditioning...) and what you are prepared to
pay for it.


Television? "Need"? I've never owned one.

Well, OK, I am tempted to buy the smallest, cheapest
black-and-white TeeVee that can run on torch batteries. Like six
"C" size or whatever. Just to get updates if there is an
earthquake, etc.

The only other use for a TeeVee I can imagine is to check out the
local broadcast news, to compare their spin to the wider Google
News feed.

DVDs would just need a computer without broadcast reception
ability.


--
Get Credit Where Credit Is Due
http://www.cardreport.com/
Credit Tools, Reference, and Forum

In article
. net,
says...
Gil Faver wrote:
"Jonathan Grobe" wrote in message
...
We just had a ice storm and I had no electricity for 22 hours. I
was mostly unprepared and didn't like the experience at all.

What are you doing to prepare for this?


I prepared for this by living in California.


Right, because California is the least likely state to have a natural
disaster.


Maybe "prepared for this by living in California" meant
developing a general attitude of preparedness.

It sure helped me. Especially being there during a major
earthquake.

And I live in another earthquake risk zone, even now.


--
Get Credit Where Credit Is Due
http://www.cardreport.com/
Credit Tools, Reference, and Forum

I have my own well. When the power goes - so does the well pump. I keep 3
five gallon buckets filled with water (and lids on them) in the bathroom for
emergency flushing. since I live alone, that is ample unless the power
outage is a very long one. I also keep a minimum of 12 two liter bottles
filled with water for drinking and cooking and washing, teeth, etc. My
stove is propane and can be lit with a match for cooking.

My biggest problem, at this time of year, is heat. In the past - during 2
ice storms, a kerosene heater in the living room was adequate. Power out 5
days each time.

Keep a stock of canned foods and dry foods that take little water to
prepare. A few weeks supply of medications on hand at all times as well as
simple first aid and common OTC meds. Flashlights and batteries - and also
non battery type flashlights.

JonquilJan

--
Learn something new every day
As long as you are learning, you are living
When you stop learning, you start dying
Steve Barker wrote in message
...
Why fill the bathtub? Does a power failure cause your water to quit?

--
Steve Barker




"betsyb" wrote in message
...
We usually fill the bath tub with cold water. Nearby for flushing. Handy
for cooking if you have a gas stove. I have one kerosene lamp.
Flashlights
and batteries for a small portable radio.
I ususally light the oven and place a pot of water on top.. Stay out of
the freezer if possible. Know what you need from the fridge before
opening
the door. Five years in AK will teach you all these things.

dkhedmo wrote:

Gil Faver wrote:
"Jonathan Grobe" wrote:
We just had a ice storm and I had no electricity for 22 hours. I
was mostly unprepared and didn't like the experience at all.

What are you doing to prepare for this?

I prepared for this by living in California.

Right, because California is the least likely state to have a natural
disaster.

We rarely have lethal weather, at least for humans. Quakes happen every
once in a while, as do snowstorms, but so far most have provided personal
entertainment rather than terror. Electricity was off for a number of hours
while they spliced the mall across the street into the system. Cable has
been out longer than that. Biggest nuisance is the goddam Rose Parade,
which lasts for DAYS.

Karen, who lived in the Bay area for 13 years

SoCal for 65.

--
Cheers,
Bev
================================================== ====================
"Steve Balmer, CEO of Microsoft[0], recently referred to LINUX as a
cancer. Unsurprisingly, that's incorrect; LINUX was released on August
25th, 1991 and is therefore a virgo." -- Kevin L

On Sun, 25 Feb 2007 20:41:21 -0600, "Steve Barker"
wrote:

Then how do you fill the tub after the power goes out?

Good qustion. But I think they are referring to times that something
like a hurricane is predicted, and people can do last minute
preparations before it hits.

Jim Yanik wrote in
:

Jonathan Grobe wrote in
:

We just had a ice storm and I had no electricity for 22 hours. I
was mostly unprepared and didn't like the experience at all.

What are you doing to prepare for this?

Thanks.


I have a couple of battery-powered fluorescent lights,more LED
flashlights,a charcoal grill for cooking.

If you have a home,you could get a generator,couple of KW at least,and
keep some gasoline on hand to run it.That will keep your fridge cold
and food unspoiled,run a TV/radio,fans in hot weather.You need a big
generator to run AC or heating,and then a power transfer box is best
and safest to couple the gen to your home wiring.

I live in an apartment,so there are some things I can't do.


I forgot to add that a propane camping stove or gas grill would be very
useful.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

"Michael Black" wrote in message ...
"Steve Barker" ) writes:
Why fill the bathtub? Does a power failure cause your water to quit?

The pumps at the filtration plant stop working if the outage is bad
enough. At the very lest, it results in contaminated water.

Michael

I wonder what's in all those towers that look like giant golf balls.
If the outage is bad enough, will gravity stop working?

Don

Mark Lloyd wrote:
On Sun, 25 Feb 2007 20:44:10 +0000 (UTC), Jonathan Grobe
wrote:

We just had a ice storm and I had no electricity for 22 hours. I
was mostly unprepared and didn't like the experience at all.


The last one we had that long here was when it was really cold (icy
out). I was glad to have a gas water heater.

BTW, a corded phone helped too (that was not out).

Years ago, I used to have this Sony cordless phone that had two
identical batteries: one in the phone, and one in the base. The
charger was in the base, so the idea was that when the phone battery
gets low, you swap them. This had a number of benefits:

(1) You don't have to hang up the phone when the battery dies.
The phone was actually built so it would hold the call for
a good 30 or 60 seconds while you switched batteries out.
(2) With the old NiCd batteries, the memory effect was still
significant and you wanted to discharge batteries all the
way whenever possible. This made that easy.
(3) When there was a power outage, the battery in the base could
power the unit and you could still talk in style on your
cordless phone, unlike all the suckers that had to revert
to using an old-fashioned phone with a cord.

Of course, like all Sony products, one day it just stopped working
for no apparent reason.

- Logan

Steve Barker wrote:
Then how do you fill the tub after the power goes out?

The subject line of this thread is "Preparing for Power Outages", so
I guess that implies you have advanced notice. :-)

- Logan

On Mon, 26 Feb 2007 00:03:59 -0500, "Don K"
wrote:

"Michael Black" wrote in message ...
"Steve Barker" ) writes:
Why fill the bathtub? Does a power failure cause your water to quit?

The pumps at the filtration plant stop working if the outage is bad
enough. At the very lest, it results in contaminated water.

Michael

I wonder what's in all those towers that look like giant golf balls.

Regular size golf balls.

If the outage is bad enough, will gravity stop working?

No. That's why the driving ranges keep operating.

Don

Now, where do I sign up to have the power company give me notice? LMAO!

--
Steve Barker




"Logan Shaw" wrote in message
...
Steve Barker wrote:
Then how do you fill the tub after the power goes out?

The subject line of this thread is "Preparing for Power Outages", so
I guess that implies you have advanced notice. :-)

- Logan

On Sun, 25 Feb 2007 23:56:38 -0600, Logan Shaw
wrote:

Mark Lloyd wrote:
On Sun, 25 Feb 2007 20:44:10 +0000 (UTC), Jonathan Grobe
wrote:

We just had a ice storm and I had no electricity for 22 hours. I
was mostly unprepared and didn't like the experience at all.


The last one we had that long here was when it was really cold (icy
out). I was glad to have a gas water heater.

BTW, a corded phone helped too (that was not out).

Years ago, I used to have this Sony cordless phone that had two
identical batteries: one in the phone, and one in the base. The
charger was in the base, so the idea was that when the phone battery
gets low, you swap them. This had a number of benefits:

(1) You don't have to hang up the phone when the battery dies.
The phone was actually built so it would hold the call for
a good 30 or 60 seconds while you switched batteries out.
(2) With the old NiCd batteries, the memory effect was still
significant and you wanted to discharge batteries all the
way whenever possible. This made that easy.
(3) When there was a power outage, the battery in the base could
power the unit and you could still talk in style on your
cordless phone, unlike all the suckers that had to revert
to using an old-fashioned phone with a cord.

Of course, like all Sony products, one day it just stopped working
for no apparent reason.

Of course no matter how good the batteries or the design, a cordless
phone won't work in an AC power failure. The battery powers the
handset, but AC powers the "base station".

This is why God gave us wires.

- Logan

mm wrote:

On Sun, 25 Feb 2007 23:56:38 -0600, Logan Shaw
wrote:

Mark Lloyd wrote:
On Sun, 25 Feb 2007 20:44:10 +0000 (UTC), Jonathan Grobe
wrote:

We just had a ice storm and I had no electricity for 22 hours. I
was mostly unprepared and didn't like the experience at all.


The last one we had that long here was when it was really cold (icy
out). I was glad to have a gas water heater.

BTW, a corded phone helped too (that was not out).

Years ago, I used to have this Sony cordless phone that had two
identical batteries: one in the phone, and one in the base. The
charger was in the base, so the idea was that when the phone battery
gets low, you swap them. This had a number of benefits:

(1) You don't have to hang up the phone when the battery dies.
The phone was actually built so it would hold the call for
a good 30 or 60 seconds while you switched batteries out.
(2) With the old NiCd batteries, the memory effect was still
significant and you wanted to discharge batteries all the
way whenever possible. This made that easy.
(3) When there was a power outage, the battery in the base could
power the unit and you could still talk in style on your
cordless phone, unlike all the suckers that had to revert
to using an old-fashioned phone with a cord.

Of course, like all Sony products, one day it just stopped working
for no apparent reason.

Of course no matter how good the batteries or the design, a cordless
phone won't work in an AC power failure. The battery powers the
handset, but AC powers the "base station".

This is why God gave us wires.

That version on Sony and some of the Vtech phones would use the
battery in the base to power the base station. In my Vtech the base
battery is only good for about 4 hours.
--
Jim Rusling
More or Less Retired
Mustang, OK
http://www.rusling.org

On Mon, 26 Feb 2007 00:03:59 -0500, "Don K"
wrote:

"Michael Black" wrote in message ...
"Steve Barker" ) writes:
Why fill the bathtub? Does a power failure cause your water to quit?

The pumps at the filtration plant stop working if the outage is bad
enough. At the very lest, it results in contaminated water.

Michael

I wonder what's in all those towers that look like giant golf balls.
If the outage is bad enough, will gravity stop working?

Those "elephant balls" as they're known as around here are mainly fire
protection reservoirs for industrial and commercial sites. At a few
thousand to a few hundred thousand gallons' capacity, they're but a
drop in the bucket compared to the demand of even a small town.
Serious water storage tanks capable of supplying days worth of water
are measured in the multi-million gallon capacity. Our little town of
about 50k people recently built two 10 million gallon tanks that are
advertised to hold enough water for a few days. These tanks are
perhaps 50 ft tall and large enough in diameter to stage a dirt track
race in.

What elephant balls that aren't associated with fire protection are
basically surge tanks, designed to lengthen the cycle of pumps that
supply the water and help stabilize water pressure. One generally
doesn't want large pumps to cycle more often than once every couple of
hours, hence the surge tanks.

From very rusty memory, seems like the planners here use 500 gallons
per day per person as the design criteria for the water system. 500
or 100, can't recall which but I think 500.

John
---
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.neon-john.com
Cleveland, Occupied TN
Don't let your schooling interfere with your education-Mark Twain

On Sun, 25 Feb 2007 23:02:00 -0500, "JonquilJan"
wrote:

Flashlights and batteries - and also
non battery type flashlights.


I assume you meant lights such as shake or crank lights that don't
require battery replacement. Let me expand a little on that.

Shake lights (the ones you shake back and forth to charge either a
small battery or a super capacitor) are the rage now but once you try
to use one for any length of time you grow to loathe them. Shake til
yer arm goes numb for a few minutes of light.

The crank lights - lights that have a hand-cranked generator - are
much more practical. Wal-mart stocks a nice little LED crank light
that sells for under $10. It is similar to this one:

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...uct_id=5026270

but is rounder and longer and is un-branded ChiCom product.

I'm somewhat of a flashahaulic so I bought one just to see how it
worked. I'm impressed. Three 7mm white LEDs in the front with an
alternating switch that turns on either 1 or all three LEDs. A
minute's worth of casual cranking produces 10 minutes worth of light.
Probably closer to 20 minutes but I got bored timing it :-)

I've put one of these in each of my vehicles, by each door and in my
bedside table. This is in addition to my other more sophisticated
lights.

For my regular lights I've converted over to either HID (expensive) or
rechargeable lithium powered LED lights. This is my favorite and the
one that stays on my hip at all times.

http://www.qualitychinagoods.com/1x1...ded-p-466.html

This light uses selected Luxeon 5 watt LEDs driven to 8 watts and
powered by the 18650 lithium ion battery. This is the same battery
that is contained in most laptop batteries. It's robust, reliable and
lasts forever. For emergency use, the approx 10 year shelf life is a
major benefit, unlike NiMH batteries that quickly self-discharge.

Here are the batteries:

http://www.qualitychinagoods.com/ult...ted-p-524.html

This flashlight only uses one battery so the pair provides one in the
light and one in the charger. Speaking of which:

http://www.qualitychinagoods.com/dsd...670-p-265.html

is the one I use. Under $10 and comes with both 120 and 12vdc cords.
Plus it'll charge the rechargeable version of the CR123 lithium
battery.

One note of caution - This store is in Hong Kong and stuff is shipped
directly from there. They have no warranty service that I can tell,
as they quit answering email when I tried to get a bad cell replaced.
OTOH, products are so cheap from here compared to US prices that for
me it's worth the risk. There are several other Hong Kong companies
on the net selling the identical product but I don't have experience
with them.

The light that probably gets the most use is a 3 watt Luxeon LED
headlight from Amandotech.

http://www.amondotech.com/index.asp?...ROD&ProdID=872

This isn't exactly like mine, as mine is waterproof but this is what
they stock now. It uses two LIR123 rechargeable lithium ion
batteries. That charger I mentioned above will charge them.

This is a superb light. Pure white light with a very well defined
spot. It beats the socks off my miner's light with the huge belt
mounted battery in brightness and with an extra set of batteries, in
battery life.

If you need to light up the whole end of the state, look at this:

http://www.amondotech.com/index.asp?...ROD&ProdID=872

This is one of the brightest handheld lights on the market. I love
mine. It uses the same miniature High Intensity Discharge arc lamp as
is used on high end cars such as Benz and Lexus. Despite the
brightness, the battery life is very good at about 2 hours.

It comes set up to throw a long narrow beam of light. For general
close in use over a larger area, a trick is to adhere some Saran wrap
to the lens. This diffuses the beam nicely.

What all of these lights have in common for emergency situations is
that the batteries have very long shelf lives. The lithiums will hold
most of their charge for 10 years, so it's claimed. I know that I
can't tell the difference in a just-charged battery and one that's
been in the light for a year. The SLA type battery in the HID light
is known for its long charge retention - several years at minimum.
Plus the light can be plugged into its charger and left that way
indefinitely.

John
---
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.neon-john.com
Cleveland, Occupied TN
Don't let your schooling interfere with your education-Mark Twain

On Sun, 25 Feb 2007 19:19:10 -0800,
wrote:

In article ,
says...
On Sun, 25 Feb 2007 18:47:13 -0600, Mark Lloyd
wrote:

BTW, a corded phone helped too (that was not out).


Good point!
Most of my phones say "Western Electric" on the handset and they work
fine in the dark.


Let me guess... Black? Rotary dial? With a non-coiled wire to
the handset? The kind of phone that will still function even
after a noo-cu-ler war?

70's style avocado green, coiled cord to the handset but hard wired,
not modular. Also hard wired to the wall connection. Installed by
The Phone Company when we got service to the place in 1972. Still
working like it was brand new. One does have to remember to tap the
microphone occasionally to loosen the carbon granules or else the
sound gets low and muffled. Other than that, yep, it'll still be
there after the Big One goes up.

I also have one of the stand-alone touch-tone pads for when that is
necessary. Also made by Western Electric, these were add-ons for dial
phones during the transition to touch-tone. Like the phone, it still
works perfectly.

I was once told by a Western Electric engineer that the design life
for these phones was 80 years. I believe it.

John
---
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.neon-john.com
Cleveland, Occupied TN
Don't let your schooling interfere with your education-Mark Twain

Per Frank:
It is my opinion that the power
infrastructure has been deteriorating over the years.

Deregulation.

The primary purpose of electric utility companies is now maximizing profit....
period.
--
PeteCresswell

Per Edwin Pawlowski:
What type of heater that does not need power?

Gas log in the fireplace.
--
PeteCresswell

In article ,
"(PeteCresswell)" wrote:

Per Frank:
It is my opinion that the power
infrastructure has been deteriorating over the years.

Deregulation.

The primary purpose of electric utility companies is now maximizing profit....
period.

Yep. Now repairs, etc., are underfunded because of profits, whereas
before it was underfunded because politicians did not want to tick off
their constituents so the Utility Commissions never raised rates.

Don K wrote:
"Michael Black" wrote in message ...
"Steve Barker" ) writes:
Why fill the bathtub? Does a power failure cause your water to quit?

The pumps at the filtration plant stop working if the outage is bad
enough. At the very lest, it results in contaminated water.

Michael

I wonder what's in all those towers that look like giant golf balls.
If the outage is bad enough, will gravity stop working?

Don


Gravity works just fine. But if they can't fill those
tanks they don't help much. Here in Eastern Oklahoma we
have had 2 major ice storms in 6 years. Many towns lost
water for several days at a time. Then water became a
jewel beyond price. It isn't fun living without lights,
heat, and water.

Lights tend to come back on much later than water. My
brother-in-law didn't get his lights back for 11 days.

Bill Gill

Anyone care to discuss the advantages of various lighting methods
(a bright light enough to read a book by which would last for
many, many hours) using kerosene, white gas, batteries...

--
Jonathan Grobe Books
Browse our inventory of thousands of used books at:
http://www.grobebooks.com

"Don K" ) writes:
"Michael Black" wrote in message ...
"Steve Barker" ) writes:
Why fill the bathtub? Does a power failure cause your water to quit?

The pumps at the filtration plant stop working if the outage is bad
enough. At the very lest, it results in contaminated water.

Michael

I wonder what's in all those towers that look like giant golf balls.
If the outage is bad enough, will gravity stop working?

So you get all your water from rain?

This is not a theoretical instance.

When we had an ice storm here in 1998, which brought down some of the
long distance power lines from the hydroelectric generators (and some of
the towers that held up those lines), it was said afterwards that we
were within hours of having no water. I can't remember whether they
were talking no filtered water or no water at all, but after the fact
they did say that if that had happened, an evacuation of this large
city was a possibility.

Michael

The Real Bev wrote:
dkhedmo wrote:

Gil Faver wrote:
"Jonathan Grobe" wrote:
We just had a ice storm and I had no electricity for 22 hours. I
was mostly unprepared and didn't like the experience at all.

What are you doing to prepare for this?

I prepared for this by living in California.
Right, because California is the least likely state to have a
natural disaster.

We rarely have lethal weather,
Five months of non-stop rain = mudslides blocking roads for weeks at a
time (ever been to Big Sur?) and houses slipping off hillsides yearly.
I'm sure plenty of people experience flooding, as well. The city of Napa
comes to mind.

Five months of non-stop rain + seven months of hot, dry summers =
wildfires/firestorms, which threaten/damaging multitudes of homes
yearly. The firestorm in the East bay was deadly, and the hillsides are
still scarred with areas that haven't yet been rebuilt.

I'm sure the people in the Sierras have few tales to tell about massive
snowfall and its effects.

Just to name a few.

Karen

Charles Quinn wrote:
Shawn Hirn wrote in news:srhi-C85B3E.18333625022007
@newsgroups.comcast.net:

In article ,
Jonathan Grobe wrote:

We just had a ice storm and I had no electricity for 22 hours. I
was mostly unprepared and didn't like the experience at all.

What are you doing to prepare for this?
Another than having a flashlight, nothing. If I lost power for that
long, I would simply read by flashlight if I was stuck at home, or if I
could go out, I would just go to my parents' house, my office at work,
or visit with friends. Heating where I live is by oil, so I don't need
power to have my heat, and even if I did, I would just go sleep at my
parents' house in their guest room.

How does the heat get out of the furnace, an oil powered fan?


OK, it could be an old gravity system, but how does the oil burner work
without electricity? All the oil burners I've ever worked on have a
motor and igniter that require electricity.

--
Remove the TOS star ship captain to reply.

Steve Barker wrote:
4 hours!? you're kidding, right? We have those monthly. No action
required.


Like I said, "long enough to be annoying", but no real big deal.
However I figured that one of these days we would have an extended
outage so I wanted to be ready for it.

--
Remove the TOS star ship captain to reply.

Jonathan Grobe wrote:
Anyone care to discuss the advantages of various lighting methods
(a bright light enough to read a book by which would last for
many, many hours) using kerosene, white gas, batteries...

There is a reason why people use electric lights. Burning things
is both dangerous and smelly.

Anthony

On Mon, 26 Feb 2007 01:24:18 -0600, Jim Rusling
wrote:



Of course no matter how good the batteries or the design, a cordless
phone won't work in an AC power failure. The battery powers the
handset, but AC powers the "base station".

This is why God gave us wires.

That version on Sony and some of the Vtech phones would use the
battery in the base to power the base station. In my Vtech the base
battery is only good for about 4 hours.

I didn't know that. I apologize for giving bad info. I even have
three cordless vtech phones that someone at a hamfest sold me for 2
dollars (wihtout batteries) and they have the battery in the base, but
I thought it was just to keep a spare one charging for the handset.

Unfortunately only two of the base stations work and only one of the
phones, and it sounds bad. Are V-tech phones cheap that they should
sound bad? Maybe I should try to fix one of the other phones or
improve the sound on this one.


Jim Rusling
More or Less Retired

Michael Black wrote:
"Don K" ) writes:
"Michael Black" wrote in message
...
"Steve Barker" ) writes:
Why fill the bathtub? Does a power failure cause your water to
quit?

The pumps at the filtration plant stop working if the outage is bad
enough. At the very lest, it results in contaminated water.

Michael

I wonder what's in all those towers that look like giant golf balls.
If the outage is bad enough, will gravity stop working?

So you get all your water from rain?

This is not a theoretical instance.

When we had an ice storm here in 1998, which brought down some of the
long distance power lines from the hydroelectric generators (and some
of the towers that held up those lines), it was said afterwards that
we were within hours of having no water. I can't remember whether
they were talking no filtered water or no water at all, but after the
fact they did say that if that had happened, an evacuation of this
large city was a possibility.

No it wasnt, it would always make more sense to cart in water instead.