I got a request for a couple thousand plant stakes this afternoon. They
need to be 5' long, fairly stiff but not very strong. Requester came in
with some .072 wire, not stiff enough, the .134 wire sample was over
kill. Something on the order of .109" to .125" would seem to be about
right. Galvanzied would be a plus, not required,

I don't want to deal with straightening a coil, don't want to sit and do
the cut off. Any thing come to mind where I could just buy it? I've
thought about trying to find a wire forming place, get it cut to length.
Fence place? Greenhouse supply? This would be 10,000' somewhere near 400
pounds so it would be a non trivial pile.

"RoyJ" wrote in message
m...
I got a request for a couple thousand plant stakes this afternoon. They need to
be 5' long, fairly stiff but not very strong. Requester came in with some .072
wire, not stiff enough, the .134 wire sample was over kill. Something on the
order of .109" to .125" would seem to be about right. Galvanzied would be a
plus, not required,

I don't want to deal with straightening a coil, don't want to sit and do the
cut off. Any thing come to mind where I could just buy it? I've thought about
trying to find a wire forming place, get it cut to length. Fence place?
Greenhouse supply? This would be 10,000' somewhere near 400 pounds so it would
be a non trivial pile.

Try wire forming companies, the kind that make pegboard hooks and such.
(unfortunately, 400 lbs. IS a trivial order)

RoyJ wrote:
I got a request for a couple thousand plant stakes this afternoon.

(...)

Way Out West we have PDM. These guys are great!
http://www.pdmsteel.com/index.html

They cut to size *and deliver* new steel for less money than the
surplus houses charge for drops.

Shamelessy stolen from their catalog:
"As demands for “pre-production processing” grew, new processing
equipment was installed at all facilities. Shears, automatic saws and
shape burning equipment that can burn in steel virtually anything
that can be drawn in two dimensions, are available. Plasma cutting
equipment allows shapes to be cut at high speed and in material
which is too thin to be cut with conventional flame cutting equipment.
Computer aided design and numerical control have made
possible the burning of shapes too large and complex to be laid out
on a drafting table, while at the same time allowing for the efficient
“nesting” of parts for reduced scrap loss."

What's not to like?

Download their catalog, would be my advice:
http://www.pdmsteel.com/PDF/pdm_cat2006c.pdf

Check the 1/8" cold finished round bar at the top of page 78,
for example.


--Winston

RoyJ wrote:

I got a request for a couple thousand plant stakes this afternoon. They
need to be 5' long, fairly stiff but not very strong. Requester came in
with some .072 wire, not stiff enough, the .134 wire sample was over
kill. Something on the order of .109" to .125" would seem to be about
right. Galvanzied would be a plus, not required,

I don't want to deal with straightening a coil, don't want to sit and do
the cut off. Any thing come to mind where I could just buy it? I've
thought about trying to find a wire forming place, get it cut to length.
Fence place? Greenhouse supply? This would be 10,000' somewhere near 400
pounds so it would be a non trivial pile.

You might look at the pre cut galvanized steel hanger wires sold for
suspended ceiling use, I believe they are 12ga and pre cut 6' lengths.

RoyJ wrote:
I got a request for a couple thousand plant stakes this afternoon. They
need to be 5' long, fairly stiff but not very strong. Requester came in
with some .072 wire, not stiff enough, the .134 wire sample was over
kill. Something on the order of .109" to .125" would seem to be about
right. Galvanzied would be a plus, not required,

I don't want to deal with straightening a coil, don't want to sit and do
the cut off. Any thing come to mind where I could just buy it? I've
thought about trying to find a wire forming place, get it cut to length.
Fence place? Greenhouse supply? This would be 10,000' somewhere near 400
pounds so it would be a non trivial pile.

What kind of plant can be supported by a thin wire like that? The stakes
I use in the garden are 6' and made from 1/2" conduit with a plastic
coating. The other stakes are 2" wood.

--
Steve W.

I think they are decorative grasses. These are grown in a greenhouse so
no issues with wind loading.

Steve W. wrote:
RoyJ wrote:
I got a request for a couple thousand plant stakes this afternoon.
They need to be 5' long, fairly stiff but not very strong. Requester
came in with some .072 wire, not stiff enough, the .134 wire sample
was over kill. Something on the order of .109" to .125" would seem to
be about right. Galvanzied would be a plus, not required,

I don't want to deal with straightening a coil, don't want to sit and
do the cut off. Any thing come to mind where I could just buy it?
I've thought about trying to find a wire forming place, get it cut to
length. Fence place? Greenhouse supply? This would be 10,000'
somewhere near 400 pounds so it would be a non trivial pile.

What kind of plant can be supported by a thin wire like that? The stakes
I use in the garden are 6' and made from 1/2" conduit with a plastic
coating. The other stakes are 2" wood.

BINGO!!!

I just got a quote from the local supplier. They come as 12 ga (.105")
wire 12 foot long in bundles of 141 pieces. I can hot saw them to either
4', 5' or 6' depending on how the project goes. They had 30,000 pieces
in stock about 4 miles from my office so turn around is not an issue.

Thanks!!!

Pete C. wrote:
RoyJ wrote:
I got a request for a couple thousand plant stakes this afternoon. They
need to be 5' long, fairly stiff but not very strong. Requester came in
with some .072 wire, not stiff enough, the .134 wire sample was over
kill. Something on the order of .109" to .125" would seem to be about
right. Galvanzied would be a plus, not required,

I don't want to deal with straightening a coil, don't want to sit and do
the cut off. Any thing come to mind where I could just buy it? I've
thought about trying to find a wire forming place, get it cut to length.
Fence place? Greenhouse supply? This would be 10,000' somewhere near 400
pounds so it would be a non trivial pile.

You might look at the pre cut galvanized steel hanger wires sold for
suspended ceiling use, I believe they are 12ga and pre cut 6' lengths.

On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 03:45:44 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm,
Winston quickly quoth:

RoyJ wrote:
I got a request for a couple thousand plant stakes this afternoon.

(...)

Way Out West we have PDM. These guys are great!
http://www.pdmsteel.com/index.html

They cut to size *and deliver* new steel for less money than the
surplus houses charge for drops.

I'll definitely have to check that out. I paid $20 for a stick of 5/8"
angle a few months ago. For larger projects, PDM might be the way to
go.


Computer aided design and numerical control have made
possible the burning of shapes too large and complex to be laid out
on a drafting table, while at the same time allowing for the efficient
“nesting” of parts for reduced scrap loss."

What's not to like?

Y'mean they can cut your pukey ducks (roosters, cowboys, and bulldog
cutouts) for ya now ? Shucks, gee whillikers, Mr. Winnie! gd&r


Download their catalog, would be my advice:
http://www.pdmsteel.com/PDF/pdm_cat2006c.pdf

That's an excellent catalog. I just printed it out on my color printer
(laser, couldn't afford an inkjet and will save it for reference on
available shapes/sizes. Plus, there is a very handy reference section
at the end.


----------------------------------
VIRTUE...is its own punishment
==================================

Larry Jaques wrote:

On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 03:45:44 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm,
Winston quickly quoth:

Way Out West we have PDM. These guys are great!
http://www.pdmsteel.com/index.html
I'll definitely have to check that out. I paid $20 for a stick of 5/8"
angle a few months ago. For larger projects, PDM might be the way to
go.

Ed Falk discovered that a local 'drop shop' got beat pricewise by
PDM recently:
"PDM had the best prices by far, $500 compared to Alan Steel's $840."
Though I understand he found Allied Iron to be more convenient at $650.

http://allied-iron.com/default.aspx
Belmont CA might be a bit of a commute for you though, Larry.


Y'mean they can cut your pukey ducks (roosters, cowboys, and bulldog
cutouts) for ya now ? Shucks, gee whillikers, Mr. Winnie! gd&r

Yup! Telescope tripods, Winch bases, and whimsical stuff like that there,
as well!

Download their catalog, would be my advice:
http://www.pdmsteel.com/PDF/pdm_cat2006c.pdf


That's an excellent catalog. I just printed it out on my color printer
(laser, couldn't afford an inkjet

pobricito!

...and will save it for reference on
available shapes/sizes. Plus, there is a very handy reference section
at the end.

Did I mention they are great people?
I have no connection other than being one happy customer.

--Winston

I found one of the wire forming shops would run coil stock through a
rotary straightener, then cut to length for right around $1 per pound of
"bright wire" stock. That is a close to the what I pay for 2"
rectangular tubing and similar. Dropped the price of a 5' piece of 11 ga
down to $.13 That's for the 5' piece NOT per foot! I have no idea how
he is going to make any money on the order.

Samples are in the truck, order to be confirmed in the AM.

RoyJ wrote:
I got a request for a couple thousand plant stakes this afternoon. They
need to be 5' long, fairly stiff but not very strong. Requester came in
with some .072 wire, not stiff enough, the .134 wire sample was over
kill. Something on the order of .109" to .125" would seem to be about
right. Galvanzied would be a plus, not required,

I don't want to deal with straightening a coil, don't want to sit and do
the cut off. Any thing come to mind where I could just buy it? I've
thought about trying to find a wire forming place, get it cut to length.
Fence place? Greenhouse supply? This would be 10,000' somewhere near 400
pounds so it would be a non trivial pile.

RoyJ wrote:

I found one of the wire forming shops would run coil stock through a
rotary straightener, then cut to length for right around $1 per pound of
"bright wire" stock. That is a close to the what I pay for 2"
rectangular tubing and similar. Dropped the price of a 5' piece of 11 ga
down to $.13 That's for the 5' piece NOT per foot! I have no idea how
he is going to make any money on the order.

Who and where, please?

--Winston

On Fri, 11 Jul 2008 03:38:32 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm,
Winston quickly quoth:

Larry Jaques wrote:

On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 03:45:44 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm,
Winston quickly quoth:

Way Out West we have PDM. These guys are great!
http://www.pdmsteel.com/index.html
I'll definitely have to check that out. I paid $20 for a stick of 5/8"
angle a few months ago. For larger projects, PDM might be the way to
go.

Ed Falk discovered that a local 'drop shop' got beat pricewise by
PDM recently:
"PDM had the best prices by far, $500 compared to Alan Steel's $840."
Though I understand he found Allied Iron to be more convenient at $650.

http://allied-iron.com/default.aspx
Belmont CA might be a bit of a commute for you though, Larry.

True. Fresno and Stockton would be, too, by about 300 miles each way.


Y'mean they can cut your pukey ducks (roosters, cowboys, and bulldog
cutouts) for ya now ? Shucks, gee whillikers, Mr. Winnie! gd&r

Yup! Telescope tripods, Winch bases, and whimsical stuff like that there,
as well!

Oh, USEFUL pukey ducks. Got it.


Download their catalog, would be my advice:
http://www.pdmsteel.com/PDF/pdm_cat2006c.pdf


That's an excellent catalog. I just printed it out on my color printer
(laser, couldn't afford an inkjet

pobricito!

g
Instead of 6 months worth of ink cartridges ($200), I got a nice
little Samsung clp600n color laser printer when Staples had a $200
coupon. The only thing wrong with it are the smell and the noise. It
stinks as bad as a skunk (which I don't really mind) and sounds like a
jet fighter idling next to me (NO NOIS print engine my ass.) I only
turn it on to print. The output is lovely, though, and it's fast.


...and will save it for reference on
available shapes/sizes. Plus, there is a very handy reference section
at the end.

Did I mention they are great people?
I have no connection other than being one happy customer.

Bueno, bwana. Muchos garcias, senior.

----------------------------------
VIRTUE...is its own punishment
==================================

Larry Jaques gravely intoned:
On Fri, 11 Jul 2008 03:38:32 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm,
Winston quickly quoth:


Larry Jaques wrote:


On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 03:45:44 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm,
Winston quickly quoth:

http://allied-iron.com/default.aspx
Belmont CA might be a bit of a commute for you though, Larry.


True. Fresno and Stockton would be, too, by about 300 miles each way.

Heck, I'd call PDM anyways. Those guys are resourceful.
Perhaps they're aware of a supplier more local to you.
Couple years ago they delivered a couple sticks of 1-1/2" box
tube to my residential side yard. Almost No Money for a 30 mile
round trip.

I was embarrassed the order was so small. Their truck driver
treated me like I was their best customer though.
That sort of attitude is nearly as easy to remember as the other kind
of attitude.

(...)

Oh, USEFUL pukey ducks. Got it.

UPDs Exactly!

(...)

g
Instead of 6 months worth of ink cartridges ($200), I got a nice
little Samsung clp600n color laser printer when Staples had a $200
coupon. The only thing wrong with it are the smell and the noise. It
stinks as bad as a skunk (which I don't really mind) and sounds like a
jet fighter idling next to me (NO NOIS print engine my ass.) I only
turn it on to print. The output is lovely, though, and it's fast.

Yup, I was at Xerox when they were developing the 'blazer' which was
a monochrome 'B' size laser printer. I got used to mine instantly.
It made beautiful schematics.

--Winston

On Fri, 11 Jul 2008 16:08:36 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm,
Winston quickly quoth:

Larry Jaques gravely intoned:
On Fri, 11 Jul 2008 03:38:32 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm,
Winston quickly quoth:


Larry Jaques wrote:


On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 03:45:44 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm,
Winston quickly quoth:

http://allied-iron.com/default.aspx
Belmont CA might be a bit of a commute for you though, Larry.


True. Fresno and Stockton would be, too, by about 300 miles each way.

Heck, I'd call PDM anyways. Those guys are resourceful.
Perhaps they're aware of a supplier more local to you.

Roger, wilco, and out.


Couple years ago they delivered a couple sticks of 1-1/2" box
tube to my residential side yard. Almost No Money for a 30 mile
round trip.

Cool.


I was embarrassed the order was so small. Their truck driver
treated me like I was their best customer though.
That sort of attitude is nearly as easy to remember as the other kind
of attitude.

That's precisely what keeps a company alive even during downturns.


(...)

Oh, USEFUL pukey ducks. Got it.

UPDs Exactly!

Just what the world needs: more acronyms!

----------------------------------
VIRTUE...is its own punishment
==================================

On Fri, 11 Jul 2008 05:21:18 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:


g
Instead of 6 months worth of ink cartridges ($200), I got a nice
little Samsung clp600n color laser printer when Staples had a $200
coupon. The only thing wrong with it are the smell and the noise. It
stinks as bad as a skunk (which I don't really mind) and sounds like a
jet fighter idling next to me (NO NOIS print engine my ass.) I only
turn it on to print. The output is lovely, though, and it's fast.

I like my Canon BJC 240 with the three cent refilled cartridges for
day to day printing. I buy the printers for up to three dollars,
provided there is a BJ-02 cartridge included, otherwise forget it.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

On Fri, 11 Jul 2008 16:08:36 GMT, Winston
wrote:


Heck, I'd call PDM anyways. Those guys are resourceful.
Perhaps they're aware of a supplier more local to you.
Couple years ago they delivered a couple sticks of 1-1/2" box
tube to my residential side yard. Almost No Money for a 30 mile
round trip.

I was embarrassed the order was so small. Their truck driver
treated me like I was their best customer though.
That sort of attitude is nearly as easy to remember as the other kind
of attitude.
It's called "customer service" and quite often results in something
that helps show a profit down the line.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

Ceiling hanger wire. Comes in 10 foot lengths already stretched
and straightened. Contact a local commercial drywall supply
house.

--
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)




"RoyJ" wrote in message
m...
I got a request for a couple thousand plant stakes this
afternoon. They need to be 5' long, fairly stiff but not very
strong. Requester came in with some .072 wire, not stiff enough,
the .134 wire sample was over kill. Something on the order of
.109" to .125" would seem to be about right. Galvanzied would be
a plus, not required,

I don't want to deal with straightening a coil, don't want to
sit and do the cut off. Any thing come to mind where I could
just buy it? I've thought about trying to find a wire forming
place, get it cut to length. Fence place? Greenhouse supply?
This would be 10,000' somewhere near 400 pounds so it would be a
non trivial pile.

Gerald Miller wrote:
(...)
I like my Canon BJC 240 with the three cent refilled cartridges for
day to day printing. I buy the printers for up to three dollars,
provided there is a BJ-02 cartridge included, otherwise forget it.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

Oh All RIGHT! I'll bite, Gerry, if nobody else will.

Where the heck do you find printers and cartridges so inexpensively?

--Winston

On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 16:37:56 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm,
Winston quickly quoth:

Gerald Miller wrote:
(...)
I like my Canon BJC 240 with the three cent refilled cartridges for
day to day printing. I buy the printers for up to three dollars,
provided there is a BJ-02 cartridge included, otherwise forget it.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

Oh All RIGHT! I'll bite, Gerry, if nobody else will.

Where the heck do you find printers and cartridges so inexpensively?

I believe they're old Roman or Goth machines, Winston. Or was that
DOS/Win3? Same/same.

----------------------------------
VIRTUE...is its own punishment
==================================

On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 16:37:56 GMT, Winston
wrote:

Gerald Miller wrote:
(...)
I like my Canon BJC 240 with the three cent refilled cartridges for
day to day printing. I buy the printers for up to three dollars,
provided there is a BJ-02 cartridge included, otherwise forget it.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

Oh All RIGHT! I'll bite, Gerry, if nobody else will.

Where the heck do you find printers and cartridges so inexpensively?

--Winston
Yard sales. Sally Ann thrift shop gave me two cartridges in original
packaging for $5. One church rummage sale yielded a BJC-240, BJC-250,
and a compaq luggable II (286) for a buck each.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 13:43:58 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 16:37:56 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm,
Winston quickly quoth:

Gerald Miller wrote:
(...)
I like my Canon BJC 240 with the three cent refilled cartridges for
day to day printing. I buy the printers for up to three dollars,
provided there is a BJ-02 cartridge included, otherwise forget it.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

Oh All RIGHT! I'll bite, Gerry, if nobody else will.

Where the heck do you find printers and cartridges so inexpensively?

I believe they're old Roman or Goth machines, Winston. Or was that
DOS/Win3? Same/same.

Course ten, you run into the seller who wants $50 for a BJC-200 with a
NIB cartridge dated 5 years ago and claims it is still worth the
retail price or will sell without the boxed cartridge for $30. Thanks,
but no thanks.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

Gerald Miller wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 16:37:56 GMT, Winston
wrote:

Gerald Miller wrote:
(...)
I like my Canon BJC 240 with the three cent refilled cartridges for
day to day printing. I buy the printers for up to three dollars,
provided there is a BJ-02 cartridge included, otherwise forget it.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada
Oh All RIGHT! I'll bite, Gerry, if nobody else will.

Where the heck do you find printers and cartridges so inexpensively?

--Winston
Yard sales. Sally Ann thrift shop gave me two cartridges in original
packaging for $5. One church rummage sale yielded a BJC-240, BJC-250,
and a compaq luggable II (286) for a buck each.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

I have one of those Compaqs myself. Not real lightweight but it still
functions. I actually use it running DOS with a couple radio programming
items.

--
Steve W.

Gerald Miller wrote:

Yard sales. Sally Ann thrift shop gave me two cartridges in original
packaging for $5. One church rummage sale yielded a BJC-240, BJC-250,
and a compaq luggable II (286) for a buck each.


You psid too much. I have about 100 printers I got for free, and
about 50 inkjet cartridges.


--
http://improve-usenet.org/index.html

If you have broadband, your ISP may have a NNTP news server included in
your account: http://www.usenettools.net/ISP.htm

Sporadic E is the Earth's aluminum foil beanie for the 'global warming'
sheep.

Gerald Miller wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 16:37:56 GMT, Winston
wrote:


Gerald Miller wrote:
(...)

I like my Canon BJC 240 with the three cent refilled cartridges for
day to day printing. I buy the printers for up to three dollars,
provided there is a BJ-02 cartridge included, otherwise forget it.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

Oh All RIGHT! I'll bite, Gerry, if nobody else will.

Where the heck do you find printers and cartridges so inexpensively?

--Winston

Yard sales. Sally Ann thrift shop gave me two cartridges in original
packaging for $5. One church rummage sale yielded a BJC-240, BJC-250,
and a compaq luggable II (286) for a buck each.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

O I C
Thanks!

--Winston

On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 23:04:10 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:



You psid too much. I have about 100 printers I got for free, and
about 50 inkjet cartridges.
But are the cartridges readily refillable? Printers are basically the
same as Blood Glucose meters, the manufacturers get their profit from
the consumables.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

Gerald Miller wrote:

But are the cartridges readily refillable?


Does Cliff crap in the woods? I have been re-inking ribbons and
refilling cartridges for over ten years.


Printers are basically the
same as Blood Glucose meters, the manufacturers get their profit from
the consumables.


That is why I get so many free printers. Some work, some need ink,
and some are damaged. Who cares, when you have five or six that are the
same model, and a dozen spare, refillable cartridges? Ny IBM 4019
printer finally died. I used it for over five years before the fuser
died, and I only had a total of $5 in it. I have another IBM / Lexmark
4019 in storage, so I'm not spending 275 for a fuser assembly. I have
repaired printers for over 20 years. My first was built from a pair of
Heathkit H-14 printers I bought for $30 at a hamfest in 1983. I still
have at least a half dozen spare print heads. It used the same
'Practical Automation' print head as some Diebold ATMs, and I used to
work next door to one of their service centers. Lots of good equipment
used to hit their dumpsters.

I keep a web page of spare printers & parts so I can check it from
anywhere. It lists the printer, interface, power supply, manuals and
drivers. There are lots of free printers & cartridges on the local
Freecycle groups.

--
http://improve-usenet.org/index.html

If you have broadband, your ISP may have a NNTP news server included in
your account: http://www.usenettools.net/ISP.htm

Sporadic E is the Earth's aluminum foil beanie for the 'global warming'
sheep.

On Sun, 13 Jul 2008 23:15:38 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


That is why I get so many free printers. Some work, some need ink,
and some are damaged. Who cares, when you have five or six that are the
same model, and a dozen spare, refillable cartridges? Ny IBM 4019
printer finally died. I used it for over five years before the fuser
died, and I only had a total of $5 in it. I have another IBM / Lexmark
4019 in storage, so I'm not spending 275 for a fuser assembly. I have
repaired printers for over 20 years. My first was built from a pair of
Heathkit H-14 printers I bought for $30 at a hamfest in 1983. I still
have at least a half dozen spare print heads. It used the same
'Practical Automation' print head as some Diebold ATMs, and I used to
work next door to one of their service centers. Lots of good equipment
used to hit their dumpsters.

I keep a web page of spare printers & parts so I can check it from
anywhere. It lists the printer, interface, power supply, manuals and
drivers. There are lots of free printers & cartridges on the local
Freecycle groups.
I started by replacing the head cable on one of the old Star printers
with a hand formed piece floppy drive cable, then a couple years
latter, I moved the toothed belt half way round to get to the unused
portion. I sold that printer at a yard sale in 1996 and saw it again
at a yard sale a couple years ago with the gray cable still working. I
wish now that I had bought it back for old times sake.
I used to buy surplus ribbon cartridges and re-load the ribbon into
other bodies that fit the printer currently in use.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

Gerald Miller wrote:

I started by replacing the head cable on one of the old Star printers
with a hand formed piece floppy drive cable, then a couple years
latter, I moved the toothed belt half way round to get to the unused
portion. I sold that printer at a yard sale in 1996 and saw it again
at a yard sale a couple years ago with the gray cable still working. I
wish now that I had bought it back for old times sake.
I used to buy surplus ribbon cartridges and re-load the ribbon into
other bodies that fit the printer currently in use.


I have repaired electronics since I was a little kid. I rarely ever
bought anything new. A couple computers, two TVs and a couple printers,
but just about everything else was free, or salvaged and repaired. I am
in my mid 50s and still do some repairs, health permitting. RIght now I
can't use my right eye. I had a palsy, and can't control movement, or
keep the lid up for more than a few seconds because of the double
vision. Of course, it was the better of the two, leaving me almost
blind.


--
http://improve-usenet.org/index.html

If you have broadband, your ISP may have a NNTP news server included in
your account: http://www.usenettools.net/ISP.htm

Sporadic E is the Earth's aluminum foil beanie for the 'global warming'
sheep.