I just got my 17€� Grizzly saw this month and it says Taiwan. It does not seem to make much difference as this came out of an ISO9001 plant, and that speaks very highly for quality control. The saw was perfect in all respects. I could not be happier.

--
For full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/woodwo...de-240968-.htm

On 11/26/2020 12:45 PM, marvin wrote:
I just got my 17€� Grizzly saw this month and it says Taiwan.Â* It does
not seem to make much difference as this came out of an ISO9001 plant,
and that speaks very highly for quality control.Â* The saw was perfect in
all respects.Â* I could not be happier.

Don't confuse quality control with quality -- one can produce an
inferior product with a very tightly controlled process just as well as
a good one. All ISO 9001 guarantees is the control of the process, not
the product design.

--

On Thu, 26 Nov 2020 13:05:52 -0600, dpb wrote:

On 11/26/2020 12:45 PM, marvin wrote:
I just got my 17€� Grizzly saw this month and it says Taiwan.Â* It does
not seem to make much difference as this came out of an ISO9001 plant,
and that speaks very highly for quality control.Â* The saw was perfect in
all respects.Â* I could not be happier.

Don't confuse quality control with quality -- one can produce an
inferior product with a very tightly controlled process just as well as
a good one. All ISO 9001 guarantees is the control of the process, not
the product design.

Yep. Quality control means that you can accurately maintain a
standard, not that the standard is particularly high. In fact if the
standard is fairly low then it's easier to maintain.

Example of quality control--I once had all four headlights on a Toyota
I had bought new burn out within four hours of each other after 4
years of ownership. In that case I could have dealt with a little bit
less quality control because it took place between 1 and 5 am in the
middle of nowhere and I ended up stuck sitting by the side of the road
with no lights until the sun came up.

McDonalds has phenomenal quality control. A burger you get from
McDonalds in East Overshoe will be identical to one you get in
Hollywood. That's quality control. You won't get that consistency
from a five-star gourmet restaurant, but their worst will still be a
lot better than McDonalds' best.

On 11/26/2020 1:05 PM, dpb wrote:
On 11/26/2020 12:45 PM, marvin wrote:
I just got my 17€� Grizzly saw this month and it says Taiwan.Â* It does
not seem to make much difference as this came out of an ISO9001 plant,
and that speaks very highly for quality control.Â* The saw was perfect
in all respects.Â* I could not be happier.

Don't confuse quality control with quality -- one can produce an
inferior product with a very tightly controlled process just as well as
a good one.Â* All ISO 9001 guarantees is the control of the process, not
the product design.

--




Take Ford for example.... I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues. Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Oil burner to the tune of about 2 quarts between oil changes until the
odometer hit about 14K. And probably as a result, valve clatter when
accelerating. That started at about 7500 miles.

Some where around the time the oil consumption went away, I put in a can
of top engine cleaner when I filled up with gas. Now the valve clatter
is gone.

And a few other items that the dealer fixed.

On Thursday, November 26, 2020 at 2:51:39 PM UTC-5, J. Clarke wrote:
On Thu, 26 Nov 2020 13:05:52 -0600, dpb wrote:

On 11/26/2020 12:45 PM, marvin wrote:
I just got my 17€� Grizzly saw this month and it says Taiwan. It does
not seem to make much difference as this came out of an ISO9001 plant,
and that speaks very highly for quality control. The saw was perfect in
all respects. I could not be happier.

Don't confuse quality control with quality -- one can produce an
inferior product with a very tightly controlled process just as well as
a good one. All ISO 9001 guarantees is the control of the process, not
the product design.
Yep. Quality control means that you can accurately maintain a
standard, not that the standard is particularly high. In fact if the
standard is fairly low then it's easier to maintain.

Example of quality control--I once had all four headlights on a Toyota
I had bought new burn out within four hours of each other after 4
years of ownership. In that case I could have dealt with a little bit
less quality control because it took place between 1 and 5 am in the
middle of nowhere and I ended up stuck sitting by the side of the road
with no lights until the sun came up.

McDonalds has phenomenal quality control. A burger you get from
McDonalds in East Overshoe will be identical to one you get in
Hollywood. That's quality control. You won't get that consistency
from a five-star gourmet restaurant, but their worst will still be a
lot better than McDonalds' best.

You obviously don't eat at McDonald's enough.

Maybe if they served the burgers while they were still frozen they
would be identical, but once they cook/season/wrap them, there
are differences in all three categories - not just across town and
not just at different times, but often in the same bag.

Leon wrote:

Take Ford for example....Â* I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues.Â* Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Oil burner to the tune of about 2 quarts between oil changes until the
odometer hit about 14K.Â* And probably as a result, valve clatter when
accelerating.Â* That started at about 7500 miles.


I have been looking at this vehicle, with a v8. Which engine do you
have? I'm guessing you have one of the ones designed to be more fuel
efficient. I'm a "little suspicious" of them, either because I'm not
comfortable with change or I because don't know any better, or
both..lol. What say you?

Happy TG,
Bill

On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 00:04:53 -0500, Bill wrote:

Leon wrote:

Take Ford for example....Â* I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues.Â* Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Oil burner to the tune of about 2 quarts between oil changes until the
odometer hit about 14K.Â* And probably as a result, valve clatter when
accelerating.Â* That started at about 7500 miles.


I have been looking at this vehicle, with a v8. Which engine do you
have? I'm guessing you have one of the ones designed to be more fuel
efficient. I'm a "little suspicious" of them, either because I'm not
comfortable with change or I because don't know any better, or
both..lol. What say you?

Note that there is a service bulletin:
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2019/MC-10169811-0001.pdf

J. Clarke wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 00:04:53 -0500, Bill wrote:

Leon wrote:

Take Ford for example....Â* I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues.Â* Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Oil burner to the tune of about 2 quarts between oil changes until the
odometer hit about 14K.Â* And probably as a result, valve clatter when
accelerating.Â* That started at about 7500 miles.


I have been looking at this vehicle, with a v8. Which engine do you
have? I'm guessing you have one of the ones designed to be more fuel
efficient. I'm a "little suspicious" of them, either because I'm not
comfortable with change or I because don't know any better, or
both..lol. What say you?

Note that there is a service bulletin:
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2019/MC-10169811-0001.pdf


Gee, thanks for the heads-up! Is that sort of "maintenance" covered
under warranty? I printed it out, and I'll pay attention to the day
of manufacture mentioned: 10/4/2019. It doesn't sound like a "fatal"
problem, but it's nice to be aware of the issue.

On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 06:37:06 -0500, Bill wrote:

J. Clarke wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 00:04:53 -0500, Bill wrote:

Leon wrote:

Take Ford for example....Â* I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues.Â* Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Oil burner to the tune of about 2 quarts between oil changes until the
odometer hit about 14K.Â* And probably as a result, valve clatter when
accelerating.Â* That started at about 7500 miles.


I have been looking at this vehicle, with a v8. Which engine do you
have? I'm guessing you have one of the ones designed to be more fuel
efficient. I'm a "little suspicious" of them, either because I'm not
comfortable with change or I because don't know any better, or
both..lol. What say you?

Note that there is a service bulletin:
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2019/MC-10169811-0001.pdf


Gee, thanks for the heads-up! Is that sort of "maintenance" covered
under warranty? I printed it out, and I'll pay attention to the day
of manufacture mentioned: 10/4/2019. It doesn't sound like a "fatal"
problem, but it's nice to be aware of the issue.

That kind of thing is an annoyance. I have a Jeep that used to suck
up oil like crazy. Turns out that in that case they had fastened a
plate in the intake system with bolts the wrong length so it didn't
seal. Took a couple of days to get all the stuff off the top of the
engine, replace the bolts and gasket, and put it all back together.
And of course since it's sucking oil like crazy it's easy for it to
get low, which isn't good for anything.

On 11/26/2020 11:04 PM, Bill wrote:
Leon wrote:

Take Ford for example....Â* I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues.Â* Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Oil burner to the tune of about 2 quarts between oil changes until the
odometer hit about 14K.Â* And probably as a result, valve clatter when
accelerating.Â* That started at about 7500 miles.


I have been looking at this vehicle, with a v8.Â* Which engine do you
have?Â* I'm guessing you have one of the ones designed to be more fuel
efficient.Â* I'm a "little suspicious" of them, either because I'm not
comfortable with change or I because don't know any better, or
both..lol.Â*Â* What say you?

Happy TG,
Bill


Actually the normally aspirated 5.0 V8

This is my first Ford ever. My wife and I were looking for a very
comfortable truck to travel in. Since August 2019 we gave been from
Houston Tx to Oklahoma, Indiana, Ohio on one trip and last month to
Roanoke Va.
This truck is VERY comfortable, King Ranch.

I had a 2007 Tundra with the 5.7 V8.
That truck spoiled me. The engine was the best I ever had in any
vehicle. Its gas mileage was good for a 2007 in 2007, not so good
today. BUT wow that truck would det up an do. The low rear end gear
ratio wand the culprit for the low gas mileage but give it the punch.

My current F150 has a much taller rear end gear ratio and has less punch
but we get a legitimate 19 MPG on the highway. The dash computer says
21-22 but comes out to a real 19.

The oil consumption issue is a common complaint for 2018~2020 IIRC. I
think it is just a very slow break in period. Once the consumption went
away and a fuel additive to rid the carbon build up the not clattering
for 7K.

FWIW an oil change requires 8.8 quarts... That might be an indicator
that break in takes a long time.

Would I buy again? Hard to say. The Tundra seemed to be a much tougher
truck. The aluminum body on the Ford seems kinda thin in the bed.

On 11/26/2020 11:31 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 00:04:53 -0500, Bill wrote:

Leon wrote:

Take Ford for example....Â* I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues.Â* Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Oil burner to the tune of about 2 quarts between oil changes until the
odometer hit about 14K.Â* And probably as a result, valve clatter when
accelerating.Â* That started at about 7500 miles.


I have been looking at this vehicle, with a v8. Which engine do you
have? I'm guessing you have one of the ones designed to be more fuel
efficient. I'm a "little suspicious" of them, either because I'm not
comfortable with change or I because don't know any better, or
both..lol. What say you?

Note that there is a service bulletin:
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2019/MC-10169811-0001.pdf



Yes I heard of that bulletin just after the oil consumption dropped. I
understand from an owner on YouTube the the new dipstick has a wider
range between full and the add oil mark.

On 11/27/2020 5:37 AM, Bill wrote:
J. Clarke wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 00:04:53 -0500, Bill wrote:

Leon wrote:

Take Ford for example....Â* I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues.Â* Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Oil burner to the tune of about 2 quarts between oil changes until the
odometer hit about 14K.Â* And probably as a result, valve clatter when
accelerating.Â* That started at about 7500 miles.


I have been looking at this vehicle, with a v8.Â* Which engine do you
have?Â* I'm guessing you have one of the ones designed to be more fuel
efficient.Â* I'm a "little suspicious" of them, either because I'm not
comfortable with change or I because don't know any better, or
both..lol.Â*Â* What say you?

Note that there is a service bulletin:
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2019/MC-10169811-0001.pdf


Gee, thanks for the heads-up!Â* Is that sort of "maintenance" covered
under warranty?Â* I printed it out, and I'll pay attention to the day
of manufacture mentioned: 10/4/2019.Â* It doesn't sound like a "fatal"
problem, but it's nice to be aware of the issue.

I would not call that maintenance so much as a dip stick replacement
that has a larger acceptable range of oil volume.

It is just something you should keep an eye on during break in.

On 11/27/2020 7:52 AM, J. Clarke wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 06:37:06 -0500, Bill wrote:

J. Clarke wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 00:04:53 -0500, Bill wrote:

Leon wrote:

Take Ford for example....Â* I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues.Â* Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Oil burner to the tune of about 2 quarts between oil changes until the
odometer hit about 14K.Â* And probably as a result, valve clatter when
accelerating.Â* That started at about 7500 miles.


I have been looking at this vehicle, with a v8. Which engine do you
have? I'm guessing you have one of the ones designed to be more fuel
efficient. I'm a "little suspicious" of them, either because I'm not
comfortable with change or I because don't know any better, or
both..lol. What say you?

Note that there is a service bulletin:
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2019/MC-10169811-0001.pdf


Gee, thanks for the heads-up! Is that sort of "maintenance" covered
under warranty? I printed it out, and I'll pay attention to the day
of manufacture mentioned: 10/4/2019. It doesn't sound like a "fatal"
problem, but it's nice to be aware of the issue.

That kind of thing is an annoyance. I have a Jeep that used to suck
up oil like crazy. Turns out that in that case they had fastened a
plate in the intake system with bolts the wrong length so it didn't
seal. Took a couple of days to get all the stuff off the top of the
engine, replace the bolts and gasket, and put it all back together.
And of course since it's sucking oil like crazy it's easy for it to
get low, which isn't good for anything.



More than an annoyance in some instances. 2 quarts of oil low between
oil changes could cause engine damage if you don't stay on top of the
oil level. And with the carbon build up as a result, the engine
clattered bad enough that there was considerable hesitation when
accelerating during the engine clatter episodes.

On Thu, 26 Nov 2020 18:45:02 +0000, marvin
wrote:

I just got my 17” Grizzly saw this month and it says Taiwan. It does not seem to make much difference as this came out of an ISO9001 plant, and that speaks very highly for quality control. The saw was perfect in all respects. I could not be happier.

ISO9000 has nothing to do with quality. It's all about process. You
can make a crappy product, as long as you follow the process to make
it. ISO9000 = Make one crappy product then make them all crappy.

On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 09:31:09 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 11/27/2020 5:37 AM, Bill wrote:
J. Clarke wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 00:04:53 -0500, Bill wrote:

Leon wrote:

Take Ford for example....* I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues.* Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Oil burner to the tune of about 2 quarts between oil changes until the
odometer hit about 14K.* And probably as a result, valve clatter when
accelerating.* That started at about 7500 miles.


I have been looking at this vehicle, with a v8.* Which engine do you
have?* I'm guessing you have one of the ones designed to be more fuel
efficient.* I'm a "little suspicious" of them, either because I'm not
comfortable with change or I because don't know any better, or
both..lol.** What say you?

Note that there is a service bulletin:
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2019/MC-10169811-0001.pdf


Gee, thanks for the heads-up!* Is that sort of "maintenance" covered
under warranty?* I printed it out, and I'll pay attention to the day
of manufacture mentioned: 10/4/2019.* It doesn't sound like a "fatal"
problem, but it's nice to be aware of the issue.

I would not call that maintenance so much as a dip stick replacement
that has a larger acceptable range of oil volume.

It is just something you should keep an eye on during break in.

I thought "break in" went away with leisure suits.

On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 09:29:02 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 11/26/2020 11:31 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 00:04:53 -0500, Bill wrote:

Leon wrote:

Take Ford for example....* I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues.* Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Oil burner to the tune of about 2 quarts between oil changes until the
odometer hit about 14K.* And probably as a result, valve clatter when
accelerating.* That started at about 7500 miles.


I have been looking at this vehicle, with a v8. Which engine do you
have? I'm guessing you have one of the ones designed to be more fuel
efficient. I'm a "little suspicious" of them, either because I'm not
comfortable with change or I because don't know any better, or
both..lol. What say you?

Note that there is a service bulletin:
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2019/MC-10169811-0001.pdf



Yes I heard of that bulletin just after the oil consumption dropped. I
understand from an owner on YouTube the the new dipstick has a wider
range between full and the add oil mark.

Wide enough to make 3 years or 36,000 miles?

On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 09:25:16 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 11/26/2020 11:04 PM, Bill wrote:
Leon wrote:

Take Ford for example....* I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues.* Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Oil burner to the tune of about 2 quarts between oil changes until the
odometer hit about 14K.* And probably as a result, valve clatter when
accelerating.* That started at about 7500 miles.


I have been looking at this vehicle, with a v8.* Which engine do you
have?* I'm guessing you have one of the ones designed to be more fuel
efficient.* I'm a "little suspicious" of them, either because I'm not
comfortable with change or I because don't know any better, or
both..lol.** What say you?

Happy TG,
Bill


Actually the normally aspirated 5.0 V8

I assume you mean fuel injected. I have the 5.0 V8 in my 2013 F150.
There was nothing like a "break in" period. It really hasn't changed
much since (better with winter blends).

This is my first Ford ever. My wife and I were looking for a very
comfortable truck to travel in. Since August 2019 we gave been from
Houston Tx to Oklahoma, Indiana, Ohio on one trip and last month to
Roanoke Va.
This truck is VERY comfortable, King Ranch.

I had a 2007 Tundra with the 5.7 V8.
That truck spoiled me. The engine was the best I ever had in any
vehicle. Its gas mileage was good for a 2007 in 2007, not so good
today. BUT wow that truck would det up an do. The low rear end gear
ratio wand the culprit for the low gas mileage but give it the punch.

My current F150 has a much taller rear end gear ratio and has less punch
but we get a legitimate 19 MPG on the highway. The dash computer says
21-22 but comes out to a real 19.

The oil consumption issue is a common complaint for 2018~2020 IIRC. I
think it is just a very slow break in period. Once the consumption went
away and a fuel additive to rid the carbon build up the not clattering
for 7K.

FWIW an oil change requires 8.8 quarts... That might be an indicator
that break in takes a long time.

Would I buy again? Hard to say. The Tundra seemed to be a much tougher
truck. The aluminum body on the Ford seems kinda thin in the bed.

I wouldn't be happy with an aluminum anything. It's hard to "bang
out" and overly susceptible to dings. IMO, it makes no sense as a
truck bed.

On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 10:31:19 AM UTC-5, Leon wrote:
On 11/27/2020 5:37 AM, Bill wrote:
J. Clarke wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 00:04:53 -0500, Bill wrote:

Leon wrote:

Take Ford for example.... I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues. Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Oil burner to the tune of about 2 quarts between oil changes until the
odometer hit about 14K. And probably as a result, valve clatter when
accelerating. That started at about 7500 miles.


I have been looking at this vehicle, with a v8. Which engine do you
have? I'm guessing you have one of the ones designed to be more fuel
efficient. I'm a "little suspicious" of them, either because I'm not
comfortable with change or I because don't know any better, or
both..lol. What say you?

Note that there is a service bulletin:
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2019/MC-10169811-0001.pdf


Gee, thanks for the heads-up! Is that sort of "maintenance" covered
under warranty? I printed it out, and I'll pay attention to the day
of manufacture mentioned: 10/4/2019. It doesn't sound like a "fatal"
problem, but it's nice to be aware of the issue.
I would not call that maintenance so much as a dip stick replacement
that has a larger acceptable range of oil volume.

It is just something you should keep an eye on during break in.

Do you know where I can get a longer dip stick for my van?

Mine doesn't reach the oil anymore.

On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 11:45:13 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Thu, 26 Nov 2020 18:45:02 +0000, marvin
wrote:

I just got my 17€� Grizzly saw this month and it says Taiwan. It does not seem to make much difference as this came out of an ISO9001 plant, and that speaks very highly for quality control. The saw was perfect in all respects. I could not be happier.
ISO9000 has nothing to do with quality. It's all about process. You
can make a crappy product, as long as you follow the process to make
it. ISO9000 = Make one crappy product then make them all crappy.

Perfect timing for a "poor design" discussion.

I loaded up my 2 month old Bosch dishwasher with a bunch of turkey dishes last night. Hit start,
closed the door and got nothing but a red flashing light. That means "Nope, I ain't going to start."
Normally I would hear a beep and the red light would be on solid.

No error codes, no indication of what was actually wrong. Standard reset procedures didn't help.

A bit frustrated, I closed the door a little harder and heard the beep, then got the flashing light. Well,
that's one step closer. I pushed the door in harder while it was closed, got the beep again, the light
came on solid and the dishwasher started.

OK, so I'm standing there keeping the door fully closed by hand and saying to myself "Do I really
want to stand here for 2 1/2 hours?" Nope! So how can I keep the door closed and at least get
through this load. I don't want to let go because the DW is working right now.

Then I realized that there is a cabinet directly across from the DW, about 3 feet away, door facing door.
I called out for SWMBO who took over the holding while I ran downstairs. I grabbed 2 towels, a 3'
length of 1x stock and wedged the wood between the cabinet and the DW, using the towels as
padding. Success! The DW kept running.

Then I went out on the web and did some searching. It turns out that the door latch has been an
issue with Bosch DW's for many years, across many models. The issue is that when you screw
the "safety tabs" into the bottom of the counter type, it bows the top of the frame and the door latch
may not fully engage. In many cases, like mine, things are fine for a few months and then the problem
shows up. The DIY fix is to put shims between the countertop and the DW frame right above the
latch. Shim until pushing up in the area of the latch doesn't produce any flex in the frame.

I did that this morning and the door is now latching and beeping with every close just like it was new.

On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 09:47:18 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 11:45:13 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Thu, 26 Nov 2020 18:45:02 +0000, marvin
wrote:

I just got my 17” Grizzly saw this month and it says Taiwan. It does not seem to make much difference as this came out of an ISO9001 plant, and that speaks very highly for quality control. The saw was perfect in all respects. I could not be happier.
ISO9000 has nothing to do with quality. It's all about process. You
can make a crappy product, as long as you follow the process to make
it. ISO9000 = Make one crappy product then make them all crappy.

Perfect timing for a "poor design" discussion.

I loaded up my 2 month old Bosch dishwasher with a bunch of turkey dishes last night. Hit start,
closed the door and got nothing but a red flashing light. That means "Nope, I ain't going to start."
Normally I would hear a beep and the red light would be on solid.

No error codes, no indication of what was actually wrong. Standard reset procedures didn't help.

A bit frustrated, I closed the door a little harder and heard the beep, then got the flashing light. Well,
that's one step closer. I pushed the door in harder while it was closed, got the beep again, the light
came on solid and the dishwasher started.

OK, so I'm standing there keeping the door fully closed by hand and saying to myself "Do I really
want to stand here for 2 1/2 hours?" Nope! So how can I keep the door closed and at least get
through this load. I don't want to let go because the DW is working right now.

Then I realized that there is a cabinet directly across from the DW, about 3 feet away, door facing door.
I called out for SWMBO who took over the holding while I ran downstairs. I grabbed 2 towels, a 3'
length of 1x stock and wedged the wood between the cabinet and the DW, using the towels as
padding. Success! The DW kept running.

Then I went out on the web and did some searching. It turns out that the door latch has been an
issue with Bosch DW's for many years, across many models. The issue is that when you screw
the "safety tabs" into the bottom of the counter type, it bows the top of the frame and the door latch
may not fully engage. In many cases, like mine, things are fine for a few months and then the problem
shows up. The DIY fix is to put shims between the countertop and the DW frame right above the
latch. Shim until pushing up in the area of the latch doesn't produce any flex in the frame.

I did that this morning and the door is now latching and beeping with every close just like it was new.

We have a KitchenAid dual fuel oven/range. We just replaced the
element ($600). The night before Thanksgiving it decided to do the
opposite - kept heating forever, no thermostat control. No error code
but online troubleshooting sites suggested the motherboard ($1000).

The oven's electronics does have a habit of losing itself but usually
gives an error code. The troubleshooting guide says to p0wer off at
the breaker, wait 30sec, power back on fixes the problem. Fortunately
it did this time too. But an error like this to make a
troubleshooting guide?

Kitchenaid, like Bosch, isn't exactly a "contractor grade" appliance.
But they are ISO9000!

On 11/27/2020 10:57 AM, wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 09:25:16 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 11/26/2020 11:04 PM, Bill wrote:
Leon wrote:

Take Ford for example....Â* I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues.Â* Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Oil burner to the tune of about 2 quarts between oil changes until the
odometer hit about 14K.Â* And probably as a result, valve clatter when
accelerating.Â* That started at about 7500 miles.


I have been looking at this vehicle, with a v8.Â* Which engine do you
have?Â* I'm guessing you have one of the ones designed to be more fuel
efficient.Â* I'm a "little suspicious" of them, either because I'm not
comfortable with change or I because don't know any better, or
both..lol.Â*Â* What say you?

Happy TG,
Bill


Actually the normally aspirated 5.0 V8

I assume you mean fuel injected. I have the 5.0 V8 in my 2013 F150.
There was nothing like a "break in" period. It really hasn't changed
much since (better with winter blends).

Non Turbo, but yes it think it has 16 injectors... I don't keep up
anymore.




This is my first Ford ever. My wife and I were looking for a very
comfortable truck to travel in. Since August 2019 we gave been from
Houston Tx to Oklahoma, Indiana, Ohio on one trip and last month to
Roanoke Va.
This truck is VERY comfortable, King Ranch.

I had a 2007 Tundra with the 5.7 V8.
That truck spoiled me. The engine was the best I ever had in any
vehicle. Its gas mileage was good for a 2007 in 2007, not so good
today. BUT wow that truck would det up an do. The low rear end gear
ratio wand the culprit for the low gas mileage but give it the punch.

My current F150 has a much taller rear end gear ratio and has less punch
but we get a legitimate 19 MPG on the highway. The dash computer says
21-22 but comes out to a real 19.

The oil consumption issue is a common complaint for 2018~2020 IIRC. I
think it is just a very slow break in period. Once the consumption went
away and a fuel additive to rid the carbon build up the not clattering
for 7K.

FWIW an oil change requires 8.8 quarts... That might be an indicator
that break in takes a long time.

Would I buy again? Hard to say. The Tundra seemed to be a much tougher
truck. The aluminum body on the Ford seems kinda thin in the bed.

I wouldn't be happy with an aluminum anything. It's hard to "bang
out" and overly susceptible to dings. IMO, it makes no sense as a
truck bed.


I would not be banging out, the body shop can deal with it.

On 11/27/2020 11:47 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 11:45:13 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Thu, 26 Nov 2020 18:45:02 +0000, marvin
wrote:

I just got my 17€� Grizzly saw this month and it says Taiwan. It does not seem to make much difference as this came out of an ISO9001 plant, and that speaks very highly for quality control. The saw was perfect in all respects. I could not be happier.
ISO9000 has nothing to do with quality. It's all about process. You
can make a crappy product, as long as you follow the process to make
it. ISO9000 = Make one crappy product then make them all crappy.

Perfect timing for a "poor design" discussion.

I loaded up my 2 month old Bosch dishwasher with a bunch of turkey dishes last night. Hit start,
closed the door and got nothing but a red flashing light. That means "Nope, I ain't going to start."
Normally I would hear a beep and the red light would be on solid.

No error codes, no indication of what was actually wrong. Standard reset procedures didn't help.

A bit frustrated, I closed the door a little harder and heard the beep, then got the flashing light. Well,
that's one step closer. I pushed the door in harder while it was closed, got the beep again, the light
came on solid and the dishwasher started.

OK, so I'm standing there keeping the door fully closed by hand and saying to myself "Do I really
want to stand here for 2 1/2 hours?" Nope! So how can I keep the door closed and at least get
through this load. I don't want to let go because the DW is working right now.

Then I realized that there is a cabinet directly across from the DW, about 3 feet away, door facing door.
I called out for SWMBO who took over the holding while I ran downstairs. I grabbed 2 towels, a 3'
length of 1x stock and wedged the wood between the cabinet and the DW, using the towels as
padding. Success! The DW kept running.

Then I went out on the web and did some searching. It turns out that the door latch has been an
issue with Bosch DW's for many years, across many models. The issue is that when you screw
the "safety tabs" into the bottom of the counter type, it bows the top of the frame and the door latch
may not fully engage. In many cases, like mine, things are fine for a few months and then the problem
shows up. The DIY fix is to put shims between the countertop and the DW frame right above the
latch. Shim until pushing up in the area of the latch doesn't produce any flex in the frame.

I did that this morning and the door is now latching and beeping with every close just like it was new.



I needed a stick a few years back to hold up the left side of our under
mount sink. The idiot installer did not secure the left side, like the
right side, and the adhesive let go.

Like you I needed a stick to prop and hold in place.

I used SketchUp to design the stick.

My design came out as a piece
3/4" x 3/4" x 20".
Then I added wood grain to the drawing and headed to the shop with my
dimensioned drawing. ;~)

On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 1:24:26 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 09:47:18 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 11:45:13 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Thu, 26 Nov 2020 18:45:02 +0000, marvin
wrote:

I just got my 17€� Grizzly saw this month and it says Taiwan. It does not seem to make much difference as this came out of an ISO9001 plant, and that speaks very highly for quality control. The saw was perfect in all respects. I could not be happier.
ISO9000 has nothing to do with quality. It's all about process. You
can make a crappy product, as long as you follow the process to make
it. ISO9000 = Make one crappy product then make them all crappy.

Perfect timing for a "poor design" discussion.

I loaded up my 2 month old Bosch dishwasher with a bunch of turkey dishes last night. Hit start,
closed the door and got nothing but a red flashing light. That means "Nope, I ain't going to start."
Normally I would hear a beep and the red light would be on solid.

No error codes, no indication of what was actually wrong. Standard reset procedures didn't help.

A bit frustrated, I closed the door a little harder and heard the beep, then got the flashing light. Well,
that's one step closer. I pushed the door in harder while it was closed, got the beep again, the light
came on solid and the dishwasher started.

OK, so I'm standing there keeping the door fully closed by hand and saying to myself "Do I really
want to stand here for 2 1/2 hours?" Nope! So how can I keep the door closed and at least get
through this load. I don't want to let go because the DW is working right now.

Then I realized that there is a cabinet directly across from the DW, about 3 feet away, door facing door.
I called out for SWMBO who took over the holding while I ran downstairs. I grabbed 2 towels, a 3'
length of 1x stock and wedged the wood between the cabinet and the DW, using the towels as
padding. Success! The DW kept running.

Then I went out on the web and did some searching. It turns out that the door latch has been an
issue with Bosch DW's for many years, across many models. The issue is that when you screw
the "safety tabs" into the bottom of the counter type, it bows the top of the frame and the door latch
may not fully engage. In many cases, like mine, things are fine for a few months and then the problem
shows up. The DIY fix is to put shims between the countertop and the DW frame right above the
latch. Shim until pushing up in the area of the latch doesn't produce any flex in the frame.

I did that this morning and the door is now latching and beeping with every close just like it was new.
We have a KitchenAid dual fuel oven/range. We just replaced the
element ($600). The night before Thanksgiving it decided to do the
opposite - kept heating forever, no thermostat control. No error code
but online troubleshooting sites suggested the motherboard ($1000).

The oven's electronics does have a habit of losing itself but usually
gives an error code. The troubleshooting guide says to p0wer off at
the breaker, wait 30sec, power back on fixes the problem. Fortunately
it did this time too. But an error like this to make a
troubleshooting guide?

Although my DW issue was more of a mechanical problem than
electronic/programming (this time) I have seen indications that
the 30 sec power removed reset doesn't always work for Bosch
DW's that have stalled mid-cycle. Indications are that they
remember where they were stalled and just power up at the same
spot, still stalled.


Kitchenaid, like Bosch, isn't exactly a "contractor grade" appliance.
But they are ISO9000!

Tru dat. Not only did I pay more than I really wanted to, I had to wait
over 2 months to get it. Very popular model + Covid related slowdowns.

To add insult to injury, when the appliance store finally called and told
me that my DW was in, I went to pick it up and found that the sound
insulation was ripped on one side. I asked for a different one but I was
told that all the other ones that came in with this shipment had already
been picked up or were out for delivery. I called BS, but they wouldn't
budge. "The damage is just to the insulation. You can take this one or
wait until late next week for the next shipment."

Knowing that nothing just rips on it's own, I peeled back the insulation
in front of the guy and saw a slight dent in the DW wall itself. I told him that
I'd wait for the next shipment. I also told him that if there were any further
issues, I'd be cancelling my order.

They called 2 days later and told me that they had one available. Imagine
that.

On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 1:41:42 PM UTC-5, Leon wrote:
On 11/27/2020 11:47 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 11:45:13 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Thu, 26 Nov 2020 18:45:02 +0000, marvin
wrote:

I just got my 17€� Grizzly saw this month and it says Taiwan. It does not seem to make much difference as this came out of an ISO9001 plant, and that speaks very highly for quality control. The saw was perfect in all respects. I could not be happier.
ISO9000 has nothing to do with quality. It's all about process. You
can make a crappy product, as long as you follow the process to make
it. ISO9000 = Make one crappy product then make them all crappy.

Perfect timing for a "poor design" discussion.

I loaded up my 2 month old Bosch dishwasher with a bunch of turkey dishes last night. Hit start,
closed the door and got nothing but a red flashing light. That means "Nope, I ain't going to start."
Normally I would hear a beep and the red light would be on solid.

No error codes, no indication of what was actually wrong. Standard reset procedures didn't help.

A bit frustrated, I closed the door a little harder and heard the beep, then got the flashing light. Well,
that's one step closer. I pushed the door in harder while it was closed, got the beep again, the light
came on solid and the dishwasher started.

OK, so I'm standing there keeping the door fully closed by hand and saying to myself "Do I really
want to stand here for 2 1/2 hours?" Nope! So how can I keep the door closed and at least get
through this load. I don't want to let go because the DW is working right now.

Then I realized that there is a cabinet directly across from the DW, about 3 feet away, door facing door.
I called out for SWMBO who took over the holding while I ran downstairs.. I grabbed 2 towels, a 3'
length of 1x stock and wedged the wood between the cabinet and the DW, using the towels as
padding. Success! The DW kept running.

Then I went out on the web and did some searching. It turns out that the door latch has been an
issue with Bosch DW's for many years, across many models. The issue is that when you screw
the "safety tabs" into the bottom of the counter type, it bows the top of the frame and the door latch
may not fully engage. In many cases, like mine, things are fine for a few months and then the problem
shows up. The DIY fix is to put shims between the countertop and the DW frame right above the
latch. Shim until pushing up in the area of the latch doesn't produce any flex in the frame.

I did that this morning and the door is now latching and beeping with every close just like it was new.

I needed a stick a few years back to hold up the left side of our under
mount sink. The idiot installer did not secure the left side, like the
right side, and the adhesive let go.

Like you I needed a stick to prop and hold in place.

I used SketchUp to design the stick.

My design came out as a piece
3/4" x 3/4" x 20".
Then I added wood grain to the drawing and headed to the shop with my
dimensioned drawing. ;~)

It sounds complicated. I hope you used the component feature.

Leon wrote:


Take Ford for example.... I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues. Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Shoulda got a SILVERAYDO https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfHtcUZXljw

On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 10:25:25 AM UTC-5, Leon wrote:


Would I buy again? Hard to say. The Tundra seemed to be a much tougher
truck. The aluminum body on the Ford seems kinda thin in the bed.

My daughter just bought a 2017 Tacoma TRD. It says Off Road on the side,
so now she does sh!t like driving 160 miles on Rimrocker Trail just to get to
a free campsite in Moab (Utah).

The road on the bottom right is the same road that she's on up top. There's
a bunch of really steep switchbacks that get you down there. 3 - 4 MPH max
in some spots.

https://i.imgur.com/Nrhgmeb.jpg

Her rig is on the left he

https://i.imgur.com/u1nMNFF.jpg

Cornish Hens and Stuffed squash for Thanksgiving.

https://i.imgur.com/P0rLiyr.jpg

She hung back to take this picture of her friends:

https://i.imgur.com/hebNQSF.jpg

On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 12:31:13 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 11/27/2020 10:57 AM, wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 09:25:16 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 11/26/2020 11:04 PM, Bill wrote:
Leon wrote:

Take Ford for example....* I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues.* Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Oil burner to the tune of about 2 quarts between oil changes until the
odometer hit about 14K.* And probably as a result, valve clatter when
accelerating.* That started at about 7500 miles.


I have been looking at this vehicle, with a v8.* Which engine do you
have?* I'm guessing you have one of the ones designed to be more fuel
efficient.* I'm a "little suspicious" of them, either because I'm not
comfortable with change or I because don't know any better, or
both..lol.** What say you?

Happy TG,
Bill


Actually the normally aspirated 5.0 V8

I assume you mean fuel injected. I have the 5.0 V8 in my 2013 F150.
There was nothing like a "break in" period. It really hasn't changed
much since (better with winter blends).

Non Turbo, but yes it think it has 16 injectors... I don't keep up
anymore.

Sorry, I got out of sync. I meant that my mileage hasn't changed much
(maybe 17-18 to 18-19)




This is my first Ford ever. My wife and I were looking for a very
comfortable truck to travel in. Since August 2019 we gave been from
Houston Tx to Oklahoma, Indiana, Ohio on one trip and last month to
Roanoke Va.
This truck is VERY comfortable, King Ranch.

I had a 2007 Tundra with the 5.7 V8.
That truck spoiled me. The engine was the best I ever had in any
vehicle. Its gas mileage was good for a 2007 in 2007, not so good
today. BUT wow that truck would det up an do. The low rear end gear
ratio wand the culprit for the low gas mileage but give it the punch.

My current F150 has a much taller rear end gear ratio and has less punch
but we get a legitimate 19 MPG on the highway. The dash computer says
21-22 but comes out to a real 19.

The oil consumption issue is a common complaint for 2018~2020 IIRC. I
think it is just a very slow break in period. Once the consumption went
away and a fuel additive to rid the carbon build up the not clattering
for 7K.

FWIW an oil change requires 8.8 quarts... That might be an indicator
that break in takes a long time.

Would I buy again? Hard to say. The Tundra seemed to be a much tougher
truck. The aluminum body on the Ford seems kinda thin in the bed.

I wouldn't be happy with an aluminum anything. It's hard to "bang
out" and overly susceptible to dings. IMO, it makes no sense as a
truck bed.


I would not be banging out, the body shop can deal with it.

I wouldn't either but body shops have a much harder time of it. Of
course, today they just replace but aluminum is more expensive that
steel. Much more so for the same strength (buildings aren't made of
aluminum either).

On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 12:39:26 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 10:25:25 AM UTC-5, Leon wrote:


Would I buy again? Hard to say. The Tundra seemed to be a much tougher
truck. The aluminum body on the Ford seems kinda thin in the bed.

My daughter just bought a 2017 Tacoma TRD. It says Off Road on the side,
so now she does sh!t like driving 160 miles on Rimrocker Trail just to get to
a free campsite in Moab (Utah).

When I lived in Vermont, I had a 4WD Ranger that said "Off Road" on
the side. My wife would get all over me for driving in snow storms. I
told her that it was an off-road truck and that I really could drive
it off road. It took a few times before it sunk in.

HKnda like the bar maid who told be that she was going hunting bear.
OK... Couldn't pass that one up. After a half hour of her calling me
a chauvinist (hell, I just told her "I'd like to see that!"), I had to
remind her that there was more than one way of spelling "bear".

The road on the bottom right is the same road that she's on up top. There's
a bunch of really steep switchbacks that get you down there. 3 - 4 MPH max
in some spots.

https://i.imgur.com/Nrhgmeb.jpg

Her rig is on the left he

https://i.imgur.com/u1nMNFF.jpg

Cornish Hens and Stuffed squash for Thanksgiving.

https://i.imgur.com/P0rLiyr.jpg

She hung back to take this picture of her friends:

https://i.imgur.com/hebNQSF.jpg

On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 10:48:03 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 1:24:26 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 09:47:18 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
wrote:
snip

Kitchenaid, like Bosch, isn't exactly a "contractor grade" appliance.
But they are ISO9000!

Tru dat. Not only did I pay more than I really wanted to, I had to wait
over 2 months to get it. Very popular model + Covid related slowdowns.

To add insult to injury, when the appliance store finally called and told
me that my DW was in, I went to pick it up and found that the sound
insulation was ripped on one side. I asked for a different one but I was
told that all the other ones that came in with this shipment had already
been picked up or were out for delivery. I called BS, but they wouldn't
budge. "The damage is just to the insulation. You can take this one or
wait until late next week for the next shipment."

Wu Flu delays are a real thing. We replaced our washer and dryer
recently ($600 for the motherboard on a 9YO washer). There were only
a couple of brands available and only a couple of models in each. No
discounts and long waits (months) for anything else. Take it or not.
SWMBO didn't like the idea of a laundromat in 'rona season.

Knowing that nothing just rips on it's own, I peeled back the insulation
in front of the guy and saw a slight dent in the DW wall itself. I told him that
I'd wait for the next shipment. I also told him that if there were any further
issues, I'd be cancelling my order.

They called 2 days later and told me that they had one available. Imagine
that.

On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 19:46:16 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

Leon wrote:


Take Ford for example.... I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues. Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Shoulda got a SILVERAYDO https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfHtcUZXljw


You sure about that?
https://www.dealerrater.com/recalls/Chevrolet/Silverado-1500/

Looks like a combination of bad brakes, bad airbags, and bad seat
belts. What could go wrong?

I'll take excessive oil consumption thank you.

On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 4:25:53 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 12:39:26 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 10:25:25 AM UTC-5, Leon wrote:


Would I buy again? Hard to say. The Tundra seemed to be a much tougher
truck. The aluminum body on the Ford seems kinda thin in the bed.

My daughter just bought a 2017 Tacoma TRD. It says Off Road on the side,
so now she does sh!t like driving 160 miles on Rimrocker Trail just to get to
a free campsite in Moab (Utah).
When I lived in Vermont, I had a 4WD Ranger that said "Off Road" on
the side. My wife would get all over me for driving in snow storms. I
told her that it was an off-road truck and that I really could drive
it off road. It took a few times before it sunk in.

As long as the truck didn't sink in too! ;-)

I don't mind if she goes off road when there is no road, like in the
dunes or on the beach, I just don't want her going off *that* road.

The truck has a feature called Crawl Mode. It's for getting out of deep
sand or going over rocky terrain.

You put it in crawl road and then just steer. The computer decides
on which wheel(s) need power and how much.

There's a few pretty cool YouTubes out there showing it off. Unfortunately,
there's a couple of bad ones too. One guy kept going on and on how much
it sucked, proving it by getting stuck and having to be towed out. Then you
read the comments and see how many people called him an idiot for all the
things he did wrong, such as locking the rear end at the same time as he
was using Crawl mode.


HKnda like the bar maid who told be that she was going hunting bear.
OK... Couldn't pass that one up. After a half hour of her calling me
a chauvinist (hell, I just told her "I'd like to see that!"), I had to
remind her that there was more than one way of spelling "bear".

The road on the bottom right is the same road that she's on up top. There's
a bunch of really steep switchbacks that get you down there. 3 - 4 MPH max
in some spots.

https://i.imgur.com/Nrhgmeb.jpg

Her rig is on the left he

https://i.imgur.com/u1nMNFF.jpg

Cornish Hens and Stuffed squash for Thanksgiving.

https://i.imgur.com/P0rLiyr.jpg

She hung back to take this picture of her friends:

https://i.imgur.com/hebNQSF.jpg

J. Clarke wrote:

On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 19:46:16 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

Leon wrote:


Take Ford for example.... I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues. Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Shoulda got a SILVERAYDO https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfHtcUZXljw


You sure about that?
https://www.dealerrater.com/recalls/Chevrolet/Silverado-1500/

Looks like a combination of bad brakes, bad airbags, and bad seat
belts. What could go wrong?

I'll take excessive oil consumption thank you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRMvjeBFFYU

You're welcome.

On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 23:34:56 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

J. Clarke wrote:

On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 19:46:16 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

Leon wrote:


Take Ford for example.... I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues. Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Shoulda got a SILVERAYDO https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfHtcUZXljw


You sure about that?
https://www.dealerrater.com/recalls/Chevrolet/Silverado-1500/

Looks like a combination of bad brakes, bad airbags, and bad seat
belts. What could go wrong?

I'll take excessive oil consumption thank you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRMvjeBFFYU

You're welcome.

That was 12th generation. Does the 14th generation have the same
problem?

Spalted Walt wrote:
Leon wrote:


Take Ford for example.... I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues. Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Shoulda got a SILVERAYDO https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfHtcUZXljw




That's pretty compelling! LOL

On 11/27/2020 2:39 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 10:25:25 AM UTC-5, Leon wrote:


Would I buy again? Hard to say. The Tundra seemed to be a much tougher
truck. The aluminum body on the Ford seems kinda thin in the bed.

My daughter just bought a 2017 Tacoma TRD. It says Off Road on the side,
so now she does sh!t like driving 160 miles on Rimrocker Trail just to get to
a free campsite in Moab (Utah).

The road on the bottom right is the same road that she's on up top. There's
a bunch of really steep switchbacks that get you down there. 3 - 4 MPH max
in some spots.

https://i.imgur.com/Nrhgmeb.jpg

I have done somethigng like that in a car. LOL


Her rig is on the left he

https://i.imgur.com/u1nMNFF.jpg
Well it must have relatively easy, a Nissan was able to make it. ;~)



Cornish Hens and Stuffed squash for Thanksgiving.

https://i.imgur.com/P0rLiyr.jpg

Nothing like a camp fire meal. At my son's wedding in Bandara, Texas,
we all got up before day break, rode horses to a spot in the woods where
the staff had a camp fire breakfast. Yum!



She hung back to take this picture of her friends:

https://i.imgur.com/hebNQSF.jpg


I love that part of the country. We used to vacation there a lot up
until about 15 Years ago.

On 11/27/2020 1:46 PM, Spalted Walt wrote:
Leon wrote:


Take Ford for example.... I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues. Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Shoulda got a SILVERAYDO https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfHtcUZXljw




LOL


Had one of those too. They break down repeatedly with the same problem.

97 Silverado. 2 Alternators, Water Pump, 2 Intake manifold gaskets, 2
heater heater hose couplings. Blower motor.

I used to work at a GM dealership, Service Sales Manager, Parts
Manager, and the GM for an AC/Delco wholesale distributor.

We stocked hundreds of single part number AC compressors, Starters,
Alternators, and blower motors.

On 11/27/2020 5:34 PM, Spalted Walt wrote:
J. Clarke wrote:

On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 19:46:16 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

Leon wrote:


Take Ford for example.... I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues. Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Shoulda got a SILVERAYDO https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfHtcUZXljw


You sure about that?
https://www.dealerrater.com/recalls/Chevrolet/Silverado-1500/

Looks like a combination of bad brakes, bad airbags, and bad seat
belts. What could go wrong?

I'll take excessive oil consumption thank you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRMvjeBFFYU

You're welcome.


Not an uncommon problem with any brand 4 WD. Ram has/had that issue too.

On Saturday, November 28, 2020 at 11:47:24 AM UTC-5, Leon wrote:
On 11/27/2020 2:39 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 10:25:25 AM UTC-5, Leon wrote:


Would I buy again? Hard to say. The Tundra seemed to be a much tougher
truck. The aluminum body on the Ford seems kinda thin in the bed.

My daughter just bought a 2017 Tacoma TRD. It says Off Road on the side,
so now she does sh!t like driving 160 miles on Rimrocker Trail just to get to
a free campsite in Moab (Utah).

The road on the bottom right is the same road that she's on up top. There's
a bunch of really steep switchbacks that get you down there. 3 - 4 MPH max
in some spots.

https://i.imgur.com/Nrhgmeb.jpg
I have done somethigng like that in a car. LOL

Her rig is on the left he

https://i.imgur.com/u1nMNFF.jpg
Well it must have relatively easy, a Nissan was able to make it. ;~)

Cornish Hens and Stuffed squash for Thanksgiving.

https://i.imgur.com/P0rLiyr.jpg
Nothing like a camp fire meal. At my son's wedding in Bandara, Texas,
we all got up before day break, rode horses to a spot in the woods where
the staff had a camp fire breakfast. Yum!

She hung back to take this picture of her friends:

https://i.imgur.com/hebNQSF.jpg

I love that part of the country. We used to vacation there a lot up
until about 15 Years ago.

Here's something that my daughter and I found quite interesting.

She had sent me the pictures of the campsite, the meal and the
white truck on the cliff earlier this week. (The Thanksgiving meal
was actually enjoyed on the weekend before Thanksgiving.)

She didn't send me that picture of her truck on the road until
yesterday. Prior to that, when I was describing the trip to other
folks, I had been using a picture that I found on the web that
I thought was a good image of what the Rimrocker Trail was like.
You'll notice that it's a Bronco, but more importantly, look at the
location.

The image I was using last week:

https://i.imgur.com/2EBxaGq.jpg

The image my daughter sent me yesterday:

https://i.imgur.com/Nrhgmeb.jpg

160 miles of trail. Hundreds of web images for me to choose from.
Innumerable spots that she could have stopped to take a picture,
and we both chose the same spot.

Coincidence or connection?

On Sat, 28 Nov 2020 10:55:38 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 11/27/2020 1:46 PM, Spalted Walt wrote:
Leon wrote:


Take Ford for example.... I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues. Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Shoulda got a SILVERAYDO https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfHtcUZXljw




LOL


Had one of those too. They break down repeatedly with the same problem.

97 Silverado. 2 Alternators, Water Pump, 2 Intake manifold gaskets, 2
heater heater hose couplings. Blower motor.

I used to work at a GM dealership, Service Sales Manager, Parts
Manager, and the GM for an AC/Delco wholesale distributor.

We stocked hundreds of single part number AC compressors, Starters,
Alternators, and blower motors.

I have just over 100K on my F150. So far, the only things I've
replaced are batteries(2), tires(1 set), brakes, and plugs. Of course
oil, filters, and all the routine stuff.

This is the only vehicle I've had that's gone over 100K. My Ranger
might have limped over the line, before it was put out of its misery.

On Saturday, November 28, 2020 at 6:55:56 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Sat, 28 Nov 2020 10:55:38 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:
On 11/27/2020 1:46 PM, Spalted Walt wrote:
Leon wrote:


Take Ford for example.... I bought a 2019 F150 last year and it is a
really nice vehicle but it has had a number of issues. Stupid issues
that the dealer nor factory rep could figure out.

Shoulda got a SILVERAYDO https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfHtcUZXljw




LOL


Had one of those too. They break down repeatedly with the same problem.

97 Silverado. 2 Alternators, Water Pump, 2 Intake manifold gaskets, 2
heater heater hose couplings. Blower motor.

I used to work at a GM dealership, Service Sales Manager, Parts
Manager, and the GM for an AC/Delco wholesale distributor.

We stocked hundreds of single part number AC compressors, Starters,
Alternators, and blower motors.
I have just over 100K on my F150. So far, the only things I've
replaced are batteries(2), tires(1 set), brakes, and plugs. Of course
oil, filters, and all the routine stuff.

This is the only vehicle I've had that's gone over 100K. My Ranger
might have limped over the line, before it was put out of its misery.

Current Family Hondas: 2017 Odyssey EX-L, 2019 HR-V EX-L,
2011 CR-V EX, 2007 CR-V EX-L

Former Family Hondas: 2004 Odyssey LX, 2006 Odyssey EX-L,
2007 Civic LX, 2003 Element EX AWD

Except for the 17 Ody and 19 HR-V, all of the other vehicles
either have or did have well over 100K when they were either
sold or traded in. The 04 and 06 Odyssey's had over 160K.

The insurance company bought the 04 Ody...

https://i.imgur.com/A5gCcsO.jpg