On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 21:00:53 -0000, FromTheRafters wrote:

Ralph Mowery was thinking very hard :
In article , says...

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 18:12:58 -0000, Ralph Mowery
wrote:


For some reason one of the lights in a room comes on when the switch is
down and off when up. Not sure if it is a 3 way switch that I can't
find another switch for , of if someone just installed it upside down.
Thought about looking and changing it, but just too lazey. That light is
seldom used anyway.

That's the normal way. Down for on, off for up.

Could be where you are, but in the US (atleast southern US) it is up for
on. All the other switches that are single and not the 3 way types are
up for on. Same as everywhere I have been in the US.

If you mount them wrong, they're down for NO.

You mount them the way you want them. Do not give in to communists! You can choose how your own house works!

--
Your mouse has moved. Windows must be restarted for this change to take effect.

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 21:18:37 -0000, wrote:

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 19:49:50 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
wrote:

This is actually driven by the code. It is required to have a
lighting outlet (luminaire or a receptacle) in every habitable room.
Nobody feels the need for a switch at every receptacle since virtually
all equipment has a switch on it.

What a stupid code. We have lights on the ceiling, with a switch by the door (or in my case a PIR).


It sounds like the same rule there. The light on the ceiling is a
"luminaire" but you can also just have a receptacle on that switch.
(for a lamp) Ceiling lights were out of fashion here for a while so
the code was amended. Now everyone wants a fan with a light in it so
the code had to upgrade those ceiling boxes to handle a 50 pound fan.

There shouldn't be a code. Do what you want in your own house, or there is no freedom. You guys built America so you were the land of the free, then you let your government dictate to you how you operate your own ****ing lights!

--
A bird in the hand is always greener than the grass under the other guy's bushes.

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 21:20:45 -0000, wrote:

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 20:00:17 +0000, Bod wrote:

On 23/12/2016 18:52, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

That's the normal way. Down for on, off for up.

My thoughts exactly.

I noticed that in New Zealand too. Maybe it has something to do with
driving on the wrong side of the road. The in and out door at a store
is backward too. ;-)

You're so sad that you remember which side in and out usually is?

--
TEACHER: Millie, give me a sentence starting with "I"
MILLIE: I is..
TEACHER: No, Millie ..... Always say, "I am"
MILLIE: All right... "I am the ninth letter of the alphabet"

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 21:26:32 -0000, wrote:

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 20:28:16 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
wrote:

Not that I've had a lightswitch in my house for a decade. They're all automated. The cats can turn them on too.


My "walking around" lights, inside and out are PIR but the light in
the bedrooms and "task lights" are on switches.
It is still fairly unusual here tho.
I started with the motion light in the kitchen after I found the wife
and daughter using the fridge light as a night light. Sometimes it
would stay open until morning. I have rope under the toe kicks and
over the train track so you can see enough to get a drink or a quick
snack.

I have everything by a PIR, mostly mounted in place of the old wall switch, except the large living room where I have 3 PIRs as you can often be out of sight of one.

--
A single blonde pregnant girl goes to the grocery store. A couple that she knows notices she's pregnant.
The lady asks her, "Whose baby is it?"
The blonde says, "Well, I don't know they are going to do blood tests, but I think it's mine."

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 21:36:12 -0000, wrote:

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 15:34:53 -0500, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

That's the normal way. Down for on, off for up.

Could be where you are, but in the US (atleast southern US) it is up for
on.

The code does not define up or down with snap switches but it does say
up is on for circuit breakers and unit disconnects that operate up and
down. There is no preference on side to side operation.
This probably came from the code rule about knife switches where it
says gravity shall not tend to move a switch to the on position.

Circuit breakers are operated with a spring. The code specifying up or down for off is ****ing beyond a joke. Do these red tape ****wits have nothing better to do with their lives?

--
A statistician took a standard deviation from his normal way home because the mean of the population was after him.

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 22:34:01 -0000, wrote:

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 15:08:58 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 18:52:37 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
wrote:

That's the normal way. Down for on, off for up.

Not here.
The limeys "open" a switch to turn something on, too, while the rest
of the world "close" it.

No, closing a switch turns it on, this is a scientific fact and indisputable and the same in every country. Are you a woman or a man today Clare?

--
BREAKFAST.SYS halted... Cereal port not responding.

On Sat, 24 Dec 2016 00:22:53 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
wrote:

It sounds like the same rule there. The light on the ceiling is a
"luminaire" but you can also just have a receptacle on that switch.
(for a lamp) Ceiling lights were out of fashion here for a while so
the code was amended. Now everyone wants a fan with a light in it so
the code had to upgrade those ceiling boxes to handle a 50 pound fan.

There shouldn't be a code. Do what you want in your own house, or there is no freedom. You guys built America so you were the land of the free, then you let your government dictate to you how you operate your own ****ing lights!

--

I agree but it is what it is.
If it makes you feel better, the code really only affects builders.
Once you move in you will never see an inspector again if you never
get a permit for anything.
I seldom do and when I do I get to the place where they will sign off
the permit as fast as I can and then do what I want.
I believe in the intent of the code, safety, but I am willing to avoid
some of the BS if it is not dangerous.

On Sat, 24 Dec 2016 00:23:22 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
wrote:

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 21:20:45 -0000, wrote:

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 20:00:17 +0000, Bod wrote:

On 23/12/2016 18:52, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

That's the normal way. Down for on, off for up.

My thoughts exactly.

I noticed that in New Zealand too. Maybe it has something to do with
driving on the wrong side of the road. The in and out door at a store
is backward too. ;-)

You're so sad that you remember which side in and out usually is?

I notice when I walk up to the door that is supposed to be the in and
it opens toward me with someone coming out.

On Sat, 24 Dec 2016 00:25:45 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
wrote:

The code does not define up or down with snap switches but it does say
up is on for circuit breakers and unit disconnects that operate up and
down. There is no preference on side to side operation.
This probably came from the code rule about knife switches where it
says gravity shall not tend to move a switch to the on position.

Circuit breakers are operated with a spring. The code specifying up or down for off is ****ing beyond a joke. Do these red tape ****wits have nothing better to do with their lives?


Since most panels have breakers going side to side, it is really not
that big a deal. The knife switch is really an archaic thing. I doubt
most people here have ever even seen one except in the movies.
They do want disconnects to be installed in a uniform way, just to
avoid confusion when someone may need to operate it in a hurry

On 12/23/2016 04:34 PM, wrote:

[snip]

The limeys "open" a switch to turn something on, too, while the rest
of the world "close" it.


That might have come from gas lights, where you OPEN the valve when you
want light.

--
2 days until the winter celebration (Sunday December 25, 2016 12:00:00
AM for 1 day).

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"I haven't lost my mind -- it's backed up on tape somewhere."

On 12/23/2016 01:49 PM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

[snip]


Floor lamps have foot-activated switches. Table lamps have a switch on
the cord or next to the bulb, or the fancy ones you touch the base and
it detects you by capacitance.

I've never seen a lamp with a foot switch. Most lamps (floor or table,
doesn't matter) I see have a switch built into the socket. I do have a
couple of touch lamps, including one that "touches" itself.

[snip]

--
2 days until the winter celebration (Sunday December 25, 2016 12:00:00
AM for 1 day).

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"I haven't lost my mind -- it's backed up on tape somewhere."

On 12/23/2016 02:08 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 18:52:37 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
wrote:

That's the normal way. Down for on, off for up.

Not here.


It's possible it was a replacement switch and the wires were too short
to turn it the right way. I've had one like that.

--
2 days until the winter celebration (Sunday December 25, 2016 12:00:00
AM for 1 day).

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"I haven't lost my mind -- it's backed up on tape somewhere."

On 12/23/2016 03:26 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 20:28:16 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
wrote:

Not that I've had a lightswitch in my house for a decade. They're all automated. The cats can turn them on too.


My "walking around" lights, inside and out are PIR but the light in
the bedrooms and "task lights" are on switches.
It is still fairly unusual here tho.
I started with the motion light in the kitchen after I found the wife
and daughter using the fridge light as a night light. Sometimes it
would stay open until morning. I have rope under the toe kicks and
over the train track so you can see enough to get a drink or a quick
snack.


I have a string of red LED holiday lights in the hall. These are called
"Lilly's Lights", after a small cat I used to have. She often slept in
the hall are the lights were to avoid stepping on her.

--
2 days until the winter celebration (Sunday December 25, 2016 12:00:00
AM for 1 day).

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"I haven't lost my mind -- it's backed up on tape somewhere."

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 20:15:38 -0600, Mark Lloyd
wrote:

I've never seen a lamp with a foot switch.

They were pretty common years ago here. You can still buy the
switches.

http://www.mylampparts.com/Departments/SWITCHES/PUSH-BUTTON-SWITCHES/METAL-TWO-CIRCUIT-PUSH-BUTTONS.aspx

On 12/23/2016 9:15 PM, Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 12/23/2016 01:49 PM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

[snip]


Floor lamps have foot-activated switches. Table lamps have a switch on
the cord or next to the bulb, or the fancy ones you touch the base and
it detects you by capacitance.

I've never seen a lamp with a foot switch. Most lamps (floor or table,
doesn't matter) I see have a switch built into the socket. I do have a
couple of touch lamps, including one that "touches" itself.

[snip]


Bought a new floor lamp about 12 years ago. Foot switch with dimmer.
First time I saw one

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 20:15:38 -0600, Mark Lloyd
wrote:

On 12/23/2016 01:49 PM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

[snip]


Floor lamps have foot-activated switches. Table lamps have a switch on
the cord or next to the bulb, or the fancy ones you touch the base and
it detects you by capacitance.

I've never seen a lamp with a foot switch. Most lamps (floor or table,
doesn't matter) I see have a switch built into the socket. I do have a
couple of touch lamps, including one that "touches" itself.

[snip]
It's another British thing. Push-on push-off switches on the base of
floor lamps were somewhat common in the British colonies as well (I
ran across a few in Zambia) - If you tripped over the light in the
dark it would turn on - or if you tripped over something in the dark
and banged your head on the lamp. I always found the darn things to be
a royal pain in the tush.

On Friday, December 23, 2016 at 12:33:13 PM UTC-6, Bod wrote:
On 23/12/2016 18:25, trader_4 wrote:
On Friday, December 23, 2016 at 11:01:38 AM UTC-5, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 02:19:20 -0000, wrote:

On Thu, 22 Dec 2016 23:37:43 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
wrote:

On Thu, 22 Dec 2016 19:57:23 -0000, Dave C wrote:

I have an AC wall socket, currently controlled by a wall switch. I
would like to change that outlet, so the one of the plugs is always
ON. The other plug would remaqin as is, ergo controlled by the wall
switch. I purchased a prior house with that configuartion for one
socket. Alas I never looked to see how that "split" outlet
configuration was implemented.

Can one inform me, how to make this change? Thanks

What century are you living in? All my sockets have switches on them.

What country is a better question.
The part you are missing is "wall switch". This is a switch near the
door that controls a receptacle somewhere in the room. (for a lamp)
It is not a switch right on the receptacle.

Makes more sense to have the switch no the socket, then it's clear what it's for and where to find it.


Yeah, that works real great for a floor lamp. When you enter the room
in the dark, you can move the sofa, crawl behind it, to turn on the switch
for the floor lamp. Idiot.

You have the choice to leave the socket switch in the on position.
Some people like to switch, say, a tv completely off and not to leave it
on standby.

The old "Instant On" tube type TV sets used a lot of power on standby to keep the CRT and vacuum tube filaments half powered so the set would come on more or less instantly. My LED TV might draw a few milliamps when it's off to keep the IR remote control circuitry active so it would be silly to unplug or kill the power to it. ヽ(€¢€¿€¢)ノ

[8~{} Uncle Instant Monster

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 20:12:44 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:


The old "Instant On" tube type TV sets used a lot of power on standby to keep the CRT and vacuum tube filaments half powered so the set would come on more or less instantly. My LED TV might draw a few milliamps when it's off to keep the IR remote control circuitry active so it would be silly to unplug or kill the power to it.
?(€¢?€¢)?

[8~{} Uncle Instant Monster

"Smart" TVs will draw more because there is a processor running all
the time and even loafing along, it is still going to draw something.
Cranked up it can stream and process 1080 HD content so that makes it
a pretty powerful PC.

On Friday, December 23, 2016 at 12:52:46 PM UTC-6, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 18:12:58 -0000, Ralph Mowery wrote:

In article ,
says...
--
I could always add a switch next to an outlet which would be fine for a kitchen counter or workbench. I actually had switches for the outlets on my workbench. The problem here in the States is that most of our electrical outlets are around foot off the floor so bending down to turn something on and off could be difficult especially if the outlet is behind a couch. Back at my home, I have two switches on the
wall inside next to the front door. One is for the porch light and the other controls the outlet under the front window for a lamp so one can turn it on when entering a dark house. The rest of the electrical outlets including those above the kitchen counters are not switched. ?(?)?

One of the outlets in my house is switched on with the wall switch where
you come into the room. The house was built around 1985.

For some reason one of the lights in a room comes on when the switch is
down and off when up. Not sure if it is a 3 way switch that I can't
find another switch for , of if someone just installed it upside down.
Thought about looking and changing it, but just too lazey. That light is
seldom used anyway.

That's the normal way. Down for on, off for up.
--


Here a light switch is toggled into the up position for "ON". you Limeys do things backwards. Heck, you even drive on the wrong side of the road. Strange for a seafaring nation where ships traditionally pass to the right when approaching each other. I thought that would have happened on roadways there too. My British cousins do seem to be contrarians. I believe that's why we divorced. ヽ(ヅ)ノ

[8~{} Uncle Related Monster

On Friday, December 23, 2016 at 2:03:46 PM UTC-6, Bod wrote:
On 23/12/2016 19:16, Dave C wrote:
On Thu, 22 Dec 2016 14:57:23 -0500, Dave C wrote:

I have an AC wall socket, currently controlled by a wall switch. I
would like to change that outlet, so the one of the plugs is always
ON. The other plug would remaqin as is, ergo controlled by the wall
switch. I purchased a prior house with that configuartion for one
socket. Alas I never looked to see how that "split" outlet
configuration was implemented.

Can one inform me, how to make this change? Thanks


Thanks to the Many responder for the extensive, timely advise. With
your advise I now have a switched/ half hot outlet.

Is the word *advise*(in the context that you are using the word) instead
of *advice* the way it is spelt in the US?

Advice /ədˈvīs/, noun,"Guidance or recommendations concerning prudent future action, typically given by someone regarded as knowledgeable or authoritative."

Advise /ədˈvīz/,verb advise 3rd person present advises past tense advised past participle advised gerund or present participle advising,"Offer suggestions about the best course of action to someone."

English is a funny, hard to learn language full of contradictions. ヽ(ヅ)ノ

[8~{} Uncle Southern Monster

On Friday, December 23, 2016 at 10:29:16 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 20:12:44 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

The old "Instant On" tube type TV sets used a lot of power on standby to keep the CRT and vacuum tube filaments half powered so the set would come on more or less instantly. My LED TV might draw a few milliamps when it's off to keep the IR remote control circuitry active so it would be silly to unplug or kill the power to it.
?(€¢?€¢)?

[8~{} Uncle Instant Monster

"Smart" TVs will draw more because there is a processor running all
the time and even loafing along, it is still going to draw something.
Cranked up it can stream and process 1080 HD content so that makes it
a pretty powerful PC.

I just have a dumbass LED TV but at least it has HDMI ports in addition to a VGA port so I can hook it to my laptops or most other computers. ヽ(ヅ)ノ

[8~{} Uncle Lap Monster

On Friday, December 23, 2016 at 9:15:41 PM UTC-5, Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 12/23/2016 01:49 PM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

[snip]


Floor lamps have foot-activated switches. Table lamps have a switch on
the cord or next to the bulb, or the fancy ones you touch the base and
it detects you by capacitance.

I've never seen a lamp with a foot switch. Most lamps (floor or table,
doesn't matter) I see have a switch built into the socket. I do have a
couple of touch lamps, including one that "touches" itself.

[snip]

--

I have 2 floor lamps with foot switches. One is alway "on" and plugged into a split, switched
receptacle, which, believe it or not, was the original topic of this thread. ;-)

"Uncle Monster" wrote in message
...

On Thursday, December 22, 2016 at 5:37:53 PM UTC-6, James Wilkinson Sword
wrote:
On Thu, 22 Dec 2016 19:57:23 -0000, Dave C wrote:

I have an AC wall socket, currently controlled by a wall switch. I
would like to change that outlet, so the one of the plugs is always
ON. The other plug would remaqin as is, ergo controlled by the wall
switch. I purchased a prior house with that configuartion for one
socket. Alas I never looked to see how that "split" outlet
configuration was implemented.

Can one inform me, how to make this change? Thanks

What century are you living in? All my sockets have switches on them.
--


You do know that North American wiring standards, voltages and frequency of
normal AC power for homes. business and industry are quite different from
those of Europe? Your inductive hum is lower and more masculine. I suppose
that's a point of pride for you. ヽ(ヅ)ノ

[8~{} Uncle Humming Monster

****Simple answers ****
Can I change duplex outlet that one half works of the switch and other being
directly on the line:: €œNO€� unless you can run additional line, you need
four wires 2 Hot one Neutral and one for Ground, Only then you can split
the duplex, one output hook to hot line and one hook on the line coming from
the switch. This is for 120 Voltage source USA standard Receptacle.

Comments has being made that is not convenient, if you enter in room need to
go behind sofa to put lamp €œon€�. Yes it defiantly sound pretty stupid. But
why one would need to do that Most of Lamps in USA comes with the switch at
the bulb socket, some come in the base of Table lamps, or you can get sound
activated switch or intrusion switch, any one comes in room the lights goes
on, they are made with time delays built in to them for on or off, that are
some remote ones that you not need do anything but plug it in.

Yes Europe power is 50 cycle (Hrz), While USA is 60 cycle (Hrz) . Please
Note; resistive loads can run very efficiently on both powers. For inductive
loads €œIt will not€� Voltage must be reduce apx. 10 to 15%. for American made
motors to run on 50 Hrz. At 50 Hrz motors will draw more current that will
cause overheat and shout down or will burn up..

As for leakage I do not believe that makes any difference with 50 or 60
Herz. However Voltage does make differences, and when it is said leakage
into what across what ???
Remember working with USA 120 Standard and working with 1000 volt (Example)
is big difference.

Some one made comment that if power is made by nuclear power plant that it
will have greater spark when connecting or disconnecting, I am sorry but
that must be a joke, the Electricity that you get in your home could have
being made with you €œfarts€� it would not make any difference to home owner
and dose not make any difference what power the €œGenerators€� that turn it to
make electricity.

What country is a better question.
The part you are missing is "wall switch". This is a switch near the
door that controls a receptacle somewhere in the room. (for a lamp)
It is not a switch right on the receptacle.

Makes more sense to have the switch no the socket, then it's clear
what it's for and where to find it.


Yeah, that works real great for a floor lamp. When you enter the room
in the dark, you can move the sofa, crawl behind it, to turn on the
switch
for the floor lamp. Idiot.

You have the choice to leave the socket switch in the on position.
Some people like to switch, say, a tv completely off and not to
leave it
on standby.

I remember when VCRs came out, it took years to convince my dad it was
easier to leave the VCR on all night than to reset the ****ing clock
every time you wanted to record something!

Ha! I remember my inlaws switching *every* socket off every night
before bed.

I know two people who think electricity leaks out of a socket if no plug
is in it.

Lol, are you serious?

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 20:54:43 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

On Friday, December 23, 2016 at 10:29:16 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 20:12:44 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

The old "Instant On" tube type TV sets used a lot of power on standby to keep the CRT and vacuum tube filaments half powered so the set would come on more or less instantly. My LED TV might draw a few milliamps when it's off to keep the IR remote control circuitry active so it would be silly to unplug or kill the power to it.
?(€¢?€¢)?

[8~{} Uncle Instant Monster

"Smart" TVs will draw more because there is a processor running all
the time and even loafing along, it is still going to draw something.
Cranked up it can stream and process 1080 HD content so that makes it
a pretty powerful PC.

I just have a dumbass LED TV but at least it has HDMI ports in addition to a VGA port so I can hook it to my laptops or most other computers. ?(?)?


I have 4 dumb TVs and 1 smart one. The dumb ones all have a PC
connected to them, making them smarter than the smart TV. One we never
use and I am thinking of just bringing it here to use as a monitor for
this PC

On Saturday, December 24, 2016 at 12:52:08 AM UTC-6, wrote:
On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 20:54:43 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

On Friday, December 23, 2016 at 10:29:16 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 20:12:44 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

The old "Instant On" tube type TV sets used a lot of power on standby to keep the CRT and vacuum tube filaments half powered so the set would come on more or less instantly. My LED TV might draw a few milliamps when it's off to keep the IR remote control circuitry active so it would be silly to unplug or kill the power to it.
?(€¢?€¢)?

[8~{} Uncle Instant Monster

"Smart" TVs will draw more because there is a processor running all
the time and even loafing along, it is still going to draw something.
Cranked up it can stream and process 1080 HD content so that makes it
a pretty powerful PC.

I just have a dumbass LED TV but at least it has HDMI ports in addition to a VGA port so I can hook it to my laptops or most other computers. ?(?)?

I have 4 dumb TVs and 1 smart one. The dumb ones all have a PC
connected to them, making them smarter than the smart TV. One we never
use and I am thinking of just bringing it here to use as a monitor for
this PC


I have my 32" LED TV hooked to the cable here at the center so I can watch the news and to the Dell laptop my little red haired girlfriend brought me via an HDMI port so I can watch Amazon Prime Video and other content I get through the WiFi here. The Chromebook is for web surfing, Email and Usenet. I've been binge watching TV series from start to finish on Amazon prime on both the TV and my 7" Fire tablet I got on sale for $40.00 off Amazon. I used to take a book or newspaper(remember them) to the bathroom when I needed to drop a load of ready-mix. Now I take my little Fire tablet. On Amazon Prime, I just finished watching a TV series called "Charlie Jade" that was filmed in South Africa and it was amazingly good and well made. I think the series ended too soon, I wish there had been more episodes. ヽ(ヅ)ノ

https://www.amazon.com/The-Power-of-.../dp/B01KL1LDQ2

[8~{} Uncle Jaded Monster

On Saturday, December 24, 2016 at 12:14:48 AM UTC-6, Tony944 wrote:
"Uncle Monster" wrote in message
...

On Thursday, December 22, 2016 at 5:37:53 PM UTC-6, James Wilkinson Sword
wrote:
On Thu, 22 Dec 2016 19:57:23 -0000, Dave C wrote:

I have an AC wall socket, currently controlled by a wall switch. I
would like to change that outlet, so the one of the plugs is always
ON. The other plug would remaqin as is, ergo controlled by the wall
switch. I purchased a prior house with that configuartion for one
socket. Alas I never looked to see how that "split" outlet
configuration was implemented.

Can one inform me, how to make this change? Thanks

What century are you living in? All my sockets have switches on them.
--


You do know that North American wiring standards, voltages and frequency of
normal AC power for homes. business and industry are quite different from
those of Europe? Your inductive hum is lower and more masculine. I suppose
that's a point of pride for you. ヽ(ヅ)ノ

[8~{} Uncle Humming Monster

****Simple answers ****
Can I change duplex outlet that one half works of the switch and other being
directly on the line:: €œNO€� unless you can run additional line, you need
four wires 2 Hot one Neutral and one for Ground, Only then you can split
the duplex, one output hook to hot line and one hook on the line coming from
the switch. This is for 120 Voltage source USA standard Receptacle.


All of the switched outlets I ever wired had the feed at the outlet not the switch. The power to the outlet was daisy chained to the other outlets in the room and a piece of Romex was run to the switch to control the power to one or both sides of the duplex receptacle. Having the feed at the receptacle means you only have to break the hot tab to separate the sides and switch one of them. ヽ(ヅ)ノ

Yes Europe power is 50 cycle (Hrz), While USA is 60 cycle (Hrz) . Please
Note; resistive loads can run very efficiently on both powers. For inductive
loads €œIt will not€� Voltage must be reduce apx. 10 to 15%.. for American made
motors to run on 50 Hrz. At 50 Hrz motors will draw more current that will
cause overheat and shout down or will burn up..

As for leakage I do not believe that makes any difference with 50 or 60
Herz. However Voltage does make differences, and when it is said leakage
into what across what ???
Remember working with USA 120 Standard and working with 1000 volt (Example)
is big difference.


The 50hz transformers are larger than 60hz transformers. Aircraft power systems often run on 400hz AC power and the transformers in the avionics are much smaller and lighter than the terrestrial 50 and 60 Hertz transformers. ヽ(ヅ)ノ

http://www.engineering.com/Electroni...-and-60Hz.aspx

[8~{} Uncle Hertzian Monster

On Friday, December 23, 2016 at 3:03:46 PM UTC-5, Bod wrote:
On 23/12/2016 19:16, Dave C wrote:
On Thu, 22 Dec 2016 14:57:23 -0500, Dave C wrote:

I have an AC wall socket, currently controlled by a wall switch. I
would like to change that outlet, so the one of the plugs is always
ON. The other plug would remaqin as is, ergo controlled by the wall
switch. I purchased a prior house with that configuartion for one
socket. Alas I never looked to see how that "split" outlet
configuration was implemented.

Can one inform me, how to make this change? Thanks


Thanks to the Many responder for the extensive, timely advise. With
your advise I now have a switched/ half hot outlet.

Is the word *advise*(in the context that you are using the word) instead
of *advice* the way it is spelt in the US?

No. It is an ordinary typographical error.

Cindy Hamilton
Former proofreader

On 24/12/2016 11:38, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
On Friday, December 23, 2016 at 3:03:46 PM UTC-5, Bod wrote:
On 23/12/2016 19:16, Dave C wrote:
On Thu, 22 Dec 2016 14:57:23 -0500, Dave C wrote:

I have an AC wall socket, currently controlled by a wall switch. I
would like to change that outlet, so the one of the plugs is always
ON. The other plug would remaqin as is, ergo controlled by the wall
switch. I purchased a prior house with that configuartion for one
socket. Alas I never looked to see how that "split" outlet
configuration was implemented.

Can one inform me, how to make this change? Thanks


Thanks to the Many responder for the extensive, timely advise. With
your advise I now have a switched/ half hot outlet.

Is the word *advise*(in the context that you are using the word) instead
of *advice* the way it is spelt in the US?

No. It is an ordinary typographical error.

Cindy Hamilton
Former proofreader

Ok fair enough, we all make em.

On Friday, December 23, 2016 at 3:27:45 PM UTC-5, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 20:16:28 -0000, Bod wrote:

On 23/12/2016 20:08, wrote:
On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 18:52:37 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
wrote:

That's the normal way. Down for on, off for up.

Not here.

Really?

Actually, it seems to change depending what you're doing. For example I find it odd that my Renault requires me to push the lever down to turn the wipers on. Every other car has been up.

And why is it taps for water and gas are anticlockwise for more, yet volume controls and electric cookers are clockwise for more?

Here, it's counterclockwise for hot (on the left) and clockwise for
cold (on the right). That gives a mirrored movement in each wrist.
I find it very convenient.

Cindy Hamilton

On Saturday, December 24, 2016 at 1:14:48 AM UTC-5, Tony944 wrote:
"Uncle Monster" wrote in message
...

On Thursday, December 22, 2016 at 5:37:53 PM UTC-6, James Wilkinson Sword
wrote:
On Thu, 22 Dec 2016 19:57:23 -0000, Dave C wrote:

I have an AC wall socket, currently controlled by a wall switch. I
would like to change that outlet, so the one of the plugs is always
ON. The other plug would remaqin as is, ergo controlled by the wall
switch. I purchased a prior house with that configuartion for one
socket. Alas I never looked to see how that "split" outlet
configuration was implemented.

Can one inform me, how to make this change? Thanks

What century are you living in? All my sockets have switches on them.
--


You do know that North American wiring standards, voltages and frequency of
normal AC power for homes. business and industry are quite different from
those of Europe? Your inductive hum is lower and more masculine. I suppose
that's a point of pride for you. ヽ(ヅ)ノ

[8~{} Uncle Humming Monster

****Simple answers ****
Can I change duplex outlet that one half works of the switch and other being
directly on the line:: €œNO€� unless you can run additional line, you need
four wires 2 Hot one Neutral and one for Ground, Only then you can split
the duplex, one output hook to hot line and one hook on the line coming from
the switch. This is for 120 Voltage source USA standard Receptacle.

That's wrong. If the source hot is already in the receptacle box then the conversion
is fairly simple. You only need to run another wire if the source hot is in the switch
box.


Comments has being made that is not convenient, if you enter in room need to
go behind sofa to put lamp €œon€�. Yes it defiantly sound pretty stupid. But
why one would need to do that Most of Lamps in USA comes with the switch at
the bulb socket, some come in the base of Table lamps, or you can get sound
activated switch or intrusion switch, any one comes in room the lights goes
on, they are made with time delays built in to them for on or off, that are
some remote ones that you not need do anything but plug it in.

If you are going to use the lamp's switch then the location of the switch for the switched
receptacle is a moot point since it will never be switched off.

On Sat, 24 Dec 2016 02:28:22 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

All of the switched outlets I ever wired had the feed at the outlet not the switch. The power to the outlet was daisy chained to the other outlets in the room and a piece of Romex was run to the switch to control the power to one or both sides of the duplex receptacle. Having the feed at the receptacle means you only have to break the hot tab to separate the sides and switch one of them. ?(?)?


The code now requires a neutral at every switch location so you may
see things wired differently. It is because there are so many "smart"
switches coming down the pipe that need a neutral.

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 22:14:49 -0800, "Tony944"
wrote:



"Uncle Monster" wrote in message
...

On Thursday, December 22, 2016 at 5:37:53 PM UTC-6, James Wilkinson Sword
wrote:
On Thu, 22 Dec 2016 19:57:23 -0000, Dave C wrote:

I have an AC wall socket, currently controlled by a wall switch. I
would like to change that outlet, so the one of the plugs is always
ON. The other plug would remaqin as is, ergo controlled by the wall
switch. I purchased a prior house with that configuartion for one
socket. Alas I never looked to see how that "split" outlet
configuration was implemented.

Can one inform me, how to make this change? Thanks

What century are you living in? All my sockets have switches on them.
--


You do know that North American wiring standards, voltages and frequency of
normal AC power for homes. business and industry are quite different from
those of Europe? Your inductive hum is lower and more masculine. I suppose
that's a point of pride for you. ?(?)?

[8~{} Uncle Humming Monster

****Simple answers ****
Can I change duplex outlet that one half works of the switch and other being
directly on the line:: “NO” unless you can run additional line, you need
four wires 2 Hot one Neutral and one for Ground, Only then you can split
the duplex, one output hook to hot line and one hook on the line coming from
the switch. This is for 120 Voltage source USA standard Receptacle.

Comments has being made that is not convenient, if you enter in room need to
go behind sofa to put lamp “on”. Yes it defiantly sound pretty stupid. But
why one would need to do that Most of Lamps in USA comes with the switch at
the bulb socket, some come in the base of Table lamps, or you can get sound
activated switch or intrusion switch, any one comes in room the lights goes
on, they are made with time delays built in to them for on or off, that are
some remote ones that you not need do anything but plug it in.

Yes Europe power is 50 cycle (Hrz), While USA is 60 cycle (Hrz) . Please
Note; resistive loads can run very efficiently on both powers. For inductive
loads “It will not” Voltage must be reduce apx. 10 to 15%. for American made
motors to run on 50 Hrz. At 50 Hrz motors will draw more current that will
cause overheat and shout down or will burn up..

As for leakage I do not believe that makes any difference with 50 or 60
Herz. However Voltage does make differences, and when it is said leakage
into what across what ???
Remember working with USA 120 Standard and working with 1000 volt (Example)
is big difference.

Some one made comment that if power is made by nuclear power plant that it
will have greater spark when connecting or disconnecting, I am sorry but
that must be a joke, the Electricity that you get in your home could have
being made with you “farts” it would not make any difference to home owner
and dose not make any difference what power the “Generators” that turn it to
make electricity.
The "leakage" was a joke too - - -.

On Sat, 24 Dec 2016 02:28:22 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

On Saturday, December 24, 2016 at 12:14:48 AM UTC-6, Tony944 wrote:
"Uncle Monster" wrote in message
...

On Thursday, December 22, 2016 at 5:37:53 PM UTC-6, James Wilkinson Sword
wrote:
On Thu, 22 Dec 2016 19:57:23 -0000, Dave C wrote:

I have an AC wall socket, currently controlled by a wall switch. I
would like to change that outlet, so the one of the plugs is always
ON. The other plug would remaqin as is, ergo controlled by the wall
switch. I purchased a prior house with that configuartion for one
socket. Alas I never looked to see how that "split" outlet
configuration was implemented.

Can one inform me, how to make this change? Thanks

What century are you living in? All my sockets have switches on them.
--


You do know that North American wiring standards, voltages and frequency of
normal AC power for homes. business and industry are quite different from
those of Europe? Your inductive hum is lower and more masculine. I suppose
that's a point of pride for you. ?(?)?

[8~{} Uncle Humming Monster

****Simple answers ****
Can I change duplex outlet that one half works of the switch and other being
directly on the line:: “NO” unless you can run additional line, you need
four wires 2 Hot one Neutral and one for Ground, Only then you can split
the duplex, one output hook to hot line and one hook on the line coming from
the switch. This is for 120 Voltage source USA standard Receptacle.


All of the switched outlets I ever wired had the feed at the outlet not the switch. The power to the outlet was daisy chained to the other outlets in the room and a piece of Romex was run to the switch to control the power to one or both sides of the duplex receptacle. Having the feed at the receptacle means you only have to break the hot tab to separate the sides and switch one of them. ?(?)?

Yes, "drop switch" wiring used to be the most common way of switching
outlets, and even cieling lights, but with the code change requiring
the use of 3 wire cable (neutral required in all boxes) it no longer
really makes sense.
Yes Europe power is 50 cycle (Hrz), While USA is 60 cycle (Hrz) . Please
Note; resistive loads can run very efficiently on both powers. For inductive
loads “It will not” Voltage must be reduce apx. 10 to 15%. for American made
motors to run on 50 Hrz. At 50 Hrz motors will draw more current that will
cause overheat and shout down or will burn up..

As for leakage I do not believe that makes any difference with 50 or 60
Herz. However Voltage does make differences, and when it is said leakage
into what across what ???
Remember working with USA 120 Standard and working with 1000 volt (Example)
is big difference.


The 50hz transformers are larger than 60hz transformers. Aircraft power systems often run on 400hz AC power and the transformers in the avionics are much smaller and lighter than the terrestrial 50 and 60 Hertz transformers. ?(?)?
Correct. Also the reason a 10 amp switch mode power supply is less
than half the size and weight of a 2 amp linear. The inductance of a
coil is a lot higher at gigh frequencies than at low - so the
"effective resistance" of say a 10 turn primary of #18 wire is a lot
lower at 2.5khz than a 2000 turn primary of #22 wire at 60 hz.

http://www.engineering.com/Electroni...-and-60Hz.aspx

[8~{} Uncle Hertzian Monster

On Sat, 24 Dec 2016 05:31:28 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Saturday, December 24, 2016 at 1:14:48 AM UTC-5, Tony944 wrote:
"Uncle Monster" wrote in message
...

On Thursday, December 22, 2016 at 5:37:53 PM UTC-6, James Wilkinson Sword
wrote:
On Thu, 22 Dec 2016 19:57:23 -0000, Dave C wrote:

I have an AC wall socket, currently controlled by a wall switch. I
would like to change that outlet, so the one of the plugs is always
ON. The other plug would remaqin as is, ergo controlled by the wall
switch. I purchased a prior house with that configuartion for one
socket. Alas I never looked to see how that "split" outlet
configuration was implemented.

Can one inform me, how to make this change? Thanks

What century are you living in? All my sockets have switches on them.
--


You do know that North American wiring standards, voltages and frequency of
normal AC power for homes. business and industry are quite different from
those of Europe? Your inductive hum is lower and more masculine. I suppose
that's a point of pride for you. ?(?)?

[8~{} Uncle Humming Monster

****Simple answers ****
Can I change duplex outlet that one half works of the switch and other being
directly on the line:: “NO” unless you can run additional line, you need
four wires 2 Hot one Neutral and one for Ground, Only then you can split
the duplex, one output hook to hot line and one hook on the line coming from
the switch. This is for 120 Voltage source USA standard Receptacle.

That's wrong. If the source hot is already in the receptacle box then the conversion
is fairly simple. You only need to run another wire if the source hot is in the switch
box.


Comments has being made that is not convenient, if you enter in room need to
go behind sofa to put lamp “on”. Yes it defiantly sound pretty stupid. But
why one would need to do that Most of Lamps in USA comes with the switch at
the bulb socket, some come in the base of Table lamps, or you can get sound
activated switch or intrusion switch, any one comes in room the lights goes
on, they are made with time delays built in to them for on or off, that are
some remote ones that you not need do anything but plug it in.

If you are going to use the lamp's switch then the location of the switch for the switched
receptacle is a moot point since it will never be switched off.
But if the lamp is in the far corner of the room from the entry, you
need to walk and trip your way through a dark room to get to the
switch, which in North ASmerican switched outlet practice, is within
armslength of the entrywaY - and in a room with 2 or more entrances is
USUALLY a 3 way (or 4 way) switch.

On Saturday, December 24, 2016 at 8:31:33 AM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Saturday, December 24, 2016 at 1:14:48 AM UTC-5, Tony944 wrote:
"Uncle Monster" wrote in message
...

On Thursday, December 22, 2016 at 5:37:53 PM UTC-6, James Wilkinson Sword
wrote:
On Thu, 22 Dec 2016 19:57:23 -0000, Dave C wrote:

I have an AC wall socket, currently controlled by a wall switch. I
would like to change that outlet, so the one of the plugs is always
ON. The other plug would remaqin as is, ergo controlled by the wall
switch. I purchased a prior house with that configuartion for one
socket. Alas I never looked to see how that "split" outlet
configuration was implemented.

Can one inform me, how to make this change? Thanks

What century are you living in? All my sockets have switches on them..
--


You do know that North American wiring standards, voltages and frequency of
normal AC power for homes. business and industry are quite different from
those of Europe? Your inductive hum is lower and more masculine. I suppose
that's a point of pride for you. ヽ(ヅ)ノ

[8~{} Uncle Humming Monster

****Simple answers ****
Can I change duplex outlet that one half works of the switch and other being
directly on the line:: €œNO€� unless you can run additional line, you need
four wires 2 Hot one Neutral and one for Ground, Only then you can split
the duplex, one output hook to hot line and one hook on the line coming from
the switch. This is for 120 Voltage source USA standard Receptacle.

That's wrong. If the source hot is already in the receptacle box then the conversion
is fairly simple. You only need to run another wire if the source hot is in the switch
box.


+1

Most commonly it's routed hot to switch, but if it's hot to receptacle,
then it's easy.




Comments has being made that is not convenient, if you enter in room need to
go behind sofa to put lamp €œon€�. Yes it defiantly sound pretty stupid. But
why one would need to do that Most of Lamps in USA comes with the switch at
the bulb socket, some come in the base of Table lamps, or you can get sound
activated switch or intrusion switch, any one comes in room the lights goes
on, they are made with time delays built in to them for on or off, that are
some remote ones that you not need do anything but plug it in.

If you are going to use the lamp's switch then the location of the switch for the switched
receptacle is a moot point since it will never be switched off.

+1

On Saturday, December 24, 2016 at 8:37:24 AM UTC-6, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Dec 2016 02:28:22 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

All of the switched outlets I ever wired had the feed at the outlet not the switch. The power to the outlet was daisy chained to the other outlets in the room and a piece of Romex was run to the switch to control the power to one or both sides of the duplex receptacle. Having the feed at the receptacle means you only have to break the hot tab to separate the sides and switch one of them. ?(?)?


The code now requires a neutral at every switch location so you may
see things wired differently. It is because there are so many "smart"
switches coming down the pipe that need a neutral.

Easy, run 14/3 w/ground to every single pole switch or 14/4 w/ground to all 3-way switches. Most of the wiring I did was commercial and industrial so I ran a lot of conduit. I left a pull string in all my conduit runs then this evil stuff called MC cable came along and made commercial wiring TOO easy. Man I ran a lot of that stuff before I wound up gimpy. ヽ(ヅ)ノ

[8~{} Uncle MC Monster Cain't touch dis!

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 17:34:27 -0600, Gordon Shumway
wrote:

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 14:28:57 -0500, Dave C wrote:

On Thu, 22 Dec 2016 14:51:57 -0600, Gordon Shumway
wrote:

On Thu, 22 Dec 2016 14:57:23 -0500, Dave C wrote:

I have an AC wall socket, currently controlled by a wall switch. I
would like to change that outlet, so the one of the plugs is always
ON. The other plug would remaqin as is, ergo controlled by the wall
switch. I purchased a prior house with that configuartion for one
socket. Alas I never looked to see how that "split" outlet
configuration was implemented.

Can one inform me, how to make this change? Thanks

If you have to ask, my advice would be to call an electrician. You don't want to start a fire.

I asked because I did not know how to do a specific home wiring task.
I knew the solution was simple, well within my capabilities -your
snide comment ignored.

Just to set the record straight my advice was not snide. Not knowing your capabilities it was appropriate.

BTW: I am a degreed electrical engineer - though my area of
knowledge/ experience is in designing Electronic Warfare microwave
systems. You can ask me how to design/build a 70 dB DR DLVA 15 MHz
video BW device and I will assist you - as used in ESM RWR receivers

Snide mode activated. If you're a EE you must have been at the bottom of your class.

Snide mode deactivated.

Actually I graduated in the top 20% of an Ivy league University class,
as a EE. I was Director of Engineering at age 37, for a large defense
company. I retired at age 45, 23 years ago because I could !!

I merely asked for advise! Clearly I was not soliciting your USELESS
/Snide commentary !! I was fortunte, that other responders WERE
Helpful, with sage advise that I implimented successfully.

Oddly, as I have followed this site for many years, I may have found
your prior posts helpful. Too bad you find the need to .....

BTW: If you think it is Obvious, to cut the side connection, on the AC
outlet - I also know that you are are a LIAR.

On Sat, 24 Dec 2016 10:52:00 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

On Saturday, December 24, 2016 at 8:37:24 AM UTC-6, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Dec 2016 02:28:22 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

All of the switched outlets I ever wired had the feed at the outlet not the switch. The power to the outlet was daisy chained to the other outlets in the room and a piece of Romex was run to the switch to control the power to one or both sides of the duplex receptacle. Having the feed at the receptacle means you only have to break the hot tab to separate the sides and switch one of them. ?(?)?


The code now requires a neutral at every switch location so you may
see things wired differently. It is because there are so many "smart"
switches coming down the pipe that need a neutral.

Easy, run 14/3 w/ground to every single pole switch or 14/4 w/ground to all 3-way switches. Most of the wiring I did was commercial and industrial so I ran a lot of conduit. I left a pull string in all my conduit runs then this evil stuff called MC cable came along and made commercial wiring TOO easy. Man I ran a lot of that stuff before I wound up gimpy. ?(?)?

[8~{} Uncle MC Monster Cain't touch dis!

Conduit is one exception to that rule, for the reason you mentioned.
Adding a wire is easy.

On Sat, 24 Dec 2016 00:54:37 -0000, wrote:

On Sat, 24 Dec 2016 00:23:22 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
wrote:

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 21:20:45 -0000, wrote:

On Fri, 23 Dec 2016 20:00:17 +0000, Bod wrote:

On 23/12/2016 18:52, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

That's the normal way. Down for on, off for up.

My thoughts exactly.

I noticed that in New Zealand too. Maybe it has something to do with
driving on the wrong side of the road. The in and out door at a store
is backward too. ;-)

You're so sad that you remember which side in and out usually is?

I notice when I walk up to the door that is supposed to be the in and
it opens toward me with someone coming out.

I go to the one marked in. I didn't know there was a standard for left and right. In fact there isn't, I know Aldi here is in on the left and B&Ms and Morrisons' are in on the right, and Asda and Tesco don't have an in and an out. It's just the way the stores happen to be laid out inside.

--
McMurphy fell 12 stories, hitting the pavement like a paper bag filled with vegetable soup.