Last week I posted pictures of my dishwasher that was leaving a cloudy
haze on the glass. The very helpful suggestions were to try it with
less soap as it might be soap buildup. So I ran it with just vinegar
in the soap dispenser, rinse and a few cups in the tub. But still I
got the same haze. It does seem to be cleaining the glasses fine as I
smeared peanut butter over them, and they came out clean.

Could the inside plumbing of the machine be so full of hard water
deposits to be causing this? Will repeated applications of vinegar
clean it up or do I need to call a professional?

The odd thing is the cloudy haze goes right away as soon as I rinse
the glasses with water in the sink. THe pictures are he

http://www.mynonsense.net/temp/

wrote:
Last week I posted pictures of my dishwasher that was leaving a cloudy
haze on the glass. The very helpful suggestions were to try it with
less soap as it might be soap buildup. So I ran it with just vinegar
in the soap dispenser, rinse and a few cups in the tub. But still I
got the same haze. It does seem to be cleaining the glasses fine as I
smeared peanut butter over them, and they came out clean.

Could the inside plumbing of the machine be so full of hard water
deposits to be causing this? Will repeated applications of vinegar
clean it up or do I need to call a professional?

The odd thing is the cloudy haze goes right away as soon as I rinse
the glasses with water in the sink. THe pictures are he

http://www.mynonsense.net/temp/

If you haven't already done so, take off the covered grill and remove
and clean all the parts you have access to. I have a similar model and
deposits on the grills & screens can restrict water flow enough to
affect cleaning.

While you're at it, remove the cylindrical water height switch and clean
that out too. (front left)

On Sep 25, 11:30*am, wrote:
Last week I posted pictures of my dishwasher that was leaving a cloudy
haze on the glass. The very helpful suggestions were to try it with
less soap as it might be soap buildup. So I ran it with just vinegar
in the soap dispenser, rinse and a few cups in the tub. But still I
got the same haze. It does seem to be cleaining the glasses fine as I
smeared peanut butter over them, and they came out clean.

Could the inside plumbing of the machine be so full of hard water
deposits to be causing this? Will repeated applications of vinegar
clean it up or do I need to call a professional?

The odd thing is the cloudy haze goes right away as soon as I rinse
the glasses with water in the sink. THe pictures are he

http://www.mynonsense.net/temp/



How long have you had the dishwasher? How long has it been doing
this?

On Sep 25, 12:50 pm, wrote:
On Sep 25, 11:30 am, wrote:

Last week I posted pictures of my dishwasher that was leaving a cloudy
haze on the glass. The very helpful suggestions were to try it with
less soap as it might be soap buildup. So I ran it with just vinegar
in the soap dispenser, rinse and a few cups in the tub. But still I
got the same haze. It does seem to be cleaining the glasses fine as I
smeared peanut butter over them, and they came out clean.

Could the inside plumbing of the machine be so full of hard water
deposits to be causing this? Will repeated applications of vinegar
clean it up or do I need to call a professional?

The odd thing is the cloudy haze goes right away as soon as I rinse
the glasses with water in the sink. THe pictures are he

http://www.mynonsense.net/temp/

How long have you had the dishwasher? How long has it been doing
this?

It is in a rental property so probably has seen 1-2 years of use. The
current tenants are the one's who noticed this hazing. Perhaps it was
doing it before, but the previous tenants found some solution?

My guess is all the vinegar I am adding is doing something to dissolve
deposits . And these are the deposits causing the haze? Perhaps I need
to run it through a cycle with just plain water and see what happens?

On Sep 25, 11:05 am, Mike Paulsen wrote:

If you haven't already done so, take off the covered grill and remove
and clean all the parts you have access to. I have a similar model and
deposits on the grills & screens can restrict water flow enough to
affect cleaning.

While you're at it, remove the cylindrical water height switch and clean
that out too. (front left)

I think my tenants did clean the grill area and said there was quite a
bit of deposit that had to be cleaned. I will try cleaning the
cylindrical water height switch. Does it just pop out or does it need
to be unscrewed?

On Sep 25, 8:30*am, wrote:
Last week I posted pictures of my dishwasher that was leaving a cloudy
haze on the glass. The very helpful suggestions were to try it with
less soap as it might be soap buildup. So I ran it with just vinegar
in the soap dispenser, rinse and a few cups in the tub. But still I
got the same haze. It does seem to be cleaning the glasses fine as I
smeared peanut butter over them, and they came out clean.

Could the inside plumbing of the machine be so full of hard water
deposits to be causing this? Will repeated applications of vinegar
clean it up or do I need to call a professional?

The odd thing is the cloudy haze goes right away as soon as I rinse
the glasses with water in the sink. THe pictures are he

http://www.mynonsense.net/temp/


There are some differing conditions that can generate the cloudy
glasses that you're getting....and I've expereicned some of them
personally.

Since you rinse away the cloudiness with fresh water from the
tap .......we can eliminate soft water / excess detergent etching.

I don't remember if you mentioned where the dishwasher is located
(local water hard? or soft?) but what your getting reminds me of the
results I was getting in an older home in Tustin, CA. The local water
was pretty hard & my glasses turned out cloudy.

Thinking I needed a new d/w & figuring I didn't need to worry about
ruining the old one, I ran it with 2 cups of ZEP calcium, rust, lime
remover (a cheaper but better ....imo... version of CLR). The water
in the d/w foamed like crazy & I let the d/w do a soak/ scrub cycle.

I did this several times until the water no longer foamed and the Cal-
Rod (water heating element) no longer showed hard water deposits.

Glasses came out fine thereafter but I started to use the energy
saving option to decrease the hard water build up on the Cal-Rod.

I still had to do the ZEP thing a couple times per year but the
glasses stayed clean.

cheers
Bob

wrote:

Last week I posted pictures of my dishwasher that was leaving a cloudy
haze on the glass. The very helpful suggestions were to try it with
less soap as it might be soap buildup. So I ran it with just vinegar
in the soap dispenser, rinse and a few cups in the tub. But still I
got the same haze. It does seem to be cleaining the glasses fine as I
smeared peanut butter over them, and they came out clean.

Could the inside plumbing of the machine be so full of hard water
deposits to be causing this? Will repeated applications of vinegar
clean it up or do I need to call a professional?

The odd thing is the cloudy haze goes right away as soon as I rinse
the glasses with water in the sink. THe pictures are he

http://www.mynonsense.net/temp/


We had a different problem with our dishwasher, which was buildup of
detergent causing
bubbles that prevented it from draining properly. The solution, which
seemed highly doubtful
at first, was to run the dw with no dishes and pour in about a quart of
white vinegar before
beginning the cycle. It worked. I have, in the past, used vinegar to
remove haze from
glassware. You might try running it with more vinegar, as I did. Then
start out using
about half the detergent for a load and see how it goes. Got a water
softener? You
might also want to try a "name brand" dw detergent if you have not already.

It is a litte "off the wall" but the test with a little vinegar might
have dissolved detergent
residue just enough to deposit it on the dishes you did that cycle.
Don't know my
detergent chemistry at all )

wrote in message
...
Last week I posted pictures of my dishwasher that was leaving a cloudy
haze on the glass. The very helpful suggestions were to try it with
less soap as it might be soap buildup. So I ran it with just vinegar
in the soap dispenser, rinse and a few cups in the tub. But still I
got the same haze. It does seem to be cleaining the glasses fine as I
smeared peanut butter over them, and they came out clean.

Could the inside plumbing of the machine be so full of hard water
deposits to be causing this? Will repeated applications of vinegar
clean it up or do I need to call a professional?

The odd thing is the cloudy haze goes right away as soon as I rinse
the glasses with water in the sink. THe pictures are he

http://www.mynonsense.net/temp/

I hate to post something so simple to an old thread BUT

Are you using the jet dri product and is the dispenser working? A DW does
not work with soap only.

Also, IMO a quality powdered soap works better than those liquid guys.

Colbyt

Colbyt wrote:
wrote in message
...
Last week I posted pictures of my dishwasher that was leaving a cloudy
haze on the glass. The very helpful suggestions were to try it with
less soap as it might be soap buildup. So I ran it with just vinegar
in the soap dispenser, rinse and a few cups in the tub. But still I
got the same haze. It does seem to be cleaining the glasses fine as I
smeared peanut butter over them, and they came out clean.

Could the inside plumbing of the machine be so full of hard water
deposits to be causing this? Will repeated applications of vinegar
clean it up or do I need to call a professional?

The odd thing is the cloudy haze goes right away as soon as I rinse
the glasses with water in the sink. THe pictures are he

http://www.mynonsense.net/temp/

I hate to post something so simple to an old thread BUT

Are you using the jet dri product and is the dispenser working? A DW does
not work with soap only.

Also, IMO a quality powdered soap works better than those liquid guys.

Colbyt

I agree with Colbyt's reply and in
addition, a lot has to do with the water.
When I 1st got a portable DW, some 40
years ago, we used it on Lake Michigan
water with absolutely no problems. We
then moved it to our present home
where we had well water that was very
hard. We had dark brown dishes. You
should have seen the white stuff on
them. We started using the rinse stuff
and it
helped a lot, but the best thing was a
water softener. Now we are back to Lake
Michigan water (same house) and it's
good again without the water softener and
even without the rinse agent.

On Sep 25, 5:50*pm, "Colbyt" wrote:
wrote in message

...

Last week I posted pictures of my dishwasher that was leaving a cloudy
haze on the glass. The very helpful suggestions were to try it with
less soap as it might be soap buildup. So I ran it with just vinegar
in the soap dispenser, rinse and a few cups in the tub. But still I
got the same haze. It does seem to be cleaining the glasses fine as I
smeared peanut butter over them, and they came out clean.

Could the inside plumbing of the machine be so full of hard water
deposits to be causing this? Will repeated applications of vinegar
clean it up or do I need to call a professional?

The odd thing is the cloudy haze goes right away as soon as I rinse
the glasses with water in the sink. THe pictures are he

http://www.mynonsense.net/temp/

I hate to post something so simple to an old thread BUT

Are you using the jet dri product and is the dispenser working? *A DW does
not work with soap only.

Never used a rinse aid until I installed the new dishwasher which
strongly recommended its use. What a difference! That's probably the
simplest/fastest/cheapest way to attack the problem, will most likely
solve the problem, and the future cost will be paid for by the tenant
as a consumable.

R

Thanks for all replies, the dishwasher is now working properly! I put
a 2 cups of CLR ( Calcium , lime , rust ) remover in it and ran that.
It started giving off a little smoke and then foamed a lot. After it
completed, I ran a few dirty dishes with no soap, and some vinegar in
the rinse. They came out perfect, no more white cloudy haze! Here's
what I emailed my tenants:

The dishwasher is now working properly. I believe all the hard water
deposits have been cleaned out . At home you will see two glasses I
smeared with peanut butter, jam and the french onion dip. You can
compare them to the hand washed/dried ones. THe trick is to use
vinegar in the rinse AND use a lot less soap. If there is any residue
it is due to the soap buildup . To fix the soap buildup, start off
with just a tablespoon of soap . Also trying other brands can make a
big difference according to the online folks, i.e cascade or
palmolive. Also water needs to be hot for soap to dissolve, so i
raised the water heater temp slightly. Run the sink faucet so the hot
water comes, before starting the DW. Also don't let dishes sit and let
food cake on them overnight and rinse before placing them in the
machine. And also don't overload it as it is not going to clean
effictively.

clipped


I agree with Colbyt's reply and in addition, a lot has to do with the
water.
When I 1st got a portable DW, some 40 years ago, we used it on Lake
Michigan
water with absolutely no problems. We then moved it to our present home
where we had well water that was very hard. We had dark brown
dishes. You
should have seen the white stuff on them. We started using the rinse
stuff and it
helped a lot, but the best thing was a water softener. Now we are
back to Lake
Michigan water (same house) and it's good again without the water
softener and
even without the rinse agent.

Lucky you - soft Lake Mich. water. I switched to liquid Cascade mainly
because
I don't use the dw very often and the powder turned to rock in the box.
We don't
keep the hot water very hot - well below the painful level - I fill only
one dispenser,
run it on regular cycle, and don't use a rinse. Perfect. Only two of
us, so I hand
wash most of the time. No water softener, but the water isn't too bad.

On Sep 26, 1:34 pm, Norminn wrote:
clipped



I agree with Colbyt's reply and in addition, a lot has to do with the
water.
When I 1st got a portable DW, some 40 years ago, we used it on Lake
Michigan
water with absolutely no problems. We then moved it to our present home
where we had well water that was very hard. We had dark brown
dishes. You
should have seen the white stuff on them. We started using the rinse
stuff and it
helped a lot, but the best thing was a water softener. Now we are
back to Lake
Michigan water (same house) and it's good again without the water
softener and
even without the rinse agent.

Lucky you - soft Lake Mich. water. I switched to liquid Cascade mainly
because
I don't use the dw very often and the powder turned to rock in the box.

That's why I immediately decant the powder detergent to a large glass
bottle
which closes tight. Never have any problem with powder hardening
because of exposure to moisture while still in the box.

We don't
keep the hot water very hot - well below the painful level - I fill only
one dispenser,
run it on regular cycle, and don't use a rinse. Perfect. Only two of
us, so I hand
wash most of the time. No water softener, but the water isn't too bad.

Mmm...you must have nice water or you live right!

I need to use one of those bottled rinse thingies. What is in those?

BTW. Plumber told me that it's best to set the water heater on "hot"
for
greater efficiency. Reason the installation instructions scare you
into setting it on
"medium" is so they won't get sued by some idiot burning themselves on
"hot".

Just another example of the ridiculous disclaimers sold with every
product
for fear of litigation.

Your opinions?

"Artful Dodger" wrote in message
...

I need to use one of those bottled rinse thingies. What is in those?


I have no clue what is in them. I know that commercial DW always use them
and have always used them in my home machine. The cost to use is less than
$1 per month if the machine is ran daily. The difference is glassware and
silverware is the most noticable.

Around here the water is very hard and I have no water softner.








BTW. Plumber told me that it's best to set the water heater on "hot"
for greater efficiency. Reason the installation instructions scare you
into setting it on "medium" is so they won't get sued by some idiot
burning themselves on
"hot".
Your opinions?


In the rental properties I set them at the lower recommended setting. Here
it would be not legal for me to do otherwise. In my own home I keep it just
short of scalding . Hot water should be hot.




Colbyt

On Sep 27, 8:40*am, "Colbyt" wrote:
"Artful Dodger" wrote in message

...



I need to use one of those bottled rinse thingies. *What is in those?

I have no clue what is in them. *I know that commercial DW always use them
and have always used them in my home machine. *The cost to use is less than
$1 per month if the machine is ran daily. *The difference is glassware and
silverware *is the most noticable.

I was very surprised the first time I used a rinse aid. I opened the
dishwasher and the entire stainless steel inside, along with
everything in it, looked like it had just been wiped down. Not a
water drop spot to be seen.

Around here the water is very hard and I have no water softner.

BTW. *Plumber told me that it's best to set the water heater on "hot"
for greater efficiency. *Reason the installation instructions scare you
into setting it on "medium" is so they won't get sued by some idiot
burning themselves on
"hot".
Your opinions?

In the rental properties I set them at the lower recommended setting. Here
it would be not legal for me to do otherwise. *In my own home I keep it just
short of scalding . *Hot water should be hot.

Dishwasher manufacturers often recommend running the hot water at the
tap so when the dishwasher calls for water it's hot and not the cooled
off water in the pipes.

R

clipped


BTW. Plumber told me that it's best to set the water heater on "hot"
for
greater efficiency.


Efficiency of dishwasher? Waste of energy?

Reason the installation instructions scare you
into setting it on
"medium" is so they won't get sued by some idiot burning themselves on
"hot".



"Idiots" aren't the only folks who get scalded in showers. 120 is hot
enough to burn in about
two to three seconds and a guest who isn't used to such hot water might
get an unpleasant
surprise.. I like hot water at the tap that isn't hot enough to hurt
when I rinse
dishes. Mechanical action is what cleans 'em at the sink and air dry is
sanitary. Never a
problem with any sort of gi illness that would relate to unsanitary dishes.

Just another example of the ridiculous disclaimers sold with every
product
for fear of litigation.

Your opinions?

"Norminn" wrote in message
m...
clipped
Mechanical action is what cleans 'em at the sink and air dry is sanitary.
Never a
problem with any sort of gi illness that would relate to unsanitary
dishes.


Not picking a fight here cause I don't care how clean your dishes aren't.

180 degree final rinse cycle is required in all food service machines. This
is a NSF standard.


And the lack thereof is considered a major violation of the Health code
standards.

Colbyt

On Sat 27 Sep 2008 06:19:10a, Norminn told us...

Efficiency of dishwasher? Waste of energy?

Efficiency of cleaning. It has nothing to do with energy. Most all
dishwasher detergents are designed to clean optimally at 140°F or higher.

"Idiots" aren't the only folks who get scalded in showers. 120 is hot
enough to burn in about
two to three seconds and a guest who isn't used to such hot water might
get an unpleasant
surprise.. I like hot water at the tap that isn't hot enough to hurt
when I rinse
dishes. Mechanical action is what cleans 'em at the sink and air dry is
sanitary. Never a
problem with any sort of gi illness that would relate to unsanitary
dishes.

Washing dishes in the sink is an entirely different process than using a
dishwasher, and moderately hot water will do the job.

120°F water temperature is totally inadequate for dishwasher washing.
That's why many high-end dishwashers have special heaters to boost the
washing temperature for each fill of the machine. In that case, it's
perfectly fine to keep the hot water tank set at 120°F.

Our contractor provided a mid-line dishwasher in our new home, and while it
has a heater for drying the dishes and *maintaining but not increasing* the
water temperature, it did a lousy job of washing the dishes with the hot
water tank set at 120°F. As soon as I increased the water tank temperature
to 140°F. the dishwasher cleaned flawlessly.


--
Wayne Boatwright

*******************************************
Date: Saturday, 09(IX)/27(XXVII)/08(MMVIII)
*******************************************
Countdown till Veteran's Day
6wks 2dys 8hrs 14mins
*******************************************
If the conniption fits, wear it. -SLR
*******************************************

On Sat 27 Sep 2008 05:40:06a, Colbyt told us...


"Artful Dodger" wrote in message
...

I need to use one of those bottled rinse thingies. What is in those?


I have no clue what is in them. I know that commercial DW always use
them and have always used them in my home machine. The cost to use is
less than $1 per month if the machine is ran daily. The difference is
glassware and silverware is the most noticable.

Around here the water is very hard and I have no water softner.


Rinse agents are surfactants which cause the water to sheet and flow off of
the items in the dishwasher instead of remaining in beads or droplets of
water which turn into spots when dried.


BTW. Plumber told me that it's best to set the water heater on "hot"
for greater efficiency. Reason the installation instructions scare
you into setting it on "medium" is so they won't get sued by some
idiot burning themselves on
"hot".
Your opinions?


In the rental properties I set them at the lower recommended setting.
Here it would be not legal for me to do otherwise. In my own home I
keep it just short of scalding . Hot water should be hot.

--
Wayne Boatwright

*******************************************
Date: Saturday, 09(IX)/27(XXVII)/08(MMVIII)
*******************************************
Countdown till Veteran's Day
6wks 2dys 8hrs 3mins
*******************************************
I was expelled from cooking school,
and it left a bad taste in my mouth.
--George Carlin

Colbyt wrote:

"Norminn" wrote in message
om...


clipped
Mechanical action is what cleans 'em at the sink and air dry is sanitary.
Never a
problem with any sort of gi illness that would relate to unsanitary
dishes.




Not picking a fight here cause I don't care how clean your dishes aren't.

180 degree final rinse cycle is required in all food service machines. This
is a NSF standard.




I'm not operating a restaurant, so I don't have strangers coming in who
haven't washed their hands since
the last toilet or who are carrying hepatitis. I cup up chicken in the
sink and rinse it well. 45 years of
housekeeping and no illnesses of the type assoc. with lack of
sanitation. Raised three children
without any being scalded in the bath, too.

I use bleach to rinse mops and clean bathrooms regularly. That's where
the nasty germs are ) I
use bleach in the laundry too - not for color - no pinkeye from bath
linens.

And the lack thereof is considered a major violation of the Health code
standards.

Colbyt