Any general tips on how to make a structural repair to the broken and
missing Aluminium extension from the friction pintle mount to where it joins
the plastic of the LCD surround ? Fractured at the screw point so only half
the screw hole remains , a highly stressed point, going by the amount of
force required to turn this pintle rod.

On Sun, 9 Aug 2009 22:36:54 +0100, N_Cook wrote:
Any general tips on how to make a structural repair to the broken and
missing Aluminium extension from the friction pintle mount to where it joins
the plastic of the LCD surround ? Fractured at the screw point so only half
the screw hole remains , a highly stressed point, going by the amount of
force required to turn this pintle rod.

Assuming your time is worth more than 1/10th minimum wge, it makes
sense simply to replace the hinge with a replacement part. You can
get one for a few bucks from a junked laptop on ebay.

"AZ Nomad" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 9 Aug 2009 22:36:54 +0100, N_Cook wrote:
Any general tips on how to make a structural repair to the broken and
missing Aluminium extension from the friction pintle mount to where it
joins
the plastic of the LCD surround ? Fractured at the screw point so only
half
the screw hole remains , a highly stressed point, going by the amount of
force required to turn this pintle rod.

Assuming your time is worth more than 1/10th minimum wge, it makes
sense simply to replace the hinge with a replacement part. You can
get one for a few bucks from a junked laptop on ebay.

Mate of mine repairs laptops for a living, and oddly enough, we were
discussing this just a couple of weeks ago, when I was in his shop, and he
told me that he buys new replacement hinges from some place that keeps a lot
of laptop spares. Might even have been an eBay shop. I'll check with him if
you like, but it won't be until Tuesday, because he has Mondays off.

Arfa

On Sun, 9 Aug 2009 22:36:54 +0100, "N_Cook" wrote:

Any general tips on how to make a structural repair to the broken and
missing Aluminium extension from the friction pintle mount to where it joins
the plastic of the LCD surround ?

No, I haven't the slightest idea, especially since you didn't bother
supplying the manufacturer and model number.

If you're missing parts, you can find just about anything from various
online computer salvage operators. Also on eBay. Be prepared to
overpay. The few surviving repair shops that actually do their own
repair usually have a fair collection of scrap parts laying around.
Ask, and you might receive.

Fractured at the screw point so only half
the screw hole remains , a highly stressed point, going by the amount of
force required to turn this pintle rod.

I've used hili-coil inserts to fix those. Also threaded brass inserts
commonly used in plastic molding. Drill it out and epoxy the insert
inplace. The smallest you can get is 4-40 which is a tolerable
substitue for the common 3mm metric screw. I've also mixed aluminum
dust with epoxy and built up the broken part sufficiently to thread
the hole. It worked, but the owner had to be very careful when
opening the hinge. It lasted about 3 years, which isn't too horrible.
All these methods were a PITA and far too much work. If it ever
happens again, I'll just epoxy the hinge to the base metal and be done
with it.

You might want to look at hints at:
http://repair4laptop.org
This looks close:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=86297

Incidentally, such breakage usually happens because the screw wiggles
loose. I recommend Loctite on enything threaded into aluminum.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Mon, 10 Aug 2009 00:59:01 +0100, "Arfa Daily"
wrote:

Mate of mine repairs laptops for a living, and oddly enough, we were
discussing this just a couple of weeks ago, when I was in his shop, and he
told me that he buys new replacement hinges from some place that keeps a lot
of laptop spares. Might even have been an eBay shop. I'll check with him if
you like, but it won't be until Tuesday, because he has Mondays off.

If I inscribe "laptop hinge" into the eBay search box, I get 821
possible hits. Plenty to choose from. Some are amazingly cheap
(direct from Hong Kong).




--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Jeff Liebermann wrote in message
...
On Sun, 9 Aug 2009 22:36:54 +0100, "N_Cook" wrote:

Any general tips on how to make a structural repair to the broken and
missing Aluminium extension from the friction pintle mount to where it
joins
the plastic of the LCD surround ?

No, I haven't the slightest idea, especially since you didn't bother
supplying the manufacturer and model number.

If you're missing parts, you can find just about anything from various
online computer salvage operators. Also on eBay. Be prepared to
overpay. The few surviving repair shops that actually do their own
repair usually have a fair collection of scrap parts laying around.
Ask, and you might receive.

Fractured at the screw point so only half
the screw hole remains , a highly stressed point, going by the amount of
force required to turn this pintle rod.

I've used hili-coil inserts to fix those. Also threaded brass inserts
commonly used in plastic molding. Drill it out and epoxy the insert
inplace. The smallest you can get is 4-40 which is a tolerable
substitue for the common 3mm metric screw. I've also mixed aluminum
dust with epoxy and built up the broken part sufficiently to thread
the hole. It worked, but the owner had to be very careful when
opening the hinge. It lasted about 3 years, which isn't too horrible.
All these methods were a PITA and far too much work. If it ever
happens again, I'll just epoxy the hinge to the base metal and be done
with it.

You might want to look at hints at:
http://repair4laptop.org
This looks close:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=86297

Incidentally, such breakage usually happens because the screw wiggles
loose. I recommend Loctite on enything threaded into aluminum.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Thanks for some interesting ideas. I was thinking of using some expanded
aluminium, anchored into the aluminium, with a fresh drilled small hole or
two and small nut/bolts. To give a scaffold for epoxy to anchor onto. Also
underscore the plastic to give a bit of key. What is the function of
aluminium dust in epoxy, other than a colourant?


To the others in the thread , if I wanted to get hints on (apparently , oftn
walletctomy) buying specific replacement stuff from e-bay or how to google I
wouldn't be posting repair queries to sci.electronics.repair which has the
word repair in the title. Why do you think I deliberately did not mention
make and model?

Jeff Liebermann wrote in
:

On Mon, 10 Aug 2009 00:59:01 +0100, "Arfa Daily"
wrote:

Mate of mine repairs laptops for a living, and oddly enough, we were
discussing this just a couple of weeks ago, when I was in his shop,
and he told me that he buys new replacement hinges from some place
that keeps a lot of laptop spares. Might even have been an eBay shop.
I'll check with him if you like, but it won't be until Tuesday,
because he has Mondays off.

If I inscribe "laptop hinge" into the eBay search box, I get 821
possible hits. Plenty to choose from. Some are amazingly cheap
(direct from Hong Kong).

cheap except for the shipping charges..... ;-)

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

"N_Cook" wrote in
:

Jeff Liebermann wrote in message
...
On Sun, 9 Aug 2009 22:36:54 +0100, "N_Cook"
wrote:

Any general tips on how to make a structural repair to the broken
and missing Aluminium extension from the friction pintle mount to
where it
joins
the plastic of the LCD surround ?

No, I haven't the slightest idea, especially since you didn't bother
supplying the manufacturer and model number.

If you're missing parts, you can find just about anything from
various online computer salvage operators. Also on eBay. Be
prepared to overpay. The few surviving repair shops that actually do
their own repair usually have a fair collection of scrap parts laying
around. Ask, and you might receive.

Fractured at the screw point so only half
the screw hole remains , a highly stressed point, going by the
amount of force required to turn this pintle rod.

I've used hili-coil inserts to fix those. Also threaded brass
inserts commonly used in plastic molding. Drill it out and epoxy the
insert inplace. The smallest you can get is 4-40 which is a
tolerable substitue for the common 3mm metric screw. I've also mixed
aluminum dust with epoxy and built up the broken part sufficiently to
thread the hole. It worked, but the owner had to be very careful
when opening the hinge. It lasted about 3 years, which isn't too
horrible. All these methods were a PITA and far too much work. If it
ever happens again, I'll just epoxy the hinge to the base metal and
be done with it.

You might want to look at hints at:
http://repair4laptop.org
This looks close:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=86297

Incidentally, such breakage usually happens because the screw wiggles
loose. I recommend Loctite on enything threaded into aluminum.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Thanks for some interesting ideas. I was thinking of using some
expanded aluminium, anchored into the aluminium, with a fresh drilled
small hole or two and small nut/bolts. To give a scaffold for epoxy to
anchor onto. Also underscore the plastic to give a bit of key. What is
the function of aluminium dust in epoxy, other than a colourant?

it's a FILLER or thickener,gives bulk to the epoxy.

I use a thin,boat-building epoxy,and several kinds of fillers such as fumed
silica,wood flour,phenolic micro-balloons,and chopped glass or plastic
fibers. It's very versatile. fumed silica makes a very hard epoxy,fibers
add strength.

for a good read on epoxy,http://www.systemthree.com,you can download their
Epoxy Book for free. Lots of useful info on using epoxies.

BTW,metal or plastic window screening also makes a good
reinforcement/"scaffold" for epoxy.

Best to rough up the plastic surface before gluing.I even drill holes for
the epoxy to flow into,for additional adhesion.


--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

Jim Yanik wrote in message
...
"N_Cook" wrote in
:

Jeff Liebermann wrote in message
...
On Sun, 9 Aug 2009 22:36:54 +0100, "N_Cook"
wrote:

Any general tips on how to make a structural repair to the broken
and missing Aluminium extension from the friction pintle mount to
where it
joins
the plastic of the LCD surround ?

No, I haven't the slightest idea, especially since you didn't bother
supplying the manufacturer and model number.

If you're missing parts, you can find just about anything from
various online computer salvage operators. Also on eBay. Be
prepared to overpay. The few surviving repair shops that actually do
their own repair usually have a fair collection of scrap parts laying
around. Ask, and you might receive.

Fractured at the screw point so only half
the screw hole remains , a highly stressed point, going by the
amount of force required to turn this pintle rod.

I've used hili-coil inserts to fix those. Also threaded brass
inserts commonly used in plastic molding. Drill it out and epoxy the
insert inplace. The smallest you can get is 4-40 which is a
tolerable substitue for the common 3mm metric screw. I've also mixed
aluminum dust with epoxy and built up the broken part sufficiently to
thread the hole. It worked, but the owner had to be very careful
when opening the hinge. It lasted about 3 years, which isn't too
horrible. All these methods were a PITA and far too much work. If it
ever happens again, I'll just epoxy the hinge to the base metal and
be done with it.

You might want to look at hints at:
http://repair4laptop.org
This looks close:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=86297

Incidentally, such breakage usually happens because the screw wiggles
loose. I recommend Loctite on enything threaded into aluminum.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Thanks for some interesting ideas. I was thinking of using some
expanded aluminium, anchored into the aluminium, with a fresh drilled
small hole or two and small nut/bolts. To give a scaffold for epoxy to
anchor onto. Also underscore the plastic to give a bit of key. What is
the function of aluminium dust in epoxy, other than a colourant?

it's a FILLER or thickener,gives bulk to the epoxy.

I use a thin,boat-building epoxy,and several kinds of fillers such as
fumed
silica,wood flour,phenolic micro-balloons,and chopped glass or plastic
fibers. It's very versatile. fumed silica makes a very hard epoxy,fibers
add strength.

for a good read on epoxy,http://www.systemthree.com,you can download their
Epoxy Book for free. Lots of useful info on using epoxies.

BTW,metal or plastic window screening also makes a good
reinforcement/"scaffold" for epoxy.

Best to rough up the plastic surface before gluing.I even drill holes for
the epoxy to flow into,for additional adhesion.


--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net


A lot of various-directioned and angled , stopped, small drill holes is
probably easier and more effective than what I was going to try.

On Mon, 10 Aug 2009 15:32:40 +0100, N_Cook wrote:
Jim Yanik wrote in message
.. .
"N_Cook" wrote in
:

Jeff Liebermann wrote in message
...
On Sun, 9 Aug 2009 22:36:54 +0100, "N_Cook"
wrote:

Any general tips on how to make a structural repair to the broken
and missing Aluminium extension from the friction pintle mount to
where it
joins
the plastic of the LCD surround ?

No, I haven't the slightest idea, especially since you didn't bother
supplying the manufacturer and model number.

If you're missing parts, you can find just about anything from
various online computer salvage operators. Also on eBay. Be
prepared to overpay. The few surviving repair shops that actually do
their own repair usually have a fair collection of scrap parts laying
around. Ask, and you might receive.

Fractured at the screw point so only half
the screw hole remains , a highly stressed point, going by the
amount of force required to turn this pintle rod.

I've used hili-coil inserts to fix those. Also threaded brass
inserts commonly used in plastic molding. Drill it out and epoxy the
insert inplace. The smallest you can get is 4-40 which is a
tolerable substitue for the common 3mm metric screw. I've also mixed
aluminum dust with epoxy and built up the broken part sufficiently to
thread the hole. It worked, but the owner had to be very careful
when opening the hinge. It lasted about 3 years, which isn't too
horrible. All these methods were a PITA and far too much work. If it
ever happens again, I'll just epoxy the hinge to the base metal and
be done with it.

You might want to look at hints at:
http://repair4laptop.org
This looks close:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=86297

Incidentally, such breakage usually happens because the screw wiggles
loose. I recommend Loctite on enything threaded into aluminum.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Thanks for some interesting ideas. I was thinking of using some
expanded aluminium, anchored into the aluminium, with a fresh drilled
small hole or two and small nut/bolts. To give a scaffold for epoxy to
anchor onto. Also underscore the plastic to give a bit of key. What is
the function of aluminium dust in epoxy, other than a colourant?

it's a FILLER or thickener,gives bulk to the epoxy.

I use a thin,boat-building epoxy,and several kinds of fillers such as
fumed
silica,wood flour,phenolic micro-balloons,and chopped glass or plastic
fibers. It's very versatile. fumed silica makes a very hard epoxy,fibers
add strength.

for a good read on epoxy,http://www.systemthree.com,you can download their
Epoxy Book for free. Lots of useful info on using epoxies.

BTW,metal or plastic window screening also makes a good
reinforcement/"scaffold" for epoxy.

Best to rough up the plastic surface before gluing.I even drill holes for
the epoxy to flow into,for additional adhesion.


--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net


A lot of various-directioned and angled , stopped, small drill holes is
probably easier and more effective than what I was going to try.

Yeah, but those door hinges would have looked cool, especially with #12
hardware.

"N_Cook" wrote in
:

Jim Yanik wrote in message
...
"N_Cook" wrote in
:

Thanks for some interesting ideas. I was thinking of using some
expanded aluminium, anchored into the aluminium, with a fresh
drilled small hole or two and small nut/bolts. To give a scaffold
for epoxy to anchor onto. Also underscore the plastic to give a bit
of key. What is the function of aluminium dust in epoxy, other than
a colourant?

it's a FILLER or thickener,gives bulk to the epoxy.

I use a thin,boat-building epoxy,and several kinds of fillers such as
fumed
silica,wood flour,phenolic micro-balloons,and chopped glass or
plastic fibers. It's very versatile. fumed silica makes a very hard
epoxy,fibers add strength.

for a good read on epoxy,http://www.systemthree.com,you can download
their Epoxy Book for free. Lots of useful info on using epoxies.

BTW,metal or plastic window screening also makes a good
reinforcement/"scaffold" for epoxy.

Best to rough up the plastic surface before gluing.I even drill holes
for the epoxy to flow into,for additional adhesion.


--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net


A lot of various-directioned and angled , stopped, small drill holes
is probably easier and more effective than what I was going to try.




too small a hole,and all you have is a epoxy shear pin... 8-)

I don't believe angling the holes will make that much difference.


--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

On Mon, 10 Aug 2009 08:23:43 +0100, "N_Cook"
wrote:

Thanks for some interesting ideas. I was thinking of using some expanded
aluminium, anchored into the aluminium, with a fresh drilled small hole or
two and small nut/bolts. To give a scaffold for epoxy to anchor onto. Also
underscore the plastic to give a bit of key. What is the function of
aluminium dust in epoxy, other than a colourant?

Epoxy is hard and brittle. Aluminum is soft an malleable. If you try
to drill and tap straight epoxy, it will usually crack. The aluminum
provides a cushion. You can buy aluminum filled epoxy at the hardware
store, but I've found that it doesn't have enough aluminum and is
mostly brittle epoxy. So, I mixed my own. The hard part was finding
the aluminum powder. I made some by destroying a grinding wheel and
grinding down a slab of dead soft (pure) aluminum. There are various
instructions on the net for making aluminum powder. One uses aluminum
foil run through a shredder, and then through a ball mill for 2 weeks.
No thanks. Anyway, use only as much epoxy as necessary to hold the
dust together. If sufficiently large volume, insert reinforcing bars,
such as a paper clip, into the mix for strength.

Something I haven't tried is to insert the matching (3mm?) screw into
the partial hole, cover it with grease or some kind of mold release,
and then build up the epoxy/aluminum/whatever material around it. When
it hardens, just remove the screw and you have an instant threaded
hole. The problem is that it has a weak spot guaranteed to cause a
stress crack at the screw hole.

To the others in the thread , if I wanted to get hints on (apparently , oftn
walletctomy) buying specific replacement stuff from e-bay or how to google I
wouldn't be posting repair queries to sci.electronics.repair which has the
word repair in the title. Why do you think I deliberately did not mention
make and model?

If you actually want to repair some item, the idea is to supply as
much information about the item and its condition as possible.
Minimalist postings are useful academic exercises, but often wander
badly in a futile attempt to guess your circumstances. More
specifically:
1. What problem are you trying to solve?
2. What do you have to work with? (Make, model, version, etc).
3. What have you done so far and what happened?
There's plenty more info that would be useful, but the aforementioned
are the essentials. Anything less usually results in guesswork and
topic drift. I won't speculate as to your motivations for
intentionally withholding useful information.



--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Mon, 10 Aug 2009 09:15:44 -0700, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

On Mon, 10 Aug 2009 08:23:43 +0100, "N_Cook" wrote:

Thanks for some interesting ideas. I was thinking of using some expanded
aluminium, anchored into the aluminium, with a fresh drilled small hole
or two and small nut/bolts. To give a scaffold for epoxy to anchor onto.
Also underscore the plastic to give a bit of key. What is the function
of aluminium dust in epoxy, other than a colourant?

Epoxy is hard and brittle. Aluminum is soft an malleable. If you try
to drill and tap straight epoxy, it will usually crack. The aluminum
provides a cushion. You can buy aluminum filled epoxy at the hardware
store, but I've found that it doesn't have enough aluminum and is mostly
brittle epoxy. So, I mixed my own. The hard part was finding the
aluminum powder. I made some by destroying a grinding wheel and
grinding down a slab of dead soft (pure) aluminum. There are various
instructions on the net for making aluminum powder. One uses aluminum
foil run through a shredder, and then through a ball mill for 2 weeks.
No thanks. Anyway, use only as much epoxy as necessary to hold the dust
together. If sufficiently large volume, insert reinforcing bars, such
as a paper clip, into the mix for strength.

Something I haven't tried is to insert the matching (3mm?) screw into
the partial hole, cover it with grease or some kind of mold release, and
then build up the epoxy/aluminum/whatever material around it. When it
hardens, just remove the screw and you have an instant threaded hole.
The problem is that it has a weak spot guaranteed to cause a stress
crack at the screw hole.

To the others in the thread , if I wanted to get hints on (apparently ,
oftn walletctomy) buying specific replacement stuff from e-bay or how to
google I wouldn't be posting repair queries to sci.electronics.repair
which has the word repair in the title. Why do you think I deliberately
did not mention make and model?

If you actually want to repair some item, the idea is to supply as much
information about the item and its condition as possible. Minimalist
postings are useful academic exercises, but often wander badly in a
futile attempt to guess your circumstances. More specifically:
1. What problem are you trying to solve? 2. What do you have to work
with? (Make, model, version, etc). 3. What have you done so far and
what happened? There's plenty more info that would be useful, but the
aforementioned are the essentials. Anything less usually results in
guesswork and topic drift. I won't speculate as to your motivations for
intentionally withholding useful information.

Try this:

http://www.freemansupply.com/Freeman801Aluminum.htm

or a similar product.

It's worked for me.

Al

On Mon, 10 Aug 2009 17:49:27 GMT, alchazz wrote:

Try this:
http://www.freemansupply.com/Freeman801Aluminum.htm
or a similar product.
It's worked for me.
Al

Good idea. Have you tried to drill and thread it? The muffler repair
epoxy I tried cracked, but my home made version worked.

I found this putty epoxy compound with Google:
http://www.cotronics.com/vo/cotr/rm_putties.htm
The main advantage is that it's allegedly machinable, which means it
has plenty of aluminum and less epoxy. Maybe add some fiberglass
matting to the mix for strength.

All this to save a few dollars for new hinge.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

In article ,
Meat Plow wrote:

There is a company that make a marine repair epoxy that I am out of
and can't recall the name

West?

Jeff Liebermann wrote in
news
On Mon, 10 Aug 2009 17:49:27 GMT, alchazz wrote:

Try this:
http://www.freemansupply.com/Freeman801Aluminum.htm
or a similar product.
It's worked for me.
Al

Good idea. Have you tried to drill and thread it? The muffler repair
epoxy I tried cracked, but my home made version worked.

Most epoxies you find at outlets like Lowes and Home Depot or auto stores
are lousy. They're just general purpose glues,and of limited use.


I found this putty epoxy compound with Google:
http://www.cotronics.com/vo/cotr/rm_putties.htm
The main advantage is that it's allegedly machinable, which means it
has plenty of aluminum and less epoxy. Maybe add some fiberglass
matting to the mix for strength.

Or chopped glass or plastic fibers.


All this to save a few dollars for new hinge.


Yeah...

some folks just like to salvage everything....

I used boat-building epoxy and fillers to fix the spring clamp on an $8
electric fan.JB weld failed,but the boat epoxy with silica filler and glass
cloth reinforcements is still holding.

BTW,did you know it takes a few -weeks- for epoxies to gain their full
strength?

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

Smitty Two wrote in newsrestwhich-
:

In article ,
Meat Plow wrote:

There is a company that make a marine repair epoxy that I am out of
and can't recall the name

West?


No,that's no paste,but a thin,fiberglassing epoxy,and no "atom" logo on it.
I use some of West's fillers.(because there's a marine store nearby...)

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

"N_Cook" wrote in message
...
Jeff Liebermann wrote in message
...
On Sun, 9 Aug 2009 22:36:54 +0100, "N_Cook" wrote:

Any general tips on how to make a structural repair to the broken and
missing Aluminium extension from the friction pintle mount to where it
joins
the plastic of the LCD surround ?

No, I haven't the slightest idea, especially since you didn't bother
supplying the manufacturer and model number.

If you're missing parts, you can find just about anything from various
online computer salvage operators. Also on eBay. Be prepared to
overpay. The few surviving repair shops that actually do their own
repair usually have a fair collection of scrap parts laying around.
Ask, and you might receive.

Fractured at the screw point so only half
the screw hole remains , a highly stressed point, going by the amount of
force required to turn this pintle rod.

I've used hili-coil inserts to fix those. Also threaded brass inserts
commonly used in plastic molding. Drill it out and epoxy the insert
inplace. The smallest you can get is 4-40 which is a tolerable
substitue for the common 3mm metric screw. I've also mixed aluminum
dust with epoxy and built up the broken part sufficiently to thread
the hole. It worked, but the owner had to be very careful when
opening the hinge. It lasted about 3 years, which isn't too horrible.
All these methods were a PITA and far too much work. If it ever
happens again, I'll just epoxy the hinge to the base metal and be done
with it.

You might want to look at hints at:
http://repair4laptop.org
This looks close:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=86297

Incidentally, such breakage usually happens because the screw wiggles
loose. I recommend Loctite on enything threaded into aluminum.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Thanks for some interesting ideas. I was thinking of using some expanded
aluminium, anchored into the aluminium, with a fresh drilled small hole or
two and small nut/bolts. To give a scaffold for epoxy to anchor onto. Also
underscore the plastic to give a bit of key. What is the function of
aluminium dust in epoxy, other than a colourant?


To the others in the thread , if I wanted to get hints on (apparently ,
oftn
walletctomy) buying specific replacement stuff from e-bay or how to google
I
wouldn't be posting repair queries to sci.electronics.repair which has the
word repair in the title. Why do you think I deliberately did not mention
make and model?



Sometimes, my friend, you don't do yourself any favours. With an arsy
attitude like that, you don't deserve to get help with your half baked bodge
repair projects. I offered you a solution based on the activities of a
friend who is a proper professional at laptop repairs, that would not have
cost you a lot of money, otherwise he wouldn't be doing it, as he makes a
proper living at it, and I wouldn't have suggested it to you, knowing your
penchant for fixing everything with some **** dissolved in epoxy, and some
obscure material not intended for the job. So go ahead, and waste forty
quidsworth of your time, on a bodged repair that won't last five minutes.
Sheesh.

Arfa

On Tue, 11 Aug 2009 01:57:10 +0100, Arfa Daily wrote:
Sometimes, my friend, you don't do yourself any favours. With an arsy
attitude like that, you don't deserve to get help with your half baked bodge
repair projects. I offered you a solution based on the activities of a
friend who is a proper professional at laptop repairs, that would not have
cost you a lot of money, otherwise he wouldn't be doing it, as he makes a
proper living at it, and I wouldn't have suggested it to you, knowing your
penchant for fixing everything with some **** dissolved in epoxy, and some
obscure material not intended for the job. So go ahead, and waste forty
quidsworth of your time, on a bodged repair that won't last five minutes.
Sheesh.

The kind of people who do such half assed repairs obviously don't value
their time in the slightest. Spend twenty hours to save what a fast food
clerk makes in an hour.

Arfa Daily wrote:
"N_Cook" wrote in message
...
Jeff Liebermann wrote in message
...
On Sun, 9 Aug 2009 22:36:54 +0100, "N_Cook" wrote:

Any general tips on how to make a structural repair to the broken and
missing Aluminium extension from the friction pintle mount to where it
joins
the plastic of the LCD surround ?
No, I haven't the slightest idea, especially since you didn't bother
supplying the manufacturer and model number.

If you're missing parts, you can find just about anything from various
online computer salvage operators. Also on eBay. Be prepared to
overpay. The few surviving repair shops that actually do their own
repair usually have a fair collection of scrap parts laying around.
Ask, and you might receive.

Fractured at the screw point so only half
the screw hole remains , a highly stressed point, going by the amount of
force required to turn this pintle rod.
I've used hili-coil inserts to fix those. Also threaded brass inserts
commonly used in plastic molding. Drill it out and epoxy the insert
inplace. The smallest you can get is 4-40 which is a tolerable
substitue for the common 3mm metric screw. I've also mixed aluminum
dust with epoxy and built up the broken part sufficiently to thread
the hole. It worked, but the owner had to be very careful when
opening the hinge. It lasted about 3 years, which isn't too horrible.
All these methods were a PITA and far too much work. If it ever
happens again, I'll just epoxy the hinge to the base metal and be done
with it.

You might want to look at hints at:
http://repair4laptop.org
This looks close:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=86297

Incidentally, such breakage usually happens because the screw wiggles
loose. I recommend Loctite on enything threaded into aluminum.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
Thanks for some interesting ideas. I was thinking of using some expanded
aluminium, anchored into the aluminium, with a fresh drilled small hole or
two and small nut/bolts. To give a scaffold for epoxy to anchor onto. Also
underscore the plastic to give a bit of key. What is the function of
aluminium dust in epoxy, other than a colourant?


To the others in the thread , if I wanted to get hints on (apparently ,
oftn
walletctomy) buying specific replacement stuff from e-bay or how to google
I
wouldn't be posting repair queries to sci.electronics.repair which has the
word repair in the title. Why do you think I deliberately did not mention
make and model?



Sometimes, my friend, you don't do yourself any favours. With an arsy
attitude like that, you don't deserve to get help with your half baked bodge
repair projects. I offered you a solution based on the activities of a
friend who is a proper professional at laptop repairs, that would not have
cost you a lot of money, otherwise he wouldn't be doing it, as he makes a
proper living at it, and I wouldn't have suggested it to you, knowing your
penchant for fixing everything with some **** dissolved in epoxy, and some
obscure material not intended for the job. So go ahead, and waste forty
quidsworth of your time, on a bodged repair that won't last five minutes.
Sheesh.

Arfa



Oh well said that man -

Ron

Ron wrote in message
...
Arfa Daily wrote:
"N_Cook" wrote in message
...
Jeff Liebermann wrote in message
...
On Sun, 9 Aug 2009 22:36:54 +0100, "N_Cook" wrote:

Any general tips on how to make a structural repair to the broken
and
missing Aluminium extension from the friction pintle mount to where
it
joins
the plastic of the LCD surround ?
No, I haven't the slightest idea, especially since you didn't bother
supplying the manufacturer and model number.

If you're missing parts, you can find just about anything from various
online computer salvage operators. Also on eBay. Be prepared to
overpay. The few surviving repair shops that actually do their own
repair usually have a fair collection of scrap parts laying around.
Ask, and you might receive.

Fractured at the screw point so only half
the screw hole remains , a highly stressed point, going by the amount
of
force required to turn this pintle rod.
I've used hili-coil inserts to fix those. Also threaded brass inserts
commonly used in plastic molding. Drill it out and epoxy the insert
inplace. The smallest you can get is 4-40 which is a tolerable
substitue for the common 3mm metric screw. I've also mixed aluminum
dust with epoxy and built up the broken part sufficiently to thread
the hole. It worked, but the owner had to be very careful when
opening the hinge. It lasted about 3 years, which isn't too horrible.
All these methods were a PITA and far too much work. If it ever
happens again, I'll just epoxy the hinge to the base metal and be done
with it.

You might want to look at hints at:
http://repair4laptop.org
This looks close:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=86297

Incidentally, such breakage usually happens because the screw wiggles
loose. I recommend Loctite on enything threaded into aluminum.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
Thanks for some interesting ideas. I was thinking of using some
expanded
aluminium, anchored into the aluminium, with a fresh drilled small hole
or
two and small nut/bolts. To give a scaffold for epoxy to anchor onto.
Also
underscore the plastic to give a bit of key. What is the function of
aluminium dust in epoxy, other than a colourant?


To the others in the thread , if I wanted to get hints on (apparently ,
oftn
walletctomy) buying specific replacement stuff from e-bay or how to
google
I
wouldn't be posting repair queries to sci.electronics.repair which has
the
word repair in the title. Why do you think I deliberately did not
mention
make and model?



Sometimes, my friend, you don't do yourself any favours. With an arsy
attitude like that, you don't deserve to get help with your half baked
bodge
repair projects. I offered you a solution based on the activities of a
friend who is a proper professional at laptop repairs, that would not
have
cost you a lot of money, otherwise he wouldn't be doing it, as he makes
a
proper living at it, and I wouldn't have suggested it to you, knowing
your
penchant for fixing everything with some **** dissolved in epoxy, and
some
obscure material not intended for the job. So go ahead, and waste forty
quidsworth of your time, on a bodged repair that won't last five
minutes.
Sheesh.

Arfa



Oh well said that man -

Ron


If I replaced the whole hinge, I'd have to find out how to take the laptop
apart to get to the other part of the hinge, C-clip or whatever is buried
inside. Anyone's guess what chance of colateral damage just doing that.
Obtain a part, without being ripped off and having the correct one supplied.
Whereas all I've to do is find a way of building up the lost few square mm
of aluminium of the hinge anchor plate and make good some of the broken away
and missing plastic of the display surround/lid. All nicely exposed and easy
to work on. Why go to all that bother if a bit of epoxy and some Al mesh/
minimal hardware/drilling is all that's required. The hinge mount failed in
quite normal use , so direct replacement likely to do the same.

To the others in the thread , if I wanted to get hints on (apparently
,
oftn
walletctomy) buying specific replacement stuff from e-bay or how to
google
I
wouldn't be posting repair queries to sci.electronics.repair which has
the
word repair in the title. Why do you think I deliberately did not
mention
make and model?



Sometimes, my friend, you don't do yourself any favours. With an arsy
attitude like that, you don't deserve to get help with your half baked
bodge
repair projects. I offered you a solution based on the activities of a
friend who is a proper professional at laptop repairs, that would not
have
cost you a lot of money, otherwise he wouldn't be doing it, as he makes
a
proper living at it, and I wouldn't have suggested it to you, knowing
your
penchant for fixing everything with some **** dissolved in epoxy, and
some
obscure material not intended for the job. So go ahead, and waste forty
quidsworth of your time, on a bodged repair that won't last five
minutes.
Sheesh.

Arfa



Oh well said that man -

Ron


If I replaced the whole hinge, I'd have to find out how to take the laptop
apart to get to the other part of the hinge, C-clip or whatever is buried
inside. Anyone's guess what chance of colateral damage just doing that.
Obtain a part, without being ripped off and having the correct one
supplied.
Whereas all I've to do is find a way of building up the lost few square mm
of aluminium of the hinge anchor plate and make good some of the broken
away
and missing plastic of the display surround/lid. All nicely exposed and
easy
to work on. Why go to all that bother if a bit of epoxy and some Al mesh/
minimal hardware/drilling is all that's required. The hinge mount failed
in
quite normal use , so direct replacement likely to do the same.



Because, when you are doing work for people who are good enough to entrust
their repairs to you, it's about both appearing to be, and *actually being*
professional about the way you tackle the job. I wonder how you would feel
about a garage that fixed your clutch cable by joining it with an electrical
junction block, rather than replacing it, because the bodge was cheaper and
easier to do ?

Honestly, I don't know how you manage to make a living judging by some of
the threads you post on here. Yes, you are right that the title of this
group includes the word "repair", but I can't believe how literally you seem
to take that. Repairing often involves fitting new genuine replacement
parts, and especially it does when you are doing the work commercially ...

Arfa

Arfa

Arfa Daily wrote in message
...

To the others in the thread , if I wanted to get hints on
(apparently
,
oftn
walletctomy) buying specific replacement stuff from e-bay or how to
google
I
wouldn't be posting repair queries to sci.electronics.repair which
has
the
word repair in the title. Why do you think I deliberately did not
mention
make and model?



Sometimes, my friend, you don't do yourself any favours. With an arsy
attitude like that, you don't deserve to get help with your half
baked
bodge
repair projects. I offered you a solution based on the activities of
a
friend who is a proper professional at laptop repairs, that would not
have
cost you a lot of money, otherwise he wouldn't be doing it, as he
makes
a
proper living at it, and I wouldn't have suggested it to you, knowing
your
penchant for fixing everything with some **** dissolved in epoxy, and
some
obscure material not intended for the job. So go ahead, and waste
forty
quidsworth of your time, on a bodged repair that won't last five
minutes.
Sheesh.

Arfa



Oh well said that man -

Ron


If I replaced the whole hinge, I'd have to find out how to take the
laptop
apart to get to the other part of the hinge, C-clip or whatever is
buried
inside. Anyone's guess what chance of colateral damage just doing that.
Obtain a part, without being ripped off and having the correct one
supplied.
Whereas all I've to do is find a way of building up the lost few square
mm
of aluminium of the hinge anchor plate and make good some of the broken
away
and missing plastic of the display surround/lid. All nicely exposed and
easy
to work on. Why go to all that bother if a bit of epoxy and some Al
mesh/
minimal hardware/drilling is all that's required. The hinge mount failed
in
quite normal use , so direct replacement likely to do the same.



Because, when you are doing work for people who are good enough to entrust
their repairs to you, it's about both appearing to be, and *actually
being*
professional about the way you tackle the job. I wonder how you would feel
about a garage that fixed your clutch cable by joining it with an
electrical
junction block, rather than replacing it, because the bodge was cheaper
and
easier to do ?

Honestly, I don't know how you manage to make a living judging by some of
the threads you post on here. Yes, you are right that the title of this
group includes the word "repair", but I can't believe how literally you
seem
to take that. Repairing often involves fitting new genuine replacement
parts, and especially it does when you are doing the work commercially ...

Arfa

Arfa




I get the customer self-referals from my local "commercial " outfit, no name
mentioned. Customers charged 20 GBP up front, no refund. If its changing a
switch , gain pot, jack socket they go ahead and do that and charge extra.
If it requires diagnosis of a proper electronic, rather than self-evident
mechanical fault ,they hang on to it , return it 3 months later, saying they
cannot get the parts, 20 squid , that'll do nicely.

A lot of hostility on this thread. I can understand it. There is a whole
lot of people bidding down in PC and Laptop repairs. This means there are
people getting away with quick and dirty fixes just to underbid and put
someone out of work who would do a proper repair.

Begs the question why certain people just don't get a job with sanitation
dept. rather than recycling.

If I replaced the whole hinge, I'd have to find out how to take the
laptop
apart to get to the other part of the hinge, C-clip or whatever is buried
inside. Anyone's guess what chance of colateral damage just doing that.
Obtain a part, without being ripped off and having the correct one
supplied.


These are the things you have to know better than the average bear.


Whereas all I've to do is find a way of building up the lost few square
mm
of aluminium of the hinge anchor plate and make good some of the broken
away
and missing plastic of the display surround/lid. All nicely exposed and
easy
to work on. Why go to all that bother if a bit of epoxy and some Al mesh/
minimal hardware/drilling is all that's required. The hinge mount failed
in
quite normal use , so direct replacement likely to do the same.


So if an actual replacement is expected to fail in the same fashion
what makes you think you can make a stronger repair? Sure this is
possible but having intimate knowledge of laptop repair and the
structure and stresses imposed I think you'll find out in the end you
are wasting time. And while that in its self isn't a real horrible
thing to do if it interferes with your credibility on a shoddy
solution was it worth it?

You can usually find disassembly instructtion for laptops online so
really no excuse not to splay it out and do a proper repair.

Unless you are incompetent.

On Tue, 11 Aug 2009 11:15:36 +0100, "N_Cook"
wrote:

If I replaced the whole hinge, I'd have to find out how to take the laptop
apart to get to the other part of the hinge, C-clip or whatever is buried
inside.

Hinge assemblies are separate components and totally separate from the
internal frame. If you had ever replaced a laptop hinge, you would
know that. There is usually a removable plastic strip just above the
keyboard that covers the some of the lower end screws. Additional
screws are sometimes found on the bottom of the laptop, and on the
rear panel. Remove these and the LCD display can be separated from
the laptop base, with the hinges still attached. In most cases, you
will need to disassemble the LCD frame in order to gain access to the
remaining screws. There is no C-clip unless you're planning to
dissemble the hinge assembly itself. Example:
http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/antennas/laptops/slides/compaq-2120us.html
This was meant to show the really awful location of a wi-fi antenna,
but shows the hinge construction quite clearly.

Anyone's guess what chance of colateral damage just doing that.

That depends on your experience level. I will admit to having
destroyed a few laptops trying to disassemble them without proper
instructions. More commonly, I get the screws mixed up. When
re-assembled, the longer screws can do some real damage. If you've
never done this before, there are disassembly diagrams in some of the
service documentation online, or on various web sites.
http://repair4laptop.org/notebook.html
To prevent disaster, I take photos as I go along and am very careful
with organizing the screws:
http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/pics/HP-laptop/index.html

Obtain a part, without being ripped off and having the correct one supplied.

I sometimes buy the wrong part. It happens. When I'm not sure and
the part is cheap, I buy several from different vendors. I like to
buy pairs of parts, especially on pullouts, so that if one is dead,
the other might work.

Whereas all I've to do is find a way of building up the lost few square mm
of aluminium of the hinge anchor plate and make good some of the broken away
and missing plastic of the display surround/lid.

No. All you have to do is gain the expertise and experience necessary
to do this properly. It took me several tries to get it right,
resulting in mixing my own formulation because I couldn't find
anything that worked. What's your time worth?

All nicely exposed and easy
to work on.

If it were easy, you wouldn't be asking.

Why go to all that bother if a bit of epoxy and some Al mesh/
minimal hardware/drilling is all that's required. The hinge mount failed in
quite normal use , so direct replacement likely to do the same.

The hinge failed because the screws became loose. They became loose
because there was insufficient thread surface area, too small a screw,
no Loctite, excessive vibration, weak base metal, or a failed previous
repair. When someone brings me a laptop, the first thing I check is
the hinge. If it's loose, they can count on an extra 30 minutes of
labor to fix it.

However, I do like your fatalistic attitude. I should point out that
it also applies to all repairs. Why bother when it might happen
again? Just throw it out and get a new laptop.


--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

If I replaced the whole hinge, I'd have to find out how to take the laptop
apart to get to the other part of the hinge, C-clip or whatever is buried
inside. Anyone's guess what chance of colateral damage just doing that.
Obtain a part, without being ripped off and having the correct one
supplied.
Whereas all I've to do is find a way of building up the lost few square mm
of aluminium of the hinge anchor plate and make good some of the broken
away
and missing plastic of the display surround/lid. All nicely exposed and
easy
to work on. Why go to all that bother if a bit of epoxy and some Al mesh/
minimal hardware/drilling is all that's required. The hinge mount failed
in
quite normal use , so direct replacement likely to do the same.


So if an actual replacement is expected to fail in the same fashion
what makes you think you can make a stronger repair? Sure this is
possible but having intimate knowledge of laptop repair and the
structure and stresses imposed I think you'll find out in the end you
are wasting time. And while that in its self isn't a real horrible
thing to do if it interferes with your credibility on a shoddy
solution was it worth it?

You can usually find disassembly instructtion for laptops online so
really no excuse not to splay it out and do a proper repair.

That's my feeling too, and whilst the first one of any particular model
might take a while to get apart, the next one will be a lot quicker.
Personally, from a credibility point of view, I would not consider repairing
a laptop hinge for a customer, in any way other than to replace it.
According to my mate, most if not all are available at reasonable cost, and
the time to dismantle and put a new one in, is not going to be any more -
and probably a lot less - than a cobbled up 'repair' to the broken one would
take. If the customer was not prepared to pay the cost of proper replacement
parts, then I would still keep the deposit I'd taken for quoting it, and
hand him it back. If he then went on to find a cheapskate who would bodge it
up for him, chances are I'd still have the last laugh when it failed again
shortly after the three months' repair warranty expired (if he even got that
....) knowing that he would probably be thinking that he should have had me
do a proper job in the first place, and now daren't come back to me ... :-)

Arfa

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

To the others in the thread , if I wanted to get hints on
(apparently ,
oftn
walletctomy) buying specific replacement stuff from e-bay or
how to
google
I
wouldn't be posting repair queries to sci.electronics.repair
which has
the
word repair in the title. Why do you think I deliberately did
not
mention
make and model?



Sometimes, my friend, you don't do yourself any favours. With an
arsy
attitude like that, you don't deserve to get help with your half
baked
bodge
repair projects. I offered you a solution based on the
activities of a
friend who is a proper professional at laptop repairs, that
would not
have
cost you a lot of money, otherwise he wouldn't be doing it, as
he makes
a
proper living at it, and I wouldn't have suggested it to you,
knowing
your
penchant for fixing everything with some **** dissolved in
epoxy, and
some
obscure material not intended for the job. So go ahead, and
waste forty
quidsworth of your time, on a bodged repair that won't last five
minutes.
Sheesh.

Arfa



Oh well said that man -

Ron


If I replaced the whole hinge, I'd have to find out how to take the
laptop
apart to get to the other part of the hinge, C-clip or whatever is
buried
inside. Anyone's guess what chance of colateral damage just doing
that.
Obtain a part, without being ripped off and having the correct one
supplied.
Whereas all I've to do is find a way of building up the lost few
square mm
of aluminium of the hinge anchor plate and make good some of the
broken away
and missing plastic of the display surround/lid. All nicely exposed
and easy
to work on. Why go to all that bother if a bit of epoxy and some Al
mesh/
minimal hardware/drilling is all that's required. The hinge mount
failed in
quite normal use , so direct replacement likely to do the same.



Because, when you are doing work for people who are good enough to
entrust their repairs to you, it's about both appearing to be, and
*actually being* professional about the way you tackle the job. I
wonder how you would feel about a garage that fixed your clutch
cable by joining it with an electrical junction block, rather than
replacing it, because the bodge was cheaper and easier to do ?

Honestly, I don't know how you manage to make a living judging by
some of the threads you post on here. Yes, you are right that the
title of this group includes the word "repair", but I can't believe
how literally you seem to take that. Repairing often involves
fitting new genuine replacement parts, and especially it does when
you are doing the work commercially ...

Arfa

I have often thought the same Arfa - perhaps Mr Cook really would be
more suited to a group called sci.electronics.remanufacture. The
efforts that he goes to to "repair" stuff is jaw-dropping! I can
understand the satisfaction gained in getting something up and running
that is deemed commercially "unrepairable", but he does seem to go to
extremes and I doubt that he has ever really costed his time into the
jobs he does. In my past experience of such jobs when I have carried
them out in order to do the customer a favour they are rarely
appreciative - whats worse, if a "bodge" subsequently fails, no matter
how far down the line, your reputation will suffer. As for
"improvements" to the original spec......nuff said.

Roy

Meat Plow wrote in message
...
On Tue, 11 Aug 2009 18:16:19 +0100, "Arfa Daily"
wrote:





I'm astounded (almost) that the things last as long as they do with
the kind of force on them. I bought an Asus laptop back in 2004 that
still serves me. I've had it apart once to repair the DC barrel
connector after the solder broke due to poor design. There were no
less than 60 screws that needed to be removed to get to the main
board. But only 3 needed to be removed from the backside to get the
keyboard out mainly due to the #2 memory slot being under the keyboard
of all places.

If you look close on the bottom case you can see a couple little bumps
from me using the couple 1/4mm longer screws to fasten the chassis to
the bottom plastic

Didn't catch this until they were all back in and I wasn't going to
undo everything. Lucky it was MY laptop, I would have been horrified
to find this on a customer unit and would have been looking for a new
bottom.

I'm sure we've all experienced collateral damage.


Ignoring time wasted on this thread.
I'm not a structural engineer , but gut feeling, this repair could be
stronger than the original. 3/4 hour spent, so far, curing epoxy currently,
small cosmetic job to follow.
Original was 1x 2.5mm screw into a plastic boss on the display outer, boss
and small part of external case broke away.
2 x 1.5 mm holes drilled through the large remnant of the hinge anchor
plate, 2 nuts and bolts and washers holding a returned loop of expanded
aluminium of area about 15x35 mm epoxied through/around and over the scored
remnant Al and bridging onto drill-pock-marked original part of case and
into the reinforcing webs, not just flat plastic. When cured, then a skim of
hotmelt glue plus dystuff and thick ptfe tape for moulding a patch, to patch
the seen outside part of the display surround that broke away, owner knowing
full well there will be a cosmetic blemish and that my repair will be a
bodge job.

cf
I hate to think how much time and money involved with the "proper" repair.
Obtain correct replacement hinge and display outer casing.
Download "how to dismantle pc" read up how to disassemble , separate bins
for separate section screws etc, remake ribbon connections etc all without
collateral damage to a ribbon/ connector or something indeterminant.
Factor in chance of replacement wrong parts/ no parts arriving, perhaps
weeks later, probability of fatally dislodging something vital inside the
pc, reassemble lid/display outer.

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

To the others in the thread , if I wanted to get hints on (apparently
,
oftn
walletctomy) buying specific replacement stuff from e-bay or how to
google
I
wouldn't be posting repair queries to sci.electronics.repair which
has
the
word repair in the title. Why do you think I deliberately did not
mention
make and model?



Sometimes, my friend, you don't do yourself any favours. With an arsy
attitude like that, you don't deserve to get help with your half baked
bodge
repair projects. I offered you a solution based on the activities of a
friend who is a proper professional at laptop repairs, that would not
have
cost you a lot of money, otherwise he wouldn't be doing it, as he
makes
a
proper living at it, and I wouldn't have suggested it to you, knowing
your
penchant for fixing everything with some **** dissolved in epoxy, and
some
obscure material not intended for the job. So go ahead, and waste
forty
quidsworth of your time, on a bodged repair that won't last five
minutes.
Sheesh.

Arfa



Oh well said that man -

Ron


If I replaced the whole hinge, I'd have to find out how to take the
laptop
apart to get to the other part of the hinge, C-clip or whatever is buried
inside. Anyone's guess what chance of colateral damage just doing that.
Obtain a part, without being ripped off and having the correct one
supplied.
Whereas all I've to do is find a way of building up the lost few square
mm
of aluminium of the hinge anchor plate and make good some of the broken
away
and missing plastic of the display surround/lid. All nicely exposed and
easy
to work on. Why go to all that bother if a bit of epoxy and some Al mesh/
minimal hardware/drilling is all that's required. The hinge mount failed
in
quite normal use , so direct replacement likely to do the same.



Because, when you are doing work for people who are good enough to entrust
their repairs to you, it's about both appearing to be, and *actually
being* professional about the way you tackle the job. I wonder how you
would feel about a garage that fixed your clutch cable by joining it with
an electrical junction block, rather than replacing it, because the bodge
was cheaper and easier to do ?

Honestly, I don't know how you manage to make a living judging by some of
the threads you post on here. Yes, you are right that the title of this
group includes the word "repair", but I can't believe how literally you
seem to take that. Repairing often involves fitting new genuine
replacement parts, and especially it does when you are doing the work
commercially ...

Arfa

Arfa


Not so much leaving as wanting to hear more from the techs. Haven't had much
luck filtering the spam using Windoze Mail, which along with OE previously,
has all my old postings and others in the various message folders.

I can visually scan the list of messages in a given newsgroup and filter
accordingly, the trouble is there just aren't many relevant posts any more.
Often I'll see fifty spam posts along with one or two legitimate posts which
mostly don't even relate to my areas of interest. So many of our best seem
to have left the room for good.

Once upon a time I might make several posts in any given day which might
have some relevance or actually help someone. I was typing away so much my
wife almost thought I was fooling around! Nowadays it's down to about one or
two posts per week tops.


Mark Z.

" Why go to all that bother if a bit of epoxy and some Al
mesh/
minimal hardware/drilling is all that's required. The hinge mount failed
in
quite normal use , so direct replacement likely to do the same.



Because, when you are doing work for people who are good enough to
entrust their repairs to you, it's about both appearing to be, and
*actually being* professional about the way you tackle the job. I wonder
how you would feel about a garage that fixed your clutch cable by joining
it with an electrical junction block, rather than replacing it, because
the bodge was cheaper and easier to do ?

Honestly, I don't know how you manage to make a living judging by some of
the threads you post on here. Yes, you are right that the title of this
group includes the word "repair", but I can't believe how literally you
seem to take that. Repairing often involves fitting new genuine
replacement parts, and especially it does when you are doing the work
commercially ...

Arfa

I have often thought the same Arfa - perhaps Mr Cook really would be more
suited to a group called sci.electronics.remanufacture. The efforts that
he goes to to "repair" stuff is jaw-dropping! I can understand the
satisfaction gained in getting something up and running that is deemed
commercially "unrepairable", but he does seem to go to extremes and I
doubt that he has ever really costed his time into the jobs he does. In my
past experience of such jobs when I have carried them out in order to do
the customer a favour they are rarely appreciative - whats worse, if a
"bodge" subsequently fails, no matter how far down the line, your
reputation will suffer. As for "improvements" to the original
spec......nuff said.

Roy

I have no problem - like you I suspect - with the art of the "technical
bodge". After all, we were taught to "mend" stuff when I was an apprentice
many many years ago. But there's a time and place in today's commercial
world. A good example was the interesting thread last week about the card
drive rubber in the HP unit. Finding and fitting, with success, an
alternative to the original part which is no longer available, is fine for
something you own yourself, and may be ok for a customer if there is
genuinely no alternative, and they are prepared to specifically authorise
you to carry out the repair in that way.

Sometimes, it's even ok to use the doctors' method of attacking the symptoms
of a fault, rather than the cause, when a problem is particularly obscure,
and lack of information or parts, renders the repair otherwise commercially
unviable. However, again, when the job was for a customer, I would not go
down this route without first explaining carefully, all of the alternatives,
and then getting a specific approval to carry out the work in that way.

In all other cases, as a commercial repairer, with a reputation and
standards to maintain, and with a desire to use my time to generate the
maximum revenue for my business, I cannot entertain carrying out repairs by
any method other than replacement of defective parts, with new ones, either
of genuine manufacturer supply, or suitable third party ones with equivalent
or superior specification.

I am also loathe to start modifying the mechanical or electrical design or
construction of an item, because I feel that it wasn't done right in the
first place. Certainly, the addition of the odd cable tie, or adding a
shakeproof washer to a screw head, is something I would do. Such 'missing'
items are often as a result of a cost cutting exercise by the manufacturer,
and do not alter the electrical or mechanical safety specs in any
detrimental way. However, I am absolutely against making any major
mechanical or electrical changes to a piece of equipment, that are not
specified as required changes in a manufacturer bulletin. I am not a
designer, and what I see as a 'design issue', may well have been done that
way in order to make the equipment comply with some safety regulation, that
I know nothing about. If I see a number of a 'young' product with a specific
design or manufacturing flaw, I will probably contact the manufacturer to
let them know, but if I see a twenty year old amplifier with an issue, then
I am not going to start questioning the designer's philosophy, and working
up mods to make it like I would want to see it.

I actually find a lot of what Mr Cook posts about, quite interesting, and I
admire his tenacity and ingenuity at finding fixes for some problems, but as
a fellow professional, I do have a lot of difficulty with the way he
apparently tackles some customer jobs, and whilst I'm sure that most if not
all of the professional repairers on here understand where he's coming from,
I'm not sure that it is right that amateurs learning from repair threads on
here, should see some of his fixes as the 'proper' way to do the job, and
the way that a commercial repairer would go about it ...

Still, as you say, 'nuff said. Perhaps I'm wrong in all this, and just being
a boring old pedant ... d;~}

Arfa

I'm a firm believer in "if it ain't broke , don't poke".

I forgot to mention 2 points, 1 on each side of the competing procedural
time/costs equation.
I also tapped the 2x 1.5mm holes with 8BA threads for the screws.
v
there is a silly powered gizmo on the display casing that you'd have to pay
for also . Even then I'm assuming its phenolic ribbon supply has a socket
receiver inside the gizmo, not soldered in place, as its all very thin,
probably fixed in place. If so then replacement full LCD + inverter, many
way, replacement ribbon as well.

Arfa Daily wrote:
" Why go to all that bother if a bit of epoxy and some Al
mesh/
minimal hardware/drilling is all that's required. The hinge mount failed
in
quite normal use , so direct replacement likely to do the same.


Because, when you are doing work for people who are good enough to
entrust their repairs to you, it's about both appearing to be, and
*actually being* professional about the way you tackle the job. I wonder
how you would feel about a garage that fixed your clutch cable by joining
it with an electrical junction block, rather than replacing it, because
the bodge was cheaper and easier to do ?

Honestly, I don't know how you manage to make a living judging by some of
the threads you post on here. Yes, you are right that the title of this
group includes the word "repair", but I can't believe how literally you
seem to take that. Repairing often involves fitting new genuine
replacement parts, and especially it does when you are doing the work
commercially ...

Arfa

I have often thought the same Arfa - perhaps Mr Cook really would be more
suited to a group called sci.electronics.remanufacture. The efforts that
he goes to to "repair" stuff is jaw-dropping! I can understand the
satisfaction gained in getting something up and running that is deemed
commercially "unrepairable", but he does seem to go to extremes and I
doubt that he has ever really costed his time into the jobs he does. In my
past experience of such jobs when I have carried them out in order to do
the customer a favour they are rarely appreciative - whats worse, if a
"bodge" subsequently fails, no matter how far down the line, your
reputation will suffer. As for "improvements" to the original
spec......nuff said.

Roy

I have no problem - like you I suspect - with the art of the "technical
bodge". After all, we were taught to "mend" stuff when I was an apprentice
many many years ago. But there's a time and place in today's commercial
world. A good example was the interesting thread last week about the card
drive rubber in the HP unit. Finding and fitting, with success, an
alternative to the original part which is no longer available, is fine for
something you own yourself, and may be ok for a customer if there is
genuinely no alternative, and they are prepared to specifically authorise
you to carry out the repair in that way.

Sometimes, it's even ok to use the doctors' method of attacking the symptoms
of a fault, rather than the cause, when a problem is particularly obscure,
and lack of information or parts, renders the repair otherwise commercially
unviable. However, again, when the job was for a customer, I would not go
down this route without first explaining carefully, all of the alternatives,
and then getting a specific approval to carry out the work in that way.

In all other cases, as a commercial repairer, with a reputation and
standards to maintain, and with a desire to use my time to generate the
maximum revenue for my business, I cannot entertain carrying out repairs by
any method other than replacement of defective parts, with new ones, either
of genuine manufacturer supply, or suitable third party ones with equivalent
or superior specification.

I am also loathe to start modifying the mechanical or electrical design or
construction of an item, because I feel that it wasn't done right in the
first place. Certainly, the addition of the odd cable tie, or adding a
shakeproof washer to a screw head, is something I would do. Such 'missing'
items are often as a result of a cost cutting exercise by the manufacturer,
and do not alter the electrical or mechanical safety specs in any
detrimental way. However, I am absolutely against making any major
mechanical or electrical changes to a piece of equipment, that are not
specified as required changes in a manufacturer bulletin. I am not a
designer, and what I see as a 'design issue', may well have been done that
way in order to make the equipment comply with some safety regulation, that
I know nothing about. If I see a number of a 'young' product with a specific
design or manufacturing flaw, I will probably contact the manufacturer to
let them know, but if I see a twenty year old amplifier with an issue, then
I am not going to start questioning the designer's philosophy, and working
up mods to make it like I would want to see it.

I actually find a lot of what Mr Cook posts about, quite interesting, and I
admire his tenacity and ingenuity at finding fixes for some problems, but as
a fellow professional, I do have a lot of difficulty with the way he
apparently tackles some customer jobs, and whilst I'm sure that most if not
all of the professional repairers on here understand where he's coming from,
I'm not sure that it is right that amateurs learning from repair threads on
here, should see some of his fixes as the 'proper' way to do the job, and
the way that a commercial repairer would go about it ...

Still, as you say, 'nuff said. Perhaps I'm wrong in all this, and just being
a boring old pedant ... d;~}

Arfa



What gets to me is when well meaning people start modifying customers
equipment without a thought to the damage they might be doing to the
value or safety.

If I took my treasured vintage 1960`s Marshall amp to a repair shop for
a simple input socket replacement, and the 'engineer' proudly told me
that he'd improved it by boring holes through the circuit board and
modifying the sockets with shoelaces, soldered in a few extra fuses, or
rewired the preamp valves in teflon coated silver plated superwire,
glued the valves in with bath sealer and added a few extra ventilation
holes in the case, I might start thinking about suing for compensation.

Even a non standard fuse holder or voltage selector can reduce the value
of some collectable amps by quite a lot, and tinkering with the lay of
internal wiring can destroy that vintage sound.

On commercial gear like that, there should be no reason why a proper
lasting repair can`t be carried out using professional methods and the
proper parts. Anyone not prepared to do the job properly shouldn`t be
doing the job at all. (IMO)

Ron

What gets to me is when well meaning people start modifying customers
equipment without a thought to the damage they might be doing to the
value or safety.

If I took my treasured vintage 1960`s Marshall amp to a repair shop for
a simple input socket replacement, and the 'engineer' proudly told me
that he'd improved it by boring holes through the circuit board and
modifying the sockets with shoelaces, soldered in a few extra fuses, or
rewired the preamp valves in teflon coated silver plated superwire,
glued the valves in with bath sealer and added a few extra ventilation
holes in the case, I might start thinking about suing for compensation.

Even a non standard fuse holder or voltage selector can reduce the value
of some collectable amps by quite a lot, and tinkering with the lay of
internal wiring can destroy that vintage sound.

On commercial gear like that, there should be no reason why a proper
lasting repair can`t be carried out using professional methods and the
proper parts. Anyone not prepared to do the job properly shouldn`t be
doing the job at all. (IMO)

Ron

When you have been into very many pieces of gear, you begin to see what
sacrifices are made in production to shave costs. A good example would be
RFI suppression and even underrated components. I suppose the purists would
want to maintain and even document all of the OEM flaws. It has often been
stated at the Antiques Roadshow, never to have repairs done as it destroys
the historical ambiance of the piece.

This is doubly true with electronics, where even new original parts have
crumbled to dust in the original boxes. I can't imagine anyone doing most
all the mods you described, but finding original parts in good order could
drive up the delivery time and price immensely. In this country, the ac
cord would probably have to be changed for safety reasons. You would want
to specify to the repairman up front that he might not be paid for a very
long time while he conducts considerable research in order to find the
originals. But if money is no object, perhaps an open account or a blank
check up front would be in order. The absolutely professional repairman
these days would tell you it's burned out and the parts are no longer
available and steer you to the showroom for the latest cheesy junk.