On Mon, 3 May 2021 22:19:05 +0100, newshound
wrote:

snip

I find bow saws pretty hard work,

If they are sharp enough and with the right blade for the job, I have
found them to be very effective. Ok, still not as 'easy' as a chainsaw
but a lot quieter, cheaper and still work straight away after being
used underwater. ;-)

but the folding curved pruning saws
are pretty fast and easy at the two inch level.

I've watched daughter use her 'Silky' on some limbs that looked like
they would be way too big / hard work for such a small saw but I was
always very surprised. Few seconds of undercut then a couple more on
top and down it went.

I just dropped the saw onto my hand once and it *was* very very sharp.
;-(

It's also interesting to
find that a decent machete will cut 20mm in one cut for some timbers.
(This is not for "neat" pruning of course, but I sometimes have to cut
back rough scrub as it encroaches on my horse paddock)

We had one and did use it for those sorts of things but the
'brushcutter' (steel) blade on the, erm, brushcutter worked even
better or even a chainsaw for the heavier bits.

Cheers, T i m

"newshound" wrote in message
...
On 03/05/2021 21:33, NY wrote:
"williamwright" wrote in message
...
On 03/05/2021 14:34, Andrew wrote:

I use a manual emission-free chain saw. Good exercise.


https://www.screwfix.com/p/bahco-erg...24-610mm/5313k

I'd worked myself nearly to death by the time I was 62. I don't want to
finish the job on anything so futile as doing the work of a machine.

When we moved into our new house, we found that the previous owners had
gone a bit OTT with vigorously spreading conifers around the garden. I
had to prune or even cut down some of them. Having tried a bow saw (which
the previous people left) and a tenon saw, both of which kept binding in
the wood, I bought a battery-powered chainsaw. I know which of those
three I'd prefer to use ;-)

I find bow saws pretty hard work, but the folding curved pruning saws are
pretty fast and easy at the two inch level. It's also interesting to find
that a decent machete will cut 20mm in one cut for some timbers. (This is
not for "neat" pruning of course, but I sometimes have to cut back rough
scrub as it encroaches on my horse paddock)

I've snapped two pruning saws when the blades got seized in branches on the
push stroke. The first time the saw was a write-off because the break was
near the handle (*); the second time it was only the tip of the blade that
snapped off. Having a blade that is not kept rigid by a thicker bar (tenon
saw) or kept in tension (bow saw) is just asking for problems...


(*) I nearly impaled my hand on the snapped end of the blade...

On Tue, 4 May 2021 08:03:28 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest troll**** unread

--
dennis@home to retarded trolling senile Rodent:
"sod off rod you don't have a clue about anything."
Message-ID:

In article , williamwright
scribeth thus
On 03/05/2021 17:40, Chris Green wrote:
It's not just power to weight ration, lubrication of a 2-stroke is by

I once edited a longish document* that was concerned with signal to
noise ratio, and the guy had put 'ration' every time.

*a report on TV interference caused by a tower in Rugby, in case
anyone's interested.

Bill

Yes what was it then?,,
--
Tony Sayer


Man is least himself when he talks in his own person.

Give him a keyboard, and he will reveal himself.

On 03/05/2021 22:13, newshound wrote:
On 03/05/2021 17:55, John Rumm wrote:


(biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo
electric chain sharpener though)


That's interesting. Which product?

This one IIRC:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/s?k=B004CEJ... rnodeltdcomp

Although manual sharpening is a bit of a fiddle, I usually find that
three to five strokes of the round file per tooth is all you need,
without bothering with the other file. So it really does not take long
for a ten inch bar.

I find it easier to just have a stash of sharp chains on hand to swap in
as required. Also the powered sharpener seems to be able to get a much
sharper edge than I can manage with the file.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Mon, 3 May 2021 23:18:29 +0100, "NY" wrote:

snip

I've snapped two pruning saws when the blades got seized in branches on the
push stroke.

Were they 'good' ones? (Silky etc)

The first time the saw was a write-off because the break was
near the handle (*); the second time it was only the tip of the blade that
snapped off.

Having a blade that is not kept rigid by a thicker bar (tenon
saw) or kept in tension (bow saw) is just asking for problems...

Depending on how it's used or if it's a 'pull saw' (Japanese, coping,
fret, band, wire etc), it can be, especially if you allow the cut to
be in an area that becomes in compression during the cut.

I spent much of my youth sat on or holding timber for Dad as he was a
keen woodworker and it was important that I *held* any unsupported
'end', not lifted (or it would pinch his saw) or it be allowed to drop
whilst being cut though.

Cheers, T i m

John Rumm wrote:

newshound wrote:

John Rumm wrote:

biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo
electric chain sharpener though

That's interesting. Which product?

This one IIRC:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/s?k=B004CEJ... rnodeltdcomp

Anyone tried the dremel chain sharpening attachment?

"T i m" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 3 May 2021 23:18:29 +0100, "NY" wrote:

snip

I've snapped two pruning saws when the blades got seized in branches on
the
push stroke.

Were they 'good' ones? (Silky etc)

I think one of them was a cheap one, but the other was a Wolf.

The first time the saw was a write-off because the break was
near the handle (*); the second time it was only the tip of the blade that
snapped off.

Having a blade that is not kept rigid by a thicker bar (tenon
saw) or kept in tension (bow saw) is just asking for problems...

Depending on how it's used or if it's a 'pull saw' (Japanese, coping,
fret, band, wire etc), it can be, especially if you allow the cut to
be in an area that becomes in compression during the cut.

I spent much of my youth sat on or holding timber for Dad as he was a
keen woodworker and it was important that I *held* any unsupported
'end', not lifted (or it would pinch his saw) or it be allowed to drop
whilst being cut though.

I did a lot of the work during the day time when my wife was at work,
otherwise I'd have got her to press on the branch to keep the cut open.
Surprisingly a cut on the upper side of the branch (having made an initial
cut on the underside to prevent splintering) tended to close up, despite the
weight of the branch which you'd expect to open the cut.

I found the best trick was to remove the blade from the cut after I'd pulled
it towards me on the cutting stroke, and then re-insert it at the other end
of the stroke, rather than trying to push it away from me, because that was
when the blade got stuck.

This was cedar, which seems to be a very hard wood compared with pine/larch.
It was still alive and so was green rather than dry wood.

On 03/05/2021 17:34, Tim+ wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 03/05/2021 17:17, Tim+ wrote:
Chris Green wrote:
"Brian Gaff \(Sofa\)" wrote:
What is the pollution like, I see a lot of power tools that seem to push out
foul smelling blue smoke all the time on strimmers hedge cutters and the
like. Brian

Older. probably, and 2-stroke which necessarily burn some oil and
produce blue smoke. Another reason why I like my 4-stroke Ryobi.


Does such a chainsaw still exist?

Tim

all my saws have been 2 stroke
power to weight, mate.



Well I know that. That said, Sthil do make 4-stroke strimmers/brush
cutters (that run on two stroke fuel) so not impossible, but I couldnt
find any Ryobi ones. A quick search suggests that other brands *do* exist.

I had a Ryobi 4 stroke combi / strimmer power head for a bit. It was a
pile of crap alas. (power output was not that good, it did not run well
at certain angles (typically those required when hedge trimming), but
the biggest weakness was the plastic components in the valve train that
made it almost impossible to tune and keep running reliably. Replaced it
with a Stihl KM 94 RC-E KombiEngine, which is vastly better in every way.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

Andy Burns wrote:
John Rumm wrote:

newshound wrote:

John Rumm wrote:

biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo
electric chain sharpener though

That's interesting. Which product?

This one IIRC:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/s?k=B004CEJ... rnodeltdcomp

Anyone tried the dremel chain sharpening attachment?

I have one of those, use with a non-Dremel motor etc. It's OK and I
have sharpened a few chains with it successfully. Its major advantage
is that it sets the angle for you fairly well (though not immovably).

I've bought a dedicated sharpener (offer at Lidl/Aldi, can't remember
which) but I haven't tried it yet.

--
Chris Green
·

On Tue, 4 May 2021 10:13:19 +0100, "NY" wrote:

snip

I've snapped two pruning saws when the blades got seized in branches on
the
push stroke.

Were they 'good' ones? (Silky etc)

I think one of them was a cheap one,

I would expect a cheap one to blunt quickly and bend rather than snap
as they generally use a lower grade steel.

but the other was a Wolf.

I would consider Wolf a branding exercise than a real make as such
(although they may well be).

If you do enough pruning (to justify the cost) I would suggest having
a look at the 'Silky' brand saws as they are very good (and what the
pro's generally use). It was an eye opener to me when I saw daughter
first remove a fairly substantial limb with one where it was easier /
safer to do by hand than with her chainsaw. I thought we were going to
be there a while but ... ;-)

snip

I spent much of my youth sat on or holding timber for Dad as he was a
keen woodworker and it was important that I *held* any unsupported
'end', not lifted (or it would pinch his saw) or it be allowed to drop
whilst being cut though.

I did a lot of the work during the day time when my wife was at work,
otherwise I'd have got her to press on the branch to keep the cut open.

It is handy having a helper for all sorts of things as it often makes
the job easier and often quicker (even if the helper isn't actually
doing much of the actual work), especially if they are a 'good' helper
(thinking ahead, staying alert, not actually getting in your way). ;-)

Surprisingly a cut on the upper side of the branch (having made an initial
cut on the underside to prevent splintering) tended to close up, despite the
weight of the branch which you'd expect to open the cut.

I think it's surprising how much sideways movement you can get in
green wood and so if there was any weight on the limb past where you
were cutting that can cause the cut to close (sideways) sufficiently
to pinch a saw.

I found the best trick was to remove the blade from the cut after I'd pulled
it towards me on the cutting stroke, and then re-insert it at the other end
of the stroke, rather than trying to push it away from me, because that was
when the blade got stuck.

Turning it into a 'pull saw' etc. ;-)

This was cedar, which seems to be a very hard wood compared with pine/larch.

I think it's a good carving wood (red cedar?) and I think it's used a
lot for untreated external cladding for it's long lasting properties?

It was still alive and so was green rather than dry wood.

I have often used an old panel saw on hanging dead wood as the blade
can be better suited than a saw 'designed' for use in green timber
etc.

When splitting wood I learned just how strong wood can be, if you
don't have a nice straight section of grain.

With a straight bit of timber in the hydraulic splitter it would
regularly split pretty quickly easily as soon as there was any real
pressure between the blade and anvil. Something with a side branch in
it might split up to the joint but the rest would often resist all the
force of the splitter (10 tonne?).

I split about 5 x 1 tonne bags of ash going from about 6 to 24" in
diameter and made the mistake of leaving all the bits that looked
likely to fight back to the end. ;-(

Cheers, T i m

On Tue, 4 May 2021 11:29:20 +0100, Chris Green wrote:

snip

I've bought a dedicated sharpener (offer at Lidl/Aldi, can't remember
which) but I haven't tried it yet.

I think daughter bought one of those (we have both local) and did find
it 'ok' (as in it seemed to work and was quite quick when set-up) but
as she never had any issue sharpening them by hand, I don't think it
got used that much.

I think the advantage of sharpening by hand is you can be a little bit
more conservative re how much you file away on each tooth, making the
blade last a bit longer?

Whilst working in someone's back garden their neighbour brought his
cheapo saw out and asked if they could sharpen it for him. She brought
it home and sharpened it and took it back when passing that evening.
Whilst advising that he now pay extra care because of how sharp it
was, the chain guard went to slid off and she nicked herself as she
tried to catch it. ;-(

That was very similar to the safety instructions I was giving her with
her first scalpel for crafting when she was a kid and I dropped the
thing on my hand ... 'Yeah, nice demo Dad' ... ;-)

Cheers, T i m

On 03/05/2021 12:02, Paul wrote:
williamwright wrote:
Yesterday I went to my daughter's with a load of wood. I was rewarded
with a very nice cottage pie (large portion), then, since it wasn't
raining Matt and I decided to do the right thing and cut the wood up
rather than just pile it in a corner and forget about it. Matt thought
we ought to use my chainsaw to save wearing his out (typical), so we
did. Unfortunately my chainsaw (Bosch 1750W) suddenly stopped working.
All it did was emit a loud buzz and some magic smoke. Not to worry;
I've had it for at least twenty years and it had done a lot of work,
and the oiler didn't work and the chain tensioner only just worked.
(Later I dismantled it out of curiosity and found that the front motor
bearing had seized absolutely solid. But surprisingly the gear wheels
showed very little wear and the motor brushes were still quite good.)
I don't know whether to get a petrol or electric chain saw. If
electric a constraint is that I want it to work from the genny, which
is 2kW. The bigger chainsaws are 2.5kW.

Bill

Here, a gentleman in the video, measures an electric chainsaw.
With the chain not moving, the peak input current is 50A on the
120V powered saw. The normal operating current is more likely
to be in the 15A range. That's at least a 3X multiplier.

https://www.tek.com/how-to/inrush-cu...ctric-chainsaw

snip

Many power tools have a soft start from EU regulations.

Generator MCBs should be tolerant of short term transients.

Most of the time you will get away with the start current from power tools.

On 03/05/2021 18:25, Andy Burns wrote:
John Rumm wrote:

biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo
electric chain sharpener though

So far I've gone the three chains for £24 route, and only managed to
dull one.

I find that you need to sharpen about every hour, and it takes about ten
minutes, and the file lasts about a chainsaw week at best.

Electric sharpeners mean you have to take the sodding chain off and that
takes even longer...


--
€œI know that most men, including those at ease with problems of the
greatest complexity, can seldom accept even the simplest and most
obvious truth if it be such as would oblige them to admit the falsity of
conclusions which they have delighted in explaining to colleagues, which
they have proudly taught to others, and which they have woven, thread by
thread, into the fabric of their lives.€�

ۥ Leo Tolstoy

On Tue, 04 May 2021 11:34:45 +0100, T i m wrote:

On Tue, 4 May 2021 10:13:19 +0100, "NY" wrote:

snip

I've snapped two pruning saws when the blades got seized in branches
on the push stroke.

Were they 'good' ones? (Silky etc)

I think one of them was a cheap one,

I would expect a cheap one to blunt quickly and bend rather than snap as
they generally use a lower grade steel.

but the other was a Wolf.

I would consider Wolf a branding exercise than a real make as such
(although they may well be).

If you do enough pruning (to justify the cost) I would suggest having a
look at the 'Silky' brand saws as they are very good (and what the pro's
generally use).

Agreed. I have an old Wolfgarten pruning attachment which is much better
than the newer Wolf one but neither match the Silky for quality. Silky
are definitely expensive though.

On 03/05/2021 18:28, williamwright wrote:
On 03/05/2021 13:38, John Rumm wrote:
What size bar do you need?

Maybe 20"

Also worth considering battery powered ones these days - especially if
you are already "bought into" an 18V battery platform. (and you can
always charge them from the genny).

No.

Perhaps you were thinking of something like this:

https://www.frjonesandson.co.uk/prod...-toy-chainsaw/





--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Mon, 3 May 2021 17:40:53 +0100, Chris Green wrote:

snip

all my saws have been 2 stroke
power to weight, mate.

It's not just power to weight ration, lubrication of a 2-stroke is by
the oil in the fuel. It's more difficult with a 4-stroke, you have to
make certain somehow that oil get's distributed around the engine
regardless of its orientation.

That's why many of the newer / better bits of kit are a hybrid, they
are 4/ in that they have conventional valves but still use a petrol /
oil mix for lubrication.

Most small 'domestic' petrol strimmers and similar machines are still
2-stroke, more for the lubrication issue than weight I think.

But may be going more 'hybrid' as the emissions and noise are
restricted.

Stihls '4-Mix' range are such.

https://blog.stihl.co.uk/stihl-4-mix...ogy-uncovered/

Our local council 'verges' crews have them and they are distinctive by
the sound of the lower revs used / available / needed.

Cheers, T i m

On 03/05/2021 23:14, T i m wrote:
On Mon, 3 May 2021 22:19:05 +0100, newshound
wrote:

snip

I find bow saws pretty hard work,

If they are sharp enough and with the right blade for the job, I have
found them to be very effective. Ok, still not as 'easy' as a chainsaw
but a lot quieter, cheaper and still work straight away after being
used underwater. ;-)

but the folding curved pruning saws
are pretty fast and easy at the two inch level.

I've watched daughter use her 'Silky' on some limbs that looked like
they would be way too big / hard work for such a small saw but I was
always very surprised. Few seconds of undercut then a couple more on
top and down it went.

I just dropped the saw onto my hand once and it *was* very very sharp.
;-(

I have a similar sounding one by Darlac - designed for the end of an
extending pole. Curved pull saw configuration, very sharp and quick -
although difficult to undercut the branch with if working at much height
(partly because the limited angle you can get from the ground and partly
the amount of leverage any weight on the end of the pole gets on *you*
when extended out at 5m or more (plus the weight of the pole)

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 04/05/2021 12:30, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 03/05/2021 18:25, Andy Burns wrote:
John Rumm wrote:

biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo
electric chain sharpener though

So far I've gone the three chains for £24 route, and only managed to
dull one.

I find that you need to sharpen about every hour, and it takes about ten
minutes, and the file lasts about a chainsaw week at best.

Electric sharpeners mean you have to take the sodding chain off and that
takes even longer...

I find if you have a few sharpened and ready, its quick to just swap a
chain.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

"John Rumm" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 04/05/2021 12:30, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 03/05/2021 18:25, Andy Burns wrote:
John Rumm wrote:

biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo electric
chain sharpener though

So far I've gone the three chains for £24 route, and only managed to
dull one.

I find that you need to sharpen about every hour, and it takes about ten
minutes, and the file lasts about a chainsaw week at best.

Electric sharpeners mean you have to take the sodding chain off and that
takes even longer...

I find if you have a few sharpened and ready, its quick to just swap a
chain.

It never occurred to me that it *might* be possible to sharpen the blades on
a chainsaw chain in situ, because of the problem of rotating the chain slow
enough to do each tooth in turn. I suppose if you mark the teeth that are
exposed and that you have sharpened, you can run the chainsaw and stop it -
and hope that sooner or later it will stop with different teeth exposed.

But it's so easy to remove the chain on my saw, and it's something I have to
do anyway every few times I use it, to clean out oil-impregnated wood
shavings that accumulate at the "inward" end of the blade (ie by the cog
that connects to the motor or engine, under the screw-on cover). A screw
driver blade, with the chain still in situ, never gets everything out: I've
found that the chain and blade need to be unhooked so the waste can be
removed properly and any excess oil can be wiped off.

NY wrote:
"John Rumm" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 04/05/2021 12:30, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 03/05/2021 18:25, Andy Burns wrote:
John Rumm wrote:

biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo electric
chain sharpener though

So far I've gone the three chains for £24 route, and only managed to
dull one.

I find that you need to sharpen about every hour, and it takes about ten
minutes, and the file lasts about a chainsaw week at best.

Electric sharpeners mean you have to take the sodding chain off and that
takes even longer...

I find if you have a few sharpened and ready, its quick to just swap a
chain.

It never occurred to me that it *might* be possible to sharpen the blades on
a chainsaw chain in situ, because of the problem of rotating the chain slow
enough to do each tooth in turn. I suppose if you mark the teeth that are
exposed and that you have sharpened, you can run the chainsaw and stop it -
and hope that sooner or later it will stop with different teeth exposed.

Pull it round by hand, easier with an electric chainsaw.

--
Chris Green
·

On 04/05/2021 00:15, tony sayer wrote:
In article , williamwright
scribeth thus
On 03/05/2021 17:40, Chris Green wrote:
It's not just power to weight ration, lubrication of a 2-stroke is by

I once edited a longish document* that was concerned with signal to
noise ratio, and the guy had put 'ration' every time.

*a report on TV interference caused by a tower in Rugby, in case
anyone's interested.

Bill

Yes what was it then?,,

The cement tower.

Bill

On 04/05/2021 10:13, NY wrote:
I did a lot of the work during the day time when my wife was at work,
Why should you do any work if your wife works? Use her pay to get a man in.

Bill

On 04/05/2021 12:30, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Electric sharpeners mean you have to take the sodding chain off and that
takes even longer...



No, you sharpen with the chain on the machine.

Bill

On 04/05/2021 15:15, NY wrote:
It never occurred to me that it *might* be possible to sharpen the
blades on a chainsaw chain in situ, because of the problem of rotating
the chain slow enough to do each tooth in turn. I suppose if you mark
the teeth that are exposed and that you have sharpened, you can run the
chainsaw and stop it - and hope that sooner or later it will stop with
different teeth exposed.

Some chainsaws you can pull the blade round by hand, dead easy.

Bill

On 03/05/2021 22:13, newshound wrote:
On 03/05/2021 17:55, John Rumm wrote:


(biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo
electric chain sharpener though)


That's interesting. Which product?

https://www.weekendgardener.net/best...pener-reviews/

I wouldn't be without one of these.

Bill

On 04/05/2021 13:41, John Rumm wrote:
On 03/05/2021 18:28, williamwright wrote:
On 03/05/2021 13:38, John Rumm wrote:
What size bar do you need?

Maybe 20"

Also worth considering battery powered ones these days - especially
if you are already "bought into" an 18V battery platform. (and you
can always charge them from the genny).

No.

Perhaps you were thinking of something like this:

https://www.frjonesandson.co.uk/prod...-toy-chainsaw/


Ha!
Bill

On 04/05/2021 15:15, NY wrote:
"John Rumm" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 04/05/2021 12:30, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 03/05/2021 18:25, Andy Burns wrote:
John Rumm wrote:

biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo
electric chain sharpener though

So far I've gone the three chains for £24 route, and only managed to
dull one.

I find that you need to sharpen about every hour, and it takes about
ten minutes, and the file lasts about a chainsaw week at best.

Electric sharpeners mean you have to take the sodding chain off and
that takes even longer...

I find if you have a few sharpened and ready, its quick to just swap a
chain.

It never occurred to me that it *might* be possible to sharpen the
blades on a chainsaw chain in situ, because of the problem of rotating
the chain slow enough to do each tooth in turn. I suppose if you mark
the teeth that are exposed and that you have sharpened, you can run the
chainsaw and stop it - and hope that sooner or later it will stop with
different teeth exposed.

?? you can move the chain without using the motor.


But it's so easy to remove the chain on my saw, and it's something I
have to do anyway every few times I use it, to clean out oil-impregnated
wood shavings that accumulate at the "inward" end of the blade (ie by
the cog that connects to the motor or engine, under the screw-on cover).
A screw driver blade, with the chain still in situ, never gets
everything out: I've found that the chain and blade need to be unhooked
so the waste can be removed properly and any excess oil can be wiped off.


--
€œIt is hard to imagine a more stupid decision or more dangerous way of
making decisions than by putting those decisions in the hands of people
who pay no price for being wrong.€�

Thomas Sowell

williamwright wrote:
On 03/05/2021 22:13, newshound wrote:
On 03/05/2021 17:55, John Rumm wrote:


(biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo
electric chain sharpener though)


That's interesting. Which product?

https://www.weekendgardener.net/best...pener-reviews/

I wouldn't be without one of these.

Bill


Which one though? ;-)

I have the Stihl 2 in 1 file. Seems to do a pretty good job.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

On 04/05/2021 16:45, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 04/05/2021 15:15, NY wrote:
"John Rumm" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 04/05/2021 12:30, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 03/05/2021 18:25, Andy Burns wrote:
John Rumm wrote:

biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo
electric chain sharpener though

So far I've gone the three chains for £24 route, and only managed
to dull one.

I find that you need to sharpen about every hour, and it takes about
ten minutes, and the file lasts about a chainsaw week at best.

Electric sharpeners mean you have to take the sodding chain off and
that takes even longer...

I find if you have a few sharpened and ready, its quick to just swap
a chain.

It never occurred to me that it *might* be possible to sharpen the
blades on a chainsaw chain in situ, because of the problem of rotating
the chain slow enough to do each tooth in turn. I suppose if you mark
the teeth that are exposed and that you have sharpened, you can run
the chainsaw and stop it - and hope that sooner or later it will stop
with different teeth exposed.

?? you can move the chain without using the motor.

Petrol ones have a centrifugal clutch - so there is no need to pull the
engine at the same time as the chain.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 04/05/2021 15:15, NY wrote:
"John Rumm" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 04/05/2021 12:30, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 03/05/2021 18:25, Andy Burns wrote:
John Rumm wrote:

biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo
electric chain sharpener though

So far I've gone the three chains for £24 route, and only managed to
dull one.

I find that you need to sharpen about every hour, and it takes about
ten minutes, and the file lasts about a chainsaw week at best.

Electric sharpeners mean you have to take the sodding chain off and
that takes even longer...

I find if you have a few sharpened and ready, its quick to just swap a
chain.

It never occurred to me that it *might* be possible to sharpen the
blades on a chainsaw chain in situ,

IME, its easier than doing it off the saw when using a hand file (unless
you have a vice or bench mounted cradle to hold the chain)

because of the problem of rotating
the chain slow enough to do each tooth in turn. I suppose if you mark
the teeth that are exposed and that you have sharpened, you can run the
chainsaw and stop it - and hope that sooner or later it will stop with
different teeth exposed.

No need to run the saw at all - just mark the first tooth, pull the
chain along (with gloves) to the next tooth with the same orientation,
rinse and repeat until back to the start. Now repeat again for all the
teeth angled in the other direction.

But it's so easy to remove the chain on my saw, and it's something I
have to do anyway every few times I use it, to clean out oil-impregnated
wood shavings that accumulate at the "inward" end of the blade (ie by
the cog that connects to the motor or engine, under the screw-on cover).
A screw driver blade, with the chain still in situ, never gets
everything out: I've found that the chain and blade need to be unhooked
so the waste can be removed properly and any excess oil can be wiped off.

Yup you soon accumulate a mass of oily wood gunk otherwise :-)

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 03/05/2021 18:28, williamwright wrote:
On 03/05/2021 13:38, John Rumm wrote:

What size bar do you need?

Maybe 20"

That's fairly long - will need something on mid range power level to
drive it. Plenty more choice about if you can cope with 40cm/18"

e.g.
https://www.lawson-his.co.uk/makita-...s-uc4020a-240v

https://www.lawson-his.co.uk/makita-...cm-bar-35-2-cc

Also worth considering battery powered ones these days - especially if
you are already "bought into" an 18V battery platform. (and you can
always charge them from the genny).

No.

I juts ordered a DUC306Z 12"/30cm 36V top handled saw, so will have to
see how that compares to my petrol one :-)


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Tue, 4 May 2021 14:28:19 +0100, John Rumm
wrote:

snip

I just dropped the saw onto my hand once and it *was* very very sharp.
;-(

I have a similar sounding one by Darlac - designed for the end of an
extending pole.

We had a cheap one of those (Lidl type pole pruner) and it was handy
(while it lasted). ;-)

Curved pull saw configuration, very sharp and quick -
although difficult to undercut the branch with if working at much height
(partly because the limited angle you can get from the ground and partly
the amount of leverage any weight on the end of the pole gets on *you*
when extended out at 5m or more (plus the weight of the pole)

Understood. The pole needs to be made of a carbon fibre tube so that
it's both stiff and light as the shape and weight of the saw itself
should do most the work?

Cheers, T i m

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
It never occurred to me that it *might* be possible to sharpen the blades
on a chainsaw chain in situ, because of the problem of rotating the chain
slow enough to do each tooth in turn. I suppose if you mark the teeth
that are exposed and that you have sharpened, you can run the chainsaw
and stop it - and hope that sooner or later it will stop with different
teeth exposed.

?? you can move the chain without using the motor.

Maybe it's different with an electric (battery) chainsaw, which mine is. If
I grabbed hold of the teeth to pull the chain round, I think I'd rip holes
in my fingers before the chain moved at all. I wonder whether there is a
reduction gear between the motor and the chain sprocket which makes it very
difficult to drive it "in reverse" by pulling on the chain.

When the chain has got embedded in the wood (which happens occasionally), it
takes a lot of effort to pull the blade back to unwind the chain from the
notch that it's cut so far, to free the teeth. So there's definitely not a
freewheel action.

NY wrote:
"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
It never occurred to me that it *might* be possible to sharpen the blades
on a chainsaw chain in situ, because of the problem of rotating the chain
slow enough to do each tooth in turn. I suppose if you mark the teeth
that are exposed and that you have sharpened, you can run the chainsaw
and stop it - and hope that sooner or later it will stop with different
teeth exposed.

?? you can move the chain without using the motor.

Maybe it's different with an electric (battery) chainsaw, which mine is. If
I grabbed hold of the teeth to pull the chain round, I think I'd rip holes
in my fingers before the chain moved at all. I wonder whether there is a
reduction gear between the motor and the chain sprocket which makes it very
difficult to drive it "in reverse" by pulling on the chain.

On my mains electric chainsaws you certainly can pull the chain round
by hand, safer if you use a gloved hand, but quite doable. This is on
a very old B&D, and a newer Makita.

--
Chris Green
·

On 04/05/2021 11:34, T i m wrote:
On Tue, 4 May 2021 10:13:19 +0100, "NY" wrote:

snip

I've snapped two pruning saws when the blades got seized in branches on
the
push stroke.

Were they 'good' ones? (Silky etc)

I think one of them was a cheap one,

I would expect a cheap one to blunt quickly and bend rather than snap
as they generally use a lower grade steel.

The ones I have had from Lidl and other places have been made from
hardened carbon steel which stay sharp but can crack if abused. They cut
on the push and pull stroke but it is best to put most force into the
pull, to reduce bending.

I've had well-used ones break (perhaps from fatigue cracks) before they
have lost their sharpness significantly.

On 04/05/2021 15:55, Chris Green wrote:
NY wrote:
"John Rumm" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 04/05/2021 12:30, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 03/05/2021 18:25, Andy Burns wrote:
John Rumm wrote:

biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo electric
chain sharpener though

So far I've gone the three chains for £24 route, and only managed to
dull one.

I find that you need to sharpen about every hour, and it takes about ten
minutes, and the file lasts about a chainsaw week at best.

Electric sharpeners mean you have to take the sodding chain off and that
takes even longer...

I find if you have a few sharpened and ready, its quick to just swap a
chain.

It never occurred to me that it *might* be possible to sharpen the blades on
a chainsaw chain in situ, because of the problem of rotating the chain slow
enough to do each tooth in turn. I suppose if you mark the teeth that are
exposed and that you have sharpened, you can run the chainsaw and stop it -
and hope that sooner or later it will stop with different teeth exposed.

Pull it round by hand, easier with an electric chainsaw.

+1. Mark the first tooth sharpened with a permanent marker. I usually
grip the handle in a workmate so that the bar is presented at a
convenient height.

IIRC the chain pulls round easily enough on my petrol chainsaw because
the centrifugal clutch is disengaged.

On 04/05/2021 16:52, Tim+ wrote:
williamwright wrote:
On 03/05/2021 22:13, newshound wrote:
On 03/05/2021 17:55, John Rumm wrote:


(biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo
electric chain sharpener though)


That's interesting. Which product?

https://www.weekendgardener.net/best...pener-reviews/

I wouldn't be without one of these.

Bill


Which one though? ;-)

I have the Stihl 2 in 1 file. Seems to do a pretty good job.

Tim

I have the Stihl file too, which I find very good. I'm still on my first
files (although I admit I don't do a vast amount of cutting). The first
choice electric one seems to be cutting square to the chain, which is wrong.

The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

So far I've gone the three chains for £24 route, and only managed to
dull one.

I find that you need to sharpen about every hour, and it takes about ten
minutes, and the file lasts about a chainsaw week at best.

Electric sharpeners mean you have to take the sodding chain off and that
takes even longer...

The dremel one looks like you can sharpen while leaving the chain on,
but swapping chains is tool-less and quick on mine, so resharpening at
home in downtime might be better ...

On 04/05/2021 17:51, T i m wrote:
On Tue, 4 May 2021 14:28:19 +0100, John Rumm
wrote:

snip

I just dropped the saw onto my hand once and it *was* very very sharp.
;-(

I have a similar sounding one by Darlac - designed for the end of an
extending pole.

We had a cheap one of those (Lidl type pole pruner) and it was handy
(while it lasted). ;-)

Curved pull saw configuration, very sharp and quick -
although difficult to undercut the branch with if working at much height
(partly because the limited angle you can get from the ground and partly
the amount of leverage any weight on the end of the pole gets on *you*
when extended out at 5m or more (plus the weight of the pole)

Understood. The pole needs to be made of a carbon fibre tube so that
it's both stiff and light as the shape and weight of the saw itself
should do most the work?

Mine is a three section Ali pole - not that heavy in itself... The saw
is not too bad. The drawstring cutoff head however is quite a bit heavier.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/