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chainsaw
Yesterday I went to my daughter's with a load of wood. I was rewarded
with a very nice cottage pie (large portion), then, since it wasn't raining Matt and I decided to do the right thing and cut the wood up rather than just pile it in a corner and forget about it. Matt thought we ought to use my chainsaw to save wearing his out (typical), so we did. Unfortunately my chainsaw (Bosch 1750W) suddenly stopped working. All it did was emit a loud buzz and some magic smoke. Not to worry; I've had it for at least twenty years and it had done a lot of work, and the oiler didn't work and the chain tensioner only just worked. (Later I dismantled it out of curiosity and found that the front motor bearing had seized absolutely solid. But surprisingly the gear wheels showed very little wear and the motor brushes were still quite good.) I don't know whether to get a petrol or electric chain saw. If electric a constraint is that I want it to work from the genny, which is 2kW. The bigger chainsaws are 2.5kW. Bill |
chainsaw
On 03/05/2021 07:42, williamwright wrote:
Yesterday I went to my daughter's with a load of wood. I was rewarded with a very nice cottage pie (large portion), then, since it wasn't raining Matt and I decided to do the right thing and cut the wood up rather than just pile it in a corner and forget about it. Matt thought we ought to use my chainsaw to save wearing his out (typical), so we did. Unfortunately my chainsaw (Bosch 1750W) suddenly stopped working. All it did was emit a loud buzz and some magic smoke. Not to worry; I've had it for at least twenty years and it had done a lot of work, and the oiler didn't work and the chain tensioner only just worked. (Later I dismantled it out of curiosity and found that the front motor bearing had seized absolutely solid. But surprisingly the gear wheels showed very little wear and the motor brushes were still quite good.) I don't know whether to get a petrol or electric chain saw. If electric a constraint is that I want it to work from the genny, which is 2kW. The bigger chainsaws are 2.5kW. Bill A motor is an inductive load..... Even if you replaced the genny with a 2.5 kW version or found a chainsaw rated at 2.00 kW, it will still not work due to motors being an inductive load. (You need a higher start power before it then settles down. Plus there is power factor to think of. |
chainsaw
williamwright wrote:
Yesterday I went to my daughter's with a load of wood. I was rewarded with a very nice cottage pie (large portion), then, since it wasn't raining Matt and I decided to do the right thing and cut the wood up rather than just pile it in a corner and forget about it. Matt thought we ought to use my chainsaw to save wearing his out (typical), so we did. Unfortunately my chainsaw (Bosch 1750W) suddenly stopped working. All it did was emit a loud buzz and some magic smoke. Not to worry; I've had it for at least twenty years and it had done a lot of work, and the oiler didn't work and the chain tensioner only just worked. (Later I dismantled it out of curiosity and found that the front motor bearing had seized absolutely solid. But surprisingly the gear wheels showed very little wear and the motor brushes were still quite good.) I don't know whether to get a petrol or electric chain saw. If electric a constraint is that I want it to work from the genny, which is 2kW. The bigger chainsaws are 2.5kW. Bill Just get a petrol one. You know you want to. ;-) My £79 Aldi/Lidl one has served me very well. Always starts first time. Saved me its cost in firewood many times over. Tim -- Please don't feed the trolls |
chainsaw
williamwright wrote:
Yesterday I went to my daughter's with a load of wood. I was rewarded with a very nice cottage pie (large portion), then, since it wasn't raining Matt and I decided to do the right thing and cut the wood up rather than just pile it in a corner and forget about it. Matt thought we ought to use my chainsaw to save wearing his out (typical), so we did. Unfortunately my chainsaw (Bosch 1750W) suddenly stopped working. All it did was emit a loud buzz and some magic smoke. Not to worry; I've had it for at least twenty years and it had done a lot of work, and the oiler didn't work and the chain tensioner only just worked. (Later I dismantled it out of curiosity and found that the front motor bearing had seized absolutely solid. But surprisingly the gear wheels showed very little wear and the motor brushes were still quite good.) I don't know whether to get a petrol or electric chain saw. If electric a constraint is that I want it to work from the genny, which is 2kW. The bigger chainsaws are 2.5kW. Bill Here, a gentleman in the video, measures an electric chainsaw. With the chain not moving, the peak input current is 50A on the 120V powered saw. The normal operating current is more likely to be in the 15A range. That's at least a 3X multiplier. https://www.tek.com/how-to/inrush-cu...ctric-chainsaw The generator must be scaled a bit, to handle that surge without stalling. If the generator is the same size as the load, maybe it will stall out when you pull the trigger. There is a Makita chainsaw with a "slow start" feature and "motor current burnout prevention" type feature. But you're paying the price of two or three chainsaws, just to make your generator hold up. The highest stall current I know of, is electric motors that draw 10X the current at zero RPM. The electric chainsaw measured 3X. Refrigerators, the estimate for the compressor, is a stall load of 5X at startup. And an oversized generator can help, with the transient load. Some electrical loads, will even trip the the generator protection device when the load is connected. So there is that possibility to consider as well. Paul |
chainsaw
On 03/05/2021 09:22, SH wrote:
I don't know whether to get a petrol or electric chain saw. If electric a constraint is that I want it to work from the genny, which is 2kW. The bigger chainsaws are 2.5kW. Bill A motor is an inductive load..... Even if you replaced the genny with a 2.5 kW version or found a chainsaw rated at 2.00 kW, it will still not work due to motors being an inductive load.Â* (You need a higher start power before it then settles down. Plus there is power factor to think of. The generator (Honda EU20i) has been in use with the existing chainsaw for many years. There have been no problems. Bill |
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On 03/05/2021 10:55, Tim+ wrote:
Just get a petrol one. You know you want to.;-) I used to have petrol power tools that wouldn't start, and were a general nuisance, but the three I have now behave perfectly. So yes. Bill |
chainsaw
On 03/05/2021 12:02, Paul wrote:
Here, a gentleman in the video, measures an electric chainsaw. With the chain not moving, the peak input current is 50A on the 120V powered saw. The normal operating current is more likely to be in the 15A range. That's at least a 3X multiplier. https://www.tek.com/how-to/inrush-cu...ctric-chainsaw The generator must be scaled a bit, to handle that surge without stalling. If the generator is the same size as the load, maybe it will stall out when you pull the trigger. The generator (Honda EU20i) has been in use with the existing chainsaw for many years. There have been no problems. Bill |
chainsaw
On 03/05/2021 07:42, williamwright wrote:
I don't know whether to get a petrol or electric chain saw. If electric a constraint is that I want it to work from the genny, which is 2kW. The bigger chainsaws are 2.5kW. What size bar do you need? Also worth considering battery powered ones these days - especially if you are already "bought into" an 18V battery platform. (and you can always charge them from the genny). -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
chainsaw
On Mon, 3 May 2021 12:28:45 +0100, williamwright
wrote: On 03/05/2021 12:02, Paul wrote: Here, a gentleman in the video, measures an electric chainsaw. With the chain not moving, the peak input current is 50A on the 120V powered saw. The normal operating current is more likely to be in the 15A range. That's at least a 3X multiplier. https://www.tek.com/how-to/inrush-cu...ctric-chainsaw The generator must be scaled a bit, to handle that surge without stalling. If the generator is the same size as the load, maybe it will stall out when you pull the trigger. The generator (Honda EU20i) has been in use with the existing chainsaw for many years. There have been no problems. Daughter tried some chainsaw carving at an arb show she had a stand at using my cheap electric chainsaw and one of my 3KW generators and I think that worked ok (as far as the saw functioning ok, rather than being nice / suitable for carving compared with her Stihl carving saw, certainly with the (stock) bar on the electric). At least the generator could be put a distance away from the visitors making the carving bit slightly greener (4/ genny) and quieter (and probably less vibration). Cheers, T i m |
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John Rumm wrote:
williamwright wrote: I don't know whether to get a petrol or electric chain saw. Also worth considering battery powered ones these days - Considering the "hedgetrimmer" thread, I can't see Bill going for that! |
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On 03/05/2021 13:38, John Rumm wrote:
On 03/05/2021 07:42, williamwright wrote: I don't know whether to get a petrol or electric chain saw. If electric a constraint is that I want it to work from the genny, which is 2kW. The bigger chainsaws are 2.5kW. What size bar do you need? Yes, that is the main piece of information not supplied by the OP. Also worth considering battery powered ones these days - especially if you are already "bought into" an 18V battery platform. (and you can always charge them from the genny). Personally I would now never consider a corded chainsaw, which simplifies the decision process. I have both cordless (smaller) and two-stroke (larger). The latter is 20 years old and sometimes reluctant to start, I have been very impressed with the amount that I can manage with my "20 volt" Lidl (with about a 10 inch bar). |
chainsaw
On 03/05/2021 14:10, Andy Burns wrote:
John Rumm wrote: williamwright wrote: I don't know whether to get a petrol or electric chain saw. Also worth considering battery powered ones these days - Considering the "hedgetrimmer" thread, I can't see Bill going for that! I use a manual emission-free chain saw. Good exercise. https://www.screwfix.com/p/bahco-erg...24-610mm/5313k |
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newshound wrote:
I have been very impressed with the amount that I can manage with my "20 volt" Lidl (with about a 10 inch bar). Likewise 36V with 14" bar (same saw available in models with longer or shorter bar) |
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Andrew wrote:
I use a manual emission-free chain saw. Good exercise. https://www.screwfix.com/p/bahco-erg...24-610mm/5313k Not such a wide throat though? I have a saw on a stick for the out of reach stuff https://www.buyaparcel.com/wolf-garten-telescopic-handle-zmv4-multi-change-rcm-loppers-pc370ms-pruning-saw/ |
chainsaw
What is the pollution like, I see a lot of power tools that seem to push out
foul smelling blue smoke all the time on strimmers hedge cutters and the like. Brian -- This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from... The Sofa of Brian Gaff... Blind user, so no pictures please Note this Signature is meaningless.! "Tim+" wrote in message ... williamwright wrote: Yesterday I went to my daughter's with a load of wood. I was rewarded with a very nice cottage pie (large portion), then, since it wasn't raining Matt and I decided to do the right thing and cut the wood up rather than just pile it in a corner and forget about it. Matt thought we ought to use my chainsaw to save wearing his out (typical), so we did. Unfortunately my chainsaw (Bosch 1750W) suddenly stopped working. All it did was emit a loud buzz and some magic smoke. Not to worry; I've had it for at least twenty years and it had done a lot of work, and the oiler didn't work and the chain tensioner only just worked. (Later I dismantled it out of curiosity and found that the front motor bearing had seized absolutely solid. But surprisingly the gear wheels showed very little wear and the motor brushes were still quite good.) I don't know whether to get a petrol or electric chain saw. If electric a constraint is that I want it to work from the genny, which is 2kW. The bigger chainsaws are 2.5kW. Bill Just get a petrol one. You know you want to. ;-) My £79 Aldi/Lidl one has served me very well. Always starts first time. Saved me its cost in firewood many times over. Tim -- Please don't feed the trolls |
chainsaw
Yes my first attempt at designing a drill speed control using a triac ended
in tears due to the strange effects of inductance, as I recall. Brian -- This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from... The Sofa of Brian Gaff... Blind user, so no pictures please Note this Signature is meaningless.! "Paul" wrote in message ... williamwright wrote: Yesterday I went to my daughter's with a load of wood. I was rewarded with a very nice cottage pie (large portion), then, since it wasn't raining Matt and I decided to do the right thing and cut the wood up rather than just pile it in a corner and forget about it. Matt thought we ought to use my chainsaw to save wearing his out (typical), so we did. Unfortunately my chainsaw (Bosch 1750W) suddenly stopped working. All it did was emit a loud buzz and some magic smoke. Not to worry; I've had it for at least twenty years and it had done a lot of work, and the oiler didn't work and the chain tensioner only just worked. (Later I dismantled it out of curiosity and found that the front motor bearing had seized absolutely solid. But surprisingly the gear wheels showed very little wear and the motor brushes were still quite good.) I don't know whether to get a petrol or electric chain saw. If electric a constraint is that I want it to work from the genny, which is 2kW. The bigger chainsaws are 2.5kW. Bill Here, a gentleman in the video, measures an electric chainsaw. With the chain not moving, the peak input current is 50A on the 120V powered saw. The normal operating current is more likely to be in the 15A range. That's at least a 3X multiplier. https://www.tek.com/how-to/inrush-cu...ctric-chainsaw The generator must be scaled a bit, to handle that surge without stalling. If the generator is the same size as the load, maybe it will stall out when you pull the trigger. There is a Makita chainsaw with a "slow start" feature and "motor current burnout prevention" type feature. But you're paying the price of two or three chainsaws, just to make your generator hold up. The highest stall current I know of, is electric motors that draw 10X the current at zero RPM. The electric chainsaw measured 3X. Refrigerators, the estimate for the compressor, is a stall load of 5X at startup. And an oversized generator can help, with the transient load. Some electrical loads, will even trip the the generator protection device when the load is connected. So there is that possibility to consider as well. Paul |
chainsaw
"Brian Gaff \(Sofa\)" wrote:
What is the pollution like, I see a lot of power tools that seem to push out foul smelling blue smoke all the time on strimmers hedge cutters and the like. Brian Older. probably, and 2-stroke which necessarily burn some oil and produce blue smoke. Another reason why I like my 4-stroke Ryobi. -- Chris Green · |
chainsaw
"Chris Green" wrote in message
... "Brian Gaff \(Sofa\)" wrote: What is the pollution like, I see a lot of power tools that seem to push out foul smelling blue smoke all the time on strimmers hedge cutters and the like. Brian Older. probably, and 2-stroke which necessarily burn some oil and produce blue smoke. Another reason why I like my 4-stroke Ryobi. With all the concern about exhaust pollution from petrol and diesel engines, how long will it be before two-stroke petrol-engined cars, bikes and power tools (or at least, crankcase-scavenged ones which burn oil) are outlawed, initially for new sales and later for use? |
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Chris Green wrote:
"Brian Gaff \(Sofa\)" wrote: What is the pollution like, I see a lot of power tools that seem to push out foul smelling blue smoke all the time on strimmers hedge cutters and the like. Brian Older. probably, and 2-stroke which necessarily burn some oil and produce blue smoke. Another reason why I like my 4-stroke Ryobi. Does such a chainsaw still exist? Tim -- Please don't feed the trolls |
chainsaw
On 03/05/2021 17:17, Tim+ wrote:
Chris Green wrote: "Brian Gaff \(Sofa\)" wrote: What is the pollution like, I see a lot of power tools that seem to push out foul smelling blue smoke all the time on strimmers hedge cutters and the like. Brian Older. probably, and 2-stroke which necessarily burn some oil and produce blue smoke. Another reason why I like my 4-stroke Ryobi. Does such a chainsaw still exist? Tim all my saws have been 2 stroke power to weight, mate. -- No Apple devices were knowingly used in the preparation of this post. |
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The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 03/05/2021 17:17, Tim+ wrote: Chris Green wrote: "Brian Gaff \(Sofa\)" wrote: What is the pollution like, I see a lot of power tools that seem to push out foul smelling blue smoke all the time on strimmers hedge cutters and the like. Brian Older. probably, and 2-stroke which necessarily burn some oil and produce blue smoke. Another reason why I like my 4-stroke Ryobi. Does such a chainsaw still exist? Tim all my saws have been 2 stroke power to weight, mate. Well I know that. That said, Sthil do make 4-stroke strimmers/brush cutters (that run on two stroke fuel) so not impossible, but I couldnt find any Ryobi ones. A quick search suggests that other brands *do* exist. Tim -- Please don't feed the trolls |
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NY wrote:
"Chris Green" wrote in message ... "Brian Gaff \(Sofa\)" wrote: What is the pollution like, I see a lot of power tools that seem to push out foul smelling blue smoke all the time on strimmers hedge cutters and the like. Brian Older. probably, and 2-stroke which necessarily burn some oil and produce blue smoke. Another reason why I like my 4-stroke Ryobi. With all the concern about exhaust pollution from petrol and diesel engines, how long will it be before two-stroke petrol-engined cars, bikes and power tools (or at least, crankcase-scavenged ones which burn oil) are outlawed, initially for new sales and later for use? They have almost been outlawed foe new production. -- Chris Green · |
chainsaw
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 03/05/2021 17:17, Tim+ wrote: Chris Green wrote: "Brian Gaff \(Sofa\)" wrote: What is the pollution like, I see a lot of power tools that seem to push out foul smelling blue smoke all the time on strimmers hedge cutters and the like. Brian Older. probably, and 2-stroke which necessarily burn some oil and produce blue smoke. Another reason why I like my 4-stroke Ryobi. Does such a chainsaw still exist? all my saws have been 2 stroke power to weight, mate. It's not just power to weight ration, lubrication of a 2-stroke is by the oil in the fuel. It's more difficult with a 4-stroke, you have to make certain somehow that oil get's distributed around the engine regardless of its orientation. Most small 'domestic' petrol strimmers and similar machines are still 2-stroke, more for the lubrication issue than weight I think. -- Chris Green · |
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On 03/05/2021 14:10, Andy Burns wrote:
John Rumm wrote: williamwright wrote: I don't know whether to get a petrol or electric chain saw. Also worth considering battery powered ones these days - Considering the "hedgetrimmer" thread, I can't see Bill going for that! I think I missed that one - my "cross post" filter may have killed it. Hang on, let's google it... Yeah, well perhaps he has not tried a pro level 36V cordless tool! :-) Plenty of head to head comparisons between petrol and battery chainsaws on youtube. -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
chainsaw
On 03/05/2021 14:30, newshound wrote:
On 03/05/2021 13:38, John Rumm wrote: On 03/05/2021 07:42, williamwright wrote: I don't know whether to get a petrol or electric chain saw. If electric a constraint is that I want it to work from the genny, which is 2kW. The bigger chainsaws are 2.5kW. What size bar do you need? Yes, that is the main piece of information not supplied by the OP. Also worth considering battery powered ones these days - especially if you are already "bought into" an 18V battery platform. (and you can always charge them from the genny). Personally I would now never consider a corded chainsaw, which simplifies the decision process. I have both cordless (smaller) and two-stroke (larger). The latter is 20 years old and sometimes reluctant to start, I have been very impressed with the amount that I can manage with my "20 volt" Lidl (with about a 10 inch bar). Yup same here - corded would be too much of a PITA. I use a 14" Makita 45cc petrol saw, and a 10" pruner saw on the end of my Stilh power head, however I am toying with getting a "top handled" saw for safer ladder / platform work - going 36V for that seems like an obvious choice. (biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo electric chain sharpener though) -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
chainsaw
On 03/05/2021 16:23, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
What is the pollution like, I see a lot of power tools that seem to push out foul smelling blue smoke all the time on strimmers hedge cutters and the like. Brian Wrong oil/petrol mix Bill |
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On 03/05/2021 17:13, NY wrote:
With all the concern about exhaust pollution from petrol and diesel engines, how long will it be before two-stroke petrol-engined cars, bikes and power tools (or at least, crankcase-scavenged ones which burn oil) are outlawed, initially for new sales and later for use? Ha! Thousands of power tool inspectors swooping on decent hardworking people. Bill |
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On 03/05/2021 17:34, Tim+ wrote:
Well I know that. That said, Sthil do make 4-stroke strimmers/brush cutters (that run on two stroke fuel) so not impossible, but I couldnt find any Ryobi ones. A quick search suggests that other brands *do* exist. Tim My strimmer is four stroke. Quiet, but a bit heavy. Bill |
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John Rumm wrote:
biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo electric chain sharpener though So far I've gone the three chains for £24 route, and only managed to dull one. |
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On 03/05/2021 17:40, Chris Green wrote:
It's not just power to weight ration, lubrication of a 2-stroke is by I once edited a longish document* that was concerned with signal to noise ratio, and the guy had put 'ration' every time. *a report on TV interference caused by a tower in Rugby, in case anyone's interested. Bill |
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On 03/05/2021 13:38, John Rumm wrote:
What size bar do you need? Maybe 20" Also worth considering battery powered ones these days - especially if you are already "bought into" an 18V battery platform. (and you can always charge them from the genny). No. Bill |
chainsaw
On 03/05/2021 14:34, Andrew wrote:
I use a manual emission-free chain saw. Good exercise. https://www.screwfix.com/p/bahco-erg...24-610mm/5313k I'd worked myself nearly to death by the time I was 62. I don't want to finish the job on anything so futile as doing the work of a machine. Bill |
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On 03/05/2021 17:42, John Rumm wrote:
Yeah, well perhaps he has not tried a pro level 36V cordless tool! :-) Plenty of head to head comparisons between petrol and battery chainsaws on youtube. Got a 36V Bosch drill. Very good. Better than its 24V predecessor. Bill |
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On 03/05/2021 17:55, John Rumm wrote:
(biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo electric chain sharpener though) My son-in-law's chainsaw was cutting very badly.Ten minutes with my 12V sharpener and he couldn't believe the difference. Bill |
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"williamwright" wrote in message
... On 03/05/2021 14:34, Andrew wrote: I use a manual emission-free chain saw. Good exercise. https://www.screwfix.com/p/bahco-erg...24-610mm/5313k I'd worked myself nearly to death by the time I was 62. I don't want to finish the job on anything so futile as doing the work of a machine. When we moved into our new house, we found that the previous owners had gone a bit OTT with vigorously spreading conifers around the garden. I had to prune or even cut down some of them. Having tried a bow saw (which the previous people left) and a tenon saw, both of which kept binding in the wood, I bought a battery-powered chainsaw. I know which of those three I'd prefer to use ;-) |
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On 03/05/2021 17:55, John Rumm wrote:
(biggest revelation in chainsaw performance was buying a cheapo electric chain sharpener though) That's interesting. Which product? Although manual sharpening is a bit of a fiddle, I usually find that three to five strokes of the round file per tooth is all you need, without bothering with the other file. So it really does not take long for a ten inch bar. |
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On 03/05/2021 21:33, NY wrote:
"williamwright" wrote in message ... On 03/05/2021 14:34, Andrew wrote: I use a manual emission-free chain saw. Good exercise. https://www.screwfix.com/p/bahco-erg...24-610mm/5313k I'd worked myself nearly to death by the time I was 62. I don't want to finish the job on anything so futile as doing the work of a machine. When we moved into our new house, we found that the previous owners had gone a bit OTT with vigorously spreading conifers around the garden. I had to prune or even cut down some of them. Having tried a bow saw (which the previous people left) and a tenon saw, both of which kept binding in the wood, I bought a battery-powered chainsaw. I know which of those three I'd prefer to use ;-) I find bow saws pretty hard work, but the folding curved pruning saws are pretty fast and easy at the two inch level. It's also interesting to find that a decent machete will cut 20mm in one cut for some timbers. (This is not for "neat" pruning of course, but I sometimes have to cut back rough scrub as it encroaches on my horse paddock) |
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On 03/05/2021 18:31, williamwright wrote:
On 03/05/2021 17:42, John Rumm wrote: Yeah, well perhaps he has not tried a pro level 36V cordless tool! :-) Plenty of head to head comparisons between petrol and battery chainsaws on youtube. Got a 36V Bosch drill. Very good. Better than its 24V predecessor. Bill Then I would certainly consider a AKE 30 LI. I don't know if they do a longer model, but it is an Oregon chain and I suspect that longer Oregon bars would also fit. |
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"NY" wrote in message ... "Chris Green" wrote in message ... "Brian Gaff \(Sofa\)" wrote: What is the pollution like, I see a lot of power tools that seem to push out foul smelling blue smoke all the time on strimmers hedge cutters and the like. Brian Older. probably, and 2-stroke which necessarily burn some oil and produce blue smoke. Another reason why I like my 4-stroke Ryobi. With all the concern about exhaust pollution from petrol and diesel engines, how long will it be before two-stroke petrol-engined cars, bikes and power tools (or at least, crankcase-scavenged ones which burn oil) are outlawed, initially for new sales and later for use? They already have been in some jurisdictions. |
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