The new freezer came with an envelope containing the instructions and so
forth. There was a large label on the bag: REGISTER NOW!" This would
'activate the free one year guarantee'. This seems to do no more than
duplicate our statutory rights. In the bag was a glossy brochure
offering 'Peace of mind'. Peace of mind is worth a lot so I read on. It
turned out that the peace of mind was limited to not worrying about the
freezer breaking down. But it was so cheap! The three year plan was only
£77! But hang on a minute! The first year is definitely covered by the
normal warranty (and if the freezer died during the subsequent months
I'd be looking at my consumer rights, since it is not a budget freezer.)
And the £77 is not a one-off payment; it is (as the tiny print implies
but doesn't explicitly state) an annual payment. So for £231 I would get
warranty for years two and three. And the price could increase: "We
reserve the right to alter the fee..." If payment is by direct debit
there's a £10 per annum reduction, presumably because you would continue
to pay during the second and third years without really being aware of it.
The warranty includes 'damage caused accidentally' (I just can't imagine
a likely scenario that would lead to a claim, having read through the
exclusions) but not the cost of spoiled food if the freezer breaks down
or there's a power cut. If the freezer is a write-off during the
warranty period and a new one is supplied the customer would have to pay
delivery charges, install the machine themselves, and dispose of the old
machine at their own cost.
£231 would go a long way towards the cost of a replacement freezer. That
would be with a statutory warranty of at least twelve months.
My experience of white goods extended warranties is that if the item
breaks down you have to wait hours for the phone to answer, then jump
through hoops during a very long phone call, then the repair man comes
many days later. We once had to wait ten working days without a washing
machine. That hardly brings peace of mind. Its better to use a trusted
local repair man. My experience of that is that the phone call lasts two
minutes, he comes the next day, and he charges SFA.

Bill

On Sunday, 29 July 2018 04:17:43 UTC+1, Bill Wright wrote:
The new freezer came with an envelope containing the instructions and so
forth. There was a large label on the bag: REGISTER NOW!" This would
'activate the free one year guarantee'. This seems to do no more than
duplicate our statutory rights. In the bag was a glossy brochure
offering 'Peace of mind'. Peace of mind is worth a lot so I read on. It
turned out that the peace of mind was limited to not worrying about the
freezer breaking down. But it was so cheap! The three year plan was only
£77! But hang on a minute! The first year is definitely covered by the
normal warranty (and if the freezer died during the subsequent months
I'd be looking at my consumer rights, since it is not a budget freezer.)
And the £77 is not a one-off payment; it is (as the tiny print implies
but doesn't explicitly state) an annual payment. So for £231 I would get
warranty for years two and three. And the price could increase: "We
reserve the right to alter the fee..." If payment is by direct debit
there's a £10 per annum reduction, presumably because you would continue
to pay during the second and third years without really being aware of it..
The warranty includes 'damage caused accidentally' (I just can't imagine
a likely scenario that would lead to a claim, having read through the
exclusions) but not the cost of spoiled food if the freezer breaks down
or there's a power cut. If the freezer is a write-off during the
warranty period and a new one is supplied the customer would have to pay
delivery charges, install the machine themselves, and dispose of the old
machine at their own cost.
£231 would go a long way towards the cost of a replacement freezer. That
would be with a statutory warranty of at least twelve months.
My experience of white goods extended warranties is that if the item
breaks down you have to wait hours for the phone to answer, then jump
through hoops during a very long phone call, then the repair man comes
many days later. We once had to wait ten working days without a washing
machine. That hardly brings peace of mind. Its better to use a trusted
local repair man. My experience of that is that the phone call lasts two
minutes, he comes the next day, and he charges SFA.

Bill

What a con!!!!
I only insure the house and cars.

On 29/07/18 04:17, Bill Wright wrote:
The new freezer came with an envelope containing the instructions and so
forth. There was a large label on the bag: REGISTER NOW!" This would
'activate the free one year guarantee'. This seems to do no more than
duplicate our statutory rights. In the bag was a glossy brochure
offering 'Peace of mind'. Peace of mind is worth a lot so I read on. It
turned out that the peace of mind was limited to not worrying about the
freezer breaking down. But it was so cheap! The three year plan was only
£77! But hang on a minute! The first year is definitely covered by the
normal warranty (and if the freezer died during the subsequent months
I'd be looking at my consumer rights, since it is not a budget freezer.)
And the £77 is not a one-off payment; it is (as the tiny print implies
but doesn't explicitly state) an annual payment. So for £231 I would get
warranty for years two and three. And the price could increase: "We
reserve the right to alter the fee..." If payment is by direct debit
there's a £10 per annum reduction, presumably because you would continue
to pay during the second and third years without really being aware of it.
The warranty includes 'damage caused accidentally' (I just can't imagine
a likely scenario that would lead to a claim, having read through the
exclusions) but not the cost of spoiled food if the freezer breaks down
or there's a power cut. If the freezer is a write-off during the
warranty period and a new one is supplied the customer would have to pay
delivery charges, install the machine themselves, and dispose of the old
machine at their own cost.
£231 would go a long way towards the cost of a replacement freezer. That
would be with a statutory warranty of at least twelve months.
My experience of white goods extended warranties is that if the item
breaks down you have to wait hours for the phone to answer, then jump
through hoops during a very long phone call, then the repair man comes
many days later. We once had to wait ten working days without a washing
machine. That hardly brings peace of mind. Its better to use a trusted
local repair man. My experience of that is that the phone call lasts two
minutes, he comes the next day, and he charges SFA.

Bill

Our fridge-freezer died a few weeks ago on the then hottest weekend of
the year. It was just under 4 years old, and 2 years out of guarantee.
It was definitely not a budget appliance! On the Monday an email went to
Customer Support, asking why an expensive "reliable" machine had gone
wrong in such a short time. The email was answered by return and with
much concern. To cut a longish story short, I was offered a brand-new FF
at 50% discount, and a further year's guarantee (over the two years
standard) free of charge. I consider that very reasonable as, being
out-of-guarantee I could have been told to get lost.

One other point. Because we needed a fridge in the short term, on the
morning the FF failed I bought a budget one which works perfectly well,
but I have been totally unable to register it over the internet for its
one-year guarantee. I fill out the form and it just sits there
"confirming" the info endlessly. It's no more than I would get from my
consumer rights, anyway, so I gave up.

--

Jeff

On 29/07/2018 07:28, harry wrote:

What a con!!!!
I only insure the house and cars.


+1 (except we only have the one car).

The whole concept of insuring small losses is obviously barmy. Maybe it
makes sense for people who are so broke and out of credit they can't
afford to replace a small appliance, but otherwise the process of
insuring adds the cost of layers of administration and profit onto the
expected cost of replacement. It's bound to be cheaper to self-insure.

On 29/07/2018 04:17, Bill Wright wrote:
The new freezer came with an envelope containing the instructions and so
forth. There was a large label on the bag: REGISTER NOW!"
I don't take the extended warranty out on anything.

As you say, the first year (or more) is covered and statistically
failures tend to follow the bath tub curve. It will be dead on arrival,
fail soon after you purchased it or fail at the end of its "normal
lifespan" Things like fridges and freezers tend to be very reliable.

Furthermore, if you are that worried about extending a warranty you will
probably find that by shopping around for this type of insurance from a
third party is much cheaper than obtaining it from the manufacturer or
from the retailer from where you purchased the item.

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On 29/07/2018 04:17, Bill Wright wrote:
The new freezer came with an envelope containing the instructions and
so forth. There was a large label on the bag: REGISTER NOW!" This
would 'activate the free one year guarantee'. This seems to do no
more than duplicate our statutory rights. In the bag was a glossy
brochure offering 'Peace of mind'. Peace of mind is worth a lot so I
read on. It turned out that the peace of mind was limited to not
worrying about the freezer breaking down. But it was so cheap! The
three year plan was only £77! But hang on a minute! The first year is
definitely covered by the normal warranty (and if the freezer died
during the subsequent months I'd be looking at my consumer rights,
since it is not a budget freezer.) And the £77 is not a one-off
payment; it is (as the tiny print implies but doesn't explicitly
state) an annual payment. So for £231 I would get warranty for years
two and three. And the price could increase: "We reserve the right to
alter the fee..." If payment is by direct debit there's a £10 per
annum reduction, presumably because you would continue to pay during
the second and third years without really being aware of it. The

It is a familiar business model of offering vastly overpriced customer
support contracts on things sold cheaply. You will almost certainly find
that in the month running up to the first anniversary of your purchase
they will try again with an even more "tempting" offer.

The droids at the checkout always look a bit hurt when I decline the
optional ripoff insurance deal they are obliged to push on consumers.

Depending on the cost of the device it is almost certainly far cheaper
to save the money you would have spent on such insurance for buying a
replacement if the thing dies. I reckon a freezer is typically good for
a decade if you don't do stupid things to it. Our VH manages to kill the
odd fridge by people moving them too brutally and then not letting them
settle before powering up again (or some other means).

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On 29/07/18 08:49, GB wrote:
On 29/07/2018 07:28, harry wrote:

What a con!!!!
I only insure the house and cars.


+1 (except we only have the one car).

The whole concept of insuring small losses is obviously barmy. Maybe it
makes sense for people who are so broke and out of credit they can't
afford to replace a small appliance, but otherwise the process of
insuring adds the cost of layers of administration and profit onto the
expected cost of replacement. It's bound to be cheaper to self-insure.

Actually I think it ties in to a whole mentality which is somnewhat like
the TV rental market used to be. I want a product, but not te
reposnibility of ownerhsip.

So cars are contract hired.With AA style support.

Appliances are bought on credit with a guarantee. If they break then
they are fixed FIC.

Household maintenace is on fixed annual price call out.

It's all about people who can understand monthly outgoings, but not how
to budget.

Further up the income scale, they simply buy new on fault.



--
Those who want slavery should have the grace to name it by its proper
name. They must face the full meaning of that which they are advocating
or condoning; the full, exact, specific meaning of collectivism, of its
logical implications, of the principles upon which it is based, and of
the ultimate consequences to which these principles will lead. They must
face it, then decide whether this is what they want or not.

Ayn Rand.

"Bill Wright" wrote in message
news
The new freezer came with an envelope containing the instructions
and so forth. There was a large label on the bag: REGISTER NOW!"
This would 'activate the free one year guarantee'. This seems to do
no more than duplicate our statutory rights. In the bag was a glossy
brochure offering 'Peace of mind'. Peace of mind is worth a lot so I
read on. It turned out that the peace of mind was limited to not
worrying about the freezer breaking down. But it was so cheap! The
three year plan was only £77! But hang on a minute! The first year
is definitely covered by the normal warranty (and if the freezer
died during the subsequent months I'd be looking at my consumer
rights, since it is not a budget freezer.) And the £77 is not a
one-off payment; it is (as the tiny print implies but doesn't
explicitly state) an annual payment. So for £231 I would get
warranty for years two and three. And the price could increase: "We
reserve the right to alter the fee..." If payment is by direct debit
there's a £10 per annum reduction, presumably because you would
continue to pay during the second and third years without really
being aware of it.
The warranty includes 'damage caused accidentally' (I just can't
imagine a likely scenario that would lead to a claim, having read
through the exclusions) but not the cost of spoiled food if the
freezer breaks down or there's a power cut. If the freezer is a
write-off during the warranty period and a new one is supplied the
customer would have to pay delivery charges, install the machine
themselves, and dispose of the old machine at their own cost.
£231 would go a long way towards the cost of a replacement freezer.
That would be with a statutory warranty of at least twelve months.
My experience of white goods extended warranties is that if the item
breaks down you have to wait hours for the phone to answer, then
jump through hoops during a very long phone call, then the repair
man comes many days later. We once had to wait ten working days
without a washing machine. That hardly brings peace of mind. It's
better to use a trusted local repair man. My experience of that is
that the phone call lasts two minutes, he comes the next day, and he
charges SFA.



Maybe I'm wrong but I thought under EU law any appliance had to have
a minimum two year guarantee. Certainly anything like a FF bought from
John Lewis gets a minimum of two years.

Add to that that the 'life expectancy' of a major appliance is
considered to be of the order of six years and you would certainly
have a strong has under the CRA if it failed much before that and had
not been abused.

Mind you try telling that to an irk in Expensive World!


--
Woody

harrogate3 at ntlworld dot com

On 29/07/2018 07:40, Jeff Layman wrote:

One other point. Because we needed a fridge in the short term, on the
morning the FF failed I bought a budget one which works perfectly well,
but I have been totally unable to register it over the internet for its
one-year guarantee. I fill out the form and it just sits there
"confirming" the info endlessly. It's no more than I would get from my
consumer rights, anyway, so I gave up.


You don't have to register it for the 1 year guarantee. The retailer is
responsible and the purchase receipt should be enough.

Manufacturers only want you to register on line so they know what
address to send the reminder about your warranty running out and to
point out the danger of not paying them lots of money to extend the
warranty. The small print may say that they cover parts but not labour.

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

Martin Brown wrote :
It is a familiar business model of offering vastly overpriced customer
support contracts on things sold cheaply. You will almost certainly find that
in the month running up to the first anniversary of your purchase they will
try again with an even more "tempting" offer.

I renewed my car insurance last Friday, no change in cost from last
year and unlikely to be beaten elsewhere. During the call to renew, the
droid tried to up-sell with offers for extra cover for any tools and
equipment I might have in my garage. There is a hell of a lot of tool
money in there, but chances of anyone breaking in and walking out with
anything useful - nill. It just doesn't happen here, besides they would
need a truck to get away with much and people might notice.

alan_m Wrote in message:
On 29/07/2018 07:40, Jeff Layman wrote:

One other point. Because we needed a fridge in the short term, on the
morning the FF failed I bought a budget one which works perfectly well,
but I have been totally unable to register it over the internet for its
one-year guarantee. I fill out the form and it just sits there
"confirming" the info endlessly. It's no more than I would get from my
consumer rights, anyway, so I gave up.


You don't have to register it for the 1 year guarantee. The retailer is
responsible and the purchase receipt should be enough.

Manufacturers only want you to register on line so they know what
address to send the reminder about your warranty running out and to
point out the danger of not paying them lots of money to extend the
warranty. The small print may say that they cover parts but not labour.


And to know who to warn when it turns out their products
spontaneously self combust...
--
--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

Martin Brown Wrote in message:
On 29/07/2018 04:17, Bill Wright wrote:
The new freezer came with an envelope containing the instructions and
so forth. There was a large label on the bag: REGISTER NOW!" This
would 'activate the free one year guarantee'. This seems to do no
more than duplicate our statutory rights. In the bag was a glossy
brochure offering 'Peace of mind'. Peace of mind is worth a lot so I
read on. It turned out that the peace of mind was limited to not
worrying about the freezer breaking down. But it was so cheap! The
three year plan was only £77! But hang on a minute! The first year is
definitely covered by the normal warranty (and if the freezer died
during the subsequent months I'd be looking at my consumer rights,
since it is not a budget freezer.) And the £77 is not a one-off
payment; it is (as the tiny print implies but doesn't explicitly
state) an annual payment. So for £231 I would get warranty for years
two and three. And the price could increase: "We reserve the right to
alter the fee..." If payment is by direct debit there's a £10 per
annum reduction, presumably because you would continue to pay during
the second and third years without really being aware of it. The

It is a familiar business model of offering vastly overpriced customer
support contracts on things sold cheaply. You will almost certainly find
that in the month running up to the first anniversary of your purchase
they will try again with an even more "tempting" offer.

The droids at the checkout always look a bit hurt when I decline the
optional ripoff insurance deal they are obliged to push on consumers.

Depending on the cost of the device it is almost certainly far cheaper
to save the money you would have spent on such insurance for buying a
replacement if the thing dies. I reckon a freezer is typically good for
a decade if you don't do stupid things to it. Our VH manages to kill the
odd fridge by people moving them too brutally and then not letting them
settle before powering up again (or some other means).


VH?
--
--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

Does anyone remember the very first video machines? the Philips 1500 and
1501?
When you bought one of these, you used to get a years free service by a
suited bloke with an attache case full of bits. Not only that but every few
months he would make an appointment and come and clean the machine often
exchanging the lacing chord and the pressure roller and cleaning the rewind
idlers etc. He often also adjusted the gain of the head amp to account for
the wear on the heads.

Can you imagine how much this must have cost? Admittedly the machine, which
had a timer directly of a cooker, cost over 300 quid and only ran a tape for
an hour and you could keep your breakfast warm on the top, but it did work
surprisingly well. Indeed when the 1700 came out with a whole 2.5 hours
recording time, and a crisper picture and a digital clock. I had the old
1500 modified to use the same heads and run at the same speed. Later on I
did a home mod for the 1700 to make it run for four hours on the tape that
was originally for 1 hour. It was surprisingly good, though the sound
suffered a bit.
Those were the days of fun.
Its all very boring now, as when stuff goes wrong you often find they just
replace it rather than fixing it.
As for the costs of the warranty. I'm a little disgusted that our old Sale
of Goods act has been watered down so making these extended warranty folk
convince people they have to pay.
In my view you should not be approached for at least 18 months for any
extended warranty.

How long an item lasts really should be defined somehow. Half the aggro is
the argument that a particular bit of gear should have lasted longer than it
did for the amount paid for it.
Strangely, cheap stuff like a tessco cd radio tape player went wrong after
a year and they just replaced it, into argument and it only cost 40 quid.

The cd player went ping one day and shot several little ball bearings into
the works of the unit!
Brian

--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Bill Wright" wrote in message
news
The new freezer came with an envelope containing the instructions and so
forth. There was a large label on the bag: REGISTER NOW!" This would
'activate the free one year guarantee'. This seems to do no more than
duplicate our statutory rights. In the bag was a glossy brochure offering
'Peace of mind'. Peace of mind is worth a lot so I read on. It turned out
that the peace of mind was limited to not worrying about the freezer
breaking down. But it was so cheap! The three year plan was only £77! But
hang on a minute! The first year is definitely covered by the normal
warranty (and if the freezer died during the subsequent months I'd be
looking at my consumer rights, since it is not a budget freezer.) And the
£77 is not a one-off payment; it is (as the tiny print implies but doesn't
explicitly state) an annual payment. So for £231 I would get warranty for
years two and three. And the price could increase: "We reserve the right
to alter the fee..." If payment is by direct debit there's a £10 per annum
reduction, presumably because you would continue to pay during the second
and third years without really being aware of it.
The warranty includes 'damage caused accidentally' (I just can't imagine a
likely scenario that would lead to a claim, having read through the
exclusions) but not the cost of spoiled food if the freezer breaks down or
there's a power cut. If the freezer is a write-off during the warranty
period and a new one is supplied the customer would have to pay delivery
charges, install the machine themselves, and dispose of the old machine at
their own cost.
£231 would go a long way towards the cost of a replacement freezer. That
would be with a statutory warranty of at least twelve months.
My experience of white goods extended warranties is that if the item
breaks down you have to wait hours for the phone to answer, then jump
through hoops during a very long phone call, then the repair man comes
many days later. We once had to wait ten working days without a washing
machine. That hardly brings peace of mind. It's better to use a trusted
local repair man. My experience of that is that the phone call lasts two
minutes, he comes the next day, and he charges SFA.

Bill

In article ,
Martin Brown wrote:
On 29/07/2018 04:17, Bill Wright wrote:
The new freezer came with an envelope containing the instructions and
so forth. There was a large label on the bag: REGISTER NOW!" This
would 'activate the free one year guarantee'. This seems to do no
more than duplicate our statutory rights. In the bag was a glossy
brochure offering 'Peace of mind'. Peace of mind is worth a lot so I
read on. It turned out that the peace of mind was limited to not
worrying about the freezer breaking down. But it was so cheap! The
three year plan was only £77! But hang on a minute! The first year is
definitely covered by the normal warranty (and if the freezer died
during the subsequent months I'd be looking at my consumer rights,
since it is not a budget freezer.) And the £77 is not a one-off
payment; it is (as the tiny print implies but doesn't explicitly
state) an annual payment. So for £231 I would get warranty for years
two and three. And the price could increase: "We reserve the right to
alter the fee..." If payment is by direct debit there's a £10 per
annum reduction, presumably because you would continue to pay during
the second and third years without really being aware of it. The

It is a familiar business model of offering vastly overpriced customer
support contracts on things sold cheaply. You will almost certainly find
that in the month running up to the first anniversary of your purchase
they will try again with an even more "tempting" offer.

I keep being rung up and told my boiler insurance is about to expire and I
need to "renew".

My boiler was installed in 1988 and has never been insured.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On 29/07/2018 09:19, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
Martin Brown wrote :
It is a familiar business model of offering vastly overpriced customer
support contracts on things sold cheaply. You will almost certainly
find that in the month running up to the first anniversary of your
purchase they will try again with an even more "tempting" offer.

I renewed my car insurance last Friday, no change in cost from last year
and unlikely to be beaten elsewhere. During the call to renew, the droid
tried to up-sell with offers for extra cover for any tools and equipment
I might have in my garage. There is a hell of a lot of tool money in
there, but chances of anyone breaking in and walking out with anything
useful - nill. It just doesn't happen here, besides they would need a
truck to get away with much and people might notice.

That may be true if you live on Lundy, but I'm rather sceptical elsewhere.

I'm just trying to remember what pride comes before.

Norman Wells formulated on Sunday :
That may be true if you live on Lundy, but I'm rather sceptical elsewhere.

Two large dogs provide better insurance and they never complain that
they '...don't cover that'.

On 29/07/2018 09:19, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
It just doesn't happen here, besides they would need a
truck to get away with much and people might notice.

When they stole my mates pickup they used a two truck. The next door
neighbour made the drivers of the tow truck a cup of tea.
--
Adam

Norman Wells formulated on Sunday :
That may be true if you live on Lundy, but I'm rather sceptical elsewhere.

I'm just trying to remember what pride comes before.

I insure the car, because it is a legal requirement. I insure the house
because I could not afford to replace it. I self insure everything
else, including myself, with the money I have saved in not paying for
extra insurances and extended warranties. I save a considerable amount
by also paying cash for everything I buy. Having spare cash available
also helps make everything much cheaper to buy. If I see a genuine
bargain, I can buy it there and then.

On 29/07/2018 09:00, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Actually I think it ties in to a whole mentality which is somnewhat like the TV rental market used to be. I want a product, but not te reposnibility of ownerhsip.

So cars are contract hired.With AA style support.

Appliances are bought on credit with aÂ* guarantee. If they break then they are fixed FIC.

Household maintenace is on fixed annual price call out.

It's all about people who can understand monthly outgoings, but not how to budget.

Further up the income scale, they simply buy new on fault.

Agreed. These extended warranties are in my view always a con. But enough people get taken in that they account for a significant amount of profit for the manufacturer and, of course, the insurance companies involved.

It's also an explanation for the difficulties of the Brexit negotiations, where there's an attempt to separate trade in goods and services. Both are broadly speaking covered while we are a member of the EU, but if we leave - who knows? The problem is that lot of the value of the supply of goods comes from a service element. And not just in consumer purchases: if a business buys a software package it will probably also buy a software update service, and at the highest levels, if you buy a frigate or an airliner you expect that a servicing contract will be included in the deal.


--
Clive Page

Harry Bloomfield Wrote in message:
Norman Wells formulated on Sunday :
That may be true if you live on Lundy, but I'm rather sceptical elsewhere.

I'm just trying to remember what pride comes before.

I insure the car, because it is a legal requirement. I insure the house
because I could not afford to replace it. I self insure everything
else, including myself, with the money I have saved in not paying for
extra insurances and extended warranties. I save a considerable amount
by also paying cash for everything I buy.

By encouraging tax evasion?

Having spare cash available
also helps make everything much cheaper to buy.

Ditto?


--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

Jim K wrote on 29/07/2018 :
By encouraging tax evasion?

How did you arrive at that conclusion?

By 'cash' I mean funds in the bank, so 'cash' = cash and cards. Cash
available to use, means you can often get a 10% discount on a posted
price in a shop, especially true if they are offering interest free
credit on an item.

Cash available means you can spot a bargain and buy it if it is
something you want /need there and then, before bargain is bought by A
N Other. Cash means that if your washing machine dies and is not
economical to repair, you don't need to borrow money at high interest
rates to replace it, or go to the likes of that high street retailer
who let you pay twice as much for spreading the cost over a year or
two.

I mentioned nothing about tax evasion, or anything else illegal - just
simply not paying more than you need to for things.

On 29/07/2018 04:17, Bill Wright wrote:
The new freezer came with an envelope containing the instructions and so
forth. There was a large label on the bag: REGISTER NOW!" This would
'activate the free one year guarantee'. This seems to do no more than
duplicate our statutory rights. In the bag was a glossy brochure
offering 'Peace of mind'. Peace of mind is worth a lot so I read on. It
turned out that the peace of mind was limited to not worrying about the
freezer breaking down. But it was so cheap! The three year plan was only
£77! But hang on a minute! The first year is definitely covered by the
normal warranty (and if the freezer died during the subsequent months
I'd be looking at my consumer rights, since it is not a budget freezer.)
And the £77 is not a one-off payment; it is (as the tiny print implies
but doesn't explicitly state) an annual payment. So for £231 I would get
warranty for years two and three. And the price could increase: "We
reserve the right to alter the fee..." If payment is by direct debit
there's a £10 per annum reduction, presumably because you would continue
to pay during the second and third years without really being aware of it.
The warranty includes 'damage caused accidentally' (I just can't imagine
a likely scenario that would lead to a claim, having read through the
exclusions) but not the cost of spoiled food if the freezer breaks down
or there's a power cut. If the freezer is a write-off during the
warranty period and a new one is supplied the customer would have to pay
delivery charges, install the machine themselves, and dispose of the old
machine at their own cost.
£231 would go a long way towards the cost of a replacement freezer. That
would be with a statutory warranty of at least twelve months.
My experience of white goods extended warranties is that if the item
breaks down you have to wait hours for the phone to answer, then jump
through hoops during a very long phone call, then the repair man comes
many days later. We once had to wait ten working days without a washing
machine. That hardly brings peace of mind. Its better to use a trusted
local repair man. My experience of that is that the phone call lasts two
minutes, he comes the next day, and he charges SFA.

Bill

I remember buying a cheap kettle (£15) from Comet many years ago and
being offered an extended warranty on it for £9 per year. I explained to
the assistant that if it failed during the first year I would be back,
if it failed during the second I would buy a new one. So worst case
scenario I would be £3 up on the deal. She did not understand my logic !?

Jim K formulated on Sunday :
And to know who to warn when it turns out their products
spontaneously self combust...
--

Only if the authorities force them to admit it..

Harry Bloomfield wrote

I insure the car, because it is a legal requirement.

I do that too, but don't have any of the optional car insurance.

I insure the house because I could not afford to replace it.

I don't, because I can afford to replace it, and because it is very
unlikely that I would lose the entire house in any circumstances.

OTOH my neighbour just one house away managed to
lose their entire house when some loony decided that
it was infested with demons and put plastic bags full of
petrol inside the house and lit one outside the house.

She's apparently still at large.

I self insure everything else, including myself,

Yeah, I don't bother with health insurance either,
tho here, it does get you a quicker result with the
no life threatening medical issues like cataracts etc.

with the money I have saved in not paying for extra insurances
and extended warranties. I save a considerable amount by also
paying cash for everything I buy. Having spare cash available
also helps make everything much cheaper to buy. If I see a
genuine bargain, I can buy it there and then.

Me too. But I chose to borrow when building the house,
partly because I was interested in seeing if it could be
done, but also because I was earning a lot more on
that money speculating in the stock market than
I was paying in interest on the borrowing.

On Sunday, 29 July 2018 10:52:16 UTC+1, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
Jim K wrote on 29/07/2018 :
By encouraging tax evasion?

How did you arrive at that conclusion?

same way as always. You must know what he's about by now.

On Sunday, 29 July 2018 10:58:13 UTC+1, Andy Bennet wrote:

I remember buying a cheap kettle (£15) from Comet many years ago and
being offered an extended warranty on it for £9 per year. I explained to
the assistant that if it failed during the first year I would be back,
if it failed during the second I would buy a new one. So worst case
scenario I would be £3 up on the deal. She did not understand my logic !?

she understood it perfectly


NT

On 29/07/2018 04:17, Bill Wright wrote:
In the bag was a glossy brochure
offering 'Peace of mind'. Peace of mind is worth a lot so I read on. It
turned out that the peace of mind was limited to not worrying about the
freezer breaking down.

Which? has consistently advised that extended warranties are a waste of
money, and I have always declined them. My experience of white goods is
that if they don't go wrong in the first 3 months then they will last a
long time.

I declined the extended warranty that Comet offered me on my fridge
freezer when I bought it. That was in 1986. The fridge freezer is
still going; Comet isn't!

At least I have been lucky enough to buy from manufacturers who wait
until the 12-months guarantee is nearly expired before tempting me with
ongoing insurance (which I ignore). The washing machine insurance was a
bit expensive I thought; expensive enough to remember the amount quoted.
When the machine did eventually go wrong, it was many years later and
the money I would have paid for the insurance would have bought one and
a half replacement machines. I just bought one.

When the 10-year old dishwasher went wrong, the engineer took an age
taking it apart to get to the bit that was faulty. Then he asked me a
question I wasn't expecting - did I just want it mended, or did I want
him to also replace the bits that were OK at the moment but probably
wouldn't last a lot longer. So I asked him why he was giving me the
options. He pointed out:
- this model is a pig to get apart to get to the works, and will take a
similarly long time to put back together. I am paying for his time so
there are some savings in replacing other bits while it is apart to save
another call-out at a later date.
- this particular model is difficult to maintain but it rarely goes
wrong, and my first fault after 10 years is not unusual. The newer
model is easy to get to the works, but it goes wrong much more often.
- a refurbishment would replace the pump with the slightly noisy
bearings and a small chip out of the impeller, the water inlet control
unit which is showing a lot of limescale from the hard water, and two
hoses which are showing the first signs of perishing, but were nowhere
near as bad as the leaking one he was about to replace along with the
door seal on its last legs.
- my options were to replace what needed replacing now, and probably
call him back within 2 years, or pay a bit more for spares and have
another 5-10 years of trouble-free use, or scrap this one and buy a
replacement which will probably need an engineer's attention within
about 5 years.

I went for the full refurbishment. It cost about half the price of a
new machine. That was 3 years ago and the machine has been trouble-free
since that engineer visit.

The only "register your purchase and get an extended guarantee" offer I
did take up was for a top quality garden hose I bought with Gift
Vouchers I received as a Christmas present. The extended guarantee was
free, and registering the purchase on-line got me a 30-year guarantee
against "faulty workmanship or materials during manufacture". I will
get a birthday card from the Queen (or probably King by then) before the
30 years expires!

Jim

Indy Jess John presented the following explanation :
I declined the extended warranty that Comet offered me on my fridge freezer
when I bought it. That was in 1986. The fridge freezer is still going;
Comet isn't!

That happened because so few were buying into their extended warranties
lol

In article ,
ARW wrote:
On 29/07/2018 09:19, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
It just doesn't happen here, besides they would need a
truck to get away with much and people might notice.

When they stole my mates pickup they used a two truck. The next door
neighbour made the drivers of the tow truck a cup of tea.

Kind neighbours are a godsend. ;-)

--
*I don't work here. I'm a consultant

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

I never buy extended warranties but accept them if offered "free". When we bought our last washing machine the model we wanted came with such a "free" 5 year warranty. On arrival we found the programmer control damaged and requested a replacement. The company were unable to replace it as it was the last of an end of line product, they offered a number of alternatives of a similar price and spec. However, none of the alternatives came with an extended warranty and to get them insured would have cost £90 if I remember correctly. I argued with them that to me the so called "free" warranty had monetary value and was an influence in my purchase choice to end up paying a similar price for a machine with an extended warranty meant accepting a much lower spec machine or forking out more for one of a similar spec.

In the end they offered us a "free" warranty or an upgrade to a higher spec machine to the value of purchasing a warranty. We chose the upgrade and bought a Siemens which, and here comes the rub, came with a free manufacturers extended warranty. So win win!

It did occur to me at the time that the extended free warranty was obviously a sweetener to shift a number of end of line products but at best it would only offer repairs as any machine could not be replaced except by offering equivalents.

Incidently the machine never needed a repair over the period covered by the warranty and it was only last year that I had to replace the motor brushes..

Richard

In article ,
Clive Page wrote:
Agreed. These extended warranties are in my view always a con. But
enough people get taken in that they account for a significant amount of
profit for the manufacturer and, of course, the insurance companies
involved.

Remember reading details about aftermarket used car warranties. Article
reckoned they paid out about 10% of premiums on claims. Not the sort of
odds I'd gamble on.

For expensive consumer goods, I tend to compare the John Lewis price which
often includes a 5 year warrenty. Don't mind paying a few quid over the
odds for that.

--
*Filthy stinking rich -- well, two out of three ain't bad

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Yes sadly this sort of thing does cost a lot. I recall seeing a price of 100
quid for two months a while ago, a ploy to discourage the practice I
imagine.

Later in the Video revolution I had a Toshiba Betamax with all sorts of
clever features, but when it went wrong it was always maladjusted when it
returned, so much so that after a year the company who sold it to me
suggested I pay them about 30 quid and they would supply a Sony C9 instead
and that lasted for many years and even then only needed a clutch and a
gear on the loading mechanism.
Brian

--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Pamela" wrote in message
...
On 09:27 29 Jul 2018, Brian Gaff wrote:

Does anyone remember the very first video machines? the Philips
1500 and 1501? When you bought one of these, you used to get a
years free service by a suited bloke with an attache case full of
bits. Not only that but every few months he would make an
appointment and come and clean the machine often exchanging the
lacing chord and the pressure roller and cleaning the rewind
idlers etc. He often also adjusted the gain of the head amp to
account for the wear on the heads.

I'd pay an extra £20 on a £130 printer for two or three years of
free on-site repairs. I did for my last two printers.

It's a nuisance if your printer packs up and, if you have kept the
packaging, you have the hassle of sending it back and waiting
weeks.

On Sunday, 29 July 2018 09:00:48 UTC+1, Woody wrote:
Maybe I'm wrong but I thought under EU law any appliance had to have
a minimum two year guarantee.

EU law requires you to be able to enforce your statutory rights against the retailer for a minimum of two years. Irrelevant in Britain, as the limitation period is six years from purchase anyway (five in Scotland, from the discovery of a fault). Some countries in the UK had much shorter periods, or the period could be limited by contract.

It means you can take Pound Shop to court if your £1 solar garden lantern fails 729 days after purchase. It doesn't mean you will win your case, if the court decides that 729 days is a reasonable lifespan for the product..

Owain

Harry Bloomfield Wrote in message:
Jim K wrote on 29/07/2018 :
By encouraging tax evasion?

How did you arrive at that conclusion?

Aw Bless!

By 'cash' I mean funds in the bank, so 'cash' = cash and cards. Cash
available to use, means you can often get a 10% discount on a posted
price in a shop, especially true if they are offering interest free
credit on an item.

You routinely ask for 10% discounts on items when paying by cash
or card?

Unless you buy on a variant of h.p. how else would it be possible
to pay?!

Cash available means you can spot a bargain and buy it if it is
something you want /need there and then, before bargain is bought by A
N Other. Cash means that if your washing machine dies and is not
economical to repair, you don't need to borrow money at high interest
rates to replace it, or go to the likes of that high street retailer
who let you pay twice as much for spreading the cost over a year or
two.

I mentioned nothing about tax evasion, or anything else illegal - just
simply not paying more than you need to for things.

The obvious interpretation of this is you (perhaps unwittingly
judging by your dubious definitions) encourage tax evasion by
offering to pay cash (folding money) for things in exchange for a
discount.

Why would a shopkeeper or tradesman accept less than the item/job
owes him?


--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

On 29/07/2018 07:40, Jeff Layman wrote:

Our fridge-freezer died a few weeks ago on the then hottest weekend of
the year.

That's when they go wrong.

Bill

On 29/07/2018 09:11, Jim K wrote:

VH?


Violent helper

Bill

On 29/07/2018 09:52, Norman Wells wrote:

I'm just trying to remember what pride comes before.


A burglary.

Bill

On 29/07/2018 10:12, Harry Bloomfield wrote:

If I see a genuine bargain, I can
buy it there and then.

I got 15 peaches for £1.50 on the market the other day.

Bill

On 29/07/2018 10:52, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
Jim K wrote on 29/07/2018 :
By encouraging tax evasion?

How did you arrive at that conclusion?

By 'cash' I mean funds in the bank, so 'cash' = cash and cards. Cash
available to use, means you can often get a 10% discount on a posted
price in a shop, especially true if they are offering interest free
credit on an item.

You should have said 'ready money', not 'cash'.

Bill

On 29/07/2018 11:21, Pamela wrote:

I'd pay an extra £20 on a £130 printer for two or three years of
free on-site repairs. I did for my last two printers.

It's a nuisance if your printer packs up and, if you have kept the
packaging, you have the hassle of sending it back and waiting
weeks.


Best thing with printers is to have two.

Bill