On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 04:47:26 -0700 (PDT), Jessica Wabbit
wrote:



Not a lot of jobs other than medical or oilfield work here in
Taft/Bakersfield
Nearly all the jobs need serious college degrees.

Gunner

Bakersfiled is a college graduate community? No Walmart, no Mc
Donald, ...?

Unemployed PhD's have about the same income as unemployed dropouts.

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 04:47:26 -0700 (PDT), Jessica Wabbit
wrote:



Not a lot of jobs other than medical or oilfield work here in
Taft/Bakersfield
Nearly all the jobs need serious college degrees.

Gunner

Bakersfiled is a college graduate community? No Walmart, no Mc
Donald, ...?

Unemployed PhD's have about the same income as unemployed dropouts.

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.

So what? What's your point here? The plain and simple fact is that if
gummer wanted to work, then he'd get a job. The kind of jobs he's
qualified for have a high turnover rate, and are a dime a dozen. As it
happens, yesterday I talked to a friend who has several employees. On
behalf of an acquaintance, I asked my friend if he'd be interested in
a new hire even though work is slow. He said that he's *always* on the
lookout for replacements. That's how it is for those types of jobs -
the people who hold them are frequently far from perfect, and
therefore easy to displace by anyone who has more talent. And there
you have it - the most talented already have the jobs, and the least
talented (which includes motivation), continue to sit on their asses
making excuses. In this case, we have a guy ludicrously claiming to
have unlimited talent at the same time he admits being so broke that
he needs to pirate web access from a neighbor's provider. As if that
wasn't enough, there's un undeniable record to prove that his
excuse-making has been going on for 30 years.

BTW, the guy who asked me to inquire about that job, already has one.
He's considering a sideways move that might suit him better. Strange
eh that a regular guy has his choice of jobs, while genius IQ snorf
gummy claims year after year that there's no work. How dumb would
anyone have to be to believe his story?

Wayne

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 04:47:26 -0700 (PDT), Jessica Wabbit
wrote:



Not a lot of jobs other than medical or oilfield work here in
Taft/Bakersfield
Nearly all the jobs need serious college degrees.

Gunner

Bakersfiled is a college graduate community? No Walmart, no Mc
Donald, ...?

Unemployed PhD's have about the same income as unemployed dropouts.

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.

Ayup.



I am the Sword of my Family
and the Shield of my Nation.
If sent, I will crush everything you have built,
burn everything you love,
and kill every one of you.
(Hebrew quote)

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:20:06 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.

Ayup.

BS I know a kid who was hired on at a local GasNgrub only recently.
He's 18 I think, and already ahead of you on account of being solvent.

Wayne

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 04:47:26 -0700 (PDT), Jessica Wabbit
wrote:



Not a lot of jobs other than medical or oilfield work here in
Taft/Bakersfield
Nearly all the jobs need serious college degrees.

Gunner

Bakersfiled is a college graduate community? No Walmart, no Mc
Donald, ...?

Unemployed PhD's have about the same income as unemployed dropouts.

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.


I had an interesting conversation with an ex-Boeing employee. If you
remember there were articles in the Sunday papers about the poor
wretches who, after 10 years with Boeing as an aerospace engineer were
now relegated to driving taxi's and drawing unemployment.

I asked the bloke "what about all the skilled craftsmen, the
machinists, welders, etc.?" He says, "Oh, they all moved to other
cities - plenty of work for those kind of chaps."

Cheers,

John D. Slocomb
(jdslocombatgmail)

On Sep 21, 9:38*pm, J. D. Slocomb wrote:
On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman





wrote:
On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 04:47:26 -0700 (PDT), Jessica Wabbit
wrote:

Not a lot of jobs other than medical or oilfield work here in
Taft/Bakersfield
Nearly all the jobs need serious college degrees.

Gunner

Bakersfiled is a college graduate community? No Walmart, no Mc
Donald, ...?

Unemployed PhD's have about the same income as unemployed dropouts.

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. *Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.

I had an interesting conversation with an ex-Boeing employee. If you
remember there were articles in the Sunday papers about the poor
wretches who, after 10 years with Boeing as an aerospace engineer were
now relegated to driving taxi's and drawing unemployment.

I asked the bloke "what about all the skilled craftsmen, the
machinists, welders, etc.?" He says, "Oh, they all moved to other
cities - plenty of work for those kind of chaps."

Cheers,

John D. Slocomb
(jdslocombatgmail

Years ago (I don't remember exactly when, but sometime in the early
1990s, I think) my brother was in electronics tech school. Many of his
classmates were former engineers from a recently closed defense
contractor. They had gone to tech school to learn a marketable skill.

On 9/21/2010 9:38 PM, J. D. Slocomb wrote:
On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 04:47:26 -0700 (PDT), Jessica Wabbit
wrote:



Not a lot of jobs other than medical or oilfield work here in
Taft/Bakersfield
Nearly all the jobs need serious college degrees.

Gunner

Bakersfiled is a college graduate community? No Walmart, no Mc
Donald, ...?

Unemployed PhD's have about the same income as unemployed dropouts.

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.


I had an interesting conversation with an ex-Boeing employee. If you
remember there were articles in the Sunday papers about the poor
wretches who, after 10 years with Boeing as an aerospace engineer were
now relegated to driving taxi's and drawing unemployment.

I asked the bloke "what about all the skilled craftsmen, the
machinists, welders, etc.?" He says, "Oh, they all moved to other
cities - plenty of work for those kind of chaps."

One of the biggest lies our government foists off on us is that we need
to train more scientists and engineers. Scientists and engineers are a
glut on the market--few work in the field for which they were trained
and IIRC roughly half work in nontechnical fields.

Simple fact is that there just isn't that much technical work out there.
If the US is "falling behind" technologically it's because the
government is acting as a pimple on the ass of progress, not because we
aren't lousy with engineers and scientists.

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 20:25:38 -0700 (PDT), rangerssuck
wrote:

On Sep 21, 9:38*pm, J. D. Slocomb wrote:
On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman





wrote:
On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 04:47:26 -0700 (PDT), Jessica Wabbit
wrote:

Not a lot of jobs other than medical or oilfield work here in
Taft/Bakersfield
Nearly all the jobs need serious college degrees.

Gunner

Bakersfiled is a college graduate community? No Walmart, no Mc
Donald, ...?

Unemployed PhD's have about the same income as unemployed dropouts.

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. *Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.

I had an interesting conversation with an ex-Boeing employee. If you
remember there were articles in the Sunday papers about the poor
wretches who, after 10 years with Boeing as an aerospace engineer were
now relegated to driving taxi's and drawing unemployment.

I asked the bloke "what about all the skilled craftsmen, the
machinists, welders, etc.?" He says, "Oh, they all moved to other
cities - plenty of work for those kind of chaps."

Cheers,

John D. Slocomb
(jdslocombatgmail

Years ago (I don't remember exactly when, but sometime in the early
1990s, I think) my brother was in electronics tech school. Many of his
classmates were former engineers from a recently closed defense
contractor. They had gone to tech school to learn a marketable skill.


A fellow I knew at Edwards AFB had an interesting theory. When his son
graduated from high school he told the kid to go learn a trade -
welder, machinist, bull-dozer driver - any skilled trade and when the
kid had that under his belt toe old man was willing to put him through
collage. The theory being a skilled craftsman can always find a job.

The up-shot was that the kid went out and learned the butcher's trade
and then talked the old man into fronting up the cash to open a
butcher's shop instead of paying for a collage education. It seems
that a really, really, high end butcher's shop that trades only in
properly aged beef and gets written up in the L.A. newspapers so that
people drive, or send the servants, clear across town to shop can be a
somewhat better investment then a collage education :-)

Cheers,

John D. Slocomb
(jdslocombatgmail)

On 9/22/2010 7:26 AM, J. D. Slocomb wrote:
On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 20:25:38 -0700 (PDT), rangerssuck
wrote:

On Sep 21, 9:38 pm, J. D. wrote:
On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman





wrote:
On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 04:47:26 -0700 (PDT), Jessica Wabbit
wrote:

Not a lot of jobs other than medical or oilfield work here in
Taft/Bakersfield
Nearly all the jobs need serious college degrees.

Gunner

Bakersfiled is a college graduate community? No Walmart, no Mc
Donald, ...?

Unemployed PhD's have about the same income as unemployed dropouts.

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.

I had an interesting conversation with an ex-Boeing employee. If you
remember there were articles in the Sunday papers about the poor
wretches who, after 10 years with Boeing as an aerospace engineer were
now relegated to driving taxi's and drawing unemployment.

I asked the bloke "what about all the skilled craftsmen, the
machinists, welders, etc.?" He says, "Oh, they all moved to other
cities - plenty of work for those kind of chaps."

Cheers,

John D. Slocomb
(jdslocombatgmail

Years ago (I don't remember exactly when, but sometime in the early
1990s, I think) my brother was in electronics tech school. Many of his
classmates were former engineers from a recently closed defense
contractor. They had gone to tech school to learn a marketable skill.


A fellow I knew at Edwards AFB had an interesting theory. When his son
graduated from high school he told the kid to go learn a trade -
welder, machinist, bull-dozer driver - any skilled trade and when the
kid had that under his belt toe old man was willing to put him through
collage. The theory being a skilled craftsman can always find a job.

The up-shot was that the kid went out and learned the butcher's trade
and then talked the old man into fronting up the cash to open a
butcher's shop instead of paying for a collage education. It seems
that a really, really, high end butcher's shop that trades only in
properly aged beef and gets written up in the L.A. newspapers so that
people drive, or send the servants, clear across town to shop can be a
somewhat better investment then a collage education :-)

Yep. I went to college because my parents insisted on it, not because I
had any particular career path in mind. Wasted a lot of time and money
and can't see where it really did me much good in the long run.

On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 08:34:10 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

On 9/22/2010 7:26 AM, J. D. Slocomb wrote:
On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 20:25:38 -0700 (PDT), rangerssuck
wrote:

On Sep 21, 9:38 pm, J. D. wrote:
On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman





wrote:
On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 04:47:26 -0700 (PDT), Jessica Wabbit
wrote:

Not a lot of jobs other than medical or oilfield work here in
Taft/Bakersfield
Nearly all the jobs need serious college degrees.

Gunner

Bakersfiled is a college graduate community? No Walmart, no Mc
Donald, ...?

Unemployed PhD's have about the same income as unemployed dropouts.

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.

I had an interesting conversation with an ex-Boeing employee. If you
remember there were articles in the Sunday papers about the poor
wretches who, after 10 years with Boeing as an aerospace engineer were
now relegated to driving taxi's and drawing unemployment.

I asked the bloke "what about all the skilled craftsmen, the
machinists, welders, etc.?" He says, "Oh, they all moved to other
cities - plenty of work for those kind of chaps."

Cheers,

John D. Slocomb
(jdslocombatgmail

Years ago (I don't remember exactly when, but sometime in the early
1990s, I think) my brother was in electronics tech school. Many of his
classmates were former engineers from a recently closed defense
contractor. They had gone to tech school to learn a marketable skill.


A fellow I knew at Edwards AFB had an interesting theory. When his son
graduated from high school he told the kid to go learn a trade -
welder, machinist, bull-dozer driver - any skilled trade and when the
kid had that under his belt toe old man was willing to put him through
collage. The theory being a skilled craftsman can always find a job.

The up-shot was that the kid went out and learned the butcher's trade
and then talked the old man into fronting up the cash to open a
butcher's shop instead of paying for a collage education. It seems
that a really, really, high end butcher's shop that trades only in
properly aged beef and gets written up in the L.A. newspapers so that
people drive, or send the servants, clear across town to shop can be a
somewhat better investment then a collage education :-)

Yep. I went to college because my parents insisted on it, not because I
had any particular career path in mind. Wasted a lot of time and money
and can't see where it really did me much good in the long run.

The problem is that Collage/University is basically just another form
of apprenticeship - i.e., it trains one to do a specific job and
certainly if one plans a career as a doctor, lawyer, engineer, it is a
distinct advantage as it crams a lot of knowledge into one's head very
quickly. On the other hand, if one is not to work in one of the
specialized career fields I wonder whether it is not highly overrated.
I wonder whether collage really was an advantage to Warren Buffett's,
who initially dropped out of collage saying that he knew more then the
professors. Bill Gates, who famously, dropped out of Harvard and Steve
Jobs who attended only one semester.

Cheers,

John D. Slocomb
(jdslocombatgmail)

"J. D. Slocomb" wrote in message
news

The problem is that Collage/University is basically just another form
of apprenticeship - i.e., it trains one to do a specific job and
certainly if one plans a career as a doctor, lawyer, engineer, it is a
distinct advantage as it crams a lot of knowledge into one's head very
quickly. On the other hand, if one is not to work in one of the
specialized career fields I wonder whether it is not highly overrated.
I wonder whether collage really was an advantage to Warren Buffett's,
who initially dropped out of collage saying that he knew more then the
professors. Bill Gates, who famously, dropped out of Harvard and Steve
Jobs who attended only one semester.

Cheers,

John D. Slocomb
(jdslocombatgmail)

you have a very distorted view of College/University, certainly different
from that of any college graduates with whom I associate - in fact the
typical difference between trade school and college is that a trade school
teaches you a specific trade, a college teaches you to do research, to find
information for yourself, and the theory behind certain things (for example,
why do fluorescent lights glow, why does mercury emit UV light when excited,
why is the sky blue (answer-bragg refraction)) - a trade school teaches an
immediate skill (weld, drive, operate), college teaches reasoning.

Bill gates dropping out doesn't invalidate the above, nor does warren
buffet - there are those who wish to use their hands and manual skills,
there are those who wish to employ mental and not manual skills, and some
enjoy a bit of both.

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 09:03:03 -0700, wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 04:47:26 -0700 (PDT), Jessica Wabbit
wrote:



Not a lot of jobs other than medical or oilfield work here in
Taft/Bakersfield
Nearly all the jobs need serious college degrees.

Gunner

Bakersfiled is a college graduate community? No Walmart, no Mc
Donald, ...?

Unemployed PhD's have about the same income as unemployed dropouts.

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.

So what? What's your point here?

I'm merely responding to Jessica that unemployed college graduates
hurt as much as unemployed anyone else. Plenty of college graduates
shop at Wal-Mart and eat at McDonald's. Some grads have mundane jobs
with both corporations while seeking and hoping for more challenging
work.

On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 20:59:30 -0700, "Bill Noble"
wrote:



"J. D. Slocomb" wrote in message
news

The problem is that Collage/University is basically just another form
of apprenticeship - i.e., it trains one to do a specific job and
certainly if one plans a career as a doctor, lawyer, engineer, it is a
distinct advantage as it crams a lot of knowledge into one's head very
quickly. On the other hand, if one is not to work in one of the
specialized career fields I wonder whether it is not highly overrated.
I wonder whether collage really was an advantage to Warren Buffett's,
who initially dropped out of collage saying that he knew more then the
professors. Bill Gates, who famously, dropped out of Harvard and Steve
Jobs who attended only one semester.

Cheers,

John D. Slocomb
(jdslocombatgmail)

you have a very distorted view of College/University, certainly different
from that of any college graduates with whom I associate - in fact the
typical difference between trade school and college is that a trade school
teaches you a specific trade, a college teaches you to do research, to find
information for yourself, and the theory behind certain things (for example,
why do fluorescent lights glow, why does mercury emit UV light when excited,
why is the sky blue (answer-bragg refraction)) - a trade school teaches an
immediate skill (weld, drive, operate), college teaches reasoning.

Bill gates dropping out doesn't invalidate the above, nor does warren
buffet - there are those who wish to use their hands and manual skills,
there are those who wish to employ mental and not manual skills, and some
enjoy a bit of both.


I suppose that I really need to be a bit more explicit, rather then
assuming that readers will get the point.

I was simply pointing out that if an individual is aggressive about
advancing himself that, apparently, collage is not specifically an
advantage... other in the specialized career fields.

Your point about the research, et al, is hardly applicable to a
doctor's training or a law degree, to name two, and my experience with
freshly graduated engineers is that they certainly understand the
basis and theory of their trade but are sadly lacking in the
application thereof. Hardly proof of research and finding information
by yourself.

Of course, if you are talking about advanced degrees, i.e., Master and
Doctor then it is a different story as generally these two degrees (as
practiced in the US) involve a certain amount of research.

Cheers,

John D. Slocomb
(jdslocombatgmail)

On Sep 23, 7:32*am, J. D. Slocomb wrote:


and my experience with
freshly graduated engineers is that they certainly understand the
basis and theory of their trade but are sadly lacking in the
application thereof. Hardly proof of research and finding information
by yourself.

John D. Slocomb
(jdslocombatgmail)

The college I went to operated on the premise that if you knew the
basis and theory, you could learn the application on your own. The
application is going to change, but the theory is much less likely to
change.

Dan

On 9/23/2010 3:23 AM, Don Foreman wrote:
On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 09:03:03 -0700, wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 04:47:26 -0700 (PDT), Jessica Wabbit
wrote:



Not a lot of jobs other than medical or oilfield work here in
Taft/Bakersfield
Nearly all the jobs need serious college degrees.

Gunner

Bakersfiled is a college graduate community? No Walmart, no Mc
Donald, ...?

Unemployed PhD's have about the same income as unemployed dropouts.

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.

So what? What's your point here?

I'm merely responding to Jessica that unemployed college graduates
hurt as much as unemployed anyone else. Plenty of college graduates
shop at Wal-Mart and eat at McDonald's. Some grads have mundane jobs
with both corporations while seeking and hoping for more challenging
work.

Note that "eat at McDonalds" and "poor" are not the same. McDonalds is
not a cheap place to eat. The local Chinese place will provide me a
really good lunch for under 5 bucks. Olive Garden occasionally has an
"all you can eat" for 9. Last time I went to McDonalds I spent 15.

McDonalds major market is working people who have a half an hour for
lunch. And most college graduates are working people who have a half an
hour for lunch. Anybody who thinks that "college graduate"
automatically equates to "rich and privileged" either isn't one or was
already rich and privileged before college.

And why not shop at Wal-Mart if they have the best price on whatever you
need or if it's the most convenient place to shop or if they have
something you particularly like? They've got the best prices in the
area on Mobil 1, they're the closest place to get oil filters for my
motorcycle, and Grapette soda is comfort food for me.

On 9/23/2010 7:54 AM, wrote:
On Sep 23, 7:32 am, J. D. wrote:


and my experience with
freshly graduated engineers is that they certainly understand the
basis and theory of their trade but are sadly lacking in the
application thereof. Hardly proof of research and finding information
by yourself.

John D. Slocomb
(jdslocombatgmail)

The college I went to operated on the premise that if you knew the
basis and theory, you could learn the application on your own. The
application is going to change, but the theory is much less likely to
change.

In some fields though the theory is little help.

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 02:23:17 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 09:03:03 -0700, wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.

So what? What's your point here?

I'm merely responding to Jessica that unemployed college graduates
hurt as much as unemployed anyone else. Plenty of college graduates
shop at Wal-Mart and eat at McDonald's. Some grads have mundane jobs
with both corporations while seeking and hoping for more challenging
work.

Looks like you've trying to weasel out of your claim that "there are
no longer any gas-pumping jobs". The facts: 1. There are still jobs
pumping gas. 2. There are lots of jobs with similar pay and skill
requirements. 3. Those who claim that they can't find such jobs are
either BSing, or of such low skill/motivation that they aren't up to
displacing those who are currently working those jobs. Hell, any kid
fresh out of high school ought to be able to take over one of those
jobs by promising to come in on time every day. Of course, he'd have
to mean it and back it up with something more than the last guy who
claimed to be a hard worker even though he made a habit of
disappearing into the bathroom 3 times a day for half-hour smoke
breaks.

Wayne

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 07:56:25 -0700, wrote:

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 02:23:17 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 09:03:03 -0700, wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.

So what? What's your point here?

I'm merely responding to Jessica that unemployed college graduates
hurt as much as unemployed anyone else. Plenty of college graduates
shop at Wal-Mart and eat at McDonald's. Some grads have mundane jobs
with both corporations while seeking and hoping for more challenging
work.

Looks like you've trying to weasel out of your claim that "there are
no longer any gas-pumping jobs".

No, that assertion stands, at least in my area. I know of no filling
station where an employee will pump my fuel for me. Things may be
different in Arizona. I trust that your job continues to be
satisfactory as you make your regular contributions to social security
and medicare (thank you) like a good, responsible citizen.

On Sep 23, 8:47*am, "J. Clarke" wrote:

The college I went to operated on the premise that if you knew the
basis and theory, you could learn the application on your own. *The
application is going to change, but the theory is much less likely to
change.

In some fields though the theory is little help.

Any examples?

Dan

On Sep 23, 1:10*pm, Don Foreman wrote:


No, that assertion stands, at least in my area. I know of no filling
station where an employee will pump my fuel for me. *Things may be
different in Arizona. * I trust that your job continues to be
satisfactory as you make your regular contributions to social security
and medicare (thank you) like a good, responsible citizen.

New Jersey and Oregon prohibit pumping gas by the driver. I think
their idea is to create jobs, but my response is to continue on to the
next state.

Dan

On 9/23/2010 1:19 PM, wrote:
On Sep 23, 8:47 am, "J. wrote:

The college I went to operated on the premise that if you knew the
basis and theory, you could learn the application on your own. The
application is going to change, but the theory is much less likely to
change.

In some fields though the theory is little help.

Any examples?

Fluid dynamics in aeronautical engineering prior to CFD. One could
calculate flow fields for a few simple configurations but the equations
were for the most part intractable.

The real work was done in the wind tunnel and with subscale models by
trial, error, and gut feel. I remember in school taking the required
courses and looking at the books and thinking that they really had
awfully little information in them and wondering when we were going to
get to the "good stuff". Never got there, when I graduated and got my
first job I found out why.

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 10:23:25 -0700, wrote:
On Sep 23, 1:10*pm, Don Foreman wrote:

No, that assertion stands, at least in my area. I know of no filling
station where an employee will pump my fuel for me. *Things may be
different in Arizona. * I trust that your job continues to be
satisfactory as you make your regular contributions to social security
and medicare (thank you) like a good, responsible citizen.

New Jersey and Oregon prohibit pumping gas by the driver. I think their
idea is to create jobs, but my response is to continue on to the next
state.

I wouldn't be surprised if it turned out that "they" claim it's a "safety"
issue.

Remember when the guy would clean your windshield, check your oil, top
off your radiator AND battery, check and air your tires, and say "Thank
You!" with a big smile?

FOR THIRTY-TWO NINE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Cheers!
Rich

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 13:46:52 -0400, J. Clarke wrote:
On 9/23/2010 1:19 PM, wrote:
On Sep 23, 8:47 am, "J. wrote:

The college I went to operated on the premise that if you knew the
basis and theory, you could learn the application on your own. The
application is going to change, but the theory is much less likely to
change.

In some fields though the theory is little help.

Any examples?

Fluid dynamics in aeronautical engineering prior to CFD. One could
calculate flow fields for a few simple configurations but the equations
were for the most part intractable.

The real work was done in the wind tunnel and with subscale models by
trial, error, and gut feel. I remember in school taking the required
courses and looking at the books and thinking that they really had awfully
little information in them and wondering when we were going to get to the
"good stuff". Never got there, when I graduated and got my first job I
found out why.

Well, yeah! The "good stuff" is "out there"! ;-D

Cheers!
Rich

On Sep 23, 1:23*pm, " wrote:
On Sep 23, 1:10*pm, Don Foreman wrote:

No, that assertion stands, at least in my area. I know of no filling
station where an employee will pump my fuel for me. *Things may be
different in Arizona. * I trust that your job continues to be
satisfactory as you make your regular contributions to social security
and medicare (thank you) like a good, responsible citizen.

New Jersey and Oregon prohibit pumping gas by the driver. *I *think
their idea is to create jobs, but my response is to continue on to the
next state.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Dan

I hate the smell of gasoline, and I'm overjoyed that I don't have to
pump it, even if it costs me an extra few cents per gallon here in NJ.

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 12:10:36 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 07:56:25 -0700, wrote:

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 02:23:17 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 09:03:03 -0700, wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.

So what? What's your point here?

I'm merely responding to Jessica that unemployed college graduates
hurt as much as unemployed anyone else. Plenty of college graduates
shop at Wal-Mart and eat at McDonald's. Some grads have mundane jobs
with both corporations while seeking and hoping for more challenging
work.

Looks like you've trying to weasel out of your claim that "there are
no longer any gas-pumping jobs".

No, that assertion stands, at least in my area. I know of no filling
station where an employee will pump my fuel for me.

Exactly as I said - more weaseling and back peddling. Facts: 1. There
are more low-end jobs now than there ever was, including some pumping
gas. 2. You must be severely out of touch if you don't know #1.

Wayne

On Sep 23, 6:32*pm, rangerssuck wrote:


I hate the smell of gasoline, and I'm overjoyed that I don't have to
pump it, even if it costs me an extra few cents per gallon here in NJ.

You would not have enjoyed the summer job I had as a roustabout on a
crew that cleaned oil wells.

Dan

On Sep 24, 4:24*pm, " wrote:
On Sep 23, 6:32*pm, rangerssuck wrote:

I hate the smell of gasoline, and I'm overjoyed that I don't have to
pump it, even if it costs me an extra few cents per gallon here in NJ.

You would not have enjoyed the summer job I had as a roustabout on a
crew that cleaned oil wells.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Dan

Probably not. I worked for several years as a motorcycle mechanic. I
hated the smell before I started. Hated it more when I finished. And
it's damned near impossible to get off your hands.

On Fri, 24 Sep 2010 12:05:52 -0700, wrote:

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 12:10:36 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 07:56:25 -0700, wrote:

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 02:23:17 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 09:03:03 -0700, wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.

So what? What's your point here?

I'm merely responding to Jessica that unemployed college graduates
hurt as much as unemployed anyone else. Plenty of college graduates
shop at Wal-Mart and eat at McDonald's. Some grads have mundane jobs
with both corporations while seeking and hoping for more challenging
work.

Looks like you've trying to weasel out of your claim that "there are
no longer any gas-pumping jobs".

No, that assertion stands, at least in my area. I know of no filling
station where an employee will pump my fuel for me.

Exactly as I said - more weaseling and back peddling. Facts: 1. There
are more low-end jobs now than there ever was, including some pumping
gas. 2. You must be severely out of touch if you don't know #1.

Wayne

I said I know of no filling station in my area where an employee will
pump fuel for me. I see no refutation, so who's weaseling and
backpedalling here?

I am definitely out of touch with the minimum wage job market. I'm
past age 65, retired, don't need or want a job. I've more than paid my
dues.

Are you in touch with the minimum wage job market? Do you have a job?
(I think not) Do you make regular or any contributions to social
security and medicare (I think not) or are you evading that civic
responsibility just as you've evaded service to your country in the
military or peace corps? Assuming you are able-bodied and younger
than 65 years, are you hauling your fair load as a citizen and
claimant of citizen's liberty and rights? (I think not) If not, then
you are every bit the parasite that you continuously accuse easy
target Gunner of being. Only difference is that he doesn't hide, you
do.

Troll on.

Don Foreman wrote:

On Fri, 24 Sep 2010 12:05:52 -0700, wrote:

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 12:10:36 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 07:56:25 -0700, wrote:

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 02:23:17 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 09:03:03 -0700, wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.

So what? What's your point here?

I'm merely responding to Jessica that unemployed college graduates
hurt as much as unemployed anyone else. Plenty of college graduates
shop at Wal-Mart and eat at McDonald's. Some grads have mundane jobs
with both corporations while seeking and hoping for more challenging
work.

Looks like you've trying to weasel out of your claim that "there are
no longer any gas-pumping jobs".

No, that assertion stands, at least in my area. I know of no filling
station where an employee will pump my fuel for me.

Exactly as I said - more weaseling and back peddling. Facts: 1. There
are more low-end jobs now than there ever was, including some pumping
gas. 2. You must be severely out of touch if you don't know #1.

Wayne

I said I know of no filling station in my area where an employee will
pump fuel for me.


Don, the state of Florida is 'Self Service' as well. The only
exception is that the disabled may request someone to pump gas for
them. Even then, they will put you off as long as they can get away
with, since most gas is sold at convenience stores with only one person
working at a time. There is only one station that I know of where the
owner has been there for over 40 years, and will come out to pump gas
without being asked if he isn't busy. He knows I have trouble walking,
and getting in or out of my truck, but in the 11 years I've done
business there, I've never asked. He has been in the business so long
that he will still 'Run a tab' for some customers. He's offered, but
I've never done it.


I see no refutation, so who's weaseling and backpedalling here?


Maybe he's never had more than a minimum wage job in his life?


I am definitely out of touch with the minimum wage job market. I'm
past age 65, retired, don't need or want a job. I've more than paid my
dues.

Are you in touch with the minimum wage job market? Do you have a job?
(I think not) Do you make regular or any contributions to social
security and medicare (I think not) or are you evading that civic
responsibility just as you've evaded service to your country in the
military or peace corps? Assuming you are able-bodied and younger
than 65 years, are you hauling your fair load as a citizen and
claimant of citizen's liberty and rights? (I think not) If not, then
you are every bit the parasite that you continuously accuse easy
target Gunner of being. Only difference is that he doesn't hide, you
do.

Troll on.






--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

On 9/25/2010 8:03 AM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Don Foreman wrote:

On Fri, 24 Sep 2010 12:05:52 -0700, wrote:

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 12:10:36 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 07:56:25 -0700, wrote:

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 02:23:17 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 09:03:03 -0700, wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.

So what? What's your point here?

I'm merely responding to Jessica that unemployed college graduates
hurt as much as unemployed anyone else. Plenty of college graduates
shop at Wal-Mart and eat at McDonald's. Some grads have mundane jobs
with both corporations while seeking and hoping for more challenging
work.

Looks like you've trying to weasel out of your claim that "there are
no longer any gas-pumping jobs".

No, that assertion stands, at least in my area. I know of no filling
station where an employee will pump my fuel for me.

Exactly as I said - more weaseling and back peddling. Facts: 1. There
are more low-end jobs now than there ever was, including some pumping
gas. 2. You must be severely out of touch if you don't know #1.

Wayne

I said I know of no filling station in my area where an employee will
pump fuel for me.


Don, the state of Florida is 'Self Service' as well. The only
exception is that the disabled may request someone to pump gas for
them. Even then, they will put you off as long as they can get away
with, since most gas is sold at convenience stores with only one person
working at a time. There is only one station that I know of where the
owner has been there for over 40 years, and will come out to pump gas
without being asked if he isn't busy. He knows I have trouble walking,
and getting in or out of my truck, but in the 11 years I've done
business there, I've never asked. He has been in the business so long
that he will still 'Run a tab' for some customers. He's offered, but
I've never done it.

I don't think that Wayne quite grasps that "gas pumping" is different
from "sitting in a booth in a convenience store running a cash register".

I see no refutation, so who's weaseling and backpedalling here?


Maybe he's never had more than a minimum wage job in his life?


I am definitely out of touch with the minimum wage job market. I'm
past age 65, retired, don't need or want a job. I've more than paid my
dues.

Are you in touch with the minimum wage job market? Do you have a job?
(I think not) Do you make regular or any contributions to social
security and medicare (I think not) or are you evading that civic
responsibility just as you've evaded service to your country in the
military or peace corps? Assuming you are able-bodied and younger
than 65 years, are you hauling your fair load as a citizen and
claimant of citizen's liberty and rights? (I think not) If not, then
you are every bit the parasite that you continuously accuse easy
target Gunner of being. Only difference is that he doesn't hide, you
do.

Troll on.

"J. Clarke" wrote:

I don't think that Wayne quite grasps that "gas pumping" is different
from "sitting in a booth in a convenience store running a cash register".


From what I hear, he doesn't have a handle on why there is day and
night!


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

On Sat, 25 Sep 2010 02:07:33 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Fri, 24 Sep 2010 12:05:52 -0700, wrote:

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 12:10:36 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 07:56:25 -0700, wrote:

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 02:23:17 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 09:03:03 -0700, wrote:

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 10:25:43 -0500, Don Foreman
wrote:

In the recession of '71, a lot of CA aerospace engineers were flipping
burgers and pumping gas. Unfortunately, there are no longer any
gas-pumping jobs.

So what? What's your point here?

I'm merely responding to Jessica that unemployed college graduates
hurt as much as unemployed anyone else. Plenty of college graduates
shop at Wal-Mart and eat at McDonald's. Some grads have mundane jobs
with both corporations while seeking and hoping for more challenging
work.

Looks like you've trying to weasel out of your claim that "there are
no longer any gas-pumping jobs".

No, that assertion stands, at least in my area. I know of no filling
station where an employee will pump my fuel for me.

Exactly as I said - more weaseling and back peddling. Facts: 1. There
are more low-end jobs now than there ever was, including some pumping
gas. 2. You must be severely out of touch if you don't know #1.

Wayne

I said I know of no filling station in my area where an employee will
pump fuel for me.

Yes, but that was part of weaseling out of your original claim that
"there are no longer any gas-pumping jobs". See any qualifiers?

Let's extend the logic snorf you've employed here...

Idiot: There are no cars anymore
Perplexed: Huh? There are more cars now than there ever were.
Idiot: No, there aren't. At least, I can't see any ever since I locked
myself in my basement.

I see no refutation, so who's weaseling and
backpedalling here?

The refutation is clear - that there are lots of low-end jobs, more
than there's ever been, including gas pumping jobs, and including
entire states where self-serve doesn't exist. And places where
self-serve stations are not only required to pump for the disabled,
but at self-serve prices.

I am definitely out of touch with the minimum wage job market.

No kidding. Haven't been reading much news lately, eh? Missed the
thing about the conversion to a service economy altogether I guess.
But that's not my main beef with you, weasel. It's that when you're
informed of being wrong, you yak up a storm rather than just saying
"oh, sorry, learn something new every day". Who is supposed to be
fooled by your M.O.?

I'm
past age 65, retired, don't need or want a job. I've more than paid my
dues.

Are you in touch with the minimum wage job market?

LOL Who's trolling now? I'm retired as well, and you damned well know
it. My main connection to minimum wage jobs is that by opening my
eyes, it's kinda' undeniable that the jobs not only exist, but are an
increasing share of the market.

Wayne

On Sat, 25 Sep 2010 08:42:16 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

On 9/25/2010 8:03 AM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Don, the state of Florida is 'Self Service' as well. The only
exception is that the disabled may request someone to pump gas for
them. Even then, they will put you off as long as they can get away
with, since most gas is sold at convenience stores with only one person
working at a time. There is only one station that I know of where the
owner has been there for over 40 years, and will come out to pump gas
without being asked if he isn't busy. He knows I have trouble walking,
and getting in or out of my truck, but in the 11 years I've done
business there, I've never asked. He has been in the business so long
that he will still 'Run a tab' for some customers. He's offered, but
I've never done it.

I don't think that Wayne quite grasps that "gas pumping" is different
from "sitting in a booth in a convenience store running a cash register".

I don't think that you grasp that one low-wage job is the same as
another when it comes to the claim that there aren't such jobs for the
skilled. And there are still lots of jobs pumping gas, even at
primarily self-serve places. I'm amazed that so many people can't see
past their own limited experience. Imagine that you're a little old
lady who has to struggle in and out of her vehicle. You don't think
that even in a primarily self-serve area, that you'd be able to find a
place where the attendant will help you out? Really? Do you imagine
that those who need a little help have to quit driving? If you were in
the fuel business you'd let those customers go to your competitor?
You've seen the proliferation of drive-throughs for everything from
banking to coffee, but imagine that nobody caters to that type of
customer when it comes to gas? I don't care how much one's personal
experience is limited, if they're sensible then they'll know that
people still get paid for pumping gas.

Wayne

On Fri, 24 Sep 2010 18:31:02 -0700, rangerssuck wrote:
On Sep 24, 4:24*pm, " wrote:
On Sep 23, 6:32*pm, rangerssuck wrote:

I hate the smell of gasoline, and I'm overjoyed that I don't have to
pump it, even if it costs me an extra few cents per gallon here in NJ.

You would not have enjoyed the summer job I had as a roustabout on a
crew that cleaned oil wells.

Probably not. I worked for several years as a motorcycle mechanic. I hated
the smell before I started. Hated it more when I finished. And it's damned
near impossible to get off your hands.

Have you tried Lava, Boraxo, or dish soap?

Cheers!
Rich

On Sat, 25 Sep 2010 08:03:46 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


I said I know of no filling station in my area where an employee will
pump fuel for me.


Don, the state of Florida is 'Self Service' as well. The only
exception is that the disabled may request someone to pump gas for
them.

Same as California.



I am the Sword of my Family
and the Shield of my Nation.
If sent, I will crush everything you have built,
burn everything you love,
and kill every one of you.
(Hebrew quote)

On 9/25/2010 3:21 PM, Rich Grise wrote:
On Fri, 24 Sep 2010 18:31:02 -0700, rangerssuck wrote:
On Sep 24, 4:24 pm, wrote:
On Sep 23, 6:32 pm, wrote:

I hate the smell of gasoline, and I'm overjoyed that I don't have to
pump it, even if it costs me an extra few cents per gallon here in NJ.

You would not have enjoyed the summer job I had as a roustabout on a
crew that cleaned oil wells.

Probably not. I worked for several years as a motorcycle mechanic. I hated
the smell before I started. Hated it more when I finished. And it's damned
near impossible to get off your hands.

Have you tried Lava, Boraxo, or dish soap?

The orange stuff that Harbor Fright sells does a remarkably effective job.

On Sep 24, 9:31*pm, rangerssuck wrote:

Probably not. I worked for several years as a motorcycle mechanic. I
hated the smell before I started. Hated it more when I finished. And
it's damned near impossible to get off your hands.

Paint thinner always worked for me.

Dan

On Sat, 25 Sep 2010 13:26:38 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Sat, 25 Sep 2010 08:03:46 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:

Don, the state of Florida is 'Self Service' as well. The only
exception is that the disabled may request someone to pump gas for
them.

Same as California.

What? Before you said that there weren't any jobs pumping gas, now
you're saying that every self-serve attendant needs to know how to
pump gas. Add that to your claims that all the jobs require degrees,
and that you've looked for a job every day for a year but can't find
one. And you wonder why anyone would doubt your word!

Well lookee here, despite all your silly self-serving BS, I was able
to find a great job for you in 30 seconds.
http://www.careerbuilder.com/JobSeek...56Q16B4Z9WMDDS
No degree required, they're willing to train and equip, lots of double
and triple overtime, and your experience as a 158 IQ "licensed
electrician" guffaw should make getting a shot a cakewalk. Just the
one minor problem... "MUST have TWO professional references that can
vouch that you have good attendance, show up on time and have a good
attitude. Must have reliable transportation".

But don't worry, as soon as they google your name they'll find
everything they need to know about your attitude, reliability, and
vehicle. I remember having some laughs reading job applications. I
couldn't believe some of the crap people put on them. So I can well
imagine your application being passed around and providing some great
amusement for any employer.

Wayne

On Sat, 25 Sep 2010 12:21:22 -0700, Rich Grise
wrote:

On Fri, 24 Sep 2010 18:31:02 -0700, rangerssuck wrote:
On Sep 24, 4:24*pm, " wrote:
On Sep 23, 6:32*pm, rangerssuck wrote:

I hate the smell of gasoline, and I'm overjoyed that I don't have to
pump it, even if it costs me an extra few cents per gallon here in NJ.

You would not have enjoyed the summer job I had as a roustabout on a
crew that cleaned oil wells.

Probably not. I worked for several years as a motorcycle mechanic. I hated
the smell before I started. Hated it more when I finished. And it's damned
near impossible to get off your hands.

Nowadays, almost all mechanics and machinists wear latex, nitrile, or
mechanics' gloves.


Have you tried Lava, Boraxo, or dish soap?

None works better than 50%. Spraying your hands with bleach and
rubbing it in for a couple minutes before rinsing takes off another
40%, but that scent persists for a long while.


"Gloves-in-a-bottle" lotions prevent the skin from taking on the scent
and somewhat prevent the pores from taking on grease so deeply.
I strongly recommend the stuff.

http://fwd4.me/g2j Avon giab

http://www.dermashieldusa.com/ The foam stuff I have used and love. I
need to remember to put some on my face, arms, and hands before hiking
in poison-oak-infested woods next time.

From their site:

"Strong odors (i.e. gasoline, fish, onions etc.) wash off instead of
lingering on the skin for hours."

--
Some people hear voices. Some see invisible people.
Others have no imagination whatsoever.

On Sat, 25 Sep 2010 18:35:27 -0700, Larry Jaques wrote:

"Gloves-in-a-bottle" lotions prevent the skin from taking on the scent and
somewhat prevent the pores from taking on grease so deeply. I strongly
recommend the stuff.

Do they transfer your fingerprints? The other day, I patched my tire tube,
and when I rubbed in the rubber cement, I left the stuff on my finger to
dry, just out of curiosity. When it was dry, I dabbed a atamp pad and put
my prints on paper; evidently the rubber cement dried so thin that my
prints still showed through.

I hear that if you scan currency and print it on your color laser or
whatever that you should obscure your fingerprints, and those plastic or
rubber gloves make my hands sweat. =:-O

Cheers!
Rich