Another thread discussing whether a switch in something was normally
open or normally closed reminded me of a similar question I have.

If I want to buy a reed switch/magnet pair to use as a door or window
contact in an alarm system and the system requires that the contact be
closed when the window or door is closed, do I buy a N.O. switch or
N.C. switch? I assumed N.C. until I started to over-think it. A
normally open switch is one that is open until it gets activated. Reed
switches are activated by the magnet getting close. So, a normally
open switch would be closed when the magnet is near and that happens
when the window is closed - which is normal - so normally, a normally
open switch is closed - aaaaaargh! I need a replacement switch a few
months ago and ended up paying extra for a double throw switch. It
wasn't labeled so I still don't know if I wanted N.O. or N.C. I just
used the contact that worked.

So, what is "normal" for a reed switch? When the magnet is near or
not?

Pat

wrote:
Another thread discussing whether a switch in something was normally
open or normally closed reminded me of a similar question I have.

If I want to buy a reed switch/magnet pair to use as a door or window
contact in an alarm system and the system requires that the contact be
closed when the window or door is closed, do I buy a N.O. switch or
N.C. switch? I assumed N.C. until I started to over-think it. A
normally open switch is one that is open until it gets activated. Reed
switches are activated by the magnet getting close. So, a normally
open switch would be closed when the magnet is near and that happens
when the window is closed - which is normal - so normally, a normally
open switch is closed - aaaaaargh! I need a replacement switch a few
months ago and ended up paying extra for a double throw switch. It
wasn't labeled so I still don't know if I wanted N.O. or N.C. I just
used the contact that worked.

So, what is "normal" for a reed switch? When the magnet is near or
not?

Pat


Normal is when there is no outside force acting on the switch,
relay, contactor, whatever.
In this case, it's when the magnet is away from the switch.

On May 25, 1:45*pm, wrote:
Another thread discussing whether a switch in something was normally
open or normally closed reminded me of a similar question I have.

If I want to buy a reed switch/magnet pair to use as a door or window
contact in an alarm system and the system requires that the contact be
closed when the window or door is closed, do I buy a N.O. switch or
N.C. switch? *I assumed N.C. until I started to over-think it. *A
normally open switch is one that is open until it gets activated. Reed
switches are activated by the magnet getting close. *So, a normally
open switch would be closed when the magnet is near and that happens
when the window is closed - which is normal - so normally, a normally
open switch is closed - aaaaaargh! *I need a replacement switch a few
months ago and ended up paying extra for a double throw switch. *It
wasn't labeled so I still don't know if I wanted N.O. or N.C. *I just
used the contact that worked. *

So, what is "normal" for a reed switch? *When the magnet is near or
not?

Pat

THEY COME WITH CONTACTS FOR BOTH NO & NC SYSTEM REQUIREMENTS.
SO STOP BANGING YOUR HEAD OVER IT...THE NORMAL CONDITION IN YOUR CASE
IS THE CLOSED WINDOW..YOU'D NEED A NORMALLY OPEN SW.....BUT SINCE A
SWITCH IS GOOD FOR BOTH CONDITIONS IT DOESNT MATTER.....YOU CAN SWAP
IT AT THE CONTROL BOARD TOO, YOU NINNY
TGITM

On May 25, 2:40*pm, The Ghost in The Machine
wrote:
On May 25, 1:45*pm, wrote:





Another thread discussing whether a switch in something was normally
open or normally closed reminded me of a similar question I have.

If I want to buy a reed switch/magnet pair to use as a door or window
contact in an alarm system and the system requires that the contact be
closed when the window or door is closed, do I buy a N.O. switch or
N.C. switch? *I assumed N.C. until I started to over-think it. *A
normally open switch is one that is open until it gets activated. Reed
switches are activated by the magnet getting close. *So, a normally
open switch would be closed when the magnet is near and that happens
when the window is closed - which is normal - so normally, a normally
open switch is closed - aaaaaargh! *I need a replacement switch a few
months ago and ended up paying extra for a double throw switch. *It
wasn't labeled so I still don't know if I wanted N.O. or N.C. *I just
used the contact that worked. *

So, what is "normal" for a reed switch? *When the magnet is near or
not?

Pat

THEY COME WITH CONTACTS FOR BOTH NO & NC SYSTEM REQUIREMENTS.
SO STOP BANGING YOUR HEAD OVER IT...THE NORMAL CONDITION IN YOUR CASE
IS THE CLOSED WINDOW..YOU'D NEED A NORMALLY OPEN SW.....BUT SINCE A
SWITCH IS GOOD FOR *BOTH CONDITIONS IT DOESNT MATTER.....YOU CAN SWAP
IT AT THE CONTROL BOARD TOO, YOU NINNY
TGITM- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

only if it is a Form C contact...

nate

On May 25, 1:45*pm, wrote:
Another thread discussing whether a switch in something was normally
open or normally closed reminded me of a similar question I have.

If I want to buy a reed switch/magnet pair to use as a door or window
contact in an alarm system and the system requires that the contact be
closed when the window or door is closed, do I buy a N.O. switch or
N.C. switch? *I assumed N.C. until I started to over-think it. *A
normally open switch is one that is open until it gets activated. Reed
switches are activated by the magnet getting close. *So, a normally
open switch would be closed when the magnet is near and that happens
when the window is closed - which is normal - so normally, a normally
open switch is closed - aaaaaargh! *I need a replacement switch a few
months ago and ended up paying extra for a double throw switch. *It
wasn't labeled so I still don't know if I wanted N.O. or N.C. *I just
used the contact that worked. *

So, what is "normal" for a reed switch? *When the magnet is near or
not?

Pat

@Pat:

N.O., or normally open, means the switch is open until a magnetic
force is applied to close the circuit...

(i.e. closing the window to align the magnet/switch pair)

N.C., or normally closed, means the switch is closed until a magnetic
force is applied to open the circuit...

As others have stated the requirements for one kind of switch or
the other will vary by: the alarm panel being used, the type of
switch being used by other devices wired in a series circuit and
the type of input being used on the given alarm panel...

~~ Evan

On May 25, 3:12*pm, Evan wrote:
On May 25, 1:45*pm, wrote:





Another thread discussing whether a switch in something was normally
open or normally closed reminded me of a similar question I have.

If I want to buy a reed switch/magnet pair to use as a door or window
contact in an alarm system and the system requires that the contact be
closed when the window or door is closed, do I buy a N.O. switch or
N.C. switch? *I assumed N.C. until I started to over-think it. *A
normally open switch is one that is open until it gets activated. Reed
switches are activated by the magnet getting close. *So, a normally
open switch would be closed when the magnet is near and that happens
when the window is closed - which is normal - so normally, a normally
open switch is closed - aaaaaargh! *I need a replacement switch a few
months ago and ended up paying extra for a double throw switch. *It
wasn't labeled so I still don't know if I wanted N.O. or N.C. *I just
used the contact that worked. *

So, what is "normal" for a reed switch? *When the magnet is near or
not?

Pat

@Pat:

N.O., or normally open, means the switch is open until a magnetic
force is applied to close the circuit...

(i.e. closing the window to align the magnet/switch pair)

N.C., or normally closed, means the switch is closed until a magnetic
force is applied to open the circuit...

As others have stated the requirements for one kind of switch or
the other will vary by: the alarm panel being used, the type of
switch being used by other devices wired in a series circuit and
the type of input being used on the given alarm panel...

~~ Evan- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Typically you want to use a normally open switch so that when the
magnet is close to it it closes. That way the circuit is complete
when the windo is closed. Anyone attempting to defeat the protection
by cutting the circuit anywhere trips it. Still can be defaeated by
shorting it somewhere else but that takes more than a pair of wire
cutters.

On May 25, 3:33*pm, jamesgangnc wrote:
On May 25, 3:12*pm, Evan wrote:



On May 25, 1:45*pm, wrote:

Another thread discussing whether a switch in something was normally
open or normally closed reminded me of a similar question I have.

If I want to buy a reed switch/magnet pair to use as a door or window
contact in an alarm system and the system requires that the contact be
closed when the window or door is closed, do I buy a N.O. switch or
N.C. switch? *I assumed N.C. until I started to over-think it. *A
normally open switch is one that is open until it gets activated. Reed
switches are activated by the magnet getting close. *So, a normally
open switch would be closed when the magnet is near and that happens
when the window is closed - which is normal - so normally, a normally
open switch is closed - aaaaaargh! *I need a replacement switch a few
months ago and ended up paying extra for a double throw switch. *It
wasn't labeled so I still don't know if I wanted N.O. or N.C. *I just
used the contact that worked. *

So, what is "normal" for a reed switch? *When the magnet is near or
not?

Pat

@Pat:

N.O., or normally open, means the switch is open until a magnetic
force is applied to close the circuit...

(i.e. closing the window to align the magnet/switch pair)

N.C., or normally closed, means the switch is closed until a magnetic
force is applied to open the circuit...

As others have stated the requirements for one kind of switch or
the other will vary by: the alarm panel being used, the type of
switch being used by other devices wired in a series circuit and
the type of input being used on the given alarm panel...

~~ Evan- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Typically you want to use a normally open switch so that when the
magnet is close to it it closes. *That way the circuit is complete
when the windo is closed. *Anyone attempting to defeat the protection
by cutting the circuit anywhere trips it. *Still can be defaeated by
shorting it somewhere else but that takes more than a pair of wire
cutters.

I have seen both types installed with the same magnet to operate
different circuits...

The N.O. switch for the alarm system...

The N.C. switch used on an unrelated and unconnected indicator
panel where when a door or window is opened the indicator light
goes on so some guard/attendant can investigate... All lights
out meant "all openings closed"...

Some of the more elaborate installations of the indicator system
used a graphic annunciator panel with a plan of the building on it...

~~ Evan

ã…—ã…‘,

wrote:
Another thread discussing whether a switch in something was normally
open or normally closed reminded me of a similar question I have.

If I want to buy a reed switch/magnet pair to use as a door or window
contact in an alarm system and the system requires that the contact be
closed when the window or door is closed, do I buy a N.O. switch or
N.C. switch? I assumed N.C. until I started to over-think it. A
normally open switch is one that is open until it gets activated. Reed
switches are activated by the magnet getting close. So, a normally
open switch would be closed when the magnet is near and that happens
when the window is closed - which is normal - so normally, a normally
open switch is closed - aaaaaargh! I need a replacement switch a few
months ago and ended up paying extra for a double throw switch. It
wasn't labeled so I still don't know if I wanted N.O. or N.C. I just
used the contact that worked.

So, what is "normal" for a reed switch? When the magnet is near or
not?

Pat
Hi,
If I were you I'd pick up reed switch with 3 wires. It can be used on
either case N.O or N.C. The wire will be marked as C(common),
NO(normally open), NC(normally closed)

wrote:

So, what is "normal" for a reed switch? When the magnet is near or
not?

The security industry made up it's own vernacular for contacts. 99% are
N/O (shelf state), closed on magnetic reed trip (actuated).

But..... to avoid confusion, they started calling them "closed loop"
switches. It only added to confusion.

Have a look at GRI, GE, and Honeywell for top quality.

http://www.bassburglaralarms.com/sen...ors_37_ctg.htm

On May 25, 1:45*pm, wrote:
Another thread discussing whether a switch in something was normally
open or normally closed reminded me of a similar question I have.

If I want to buy a reed switch/magnet pair to use as a door or window
contact in an alarm system and the system requires that the contact be
closed when the window or door is closed, do I buy a N.O. switch or
N.C. switch? *I assumed N.C. until I started to over-think it. *A
normally open switch is one that is open until it gets activated. Reed
switches are activated by the magnet getting close. *So, a normally
open switch would be closed when the magnet is near and that happens
when the window is closed - which is normal - so normally, a normally
open switch is closed - aaaaaargh! *I need a replacement switch a few
months ago and ended up paying extra for a double throw switch. *It
wasn't labeled so I still don't know if I wanted N.O. or N.C. *I just
used the contact that worked. *

So, what is "normal" for a reed switch? *When the magnet is near or
not?

Pat

If its open without the magnet then its NO

Jimmie

On May 25, 8:39*pm, JIMMIE wrote:
On May 25, 1:45*pm, wrote:





Another thread discussing whether a switch in something was normally
open or normally closed reminded me of a similar question I have.

If I want to buy a reed switch/magnet pair to use as a door or window
contact in an alarm system and the system requires that the contact be
closed when the window or door is closed, do I buy a N.O. switch or
N.C. switch? *I assumed N.C. until I started to over-think it. *A
normally open switch is one that is open until it gets activated. Reed
switches are activated by the magnet getting close. *So, a normally
open switch would be closed when the magnet is near and that happens
when the window is closed - which is normal - so normally, a normally
open switch is closed - aaaaaargh! *I need a replacement switch a few
months ago and ended up paying extra for a double throw switch. *It
wasn't labeled so I still don't know if I wanted N.O. or N.C. *I just
used the contact that worked. *

So, what is "normal" for a reed switch? *When the magnet is near or
not?

Pat

If its open without the magnet then its NO

Jimmie- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

If you have a NO switch, you can easily convert it to a NC closed
switch..Mount the reed relay with a magnet nearby to close it. Then
use the movable magnet to cancel the field from the attached magnet
when the movable magnet is in the vicinity of the reed relay. All it
takes is one little extra magnet.

On 5/25/2011 12:45 PM, wrote:
Another thread discussing whether a switch in something was normally
open or normally closed reminded me of a similar question I have.

If I want to buy a reed switch/magnet pair to use as a door or window
contact in an alarm system and the system requires that the contact be
closed when the window or door is closed, do I buy a N.O. switch or
N.C. switch? I assumed N.C. until I started to over-think it. A
normally open switch is one that is open until it gets activated. Reed
switches are activated by the magnet getting close. So, a normally
open switch would be closed when the magnet is near and that happens
when the window is closed - which is normal - so normally, a normally
open switch is closed - aaaaaargh! I need a replacement switch a few
months ago and ended up paying extra for a double throw switch. It
wasn't labeled so I still don't know if I wanted N.O. or N.C. I just
used the contact that worked.

So, what is "normal" for a reed switch? When the magnet is near or
not?

Pat


There was a thread on this about a year ago.

RBM's reply was:
As an electrician, I've been through this numerous times over the years.
It clearly depend on who you are talking to, and what trade they're in.
IMO, the "normal" position is the state the switch is in when nothing
affects it. Alarm people have the opposite take on it.


My reply was:
I agree.

In all the following the contacts are closed with the magnet next to the
reed switch.

From an alarm perspective *NC* ("normal" is when the door is closed):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burglar..._control_panel
"Most switching devices are N.C. (normally closed) circuits, so when the
device is not in an alarm condition, the circuit is closed."

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/21...or_Alarm_Switc...
"Output signal: normally closed (switch contact is closed when the door
closed)"

From a component manufacturer *NO*
C&K: "ELECTRICAL CIRCUIT: SPST NO (Contact Form A). Reed switch
opens when magnet is removed from proximity. Contacts are
held closed when magnet is within actuation range."

To know what the switch does you need to have a description like all of
the above.
end reply.

--
bud--

On May 26, 7:52*am, bud-- wrote:
On 5/25/2011 12:45 PM, wrote:





Another thread discussing whether a switch in something was normally
open or normally closed reminded me of a similar question I have.

If I want to buy a reed switch/magnet pair to use as a door or window
contact in an alarm system and the system requires that the contact be
closed when the window or door is closed, do I buy a N.O. switch or
N.C. switch? *I assumed N.C. until I started to over-think it. *A
normally open switch is one that is open until it gets activated. Reed
switches are activated by the magnet getting close. *So, a normally
open switch would be closed when the magnet is near and that happens
when the window is closed - which is normal - so normally, a normally
open switch is closed - aaaaaargh! *I need a replacement switch a few
months ago and ended up paying extra for a double throw switch. *It
wasn't labeled so I still don't know if I wanted N.O. or N.C. *I just
used the contact that worked.

So, what is "normal" for a reed switch? *When the magnet is near or
not?

Pat

There was a thread on this about a year ago.

RBM's reply was:
As an electrician, I've been through this numerous times over the years.
It clearly depend on who you are talking to, and what trade they're in.
IMO, the "normal" position is the state the switch is in when nothing
affects it. Alarm people have the opposite take on it.

My reply was:
I agree.

In all the following the contacts are closed with the magnet next to the
reed switch.

* From an alarm perspective *NC* ("normal" is when the door is closed):http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burglar..._control_panel
"Most switching devices are N.C. (normally closed) circuits, so when the
device is not in an alarm condition, the circuit is closed."

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/21...or_Alarm_Switc...
"Output signal: normally closed (switch contact is closed when the door
closed)"

* From a component manufacturer *NO*
C&K: "ELECTRICAL CIRCUIT: SPST NO (Contact Form A). Reed switch
opens when magnet is removed from proximity. Contacts are
held closed when magnet is within actuation range."

To know what the switch does you need to have a description like all of
the above.
end reply.

--
bud--- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I agree with the above and it also agrees, I think, with what all the
other
replies have been. I thought this would lead to one of those 100
reply
threads, because it does get confusing.

But, if one wants a typical alarm reed switch for a door or window,
I think it's fairly easy to get the right one. All the alarms I've
seen use
a circuit that gets interrupted to cause an alarm. Which makes
sense, since then even if a wire breaks, it trips the alarm
indicating
something is wrong. If you just buy a switch clearly
intended for door/window use, very high probability you'll get one
that is closed when the magnet is present.

In article ,
bud-- wrote:

On 5/25/2011 12:45 PM, wrote:
Another thread discussing whether a switch in something was normally
open or normally closed reminded me of a similar question I have.

If I want to buy a reed switch/magnet pair to use as a door or window
contact in an alarm system and the system requires that the contact be
closed when the window or door is closed, do I buy a N.O. switch or
N.C. switch? I assumed N.C. until I started to over-think it. A
normally open switch is one that is open until it gets activated. Reed
switches are activated by the magnet getting close. So, a normally
open switch would be closed when the magnet is near and that happens
when the window is closed - which is normal - so normally, a normally
open switch is closed - aaaaaargh! I need a replacement switch a few
months ago and ended up paying extra for a double throw switch. It
wasn't labeled so I still don't know if I wanted N.O. or N.C. I just
used the contact that worked.

So, what is "normal" for a reed switch? When the magnet is near or
not?

Pat


There was a thread on this about a year ago.

RBM's reply was:
As an electrician, I've been through this numerous times over the years.
It clearly depend on who you are talking to, and what trade they're in.
IMO, the "normal" position is the state the switch is in when nothing
affects it. Alarm people have the opposite take on it.


My reply was:
I agree.

In all the following the contacts are closed with the magnet next to the
reed switch.

From an alarm perspective *NC* ("normal" is when the door is closed):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burglar..._control_panel
"Most switching devices are N.C. (normally closed) circuits, so when the
device is not in an alarm condition, the circuit is closed."

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/21...or_Alarm_Switc...
"Output signal: normally closed (switch contact is closed when the door
closed)"

From a component manufacturer *NO*
C&K: "ELECTRICAL CIRCUIT: SPST NO (Contact Form A). Reed switch
opens when magnet is removed from proximity. Contacts are
held closed when magnet is within actuation range."

To know what the switch does you need to have a description like all of
the above.
end reply.

Interesting. My take on that is twofold:

One, alarm people don't know what the hell they're talking about. Words
become meaningless when one group of people decide to throw out the real
definition and use their own.

Two, If the OP buys a switch from an electronic component distributor,
he needs an NO. If he buys from an alarm company, he needs to ask for an
NC, while muttering "you're all retarded" under his breath.

On Thu, 26 May 2011 08:24:04 -0700, Smitty Two
wrote:

In article ,
bud-- wrote:

On 5/25/2011 12:45 PM, wrote:
Another thread discussing whether a switch in something was normally
open or normally closed reminded me of a similar question I have.

If I want to buy a reed switch/magnet pair to use as a door or window
contact in an alarm system and the system requires that the contact be
closed when the window or door is closed, do I buy a N.O. switch or
N.C. switch? I assumed N.C. until I started to over-think it. A
normally open switch is one that is open until it gets activated. Reed
switches are activated by the magnet getting close. So, a normally
open switch would be closed when the magnet is near and that happens
when the window is closed - which is normal - so normally, a normally
open switch is closed - aaaaaargh! I need a replacement switch a few
months ago and ended up paying extra for a double throw switch. It
wasn't labeled so I still don't know if I wanted N.O. or N.C. I just
used the contact that worked.

So, what is "normal" for a reed switch? When the magnet is near or
not?

Pat


There was a thread on this about a year ago.

RBM's reply was:
As an electrician, I've been through this numerous times over the years.
It clearly depend on who you are talking to, and what trade they're in.
IMO, the "normal" position is the state the switch is in when nothing
affects it. Alarm people have the opposite take on it.


My reply was:
I agree.

In all the following the contacts are closed with the magnet next to the
reed switch.

From an alarm perspective *NC* ("normal" is when the door is closed):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burglar..._control_panel
"Most switching devices are N.C. (normally closed) circuits, so when the
device is not in an alarm condition, the circuit is closed."

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/21...or_Alarm_Switc...
"Output signal: normally closed (switch contact is closed when the door
closed)"

From a component manufacturer *NO*
C&K: "ELECTRICAL CIRCUIT: SPST NO (Contact Form A). Reed switch
opens when magnet is removed from proximity. Contacts are
held closed when magnet is within actuation range."

To know what the switch does you need to have a description like all of
the above.
end reply.

Interesting. My take on that is twofold:

One, alarm people don't know what the hell they're talking about. Words
become meaningless when one group of people decide to throw out the real
definition and use their own.

Two, If the OP buys a switch from an electronic component distributor,
he needs an NO. If he buys from an alarm company, he needs to ask for an
NC, while muttering "you're all retarded" under his breath.
Good answer!

Thanks for all the replies. Since I was planning to buy from Digikey
rather than an alarm company, the clear answer seems to be N.O.

wrote:

Thanks for all the replies. Since I was planning to buy from Digikey
rather than an alarm company, the clear answer seems to be N.O.

N.O. 'closed loop' to be precise.

You can use N.C. contacts in an alarm zone circuit, but the wiring would
be in parallel. Most are wired in series, hence the NO 'closed loop'.

On 5/26/2011 10:24 AM, Smitty Two wrote:
In ,
wrote:

On 5/25/2011 12:45 PM, wrote:
Another thread discussing whether a switch in something was normally
open or normally closed reminded me of a similar question I have.

If I want to buy a reed switch/magnet pair to use as a door or window
contact in an alarm system and the system requires that the contact be
closed when the window or door is closed, do I buy a N.O. switch or
N.C. switch? I assumed N.C. until I started to over-think it. A
normally open switch is one that is open until it gets activated. Reed
switches are activated by the magnet getting close. So, a normally
open switch would be closed when the magnet is near and that happens
when the window is closed - which is normal - so normally, a normally
open switch is closed - aaaaaargh! I need a replacement switch a few
months ago and ended up paying extra for a double throw switch. It
wasn't labeled so I still don't know if I wanted N.O. or N.C. I just
used the contact that worked.

So, what is "normal" for a reed switch? When the magnet is near or
not?

Pat


There was a thread on this about a year ago.

RBM's reply was:
As an electrician, I've been through this numerous times over the years.
It clearly depend on who you are talking to, and what trade they're in.
IMO, the "normal" position is the state the switch is in when nothing
affects it. Alarm people have the opposite take on it.


My reply was:
I agree.

In all the following the contacts are closed with the magnet next to the
reed switch.

From an alarm perspective *NC* ("normal" is when the door is closed):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burglar..._control_panel
"Most switching devices are N.C. (normally closed) circuits, so when the
device is not in an alarm condition, the circuit is closed."

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/21...or_Alarm_Switc...
"Output signal: normally closed (switch contact is closed when the door
closed)"

From a component manufacturer *NO*
C&K: "ELECTRICAL CIRCUIT: SPST NO (Contact Form A). Reed switch
opens when magnet is removed from proximity. Contacts are
held closed when magnet is within actuation range."

To know what the switch does you need to have a description like all of
the above.
end reply.

Interesting. My take on that is twofold:

One, alarm people don't know what the hell they're talking about. Words
become meaningless when one group of people decide to throw out the real
definition and use their own.


IMHO alarm terms make sense from within the industry. For a series loop
circuit you need devices that are NC while the alarm is armed. That is a
NO reed switch with the magnet adjacent. A NO reed switch in its
"normal" condition (while armed) is NC, and is called NC. If you buy
from sources in the alarm industry you probably won't have a problem.

There is a problem using devices from outside the alarm industry.

It is not the only instance where terminology changes. Electronics
circuits have (had?) black as "ground", green was vacuum tube grid. A
neon transformer that is "overloaded" has too long a length of neon
tubes connected (current is too low). What is "high voltage" is
different for a low voltage tech, an electrician, a TV (CRT) repairman,
and a power utility engineer.

--
bud--

On May 27, 10:56*am, bud-- wrote:
On 5/26/2011 10:24 AM, Smitty Two wrote:





In ,
* *wrote:

On 5/25/2011 12:45 PM, wrote:
Another thread discussing whether a switch in something was normally
open or normally closed reminded me of a similar question I have.

If I want to buy a reed switch/magnet pair to use as a door or window
contact in an alarm system and the system requires that the contact be
closed when the window or door is closed, do I buy a N.O. switch or
N.C. switch? *I assumed N.C. until I started to over-think it. *A
normally open switch is one that is open until it gets activated. Reed
switches are activated by the magnet getting close. *So, a normally
open switch would be closed when the magnet is near and that happens
when the window is closed - which is normal - so normally, a normally
open switch is closed - aaaaaargh! *I need a replacement switch a few
months ago and ended up paying extra for a double throw switch. *It
wasn't labeled so I still don't know if I wanted N.O. or N.C. *I just
used the contact that worked.

So, what is "normal" for a reed switch? *When the magnet is near or
not?

Pat

There was a thread on this about a year ago.

RBM's reply was:
As an electrician, I've been through this numerous times over the years.
It clearly depend on who you are talking to, and what trade they're in..
IMO, the "normal" position is the state the switch is in when nothing
affects it. Alarm people have the opposite take on it.

My reply was:
I agree.

In all the following the contacts are closed with the magnet next to the
reed switch.

* *From an alarm perspective *NC* ("normal" is when the door is closed):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burglar..._control_panel
"Most switching devices are N.C. (normally closed) circuits, so when the
device is not in an alarm condition, the circuit is closed."

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/21...or_Alarm_Switc....
"Output signal: normally closed (switch contact is closed when the door
closed)"

* *From a component manufacturer *NO*
C&K: "ELECTRICAL CIRCUIT: SPST NO (Contact Form A). Reed switch
opens when magnet is removed from proximity. Contacts are
held closed when magnet is within actuation range."

To know what the switch does you need to have a description like all of
the above.
end reply.

Interesting. My take on that is twofold:

One, alarm people don't know what the hell they're talking about. Words
become meaningless when one group of people decide to throw out the real
definition and use their own.

IMHO alarm terms make sense from within the industry. For a series loop
circuit you need devices that are NC while the alarm is armed. That is a
NO reed switch with the magnet adjacent. A NO reed switch in its
"normal" condition (while armed) is NC, and is called NC. If you buy
from sources in the alarm industry you probably won't have a problem.

That was the point I made a while back, ie if you buy a window/door
switch sold for alarm use, it's very hard to go wrong.



There is a problem using devices from outside the alarm industry.

Which is why I don't understand the need to buy a reed switch
from any other source if you're intending to use it as a door/window
switch in an alarm system They come made specifically for that
purpose, with self-adhesive and screw mounting capability, cost
$3 and are widely available, including Ebay.





It is not the only instance where terminology changes. Electronics
circuits have (had?) black as "ground", green was vacuum tube grid. A
neon transformer that is "overloaded" has too long a length of neon
tubes connected (current is too low). What is "high voltage" is
different for a low voltage tech, an electrician, a TV (CRT) repairman,
and a power utility engineer.

--
bud--- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Smitty Two wrote:

One, alarm people don't know what the hell they're talking about. Words
become meaningless when one group of people decide to throw out the real
definition and use their own.

Smitty,

Alarm people 'do' know what they're talking about. You can blame the
manufacturers for the vernacular confusion, but 'alarm people" know.

Come on over to alt.security.alarms for further discussion if it bothers
you. I'm sure some of my colleges can define the reason better than I.

On Sat, 28 May 2011 11:26:46 -0500, G. Morgan
wrote:

Smitty Two wrote:

One, alarm people don't know what the hell they're talking about. Words
become meaningless when one group of people decide to throw out the real
definition and use their own.

Smitty,

Alarm people 'do' know what they're talking about. You can blame the
manufacturers for the vernacular confusion, but 'alarm people" know.

Come on over to alt.security.alarms for further discussion if it bothers
you. I'm sure some of my colleges can define the reason better than I.

It is easy to understand if you just acknowledge that your security
system is normal/ready when the window loop is closed.

Fire alarms are also "ready" when the zone relays are energized. This
is to allow them to fail safe.

Metspitzer wrote:

It is easy to understand if you just acknowledge that your security
system is normal/ready when the window loop is closed.

Indeed.


Fire alarms are also "ready" when the zone relays are energized. This
is to allow them to fail safe.

It's the same thing. Fire alarm devices like smoke detectors, heat
detectors, duct smoke, pull-stations, whatever.... They are 'open' in a
normal situation (no alarm) and close the contacts when the device is
actuated. The big difference is wiring. Conventional fire alarms MUST
be wired in parallel, with the EOLR (end of line resistor) in parallel
with the last physical device on that zone. That way, we can detect a
disconnected wire/device and get a 'trouble' condition (instead of
ALARM) on the panel.

The reason series wiring is used for burglary is the way the house is
wired. On a "good" pre-wire job (during construction), each window and
door has a cable "home-run" to the panel. Well, most homes have an
average of 15-20 windows, 3-5 exterior doors, a couple of motion
detectors, and perhaps a monitored fire zone. Your average burg. panel
has about 8 hardwired zones. It would not make sense to put each device
on it's own zone, it would be cost-prohibitive to add the zone
expanders.

So, we identify the cables for a "set" of windows i.e. "living
room/kitchen" and wire those cables in series right at the panel. You
have to use the zones you have to work with as optimally as possible.
Because they will not be all the same type, for example: Zone 1 Fire,
Zone 2 is an entry/exit delay, Zone 3 for 'interior' devices', Zone 4 -
CO detector (or aux. device) Zones 5-8 for 'perimeter' devices and
extra interior devices.

Series wiring gives us the greatest flexibility to work 'creative'
solutions for security. Fire alarms are a whole different animal
because they MUST adhere to the NFPA 72 code, which does not permit
series wiring for a conventional class-B zone style.

I've heard a fire instructor tell us, "Fire alarms are science, security
systems are art."

On 5/28/2011 11:26 AM, G. Morgan wrote:
Smitty Two wrote:

One, alarm people don't know what the hell they're talking about. Words
become meaningless when one group of people decide to throw out the real
definition and use their own.

Smitty,

Alarm people 'do' know what they're talking about. You can blame the
manufacturers for the vernacular confusion, but 'alarm people" know.

Come on over to alt.security.alarms for further discussion if it bothers
you. I'm sure some of my colleges can define the reason better than I.


People in different industries using the same types of technology often
have different terminology for the same process. I've worked across many
fields over the years so I'm well aware of it. In alarm tech, normal
state is considered the secured state. Which means the magnet
is against the magnetic switch closing the circuit which is usually
a supervised circuit with a set resistance in the loop. In the field of
electronics or control systems the normal state is considered to be no
outside force affecting a switch. As a broadcast engineer working with
remote signals, I had to work with engineers and techs with the phone
company. To get a higher signal level, the radio guy will say "increase
the gain", the phone tech won't grok that unless I told them to "lessen
the loss". Same technology, different dialect. ^_^

TDD

The Daring Dufas wrote:

People in different industries using the same types of technology often
have different terminology for the same process. I've worked across many
fields over the years so I'm well aware of it. In alarm tech, normal
state is considered the secured state. Which means the magnet
is against the magnetic switch closing the circuit which is usually
a supervised circuit with a set resistance in the loop. In the field of
electronics or control systems the normal state is considered to be no
outside force affecting a switch. As a broadcast engineer working with
remote signals, I had to work with engineers and techs with the phone
company. To get a higher signal level, the radio guy will say "increase
the gain", the phone tech won't grok that unless I told them to "lessen
the loss". Same technology, different dialect. ^_^

Heh, yup. And you have to speak both when dealing with various vendors.

On 5/28/2011 3:06 PM, G. Morgan wrote:
The Daring Dufas wrote:

People in different industries using the same types of technology often
have different terminology for the same process. I've worked across many
fields over the years so I'm well aware of it. In alarm tech, normal
state is considered the secured state. Which means the magnet
is against the magnetic switch closing the circuit which is usually
a supervised circuit with a set resistance in the loop. In the field of
electronics or control systems the normal state is considered to be no
outside force affecting a switch. As a broadcast engineer working with
remote signals, I had to work with engineers and techs with the phone
company. To get a higher signal level, the radio guy will say "increase
the gain", the phone tech won't grok that unless I told them to "lessen
the loss". Same technology, different dialect. ^_^

Heh, yup. And you have to speak both when dealing with various vendors.


I work in many different fields now to alleviate boredom. I can't hold a
regular job because of medial problems. My situation is such that I
don't have trouble finding work, I have trouble getting out of bed and
walking across the room. I'm trying to recover from the aftereffects of
serious bouts of pneumonia and there are days when I'm as weak as a
kitten. It really ****es me off to not be able to get up and go. :-(

TDD

The Daring Dufas wrote:

I work in many different fields now to alleviate boredom. I can't hold a
regular job because of medial problems. My situation is such that I
don't have trouble finding work, I have trouble getting out of bed and
walking across the room. I'm trying to recover from the aftereffects of
serious bouts of pneumonia and there are days when I'm as weak as a
kitten. It really ****es me off to not be able to get up and go. :-(

****, that sucks. I hope you're taking anti-biotics. Get well soon.

On 5/28/2011 4:10 PM, G. Morgan wrote:
The Daring Dufas wrote:

I work in many different fields now to alleviate boredom. I can't hold a
regular job because of medial problems. My situation is such that I
don't have trouble finding work, I have trouble getting out of bed and
walking across the room. I'm trying to recover from the aftereffects of
serious bouts of pneumonia and there are days when I'm as weak as a
kitten. It really ****es me off to not be able to get up and go. :-(

****, that sucks. I hope you're taking anti-biotics. Get well soon.



I went through pills but Easter Sunday at 3:00am I coughed and something
tore, burst or ripped in my ribcage and by 5:00am I
got my roommate to drive me to the ER where I was admitted and
spent 3 days in the hospital on IV antibiotics and X-rays did
not show a pneumothorax or broken rib which can happen if you
hold your body just right and cough. I guess I tore a muscle in
my ribcage which has pretty much healed. The problem with all the
antibiotics is the fact that they killed all the good bugs in my
system and I had to down a gallon of yogurt to fix my guts and I
got a yeast infection in my throat and have medication for that.
It's a real bitch when you get so weak you can't keep your eyes
open and pass out in front of your computer.....................
.................................................. ...............
.................................................. ...............
I wake up a lot of times and find that my hand has been resting on
the space bar or a single letter which can fill up dozens of pages
or until the computer GRONKS. Darn it I got a lot of work to do
and just got off the phone with my buddy I do a lot of AC work with.
We have a 7.5 ton evaporator coil on the way that we have to change
out for a pharmacy and I desperately need my energy level to return
to normal or at least somewhat normal. :-(

TDD

The Daring Dufas wrote:

I wake up a lot of times and find that my hand has been resting on
the space bar or a single letter which can fill up dozens of pages
or until the computer GRONKS. Darn it I got a lot of work to do
and just got off the phone with my buddy I do a lot of AC work with.
We have a 7.5 ton evaporator coil on the way that we have to change
out for a pharmacy and I desperately need my energy level to return
to normal or at least somewhat normal. :-(

You may want to ask the doc. for a stimulant. If you fall asleep and
aspirate stuff from your mouth to the lungs you could be in a lot of
trouble.

http://www.cnn.com/2011/SHOWBIZ/cele...ex.html?hpt=T2

On 5/28/2011 7:05 PM, G. Morgan wrote:
The Daring Dufas wrote:

I wake up a lot of times and find that my hand has been resting on
the space bar or a single letter which can fill up dozens of pages
or until the computer GRONKS. Darn it I got a lot of work to do
and just got off the phone with my buddy I do a lot of AC work with.
We have a 7.5 ton evaporator coil on the way that we have to change
out for a pharmacy and I desperately need my energy level to return
to normal or at least somewhat normal. :-(

You may want to ask the doc. for a stimulant. If you fall asleep and
aspirate stuff from your mouth to the lungs you could be in a lot of
trouble.

http://www.cnn.com/2011/SHOWBIZ/cele...ex.html?hpt=T2


Oh man, I liked Jeff Conaway, he was in a lot of my favorite shows. I
made a trip to the pharmacy this afternoon and I stopped at the closest
convenience store to get the largest Monster Energy Drink on sale there
because I didn't want to pass out while driving. I despise taking drugs
and take as little as I can get away with except for the antibiotics
which I take on schedule until they're all gone. ^_^

TDD

On May 28, 6:08*pm, The Daring Dufas
wrote:
On 5/28/2011 7:05 PM, G. Morgan wrote:









The Daring Dufas wrote:

I wake up a lot of times and find that my hand has been resting on
the space bar or a single letter which can fill up dozens of pages
or until the computer GRONKS. Darn it I got a lot of work to do
and just got off the phone with my buddy I do a lot of AC work with.
We have a 7.5 ton evaporator coil on the way that we have to change
out for a pharmacy and I desperately need my energy level to return
to normal or at least somewhat normal. *:-(

You may want to ask the doc. for a stimulant. *If you fall asleep and
aspirate stuff from your mouth to the lungs you could be in a lot of
trouble.

http://www.cnn.com/2011/SHOWBIZ/cele...5/27/jeff.cona...

Oh man, I liked Jeff Conaway, he was in a lot of my favorite shows. I
made a trip to the pharmacy this afternoon and I stopped at the closest
convenience store to get the largest Monster Energy Drink on sale there
because I didn't want to pass out while driving. I despise taking drugs
and take as little as I can get away with except for the antibiotics
which I take on schedule until they're all gone. ^_^

TDD

This is an honest, non-hostile question. I hesitate to ask, given
your reported medical condition, but
couldn't a drink of orange juice have done as well as the "Monster
Energy Drink"? Based on what research I have done, those drinks are
loaded with empty calories and other "bad things", and count on macho
advertising to sell their wares. I share your displeasure at taking
drugs and avoid them whenever possible. Just had elective surgery for
a torn meniscus in the knee, and do take some **** for the pain, but
resent the hell out of it and hope it dies down soon.

Anyway, hope my q. was not objectionable, and wish you all the best
that SHE up there can provide.

HB

"The Daring Dufas" wrote in message
...
On 5/28/2011 7:05 PM, G. Morgan wrote:
The Daring Dufas wrote:

I wake up a lot of times and find that my hand has been resting on
the space bar or a single letter which can fill up dozens of pages
or until the computer GRONKS. Darn it I got a lot of work to do
and just got off the phone with my buddy I do a lot of AC work with.
We have a 7.5 ton evaporator coil on the way that we have to change
out for a pharmacy and I desperately need my energy level to return
to normal or at least somewhat normal. :-(

You may want to ask the doc. for a stimulant. If you fall asleep and
aspirate stuff from your mouth to the lungs you could be in a lot of
trouble.


http://www.cnn.com/2011/SHOWBIZ/cele...ex.html?hpt=T2


Oh man, I liked Jeff Conaway, he was in a lot of my favorite shows. I
made a trip to the pharmacy this afternoon and I stopped at the closest
convenience store to get the largest Monster Energy Drink on sale there
because I didn't want to pass out while driving. I despise taking drugs
and take as little as I can get away with except for the antibiotics
which I take on schedule until they're all gone. ^_^

TDD

If you snore (and living alone, that's often hard to tell - get a cheap tape
recorder to be sure) you've probably got sleep apnea. During the night,
your airway closes up and when the oxygen in your blood gets too low, you
wake up. This can happen 100's of times in an evening. Stimulants will
help, for a while, but eventually the nights of low oxygen sleep will get to
you. My boss had it and drove off the road into the side of a local high
school. Fortunately no one was injured, but he finally got to a sleep
specialist that put him on a polysomnograph and measured the times he woke
up from the mini-asphxiations. 141. His oxygen level dropped to near
critical levels as well. Sleep like that is almost like no sleep at all.
Some people actually go psychotic from the lack of sleep if it goes on long
enough.

The put him on a CPAP (forced air mask system that keeps your windpipe open
by pressurizing it) and he improved immediately. The people I know who've
had their apnea cured say it's like getting your life back. It's serious
business, Duf, get it checked out. The energy drinks are not the answer.
They are actually making your overall fatigue worse as they squeeze out
every bit of reserve power you have left.

--
Bobby G.

In article
,
Higgs Boson wrote:

This is an honest, non-hostile question. I hesitate to ask, given
your reported medical condition, but
couldn't a drink of orange juice have done as well as the "Monster
Energy Drink"? Based on what research I have done, those drinks are
loaded with empty calories and other "bad things", and count on macho
advertising to sell their wares.

Uh, they're loaded with caffeine, at a hefty price premium.

The Daring Dufas wrote:

Oh man, I liked Jeff Conaway, he was in a lot of my favorite shows. I
made a trip to the pharmacy this afternoon and I stopped at the closest
convenience store to get the largest Monster Energy Drink on sale there
because I didn't want to pass out while driving. I despise taking drugs
and take as little as I can get away with except for the antibiotics
which I take on schedule until they're all gone. ^_^

Dude, I think you should at least call the doctor and tell him/her the
symptoms. Monster is sugar and caffeine. Both hit quick, and crash
quick.

On 5/28/2011 8:46 PM, Higgs Boson wrote:
On May 28, 6:08 pm, The Daring
wrote:
On 5/28/2011 7:05 PM, G. Morgan wrote:









The Daring Dufas wrote:

I wake up a lot of times and find that my hand has been resting
on the space bar or a single letter which can fill up dozens of
pages or until the computer GRONKS. Darn it I got a lot of work
to do and just got off the phone with my buddy I do a lot of AC
work with. We have a 7.5 ton evaporator coil on the way that we
have to change out for a pharmacy and I desperately need my
energy level to return to normal or at least somewhat normal.
:-(

You may want to ask the doc. for a stimulant. If you fall asleep
and aspirate stuff from your mouth to the lungs you could be in a
lot of trouble.

http://www.cnn.com/2011/SHOWBIZ/cele...5/27/jeff.cona...



Oh man, I liked Jeff Conaway, he was in a lot of my favorite shows. I
made a trip to the pharmacy this afternoon and I stopped at the
closest convenience store to get the largest Monster Energy Drink
on sale there because I didn't want to pass out while driving. I
despise taking drugs and take as little as I can get away with
except for the antibiotics which I take on schedule until they're
all gone. ^_^

TDD

This is an honest, non-hostile question. I hesitate to ask, given
your reported medical condition, but couldn't a drink of orange juice
have done as well as the "Monster Energy Drink"? Based on what
research I have done, those drinks are loaded with empty calories and
other "bad things", and count on macho advertising to sell their
wares. I share your displeasure at taking drugs and avoid them
whenever possible. Just had elective surgery for a torn meniscus in
the knee, and do take some **** for the pain, but resent the hell out
of it and hope it dies down soon.

Anyway, hope my q. was not objectionable, and wish you all the best
that SHE up there can provide.

HB

Thanks for the question, I've never consumed an alcoholic beverage in my
life or taken an illegal or recreational drug either and all my fellow
hippies thought I was weird while I watched them bounce off walls and
hallucinate polka doted elephants lecturing them on politics. I saved
many of their lives just by being there and driving them home. Being a
science geek from a young age I've always wanted to know what, why, when
and what's in that. The Monster type energy drinks contain a lot of
caffeine, taurine, ginseng, guarana and B-Vitamins along with a lot of
sugar. I don't EVER drink more than one a day and may go months without
drinking one but if I feel I need a kick in the butt from legal
stimulants, I may consume an energy drink. I've never been a coffee
drinker but being a Southerner I did drink sweet iced tea until cutting
out a lot of sugar and switching to unsweetened tea and diet soft
drinks. I do not recommend anyone of any age to consume large amounts of
the potentially evil beverages. I have a friend who aggravated his
heart condition and landed in the hospital because he was drinking a lot
of those energy drinks to keep his energy level up. Drink Monster
Juice with caution. I hope your medical condition improves also because
nobody deserves to suffer that kind of pain. Believe me, as someone who
has lived with and ignored more pain than most folks can tolerate, I
know what pain is. :-)

TDD

On 5/28/2011 9:06 PM, Robert Green wrote:
"The Daring wrote in message
...
On 5/28/2011 7:05 PM, G. Morgan wrote:
The Daring Dufas wrote:

I wake up a lot of times and find that my hand has been resting on
the space bar or a single letter which can fill up dozens of pages
or until the computer GRONKS. Darn it I got a lot of work to do
and just got off the phone with my buddy I do a lot of AC work with.
We have a 7.5 ton evaporator coil on the way that we have to change
out for a pharmacy and I desperately need my energy level to return
to normal or at least somewhat normal. :-(

You may want to ask the doc. for a stimulant. If you fall asleep and
aspirate stuff from your mouth to the lungs you could be in a lot of
trouble.


http://www.cnn.com/2011/SHOWBIZ/cele...ex.html?hpt=T2


Oh man, I liked Jeff Conaway, he was in a lot of my favorite shows. I
made a trip to the pharmacy this afternoon and I stopped at the closest
convenience store to get the largest Monster Energy Drink on sale there
because I didn't want to pass out while driving. I despise taking drugs
and take as little as I can get away with except for the antibiotics
which I take on schedule until they're all gone. ^_^

TDD

If you snore (and living alone, that's often hard to tell - get a cheap tape
recorder to be sure) you've probably got sleep apnea. During the night,
your airway closes up and when the oxygen in your blood gets too low, you
wake up. This can happen 100's of times in an evening. Stimulants will
help, for a while, but eventually the nights of low oxygen sleep will get to
you. My boss had it and drove off the road into the side of a local high
school. Fortunately no one was injured, but he finally got to a sleep
specialist that put him on a polysomnograph and measured the times he woke
up from the mini-asphxiations. 141. His oxygen level dropped to near
critical levels as well. Sleep like that is almost like no sleep at all.
Some people actually go psychotic from the lack of sleep if it goes on long
enough.

The put him on a CPAP (forced air mask system that keeps your windpipe open
by pressurizing it) and he improved immediately. The people I know who've
had their apnea cured say it's like getting your life back. It's serious
business, Duf, get it checked out. The energy drinks are not the answer.
They are actually making your overall fatigue worse as they squeeze out
every bit of reserve power you have left.

--
Bobby G.



Thanks Robert, I don't snore unless I'm in the wrong sleeping position
and I can tell because my mouth will be dry when I wake. My lack of
sleep I'm now suffering from is due to the respiratory problems I've
had as of late. When I was in the hospital, the doctors changed some of
my medication and I felt like I was drowning because I could get no air.
It turned out I had fluid in my lungs so I was given Lasix intravenously
and I peed out two gallon in a hour and could breath again. I may have
to get on a steroid nasal spray because I'll wake in
the middle of the night because my sinuses close up. I've always had
trouble breathing thanks to those adults who exposed me to tobacco smoke
from the time I was in the womb. I can't hate them for it because they
didn't know any better back in the middle of the last century. I sure
can resent it though. Nowadays there is no excuse to expose children to
that sort of pollution because no one, not even the dumbest of people,
can claim ignorance. Tobacco smoke is like tear gas to me. :-)

TDD

On 5/28/2011 9:47 PM, G. Morgan wrote:
The Daring Dufas wrote:

Oh man, I liked Jeff Conaway, he was in a lot of my favorite shows. I
made a trip to the pharmacy this afternoon and I stopped at the closest
convenience store to get the largest Monster Energy Drink on sale there
because I didn't want to pass out while driving. I despise taking drugs
and take as little as I can get away with except for the antibiotics
which I take on schedule until they're all gone. ^_^

Dude, I think you should at least call the doctor and tell him/her the
symptoms. Monster is sugar and caffeine. Both hit quick, and crash
quick.


I have to go see my doctor friend who helps me out since I keep his
20 year old ultrasound machine working and build his computers for him.

TDD

From what I've read, you have more than your share of
medical problems. Best wishes you get some energy back.

I've been slowly healing from a pinched nerve. My right arm
still doesn't work quite right. I've had plenty of work,
fortunately.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in
message ...

I went through pills but Easter Sunday at 3:00am I coughed
and something
tore, burst or ripped in my ribcage and by 5:00am I
got my roommate to drive me to the ER where I was admitted
and
spent 3 days in the hospital on IV antibiotics and X-rays
did
not show a pneumothorax or broken rib which can happen if
you
hold your body just right and cough. I guess I tore a muscle
in
my ribcage which has pretty much healed. The problem with
all the
antibiotics is the fact that they killed all the good bugs
in my
system and I had to down a gallon of yogurt to fix my guts
and I
got a yeast infection in my throat and have medication for
that.
It's a real bitch when you get so weak you can't keep your
eyes
open and pass out in front of your
computer.....................
.................................................. ...............
.................................................. ...............
I wake up a lot of times and find that my hand has been
resting on
the space bar or a single letter which can fill up dozens of
pages
or until the computer GRONKS. Darn it I got a lot of work to
do
and just got off the phone with my buddy I do a lot of AC
work with.
We have a 7.5 ton evaporator coil on the way that we have to
change
out for a pharmacy and I desperately need my energy level to
return
to normal or at least somewhat normal. :-(

TDD

When I was a kid, my grand parents used to live on pills. I
resolved not to get like that. And now, I am like that.

The LDS church has spoken out against "energy drinks".
However, it sounds like they are less dangerous than crash
and burn. I do carry Nodoz in both vehicles, and in my bug
out bags. Once every couple weeks I take one, figuring it's
safer than falling asleep while driving.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in
message ...

Oh man, I liked Jeff Conaway, he was in a lot of my favorite
shows. I
made a trip to the pharmacy this afternoon and I stopped at
the closest
convenience store to get the largest Monster Energy Drink on
sale there
because I didn't want to pass out while driving. I despise
taking drugs
and take as little as I can get away with except for the
antibiotics
which I take on schedule until they're all gone. ^_^

TDD

It is interesting quetion. I'm guessing TDD has tried
various things.

As to the energy drinks, the church has found they get
addictive. After the lift is the crash, and so people "need"
another cause they are crashing.

My very occasional Nodoz, I call "sleep later pills". I will
sleep; but not now. Later in the evening I'll go to bed.
Also, in addition to going to bed later, I will arise later
in the AM.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Higgs Boson" wrote in message
...

This is an honest, non-hostile question. I hesitate to ask,
given
your reported medical condition, but
couldn't a drink of orange juice have done as well as the
"Monster
Energy Drink"? Based on what research I have done, those
drinks are
loaded with empty calories and other "bad things", and count
on macho
advertising to sell their wares. I share your displeasure
at taking
drugs and avoid them whenever possible. Just had elective
surgery for
a torn meniscus in the knee, and do take some **** for the
pain, but
resent the hell out of it and hope it dies down soon.

Anyway, hope my q. was not objectionable, and wish you all
the best
that SHE up there can provide.

HB

Sounds a bit like me, the occasional stimulant for a
specific situation.

Do you ever notice people are uncomfortable drinking around
someone who is sober? Or, swearing and cursing around
someone who doesn't curse?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas"
wrote in message ...

Thanks for the question, I've never consumed an alcoholic
beverage in my
life or taken an illegal or recreational drug either and all
my fellow
hippies thought I was weird while I watched them bounce off
walls and
hallucinate polka doted elephants lecturing them on
politics. I saved
many of their lives just by being there and driving them
home. Being a
science geek from a young age I've always wanted to know
what, why, when
and what's in that. The Monster type energy drinks contain a
lot of
caffeine, taurine, ginseng, guarana and B-Vitamins along
with a lot of
sugar. I don't EVER drink more than one a day and may go
months without
drinking one but if I feel I need a kick in the butt from
legal
stimulants, I may consume an energy drink. I've never been a
coffee
drinker but being a Southerner I did drink sweet iced tea
until cutting
out a lot of sugar and switching to unsweetened tea and diet
soft
drinks. I do not recommend anyone of any age to consume
large amounts of
the potentially evil beverages. I have a friend who
aggravated his
heart condition and landed in the hospital because he was
drinking a lot
of those energy drinks to keep his energy level up. Drink
Monster
Juice with caution. I hope your medical condition improves
also because
nobody deserves to suffer that kind of pain. Believe me, as
someone who
has lived with and ignored more pain than most folks can
tolerate, I
know what pain is. :-)

TDD

My parents both used to smoke. And I've got the list of
medical problems to show for it. Like you say; back then no
one gave it much thought.

Medical care is interesting. Glad you were able to drain
your lungs.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in
message ...

Thanks Robert, I don't snore unless I'm in the wrong
sleeping position
and I can tell because my mouth will be dry when I wake. My
lack of
sleep I'm now suffering from is due to the respiratory
problems I've
had as of late. When I was in the hospital, the doctors
changed some of
my medication and I felt like I was drowning because I could
get no air.
It turned out I had fluid in my lungs so I was given Lasix
intravenously
and I peed out two gallon in a hour and could breath again.
I may have
to get on a steroid nasal spray because I'll wake in
the middle of the night because my sinuses close up. I've
always had
trouble breathing thanks to those adults who exposed me to
tobacco smoke
from the time I was in the womb. I can't hate them for it
because they
didn't know any better back in the middle of the last
century. I sure
can resent it though. Nowadays there is no excuse to expose
children to
that sort of pollution because no one, not even the dumbest
of people,
can claim ignorance. Tobacco smoke is like tear gas to me.
:-)

TDD