The LDS churchhas never spoken on caffeine. Many years ago,
it prohibited "hot drinks" which was later ruled to be tea
and coffee.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"G. Morgan" wrote in message
...
Stormin Mormon wrote:

As to the energy drinks, the church has found they get
addictive. After the lift is the crash, and so people
"need"
another cause they are crashing.

Your church says the same about caffeine, NoDoz has
caffeine.

So, does this mean you're going to hell with all the other
non-Mormon's?

On 5/29/2011 5:20 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
The LDS churchhas never spoken on caffeine. Many years ago,
it prohibited "hot drinks" which was later ruled to be tea
and coffee.

Where's the prohibition on cola soft drinks come from then?

--

I've been LDS for 20+ years, and carry a current temple
reccomend. Every leader I've talked to says cola / sodas are
personal choice. That cola / soda pop is not prohibited. I'm
quite fond of generic diet cola. Stars and Stripes brand
from Dollar Tree.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"dpb" wrote in message
...
On 5/29/2011 5:20 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
The LDS churchhas never spoken on caffeine. Many years
ago,
it prohibited "hot drinks" which was later ruled to be tea
and coffee.

Where's the prohibition on cola soft drinks come from then?

--

On 5/30/2011 6:45 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
I've been LDS for 20+ years, and carry a current temple
reccomend. Every leader I've talked to says cola / sodas are
personal choice. That cola / soda pop is not prohibited. I'm
quite fond of generic diet cola. Stars and Stripes brand
from Dollar Tree.

The "word" based on what I could find at the lds.org site seems to be
based on the "commonsense" definition of what's good/bad for the body
(which somewhat surprised me; from what had been told by those w/ whom
had most contact I thought there was a specific prohibition on caffeine).

That being so, there's an apparent contradiction on the "hot drinks" of
the original proscription being coffee and tea since both (and
especially the latter) are often served cold in which case the original
wouldn't seem quite accurate.

OTOH, given the apparent recasting, what about the recent studies that
indicate there are actually beneficial results from coffee on various
onset rates for disease? That would seem to lift the "ban"...

Ah, what tangled web we weave...

On a side note, grandfather was raised in LDS, when married she was from
Irish Roman Catholic branch. Neither having a congregation where
settled in SW KS, they "compromised" and raised all the kids as
Methodists.

--

Sounds like an interesting compromise. At least they are
Christians. Are Methodists Christian?

I don't totally understand the word of wisdom. I don't much
worry about it, someday will be explained to me. Studies
come and go. Some studies may say coffee is benficial, but I
have more trust in the word of the Lord on the matter.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"dpb" wrote in message
...
On 5/30/2011 6:45 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
I've been LDS for 20+ years, and carry a current temple
reccomend. Every leader I've talked to says cola / sodas
are
personal choice. That cola / soda pop is not prohibited.
I'm
quite fond of generic diet cola. Stars and Stripes brand
from Dollar Tree.

The "word" based on what I could find at the lds.org site
seems to be
based on the "commonsense" definition of what's good/bad for
the body
(which somewhat surprised me; from what had been told by
those w/ whom
had most contact I thought there was a specific prohibition
on caffeine).

That being so, there's an apparent contradiction on the "hot
drinks" of
the original proscription being coffee and tea since both
(and
especially the latter) are often served cold in which case
the original
wouldn't seem quite accurate.

OTOH, given the apparent recasting, what about the recent
studies that
indicate there are actually beneficial results from coffee
on various
onset rates for disease? That would seem to lift the
"ban"...

Ah, what tangled web we weave...

On a side note, grandfather was raised in LDS, when married
she was from
Irish Roman Catholic branch. Neither having a congregation
where
settled in SW KS, they "compromised" and raised all the kids
as
Methodists.

--

In article ,
"Stormin Mormon" wrote:

Some studies may say coffee is benficial, but I
have more trust in the word of the Lord on the matter.

good lord. I'm gonna pretend you were joking, otherwise I'd have to send
the men in the white coats for you.

On 5/30/2011 8:58 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
Sounds like an interesting compromise. At least they are
Christians. Are Methodists Christian?

I'll leave that for you to determine...

I don't totally understand the word of wisdom. I don't much
worry about it, someday will be explained to me. Studies
come and go. Some studies may say coffee is benficial, but I
have more trust in the word of the Lord on the matter.

AFAIK, He said nothing about it...

--

Stormin Mormon wrote:

Are Methodists Christian?

Wow... You don't know much about religion do you? Yes, the Methodists
were Christian long before Joe Smith had his hallucination.

Some studies may say coffee is benficial, but I
have more trust in the word of the Lord on the matter.

It's no ****ing wonder our nation is in so much trouble. Seems like
most folk, like yourself, just woke up one day and decided to stop
thinking for yourselves.

G. Morgan wrote:

Your church says the same about caffeine, NoDoz has caffeine.

So, does this mean you're going to hell with all the other non-Mormon's?

Looks like I hit a nerve. Why was this emailed and not posted to the
group?


From: JimT
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17)
Gecko/20110414 Thunderbird/3.1.10
MIME-Version: 1.0
To:
Subject: Alarm System Contacts/ monster drinks
References:










In-Reply-To:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

On 5/29/2011 2:00 PM, G. Morgan wrote:
Stormin Mormon wrote:

As to the energy drinks, the church has found they get
addictive. After the lift is the crash, and so people "need"
another cause they are crashing.
Your church says the same about caffeine, NoDoz has caffeine.

So, does this mean you're going to hell with all the other non-Mormon's

The Mormons are the only ones allowed in Heaven.

Jim

On 5/30/2011 9:23 AM, Smitty Two wrote:
In ,
"Stormin wrote:

Some studies may say coffee is benficial, but I
have more trust in the word of the Lord on the matter.

good lord. I'm gonna pretend you were joking, otherwise I'd have to send
the men in the white coats for you.

Will they have caffeine dart guns? ^_^

TDD

Well, of course, you have to be listening, and know where to
listen.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"dpb" wrote in message
...

come and go. Some studies may say coffee is benficial, but
I
have more trust in the word of the Lord on the matter.

AFAIK, He said nothing about it...

People ask if the Church of Jesus Christ is Christian. I
return the courtesy.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"G. Morgan" wrote in message
...
Stormin Mormon wrote:

Are Methodists Christian?

Wow... You don't know much about religion do you? Yes, the
Methodists
were Christian long before Joe Smith had his hallucination.

Some studies may say coffee is benficial, but I
have more trust in the word of the Lord on the matter.

It's no wonder our nation is in so much trouble. Seems like
most folk, like yourself, just woke up one day and decided
to stop
thinking for yourselves.

On Mon, 30 May 2011 18:40:28 -0500, wrote:

On Sun, 29 May 2011 08:36:20 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

Do you ever notice people are uncomfortable drinking around
someone who is sober? Or, swearing and cursing around
someone who doesn't curse?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

I'm uncomfortable around people who spam the internet with their
religious beliefs.

You being uncomfortable does nothing to his Constitutional rights. The word
of the day is "tough".

There's a place to dicuss religion, it's called a
church.

You can leave anytime you want.

Leave it there.

Leave here. Now.

On 5/30/2011 8:05 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
Well, of course, you have to be listening, and know where to
listen.

Or, in this case, more specifically, listen to somebody who says _they_
have the inside poop methinks...

--

On 5/30/2011 8:06 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
People ask if the Church of Jesus Christ is Christian. I
return the courtesy.

Depending on who you ask, the answer isn't always the same, though, is
it?

--

On Mon, 30 May 2011 20:20:56 -0500, dpb wrote:

On 5/30/2011 8:06 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
People ask if the Church of Jesus Christ is Christian. I
return the courtesy.

Depending on who you ask, the answer isn't always the same, though, is
it?

Nope. Ask my wife if the Methodist Church is Christian and you'll likely not
get the answer you expect either. ;-)

Stormin Mormon wrote:

People ask if the Church of Jesus Christ is Christian. I
return the courtesy.

I hope you tell the truth and tell them it's really a kludged together
*******ization of Christianity.


Wiki:
"Under the doctrine of continuing revelation, Latter-day Saints believe
that Jesus leads the church by revealing his will to its President, whom
adherents regard as a modern-day "prophet, seer, and revelator." The
current President is Thomas S. Monson. "

To subscribe to that faith one would have to believe the "boss" of the
church has a direct hotline to God. No one else, only the
"President"...(are you sure you're just not running a corporation?) gets
to tell his minions what God wants them to do. Nice little cult you
have there, I rank it right up there with Scientology. Both need to
have their tax-exempt status revoked. It's all about the $$$$, right?
That's why you force your children out in pairs to 'convert' people by
knocking on my door all the time. Selling religion, what a concept.

I politely tell your missionaries I'm Jewish and close the door. They
have not come up with a good come-back to that one (yet), it's probably
being worked on in the sales dept. as we type.

--

~G (not Jewish or member of any organized 'religion, but I've studied
most... including your sub-sect.)

On 5/30/2011 8:44 PM, zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
On Mon, 30 May 2011 20:20:56 -0500, wrote:

On 5/30/2011 8:06 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
People ask if the Church of Jesus Christ is Christian. I
return the courtesy.

Depending on who you ask, the answer isn't always the same, though, is
it?

Nope. Ask my wife if the Methodist Church is Christian and you'll likely not
get the answer you expect either. ;-)

I don't expect any specific answer...it's all anybody chooses...

But "official" doctrine is pretty mainstream Protestant, very little
substantive difference in core w/ virtually any of other major
denominations. Somewhat different in the social field, though, as
result of the Wesley tradition.

--

On Mon, 30 May 2011 23:14:44 -0500, dpb wrote:

On 5/30/2011 8:44 PM, zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
On Mon, 30 May 2011 20:20:56 -0500, wrote:

On 5/30/2011 8:06 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
People ask if the Church of Jesus Christ is Christian. I
return the courtesy.

Depending on who you ask, the answer isn't always the same, though, is
it?

Nope. Ask my wife if the Methodist Church is Christian and you'll likely not
get the answer you expect either. ;-)

I don't expect any specific answer...it's all anybody chooses...

But "official" doctrine is pretty mainstream Protestant, very little
substantive difference in core w/ virtually any of other major
denominations. Somewhat different in the social field, though, as
result of the Wesley tradition.

I understand all the ancient history. The more recent history of the church,
or at least portions thereof, are suspect.

On Mon, 30 May 2011 23:00:06 -0500, G. Morgan wrote:

Stormin Mormon wrote:

People ask if the Church of Jesus Christ is Christian. I
return the courtesy.

I hope you tell the truth and tell them it's really a kludged together
*******ization of Christianity.


Wiki:
"Under the doctrine of continuing revelation, Latter-day Saints believe
that Jesus leads the church by revealing his will to its President, whom
adherents regard as a modern-day "prophet, seer, and revelator." The
current President is Thomas S. Monson. "

To subscribe to that faith one would have to believe the "boss" of the
church has a direct hotline to God.

You mean, like the Pope?

No one else, only the
"President"...(are you sure you're just not running a corporation?) gets
to tell his minions what God wants them to do. Nice little cult you
have there, I rank it right up there with Scientology. Both need to
have their tax-exempt status revoked. It's all about the $$$$, right?
That's why you force your children out in pairs to 'convert' people by
knocking on my door all the time. Selling religion, what a concept.

You mean like the Catholic Church?

I politely tell your missionaries I'm Jewish and close the door. They
have not come up with a good come-back to that one (yet), it's probably
being worked on in the sales dept. as we type.

Whatever you do, don't tell them you're a Druid!

zzzzzzzzzz wrote:

You mean, like the Pope?

Yup, isn't he an ex-Nazi?

You mean like the Catholic Church?

Yup.

I politely tell your missionaries I'm Jewish and close the door. They
have not come up with a good come-back to that one (yet), it's probably
being worked on in the sales dept. as we type.

Whatever you do, don't tell them you're a Druid!

Oh, good one! I think I'm gonna go with "Pagan" next time.

G. Morgan wrote:

To subscribe to that faith one would have to believe the "boss" of the
church has a direct hotline to God. No one else, only the
"President"...(are you sure you're just not running a corporation?)
gets to tell his minions what God wants them to do. Nice little cult
you have there, I rank it right up there with Scientology. Both need
to have their tax-exempt status revoked. It's all about the $$$$,
right? That's why you force your children out in pairs to 'convert'
people by knocking on my door all the time. Selling religion, what a
concept.

Most Christians harken to the dogma that the leader of the Church is God's
agent on earth ("Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth
shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be
loosed in heaven." Matt 18:18).

There are more Catholics in Mexico City today than Baptists who have ever
lived.


I politely tell your missionaries I'm Jewish and close the door. They
have not come up with a good come-back to that one (yet), it's
probably being worked on in the sales dept. as we type.

That's odd... Mormons hold that they ARE Jewish - and they want all Jews to
become Mormons.

On 5/30/2011 11:25 PM, zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
....

I understand all the ancient history. The more recent history of the church,
or at least portions thereof, are suspect.

Allusion too obtuse; whatever you're after, I don't grok...

--

I do get personal revelation through the Spirit. More than
once, I've gotten the straight poop in my ear.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"dpb" wrote in message
...
On 5/30/2011 8:05 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
Well, of course, you have to be listening, and know where
to
listen.

Or, in this case, more specifically, listen to somebody who
says _they_
have the inside poop methinks...

Which is why I ask, the answers are generally ammusing.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"dpb" wrote in message
...
On 5/30/2011 8:06 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
People ask if the Church of Jesus Christ is Christian. I
return the courtesy.

Depending on who you ask, the answer isn't always the same,
though, is
it?

--

And, what would she say?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


wrote in message
...

Nope. Ask my wife if the Methodist Church is Christian and
you'll likely not
get the answer you expect either. ;-)

You should invite the missionaries in, some time. Might
learn what Mormons really believe. Could be inspirational.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"G. Morgan" wrote in message
...
Stormin Mormon wrote:

People ask if the Church of Jesus Christ is Christian. I
return the courtesy.

I hope you tell the truth and tell them it's really a
kludged together
*******ization of Christianity.


Wiki:
"Under the doctrine of continuing revelation, Latter-day
Saints believe
that Jesus leads the church by revealing his will to its
President, whom
adherents regard as a modern-day "prophet, seer, and
revelator." The
current President is Thomas S. Monson. "

To subscribe to that faith one would have to believe the
"boss" of the
church has a direct hotline to God. No one else, only the
"President"...(are you sure you're just not running a
corporation?) gets
to tell his minions what God wants them to do. Nice little
cult you
have there, I rank it right up there with Scientology. Both
need to
have their tax-exempt status revoked. It's all about the
$$$$, right?
That's why you force your children out in pairs to 'convert'
people by
knocking on my door all the time. Selling religion, what a
concept.

I politely tell your missionaries I'm Jewish and close the
door. They
have not come up with a good come-back to that one (yet),
it's probably
being worked on in the sales dept. as we type.

--

~G (not Jewish or member of any organized 'religion, but
I've studied
most... including your sub-sect.)

The "bind on Earth" quote refers to the sealing ordinances
of the temple.

Jews are the tribe of Judah. I don't think many Mormons from
that tribe.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"HeyBub" wrote in message
m...

Most Christians harken to the dogma that the leader of the
Church is God's
agent on earth ("Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall
bind on earth
shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on
earth shall be
loosed in heaven." Matt 18:18).

There are more Catholics in Mexico City today than Baptists
who have ever
lived.


I politely tell your missionaries I'm Jewish and close the
door. They
have not come up with a good come-back to that one (yet),
it's
probably being worked on in the sales dept. as we type.

That's odd... Mormons hold that they ARE Jewish - and they
want all Jews to
become Mormons.

Stormin Mormon wrote:

You should invite the missionaries in, some time. Might
learn what Mormons really believe. Could be inspirational.

I know all about it, I had a friend who was brainwashed as a child. He
told me more about your "church" than any of your door-to-door
missionaries even know.

I know the "official" version, and the real deal.

I suspect you are not an 'elder', thus not privy to the financial goals
of the corp.

Stormin Mormon wrote:

You should invite the missionaries in, some time. Might
learn what Mormons really believe. Could be inspirational.

One more thing....

Is that all you have to say after I ripped your whole belief system
apart?

Stormin Mormon wrote:

More than
once, I've gotten the straight poop in my ear.

psst....

The poop was from a bull.

On Tue, 31 May 2011 08:17:40 -0500, dpb wrote:

On 5/30/2011 11:25 PM, zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
...

I understand all the ancient history. The more recent history of the church,
or at least portions thereof, are suspect.

Allusion too obtuse; whatever you're after, I don't grok...

Liberalization. Going away from the teachings of Christ. New age
gobbledygook. That's why she left the Methodists; they left her first.

On Tue, 31 May 2011 00:06:47 -0500, G. Morgan wrote:

wrote:

You mean, like the Pope?

Yup, isn't he an ex-Nazi?

You mean like the Catholic Church?

Yup.

I politely tell your missionaries I'm Jewish and close the door. They
have not come up with a good come-back to that one (yet), it's probably
being worked on in the sales dept. as we type.

Whatever you do, don't tell them you're a Druid!

Oh, good one! I think I'm gonna go with "Pagan" next time.

Don't do it! A friend made that mistake when they woke him up the morning
after a college finals bender. He became their personal mission. He *had* to
be saved.

On 5/31/2011 6:24 PM, zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
On Tue, 31 May 2011 00:06:47 -0500, G. wrote:

zzzzzzzzzz wrote:

You mean, like the Pope?

Yup, isn't he an ex-Nazi?

You mean like the Catholic Church?

Yup.

I politely tell your missionaries I'm Jewish and close the door. They
have not come up with a good come-back to that one (yet), it's probably
being worked on in the sales dept. as we type.

Whatever you do, don't tell them you're a Druid!

Oh, good one! I think I'm gonna go with "Pagan" next time.

Don't do it! A friend made that mistake when they woke him up the morning
after a college finals bender. He became their personal mission. He *had* to
be saved.


I used to have a black cape and headdress with horns and I would greet
them at the door and ask them if they were virgins because we needed a
sacrifice for our Satan worship session. ^_^

TDD

On 5/31/2011 6:20 PM, zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
On Tue, 31 May 2011 08:17:40 -0500, wrote:

On 5/30/2011 11:25 PM, zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
...

I understand all the ancient history. The more recent history of the church,
or at least portions thereof, are suspect.

Allusion too obtuse; whatever you're after, I don't grok...

Liberalization. Going away from the teachings of Christ. New age
gobbledygook. That's why she left the Methodists; they left her first.

Well, not sure there's a real departure there or not...Christ was a
pretty radical kinda' guy at the time...

I'm only slightly to the right of Genghis Khan as the saying goes, and
don't care that much about the central office direction either but out
here in the hinterlands individual congregations pretty much go their
own way; one of the features of the Methodist organization is that there
isn't a great deal of requirement for strict conformance to some set of
initiatives.

AFAIK, the official doctrine hasn't actually been changed much (altho I
don't go and read it regularly).

But, as I said earlier, everybody has to have their own interpretation
and do what they think bestest...I'm too traditionalist to bother to go
find somewhere different so just keep on keepin' on at same ol' place
where went as a kid since came back home after 30 year hiatus. Of
course, stuff has changed here demographically to the point that it's
now minority majority and the congregation is dwindling owing to simply
a reduction in the candidate population. I suppose it'll probably about
last my duration altho the smaller second congregation closed their
doors earlier this summer.

--

On Tue, 31 May 2011 18:35:40 -0500, dpb wrote:

On 5/31/2011 6:20 PM, zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
On Tue, 31 May 2011 08:17:40 -0500, wrote:

On 5/30/2011 11:25 PM, zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
...

I understand all the ancient history. The more recent history of the church,
or at least portions thereof, are suspect.

Allusion too obtuse; whatever you're after, I don't grok...

Liberalization. Going away from the teachings of Christ. New age
gobbledygook. That's why she left the Methodists; they left her first.

Well, not sure there's a real departure there or not...Christ was a
pretty radical kinda' guy at the time...

"Radical" isn't a constant. Obummer calls Repubicans radicals.

I'm only slightly to the right of Genghis Khan as the saying goes, and
don't care that much about the central office direction either but out
here in the hinterlands individual congregations pretty much go their
own way; one of the features of the Methodist organization is that there
isn't a great deal of requirement for strict conformance to some set of
initiatives.

They don't in the East. It's their way or the highway. She chose the latter,
as did a rather large percentage of the congregation.

AFAIK, the official doctrine hasn't actually been changed much (altho I
don't go and read it regularly).

It is a regional thing, sure, but the central church allows it. She went from
there to a rather large congregational church (held five services on Sunday,
two in a movie theater, complete with popcorn and coffee , then to S.
Babtist (where she was brought up) after we moved to the South.

But, as I said earlier, everybody has to have their own interpretation
and do what they think bestest...I'm too traditionalist to bother to go
find somewhere different so just keep on keepin' on at same ol' place
where went as a kid since came back home after 30 year hiatus. Of
course, stuff has changed here demographically to the point that it's
now minority majority and the congregation is dwindling owing to simply
a reduction in the candidate population. I suppose it'll probably about
last my duration altho the smaller second congregation closed their
doors earlier this summer.

On 5/31/2011 6:54 PM, zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
On Tue, 31 May 2011 18:35:40 -0500, wrote:
....

... one of the features of the Methodist organization is that there
isn't a great deal of requirement for strict conformance to some set of
initiatives.

They don't in the East. It's their way or the highway. She chose the latter,
as did a rather large percentage of the congregation.

AFAIK, the official doctrine hasn't actually been changed much (altho I
don't go and read it regularly).

It is a regional thing, sure, but the central church allows it. She went from
there to a rather large congregational church (held five services on Sunday,
two in a movie theater, complete with popcorn and coffee , then to S.
Babtist (where she was brought up) after we moved to the South.

Well, I can't imagine a serious S Baptist _ever_ agreeing w/ Methodist
doctrine to begin with, but... (I certainly don't much cotton to
some of their precepts from the other direction so it's pretty much a
dead heat )

That description sounds like a particular congregational thing as much
or more the entire denomination's change in actual doctrine. Since
pastors are assigned by Conference; all it takes is a new man in charge
and a congregation can have a different flavor the next week after the
previous has left. That has the potential to upset the traditional in
both directions.

As noted previously, I don't believe there's much change in actual
theology as stated in the official doctrine since the time of the Wesleys.

The rest is simply trappings around the basic beliefs; there were
probably other UMC congregations in the area that were much more
traditional at the time if it was a sizable metro area.

But, need to retire from this; this is just _way_ too far off topic,
even for a reasoned-tone discussion....

--

That's a typical thing people say. Some how you know more
about my church than I do.

Yes, I'm an Elder, and have been so for many years.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"G. Morgan" wrote in message
...
Stormin Mormon wrote:

You should invite the missionaries in, some time. Might
learn what Mormons really believe. Could be inspirational.

I know all about it, I had a friend who was brainwashed as a
child. He
told me more about your "church" than any of your
door-to-door
missionaries even know.

I know the "official" version, and the real deal.

I suspect you are not an 'elder', thus not privy to the
financial goals
of the corp.

You were so totally wrong, I thought it was coureous to
invite you to be less wrong.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"G. Morgan" wrote in message
...
Stormin Mormon wrote:

You should invite the missionaries in, some time. Might
learn what Mormons really believe. Could be inspirational.

One more thing....

Is that all you have to say after I ripped your whole belief
system
apart?

On Tue, 31 May 2011 19:21:44 -0500, dpb wrote:

On 5/31/2011 6:54 PM, zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
On Tue, 31 May 2011 18:35:40 -0500, wrote:
...

... one of the features of the Methodist organization is that there
isn't a great deal of requirement for strict conformance to some set of
initiatives.

They don't in the East. It's their way or the highway. She chose the latter,
as did a rather large percentage of the congregation.

AFAIK, the official doctrine hasn't actually been changed much (altho I
don't go and read it regularly).

It is a regional thing, sure, but the central church allows it. She went from
there to a rather large congregational church (held five services on Sunday,
two in a movie theater, complete with popcorn and coffee , then to S.
Babtist (where she was brought up) after we moved to the South.

Well, I can't imagine a serious S Baptist _ever_ agreeing w/ Methodist
doctrine to begin with, but... (I certainly don't much cotton to
some of their precepts from the other direction so it's pretty much a
dead heat )

She was a SB when she was a kid, living in Texas, then again after forty
years, after moving back South. No, the Methodist church she was a member of
did a hard left turn, after most of the congregation made it perfectly clear
they wanted to go "straight".

That description sounds like a particular congregational thing as much
or more the entire denomination's change in actual doctrine. Since
pastors are assigned by Conference; all it takes is a new man in charge
and a congregation can have a different flavor the next week after the
previous has left. That has the potential to upset the traditional in
both directions.

Yes, the congregation had *no* choice. She, and many in the congregation
showed them that, yes, they did have a choice.

As noted previously, I don't believe there's much change in actual
theology as stated in the official doctrine since the time of the Wesleys.

Theology without practice isn't worth much. She didn't join a Unitarian
Universalists church (which, we got married in, BTW) but she might just as
well have, after the shift.

The rest is simply trappings around the basic beliefs; there were
probably other UMC congregations in the area that were much more
traditional at the time if it was a sizable metro area.

Nope. She *was* at one of the more conservative of the churches but it was
under new management. Since there is no input from the congregation, she and
a *bunch* of others left.

But, need to retire from this; this is just _way_ too far off topic,
even for a reasoned-tone discussion....

You've *got* to be kidding. ;-)