Steve wrote:


My work is aboard the International Space Station, while yours is
rusting in moldy basements, and your industry has a reputation worse
that TV repairmen used to.

I am not a rocket surgen, but my company has been working for excellence for
many years. I am *not* "billy-joe-jim-bob". Yes there are a lot of hacks out
there, but there are some true professionals out there too. I keep trying to
help change the rep that HVAC industry has, and raise the bar in my area.
FWIW, my company has all but stopped advertising in the yellow pages, it
doesn't need to. 90% of our new customers are all from word of mouth
referals.


After I left the US Army, I started an Industrial Electronics repair
business. I never had a sign on the business, or even a listed
telephone number. I also did all the electronic repair for three school
systems. The only time they asked for a price up front was when they
needed new equipment. The rest of the time, the principals called me,
and at the end of the month I billed the school systems. When I
started, some customers had piles of 'unreparible' equipment that took
six months to two years to get back from their previous contractor. I
fixed all of it.


Someone really needs to clean up that industry, and I wish you luck.
A lot of companies around here were hiring anyone with a valid driver's
license. They don't care about their reputation, or their customers.
Some operate under five or more business names, so when they screw a
customer, they end up calling the same people.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

The Daring Dufas wrote:

On 9/22/2010 9:23 PM, Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
fired this volley in news:i7e9b9$sui$1
@news.eternal-september.org:

What is *YOUR* vocation?? hmm??

I design pyrotechnic effects for the stage trade, sell them to people who
ASK for them, and do NOT bilk people by telling them the effect they
bought for $60.00 two years ago needs to be replaced by a $6,000.00 "new
technology" replacement, or their family will die from CO poisoning.

Instead, if the effect they bought doesn't work right, I replace it for
free -- including shipping.

And y'know what? Nobody who's ever dealt with our company thinks we're
dishonest -- not even the ones who don't prefer ours over another brand.
Why? 1) We've never, ever cheated anyone. 2) We bend over backwards to
save our customers money, instead of pushing more and more stuff down
their throats. The result is, the sales we might have "lost" by not
pushing hard, we gain back in new business by happy referrals.

I can't even think five times when an HVAC guy actually fixed something
that I was happy about it. They overcharge, they seldom fix the problem
on the first try, and always say "the other part won't be in 'til next
Tuesday", they have a cartel/monopoly subsidized by our government, and
they mostly don't know what they're doing.

Now... How are you crooks?

First of all, I can't speak to whether or not you personally are one.
But the company you keep paints you with a broad brush. MOST of the HVAC
"repair" companies in Central Florida have so many black marks against
them with BBB, Florida Department of Law Enforcement, and various
"investigative journalists" that it's as likely to find an honest one as
to win the lottery.

They even go so far as to sabotage units so they can declare them junk
and coerce the customer into a replacement.

THAT's how "you" are crooks. I never said, "All reefer guys are crooks."

LLoyd



I wanna blow stuff up too! Pleeeez! Meeeee Toooooo! 8-)


I miss firing the M-72, and the sound of exploding parts inside big
TV transmitters while you were on the air. The first was at a US Army
base where I was a broadcast engineer.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 01:32:33 -0500, The Daring Dufas wrote:
On 9/22/2010 10:57 PM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" wrote:

The Daring fired this volley in
:


Where did you learn about the famous "frammistan"?

It's in the manual, right next to the page showing the three-pronged
veeblefork.


Where are the muffler bearings?



Believe it or not, there is such a thing as a muffler bearing. A front
wheel drive car may have one to accommodate the movement of a transverse
mounted engine.

Yes, on cars equiped with blinker fluid.

The Daring Dufas wrote:

On 9/23/2010 3:07 AM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

The Daring Dufas wrote:

On 9/23/2010 1:44 AM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

The Daring Dufas wrote:

On 9/22/2010 10:57 PM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" wrote:

The Daring fired this volley in
:


Where did you learn about the famous "frammistan"?

It's in the manual, right next to the page showing the three-pronged
veeblefork.


Where are the muffler bearings?



Believe it or not, there is such a thing as a muffler bearing. A front
wheel drive car may have one to accommodate the movement of a transverse
mounted engine.


It used to be a joke among used care salesmen, when telling people
what was wrong with their trade-ins in the '60s& '70s. "Our mechanic
just informed me that we'll have to take $250 off our offer, since the
muffler bearings are bad..." ;-)

That's why I never traded in a used car, or bought one off a lot.

The other was a joke to confuse the new guy at the parts counter,
when one of the mechanics would tell him he needed a muffler bearing for
a 65 Mustang. Maybe it was a regional thing?



I got real tickled when I heard a parts man call another supplier and
ask for a harmonica balancer for a Chevy V8.



I remember watching the harmonic balancer from the Chevy 283 in my
van rolling up the exit ramp off I-75 at Lima Ohio, after it bounced
around under the engine cover a couple times. I was doing 35 MPH, and
it was outrunning the van.


I had a similar experience when I cut a corner too hard and snapped the
left front hub out of the brake drum on my 65 Dart and the wheel outran
me. o_O


Ever had the hood pop up and pull one hinge out of the body? It
happened to me on I-75 near cincinnati, Ohio in the '70s. It was a 66
Opal Cadet. I was doing 55 MPH when the hood latch failed. A split
second later I was looking at the bottom of the hood, that was caught on
the wiper post. It had hit one of the carburetors and bent the top,
which wouldn't let me slow down, and had ripped the reservoir off the
master cylinder, so I had no brakes. I had to power shift to get work
my way down to first gear before I shut off the engine. I was steering
by looking down at the flashing white line, which made me quite dizzy.
I finally got it slowed enough to pull off to the right side of the
road. Luckily, I didn't hit anything before I stopped. I got out and
ripped the other hinge out, and shoved it into the trunk. I pried the
top of the carburetor open, so I could drive it home. The car was a
total loss, because the of the hood hitting the right door post before
it hit the windshield. The welds cracked, all the way down the door
post, and across the floor to my feet. The only thing holding the body
together was the roof and the left door post. I called my boss as soon
as II got home and was told that I should have tied the hood down and
drove to work, and that what happened was no excuse for missing work.
Its no wonder that people called the place 'Chicken**** Electronics'. I
was working in QA on the PRC77 manpack radio at the time.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" wrote:

"Michael A. Terrell" fired this volley in
m:

Where are the muffler bearings?

Right next to the relative bearing grease.


Beware of relatives bearing grease! ;-)


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

"Steve" wrote in message
...



My work is aboard the International Space Station,
while yours is
rusting in moldy basements, and your industry has a
reputation worse
that TV repairmen used to.

I am not a rocket surgen, but my company has been working
for excellence for many years. I am *not*
"billy-joe-jim-bob". Yes there are a lot of hacks out
there, but there are some true professionals out there
too. I keep trying to help change the rep that HVAC
industry has, and raise the bar in my area. FWIW, my
company has all but stopped advertising in the yellow
pages, it doesn't need to. 90% of our new customers are
all from word of mouth referals.

Hello Steve,
It is fortunate for the HVAC industry that the general
public does not read the alt.hvac newsgroup. The regulars
there seem to know more about their reproductive organs and
lower digestive tract than anything about HVAC. I remember a
reply from a homeowner asking a question and the slew of BS
that came back was amazing. One memorable reply came from a
regular poster (pjm) that said this was group for
"professionals only" and homemoaners (sic) were not welcome
here. Well my sampling of "professionals" on that group does
not speak well of their competence and people skills. They
do not seem to realize that basic refrigeration and heating
is quite simple. The complexity comes from the newer
electronic controls and they know nothing about that other
than swap things until it works. A case in point was a
neighbor that called a professional because the blower motor
in the furnace had stopped working. The "pro" said the motor
controller was bad, the board was no longer available, so
both the motor and controller needed replacing for $800. The
neighbor is a bit of a handyman so I asked him to bring the
control board to my house and I would look it over. One look
and it was obvious that there was a bad solder joint on the
line input common mode choke coil and a bit of solder
restored it completely. I will bet not one in a hundred of
these "pros" even know what a common mode choke is.

David


David

David wrote:

"Steve" wrote in message
...



My work is aboard the International Space Station,
while yours is
rusting in moldy basements, and your industry has a
reputation worse
that TV repairmen used to.

I am not a rocket surgen, but my company has been working
for excellence for many years. I am *not*
"billy-joe-jim-bob". Yes there are a lot of hacks out
there, but there are some true professionals out there
too. I keep trying to help change the rep that HVAC
industry has, and raise the bar in my area. FWIW, my
company has all but stopped advertising in the yellow
pages, it doesn't need to. 90% of our new customers are
all from word of mouth referals.

Hello Steve,
It is fortunate for the HVAC industry that the general
public does not read the alt.hvac newsgroup. The regulars
there seem to know more about their reproductive organs and
lower digestive tract than anything about HVAC. I remember a
reply from a homeowner asking a question and the slew of BS
that came back was amazing. One memorable reply came from a
regular poster (pjm) that said this was group for
"professionals only" and homemoaners (sic) were not welcome
here. Well my sampling of "professionals" on that group does
not speak well of their competence and people skills. They
do not seem to realize that basic refrigeration and heating
is quite simple. The complexity comes from the newer
electronic controls and they know nothing about that other
than swap things until it works. A case in point was a
neighbor that called a professional because the blower motor
in the furnace had stopped working. The "pro" said the motor
controller was bad, the board was no longer available, so
both the motor and controller needed replacing for $800. The
neighbor is a bit of a handyman so I asked him to bring the
control board to my house and I would look it over. One look
and it was obvious that there was a bad solder joint on the
line input common mode choke coil and a bit of solder
restored it completely. I will bet not one in a hundred of
these "pros" even know what a common mode choke is.


Or that broken solder joints are quite common failures.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

Yes, cold solder joints are a common problem. GE refrigerators are
another example of this. A friend of mine is a computer repairman, so
I've given him a couple GE boards to remelt. Havn't used them in the
field yet, but I'm guessing they are fine.

I'm glad you were able to repair the board.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"David"
wrote in message ...

The "pro" said the motor
controller was bad, the board was no longer available, so
both the motor and controller needed replacing for $800. The
neighbor is a bit of a handyman so I asked him to bring the
control board to my house and I would look it over. One look
and it was obvious that there was a bad solder joint on the
line input common mode choke coil and a bit of solder
restored it completely. I will bet not one in a hundred of
these "pros" even know what a common mode choke is.

David


David

I've also noticed a severe lack of manners. Sadly, so. Not sure what's
that all about.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"David"
wrote in message ...

It is fortunate for the HVAC industry that the general
public does not read the alt.hvac newsgroup. The regulars
there seem to know more about their reproductive organs and
lower digestive tract than anything about HVAC.

David


David

The blinker fluid reservoir is right next to the back seat choke.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"AZ Nomad" wrote in message
...


It's in the manual, right next to the page showing the
three-pronged
veeblefork.


Where are the muffler bearings?



Believe it or not, there is such a thing as a muffler bearing. A
front
wheel drive car may have one to accommodate the movement of a
transverse
mounted engine.

Yes, on cars equiped with blinker fluid.

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 04:19:27 -0400, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

My work is aboard the International Space Station, while yours is
rusting in moldy basements, and your industry has a reputation worse that
TV repairmen used to.

I remember TV repairmen, and the most prominent memory, other than that
tube caddy and their genial personalities, was the B.O.

Thanks,
Rich

On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 22:12:21 -0500, The Daring Dufas wrote:
On 9/22/2010 3:18 PM, Rich Grise wrote:
On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 23:17:52 -0500, The Daring Dufas wrote:
....
a blank stare and a "duh?".

Yes, but did it have ventricles in the frammistan? ;-P

Where did you learn about the famous "frammistan"?

I was reading a review of some computeristic trade show, and the
writer was discussing some pitchdrone, who would answer all his
questions very enthusiastically, with little or no information:
"Yes, yes, we have all the latest features."
"But, does it have ventricles?"
"Yes, we keep up with all the latest technical advances!"
"But, does it have ventricles in the frammistan?"

The writer says, "It was probably "frammistan" that tipped him off
that I was messing with him" or some such.

But actually, the first time I heard "Frammistan" was on the "I Love
Lucy" show (ca. 1950's), when Lucy and Ethel were trying to scam somebody,
by impersonating the "Maharincess of Frammistan".

Or maybe "Franistan." ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 22:18:06 -0500, Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
The Daring Dufas fired this volley in

Where did you learn about the famous "frammistan"?

It's in the manual, right next to the page showing the three-pronged
veeblefork.

I've also heard that called the "three-pronged blivet"
http://www.google.com/images?hl=en&s...=&oq=&gs_rfai=
and the "Mad POIUYT."
http://www.flickr.com/photos/popopnits/3801814762

But "veeblefork?" That's a new one on me! ;-P

Cheers!
Rich

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 02:44:28 -0400, Michael A. Terrell wrote:
The Daring Dufas wrote:
On 9/22/2010 10:57 PM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:
"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" wrote:
The Daring fired this volley in

Where did you learn about the famous "frammistan"?

It's in the manual, right next to the page showing the three-pronged
veeblefork.

Where are the muffler bearings?

Believe it or not, there is such a thing as a muffler bearing. A front
wheel drive car may have one to accommodate the movement of a transverse
mounted engine.

It used to be a joke among used care salesmen, when telling people
what was wrong with their trade-ins in the '60s & '70s. "Our mechanic just
informed me that we'll have to take $250 off our offer, since the muffler
bearings are bad..." ;-)

That's why I never traded in a used car, or bought one off a lot.

The other was a joke to confuse the new guy at the parts counter,
when one of the mechanics would tell him he needed a muffler bearing for a
65 Mustang. Maybe it was a regional thing?

In USAF electronics tech school, we used to send the newbies out for a
bucket of prop wash, 20 ft. of flight line, a cup of grid-leak bias,
and when doing the floor, a buffer amplifier. ;-)

Some guy actually came back with a cup of some pink liquid, which
they had told him was "grid-leak bias."

And then there's the guy who wanted to borrow a Crescent wrench, and
the shop guy asked, "Metric or standard?" ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 10:23:52 -0700, Rich Grise
wrote:

On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 22:18:06 -0500, Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
The Daring Dufas fired this volley in

Where did you learn about the famous "frammistan"?

It's in the manual, right next to the page showing the three-pronged
veeblefork.

I've also heard that called the "three-pronged blivet"
http://www.google.com/images?hl=en&s...=&oq=&gs_rfai=
and the "Mad POIUYT."
http://www.flickr.com/photos/popopnits/3801814762

But "veeblefork?" That's a new one on me! ;-P

Cheers!
Rich

Its closely related to, but totally different from the famed
veeblefetzer.

Gunner


I am the Sword of my Family
and the Shield of my Nation.
If sent, I will crush everything you have built,
burn everything you love,
and kill every one of you.
(Hebrew quote)

Steve wrote:
FWIW, my company has all
but stopped advertising in the yellow pages, it doesn't need to. 90%
of our new customers are all from word of mouth referals.

That, plus the Yellow Pages are so quaint...

Do you have a web site? (The new Yellow Pages)

"David" wrote in message
...


"Steve" wrote in message
...



My work is aboard the International Space Station, while yours is
rusting in moldy basements, and your industry has a reputation worse
that TV repairmen used to.

I am not a rocket surgen, but my company has been working for excellence
for many years. I am *not* "billy-joe-jim-bob". Yes there are a lot of
hacks out there, but there are some true professionals out there too. I
keep trying to help change the rep that HVAC industry has, and raise the
bar in my area. FWIW, my company has all but stopped advertising in the
yellow pages, it doesn't need to. 90% of our new customers are all from
word of mouth referals.

Hello Steve,
It is fortunate for the HVAC industry that the general public does not
read the alt.hvac newsgroup. The regulars there seem to know more about
their reproductive organs and lower digestive tract than anything about
HVAC. I remember a reply from a homeowner asking a question and the slew
of BS that came back was amazing. One memorable reply came from a regular
poster (pjm) that said this was group for "professionals only" and
homemoaners (sic) were not welcome here. Well my sampling of
"professionals" on that group does not speak well of their competence and
people skills. They do not seem to realize that basic refrigeration and
heating is quite simple. The complexity comes from the newer electronic
controls and they know nothing about that other than swap things until it
works. A case in point was a neighbor that called a professional because
the blower motor in the furnace had stopped working. The "pro" said the
motor controller was bad, the board was no longer available, so both the
motor and controller needed replacing for $800. The neighbor is a bit of a
handyman so I asked him to bring the control board to my house and I would
look it over. One look and it was obvious that there was a bad solder
joint on the line input common mode choke coil and a bit of solder
restored it completely. I will bet not one in a hundred of these "pros"
even know what a common mode choke is.

David

Or a soldering iron.

Steve

On 9/23/2010 9:04 AM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

The Daring Dufas wrote:

On 9/23/2010 3:19 AM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Steve wrote:

"Michael A. wrote in message
...

HVAC wrote:

wrote in message
...


I've never been so busy. Seriously.

I do commercial only and all I can say
is WHAT recession?

Now we know who you do commercials FOR - Brobama !

I've said it before and I'll say it again.....

It's only a recession if you don't have work.


And your only an ignorant asshole if you work in HVAC.

The same could be said ofinsert your vocation here.


Sigh. I was a Broadcast engineer at three TV stations and a bunch of
AM radio stations. All of which would fire you on the spot if you were
inept, or an asshole.

I ran a repair depot for a large MSO CATV operator, where we did
millions of dollars worth of repairs for the various systems we owned.

I also worked in manufacturing and engineering for a company that
provided Telemetry systems for NASA, NOAA and the European Space
Agency. They never told us how to do our job. They just asked for a
price and wrote a check. Some of our equipment was still in use over 30
years after delivery and had never been serviced. It was being used to
track some of NASA's deep space probes that were launched in the early
'70s.


My work is aboard the International Space Station, while yours is
rusting in moldy basements, and your industry has a reputation worse
that TV repairmen used to.



Hey Mike, I worked out at The Kwajalein Missile Range back in 87 and 88,
there was a lot of telemetry going on there, did you happen to be
working in the telemetry field at the time? It's now The Ronald Reagan
Ballistic Missile Defense Test Site, I think I know why it was renamed.
There was some pretty cool stuff going on there back in the late 80's
and I'll bet there is some even cooler stuff going on there now. And
speaking of cool, there was a good sized sat dish with a cryo cooled
LNA or LNB right near my living quarters. I loved it out in the islands.


No, I was in that field in the late '90s and early '00s, until my
health failed. Did you use any equipment from Microdyne? They were
still supplying parts& upgrades for the 1100 series they built during
that era. The 1200 series was still in production, along with the
700/1620 series, and the 1400 series. I worked on the launch of their
RCB2000/DR2000 series to move it from prototype to production ready.



I wasn't working on any of the missile systems, I was working for a
contractor building facilities. The only electronic systems I worked
on were the office phone system, the two way radios, any control
problems, access control, Halon fire suppression system, of course,
any of the guys having a problem with a TV, VCR or tape player asked
for my help. I had to rebuild the voltage regulator for the 20kw gen
set on our crew boat. I took it to the TV repair shop there on the
island and found an FET from a TV that worked in the regulator and
had the generator back up and running. The gen set ran a compressor
for the air starters on the twin 12 cylinder supercharged Detroit
Diesel engines. The smart ass captain liked to start those monsters
when I was down in the engine room checking things out. I kept ear
plugs handy, especially whenever I had to go to any of the power
plants. I loved it out there and would have stayed if I hadn't been
transferred to a 20 man housing unit that had 19 smokers living in it.

TDD

It showed up again in the tv show MASH, where a general was trying to
distract Blake long enough to make time with Hot Lips.

Framistat plan, was to make motor oil last 6,000 miles and then make
it edible.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Rich Grise" wrote in message
news
"Yes, we keep up with all the latest technical advances!"
"But, does it have ventricles in the frammistan?"

The writer says, "It was probably "frammistan" that tipped him off
that I was messing with him" or some such.

But actually, the first time I heard "Frammistan" was on the "I Love
Lucy" show (ca. 1950's), when Lucy and Ethel were trying to scam
somebody,
by impersonating the "Maharincess of Frammistan".

Or maybe "Franistan." ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

And shows the mechanic's ignorance. They only come in Metric, English,
and very expensive in Whitworth.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Rich Grise" wrote in message
news
And then there's the guy who wanted to borrow a Crescent wrench, and
the shop guy asked, "Metric or standard?" ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

The Daring Dufas wrote:

Michael A. Terrell wrote:

The Daring Dufas wrote:

Hey Mike, I worked out at The Kwajalein Missile Range back in 87 and 88,
there was a lot of telemetry going on there, did you happen to be
working in the telemetry field at the time? It's now The Ronald Reagan
Ballistic Missile Defense Test Site, I think I know why it was renamed.
There was some pretty cool stuff going on there back in the late 80's
and I'll bet there is some even cooler stuff going on there now. And
speaking of cool, there was a good sized sat dish with a cryo cooled
LNA or LNB right near my living quarters. I loved it out in the islands.

No, I was in that field in the late '90s and early '00s, until my
health failed. Did you use any equipment from Microdyne? They were
still supplying parts& upgrades for the 1100 series they built during
that era. The 1200 series was still in production, along with the
700/1620 series, and the 1400 series. I worked on the launch of their
RCB2000/DR2000 series to move it from prototype to production ready.

I wasn't working on any of the missile systems, I was working for a
contractor building facilities. The only electronic systems I worked
on were the office phone system, the two way radios, any control
problems, access control, Halon fire suppression system, of course,
any of the guys having a problem with a TV, VCR or tape player asked
for my help. I had to rebuild the voltage regulator for the 20kw gen
set on our crew boat. I took it to the TV repair shop there on the
island and found an FET from a TV that worked in the regulator and
had the generator back up and running. The gen set ran a compressor
for the air starters on the twin 12 cylinder supercharged Detroit
Diesel engines. The smart ass captain liked to start those monsters
when I was down in the engine room checking things out. I kept ear
plugs handy, especially whenever I had to go to any of the power
plants. I loved it out there and would have stayed if I hadn't been
transferred to a 20 man housing unit that had 19 smokers living in it.


That's like sharing a four bay room in Army barracks with three
slobs.

Luckily, most of my time after basic I had a one man room. It only
took 15 minutes a week to keep it clean enough to pass all inspections.
It was funny, at Ft. Rucker. I was an E2, but in a slot for an E5, so I
managed to get the key for the assigned one man room. It was a real
mess, and took about two weeks to clean all the old floor wax off the
floor, baseboards and even the walls. A month later we were visited by
a bunch of generals from Washington. One asked my captain who's room
they were in, then said it was the cleanest he'd seen on the whole
trip. When he found out it belonged to an E2 he got mad, then laughed
and said, Anyone who spends enough time to keep his quarters that neat
could keep the room. I barely spent 15 minutes a week. Luckily, he
didn't see the coil of coax hanging outside my window. I worked in the
Weathervision system, which included 17 Cable TV systems. The man that
maintained the civilian cable TV on base gave me permission to run a
drop to my room in the barracks when he caught me repairing the damaged
drop to our dayroom. He figured that if I had cable, I would keep the
two paid drops working for him.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

On 9/23/2010 9:36 AM, David wrote:


"Steve" wrote in message
...



My work is aboard the International Space Station, while yours is
rusting in moldy basements, and your industry has a reputation worse
that TV repairmen used to.

I am not a rocket surgen, but my company has been working for
excellence for many years. I am *not* "billy-joe-jim-bob". Yes there
are a lot of hacks out there, but there are some true professionals
out there too. I keep trying to help change the rep that HVAC industry
has, and raise the bar in my area. FWIW, my company has all but
stopped advertising in the yellow pages, it doesn't need to. 90% of
our new customers are all from word of mouth referals.

Hello Steve,
It is fortunate for the HVAC industry that the general public does not
read the alt.hvac newsgroup. The regulars there seem to know more about
their reproductive organs and lower digestive tract than anything about
HVAC. I remember a reply from a homeowner asking a question and the slew
of BS that came back was amazing. One memorable reply came from a
regular poster (pjm) that said this was group for "professionals only"
and homemoaners (sic) were not welcome here. Well my sampling of
"professionals" on that group does not speak well of their competence
and people skills. They do not seem to realize that basic refrigeration
and heating is quite simple. The complexity comes from the newer
electronic controls and they know nothing about that other than swap
things until it works. A case in point was a neighbor that called a
professional because the blower motor in the furnace had stopped
working. The "pro" said the motor controller was bad, the board was no
longer available, so both the motor and controller needed replacing for
$800. The neighbor is a bit of a handyman so I asked him to bring the
control board to my house and I would look it over. One look and it was
obvious that there was a bad solder joint on the line input common mode
choke coil and a bit of solder restored it completely. I will bet not
one in a hundred of these "pros" even know what a common mode choke is.

David


The majority of HVAC techs have no idea how to do board level repairs.
I find cold solder joints all the time and am able to get a system up
and running without having to replace an expensive circuit board. The
catch is, how much time will it take to repair a one hundred dollar
circuit board vs $85.00 per hour. ---- it's a simplified example.
Don't yap about how expensive most control boards are. Ask an HVAC
tech what wave soldering is and he/she/it smile and wave at you.

TDD

On 9/23/2010 12:28 PM, Rich Grise wrote:
On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 02:44:28 -0400, Michael A. Terrell wrote:
The Daring Dufas wrote:
On 9/22/2010 10:57 PM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:
"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" wrote:
The Daring fired this volley in

Where did you learn about the famous "frammistan"?

It's in the manual, right next to the page showing the three-pronged
veeblefork.

Where are the muffler bearings?

Believe it or not, there is such a thing as a muffler bearing. A front
wheel drive car may have one to accommodate the movement of a transverse
mounted engine.

It used to be a joke among used care salesmen, when telling people
what was wrong with their trade-ins in the '60s& '70s. "Our mechanic just
informed me that we'll have to take $250 off our offer, since the muffler
bearings are bad..." ;-)

That's why I never traded in a used car, or bought one off a lot.

The other was a joke to confuse the new guy at the parts counter,
when one of the mechanics would tell him he needed a muffler bearing for a
65 Mustang. Maybe it was a regional thing?

In USAF electronics tech school, we used to send the newbies out for a
bucket of prop wash, 20 ft. of flight line, a cup of grid-leak bias,
and when doing the floor, a buffer amplifier. ;-)

Some guy actually came back with a cup of some pink liquid, which
they had told him was "grid-leak bias."

And then there's the guy who wanted to borrow a Crescent wrench, and
the shop guy asked, "Metric or standard?" ;-)

Cheers!
Rich


I put an oscillator inside a hollowed out D-cell to show smart asses
who asked me for an AC battery. When I showed up with my AC battery
I would get this "we're just kidding, there's no such thing." Then I
hooked it to a scope and said "SEE?". I swiped the idea from I don't
remember who. 8-)

TDD

On 9/23/2010 10:05 PM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

The Daring Dufas wrote:

Michael A. Terrell wrote:

The Daring Dufas wrote:

Hey Mike, I worked out at The Kwajalein Missile Range back in 87 and 88,
there was a lot of telemetry going on there, did you happen to be
working in the telemetry field at the time? It's now The Ronald Reagan
Ballistic Missile Defense Test Site, I think I know why it was renamed.
There was some pretty cool stuff going on there back in the late 80's
and I'll bet there is some even cooler stuff going on there now. And
speaking of cool, there was a good sized sat dish with a cryo cooled
LNA or LNB right near my living quarters. I loved it out in the islands.

No, I was in that field in the late '90s and early '00s, until my
health failed. Did you use any equipment from Microdyne? They were
still supplying parts& upgrades for the 1100 series they built during
that era. The 1200 series was still in production, along with the
700/1620 series, and the 1400 series. I worked on the launch of their
RCB2000/DR2000 series to move it from prototype to production ready.

I wasn't working on any of the missile systems, I was working for a
contractor building facilities. The only electronic systems I worked
on were the office phone system, the two way radios, any control
problems, access control, Halon fire suppression system, of course,
any of the guys having a problem with a TV, VCR or tape player asked
for my help. I had to rebuild the voltage regulator for the 20kw gen
set on our crew boat. I took it to the TV repair shop there on the
island and found an FET from a TV that worked in the regulator and
had the generator back up and running. The gen set ran a compressor
for the air starters on the twin 12 cylinder supercharged Detroit
Diesel engines. The smart ass captain liked to start those monsters
when I was down in the engine room checking things out. I kept ear
plugs handy, especially whenever I had to go to any of the power
plants. I loved it out there and would have stayed if I hadn't been
transferred to a 20 man housing unit that had 19 smokers living in it.


That's like sharing a four bay room in Army barracks with three
slobs.

Luckily, most of my time after basic I had a one man room. It only
took 15 minutes a week to keep it clean enough to pass all inspections.
It was funny, at Ft. Rucker. I was an E2, but in a slot for an E5, so I
managed to get the key for the assigned one man room. It was a real
mess, and took about two weeks to clean all the old floor wax off the
floor, baseboards and even the walls. A month later we were visited by
a bunch of generals from Washington. One asked my captain who's room
they were in, then said it was the cleanest he'd seen on the whole
trip. When he found out it belonged to an E2 he got mad, then laughed
and said, Anyone who spends enough time to keep his quarters that neat
could keep the room. I barely spent 15 minutes a week. Luckily, he
didn't see the coil of coax hanging outside my window. I worked in the
Weathervision system, which included 17 Cable TV systems. The man that
maintained the civilian cable TV on base gave me permission to run a
drop to my room in the barracks when he caught me repairing the damaged
drop to our dayroom. He figured that if I had cable, I would keep the
two paid drops working for him.



A friend of mine studied electrical engineering at Auburn back in the
1960's and lived in a dorm with a bunch of other typical college boys
of the era, no coed in ancient times. The big thing at the time was
the big AM station in the state playing pop music all day. When my
friend wanted to sleep or study, he would switch on his low power AM
transmitter he had hooked to the dorm's rain gutters and silence all
the radios in the dorm. When he grew up, he wound up being in charge
of the communications division of a major utility company.

TDD

On 9/23/2010 10:48 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 22:19:20 -0500, The Daring Dufas
wrote:

I put an oscillator inside a hollowed out D-cell to show smart asses
who asked me for an AC battery. When I showed up with my AC battery
I would get this "we're just kidding, there's no such thing." Then I
hooked it to a scope and said "SEE?". I swiped the idea from I don't
remember who. 8-)

TDD

Causing many heads to look like the watermelons at a Gallagher
show, I assume :-)



Turn about is fair play but outsmarting smart-asses causes them to
hate you and they waste countless hours trying to get back at you.
I love pranks but draw the line at anything destructive or something
that could possibly cause someone harm, like the old gasoline in the
fire extinguisher gag. When I worked in a repair depot so many years
ago, our individual work benches had a master switch to kill the
power to the various magnifier lamps, test gear and soldering stations.
One of my coworkers was a REAL gun nut. He had guns everywhere. He had
at least two on him at any time so I couldn't resist. I painted his
soldering iron with liquid flux then coated it with gun powder. He
came into work that day in a foul mood growling at everything in sight,
slammed down what he was carrying on his work bench, flipped on the
power switch and we all cringed expecting him to go berserk and shoot
everyone in sight. After 10 seconds a big flash and puff of smoke
came from his soldering iron, he jumped up and screamed like a woman
in a monster movie then started giggling. After that he was OK and in a
good mood the rest of the day. See, pranks can be therapeutic! 8-)

TDD

I used to stuff components for a wave solder. The guy who tended the
machine used to say "go with the flow, bro" which we thought was
funny.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in message
...

control board to my house and I would look it over. One look and it
was
obvious that there was a bad solder joint on the line input common
mode
choke coil and a bit of solder restored it completely. I will bet
not
one in a hundred of these "pros" even know what a common mode choke
is.

David


The majority of HVAC techs have no idea how to do board level repairs.
I find cold solder joints all the time and am able to get a system up
and running without having to replace an expensive circuit board. The
catch is, how much time will it take to repair a one hundred dollar
circuit board vs $85.00 per hour. ---- it's a simplified example.
Don't yap about how expensive most control boards are. Ask an HVAC
tech what wave soldering is and he/she/it smile and wave at you.

TDD

When I was in college, one professor used to smoke cigarettes while he
taught. Which was painful to me, as I'm allergic. He'd look in the
trash can, and find something for an ash tray. Piece of paper, or soda
can. I got the brilliant idea to put some flash powder in a dry pop
can, and leave in the trash can. He'd put still-lit cigarettes into
the pop can. I got the idea, but never did try it. I really should
have.

Glad I'm not the only one who thought of gasoline in the fire
extinguisher.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in message
...

Turn about is fair play but outsmarting smart-asses causes them to
hate you and they waste countless hours trying to get back at you.
I love pranks but draw the line at anything destructive or something
that could possibly cause someone harm, like the old gasoline in the
fire extinguisher gag. When I worked in a repair depot so many years
ago, our individual work benches had a master switch to kill the
power to the various magnifier lamps, test gear and soldering
stations.
One of my coworkers was a REAL gun nut. He had guns everywhere. He had
at least two on him at any time so I couldn't resist. I painted his
soldering iron with liquid flux then coated it with gun powder. He
came into work that day in a foul mood growling at everything in
sight,
slammed down what he was carrying on his work bench, flipped on the
power switch and we all cringed expecting him to go berserk and shoot
everyone in sight. After 10 seconds a big flash and puff of smoke
came from his soldering iron, he jumped up and screamed like a woman
in a monster movie then started giggling. After that he was OK and in
a
good mood the rest of the day. See, pranks can be therapeutic! 8-)

TDD

"The Daring Dufas" wrote in message
...
On 9/23/2010 9:36 AM, David wrote:


"Steve" wrote in message
...



My work is aboard the International Space Station, while yours is
rusting in moldy basements, and your industry has a reputation worse
that TV repairmen used to.

I am not a rocket surgen, but my company has been working for
excellence for many years. I am *not* "billy-joe-jim-bob". Yes there
are a lot of hacks out there, but there are some true professionals
out there too. I keep trying to help change the rep that HVAC industry
has, and raise the bar in my area. FWIW, my company has all but
stopped advertising in the yellow pages, it doesn't need to. 90% of
our new customers are all from word of mouth referals.

Hello Steve,
It is fortunate for the HVAC industry that the general public does not
read the alt.hvac newsgroup. The regulars there seem to know more about
their reproductive organs and lower digestive tract than anything about
HVAC. I remember a reply from a homeowner asking a question and the slew
of BS that came back was amazing. One memorable reply came from a
regular poster (pjm) that said this was group for "professionals only"
and homemoaners (sic) were not welcome here. Well my sampling of
"professionals" on that group does not speak well of their competence
and people skills. They do not seem to realize that basic refrigeration
and heating is quite simple. The complexity comes from the newer
electronic controls and they know nothing about that other than swap
things until it works. A case in point was a neighbor that called a
professional because the blower motor in the furnace had stopped
working. The "pro" said the motor controller was bad, the board was no
longer available, so both the motor and controller needed replacing for
$800. The neighbor is a bit of a handyman so I asked him to bring the
control board to my house and I would look it over. One look and it was
obvious that there was a bad solder joint on the line input common mode
choke coil and a bit of solder restored it completely. I will bet not
one in a hundred of these "pros" even know what a common mode choke is.

David


The majority of HVAC techs have no idea how to do board level repairs.

Some of us do, but its not cost effective to do so.

I find cold solder joints all the time and am able to get a system up
and running without having to replace an expensive circuit board. The
catch is, how much time will it take to repair a one hundred dollar
circuit board vs $85.00 per hour. ---- it's a simplified example.
Don't yap about how expensive most control boards are. Ask an HVAC
tech what wave soldering is and he/she/it smile and wave at you.

No, control boards are not free, and yes, some of us *DO* know what wave
soldering is.

On 9/24/2010 7:36 AM, Steve wrote:
"The Daring wrote in message
...
On 9/23/2010 9:36 AM, David wrote:


wrote in message
...



My work is aboard the International Space Station, while yours is
rusting in moldy basements, and your industry has a reputation worse
that TV repairmen used to.

I am not a rocket surgen, but my company has been working for
excellence for many years. I am *not* "billy-joe-jim-bob". Yes there
are a lot of hacks out there, but there are some true professionals
out there too. I keep trying to help change the rep that HVAC industry
has, and raise the bar in my area. FWIW, my company has all but
stopped advertising in the yellow pages, it doesn't need to. 90% of
our new customers are all from word of mouth referals.

Hello Steve,
It is fortunate for the HVAC industry that the general public does not
read the alt.hvac newsgroup. The regulars there seem to know more about
their reproductive organs and lower digestive tract than anything about
HVAC. I remember a reply from a homeowner asking a question and the slew
of BS that came back was amazing. One memorable reply came from a
regular poster (pjm) that said this was group for "professionals only"
and homemoaners (sic) were not welcome here. Well my sampling of
"professionals" on that group does not speak well of their competence
and people skills. They do not seem to realize that basic refrigeration
and heating is quite simple. The complexity comes from the newer
electronic controls and they know nothing about that other than swap
things until it works. A case in point was a neighbor that called a
professional because the blower motor in the furnace had stopped
working. The "pro" said the motor controller was bad, the board was no
longer available, so both the motor and controller needed replacing for
$800. The neighbor is a bit of a handyman so I asked him to bring the
control board to my house and I would look it over. One look and it was
obvious that there was a bad solder joint on the line input common mode
choke coil and a bit of solder restored it completely. I will bet not
one in a hundred of these "pros" even know what a common mode choke is.

David


The majority of HVAC techs have no idea how to do board level repairs.

Some of us do, but its not cost effective to do so.

I find cold solder joints all the time and am able to get a system up
and running without having to replace an expensive circuit board. The
catch is, how much time will it take to repair a one hundred dollar
circuit board vs $85.00 per hour.---- it's a simplified example.
Don't yap about how expensive most control boards are. Ask an HVAC
tech what wave soldering is and he/she/it smile and wave at you.

No, control boards are not free, and yes, some of us *DO* know what wave
soldering is.



That would make you the exception. Lack of knowledge in one area doesn't
make one stupid or ineffective in their chosen field. Ignorance means
you don't know but you can learn, stupid means no way. I'm ignorant
about a lot of things so I use what my mother taught me, "If it smells
bad, don't eat it." I apply this to everything in my life. 8-)

TDD

"Jules Richardson" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 21:18:37 -0700, Bill Noble wrote:
the last time I had those symptoms, it was a 1947 Norge that had run
until 1987. I took it apart, and the root cause was lack of lubrication
to the rod bearing caused by a particle of some kind getting into the
lubrication hole and blocking it - Still, one can't be too unhappy about
a 40 year life on a refrig.

Ours will be 34 next year, so it's getting up there. I'd replace it if I
had any faith in a modern one lasting even a third of that time, but as
it stands I'll just run it until something major breaks.

I'm sure it uses huge amounts of power - but we have to heat the house
for over half the year here, so at least anything that it loses as heat
isn't going to waste during that time ;-)

I was of the same mind until I clocked both old and new with a KillaWatt
power meter. The old one (admittedly low on freon so working extra hard)
ran 4X the kWh as the new one. That's hard to ignore. I was of the same
mind as you - IIABDFI! But when the old one couldn't cool well on the
hottest days anymore, I had to make a choice and I chose the simplest model
in the hopes that reliability is truly inversely proportional to complexity.

Fridges are like classic cars. After 30 years, the plastic and rubber parts
are heading off to Jesus, replacements aren't readily available and the
patches accumulate to the point of embarrassment. One thing I like about
the new one is the absence of a dimpled egg shelf. Never used it, the space
was wasted and it collected all sorts of crap that had to be scooped out one
$#$%% egg hole at a time.

The new fridge is much easier to clean overall and has enormous shelves
built into each door. Good some ways, bad others. Grabbing creamer,
condiments and the ice tea pitcher doesn't require a full door opening,
which is a very large energy consumer, especially with teenagers doing a
IG-level food inventory before deciding what to eat.

We did make one super-size mistake in selecting the capacity of the units.
They allege to be the same cubic capacity, but the new one had it laid out
in very much less friendly space. It's our fault (well, mine) because we
(I) didn't think to measure the cubic space of each compartment. The new
box has much less freezer space and turned out to be a biggish sort of
mistake.

But now that the government says the recession is over we'll be leaving it
behind when we buy our new, fairly priced, equitably taxed house in a stable
neighborhood not riddled with foreclosed and empty houses. Phew!

The fridge compartment is conspicuously empty and the freezer, the reverse.
It's laid out so where once we could have containers and frozen food cartons
2 deep, now it's 1.75 deep which basically means one deep. The walls are
much thicker as well, but that's part of the reason it's using 1/4 the
juice. We had a lot of limitations, though, in terms of getting it IN the
house. We have very small doors that limited the overall size of the
replacement. The two guys who did the install had to put a ratty look sling
under the bottom and literally "dance" it into the house.

Will it last as long as the old box? Probably not. What does? Will I save
enough money to offset the cost of buying a new one? No, but if I had
replaced it when it first started getting quirky, the savings picture would
be different. One thing it inspired me to do was take baseline kWh readings
on the new one. Armed with that information, it might be possible to spot a
problem as insidious as water-logged insulation. I'll at least have some
idea what the current draw was when the machine was well to help gauge the
severity of future problem. I'll bet waterlogged insulation can really jack
up the kWh consumption per day. Where did the water come from?

--
Bobby G.

The Daring Dufas wrote:

On 9/23/2010 10:05 PM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

The Daring Dufas wrote:

Michael A. Terrell wrote:

The Daring Dufas wrote:

Hey Mike, I worked out at The Kwajalein Missile Range back in 87 and 88,
there was a lot of telemetry going on there, did you happen to be
working in the telemetry field at the time? It's now The Ronald Reagan
Ballistic Missile Defense Test Site, I think I know why it was renamed.
There was some pretty cool stuff going on there back in the late 80's
and I'll bet there is some even cooler stuff going on there now. And
speaking of cool, there was a good sized sat dish with a cryo cooled
LNA or LNB right near my living quarters. I loved it out in the islands.

No, I was in that field in the late '90s and early '00s, until my
health failed. Did you use any equipment from Microdyne? They were
still supplying parts& upgrades for the 1100 series they built during
that era. The 1200 series was still in production, along with the
700/1620 series, and the 1400 series. I worked on the launch of their
RCB2000/DR2000 series to move it from prototype to production ready.

I wasn't working on any of the missile systems, I was working for a
contractor building facilities. The only electronic systems I worked
on were the office phone system, the two way radios, any control
problems, access control, Halon fire suppression system, of course,
any of the guys having a problem with a TV, VCR or tape player asked
for my help. I had to rebuild the voltage regulator for the 20kw gen
set on our crew boat. I took it to the TV repair shop there on the
island and found an FET from a TV that worked in the regulator and
had the generator back up and running. The gen set ran a compressor
for the air starters on the twin 12 cylinder supercharged Detroit
Diesel engines. The smart ass captain liked to start those monsters
when I was down in the engine room checking things out. I kept ear
plugs handy, especially whenever I had to go to any of the power
plants. I loved it out there and would have stayed if I hadn't been
transferred to a 20 man housing unit that had 19 smokers living in it.


That's like sharing a four bay room in Army barracks with three
slobs.

Luckily, most of my time after basic I had a one man room. It only
took 15 minutes a week to keep it clean enough to pass all inspections.
It was funny, at Ft. Rucker. I was an E2, but in a slot for an E5, so I
managed to get the key for the assigned one man room. It was a real
mess, and took about two weeks to clean all the old floor wax off the
floor, baseboards and even the walls. A month later we were visited by
a bunch of generals from Washington. One asked my captain who's room
they were in, then said it was the cleanest he'd seen on the whole
trip. When he found out it belonged to an E2 he got mad, then laughed
and said, Anyone who spends enough time to keep his quarters that neat
could keep the room. I barely spent 15 minutes a week. Luckily, he
didn't see the coil of coax hanging outside my window. I worked in the
Weathervision system, which included 17 Cable TV systems. The man that
maintained the civilian cable TV on base gave me permission to run a
drop to my room in the barracks when he caught me repairing the damaged
drop to our dayroom. He figured that if I had cable, I would keep the
two paid drops working for him.



A friend of mine studied electrical engineering at Auburn back in the
1960's and lived in a dorm with a bunch of other typical college boys
of the era, no coed in ancient times. The big thing at the time was
the big AM station in the state playing pop music all day. When my
friend wanted to sleep or study, he would switch on his low power AM
transmitter he had hooked to the dorm's rain gutters and silence all
the radios in the dorm. When he grew up, he wound up being in charge
of the communications division of a major utility company.


Later, I worked at a military TV station, before leaving the
service. Years later I was an engineer at a UHF TV station with a 5 MW
EIRP signal on a 1749 foot tower near the east coast of Central Florida.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

Steve wrote:

"The Daring Dufas" wrote in message
...
On 9/23/2010 9:36 AM, David wrote:


"Steve" wrote in message
...



My work is aboard the International Space Station, while yours is
rusting in moldy basements, and your industry has a reputation worse
that TV repairmen used to.

I am not a rocket surgen, but my company has been working for
excellence for many years. I am *not* "billy-joe-jim-bob". Yes there
are a lot of hacks out there, but there are some true professionals
out there too. I keep trying to help change the rep that HVAC industry
has, and raise the bar in my area. FWIW, my company has all but
stopped advertising in the yellow pages, it doesn't need to. 90% of
our new customers are all from word of mouth referals.

Hello Steve,
It is fortunate for the HVAC industry that the general public does not
read the alt.hvac newsgroup. The regulars there seem to know more about
their reproductive organs and lower digestive tract than anything about
HVAC. I remember a reply from a homeowner asking a question and the slew
of BS that came back was amazing. One memorable reply came from a
regular poster (pjm) that said this was group for "professionals only"
and homemoaners (sic) were not welcome here. Well my sampling of
"professionals" on that group does not speak well of their competence
and people skills. They do not seem to realize that basic refrigeration
and heating is quite simple. The complexity comes from the newer
electronic controls and they know nothing about that other than swap
things until it works. A case in point was a neighbor that called a
professional because the blower motor in the furnace had stopped
working. The "pro" said the motor controller was bad, the board was no
longer available, so both the motor and controller needed replacing for
$800. The neighbor is a bit of a handyman so I asked him to bring the
control board to my house and I would look it over. One look and it was
obvious that there was a bad solder joint on the line input common mode
choke coil and a bit of solder restored it completely. I will bet not
one in a hundred of these "pros" even know what a common mode choke is.

David


The majority of HVAC techs have no idea how to do board level repairs.

Some of us do, but its not cost effective to do so.

I find cold solder joints all the time and am able to get a system up
and running without having to replace an expensive circuit board. The
catch is, how much time will it take to repair a one hundred dollar
circuit board vs $85.00 per hour. ---- it's a simplified example.
Don't yap about how expensive most control boards are. Ask an HVAC
tech what wave soldering is and he/she/it smile and wave at you.

No, control boards are not free, and yes, some of us *DO* know what wave
soldering is.


Reflow soldering is a lot more common these days. With so much
surface mount, wave solder has lost a lot of market share.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
...
I used to stuff components for a wave solder. The guy who tended the
machine used to say "go with the flow, bro" which we thought was
funny.


"We" ?

Is that you + the voices in your head?





--
Every Time You See a Rainbow, God is Having Gay Sex

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
...

When I was in college,


That was the "Close cover before striking" college, right?



--
“Intelligent Design” Helping Stupid People Feel Smart Since 1987

The Daring Dufas on Thu, 23 Sep 2010
22:19:20 -0500 typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
On 9/23/2010 12:28 PM, Rich Grise wrote:
On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 02:44:28 -0400, Michael A. Terrell wrote:
The Daring Dufas wrote:
On 9/22/2010 10:57 PM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:
"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" wrote:
The Daring fired this volley in

Where did you learn about the famous "frammistan"?

It's in the manual, right next to the page showing the three-pronged
veeblefork.

Where are the muffler bearings?

Believe it or not, there is such a thing as a muffler bearing. A front
wheel drive car may have one to accommodate the movement of a transverse
mounted engine.

It used to be a joke among used care salesmen, when telling people
what was wrong with their trade-ins in the '60s& '70s. "Our mechanic just
informed me that we'll have to take $250 off our offer, since the muffler
bearings are bad..." ;-)

That's why I never traded in a used car, or bought one off a lot.

The other was a joke to confuse the new guy at the parts counter,
when one of the mechanics would tell him he needed a muffler bearing for a
65 Mustang. Maybe it was a regional thing?

In USAF electronics tech school, we used to send the newbies out for a
bucket of prop wash, 20 ft. of flight line, a cup of grid-leak bias,
and when doing the floor, a buffer amplifier. ;-)

Some guy actually came back with a cup of some pink liquid, which
they had told him was "grid-leak bias."

And then there's the guy who wanted to borrow a Crescent wrench, and
the shop guy asked, "Metric or standard?" ;-)

Had a co-worker who would respond to request for "a butt load" of
anything with "That a standard or metric butt load?"
--
pyotr filipivich
We will drink no whiskey before its nine.
It's eight fifty eight. Close enough!

HVAC wrote:

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
...
I used to stuff components for a wave solder. The guy who tended the
machine used to say "go with the flow, bro" which we thought was
funny.

"We" ?

Is that you + the voices in your head?


Appparently, you are the only one with voices in your head.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

pyotr filipivich wrote:

Had a co-worker who would respond to request for "a butt load" of
anything with "That a standard or metric butt load?"


Well, some people DO confuse 'a ton' with 'a butt load'. ;-)


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

On Sep 24, 6:27*pm, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:
pyotr filipivich wrote:

* * * * Had a co-worker who would respond to request for "a butt load" of
anything with "That a standard or metric butt load?"

* *Well, some people DO confuse 'a ton' with 'a butt load'. ;-)

--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

Oh no, not the butt load again...I remember it being a bulk load.
Someone got Trolled
Randy

(Do not do today, what you shouldn't do tomorrow)

On 9/24/2010 4:17 PM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

The Daring Dufas wrote:

On 9/23/2010 10:05 PM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

The Daring Dufas wrote:

Michael A. Terrell wrote:

The Daring Dufas wrote:

Hey Mike, I worked out at The Kwajalein Missile Range back in 87 and 88,
there was a lot of telemetry going on there, did you happen to be
working in the telemetry field at the time? It's now The Ronald Reagan
Ballistic Missile Defense Test Site, I think I know why it was renamed.
There was some pretty cool stuff going on there back in the late 80's
and I'll bet there is some even cooler stuff going on there now. And
speaking of cool, there was a good sized sat dish with a cryo cooled
LNA or LNB right near my living quarters. I loved it out in the islands.

No, I was in that field in the late '90s and early '00s, until my
health failed. Did you use any equipment from Microdyne? They were
still supplying parts& upgrades for the 1100 series they built during
that era. The 1200 series was still in production, along with the
700/1620 series, and the 1400 series. I worked on the launch of their
RCB2000/DR2000 series to move it from prototype to production ready.

I wasn't working on any of the missile systems, I was working for a
contractor building facilities. The only electronic systems I worked
on were the office phone system, the two way radios, any control
problems, access control, Halon fire suppression system, of course,
any of the guys having a problem with a TV, VCR or tape player asked
for my help. I had to rebuild the voltage regulator for the 20kw gen
set on our crew boat. I took it to the TV repair shop there on the
island and found an FET from a TV that worked in the regulator and
had the generator back up and running. The gen set ran a compressor
for the air starters on the twin 12 cylinder supercharged Detroit
Diesel engines. The smart ass captain liked to start those monsters
when I was down in the engine room checking things out. I kept ear
plugs handy, especially whenever I had to go to any of the power
plants. I loved it out there and would have stayed if I hadn't been
transferred to a 20 man housing unit that had 19 smokers living in it.


That's like sharing a four bay room in Army barracks with three
slobs.

Luckily, most of my time after basic I had a one man room. It only
took 15 minutes a week to keep it clean enough to pass all inspections.
It was funny, at Ft. Rucker. I was an E2, but in a slot for an E5, so I
managed to get the key for the assigned one man room. It was a real
mess, and took about two weeks to clean all the old floor wax off the
floor, baseboards and even the walls. A month later we were visited by
a bunch of generals from Washington. One asked my captain who's room
they were in, then said it was the cleanest he'd seen on the whole
trip. When he found out it belonged to an E2 he got mad, then laughed
and said, Anyone who spends enough time to keep his quarters that neat
could keep the room. I barely spent 15 minutes a week. Luckily, he
didn't see the coil of coax hanging outside my window. I worked in the
Weathervision system, which included 17 Cable TV systems. The man that
maintained the civilian cable TV on base gave me permission to run a
drop to my room in the barracks when he caught me repairing the damaged
drop to our dayroom. He figured that if I had cable, I would keep the
two paid drops working for him.



A friend of mine studied electrical engineering at Auburn back in the
1960's and lived in a dorm with a bunch of other typical college boys
of the era, no coed in ancient times. The big thing at the time was
the big AM station in the state playing pop music all day. When my
friend wanted to sleep or study, he would switch on his low power AM
transmitter he had hooked to the dorm's rain gutters and silence all
the radios in the dorm. When he grew up, he wound up being in charge
of the communications division of a major utility company.


Later, I worked at a military TV station, before leaving the
service. Years later I was an engineer at a UHF TV station with a 5 MW
EIRP signal on a 1749 foot tower near the east coast of Central Florida.


If you could get close enough to the antenna, you could cook hot dogs,
in about a tenth of a second. I've tried to explain to a lot of folks
that an AM station tower IS the antenna and it sits on insulators. I
remember a couple of idiots climbing the TV towers around here. RF is
so much fun to play with. 8-)

TDD

On 9/24/2010 4:18 PM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Steve wrote:

"The Daring wrote in message
...
On 9/23/2010 9:36 AM, David wrote:


wrote in message
...



My work is aboard the International Space Station, while yours is
rusting in moldy basements, and your industry has a reputation worse
that TV repairmen used to.

I am not a rocket surgen, but my company has been working for
excellence for many years. I am *not* "billy-joe-jim-bob". Yes there
are a lot of hacks out there, but there are some true professionals
out there too. I keep trying to help change the rep that HVAC industry
has, and raise the bar in my area. FWIW, my company has all but
stopped advertising in the yellow pages, it doesn't need to. 90% of
our new customers are all from word of mouth referals.

Hello Steve,
It is fortunate for the HVAC industry that the general public does not
read the alt.hvac newsgroup. The regulars there seem to know more about
their reproductive organs and lower digestive tract than anything about
HVAC. I remember a reply from a homeowner asking a question and the slew
of BS that came back was amazing. One memorable reply came from a
regular poster (pjm) that said this was group for "professionals only"
and homemoaners (sic) were not welcome here. Well my sampling of
"professionals" on that group does not speak well of their competence
and people skills. They do not seem to realize that basic refrigeration
and heating is quite simple. The complexity comes from the newer
electronic controls and they know nothing about that other than swap
things until it works. A case in point was a neighbor that called a
professional because the blower motor in the furnace had stopped
working. The "pro" said the motor controller was bad, the board was no
longer available, so both the motor and controller needed replacing for
$800. The neighbor is a bit of a handyman so I asked him to bring the
control board to my house and I would look it over. One look and it was
obvious that there was a bad solder joint on the line input common mode
choke coil and a bit of solder restored it completely. I will bet not
one in a hundred of these "pros" even know what a common mode choke is.

David


The majority of HVAC techs have no idea how to do board level repairs.

Some of us do, but its not cost effective to do so.

I find cold solder joints all the time and am able to get a system up
and running without having to replace an expensive circuit board. The
catch is, how much time will it take to repair a one hundred dollar
circuit board vs $85.00 per hour.---- it's a simplified example.
Don't yap about how expensive most control boards are. Ask an HVAC
tech what wave soldering is and he/she/it smile and wave at you.

No, control boards are not free, and yes, some of us *DO* know what wave
soldering is.


Reflow soldering is a lot more common these days. With so much
surface mount, wave solder has lost a lot of market share.



I don't see that much surface mount on the majority of HVAC control
boards. I haven't seen the latest supercalafragilistic uber-efficient
HVAC system control boards but the simple ones are mostly single or
dual layer with components having leads soldered through holes. I
don't have customers who can afford that really high end stuff for
their homes.

TDD