I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

Cheers



Dave R


--
AMD FX-6300 in GA-990X-Gaming SLI-CF running Windows 7 Pro x64

---
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On 09/02/2019 15:04, David wrote:
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Don't you have real time access to current consumption through your
wizzy remote gadget? What else would you expect to see?

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

It won't.

--
Max Demian

On 09/02/2019 15:04, David wrote:
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am on.
8

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

By letting you use the tariff you are on.

"David" wrote in message
...
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

You wont have to pay the wages of the meter reader in what they
charge you for the electricity they supply you and if you are on a
time of use tariff as you likely are if the smartmeter is required for
you to have that tariff, you save by being able to time your higher
loads like washing machine and dishwasher runs when the
electricity is cheaper.

On 09/02/2019 15:04, David wrote:
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

The Government is making the energy suppliers roll out smart meters, and
imposes penalties if they fail.

https://www.theguardian.com/business...-meter-penalty

So you are helping your supplier avoid this penalty which may reduce
their costs which they are likely wanting to pass on to you.

--
Michael Chare

On Saturday, 9 February 2019 15:04:21 UTC, David WE Roberts (Google) wrote:
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

Cheers



Dave R


--
AMD FX-6300 in GA-990X-Gaming SLI-CF running Windows 7 Pro x64

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
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The ultimate purpose of the smart meter is for our brave new world of renewable energy when tariffs will be continuously varied depending on availability of electricity.
It will then be possible to make big savings.

On 09/02/2019 17:57, Max Demian wrote:
On 09/02/2019 15:04, David wrote:
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am
on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Don't you have real time access to current consumption through your
wizzy remote gadget? What else would you expect to see?

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

It won't.

It might save you a few pounds if you seek out the main contributors to
your base load once you can see it. If you already have an Owl or
equivalent realtime power monitor then it merely allows your supplier to
get a slightly smaller non-compliance with ridiculous target fine.

Personally I would not let them install a first generation smart meter
in my home even if it could get a mobile signal to work which it can't.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

Rod Speed wrote:


"David" wrote in message
...
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

You wont have to pay the wages of the meter reader in what they
charge you for the electricity they supply you and if you are on a
time of use tariff as you likely are if the smartmeter is required for
you to have that tariff, you save by being able to time your higher
loads like washing machine and dishwasher runs when the
electricity is cheaper.

We are on a 'time of use' tariff and don't have a smart meter, the
meter simply has two counters, one for peak and one for off-peak.

We see a meter reader once a year or less, the cost must be trivial.
We send 'real' readings by E-Mail monthly.

We have little or no mobile coverage so a smart meter probably won't
work anyway.

--
Chris Green
·

I would have thought the local terminal would let you know in real time, its
only the analysis by edf which is done periodically Otherwise how on earth
would tariffs like Economy 7 ever work on a smart meter. It has to be real
time measuring surely or its pointless both for the supplier and yourself.
Sounds to me like they don't understand their own kit.
Brian

--
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"David" wrote in message
...
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

Cheers



Dave R


--
AMD FX-6300 in GA-990X-Gaming SLI-CF running Windows 7 Pro x64

---
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It only saves you money if you react to the real time readings of usage. I
do have misgivings about the elderly being frightened by the huge
consumption going on with some stuff, like heaters and cookers and putting
their health at risk because of it. There needs to be some education here I
feel.

I tell people who are getting one that its always been the way it looks on
the remote device, its just that its now more 'in your face' unless you are
a person who sits in their meter cupboard watching the disc going around and
the needles moving, a pursuit probably only marginally less boring that
current TV viewing these days.
Brian

--
----- --
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The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Max Demian" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 09/02/2019 15:04, David wrote:
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am
on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Don't you have real time access to current consumption through your wizzy
remote gadget? What else would you expect to see?

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

It won't.

--
Max Demian

"Chris Green" wrote in message
...
Rod Speed wrote:


"David" wrote in message
...
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am
on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF
using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

You wont have to pay the wages of the meter reader in what they
charge you for the electricity they supply you and if you are on a
time of use tariff as you likely are if the smartmeter is required for
you to have that tariff, you save by being able to time your higher
loads like washing machine and dishwasher runs when the
electricity is cheaper.

We are on a 'time of use' tariff and don't have a smart meter, the
meter simply has two counters, one for peak and one for off-peak.

But his supplier clearly requires a smart meter for the tariff
he presumably chose because its the cheapest he could find.

We see a meter reader once a year or less, the cost must be trivial.

Much cheaper to read it electronically.

We send 'real' readings by E-Mail monthly.

And that isnt required with a smart meter.

We have little or no mobile coverage so a
smart meter probably won't work anyway.

But it clearly does work for him and for plenty of others.

I was told the new ones are the ones that can do the job properly, and have
updatable firmware. Not that I've been offered one since the talking
terminal has not yet come in in sufficient quantities apparently.
I guess if you go for faster data, then you can monitor it via a smart
phone. For some reason they will not let you get the meter onto your network
and hence be easy to get at on computers and phones. Is this perhaps a
security issue, or more to do with trying to keep the calculation of the
money as a black art?
Brian

--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Martin Brown" wrote in message
...
On 09/02/2019 17:57, Max Demian wrote:
On 09/02/2019 15:04, David wrote:
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am
on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Don't you have real time access to current consumption through your wizzy
remote gadget? What else would you expect to see?

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF
using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

It won't.

It might save you a few pounds if you seek out the main contributors to
your base load once you can see it. If you already have an Owl or
equivalent realtime power monitor then it merely allows your supplier to
get a slightly smaller non-compliance with ridiculous target fine.

Personally I would not let them install a first generation smart meter in
my home even if it could get a mobile signal to work which it can't.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

To be fair though, the big cock up in smart meter design and availability is
not of the energy companies making. These were supposed to have been
designed years ago by a company who got the contract. Its been a comedy of
errors ever since.
Brian

--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Michael Chare" wrote in message
...
On 09/02/2019 15:04, David wrote:
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am
on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

The Government is making the energy suppliers roll out smart meters, and
imposes penalties if they fail.

https://www.theguardian.com/business...-meter-penalty

So you are helping your supplier avoid this penalty which may reduce their
costs which they are likely wanting to pass on to you.

--
Michael Chare

On Sunday, 10 February 2019 09:33:05 UTC, Chris Green wrote:
Rod Speed wrote:
"David" wrote in message
...


Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

You wont have to pay the wages of the meter reader in what they
charge you for the electricity they supply you and if you are on a
time of use tariff as you likely are if the smartmeter is required for
you to have that tariff, you save by being able to time your higher
loads like washing machine and dishwasher runs when the
electricity is cheaper.

We are on a 'time of use' tariff and don't have a smart meter, the
meter simply has two counters, one for peak and one for off-peak.

We see a meter reader once a year or less, the cost must be trivial.
We send 'real' readings by E-Mail monthly.

1 - 5 minutes per house, say average 3 mins at (guess) £10 an hour = 50p a year. Adding employment costs increases that, but not to anything that makes it worth installing a smart meter for that purpose.


NT

We have little or no mobile coverage so a smart meter probably won't
work anyway.

On Sun, 10 Feb 2019 00:42:22 -0800 (PST), harry wrote:

The ultimate purpose of the smart meter is for our brave new world of
renewable energy when tariffs will be continuously varied depending on
availability of electricity. It will then be possible to make big
savings.

Only if you let the tail wag the dog. Base load is base load, there
is very little one can do about that unless you're still using
incandescant light bulbs.

Our next largest consumer is cooking, normally takes place close or
at the evening peak, odd that. Prices would have to be extremely
dynamic and guaranteed to make me shift cooking very far. Say normal
rate 15p kWHr and 1800 to 1830 50p kWHr but unless it was guranteed
to be back down to 15p at 1831 and I could see what my tariff
actually is, I'd just take the hit. No point in delaying the cooking
30 mins only to find that the next 30 mins is also 50p kWHr... I'd
also need to see these guaranteed prices at least 24, or better 48
hours, in advance so things can be planned.

What would be more useful would be a dynamic E7 tariff. You still got
your 7 hours reduced rate but those 7 hours could be split up into 30
min periods through out the day. There would have to be some
guarantee that the overall energy "stored" never fell below "zero".
ie an off period was never so long that it required more energy than
that provided by the previous on/off periods.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Sunday, 10 February 2019 09:46:49 UTC, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Sun, 10 Feb 2019 00:42:22 -0800 (PST), harry wrote:

The ultimate purpose of the smart meter is for our brave new world of
renewable energy when tariffs will be continuously varied depending on
availability of electricity. It will then be possible to make big
savings.

Only if you let the tail wag the dog. Base load is base load, there
is very little one can do about that unless you're still using
incandescant light bulbs.

Our next largest consumer is cooking, normally takes place close or
at the evening peak, odd that. Prices would have to be extremely
dynamic and guaranteed to make me shift cooking very far. Say normal
rate 15p kWHr and 1800 to 1830 50p kWHr but unless it was guranteed
to be back down to 15p at 1831 and I could see what my tariff
actually is, I'd just take the hit. No point in delaying the cooking
30 mins only to find that the next 30 mins is also 50p kWHr... I'd
also need to see these guaranteed prices at least 24, or better 48
hours, in advance so things can be planned.

Almost everyone would take the hit. The suppliers will be smiling at getting 50p a unit for a peak hour each day. That of course is the point. And they will insist on blaming it entirely on the intransigent & sometimes irresponsible consumer. Perfect.


What would be more useful would be a dynamic E7 tariff. You still got
your 7 hours reduced rate but those 7 hours could be split up into 30
min periods through out the day. There would have to be some
guarantee that the overall energy "stored" never fell below "zero".
ie an off period was never so long that it required more energy than
that provided by the previous on/off periods.

It would be pointless, and no supplier wants to slash prices like that.


NT

On 10/02/2019 09:39, Brian Gaff wrote:

I was told the new ones are the ones that can do the job properly, and have
updatable firmware. Not that I've been offered one since the talking
terminal has not yet come in in sufficient quantities apparently.
I guess if you go for faster data, then you can monitor it via a smart
phone. For some reason they will not let you get the meter onto your network
and hence be easy to get at on computers and phones. Is this perhaps a
security issue, or more to do with trying to keep the calculation of the
money as a black art?

Would you really want your electricity supplier to have access to your
home network? Are you (or anyone else) sure you would be able to stop
them from seeing the contents of your hard drives?

--
Max Demian

On 10/02/2019 06:13, Rod Speed wrote:


"FMurtz" wrote in message
...
David wrote:
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I
am on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF
using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

It won't save money

Corse it will when having one allows him to use a time of use tariff
and save money by doing the higher power operations like the
washing machine and dishwasher when the electricity costs less.

We already have a thing called Economy 7 that lets us do that. Cheaper
electricity from midnight to 7am or so; predictable so can be used with
storage and water heaters and run the washing machine overnight. Smart
meters could allow that in a much less predictable way at the whim of
the supplier who might decide that it would be better to have our main
meal in the evening rather than mid day.

--
Max Demian

On Sun, 10 Feb 2019 01:42:52 -0800 (PST), wrote:

We see a meter reader once a year or less, the cost must be
trivial.
We send 'real' readings by E-Mail monthly.

1 - 5 minutes per house, say average 3 mins at (guess) £10 an hour =
50p a year. Adding employment costs increases that, but not to anything
that makes it worth installing a smart meter for that purpose.

3 mins average to read a meter? Get real. Might just be able to
manage that from stepping over the threshold in and then back out.
But you need to add to that, walking back to van, looking up the next
place, driving to it, parking up, walking to door, waiting for
answer...

Round here 12 mins/meter (5/hour) would be more like it or
£2.00/meter. 25 million meters(?) = 50 million quid and about 3,000
meter readers to read every meter at least once a year. Plus cost of
maintenance. fuel, insurance, etc on 3,000 vans...

In a urban area you might get down to 5 mins/meter (12/hour) for one
of the "big six" or the supplier who was the original regional
company, but but not for all the other (50 odd?) smaller suppliers
with far lower "meter density".

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 10/02/2019 08:42, harry wrote:

The ultimate purpose of the smart meter is for our brave new world of renewable energy when tariffs will be continuously varied depending on availability of electricity.

And you'll have to pay ten times as much for each unit when the sun
isn't shining and there's no wind (or even too much wind).

In article , Max Demian
wrote:
On 10/02/2019 09:39, Brian Gaff wrote:

I was told the new ones are the ones that can do the job properly, and
have updatable firmware. Not that I've been offered one since the
talking terminal has not yet come in in sufficient quantities
apparently. I guess if you go for faster data, then you can monitor it
via a smart phone. For some reason they will not let you get the meter
onto your network and hence be easy to get at on computers and phones.
Is this perhaps a security issue, or more to do with trying to keep the
calculation of the money as a black art?

Would you really want your electricity supplier to have access to your
home network? Are you (or anyone else) sure you would be able to stop
them from seeing the contents of your hard drives?

Of course, if they turn off your supply via your home network, they won't
be able to turn it back on. ;-)

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On Sun, 10 Feb 2019 10:05:08 +0000, Max Demian wrote:

For some reason they will not let you get the meter onto your
network
and hence be easy to get at on computers and phones. Is this
perhaps a
security issue, or more to do with trying to keep the calculation
of
the money as a black art?

Would you really want your electricity supplier to have access to your
home network?

No but they don't need to have access to your network or you to have
access to the meter. The "meter" just needs to squirt the consumption
data out at regular intervals. As USB is limited to 5 m unless you
start using active cables, the data ought come out of the remote
display box which is far more likely to be within USB range of a PC.
The only communication between the box and PC would be the low level
stuff to establish the USB link. The PC then just listens to the
incoming data stream (XML formated say). In the box any data sent by
the PC isn't connected to anything so is "harmless".

This is how my "Current Cost" useage monitor works (except it sends a
TTL serial data stream but they do a TTL to USB convertor). It sends
live data every few seconds, then every minute or five historical
data, broken into a number of periods. Last 24 hours, last week, last
month I think, I only log the live data and do my own processing.

--
Cheers
Dave.

Dave Liquorice wrote:

On Sun, 10 Feb 2019 01:42:52 -0800 (PST), wrote:

We see a meter reader once a year or less, the cost must be
trivial.
We send 'real' readings by E-Mail monthly.

1 - 5 minutes per house, say average 3 mins at (guess) £10 an hour =
50p a year. Adding employment costs increases that, but not to anything
that makes it worth installing a smart meter for that purpose.

3 mins average to read a meter? Get real. Might just be able to
manage that from stepping over the threshold in and then back out.
But you need to add to that, walking back to van, looking up the next
place, driving to it, parking up, walking to door, waiting for
answer...

Round here 12 mins/meter (5/hour) would be more like it or
£2.00/meter. 25 million meters(?) = 50 million quid and about 3,000
meter readers to read every meter at least once a year. Plus cost of
maintenance. fuel, insurance, etc on 3,000 vans...

In a urban area you might get down to 5 mins/meter (12/hour) for one
of the "big six" or the supplier who was the original regional
company, but but not for all the other (50 odd?) smaller suppliers
with far lower "meter density".

My impression is that meter reading is done jointly for all the
suppliers. I don't know who runs the service or how it is paid for.


--

Roger Hayter

On Sun, 10 Feb 2019 11:15:15 +0000, Roger Hayter wrote:

In a urban area you might get down to 5 mins/meter (12/hour) for
one
of the "big six" or the supplier who was the original regional
company, but but not for all the other (50 odd?) smaller suppliers
with far lower "meter density".

My impression is that meter reading is done jointly for all the
suppliers. I don't know who runs the service or how it is paid for.

A given meter reading company (pretty sure there is more than one)
might read meters for more than one supplier but they only read the
meters that the supplier has asked them to. They don't just "walk
down the street" as used to happen in the old, single supplier, REC
days.

We have three supplies, normally from three different suppliers, they
all send their "own" meter reader(s). Currently two supplies are with
the same supplier but different accounts, I think we've had a seprate
reader for each account...

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Sun, 10 Feb 2019 10:20:19 -0000 (UTC), Jethro_uk wrote:

Only if you let the tail wag the dog. Base load is base load,
there is
very little one can do about that unless you're still using
incandescant light bulbs.

So ?

If you have to use the resource at x time, then you have to -
regardless of cost.

Exactly, though one can reduce base load consumption by using more
effcient devices, such as CFL or LED bulbs instead of incandescant.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 10/02/2019 11:43, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Sun, 10 Feb 2019 11:15:15 +0000, Roger Hayter wrote:

In a urban area you might get down to 5 mins/meter (12/hour) for
one
of the "big six" or the supplier who was the original regional
company, but but not for all the other (50 odd?) smaller suppliers
with far lower "meter density".

My impression is that meter reading is done jointly for all the
suppliers. I don't know who runs the service or how it is paid for.

A given meter reading company (pretty sure there is more than one)
might read meters for more than one supplier but they only read the
meters that the supplier has asked them to. They don't just "walk
down the street" as used to happen in the old, single supplier, REC
days.

We have three supplies, normally from three different suppliers, they
all send their "own" meter reader(s). Currently two supplies are with
the same supplier but different accounts, I think we've had a seprate
reader for each account...


Also very many nugatory visits to households where no one answers, or
where the meter reader is refused entry.

--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

On 10/02/2019 11:48, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Sun, 10 Feb 2019 10:20:19 -0000 (UTC), Jethro_uk wrote:

Only if you let the tail wag the dog. Base load is base load,
there is
very little one can do about that unless you're still using
incandescant light bulbs.

So ?

If you have to use the resource at x time, then you have to -
regardless of cost.

Exactly, though one can reduce base load consumption by using more
effcient devices, such as CFL or LED bulbs instead of incandescant.

One can.but a lot of base load here is computer equipment, fridges, the
motor that runs the sewage plant, the kettle, cooking, the electr[on]ics
that runs the CH and water heating...

It's like insulation. Once you have picked the low hanging fruit one
finds diminishing returns.


--
"First, find out who are the people you can not criticise. They are your
oppressors."
- George Orwell

On Sunday, 10 February 2019 10:16:15 UTC, Max Demian wrote:
On 10/02/2019 06:13, Rod Speed wrote:


"FMurtz" wrote in message
...
David wrote:
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I
am on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF
using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

It won't save money

Corse it will when having one allows him to use a time of use tariff
and save money by doing the higher power operations like the
washing machine and dishwasher when the electricity costs less.

We already have a thing called Economy 7 that lets us do that. Cheaper
electricity from midnight to 7am or so; predictable so can be used with
storage and water heaters and run the washing machine overnight. Smart
meters could allow that in a much less predictable way at the whim of
the supplier who might decide that it would be better to have our main
meal in the evening rather than mid day.

Though given the number of reports of fires due to domestic appliances, what once seemed an appealing way of saving money is now a questionable approach on safety grounds.

Yes, I know that the number of fires is still small and the number of people saving is large, but I am not at all sure that I would now be happy allowing my washing machine to run overnight. And most especially, not tumble dryer.

On 09/02/2019 15:04, David wrote:
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

Cheers



Dave R


It isn't.

Top posted for Brian.

I may be wrong but I don't think you get to interrogate the meter directly.

I seem to remember that you are (for at least some suppliers) required to
go to their web site for the results.

Anyway, I have a local clamp on device courtesy of Eon many years ago.


On Sun, 10 Feb 2019 09:30:41 +0000, Brian Gaff wrote:

I would have thought the local terminal would let you know in real time,
its only the analysis by edf which is done periodically Otherwise how on
earth would tariffs like Economy 7 ever work on a smart meter. It has to
be real time measuring surely or its pointless both for the supplier and
yourself. Sounds to me like they don't understand their own kit.
Brian





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How exactly does your smart phone get the data?

Does it read it directly from the meter infrastructure or does it go to
the supplier's web site?





On Sun, 10 Feb 2019 09:39:08 +0000, Brian Gaff wrote:

I was told the new ones are the ones that can do the job properly, and
have updatable firmware. Not that I've been offered one since the
talking terminal has not yet come in in sufficient quantities
apparently.
I guess if you go for faster data, then you can monitor it via a smart
phone. For some reason they will not let you get the meter onto your
network and hence be easy to get at on computers and phones. Is this
perhaps a security issue, or more to do with trying to keep the
calculation of the money as a black art?
Brian





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On 09/02/2019 20:55, Rod Speed wrote:


"David" wrote in message
...
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am
on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

You wont have to pay the wages of the meter reader in what they
charge you for the electricity they supply you and if you are on a
time of use tariff as you likely are if the smartmeter is required for
you to have that tariff, you save by being able to time your higher
loads like washing machine and dishwasher runs when the
electricity is cheaper.

and you really believe the company will lower their charges to take
account of no meter reader.
LED lights were supposed to save money, but the company just put up
their tariffs to compensate for their loss.

On 10/02/2019 08:42, harry wrote:
On Saturday, 9 February 2019 15:04:21 UTC, David WE Roberts (Google) wrote:
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

Cheers



Dave R


--
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The ultimate purpose of the smart meter is for our brave new world of renewable energy when tariffs will be continuously varied depending on availability of electricity.
It will then be possible to make big savings.

dont be silly harry

Rod Speed wrote:
You wont have to pay the wages of the meter reader in what they
charge you for the electricity they supply you and if you are on a
time of use tariff as you likely are if the smartmeter is required for
you to have that tariff, you save by being able to time your higher
loads like washing machine and dishwasher runs when the
electricity is cheaper.

We are on a 'time of use' tariff and don't have a smart meter, the
meter simply has two counters, one for peak and one for off-peak.

But his supplier clearly requires a smart meter for the tariff
he presumably chose because its the cheapest he could find.

You said "if you are on a time of use tariff as you likely are if
the smartmeter is required for you to have that tariff...", I was just
pointing out that it ain't necessarily so.


We see a meter reader once a year or less, the cost must be trivial.

Much cheaper to read it electronically.

Much cheaper than trivial is trivial! :-)


We send 'real' readings by E-Mail monthly.

And that isnt required with a smart meter.

Wow, I'd never have guessed.


We have little or no mobile coverage so a
smart meter probably won't work anyway.

But it clearly does work for him and for plenty of others.

And?


Yes, I know, it's pointless arguing with Rod, I'll not bother further
though I expect he will do his best to irritate me still. :-)

--
Chris Green
·

On Sunday, 10 February 2019 10:41:38 UTC, Mike Clarke wrote:
On 10/02/2019 08:42, harry wrote:

The ultimate purpose of the smart meter is for our brave new world of renewable energy when tariffs will be continuously varied depending on availability of electricity.

And you'll have to pay ten times as much for each unit when the sun
isn't shining and there's no wind (or even too much wind).

Ah. You're beginning to grasp the picture.
You'll probably be able to set up your home computer to switch off none essential equipment for you when it's expensive to run.

Eg fridge, freezer, immersion heater etc.Even large TVs. (Watch on smaller one instead)

On Sunday, 10 February 2019 14:46:01 UTC, critcher wrote:
On 10/02/2019 08:42, harry wrote:
On Saturday, 9 February 2019 15:04:21 UTC, David WE Roberts (Google) wrote:
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

Cheers



Dave R


--
AMD FX-6300 in GA-990X-Gaming SLI-CF running Windows 7 Pro x64

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
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The ultimate purpose of the smart meter is for our brave new world of renewable energy when tariffs will be continuously varied depending on availability of electricity.
It will then be possible to make big savings.

dont be silly harry

It's you being silly.
In Germany, you can be paid for using electricity

https://www.independent.co.uk/enviro...-a8141431.html

You're not very well informed are you?
Try to keep up!

Brian Gaff wrote

It only saves you money if you react to the real time readings of usage.

It also saves you money when you can use the tariff the supplier
will only allow those with smartmeters to use which is cheaper
than the tariff they charge if you don’t have a smartmeter.

And allows the supplier to read the meter much more
cheaply and in a very competitive market, that means
they can have a cheaper tariff than otherwise.

And if the supplier avoids the penalty for not having
enough smartmeters, you save money by not having
to pay that indirectly too.

I do have misgivings about the elderly being frightened by the huge
consumption going on with some stuff, like heaters and cookers and
putting their health at risk because of it. There needs to be some
education here I feel.

No real risk of putting your health at risk.

I tell people who are getting one that its always been the way it looks on
the remote device, its just that its now more 'in your face' unless you
are a person who sits in their meter cupboard watching the disc going
around and the needles moving, a pursuit probably only marginally less
boring that current TV viewing these days.

"Max Demian" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 09/02/2019 15:04, David wrote:
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am
on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Don't you have real time access to current consumption through your wizzy
remote gadget? What else would you expect to see?

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF
using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

It won't.

--
Max Demian

"Max Demian" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 10/02/2019 06:13, Rod Speed wrote:


"FMurtz" wrote in message
...
David wrote:
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am
on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF
using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

It won't save money

Corse it will when having one allows him to use a time of use tariff
and save money by doing the higher power operations like the
washing machine and dishwasher when the electricity costs less.

We already have a thing called Economy 7 that lets us do that.

The difference is that time of use tariffs can be rather
fancier than that. Ours mostly have 3 time bands, not
just two, with different rates for each band.

Cheaper electricity from midnight to 7am or so; predictable so can be used
with storage and water heaters and run the washing machine overnight.
Smart meters could allow that in a much less predictable way at the whim
of the supplier who might decide that it would be better to have our main
meal in the evening rather than mid day.

In fact they dont do stuff like that.

"polygonum_on_google" wrote in message
...
On Sunday, 10 February 2019 10:16:15 UTC, Max Demian wrote:
On 10/02/2019 06:13, Rod Speed wrote:


"FMurtz" wrote in message
...
David wrote:
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I
am on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every
30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have
enough
data to see daily trends.

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF
using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

It won't save money

Corse it will when having one allows him to use a time of use tariff
and save money by doing the higher power operations like the
washing machine and dishwasher when the electricity costs less.

We already have a thing called Economy 7 that lets us do that. Cheaper
electricity from midnight to 7am or so; predictable so can be used with
storage and water heaters and run the washing machine overnight. Smart
meters could allow that in a much less predictable way at the whim of
the supplier who might decide that it would be better to have our main
meal in the evening rather than mid day.

Though given the number of reports of fires due to domestic
appliances, what once seemed an appealing way of saving
money is now a questionable approach on safety grounds.

Yes, I know that the number of fires is still small and the
number of people saving is large, but I am not at all sure
that I would now be happy allowing my washing machine
to run overnight. And most especially, not tumble dryer.

Not hard to have a decent alarm that wakes you.

You should have some anyway.

"critcher" wrote in message
...
On 09/02/2019 20:55, Rod Speed wrote:


"David" wrote in message
...
I've booked my install because it is a requirement for the tariff I am
on.

Nearly at the end they ask if you want information collecting every 30
minutes, weekly or monthly (IIRC).

Well, if I'm going to get any value at all I might as well have enough
data to see daily trends.

Hang on, if I ask for 30 minute data capture I have to agree to EDF
using
the information to offer me services to improve my energy usage. So
reversing the privacy options that I have selected.

I'm having data collected monthly.

Remind me again how this Smart meter is going to save me money?

You wont have to pay the wages of the meter reader in what they
charge you for the electricity they supply you and if you are on a
time of use tariff as you likely are if the smartmeter is required for
you to have that tariff, you save by being able to time your higher
loads like washing machine and dishwasher runs when the
electricity is cheaper.

and you really believe the company will lower their charges to take
account of no meter reader.

Corse they do in a very competitive environment like that
when some have such low rates that they go broke.

LED lights were supposed to save money, but the company just put up their
tariffs to compensate for their loss.

Bull****. Lights are **** all of most bills.