ARWadsworth wrote:
charles wrote:
In article ,
ARWadsworth wrote:

[Snip]

Lights are not on the list. It's not needed in this case.

lights on a vehicle have to be in working order - even during
daylight hours.

The lights are not on the check list as we do not need the
apprentices to check them on a weekly basis because of the way the
vans are parked up at night.

Don't really want to **** you off Adam, but obligatory lights, tyres, oil,
horn, water and washer fluid should be checked on a daily basis by the
*driver* whether on a weekly 'list' or not - as your firm and drivers will
find out if the VOSA pulls the vehicles in for a roadside inspection, and if
these are involved in a serious accident and VOSA gets involved, they go
even deeper, and dig rather deeply into the history of the vehicles past
safety inspections (should be done monthly) along with their service and
maintenance records.

So just out of curiosity, are the vehicles being checked daily by the
driver, with the weekly 'list' simply being used as a part of a 'training
plan' for the apprentices?

Now from the comments you make here about those apprentices, its surprising
that the more hot-headed of them haven't decided to run a weekly 'hooter
test' and 'modify' your nose with their fist - and I wonder how many of
those comments of yours are actually factual!

Unbeliever wrote:
ARWadsworth wrote:
charles wrote:
In article ,
ARWadsworth wrote:

[Snip]

Lights are not on the list. It's not needed in this case.

lights on a vehicle have to be in working order - even during
daylight hours.

The lights are not on the check list as we do not need the
apprentices to check them on a weekly basis because of the way the
vans are parked up at night.

Don't really want to **** you off Adam, but obligatory lights, tyres,
oil, horn, water and washer fluid should be checked on a daily basis
by the *driver* whether on a weekly 'list' or not - as your firm and
drivers will find out if the VOSA pulls the vehicles in for a
roadside inspection, and if these are involved in a serious accident
and VOSA gets involved, they go even deeper, and dig rather deeply
into the history of the vehicles past safety inspections (should be
done monthly) along with their service and maintenance records.

So just out of curiosity, are the vehicles being checked daily by the
driver, with the weekly 'list' simply being used as a part of a
'training plan' for the apprentices?

Now from the comments you make here about those apprentices, its
surprising that the more hot-headed of them haven't decided to run a
weekly 'hooter test' and 'modify' your nose with their fist - and I
wonder how many of those comments of yours are actually factual!

Only one apprentice has ever hit me. I floored him and then I fired him. And
he was that stupid he waited in the car park for a lift home. So at 4pm he
had to make his own way back from Sheffield to Doncaster instead of doing it
at 1pm.

--
Adam

H. Neary wrote:
On Sat, 2 Jun 2012 22:17:47 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
On Sat, 2 Jun 2012 17:54:09 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

Clive George wrote:
On 02/06/2012 07:09, ARWadsworth wrote:

You shouldn't. Foul language and shouting betrays a lack
of education and an inability to communicate.

So how do you give out a bollocking then?

It's possible to do it without swearing or shouting, and
indeed can be more menacing that way. The quick shout can be
more appropriate though.

There are other ways

A couple of weeks ago an apprentice who I had asked to drill
some holes came back to me about 15 minutes later to tell me
the drill was not working. I told him to make sure there was
power to the drill (it was already in place as I had used it
earlier) and that the extension lead was plugged into a
transformer and that the transformer was plugged into a socket.
15 minutes later he came back and announced the drill was
broken. I warned him that if I had to get down from the tower
scaffold to plug the drill in I would punch him in the ********
and he needed to go and recheck the extension lead and
transformer as I was busy. He went away and 15 minutes later he
came back to say they were fine so I climbed down the scaffold
walked across to where I had earlier plugged the extension lead
into a transformer to find the extension lead plug sat on the
floor and not plugged in to a transformer.

Just as I pulled the van into the unit I punched him in the
********.


Oh well I assume his pay doesn't impact on the company too much.


The idiot must really be short of a few brain cells.


I would have
screamed in agony, rolled on the floor till the ambulance
arrived, had a month off work [ Or at the very least four working
days], and also contacted the police and a solicitor.

So are you are saying that you could not manage to plug in a 110V
extension lead to a 110V transformer?

No of couse not!

I'm saying that I would take full advantage of any physical assault
against me.

And lose your job!

What would you do to the apprentice then? Plugging an extension lead in is
easy and he needed to learn.a leasson.

--
Adam

On Sat, 02 Jun 2012 23:22:46 +0100, gremlin_95
wrote:

On 02/06/2012 21:58, H. Neary wrote:
On Sat, 2 Jun 2012 22:17:47 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
On Sat, 2 Jun 2012 17:54:09 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

Clive George wrote:
On 02/06/2012 07:09, ARWadsworth wrote:

You shouldn't. Foul language and shouting betrays a lack of
education and an inability to communicate.
So how do you give out a bollocking then?
It's possible to do it without swearing or shouting, and indeed
can be more menacing that way. The quick shout can be more
appropriate though.
There are other ways

A couple of weeks ago an apprentice who I had asked to drill some
holes came back to me about 15 minutes later to tell me the drill
was not working. I told him to make sure there was power to the
drill (it was already in place as I had used it earlier) and that
the extension lead was plugged into a transformer and that the
transformer was plugged into a socket. 15 minutes later he came
back and announced the drill was broken. I warned him that if I had
to get down from the tower scaffold to plug the drill in I would
punch him in the ******** and he needed to go and recheck the
extension lead and transformer as I was busy. He went away and 15
minutes later he came back to say they were fine so I climbed down
the scaffold walked across to where I had earlier plugged the
extension lead into a transformer to find the extension lead plug
sat on the floor and not plugged in to a transformer.

Just as I pulled the van into the unit I punched him in the
********.

Oh well I assume his pay doesn't impact on the company too much.


The idiot must really be short of a few brain cells.

I would have
screamed in agony, rolled on the floor till the ambulance arrived, had
a month off work [ Or at the very least four working days], and also
contacted the police and a solicitor.
So are you are saying that you could not manage to plug in a 110V extension
lead to a 110V transformer?
No of couse not!

I'm saying that I would take full advantage of any physical assault
against me.

HN

Well you're an idiot then. We lost a very good lecturer in college
recently because some **** reported him for giving him a quick poke when
telling him to get off his phone, no harm was caused by the 'poke' and
the guy wasn't even meant to be on his phone anyway!!! So now, one of
our units is gone completely tits up until this mess is sorted.

You justify an atttack and I'm an idiot? Really?

No one has the right to assault another person. How would you take it
if someone walked up and poked you, or is it a normal greeting in your
part of the country.

I went through many years of college and University and never saw
anyone get assaulted once. I is not a normal or acceptable form of
communication you know.

HN

On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 08:54:39 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
On Sat, 2 Jun 2012 22:17:47 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
On Sat, 2 Jun 2012 17:54:09 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

Clive George wrote:
On 02/06/2012 07:09, ARWadsworth wrote:

You shouldn't. Foul language and shouting betrays a lack
of education and an inability to communicate.

So how do you give out a bollocking then?

It's possible to do it without swearing or shouting, and
indeed can be more menacing that way. The quick shout can be
more appropriate though.

There are other ways

A couple of weeks ago an apprentice who I had asked to drill
some holes came back to me about 15 minutes later to tell me
the drill was not working. I told him to make sure there was
power to the drill (it was already in place as I had used it
earlier) and that the extension lead was plugged into a
transformer and that the transformer was plugged into a socket.
15 minutes later he came back and announced the drill was
broken. I warned him that if I had to get down from the tower
scaffold to plug the drill in I would punch him in the ********
and he needed to go and recheck the extension lead and
transformer as I was busy. He went away and 15 minutes later he
came back to say they were fine so I climbed down the scaffold
walked across to where I had earlier plugged the extension lead
into a transformer to find the extension lead plug sat on the
floor and not plugged in to a transformer.

Just as I pulled the van into the unit I punched him in the
********.


Oh well I assume his pay doesn't impact on the company too much.


The idiot must really be short of a few brain cells.


I would have
screamed in agony, rolled on the floor till the ambulance
arrived, had a month off work [ Or at the very least four working
days], and also contacted the police and a solicitor.

So are you are saying that you could not manage to plug in a 110V
extension lead to a 110V transformer?

No of couse not!

I'm saying that I would take full advantage of any physical assault
against me.

And lose your job!

What would you do to the apprentice then? Plugging an extension lead in is
easy and he needed to learn.a leasson.

I think by the time the HSE enquiry was over the apprentices job would
be safe for a while.

How did the apprentice make it past the interview? I would assume a
few O levels or the equivalent are needed.

Anyway I would inform the apprentice where he went wrong and on a
second occasion refuse to work with him. Sites can be dagerous places
an a clear understanding of the task and what is expected is an
absolute must.

HN

On Sun, 03 Jun 2012 11:06:11 +0100, gremlin_95
wrote:

On 03/06/2012 09:28, H. Neary wrote:

You justify an atttack and I'm an idiot? Really?

No one has the right to assault another person. How would you take it
if someone walked up and poked you, or is it a normal greeting in your
part of the country.

I went through many years of college and University and never saw
anyone get assaulted once. I is not a normal or acceptable form of
communication you know.

HN

Well it's just this 'claim' culture that annoys me. My point was, no
harm was really done at all by this so called assault.

I rest my case

I would say it was harmful. People are in college to be taught not
poked and prodded. Where does it stop?

If a lecturer has to resort to a phyusical assault to get a point
across then he is not fit for purpose!

HN

On 03/06/2012 09:28, H. Neary wrote:

You justify an atttack and I'm an idiot? Really?

No one has the right to assault another person. How would you take it
if someone walked up and poked you, or is it a normal greeting in your
part of the country.

I went through many years of college and University and never saw
anyone get assaulted once. I is not a normal or acceptable form of
communication you know.

HN

Well it's just this 'claim' culture that annoys me. My point was, no
harm was really done at all by this so called assault.

I rest my case

--
David

On Sun, 03 Jun 2012 12:12:44 +0100, Grimly Curmudgeon
wrote:

On Sun, 03 Jun 2012 09:28:57 +0100, H. Neary
wrote:

Well you're an idiot then. We lost a very good lecturer in college
recently because some **** reported him for giving him a quick poke when
telling him to get off his phone, no harm was caused by the 'poke' and
the guy wasn't even meant to be on his phone anyway!!! So now, one of
our units is gone completely tits up until this mess is sorted.

You justify an atttack and I'm an idiot? Really?

No one has the right to assault another person.

Oh, ffs. It's a question of intent. Please don't be an arse.

So there was no intention to assault then. Was the lecturer Insane or
did he suffer from some severe nervous trauma where he had no control
over his movements?


Suppose I were to come along and give you a quick poke, how would you
like it?

I could get a few friends in on the act too if you wanted, maybe a few
of your neighbours also. When they all hear how "right" it is, you
could enjoy being poked & prodded well into retirement.



HN

On Sun, 03 Jun 2012 09:28:57 +0100, H. Neary
wrote:

Well you're an idiot then. We lost a very good lecturer in college
recently because some **** reported him for giving him a quick poke when
telling him to get off his phone, no harm was caused by the 'poke' and
the guy wasn't even meant to be on his phone anyway!!! So now, one of
our units is gone completely tits up until this mess is sorted.

You justify an atttack and I'm an idiot? Really?

No one has the right to assault another person.

Oh, ffs. It's a question of intent. Please don't be an arse.

On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 13:24:42 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
On Sat, 02 Jun 2012 23:22:46 +0100, gremlin_95

Well you're an idiot then. We lost a very good lecturer in college
recently because some **** reported him for giving him a quick poke
when telling him to get off his phone, no harm was caused by the
'poke' and the guy wasn't even meant to be on his phone anyway!!!
So now, one of our units is gone completely tits up until this mess
is sorted.

You justify an atttack and I'm an idiot? Really?

No one has the right to assault another person. How would you take it
if someone walked up and poked you, or is it a normal greeting in your
part of the country.

I went through many years of college and University and never saw
anyone get assaulted once. I is not a normal or acceptable form of
communication you know.

Poking someone who is messing on their phone instead of learning is not
assault.
Really?

Try correcting youir postman, a traffic warden or a police officer
with a poke. Your learning experience would probably benefit a great
deal.

HN

On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 13:30:14 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
What would you do to the apprentice then? Plugging an extension
lead in is easy and he needed to learn.a leasson.

I think by the time the HSE enquiry was over the apprentices job would
be safe for a while.

Apprentices are disposable. If you want shut you get shut. There are lots of
easy ways to do this, some of them are legal.

How did the apprentice make it past the interview? I would assume a
few O levels or the equivalent are needed.

Qualifications mean sod all if you cannot plug an extension lead in.

Anyway I would inform the apprentice where he went wrong and on a
second occasion refuse to work with him. Sites can be dagerous places
an a clear understanding of the task and what is expected is an
absolute must.

Then you could never have an apprentice then. They always **** up even after
repeated instructions.

I had several apprentices in my younger days. I never resorted to
physical or verbal abuse. I seem to recollect that they were easily
distracted which could be a little irritating when tasks were not
completed. On the whole they performed well and were extremely well
motivated considering the pay was relatively poor in those days.

HN

On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 14:03:00 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 13:24:42 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
On Sat, 02 Jun 2012 23:22:46 +0100, gremlin_95


Well you're an idiot then. We lost a very good lecturer in
college recently because some **** reported him for giving him
a quick poke when telling him to get off his phone, no harm was
caused by the 'poke' and the guy wasn't even meant to be on his
phone anyway!!! So now, one of our units is gone completely
tits up until this mess is sorted.

You justify an atttack and I'm an idiot? Really?

No one has the right to assault another person. How would you
take it if someone walked up and poked you, or is it a normal
greeting in your part of the country.

I went through many years of college and University and never saw
anyone get assaulted once. I is not a normal or acceptable form of
communication you know.

Poking someone who is messing on their phone instead of learning is
not assault.
Really?

Try correcting youir postman, a traffic warden or a police officer
with a poke. Your learning experience would probably benefit a great
deal.

They are adults doing a job and I am not in charge of them. However if I was
training them or in charge of them I WOULD poke them if they were messing
about.

And I have been arrested for asaulting a police officer (but not charged).

You do not seem to be a fit person to be in charge of anyone.
Perhaps if you improved your communication skills and toned down your
language a bit you wouldn't find a need to resort to violence.

HN

H. Neary wrote:
On Sat, 02 Jun 2012 23:22:46 +0100, gremlin_95

Well you're an idiot then. We lost a very good lecturer in college
recently because some **** reported him for giving him a quick poke
when telling him to get off his phone, no harm was caused by the
'poke' and the guy wasn't even meant to be on his phone anyway!!!
So now, one of our units is gone completely tits up until this mess
is sorted.

You justify an atttack and I'm an idiot? Really?

No one has the right to assault another person. How would you take it
if someone walked up and poked you, or is it a normal greeting in your
part of the country.

I went through many years of college and University and never saw
anyone get assaulted once. I is not a normal or acceptable form of
communication you know.

Poking someone who is messing on their phone instead of learning is not
assault.

--
Adam

H. Neary wrote:
What would you do to the apprentice then? Plugging an extension
lead in is easy and he needed to learn.a leasson.

I think by the time the HSE enquiry was over the apprentices job would
be safe for a while.

Apprentices are disposable. If you want shut you get shut. There are lots of
easy ways to do this, some of them are legal.

How did the apprentice make it past the interview? I would assume a
few O levels or the equivalent are needed.

Qualifications mean sod all if you cannot plug an extension lead in.

Anyway I would inform the apprentice where he went wrong and on a
second occasion refuse to work with him. Sites can be dagerous places
an a clear understanding of the task and what is expected is an
absolute must.

Then you could never have an apprentice then. They always **** up even after
repeated instructions.

--
Adam

dennis@home wrote:
"Clive George" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 02/06/2012 07:09, ARWadsworth wrote:

You shouldn't. Foul language and shouting betrays a lack of
education and an inability to communicate.

So how do you give out a bollocking then?

It's possible to do it without swearing or shouting, and indeed can
be more menacing that way. The quick shout can be more appropriate
though.

Foul language is a good way to make them all laugh at you.
In better educated circles we never use foul language and can get
along without it.

Claiming you are better educated than me dennis?

--
Adam

tony sayer wrote:
In article , ARWadsworth
adamwadsworth@blue yonder.co.uk scribeth thus
Davey wrote:
On Fri, 1 Jun 2012 10:51:00 -0700 (PDT)
harry wrote:

On Jun 1, 6:45 pm, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:
1. Not doing the weekly vehicle checks [1] properly and
letting vans go out with bald tyres.

2. Putting 6.30am down on his time sheets instead of 8.00am -
Apprentices do not get paid travel time. Although to be fair
one of the electricians told him to put 6.30 on his sheets
just to see him get into trouble when he asked what time to
put on the sheets. (same apprentice also got a bollocking for
doing the same a few months ago)

3. Using "text speak" on his job report forms. I heard the
words "I do not want to read **** like that" shouted as he
handed them in.

[1] All vehicle checks have a signed and dated form so we
know who checks which van each week.

--

Adam

OOOOO, you are evil.
How detailed a vehicle check do you expect?

Have they got to check the oil?

Reasonable..

How about brake fluid?

Ditto..

How about track rod ends?

MOT item really, they don't usually develop sudden serious wear
whereas Oil disappearing quickly as with Brake fluid is serious..


How about excessive emissions?

Well clouds of smoke are likely to attract Plods attention so common
sense really needed here..

When I drove someones van all I checked was petrol oil and
water.

Not tyres, the things most likely to get you in trouble, before
defective lights?

Lights are not on the list. It's not needed in this case.



Well its in apprentices best interests to check, after all its his
"licence" that will get the blame, driver responsible for the
condition of his vehicle.

Commendable to see that Adam is enforcing these checks.....

I have my own van. I would not let those daft little *******s check it.

--
Adam

Unbeliever wrote:
ARWadsworth wrote:
charles wrote:
In article ,
ARWadsworth wrote:

[Snip]

Lights are not on the list. It's not needed in this case.

lights on a vehicle have to be in working order - even during
daylight hours.

The lights are not on the check list as we do not need the
apprentices to check them on a weekly basis because of the way the
vans are parked up at night.

Don't really want to **** you off Adam, but obligatory lights, tyres,
oil, horn, water and washer fluid should be checked on a daily basis
by the *driver* whether on a weekly 'list' or not - as your firm and
drivers will find out if the VOSA pulls the vehicles in for a
roadside inspection, and if these are involved in a serious accident
and VOSA gets involved, they go even deeper, and dig rather deeply
into the history of the vehicles past safety inspections (should be
done monthly) along with their service and maintenance records.

So just out of curiosity, are the vehicles being checked daily by the
driver, with the weekly 'list' simply being used as a part of a
'training plan' for the apprentices?

I check my tyres occasionally. I never check the oil (the van does that for
me). I fill the washer bottle up weekly. I test the horn when a ****** gets
in the way. I never check the water level.
I test the rear lights by looking in my mirrors when reversing.


However this is my van with no other drivers.

When I did have a small radiator leak it was obvious that it had a leak as
the temperature gauge showed the engine was warming up faster than normal
(and that was with only a litre having gone).

I know my van and I watch for these things. I also do not kerb the van so I
have no need to worry about the tracking. Generally I can guess by the
mileage when the tyres wll need changing.


--
Adam

H. Neary wrote:
On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 13:24:42 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
On Sat, 02 Jun 2012 23:22:46 +0100, gremlin_95


Well you're an idiot then. We lost a very good lecturer in
college recently because some **** reported him for giving him
a quick poke when telling him to get off his phone, no harm was
caused by the 'poke' and the guy wasn't even meant to be on his
phone anyway!!! So now, one of our units is gone completely
tits up until this mess is sorted.

You justify an atttack and I'm an idiot? Really?

No one has the right to assault another person. How would you
take it if someone walked up and poked you, or is it a normal
greeting in your part of the country.

I went through many years of college and University and never saw
anyone get assaulted once. I is not a normal or acceptable form of
communication you know.

Poking someone who is messing on their phone instead of learning is
not assault.
Really?

Try correcting youir postman, a traffic warden or a police officer
with a poke. Your learning experience would probably benefit a great
deal.

They are adults doing a job and I am not in charge of them. However if I was
training them or in charge of them I WOULD poke them if they were messing
about.

And I have been arrested for asaulting a police officer (but not charged).

--
Adam

On Sun, 03 Jun 2012 12:44:02 +0100, H. Neary wrote:

On the whole they performed well and were extremely well motivated
considering the pay was relatively poor in those days.

Unless you have a generous company it is pretty bad
now:

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/employme...onalminimumwag
e/dg_10027201

"£2.60 - the apprentice rate, for apprentices under 19 or 19 or over
and in the first year of their apprenticeship."

Goes up by 5p in October, wow.

It doesn't say what you get as an apprentice over 19 and in your 2nd
year or greater. Maybe apprenticeships these days don't last
12months?

--
Cheers
Dave.

H. Neary wrote:
Try correcting youir postman, a traffic warden or a police officer
with a poke. Your learning experience would probably benefit a
great deal.

They are adults doing a job and I am not in charge of them. However
if I was training them or in charge of them I WOULD poke them if
they were messing about.

And I have been arrested for asaulting a police officer (but not
charged).

You do not seem to be a fit person to be in charge of anyone.
Perhaps if you improved your communication skills and toned down your
language a bit you wouldn't find a need to resort to violence.


There is work to be done and it wants doing properly. If they are going to
mess around, cut corners and lie instead of doing the work they will get
shouted and sworn at. I do not have the option of refusing to work with them
again if they **** up on a second occasion. I have to get them into shape
and they do not listen to reason so shouting and swearing has to be used.
It's a tough world out there and they need to get real about it.

--
Adam

On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 14:59:55 +0100, tony sayer
wrote:

The idiot must really be short of a few brain cells.

I would have
screamed in agony, rolled on the floor till the ambulance arrived, had
a month off work [ Or at the very least four working days], and also
contacted the police and a solicitor.
So are you are saying that you could not manage to plug in a 110V extension
lead to a 110V transformer?
No of couse not!

I'm saying that I would take full advantage of any physical assault
against me.

HN

Well you're an idiot then. We lost a very good lecturer in college
recently because some **** reported him for giving him a quick poke when
telling him to get off his phone, no harm was caused by the 'poke' and
the guy wasn't even meant to be on his phone anyway!!! So now, one of
our units is gone completely tits up until this mess is sorted.


That sort of thing happened where I worked when I was younger and in a
way was expected behaviour and accepted and at school as well..

I seriously don't think it did me and anyone I worked with and was at
school with any harm at all, just we learnt to behave and respect others
that bit quicker...

And No its no excuse for long term systematic abuse anywhere either...

There is a separation between the two..

There is no seperation. Physical assault doesn't become acceptable
just because it is a one off.

I'm sure the systematic abuse that is still coming to light in church
schools, orphanages, detetion centres etc, didn't start with any
intention of prolonged repeated assaults either.

To bully someone just because he is a few steps below you on the
professional ladder is a pretty lame and despicable thing to do.

I would tend to wonder about the motives behind this thuggery
incidentally. When I did my "apprenticeship" I and the three or four
others working for the company had the benefit of day release, and
this gave us a technical knowledge of the subject that far exceeded
some of the engineers, who quite often were in place because of
experience in a field that was by this time mutating rapidly.

The professional jealousy coupled with the threats to their careers
was probably the reason behind the arrogance and insults a few were so
keen to dish out.

Although it never happened I am reasonably certain any assault on an
apprentice at my workplace even in those days would have been met with
instant dismissal.


HN

Well its in apprentices best interests to check, after all its his
"licence" that will get the blame, driver responsible for the
condition of his vehicle.

Commendable to see that Adam is enforcing these checks.....

I have my own van. I would not let those daft little *******s check it.

No Adam, for their benefit otherwise who will they learn;?..

After all what happens to young drivers?, they get "past" the test get a
car and who teaches them anything else?...
--
Tony Sayer

Everyone is expected to know what is required of them and perform
accordingly.

Does this include apprentices?


We don't have them. Someone straight from full time education would
probably be allocated a position in "spreadsheet land" before they
went to site.

I never see youngsters on site. The last time I saw what I assumed
were apprentices, they were pulling cables through at a water
treatment works ten years back. They worked for a well known firm of
Welsh Electrical contractors. I remember them because of the stupid
infighting they had with each other, and even watched a pair being
seperated by their colleagues.

I don't think the company still employs such people. Behaviour like
that is not on, indeed on a recent FAT, I saw no one under 25 on their
premises [Apart from the somewhat scenic receptionist of course].

HN

So how do the young learn anything useful if industry doesn't teach them
anything?.

They can't learn it all in school or tech college...

--
Tony Sayer

The idiot must really be short of a few brain cells.

I would have
screamed in agony, rolled on the floor till the ambulance arrived, had
a month off work [ Or at the very least four working days], and also
contacted the police and a solicitor.
So are you are saying that you could not manage to plug in a 110V extension
lead to a 110V transformer?
No of couse not!

I'm saying that I would take full advantage of any physical assault
against me.

HN

Well you're an idiot then. We lost a very good lecturer in college
recently because some **** reported him for giving him a quick poke when
telling him to get off his phone, no harm was caused by the 'poke' and
the guy wasn't even meant to be on his phone anyway!!! So now, one of
our units is gone completely tits up until this mess is sorted.


That sort of thing happened where I worked when I was younger and in a
way was expected behaviour and accepted and at school as well..

I seriously don't think it did me and anyone I worked with and was at
school with any harm at all, just we learnt to behave and respect others
that bit quicker...

And No its no excuse for long term systematic abuse anywhere either...

There is a separation between the two..
--
Tony Sayer

I went through many years of college and University and never saw
anyone get assaulted once. I is not a normal or acceptable form of
communication you know.

HN

Not everyone goes to Uni .. some have differing routes in the world....
--
Tony Sayer

On Sun, 03 Jun 2012 13:13:19 +0100, H. Neary wrote:

On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 14:03:00 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 13:24:42 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
On Sat, 02 Jun 2012 23:22:46 +0100, gremlin_95


Well you're an idiot then. We lost a very good lecturer in
college recently because some **** reported him for giving him a
quick poke when telling him to get off his phone, no harm was
caused by the 'poke' and the guy wasn't even meant to be on his
phone anyway!!! So now, one of our units is gone completely tits
up until this mess is sorted.

You justify an atttack and I'm an idiot? Really?

No one has the right to assault another person. How would you take
it if someone walked up and poked you, or is it a normal greeting
in your part of the country.

I went through many years of college and University and never saw
anyone get assaulted once. I is not a normal or acceptable form of
communication you know.

Poking someone who is messing on their phone instead of learning is
not assault.
Really?

Try correcting youir postman, a traffic warden or a police officer
with a poke. Your learning experience would probably benefit a great
deal.

They are adults doing a job and I am not in charge of them. However if I
was training them or in charge of them I WOULD poke them if they were
messing about.

And I have been arrested for asaulting a police officer (but not
charged).

You do not seem to be a fit person to be in charge of anyone. Perhaps if
you improved your communication skills and toned down your language a
bit you wouldn't find a need to resort to violence.

If the need and occasion arose, I would be happy to send either of my
sons to be an apprentice with Adam.

--
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
http://www.mirrorservice.org

*lightning protection* - a w_tom conductor

On Sun, 03 Jun 2012 11:35:13 +0100, H. Neary
wrote:

Oh, ffs. It's a question of intent. Please don't be an arse.

So there was no intention to assault then. Was the lecturer Insane or
did he suffer from some severe nervous trauma where he had no control
over his movements?


Suppose I were to come along and give you a quick poke, how would you
like it?

I could get a few friends in on the act too if you wanted, maybe a few
of your neighbours also. When they all hear how "right" it is, you
could enjoy being poked & prodded well into retirement.

Sorry, but you've reductio ad absurded yourself into arsedom.

"tony sayer" wrote in message
...

Everyone is expected to know what is required of them and perform
accordingly.

Does this include apprentices?


We don't have them. Someone straight from full time education would
probably be allocated a position in "spreadsheet land" before they
went to site.

I never see youngsters on site. The last time I saw what I assumed
were apprentices, they were pulling cables through at a water
treatment works ten years back. They worked for a well known firm of
Welsh Electrical contractors. I remember them because of the stupid
infighting they had with each other, and even watched a pair being
seperated by their colleagues.

I don't think the company still employs such people. Behaviour like
that is not on, indeed on a recent FAT, I saw no one under 25 on their
premises [Apart from the somewhat scenic receptionist of course].

HN

So how do the young learn anything useful if industry doesn't teach them
anything?.

They can't learn it all in school or tech college...

Adam doesn't want to teach them anything..
If he did they would get his job.

On 02/06/2012 20:24, H. Neary wrote:
On Sat, 02 Jun 2012 18:00:23 +0100, Tim Streater
wrote:

In ,
H. wrote:

One in particular where an electrical commissioning Engineer
valved of the delivery of a pump I was calibrating.

What does this mean? Is it even English?


Valved off = closed the valve on the delivery side of a pump. [ Bad
move, increases pressure].

Electrical commissioning Engineer = Person with an electrical
qualification that gets a project working.

Delivery = output

Pump = see Wikipedia

Calibrating = comparing perfomance with a known standard.

I sincerely hope this is of assistance. Do you not think that this NG
is maybe a little outside your abilities BTW?



At the risk of invoking Muphry's law your original use of "of" instead
of "off" didn't help.

Andy

On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 16:35:24 +0000 (UTC), Steve Firth
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
On Sat, 02 Jun 2012 23:22:46 +0100, gremlin_95
wrote:
[snip]

You justify an atttack and I'm an idiot? Really?

The two are not mutually exclusive.

No one has the right to assault another person.

Oh I don't know. The BMW driver who tried to ram into my vehicle yesterday
because he didn't know how to join a motorway, or use his mirrors or notice
that I was being overtaken hence could not move into lane 2 deserved a
slap. He didn't deserve a big slap until he overtook me then slowed down to
make pointing at his eyes gestures. It wasn't me that needed specs it was
the twerp trying to out-accelerate a vehicle that had already passed him
before he pulled the fool trick of trying to accelerate up the inside of
said vehicle.

Yes indeed, give the plonker a hiding. Then scrap the courts, who
needs formal justice if punishment can be carried out instantly?

Scrap the police next.

Who needs them?


I live in a city where north and south are linked by a fast dual
carriageway with a large number of sliproads. We also have the
thickest drivers in the UK. Almost all of them rely the vehicles on
the dual carriagway to alter speed to allow them in.

A chain of these cretins will drive nose to tail down the sliproad and
not once consider that traffic on the carriageway may not be in a
position to slam the brakes on or move to the right.

I have felt a certain animosity toward these morons, and indeed as the
demise of the elderly Fiat is coming up soon, I will feel very
disinclined to move over and put myself and anyone trying to overtake
at risk.

I still wouldn't get nasty though.

HN

On Jun 2, 8:30*pm, H. Neary wrote:

The idiot must really be short of a few brain cells. I would have
screamed in agony, rolled on the floor till the ambulance arrived, had
a month off work [ Or at the very least four working days], and also
contacted the police and a solicitor.

HN

Since you seem (rightly) offended by the notion of assault, how do you
justify insurance fraud?

dennis@home wrote:
"tony sayer" wrote in message
...

Everyone is expected to know what is required of them and
perform accordingly.

Does this include apprentices?


We don't have them. Someone straight from full time education
would probably be allocated a position in "spreadsheet land"
before they went to site.

I never see youngsters on site. The last time I saw what I assumed
were apprentices, they were pulling cables through at a water
treatment works ten years back. They worked for a well known firm
of Welsh Electrical contractors. I remember them because of the
stupid infighting they had with each other, and even watched a
pair being seperated by their colleagues.

I don't think the company still employs such people. Behaviour
like that is not on, indeed on a recent FAT, I saw no one under
25 on their premises [Apart from the somewhat scenic receptionist
of course]. HN

So how do the young learn anything useful if industry doesn't teach
them anything?.

They can't learn it all in school or tech college...

Adam doesn't want to teach them anything..
If he did they would get his job.

I prefer to teach them to think for themselves. Something that we do not
often do these days.

I set the apprentices tasks and challenges that mean they have to think for
themselves instead of me just wiping their arses. They do not like it. They
like to live in a world where they are protected by their Mother and have
everything done for them.


--
Adam

H. Neary wrote:
On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 14:59:55 +0100, tony sayer
wrote:

The idiot must really be short of a few brain cells.

I would have
screamed in agony, rolled on the floor till the ambulance
arrived, had a month off work [ Or at the very least four
working days], and also contacted the police and a
solicitor.
So are you are saying that you could not manage to plug in a
110V extension lead to a 110V transformer?
No of couse not!

I'm saying that I would take full advantage of any physical
assault against me.

HN

Well you're an idiot then. We lost a very good lecturer in college
recently because some **** reported him for giving him a quick
poke when telling him to get off his phone, no harm was caused by
the 'poke' and the guy wasn't even meant to be on his phone
anyway!!! So now, one of our units is gone completely tits up
until this mess is sorted.


That sort of thing happened where I worked when I was younger and
in a way was expected behaviour and accepted and at school as well..

I seriously don't think it did me and anyone I worked with and was
at school with any harm at all, just we learnt to behave and
respect others that bit quicker...

And No its no excuse for long term systematic abuse anywhere
either...

There is a separation between the two..

There is no seperation. Physical assault doesn't become acceptable
just because it is a one off.

Poking someone for ****ing around with their mobile phone is NOT assault.

--
Adam

On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 17:31:13 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 14:59:55 +0100, tony sayer
wrote:

The idiot must really be short of a few brain cells.

I would have
screamed in agony, rolled on the floor till the ambulance
arrived, had a month off work [ Or at the very least four
working days], and also contacted the police and a
solicitor.
So are you are saying that you could not manage to plug in a
110V extension lead to a 110V transformer?
No of couse not!

I'm saying that I would take full advantage of any physical
assault against me.

HN

Well you're an idiot then. We lost a very good lecturer in college
recently because some **** reported him for giving him a quick
poke when telling him to get off his phone, no harm was caused by
the 'poke' and the guy wasn't even meant to be on his phone
anyway!!! So now, one of our units is gone completely tits up
until this mess is sorted.


That sort of thing happened where I worked when I was younger and
in a way was expected behaviour and accepted and at school as well..

I seriously don't think it did me and anyone I worked with and was
at school with any harm at all, just we learnt to behave and
respect others that bit quicker...

And No its no excuse for long term systematic abuse anywhere
either...

There is a separation between the two..

There is no seperation. Physical assault doesn't become acceptable
just because it is a one off.

Poking someone for ****ing around with their mobile phone is NOT assault.

It most certainly is!

Try poking the next person you see using a mobile, you may welol find
out how erronious that statement is.

HN

H. Neary wrote:
On Sat, 02 Jun 2012 23:22:46 +0100, gremlin_95
wrote:
[snip]

You justify an atttack and I'm an idiot? Really?

The two are not mutually exclusive.

No one has the right to assault another person.

Oh I don't know. The BMW driver who tried to ram into my vehicle yesterday
because he didn't know how to join a motorway, or use his mirrors or notice
that I was being overtaken hence could not move into lane 2 deserved a
slap. He didn't deserve a big slap until he overtook me then slowed down to
make pointing at his eyes gestures. It wasn't me that needed specs it was
the twerp trying to out-accelerate a vehicle that had already passed him
before he pulled the fool trick of trying to accelerate up the inside of
said vehicle.

On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 09:20:54 -0700 (PDT), mike
wrote:

On Jun 2, 8:30*pm, H. Neary wrote:

The idiot must really be short of a few brain cells. I would have
screamed in agony, rolled on the floor till the ambulance arrived, had
a month off work [ Or at the very least four working days], and also
contacted the police and a solicitor.

HN

Since you seem (rightly) offended by the notion of assault, how do you
justify insurance fraud?


It isn't insurance fraud. The HSE have a duty to inspect reportable
incidents and if some criminal assaulted me I would take quite a while
to recover from the effects. I would certainly not want to return to a
job where older men payed unwanted interest in, and interfered with my
genitalia in a hurry.

I have never yet seen a contract of employment requiring staff to take
abuse and physical punishment as part of the package.

HN

H. Neary wrote:
On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 14:03:00 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 13:24:42 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
On Sat, 02 Jun 2012 23:22:46 +0100, gremlin_95


Well you're an idiot then. We lost a very good lecturer in
college recently because some **** reported him for giving
him a quick poke when telling him to get off his phone, no
harm was caused by the 'poke' and the guy wasn't even meant
to be on his phone anyway!!! So now, one of our units is
gone completely tits up until this mess is sorted.

You justify an atttack and I'm an idiot? Really?

No one has the right to assault another person. How would you
take it if someone walked up and poked you, or is it a normal
greeting in your part of the country.

I went through many years of college and University and never
saw anyone get assaulted once. I is not a normal or
acceptable form of communication you know.

Poking someone who is messing on their phone instead of
learning is not assault.
Really?

Try correcting youir postman, a traffic warden or a police officer
with a poke. Your learning experience would probably benefit a
great deal.

They are adults doing a job and I am not in charge of them. However
if I was training them or in charge of them I WOULD poke them if
they were messing about.

And I have been arrested for asaulting a police officer (but not
charged).

You do not seem to be a fit person to be in charge of anyone.
Perhaps if you improved your communication skills and toned down your
language a bit you wouldn't find a need to resort to violence.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFQcxYZz628&list

--
Adam

On Sun, 03 Jun 2012 15:44:42 +0100, Grimly Curmudgeon
wrote:

On Sun, 03 Jun 2012 11:35:13 +0100, H. Neary
wrote:

Oh, ffs. It's a question of intent. Please don't be an arse.

So there was no intention to assault then. Was the lecturer Insane or
did he suffer from some severe nervous trauma where he had no control
over his movements?


Suppose I were to come along and give you a quick poke, how would you
like it?

I could get a few friends in on the act too if you wanted, maybe a few
of your neighbours also. When they all hear how "right" it is, you
could enjoy being poked & prodded well into retirement.

Sorry, but you've reductio ad absurded yourself into arsedom.

You just dont get it do you?

When is a poke allowed and acceptable, how hard should the poke be,
under what circumstances can it be applied, what age group should the
poke be limited to, how many pokes are acceptable in the course of a
day, month, year?

Should these pokes be delivered in private so as not to cause a loss
of self esteem to the victim being poked.

Why do you find it so objectionable when I ask you how you would react
to being poked, yet you consider it to be fair play when applied to
others.

As I suggested to the apprentice abuser, go poke a policeman, then you
will see how acceptable a means of interaction it is.

HN

On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 19:04:47 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 17:31:13 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 14:59:55 +0100, tony sayer
wrote:

The idiot must really be short of a few brain cells.

I would have
screamed in agony, rolled on the floor till the
ambulance arrived, had a month off work [ Or at the
very least four working days], and also contacted the
police and a solicitor.
So are you are saying that you could not manage to plug
in a 110V extension lead to a 110V transformer?
No of couse not!

I'm saying that I would take full advantage of any physical
assault against me.

HN

Well you're an idiot then. We lost a very good lecturer in
college recently because some **** reported him for giving
him a quick poke when telling him to get off his phone, no
harm was caused by the 'poke' and the guy wasn't even meant
to be on his phone anyway!!! So now, one of our units is gone
completely tits up until this mess is sorted.


That sort of thing happened where I worked when I was younger
and in a way was expected behaviour and accepted and at school
as well..

I seriously don't think it did me and anyone I worked with and
was at school with any harm at all, just we learnt to behave and
respect others that bit quicker...

And No its no excuse for long term systematic abuse anywhere
either...

There is a separation between the two..

There is no seperation. Physical assault doesn't become acceptable
just because it is a one off.

Poking someone for ****ing around with their mobile phone is NOT
assault.

It most certainly is!

Try poking the next person you see using a mobile, you may welol find
out how erronious that statement is.


It's not assault if I am charge of the person using the phone.

Rubbish!


HN

On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 17:31:13 +0100, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:

H. Neary wrote:
On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 14:59:55 +0100, tony sayer
wrote:

The idiot must really be short of a few brain cells.

I would have
screamed in agony, rolled on the floor till the ambulance
arrived, had a month off work [ Or at the very least four
working days], and also contacted the police and a
solicitor.
So are you are saying that you could not manage to plug in a
110V extension lead to a 110V transformer?
No of couse not!

I'm saying that I would take full advantage of any physical
assault against me.

HN

Well you're an idiot then. We lost a very good lecturer in college
recently because some **** reported him for giving him a quick
poke when telling him to get off his phone, no harm was caused by
the 'poke' and the guy wasn't even meant to be on his phone
anyway!!! So now, one of our units is gone completely tits up
until this mess is sorted.


That sort of thing happened where I worked when I was younger and
in a way was expected behaviour and accepted and at school as well..

I seriously don't think it did me and anyone I worked with and was
at school with any harm at all, just we learnt to behave and
respect others that bit quicker...

And No its no excuse for long term systematic abuse anywhere
either...

There is a separation between the two..

There is no seperation. Physical assault doesn't become acceptable
just because it is a one off.

Poking someone for ****ing around with their mobile phone is NOT assault.


I didn't think you were into poking too. Is that as eciting as
assaulting their genitalia?

HN