I'm looking for a traditional lever action .3030 saddle gun, but I
find I'm actually more impressed with the Marlin 336 compared to a
traditional Winchester 94.

It seemed like the working parts just fit together better - crisp and
clean action, and a stronger flat-top top frame.

And I like that the bolt can be removed easily for cleaning like a
breech loader...

I shoot open sights, so the ejection port and the scope mounts are
not all that important to me.
And no, I don't think I need the lever operated bayonet option.

Mostly I'd shoot 150 grain factory Winchester loads.

I wanted to ask if anyone else had any experience with either rifle.

Anything in particular to pay attention to?

Likes or dislikes.

How old is the Win 94 ? I have a 15 year old one maybe and it was
made before they were shipped overseas to be made. Japan as I recall,
maybe that was only the stock. Odd at that even.

I was cautioned at the time to see. Mine a walnut. Some were hard pine.

Winchester ammo isn't made by Winchester anymore either. :-) such
turn in the industry through the years.

Martin

On 2/19/2013 11:20 PM, Richard wrote:
I'm looking for a traditional lever action .3030 saddle gun, but I
find I'm actually more impressed with the Marlin 336 compared to a
traditional Winchester 94.

It seemed like the working parts just fit together better - crisp and
clean action, and a stronger flat-top top frame.

And I like that the bolt can be removed easily for cleaning like a
breech loader...

I shoot open sights, so the ejection port and the scope mounts are
not all that important to me.
And no, I don't think I need the lever operated bayonet option.

Mostly I'd shoot 150 grain factory Winchester loads.

I wanted to ask if anyone else had any experience with either rifle.

Anything in particular to pay attention to?

Likes or dislikes.

The Winchester is a 73 model. Walnut, it appears.

The Marlin is brand new in the box.


On 2/19/2013 11:36 PM, Martin Eastburn wrote:
How old is the Win 94 ? I have a 15 year old one maybe and it was
made before they were shipped overseas to be made. Japan as I recall,
maybe that was only the stock. Odd at that even.

I was cautioned at the time to see. Mine a walnut. Some were hard pine.

Winchester ammo isn't made by Winchester anymore either. :-) such
turn in the industry through the years.

Martin

On 2/19/2013 11:20 PM, Richard wrote:
I'm looking for a traditional lever action .3030 saddle gun, but I
find I'm actually more impressed with the Marlin 336 compared to a
traditional Winchester 94.

It seemed like the working parts just fit together better - crisp and
clean action, and a stronger flat-top top frame.

And I like that the bolt can be removed easily for cleaning like a
breech loader...

I shoot open sights, so the ejection port and the scope mounts are
not all that important to me.
And no, I don't think I need the lever operated bayonet option.

Mostly I'd shoot 150 grain factory Winchester loads.

I wanted to ask if anyone else had any experience with either rifle.

Anything in particular to pay attention to?

Likes or dislikes.

"Richard" wrote in message
news
I'm looking for a traditional lever action .3030 saddle gun, but I
find I'm actually more impressed with the Marlin 336 compared to a
traditional Winchester 94.

It seemed like the working parts just fit together better - crisp and
clean action, and a stronger flat-top top frame.

And I like that the bolt can be removed easily for cleaning like a breech
loader...

I shoot open sights, so the ejection port and the scope mounts are
not all that important to me.
And no, I don't think I need the lever operated bayonet option.

Mostly I'd shoot 150 grain factory Winchester loads.

I wanted to ask if anyone else had any experience with either rifle.

Anything in particular to pay attention to?

Likes or dislikes.

I've had several 94s chambered 32 special over the years, great gun for
trekking through the brush.

On 2/19/2013 11:36 PM, Martin Eastburn wrote:
How old is the Win 94 ? I have a 15 year old one maybe and it was
made before they were shipped overseas to be made. Japan as I recall,
maybe that was only the stock. Odd at that even.

I was cautioned at the time to see. Mine a walnut. Some were hard pine.

Winchester ammo isn't made by Winchester anymore either. :-) such
turn in the industry through the years.

Martin


Sorry! Fingers get away from me some times...
(Like Dr Strangelove in the war room?)

Copy that about the ammo. I was referring to the original 150 grain
Winchester 3030 specs, not necessarily the manufacturer.

I did get a box of Buffalo Bore 190 grain loads tho.
WOW! (gift from D's Dad)

On 2/19/2013 11:39 PM, PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

I've had several 94s chambered 32 special over the years, great gun for
trekking through the brush.


Really!?!

I would guess that would be for the DIY reload types.
Can't remember ever seeing any of that on the shelf anywhere...

I thought I'd stick with plain Jane .3030 ammo.
It's fairly inexpensive (even now) and less lead fouling with a jacketed
round (?)

I wanna go shootin!

On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 23:20:18 -0600, Richard
wrote:

I'm looking for a traditional lever action .3030 saddle gun, but I
find I'm actually more impressed with the Marlin 336 compared to a
traditional Winchester 94.

It seemed like the working parts just fit together better - crisp and
clean action, and a stronger flat-top top frame.

And I like that the bolt can be removed easily for cleaning like a
breech loader...

I shoot open sights, so the ejection port and the scope mounts are
not all that important to me.
And no, I don't think I need the lever operated bayonet option.

Mostly I'd shoot 150 grain factory Winchester loads.

I wanted to ask if anyone else had any experience with either rifle.

Anything in particular to pay attention to?

Likes or dislikes.

You may find this of some interest.

http://www.30cal.com/text/3030faq.html

As you can see..I agree about the Marlins.

Its been floating around the net since the late 1990s and Ive gotten a
fair amount of good reviews on it over the years...

As for open signts...I STRONGLY recommend a set of Williams FP94 peep
sights for any lever gun.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Williams-Foo...-/160977904170


Or the 5D
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Williams-5D-...-/350713648424


Or the very very good Fire Sights

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Marlin-FIRE-...-/111013972052

Btw...there is absolutely nothing wrong with the Marlin 1894 in 44
Magnum for a utility rifle.

It has nearly the same range as the 3030, ammo is actually cheaper, it
holds significantly more rounds (11) and has very good ballicstics.

44 Mag -125yrds
3030 = 150 yrds

The 1894 is also available in 357 Mag, which means you can also carry
38 Specials in it, though its no where near as potent over 100 yrds as
the 44 mag and the 3030.

Its for smaller game in heavy brush country.

I carry the 1894 in 44 mag quite a bit...the 3030 slightly less so as
the 44 mag is simply cheaper to shoot, even with handloads.

If you decide to go with the 3030..the best time to stock up on ammo
is right after deer season when prices (used to) drop to about $8-10
per 20 rds...if you dont hand load your own. (more on that if you are
interested)

The methodology of the left has always been:

1. Lie
2. Repeat the lie as many times as possible
3. Have as many people repeat the lie as often as possible
4. Eventually, the uninformed believe the lie
5. The lie will then be made into some form oflaw
6. Then everyone must conform to the lie

On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 23:42:43 -0600, Richard
wrote:

On 2/19/2013 11:36 PM, Martin Eastburn wrote:
How old is the Win 94 ? I have a 15 year old one maybe and it was
made before they were shipped overseas to be made. Japan as I recall,
maybe that was only the stock. Odd at that even.

I was cautioned at the time to see. Mine a walnut. Some were hard pine.

Winchester ammo isn't made by Winchester anymore either. :-) such
turn in the industry through the years.

Martin


Sorry! Fingers get away from me some times...
(Like Dr Strangelove in the war room?)

Copy that about the ammo. I was referring to the original 150 grain
Winchester 3030 specs, not necessarily the manufacturer.

I did get a box of Buffalo Bore 190 grain loads tho.
WOW! (gift from D's Dad)

Load 125gr V-Max bullets in the 3030..fine fine load for 2 and 4
legged varmints up to deer size.

the 110-130 flat nosed hollowpoints are scary accurate out of a Marlin
as well

http://www.reloadammo.com/3030load.htm

http://www.shootersforum.com/marlin-...ic-curves.html

Remember..NO pointed bullets in a Lever action..unless they are the
plastic nosed Ballistic tip type slugs..such as the V-Max and a few
others.

Or you load ONLY ONE in the mag and one in the chamber before
firing....


The methodology of the left has always been:

1. Lie
2. Repeat the lie as many times as possible
3. Have as many people repeat the lie as often as possible
4. Eventually, the uninformed believe the lie
5. The lie will then be made into some form oflaw
6. Then everyone must conform to the lie

On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 23:47:56 -0600, Richard
wrote:

On 2/19/2013 11:39 PM, PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

I've had several 94s chambered 32 special over the years, great gun for
trekking through the brush.


Really!?!

I would guess that would be for the DIY reload types.
Can't remember ever seeing any of that on the shelf anywhere...

I thought I'd stick with plain Jane .3030 ammo.
It's fairly inexpensive (even now) and less lead fouling with a jacketed
round (?)

I wanna go shootin!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UeEl9wZyabc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...IoNCtFHwU&NR=1

$100 bill gets you reloading equipment, powder, primers, bullets..etc
etc..everything you need to load 200 rds of ammo.

After that...a $100 will get you enough stuff for at least 500
rds...2000 rds if you load lead bullets

Gunner

The methodology of the left has always been:

1. Lie
2. Repeat the lie as many times as possible
3. Have as many people repeat the lie as often as possible
4. Eventually, the uninformed believe the lie
5. The lie will then be made into some form oflaw
6. Then everyone must conform to the lie

On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 23:20:18 -0600, Richard
wrote:

I'm looking for a traditional lever action .3030 saddle gun, but I
find I'm actually more impressed with the Marlin 336 compared to a
traditional Winchester 94.

It seemed like the working parts just fit together better - crisp and
clean action, and a stronger flat-top top frame.

And I like that the bolt can be removed easily for cleaning like a
breech loader...

I shoot open sights, so the ejection port and the scope mounts are
not all that important to me.
And no, I don't think I need the lever operated bayonet option.

Mostly I'd shoot 150 grain factory Winchester loads.

I wanted to ask if anyone else had any experience with either rifle.

Anything in particular to pay attention to?

Likes or dislikes.

I've got a Marlin 1895 in .450 Marlin, same action. Shoots well,
although I named it "Thumper" due to the light weight and hefty
recoil. But I helped a cousin with a 336 with possibly the worst
trigger pull I've ever seen. I could watch the hammer camming back as
I slowly squeezed the trigger due to the pronounced hook and depth of
engagement in the sear notch. I fixed it by drilling below the notch
for a steel pin, then epoxying it in place. Filed it back until he
liked the pull and it tested safe (couldn't knock it out of
engagement).

So check the trigger pull, might be fine, maybe not.

Pete Keillor

On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 23:47:56 -0600, Richard
wrote:

On 2/19/2013 11:39 PM, PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

I've had several 94s chambered 32 special over the years, great gun for
trekking through the brush.


Really!?!

I would guess that would be for the DIY reload types.
Can't remember ever seeing any of that on the shelf anywhere...

I thought I'd stick with plain Jane .3030 ammo.
It's fairly inexpensive (even now) and less lead fouling with a jacketed
round (?)

I wanna go shootin!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=irC3NuIKDm4


The methodology of the left has always been:

1. Lie
2. Repeat the lie as many times as possible
3. Have as many people repeat the lie as often as possible
4. Eventually, the uninformed believe the lie
5. The lie will then be made into some form oflaw
6. Then everyone must conform to the lie

On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 05:46:52 -0600, Pete Keillor
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 23:20:18 -0600, Richard
wrote:

I'm looking for a traditional lever action .3030 saddle gun, but I
find I'm actually more impressed with the Marlin 336 compared to a
traditional Winchester 94.

It seemed like the working parts just fit together better - crisp and
clean action, and a stronger flat-top top frame.

And I like that the bolt can be removed easily for cleaning like a
breech loader...

I shoot open sights, so the ejection port and the scope mounts are
not all that important to me.
And no, I don't think I need the lever operated bayonet option.

Mostly I'd shoot 150 grain factory Winchester loads.

I wanted to ask if anyone else had any experience with either rifle.

Anything in particular to pay attention to?

Likes or dislikes.

I've got a Marlin 1895 in .450 Marlin, same action. Shoots well,
although I named it "Thumper" due to the light weight and hefty
recoil. But I helped a cousin with a 336 with possibly the worst
trigger pull I've ever seen. I could watch the hammer camming back as
I slowly squeezed the trigger due to the pronounced hook and depth of
engagement in the sear notch. I fixed it by drilling below the notch
for a steel pin, then epoxying it in place. Filed it back until he
liked the pull and it tested safe (couldn't knock it out of
engagement).

So check the trigger pull, might be fine, maybe not.

Pete Keillor

When was it made? Remington took over making the Marlins in 2010..and
its been an utter cluster**** of bad manufacturing and **** poor
repair since then. Id not..not..not buy a Marlin made after 2009.

Ive heard that they have finally cleaned up their manufacturing..but
it damned near put the Marlin line out of business for several years.

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/201...ing-the-drain/

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/201...rley-davidson/

http://www.m4carbine.net/archive/index.php/t-93543.html

http://www.glockpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14564

"A good rule of thumb is to look for the JM stamp on the left side of
the barrel close to the receiver, a barrel address of North Haven,
Conn, and a serial number that starts with 91, 92, 93, etc. Marlin
would serial number their guns where the first two digits can be
subtracted from 2100 to give you the year of production. There have
been some reported issues with the "91" guns, 2009 production,
although it seems few and far between from what I've read. The North
Haven plant was still running in 2009, but Remington was in control at
this point. This was the last year for genuine North Haven Marlins
built by the old crew.

A Remlin will have REP stamped on the right side of the barrel, will
feature an Ilion, New York address on the barrel, and will have a
serial number beginning with MR. The Marlin board was getting so many
complaints about poor quality guns after the plant was shut down and
moved they had to open up a new rant forum.

There are pre-Remlin SBLs to be had, but you have to do some searching
and have a little patience. A good bet would be to post a WTB ad on
the Marlin Owners board or check out the classified very regularly.
Sellers on the big auction boards are usually pretty good to mention
if their gun is a "real JM" gun. It seems like the prices are going up
on them. While you have excellent tastes in lever guns, there ain't no
way I'd pay my hard earned money for a Remlin. Period. I know folks
have gotten good Remlins, but I wouldn't gamble with the possibility
of getting a typical piece of junk. "

http://www.marlinowners.com/forum/marlin-rant-forum/

There are tons of pre Remlin Marlins out there as used guns. Check the
pawn shops, local news boards, consignment sales and gun shows.

Id forgotten about the "new" Marlins having such bad quality. All of
mine are pre 2000 guns. Shrug

They are..are getting better as you can see in the date range of the
rants on the above link.

Gunner



The methodology of the left has always been:

1. Lie
2. Repeat the lie as many times as possible
3. Have as many people repeat the lie as often as possible
4. Eventually, the uninformed believe the lie
5. The lie will then be made into some form oflaw
6. Then everyone must conform to the lie

On 2/20/2013 5:30 AM, Gunner wrote:
On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 23:42:43 -0600,
wrote:

On 2/19/2013 11:36 PM, Martin Eastburn wrote:
How old is the Win 94 ? I have a 15 year old one maybe and it was
made before they were shipped overseas to be made. Japan as I recall,
maybe that was only the stock. Odd at that even.

I was cautioned at the time to see. Mine a walnut. Some were hard pine.

Winchester ammo isn't made by Winchester anymore either. :-) such
turn in the industry through the years.

Martin


Sorry! Fingers get away from me some times...
(Like Dr Strangelove in the war room?)

Copy that about the ammo. I was referring to the original 150 grain
Winchester 3030 specs, not necessarily the manufacturer.

I did get a box of Buffalo Bore 190 grain loads tho.
WOW! (gift from D's Dad)

Load 125gr V-Max bullets in the 3030..fine fine load for 2 and 4
legged varmints up to deer size.

the 110-130 flat nosed hollowpoints are scary accurate out of a Marlin
as well

http://www.reloadammo.com/3030load.htm

http://www.shootersforum.com/marlin-...ic-curves.html

Remember..NO pointed bullets in a Lever action..unless they are the
plastic nosed Ballistic tip type slugs..such as the V-Max and a few
others.

Or you load ONLY ONE in the mag and one in the chamber before
firing....



This ain't my first rodeo, Gunner.
I know better than to use pointy bullets in a tube magazine.

And I have no intention (or fantasies) of shooting anything less than
four legs. You really need to get some professional help for that.
(or maybe you did, and it didn't help?)

Unless you are secretly trying to scare people into supporting the
gun control agenda that Washington is pressing.

Unintended Consequences, you know?


The forum that your link pointed to seems a bit off to me

Who in their right mind would want to chamber a pistol round in a saddle
gun?

On 2/20/2013 5:55 AM, Gunner wrote:
On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 23:47:56 -0600,
wrote:

On 2/19/2013 11:39 PM, PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

I've had several 94s chambered 32 special over the years, great gun for
trekking through the brush.


Really!?!

I would guess that would be for the DIY reload types.
Can't remember ever seeing any of that on the shelf anywhere...

I thought I'd stick with plain Jane .3030 ammo.
It's fairly inexpensive (even now) and less lead fouling with a jacketed
round (?)

I wanna go shootin!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=irC3NuIKDm4




I don't think so, Gunner.
I have no desire to reload ammo.

That's one of the reasons for selecting the traditional .3030 round.
They are not in as hot of a demand as war rounds, and so prices are
still fairly reasonable.

I have 300 rounds that were given to me.
Add another 300 and I'm good for quite a while.

Come on - 6 rounds of each to sight in (yes I can do it with less, but why?)

The rest are for fun.

On 2/20/2013 5:05 AM, Gunner wrote:

Or the very very good Fire Sights

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Marlin-FIRE-...-/111013972052

Hey there, that has possibilities!

Looks like the front blade is high enough to sight in the the faster
rounds.

And I do love a good peep show!



Btw...there is absolutely nothing wrong with the Marlin 1894 in 44
Magnum for a utility rifle.

It has nearly the same range as the 3030, ammo is actually cheaper, it
holds significantly more rounds (11) and has very good ballicstics.

44 Mag -125yrds
3030 = 150 yrds

The 1894 is also available in 357 Mag, which means you can also carry
38 Specials in it, though its no where near as potent over 100 yrds as
the 44 mag and the 3030.

Pistol rounds?

Gunner, wake up and slap yourself!
Yer babbling!


Its for smaller game in heavy brush country.

I carry the 1894 in 44 mag quite a bit...the 3030 slightly less so as
the 44 mag is simply cheaper to shoot, even with handloads.

If you decide to go with the 3030..the best time to stock up on ammo
is right after deer season when prices (used to) drop to about $8-10
per 20 rds...if you dont hand load your own. (more on that if you are
interested)


Good tip, thanks.
But like I said, I don't intend to reload myself.
Or even shoot reloads, unless they are from someone I trust.
The Marlin Micro-Groove (tm) rifling is reportedly not too happy with
soft lead bullets. Increasing the diameter is supposed to help with
that, but to my mind, I'd rather not take the chance.

Originally I had thought of maybe a 45-70.
But they cost way too much for just plinking.

On 2/20/2013 5:46 AM, Pete Keillor wrote:

Anything in particular to pay attention to?

Likes or dislikes.

I've got a Marlin 1895 in .450 Marlin, same action. Shoots well,
although I named it "Thumper" due to the light weight and hefty
recoil. But I helped a cousin with a 336 with possibly the worst
trigger pull I've ever seen. I could watch the hammer camming back as
I slowly squeezed the trigger due to the pronounced hook and depth of
engagement in the sear notch. I fixed it by drilling below the notch
for a steel pin, then epoxying it in place. Filed it back until he
liked the pull and it tested safe (couldn't knock it out of
engagement).

So check the trigger pull, might be fine, maybe not.

Pete Keillor


Thanks Pete. That's exactly on target.

And I had noted that both of these rifles have unsat triggers.
Not like a lawn mower full of bailing wire, but not all that smooth either.

I'm fairly well spoiled by my little Bersa .380 squirt gun.
It has the sweetest trigger of anything you've ever shot.
Try one if you get a chance.

I don't feel up to doing smith work like that on my own.
But I recently met a gunsmith who I thrust.

Thumper, huh?
I'll bet it does!

On 2/20/2013 7:03 AM, Gunner wrote:

When was it made? Remington took over making the Marlins in 2010..and
its been an utter cluster**** of bad manufacturing and **** poor
repair since then. Id not..not..not buy a Marlin made after 2009.


Thanks, bud. Will check.

A friend let me shoot his win 94, years ago. I learned that the operator has
to cycle the action (pull the lever) totally to the end of its travel, and
then back. Cycle it rapidly, deliberately, and completely. Short cycling
will jam a cartridge in there under this or that, and it's a total PIA to
recover. Recoil is strong, but manageable. A folded towel under the jacket
helps with sore shoulder. Used to be able to (in the eighties) buy 125 grain
sabot varmint loads.

Wonder if he's still got it? Probably worth a buck, now that guns are
unobtanium.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

"Richard" wrote in message
m...

That's one of the reasons for selecting the traditional .3030 round.
They are not in as hot of a demand as war rounds, and so prices are
still fairly reasonable.

I have 300 rounds that were given to me.
Add another 300 and I'm good for quite a while.

Come on - 6 rounds of each to sight in (yes I can do it with less, but why?)

The rest are for fun.

Richard wrote:
On 2/20/2013 5:30 AM, Gunner wrote:
On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 23:42:43 -0600,
wrote:

On 2/19/2013 11:36 PM, Martin Eastburn wrote:
How old is the Win 94 ? I have a 15 year old one maybe and it was
made before they were shipped overseas to be made. Japan as I recall,
maybe that was only the stock. Odd at that even.

I was cautioned at the time to see. Mine a walnut. Some were hard pine.

Winchester ammo isn't made by Winchester anymore either. :-) such
turn in the industry through the years.

Martin

Sorry! Fingers get away from me some times...
(Like Dr Strangelove in the war room?)

Copy that about the ammo. I was referring to the original 150 grain
Winchester 3030 specs, not necessarily the manufacturer.

I did get a box of Buffalo Bore 190 grain loads tho.
WOW! (gift from D's Dad)

Load 125gr V-Max bullets in the 3030..fine fine load for 2 and 4
legged varmints up to deer size.

the 110-130 flat nosed hollowpoints are scary accurate out of a Marlin
as well

http://www.reloadammo.com/3030load.htm

http://www.shootersforum.com/marlin-...ic-curves.html

Remember..NO pointed bullets in a Lever action..unless they are the
plastic nosed Ballistic tip type slugs..such as the V-Max and a few
others.

Or you load ONLY ONE in the mag and one in the chamber before
firing....



This ain't my first rodeo, Gunner.
I know better than to use pointy bullets in a tube magazine.

And I have no intention (or fantasies) of shooting anything less than
four legs. You really need to get some professional help for that.
(or maybe you did, and it didn't help?)

Unless you are secretly trying to scare people into supporting the
gun control agenda that Washington is pressing.

Unintended Consequences, you know?


The forum that your link pointed to seems a bit off to me

Who in their right mind would want to chamber a pistol round in a saddle
gun?

Lot's of lever guns out there in "pistol" calibers.


--
Steve W.

Richard wrote:
I'm looking for a traditional lever action .3030 saddle gun, but I
find I'm actually more impressed with the Marlin 336 compared to a
traditional Winchester 94.

It seemed like the working parts just fit together better - crisp and
clean action, and a stronger flat-top top frame.

And I like that the bolt can be removed easily for cleaning like a
breech loader...

I shoot open sights, so the ejection port and the scope mounts are
not all that important to me.
And no, I don't think I need the lever operated bayonet option.

Mostly I'd shoot 150 grain factory Winchester loads.

I wanted to ask if anyone else had any experience with either rifle.

Anything in particular to pay attention to?

Likes or dislikes.


I like my Marlin in 30/30, and the XLR in .35 Rem isn't bad either.
I use mine for deer and similar sized game.

--
Steve W.

On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 07:12:03 -0600, Richard
wrote:

On 2/20/2013 5:30 AM, Gunner wrote:
On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 23:42:43 -0600,
wrote:

On 2/19/2013 11:36 PM, Martin Eastburn wrote:
How old is the Win 94 ? I have a 15 year old one maybe and it was
made before they were shipped overseas to be made. Japan as I recall,
maybe that was only the stock. Odd at that even.

I was cautioned at the time to see. Mine a walnut. Some were hard pine.

Winchester ammo isn't made by Winchester anymore either. :-) such
turn in the industry through the years.

Martin


Sorry! Fingers get away from me some times...
(Like Dr Strangelove in the war room?)

Copy that about the ammo. I was referring to the original 150 grain
Winchester 3030 specs, not necessarily the manufacturer.

I did get a box of Buffalo Bore 190 grain loads tho.
WOW! (gift from D's Dad)

Load 125gr V-Max bullets in the 3030..fine fine load for 2 and 4
legged varmints up to deer size.

the 110-130 flat nosed hollowpoints are scary accurate out of a Marlin
as well

http://www.reloadammo.com/3030load.htm

http://www.shootersforum.com/marlin-...ic-curves.html

Remember..NO pointed bullets in a Lever action..unless they are the
plastic nosed Ballistic tip type slugs..such as the V-Max and a few
others.

Or you load ONLY ONE in the mag and one in the chamber before
firing....



This ain't my first rodeo, Gunner.
I know better than to use pointy bullets in a tube magazine.

Ok, I wasnt certain of your experience with firearms of this type.
Ive seen a few folks want a tool and not know the proper way to use
it.

And I have no intention (or fantasies) of shooting anything less than
four legs. You really need to get some professional help for that.
(or maybe you did, and it didn't help?)

So one only needs fire extingushers for cracking walnuts eh?

Unless you are secretly trying to scare people into supporting the
gun control agenda that Washington is pressing.

Oh they will try to do that no matter what I or 80 million other
people say.

Unintended Consequences, you know?


The forum that your link pointed to seems a bit off to me

Who in their right mind would want to chamber a pistol round in a saddle
gun?

So I was right...your firearms experence is limited.

Check some of the links I provided for ballistics data and so forth.
Then you will see that there is not all that much difference between
pumping out a 150gr bullet at 2400 fps and a 240gr bullet at 2100 fps
in impact and line of sight hit probabliity, until that 240 gr bullet
slows down (and it will) enough to fall below the ballistics of the
150gr bullet..at which point the 150 bullet becomes "better"..but the
fact of the matter is...it does so at a range beyond most to shoot
open sights out of a light leveraction..and the accuracy of the weapon
itselt.

Or are you somehow equating the magnums with 32 ACPs versus 3030?

They both shoot 30 caliber bullets you know.

Im only trying to be helpful. If you chose to ignore my help, simply
say the word. I am not the worlds most reputable expert when it
comes to firearms/ammo and whatnot...but I was once well paid to write
articles for a few gun magazines and so forth. So a few people think
I know something.....

Up to you. take it or leave it

Gunner

The methodology of the left has always been:

1. Lie
2. Repeat the lie as many times as possible
3. Have as many people repeat the lie as often as possible
4. Eventually, the uninformed believe the lie
5. The lie will then be made into some form oflaw
6. Then everyone must conform to the lie

On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 07:17:10 -0600, Richard
wrote:

On 2/20/2013 5:55 AM, Gunner wrote:
On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 23:47:56 -0600,
wrote:

On 2/19/2013 11:39 PM, PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

I've had several 94s chambered 32 special over the years, great gun for
trekking through the brush.


Really!?!

I would guess that would be for the DIY reload types.
Can't remember ever seeing any of that on the shelf anywhere...

I thought I'd stick with plain Jane .3030 ammo.
It's fairly inexpensive (even now) and less lead fouling with a jacketed
round (?)

I wanna go shootin!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=irC3NuIKDm4




I don't think so, Gunner.
I have no desire to reload ammo.

That's one of the reasons for selecting the traditional .3030 round.
They are not in as hot of a demand as war rounds, and so prices are
still fairly reasonable.

I have 300 rounds that were given to me.
Add another 300 and I'm good for quite a while.

Come on - 6 rounds of each to sight in (yes I can do it with less, but why?)

The rest are for fun.


Just trying to be helpful. Its quite easy to do and can be done for
about 1/4 the price of store bought ammo. You wont save any money..you
will just shoot a hell of a lot more G

If you arent going to reload that brass..save it for me after shooting
and Ill buy it from you. Its just "junk" to a non reloader once its
fired..and Ill pay for it.

Gunner

The methodology of the left has always been:

1. Lie
2. Repeat the lie as many times as possible
3. Have as many people repeat the lie as often as possible
4. Eventually, the uninformed believe the lie
5. The lie will then be made into some form oflaw
6. Then everyone must conform to the lie

On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 07:32:15 -0600, Richard
wrote:

On 2/20/2013 5:05 AM, Gunner wrote:

Or the very very good Fire Sights

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Marlin-FIRE-...-/111013972052

Hey there, that has possibilities!

Looks like the front blade is high enough to sight in the the faster
rounds.

And I do love a good peep show!



Btw...there is absolutely nothing wrong with the Marlin 1894 in 44
Magnum for a utility rifle.

It has nearly the same range as the 3030, ammo is actually cheaper, it
holds significantly more rounds (11) and has very good ballicstics.

44 Mag -125yrds
3030 = 150 yrds

The 1894 is also available in 357 Mag, which means you can also carry
38 Specials in it, though its no where near as potent over 100 yrds as
the 44 mag and the 3030.

Pistol rounds?

Gunner, wake up and slap yourself!
Yer babbling!

You are aware that the 73 was in 44-40...the same caliber as the
pistols that the cowboy carried...right? Know why they would carry a
single cartridge for two different firearms?

Because they were smart. Chuckle.


Its for smaller game in heavy brush country.

I carry the 1894 in 44 mag quite a bit...the 3030 slightly less so as
the 44 mag is simply cheaper to shoot, even with handloads.

If you decide to go with the 3030..the best time to stock up on ammo
is right after deer season when prices (used to) drop to about $8-10
per 20 rds...if you dont hand load your own. (more on that if you are
interested)


Good tip, thanks.
But like I said, I don't intend to reload myself.
Or even shoot reloads, unless they are from someone I trust.
The Marlin Micro-Groove (tm) rifling is reportedly not too happy with
soft lead bullets. Increasing the diameter is supposed to help with
that, but to my mind, I'd rather not take the chance.

Originally I had thought of maybe a 45-70.
But they cost way too much for just plinking.

The 1894 Marlins (most) are rifled with Ballard rifling..not
Microgroove since 2007 or a little before.

http://www.leverguns.com/articles/fr...ve-barrels.htm

As of fall of 2007, Marlin still makes a number of guns that have
Microgroove barrels on them (according to the 2007 Marlin catalog
posted on their website; http://www.marlinfirearms.com/). All of their
..22 LR and .22 Magnum rifles still have Microgroove barrels. The 336s
in .30-30 and .35 Remington are still made with Microgroove barrels,
however the stainless 336XLR in .30-30 and .35 Remington have Ballard
rifled barrels. All of the big-bore Marlin leverguns (e.g. 444, 1895,
etc.) are now fitted with Ballard rifled barrels (both blued and
stainless guns), as are the 1894 and 1895 Cowboy models.
Interestingly, in the 1894 series, the.44 Magnum and .357 Magnum guns
are Ballard rifled, but the .32-20 1894CL and .41 Magnum 1894 FG are
both fitted with Microgroove barrels. "

IE..all the guns that would normally be fired with lead bullets bigger
than 22lr...are now Ballard rifled. A Marlin Microgroove barrel
starts leading at about 1600 fps. Some a litle more..some a little
less...shrug..with normal cast bullets prepared "normally". Yet with
jacketed bullets...well..I have a 3006 carbine I made out of a 98
action with a Marlin Microgroove .30 barrel that can shoot at 3000 fps
all day long and very accurately. Normally grooved barrels.... I start
worrying about leading at about 2200 fps with wheelweight bullets.

Hence Marlin going to Ballard rifling in the arms chambered for big
lead bullet cartridges...IE...444 Marlin, 45-70, 44 Mag, 357 Mag, 45
Long Colt, etc etc

All of my Marlins are pre 2007..all have Microgroove barrels and I do
have to take additional steps to shoot cast bullets in them, so they
dont lead the bores.

Just trying to edumacate you a bit.





The methodology of the left has always been:

1. Lie
2. Repeat the lie as many times as possible
3. Have as many people repeat the lie as often as possible
4. Eventually, the uninformed believe the lie
5. The lie will then be made into some form oflaw
6. Then everyone must conform to the lie

On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 10:54:26 -0500, "Steve W."
wrote:

Richard wrote:
I'm looking for a traditional lever action .3030 saddle gun, but I
find I'm actually more impressed with the Marlin 336 compared to a
traditional Winchester 94.

It seemed like the working parts just fit together better - crisp and
clean action, and a stronger flat-top top frame.

And I like that the bolt can be removed easily for cleaning like a
breech loader...

I shoot open sights, so the ejection port and the scope mounts are
not all that important to me.
And no, I don't think I need the lever operated bayonet option.

Mostly I'd shoot 150 grain factory Winchester loads.

I wanted to ask if anyone else had any experience with either rifle.

Anything in particular to pay attention to?

Likes or dislikes.


I like my Marlin in 30/30, and the XLR in .35 Rem isn't bad either.
I use mine for deer and similar sized game.


The XLR should have Ballard rifling in it. Shoot any lead bullets?
The cartridge does shoot 357 Mag bullets nicely btw if you handload

Gunner

The methodology of the left has always been:

1. Lie
2. Repeat the lie as many times as possible
3. Have as many people repeat the lie as often as possible
4. Eventually, the uninformed believe the lie
5. The lie will then be made into some form oflaw
6. Then everyone must conform to the lie

There was a documentary on Winchester that mentioned that 94s before a
certain year are more desirable.

Gunner wrote:
On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 10:54:26 -0500, "Steve W."
wrote:

Richard wrote:
I'm looking for a traditional lever action .3030 saddle gun, but I
find I'm actually more impressed with the Marlin 336 compared to a
traditional Winchester 94.

It seemed like the working parts just fit together better - crisp and
clean action, and a stronger flat-top top frame.

And I like that the bolt can be removed easily for cleaning like a
breech loader...

I shoot open sights, so the ejection port and the scope mounts are
not all that important to me.
And no, I don't think I need the lever operated bayonet option.

Mostly I'd shoot 150 grain factory Winchester loads.

I wanted to ask if anyone else had any experience with either rifle.

Anything in particular to pay attention to?

Likes or dislikes.

I like my Marlin in 30/30, and the XLR in .35 Rem isn't bad either.
I use mine for deer and similar sized game.


The XLR should have Ballard rifling in it. Shoot any lead bullets?
The cartridge does shoot 357 Mag bullets nicely btw if you handload

Gunner


Yep it's had some lead through it. Both "factory" made cast and a bunch
of home cast ones. Usually 200 or 220 grain depending on which mold I
use. I've shot lead through the 30-30 as well. No problem with the
microgroove IF you cast slightly over sized and use a gas check.

--
Steve W.

On 2/20/2013 11:31 AM, Gunner wrote:


So I was right...your firearms experence is limited.

You have ASSmed far too much, Gunner.

I've just not interested in becoming a wanna-be bullet head.


Im only trying to be helpful. If you chose to ignore my help, simply
say the word. I am not the worlds most reputable expert when it
comes to firearms/ammo and whatnot...but I was once well paid to write
articles for a few gun magazines and so forth. So a few people think
I know something.....

Up to you. take it or leave it

Nor am I.
So I did ask for other opinions.
I thank you for yours.
I appreciate your suggestions, but please don't be offended if I don't
go that way.

Ok?

On 2/20/2013 11:36 AM, Gunner wrote:

If you arent going to reload that brass..save it for me after shooting
and Ill buy it from you. Its just "junk" to a non reloader once its
fired..and Ill pay for it.

I've never left brass behind. Well, not entirely true as I sprinkled
a lot of it over parts of sunny exciting South East Asia.
But that was a special case.

It won't be a lot, but if you want it, I'll save it for you.
A small gift...


Gunner

On 2/20/2013 2:02 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
There was a documentary on Winchester that mentioned that 94s before a
certain year are more desirable.



1964 was the first big change.
Some of the internals that were forged before were changed to stamped
sheet metal (so we are on topic). Some solid pins were changed to roll
pins. All in order to reduce manufacturing costs.

All this went over like a lead balloon. Customers were offended - even
though it really made no difference in operation or accuracy.


The next big change was in the early '90s when Winchester redesigned the
action to allow the brass to be ejected to the side rather than straight
up. This was to allow the installation of a scope.

(Marlins have always ejected to the side (oh, and Marlin predates the
Winchester 94 by one year))

At the same time, a cross-bolt safety was added - which again upset a
lot of customers. While it adds a safety feature, the hammer still
releases when the trigger is pulled, but the gun doesn't fire.
Wasted shots were the big complaint. BTW, this is often referred to as
the "Lawyer's Safety".

In 2003 they moved the safety to a tang on the aft end of the receiver.
(Dunno if that locked the trigger, or just blocked the hammer)

Production at Winchester ended in 2006 and moved to Japan.

On Feb 19, 10:20*pm, Richard wrote:
I'm looking for a traditional lever action .3030 saddle gun, but I
find I'm actually more impressed with the Marlin 336 compared to a
traditional Winchester 94.

It seemed like the working parts just fit together better - crisp and
clean action, and a stronger flat-top top frame.

And I like that the bolt can be removed easily for cleaning like a
breech loader...

I shoot open sights, so the ejection port and the scope mounts are
not all that important to me.
And no, I don't think I need the lever operated bayonet option.

Mostly I'd shoot 150 grain factory Winchester loads.

I wanted to ask if anyone else had any experience with either rifle.

Anything in particular to pay attention to?

Likes or dislikes.

Age on either is the thing. Post-'64, the Win 94 was made with a cast
receiver that can't be repolished and reblued like regular gun steels
can. Some of the USRA ones, at least, were made with regular gun
steels. Post-2009, the Marlin factory was shut down and cleaned out,
bought out by Remington and quality since has been iffy. So there are
no real Marlins anymore, just like there's no real Winchesters.
They're both just brand names put on replicas made by someone else.
Anything with the flying W on it has a premium, particularly pre-'64
models. The hunting-grade .30-30 Marlins have tended to have much
lower asking prices, mostly because the general public doesn't know
that they're gone(and not returning). There are also house-branded
Marlins and the Glenfield line that are real Marlins, just have
cheaper wood and no bullseye in the butt. Can usually be had really
cheap. Current Win 94s are made by Miroku and really aren't intended
for the likes of us. Nice guns, but you really don't stick a $2000
lever gun in a pickup gun rack and rattle it all over the place.
They're for sale to the carriage trade that might want an Old West gun
to fondle.

The Marlin action is far simpler than a 94, I've stripped one in about
5 minutes with a set of screwdrivers. It's easy to slick up, if
needed. Have never had a yen for a Winchester 94. Peeps can be put
on either.

If you want a smaller and handier long gun, Marlin's 1894 is out
there, originally in the "dash" pistol calibers prior to WWI, now made
in .357 and .44 with some.45 Colts and some other short runs. Those
have been increasing in price since the shutdown, too. The .44 has
gotten deer every year I've used it. Good to maybe 125 yards if you
know how the bullet drops.

Stan

On 2/20/2013 4:34 PM, Stanley Schaefer wrote:

Age on either is the thing. Post-'64, the Win 94 was made with a cast
receiver that can't be repolished and reblued like regular gun steels
can. Some of the USRA ones, at least, were made with regular gun
steels.

Stan


Thank yo much for that, Stan.

That makes the "new in the box" choice a lot less appetizing, doesn't it.

Problem is, the big box stores don't know squat about what they sell.

Glad I asked!


Richard

"Richard" wrote in message
m...
On 2/20/2013 2:02 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
There was a documentary on Winchester that mentioned that 94s before a
certain year are more desirable.



1964 was the first big change.
Some of the internals that were forged before were changed to stamped
sheet metal (so we are on topic). Some solid pins were changed to roll
pins. All in order to reduce manufacturing costs.

All this went over like a lead balloon. Customers were offended - even
though it really made no difference in operation or accuracy.


The next big change was in the early '90s when Winchester redesigned the
action to allow the brass to be ejected to the side rather than straight
up. This was to allow the installation of a scope.


One correction, Angle eject was done in the early '80s.
The crossbolt safety was in the '90s.

Paul K. Dickman


At the same time, a cross-bolt safety was added - which again upset a
lot of customers. While it adds a safety feature, the hammer still
releases when the trigger is pulled, but the gun doesn't fire.
Wasted shots were the big complaint. BTW, this is often referred to as
the "Lawyer's Safety".

In 2003 they moved the safety to a tang on the aft end of the receiver.
(Dunno if that locked the trigger, or just blocked the hammer)

Production at Winchester ended in 2006 and moved to Japan.

On 2/20/2013 8:19 PM, Paul K. Dickman wrote:

One correction, Angle eject was done in the early '80s.
The crossbolt safety was in the '90s.

Paul K. Dickman



(nod) thank you, Paul.

On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 17:04:47 -0500, "Steve W."
wrote:

Gunner wrote:
On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 10:54:26 -0500, "Steve W."
wrote:

Richard wrote:
I'm looking for a traditional lever action .3030 saddle gun, but I
find I'm actually more impressed with the Marlin 336 compared to a
traditional Winchester 94.

It seemed like the working parts just fit together better - crisp and
clean action, and a stronger flat-top top frame.

And I like that the bolt can be removed easily for cleaning like a
breech loader...

I shoot open sights, so the ejection port and the scope mounts are
not all that important to me.
And no, I don't think I need the lever operated bayonet option.

Mostly I'd shoot 150 grain factory Winchester loads.

I wanted to ask if anyone else had any experience with either rifle.

Anything in particular to pay attention to?

Likes or dislikes.

I like my Marlin in 30/30, and the XLR in .35 Rem isn't bad either.
I use mine for deer and similar sized game.


The XLR should have Ballard rifling in it. Shoot any lead bullets?
The cartridge does shoot 357 Mag bullets nicely btw if you handload

Gunner


Yep it's had some lead through it. Both "factory" made cast and a bunch
of home cast ones. Usually 200 or 220 grain depending on which mold I
use. I've shot lead through the 30-30 as well. No problem with the
microgroove IF you cast slightly over sized and use a gas check.

And keep rifling in Microgroove down to about 1600 fps. No gas checks
needed at those velocities btw. I shoot so few gas checks Ive got
probably 15,000 on the shelves. Only use em in the .30 caliber stuff
or anything over 1900 fps, but I tend to cast hard.

The XLR has Ballard rifling, which is far mo better for lead rounds
than Microgroove is , when going over 1600 fps.

Gunner

The methodology of the left has always been:

1. Lie
2. Repeat the lie as many times as possible
3. Have as many people repeat the lie as often as possible
4. Eventually, the uninformed believe the lie
5. The lie will then be made into some form oflaw
6. Then everyone must conform to the lie

On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 16:11:23 -0600, Richard
wrote:

On 2/20/2013 11:31 AM, Gunner wrote:


So I was right...your firearms experence is limited.

You have ASSmed far too much, Gunner.

I've just not interested in becoming a wanna-be bullet head.

So you are limited in Some of your knowledge. Shrug..nothing to be
ashamed of.

I dont know dick about car engines or transmissions. But I drive a
****load of miles every year.



Im only trying to be helpful. If you chose to ignore my help, simply
say the word. I am not the worlds most reputable expert when it
comes to firearms/ammo and whatnot...but I was once well paid to write
articles for a few gun magazines and so forth. So a few people think
I know something.....

Up to you. take it or leave it

Nor am I.
So I did ask for other opinions.
I thank you for yours.
I appreciate your suggestions, but please don't be offended if I don't
go that way.

Ok?


Not a problem.

Gunner

The methodology of the left has always been:

1. Lie
2. Repeat the lie as many times as possible
3. Have as many people repeat the lie as often as possible
4. Eventually, the uninformed believe the lie
5. The lie will then be made into some form oflaw
6. Then everyone must conform to the lie

On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 16:15:37 -0600, Richard
wrote:

On 2/20/2013 11:36 AM, Gunner wrote:

If you arent going to reload that brass..save it for me after shooting
and Ill buy it from you. Its just "junk" to a non reloader once its
fired..and Ill pay for it.

I've never left brass behind. Well, not entirely true as I sprinkled
a lot of it over parts of sunny exciting South East Asia.
But that was a special case.

It won't be a lot, but if you want it, I'll save it for you.
A small gift...


Gunner


Id be happy to pay shipping and a small amount per round. I use the
3030 as the parent case for quite a few different wildcat cartridges,
such as the 357 and 30 Herret.

Gunner

The methodology of the left has always been:

1. Lie
2. Repeat the lie as many times as possible
3. Have as many people repeat the lie as often as possible
4. Eventually, the uninformed believe the lie
5. The lie will then be made into some form oflaw
6. Then everyone must conform to the lie

I have a couple of each.

The Winchester is lighter and handier, and seems to balance just right at the receiver. I don't care for the way half the guts comes out of the bottom when you work the lever, but it's been that way for a century or so.

The Marlin is no doubt sturdier. the receiver fills like a solid hunk of steel. Of course it's also heavier and thicker.

I think if I were going to carry it all day I'd want the Winny. If it were rough country I'd probably take the Marlin. Both of mine seem to group about the same at normal hunting distances.

I'd also point out that .32 Win was a very popular chambering for the 94 for a lot of years. A little more power and reach for the same money, but it's a bit of an orphan these days.