On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 02:13:15 -0500, Gerald Miller
wrote:


The thing that gets me is the "safety" side cut can opener in the
kitchen drawer. Why is it safer to have a sharp edge of the can
surrounding the contents you are digging at, rather than on the metal
disk you are tossing into the trash; this assumes that you don't make
a habit of licking the lids clean before you toss them.
To my mind, they advertise these because they are made to a lower
standard of accuracy than the old top cut opener.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada


The "safety cut" can openers I'm familiar with don't cut anything -
they uncrimp the can top so you just lift it off. They're hard to
find, but I like them better'n anything, including (especially?)
electric openers.

Joe

On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 18:18:47 -0700, "Paul Hovnanian P.E."
wrote:

"Steve W." wrote:

[snip]

Now with the P-38 I could likely open it a lot faster.

Strafe it from a WWII era fighter?


Deja vue all over again :-)


Mark Rand
RTFM

"Bruce L. Bergman" wrote:

On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 09:26:09 -0600, "Pete C."
wrote:

Crank start...

A Diesel. Riiiiiight.... After you. Bring friends.

International UD9 - got one - it crank starts just fine with one person
jumping on the crank.

On Nov 29, 2:13*am, Gerald Miller wrote:
On Sat, 28 Nov 2009 16:27:57 -0700, Steve Ackman



wrote:
In , on Fri, 27 Nov 2009 17:06:25
-0800, Michael Koblic, wrote:
I saw an interesting event on Jay Jeno last night: Memebrs of the five armed
services were trying to open a can of cranberry sauce using a Swiss army
knife. It was horrible. None of them seemed to have a clear idea how to use
the can opener attachment, in fact I am pretty sure some of them used the
wrong attachment. Four of them managed eventually at a cost of some injuries
and the cans were mangled.

*It was Air Force who cut himself. *"Anything to win,"
was his quip. *Incidentally, he WAS the one to win the
race and the car... though for those who didn't see it,
he didn't win the car for himself, but for a randomly
selected member of his branch.

One failed to empty the can in the alloted time.

*That was the whole point. *The last one to empty the
contents was eliminated from the competition. *By
definition the slowest didn't finish in time.

I wondered about the implications: Is this a reflection on general
population's unfamiliarity with a can opener? Is this a reflection on basic
training? Is it because the knife was *Swiss*? It cannot be because the
knife was *Army* as I believe it was the Army guy who failed. I hesitate to
cite stress affecting the performance of members of fighitng forces.

*It wasn't the Army guy who failed because he was in
the footrace against the Air Force guy. *I *think* it
was the Navy guy who failed.

Would members of the Special Forces have done better? One of the guys made a
creditable effort to rip the can open with his bare hands but with a minimum
result.

*The guy using "his bare hands" had already opened the
can about 5/8 of the way around. *He was using his hands
to try to bend the lid up and out of the way so he could
empty the cranberry sauce onto the plate. *He's one who
did NOT cut himself, strangely enough. *Pretty sure he
was first, and Army.

Is this something to be concerned about?

*Maybe.

Do I have too much time on my *hands?

*Probably.

*I laughed with incredulity, but come to think of it,
none of these guys has ever seen a C-ration. *Guess
there's no reason for them to know how to operate a
field can opener.

The thing that gets me is the "safety" side cut can opener in the
kitchen drawer. Why is it safer to have a sharp edge of the can
surrounding the contents you are digging at, rather than on the metal
disk you are tossing into the trash; this assumes that you don't make
a habit of licking the lids clean before you toss them.
To my mind, they advertise these because they are made to a lower
standard of accuracy than the old top cut opener.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

I guess you've never actually used one of these. The "safety opener"
cuts through the crimp, leaving a rounded edge on the can *AND* on the
lid. I have two, one manual and one electric.

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 09:26:39 -0500, Joe
wrote:

snip
The "safety cut" can openers I'm familiar with don't cut anything -
they uncrimp the can top so you just lift it off. They're hard to
find, but I like them better'n anything, including (especially?)
electric openers.

Joe

The one I have (safety cut) cuts. Didn't realize how the
cans were constructed until I got one.

They work pretty well on the pull-tops too, they really
annoy me. If you open them as intended it is hard to swab
out everything. I'm sure most people don't bother with
that...

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

Pete C. wrote:
"Bruce L. Bergman" wrote:
On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 09:26:09 -0600, "Pete C."
wrote:
Crank start...
A Diesel. Riiiiiight.... After you. Bring friends.

International UD9 - got one - it crank starts just fine with one person
jumping on the crank.

Google "Lanz Bulldog" and "Field Marshall" tractors.

The early Cat scrapers were hand cranked - the small
gas pony motor that is. It was then run for awhile
to heat up the diesel then clutched in to start it.

"Leon Fisk" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 09:26:39 -0500, Joe
wrote:

snip
The "safety cut" can openers I'm familiar with don't cut anything -
they uncrimp the can top so you just lift it off. They're hard to
find, but I like them better'n anything, including (especially?)
electric openers.

Joe

The one I have (safety cut) cuts. Didn't realize how the
cans were constructed until I got one.

They work pretty well on the pull-tops too, they really
annoy me. If you open them as intended it is hard to swab
out everything. I'm sure most people don't bother with
that...

--
Leon Fisk


me too. just recently got one of those fancy new expensive can openers
(wouldn't've got the fancy kind except the cheap ones i kept buying kept
breaking, was sick of buying cheap junk). i've always used a rubber spatula
to get every drop of soup/chili/etc. out of the can, and the ridge left from
the new pull top cans were kind of frustrating. with the new can opener
it's easy, leaves a smooth ridge-less edge. i just mention this to say,
leon, you're not the only one. i think it's from my grandfather having gone
through the depression, something like, he was abandoned and later adopted
by an abusive family, hard times, tough childhood.

b.w.

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 09:26:39 -0500, Joe wrote:

On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 02:13:15 -0500, Gerald Miller
wrote:


The thing that gets me is the "safety" side cut can opener in the
kitchen drawer. Why is it safer to have a sharp edge of the can
surrounding the contents you are digging at, rather than on the metal
disk you are tossing into the trash; this assumes that you don't make
a habit of licking the lids clean before you toss them.
To my mind, they advertise these because they are made to a lower
standard of accuracy than the old top cut opener.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada


The "safety cut" can openers I'm familiar with don't cut anything -
they uncrimp the can top so you just lift it off. They're hard to
find, but I like them better'n anything, including (especially?)
electric openers.

Joe
The ones I'm bitching about take the rolled rim plus the disk off,
leaving a sharp edge on the side of the can; hyper-advertised as being
safer than the one that cuts out a sharp edged disk out, leaving the
rolled edge still attached to the side of the can.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

On Tue, 1 Dec 2009 11:18:15 -0800 (PST), rangerssuck
wrote:



I guess you've never actually used one of these. The "safety opener"
cuts through the crimp, leaving a rounded edge on the can *AND* on the
lid. I have two, one manual and one electric.
The one I'm bitching about cuts below the crimp leaving a sharp egged
on the can. They are trying to take advantage of the one you mention
which semi seals the can when you replace the lid.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

On Dec 1, 8:36*pm, Gerald Miller wrote:
On Tue, 1 Dec 2009 11:18:15 -0800 (PST), rangerssuck

wrote:

I guess you've never actually used one of these. The "safety opener"
cuts through the crimp, leaving a rounded edge on the can *AND* on the
lid. I have two, one manual and one electric.

The one I'm bitching about cuts below the crimp leaving a sharp egged
on the can. They are trying to take advantage of the one you mention
which semi seals the can when you replace the lid.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

I never saw one like that. Yes, that would be just stupid.

OTOH, I used a P38 a couple of weeks ago to open a #10 can of beans.
My wrist and fingers were screaming after that ordeal. Said P38 came
from my Dad's WWII dog tags. It's lived on my keychain for over 40
years.

On Tue, 1 Dec 2009 17:41:59 -0600, "William Wixon"
wrote:

snip
me too. just recently got one of those fancy new expensive can openers
(wouldn't've got the fancy kind except the cheap ones i kept buying kept
breaking, was sick of buying cheap junk). i've always used a rubber spatula
to get every drop of soup/chili/etc. out of the can, and the ridge left from
the new pull top cans were kind of frustrating. with the new can opener
it's easy, leaves a smooth ridge-less edge. i just mention this to say,
leon, you're not the only one. i think it's from my grandfather having gone
through the depression, something like, he was abandoned and later adopted
by an abusive family, hard times, tough childhood.

b.w.

Both my Mom and Dad went through the depression, WWII
rationing and working for a living. Might be more of us
around than I think, but most of the people I've been privy
to observing don't bother...

What does it smell like? Does it look okay? Try tasting
it... seems to be a lost art nowadays. People only seem to
understand expiration dates anymore. Which I don't pay a
whole lot of attention to

For a good regular can opener look at/for "Swing-A-Way". You
need to have both the upper and lower wheels geared
together. Used to run around $8 for one. We have two, the
older one has been in use for ~30 years or more. Still works
fine, probably would be a bit easier to crank if I gave it a
good clean/lube job. Only had the safety cut for a couple
years, don't know how well it is going to hold up. Bought it
in hopes that it would work on the crummy pull-top cans,
which it does. Mom can't crank it though, turns too hard.
She can use the old Swing-A-Way just fine though.

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

Leon Fisk wrote:

For a good regular can opener look at/for "Swing-A-Way". You
need to have both the upper and lower wheels geared
together. Used to run around $8 for one. We have two, the
older one has been in use for ~30 years or more. Still works
fine, probably would be a bit easier to crank if I gave it a
good clean/lube job. Only had the safety cut for a couple
years, don't know how well it is going to hold up. Bought it
in hopes that it would work on the crummy pull-top cans,
which it does. Mom can't crank it though, turns too hard.
She can use the old Swing-A-Way just fine though.


I bought a new Swing-A-Way at K-mart about a year ago. I finally had
to replace my 20+ year old Swing-A-Way can opener.


--
The movie 'Deliverance' isn't a documentary!

PinstripeSniper wrote:

"Michael A. Terrell" wrote:
I lost all the OTA channels when they made the switch.

Have you looked into a different antenna?
I'm in a funky spot and have to sometimes rotate my rabbit ear antenna
to get certain stations. I also tried an omni directional both
powered and un and I like the bunny ears better.


Yes, I have. I installed TV antennas in the '60s & '70s, then became
a TV broadcast engineer in the early '70s. Later, I was a CATV engineer
designing headens and distribution systems. I have the proper tools and
test equipment to install, aim and test TV antennas. There just isn't
anything usable around here, anymore.


The UHF stations also started working much better when I removed the
little UHF loop antenna - go figure.

Overall I have more channels than before so digtial works for me.


You're lucky.


--
The movie 'Deliverance' isn't a documentary!

On Thu, 03 Dec 2009 19:12:25 GMT,
(PinstripeSniper) wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:
Yeah, how many men (or women) here have received a new knife and
haven't tried every single blade on it to get a feel for it? I always
did the very day, if not hour, that I received/bought one.

I will confess to having difficulty remembering what needs to be
flipped open/out on my multitools. (Leatherman) Anybody seen that
super deluxe Swiss knife that is about 2 inches thick with all the
stuff?

Why not just go for the Mac Tools, or Snap on truck. Every time I
bought a multi purpose tool, it proved to do nothing well.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

Jim Stewart wrote:

Pete C. wrote:
"Bruce L. Bergman" wrote:
On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 09:26:09 -0600, "Pete C."
wrote:
Crank start...
A Diesel. Riiiiiight.... After you. Bring friends.

International UD9 - got one - it crank starts just fine with one person
jumping on the crank.

Google "Lanz Bulldog" and "Field Marshall" tractors.

The early Cat scrapers were hand cranked - the small
gas pony motor that is. It was then run for awhile
to heat up the diesel then clutched in to start it.

The UD9 is more interesting. Diesel injectors, spark plugs, gas carb,
switchable compression ratio.

On Thu, 03 Dec 2009 19:09:32 GMT,
(PinstripeSniper) wrote:

"Michael A. Terrell" wrote:
I lost all the OTA channels when they made the switch.

Have you looked into a different antenna?
I'm in a funky spot and have to sometimes rotate my rabbit ear antenna
to get certain stations. I also tried an omni directional both
powered and un and I like the bunny ears better.

The UHF stations also started working much better when I removed the
little UHF loop antenna - go figure.

Overall I have more channels than before so digtial works for me.


PsS

Rabbit ears? UHF Loop?

You live a couple miles from the transmitter site,....right?

Ive got a 14' long vhf/uhf remote location/long distance antenna up on
the roof and it feeds 3 sets with cable and a remote amp.

Gunner

"Aren't cats Libertarian? They just want to be left alone.
I think our dog is a Democrat, as he is always looking for a handout"
Unknown Usnet Poster

Heh, heh, I'm pretty sure my dog is a liberal - he has no balls.
Keyton

"Pete C." wrote in message
ter.com...

Jim Stewart wrote:

Pete C. wrote:
"Bruce L. Bergman" wrote:
On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 09:26:09 -0600, "Pete C."
wrote:
Crank start...
A Diesel. Riiiiiight.... After you. Bring friends.

International UD9 - got one - it crank starts just fine with one person
jumping on the crank.

Google "Lanz Bulldog" and "Field Marshall" tractors.

The early Cat scrapers were hand cranked - the small
gas pony motor that is. It was then run for awhile
to heat up the diesel then clutched in to start it.

The UD9 is more interesting. Diesel injectors, spark plugs, gas carb,
switchable compression ratio.

There was no starting them by hand though. They were the same set up as the
early IH diesel tractors.....they worked but there was a better way, as
Oliver proved at least in the farm tractors.
Steve

Up North wrote:

"Pete C." wrote in message
ter.com...

Jim Stewart wrote:

Pete C. wrote:
"Bruce L. Bergman" wrote:
On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 09:26:09 -0600, "Pete C."
wrote:
Crank start...
A Diesel. Riiiiiight.... After you. Bring friends.

International UD9 - got one - it crank starts just fine with one person
jumping on the crank.

Google "Lanz Bulldog" and "Field Marshall" tractors.

The early Cat scrapers were hand cranked - the small
gas pony motor that is. It was then run for awhile
to heat up the diesel then clutched in to start it.

The UD9 is more interesting. Diesel injectors, spark plugs, gas carb,
switchable compression ratio.

There was no starting them by hand though. They were the same set up as the
early IH diesel tractors.....they worked but there was a better way, as
Oliver proved at least in the farm tractors.
Steve

Baloney, I've started a UD9 by hand a number of times and it works fine.

Gerald Miller wrote: Every time I
bought a multi purpose tool, it proved to do nothing well.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

That has been my experience also.
Anything that tries to do multiple tasks sacrifices
the ability to do any one of them the best.
(for example a "Shop Smith" :-) )
...lew...

On Dec 4, 11:08*am, Lewis Hartswick wrote:
Gerald Miller wrote: Every time I
bought a multi purpose tool, it proved to do nothing well.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

That has been my experience also.
Anything that tries to do multiple tasks sacrifices
the ability to do any one of them the best.
(for example a "Shop Smith" :-) )
* * ...lew...

In defense of the Shopsmith it may not be the most precise or rigid
machine but it handles oversized jobs very well. They can drill a
large hole straight into the end of a canopy bed post and rip a full
sheet of plywood accurately using the fence on the extension table. I
had no trouble making panel doors and tongue&groove flooring on one.

jsw

On Thu, 03 Dec 2009 17:17:32 -0500, Michael A. Terrell wrote:
PinstripeSniper wrote:


Have you looked into a different antenna? I'm in a funky spot and have
to sometimes rotate my rabbit ear antenna to get certain stations. I
also tried an omni directional both powered and un and I like the bunny
ears better.

Yes, I have. I installed TV antennas in the '60s & '70s, then became
a TV broadcast engineer in the early '70s. Later, I was a CATV engineer
designing headens and distribution systems. I have the proper tools and
test equipment to install, aim and test TV antennas. There just isn't
anything usable around here, anymore.


Um, you _do_ know you need either a digital-capable TV or one of those $50
(at Wally World) converter boxes, right?

I built one of those 4-bay bowties on youtube, and it seems to work fine,
but I'm only about 20 mi. from Mt. Whitney.

Isn't Florida almost flat, such that almost anything is line-of-sight?

Good Luck!
Rich

On Fri, 04 Dec 2009 08:17:57 -0600, "Pete C."
wrote:


Up North wrote:

"Pete C." wrote in message
ter.com...

Jim Stewart wrote:

Pete C. wrote:
"Bruce L. Bergman" wrote:
On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 09:26:09 -0600, "Pete C."
wrote:
Crank start...
A Diesel. Riiiiiight.... After you. Bring friends.

International UD9 - got one - it crank starts just fine with one person
jumping on the crank.

Google "Lanz Bulldog" and "Field Marshall" tractors.

The early Cat scrapers were hand cranked - the small
gas pony motor that is. It was then run for awhile
to heat up the diesel then clutched in to start it.

The UD9 is more interesting. Diesel injectors, spark plugs, gas carb,
switchable compression ratio.

There was no starting them by hand though. They were the same set up as the
early IH diesel tractors.....they worked but there was a better way, as
Oliver proved at least in the farm tractors.
Steve

Baloney, I've started a UD9 by hand a number of times and it works fine.

I've heard of a lot of the dodges used to get antique tractors and
implements running. While it is possible to hand-crank small diesels
in the Under 10 HP range (Hatz has several one-lung horizontal shaft
engines) anything bigger you start playing with multi-fuel, and pony
engines, and compression release shifts, and lighting a big wad of
newspaper in front of the air inlet in lieu of glowplugs, and other
dodges old and new...

Not all that safe, not all that reliable, and while a technically
inclined person could do it no problem it certainly is not something
you want your wife or mother trying at 3 AM in a snowstorm.

That's the time you need something roughly as simple as driving a
modern car, or someone is going to get hurt.

It needs to be all hooked up and ready to go, and easily done
following a short checklist.

And shutdown is the same in the reverse.

A fully automatic start and transfer switch would be ideal, but you
can't turn a housewife into a competent field engineer. So you have
to pick one that doesn't involve Technical Stuff like swinging a dead
chicken over the engine (Counterclockwise only!) to get started.

-- Bruce --

"Bruce L. Bergman" wrote:

On Fri, 04 Dec 2009 08:17:57 -0600, "Pete C."
wrote:


Up North wrote:

"Pete C." wrote in message
ter.com...

Jim Stewart wrote:

Pete C. wrote:
"Bruce L. Bergman" wrote:
On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 09:26:09 -0600, "Pete C."
wrote:
Crank start...
A Diesel. Riiiiiight.... After you. Bring friends.

International UD9 - got one - it crank starts just fine with one person
jumping on the crank.

Google "Lanz Bulldog" and "Field Marshall" tractors.

The early Cat scrapers were hand cranked - the small
gas pony motor that is. It was then run for awhile
to heat up the diesel then clutched in to start it.

The UD9 is more interesting. Diesel injectors, spark plugs, gas carb,
switchable compression ratio.

There was no starting them by hand though. They were the same set up as the
early IH diesel tractors.....they worked but there was a better way, as
Oliver proved at least in the farm tractors.
Steve

Baloney, I've started a UD9 by hand a number of times and it works fine.

I've heard of a lot of the dodges used to get antique tractors and
implements running. While it is possible to hand-crank small diesels
in the Under 10 HP range (Hatz has several one-lung horizontal shaft
engines) anything bigger you start playing with multi-fuel, and pony
engines, and compression release shifts, and lighting a big wad of
newspaper in front of the air inlet in lieu of glowplugs, and other
dodges old and new...

The UD9 is ~50 HP, and indeed has the multi fuel and dual compression
ratio. Pretty neat really since there are no glow plugs and if you were
to bypass the diesel shutoff solenoid you don't need any electrical
power to get it started.


Not all that safe, not all that reliable, and while a technically
inclined person could do it no problem it certainly is not something
you want your wife or mother trying at 3 AM in a snowstorm.

Seems safe and reliable on the UD9. As for the later issue, anything
short of a "start" button on the wall in the house tends to be a problem
there.


That's the time you need something roughly as simple as driving a
modern car, or someone is going to get hurt.

It needs to be all hooked up and ready to go, and easily done
following a short checklist.

And shutdown is the same in the reverse.

A fully automatic start and transfer switch would be ideal, but you
can't turn a housewife into a competent field engineer. So you have
to pick one that doesn't involve Technical Stuff like swinging a dead
chicken over the engine (Counterclockwise only!) to get started.

On Thu, 03 Dec 2009 18:56:33 -0500, the infamous Gerald Miller
scrawled the following:

On Thu, 03 Dec 2009 19:12:25 GMT,
(PinstripeSniper) wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:
Yeah, how many men (or women) here have received a new knife and
haven't tried every single blade on it to get a feel for it? I always
did the very day, if not hour, that I received/bought one.

I will confess to having difficulty remembering what needs to be
flipped open/out on my multitools. (Leatherman) Anybody seen that
super deluxe Swiss knife that is about 2 inches thick with all the
stuff?

Why not just go for the Mac Tools, or Snap on truck. Every time I
bought a multi purpose tool, it proved to do nothing well.

I was talking about receiving knives as a kid. We all wanted the super
duper Swiss job but soon found out that they were hard as hell to use
with all that other crap in the way. My current pocket knife is the
mini Swiss, with a single blade, screwdriver/nailfile, scissors,
toothpick, and tweezers. $10 at Target. Since I keep a 600 grit
diamond paddle in the truck and a 600 grit 2x6" diamond plate at home,
it's always sharp in under a minute after I've used it for awhile.

My Leatherman is extremely hard to open, so I keep it in the truck
where I have other tools to use to pry the damned thing open.
It didn't prove nearly as invaluable to me as I had imagined. Kinda
like the Swiss Army knife experience I had 30 years earlier.

I'm surprise I didn't get any feedback whatsoever about using all the
blades on the knife the day you got it. Was I alone in doing that?
I'd find that extremely hard to believe. We're a curious lot here and
-not- doing that would seem to go against the grain. shrug

--
Follow the path of the unsafe, independent thinker. Expose your ideas
to the dangers of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label
of 'crackpot' than the stigma of conformity. And on issues that seem
important to you, stand up and be counted at any cost.
-- Thomas J. Watson

On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 08:53:32 -0800, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Thu, 03 Dec 2009 18:56:33 -0500, the infamous Gerald Miller
scrawled the following:

On Thu, 03 Dec 2009 19:12:25 GMT,
(PinstripeSniper) wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:
Yeah, how many men (or women) here have received a new knife and
haven't tried every single blade on it to get a feel for it? I always
did the very day, if not hour, that I received/bought one.

I will confess to having difficulty remembering what needs to be
flipped open/out on my multitools. (Leatherman) Anybody seen that
super deluxe Swiss knife that is about 2 inches thick with all the
stuff?

Why not just go for the Mac Tools, or Snap on truck. Every time I
bought a multi purpose tool, it proved to do nothing well.

I was talking about receiving knives as a kid. We all wanted the super
duper Swiss job but soon found out that they were hard as hell to use
with all that other crap in the way. My current pocket knife is the
mini Swiss, with a single blade, screwdriver/nailfile, scissors,
toothpick, and tweezers. $10 at Target. Since I keep a 600 grit
diamond paddle in the truck and a 600 grit 2x6" diamond plate at home,
it's always sharp in under a minute after I've used it for awhile.

My Leatherman is extremely hard to open, so I keep it in the truck
where I have other tools to use to pry the damned thing open.
It didn't prove nearly as invaluable to me as I had imagined. Kinda
like the Swiss Army knife experience I had 30 years earlier.

I'm surprise I didn't get any feedback whatsoever about using all the
blades on the knife the day you got it. Was I alone in doing that?
I'd find that extremely hard to believe. We're a curious lot here and
-not- doing that would seem to go against the grain. shrug


Pick up a Gerber..its a far superior multi-tool

Dont get the needle nosed one..get the plyers nosed one.

Works great!

Gunner


"First Law of Leftist Debate
The more you present a leftist with factual evidence
that is counter to his preconceived world view and the
more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without
losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot,
homophobe approaches infinity.

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." Grey Ghost

On 2009-12-05, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 08:53:32 -0800, Larry Jaques
wrote:

[ ... ]

My Leatherman is extremely hard to open, so I keep it in the truck
where I have other tools to use to pry the damned thing open.
It didn't prove nearly as invaluable to me as I had imagined. Kinda
like the Swiss Army knife experience I had 30 years earlier.

Hmm ... while I used someone else's Leatherman, when I went to a
knife store which had them, they also had the Gerber, and after examining
them both, I got the Gerber.

Reason? The pliers body slides out of the handles, instead of
the handles unfolding around it and presenting semi-sharp edges to the
hand trying to close the pliers to grip something. *And*, if you hold
it just right, a flick of the wrist and the pliers extend -- one handed
-- to position for use.

The "hold it just right" involves letting the handles rest
flat on the fingers, and bring the thumb down on the other side of both
handles so the thumb extrudes a bit between the handles and thus
separates them slightly. Then flick the wrist, and the head of the
pliers slides out and locks in position. You can also close it
one-handed, pressing the two buttons with thumb and index finger while
the back of the jaws rests against the heel of your hand, hten pull in
and the head slides back into place.

To get the knife blades, screwdriver blades, or file out, you do
need both hands however, but often I simply need the pliers and am in a
position where I only have one hand to devote to the task of opening the
pliers.

Also -- the design means that the part which you grip while
closing it on some workpiece is a flat stainless steel with nicely
rounded edges, instead of two semi-sharp edges. A lot more comfortable
to use seriously.

The ones which I have include a cylindrical adaptor which slides
over the square shank of the Phillips bit, and accepts 1/4" hex
screwdriver bits, of which six (along with the adaptor) are stored in
a rubber carrier in a secondary pouch on the belt case.

I'm surprise I didn't get any feedback whatsoever about using all the
blades on the knife the day you got it. Was I alone in doing that?
I'd find that extremely hard to believe. We're a curious lot here and
-not- doing that would seem to go against the grain. shrug

We all do it -- so why discuss it? :-)

Pick up a Gerber..its a far superior multi-tool

Amen!

Dont get the needle nosed one..get the plyers nosed one.

Hmm ... what do you find wrong with the needle nosed version?
That is what I am using, and I find it quite useful for what I need.
(I've even fixed a chain-mail bra -- in situ -- at a SF con(vention).
The ring joining the two cups was opening up under the strain. No, I
don't know her name or phone number -- my wife was with me. :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On Dec 1, 6:27*pm, Gerald Miller wrote:
On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 09:26:39 -0500, Joe wrote:
On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 02:13:15 -0500, Gerald Miller
wrote:

The thing that gets me is the "safety" side cut can opener in the
kitchen drawer. Why is it safer to have a sharp edge of the can
surrounding the contents you are digging at, rather than on the metal
disk you are tossing into the trash; this assumes that you don't make
a habit of licking the lids clean before you toss them.
To my mind, they advertise these because they are made to a lower
standard of accuracy than the old top cut opener.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

The "safety cut" can openers I'm familiar with don't cut anything -
they uncrimp the can top so you just lift it off. They're hard to
find, but I like them better'n anything, including (especially?)
electric openers.

Joe

The ones I'm bitching about take the rolled rim plus the disk off,
leaving a sharp edge on the side of the can; hyper-advertised as being
safer than the one that cuts out a sharp edged disk out, leaving the
rolled edge still attached to the side of the can.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Those are the chinese copies of the real thing. There's a patent
involved, so I think the cheapies either cut below the crimp as an
evasion and rely on the poor sucker who bought it, thinking he had the
real thing, not squawking, or it's just terrible QC. The real deal
will neatly cut through the crimp about midway, leaving smooth edges
on both pieces and the lid can be replaced. They also cost 4-5x as
much as the cheapies, probably due to royalties. Somebody clever
could take a cheapie, make a shim to space the cutter up farther on
the crimp and save a few bucks. The shim would have to probably be on
the side of the pinch wheel next to the lid. Just wish the real ones
would last as long as a Swing-away, the hand operated one had the
crank knob bust after about a year of cat food duty.

Stan

On 5 Dec 2009 22:28:22 GMT, "DoN. Nichols" wrote:


I'm surprise I didn't get any feedback whatsoever about using all the
blades on the knife the day you got it. Was I alone in doing that?
I'd find that extremely hard to believe. We're a curious lot here and
-not- doing that would seem to go against the grain. shrug

We all do it -- so why discuss it? :-)

Pick up a Gerber..its a far superior multi-tool

Amen!

Dont get the needle nosed one..get the plyers nosed one.

Hmm ... what do you find wrong with the needle nosed version?
That is what I am using, and I find it quite useful for what I need.
(I've even fixed a chain-mail bra -- in situ -- at a SF con(vention).
The ring joining the two cups was opening up under the strain. No, I
don't know her name or phone number -- my wife was with me. :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.

Because the plyer nosed ones can be used in a pinch..as a nut
tightener...of good sized nuts and in my line of work..I find them to be
more useful than do needle nosed pliers. Shrug...its a different
application and for me..works better. And I have both types.

Gunner


"First Law of Leftist Debate
The more you present a leftist with factual evidence
that is counter to his preconceived world view and the
more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without
losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot,
homophobe approaches infinity.

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." Grey Ghost

In article ,
"DoN. Nichols" wrote:


Hmm ... what do you find wrong with the needle nosed version?
That is what I am using, and I find it quite useful for what I need.
(I've even fixed a chain-mail bra -- in situ -- at a SF con(vention).
The ring joining the two cups was opening up under the strain. No, I
don't know her name or phone number -- my wife was with me. :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.

It was an itsy-bitsy, teeny-weeny, stainless steel chainmail bikini
That she wore for the first time today.
(With thanks to: Andrew Mac Rob et al)

"DoN. Nichols" wrote in message
...


Dont get the needle nosed one..get the plyers nosed one.

Hmm ... what do you find wrong with the needle nosed version?
That is what I am using, and I find it quite useful for what I need.
(I've even fixed a chain-mail bra -- in situ -- at a SF con(vention).
The ring joining the two cups was opening up under the strain. No, I
don't know her name or phone number -- my wife was with me. :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.




chain mail bra huh? hmmm...

http://fc04.deviantart.net/fs46/f/20...nyo_spoons.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1225/...905c4ad24b.jpg

On Sat, 5 Dec 2009 22:39:10 -0600, "William Wixon"
wrote:


http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1225/...905c4ad24b.jpg


NICE!!!

Gunner


"First Law of Leftist Debate
The more you present a leftist with factual evidence
that is counter to his preconceived world view and the
more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without
losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot,
homophobe approaches infinity.

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." Grey Ghost

Gunner Asch wrote in
:

On Sat, 5 Dec 2009 22:39:10 -0600, "William Wixon"
wrote:


http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1225/...905c4ad24b.jpg


NICE!!!

Gunner



How about http://dealspl.us/product/chain-mail-bra-and-thong ?

"Eregon" wrote in message
...
Gunner Asch wrote in
:

On Sat, 5 Dec 2009 22:39:10 -0600, "William Wixon"
wrote:


http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1225/...905c4ad24b.jpg


NICE!!!

Gunner



How about http://dealspl.us/product/chain-mail-bra-and-thong ?



after seeing your comment i went back and re-looked and you're right. glad
we can agree on something. very cute and nice curvy feminine figure, nice
junk in da trunk. i just posted the url of the pic but this is the flickr
page... there's another pic of her there. (there is SOME bit of
metalworking content there.) too bad i'd just be a creepy old man to her.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/7168480@N02/1473153370


the title of this song comes to mind.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rREY4_q3C20

"I Bow Down and Pray to Every Woman I See"


b.w.

On Sat, 5 Dec 2009 15:09:56 -0800 (PST), wrote:

On Dec 1, 6:27*pm, Gerald Miller wrote:
On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 09:26:39 -0500, Joe wrote:
On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 02:13:15 -0500, Gerald Miller
wrote:

The thing that gets me is the "safety" side cut can opener in the
kitchen drawer. Why is it safer to have a sharp edge of the can
surrounding the contents you are digging at, rather than on the metal
disk you are tossing into the trash; this assumes that you don't make
a habit of licking the lids clean before you toss them.
To my mind, they advertise these because they are made to a lower
standard of accuracy than the old top cut opener.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

The "safety cut" can openers I'm familiar with don't cut anything -
they uncrimp the can top so you just lift it off. They're hard to
find, but I like them better'n anything, including (especially?)
electric openers.

Joe

The ones I'm bitching about take the rolled rim plus the disk off,
leaving a sharp edge on the side of the can; hyper-advertised as being
safer than the one that cuts out a sharp edged disk out, leaving the
rolled edge still attached to the side of the can.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Those are the chinese copies of the real thing. There's a patent
involved, so I think the cheapies either cut below the crimp as an
evasion and rely on the poor sucker who bought it, thinking he had the
real thing, not squawking, or it's just terrible QC. The real deal
will neatly cut through the crimp about midway, leaving smooth edges
on both pieces and the lid can be replaced. They also cost 4-5x as
much as the cheapies, probably due to royalties. Somebody clever
could take a cheapie, make a shim to space the cutter up farther on
the crimp and save a few bucks. The shim would have to probably be on
the side of the pinch wheel next to the lid. Just wish the real ones
would last as long as a Swing-away, the hand operated one had the
crank knob bust after about a year of cat food duty.

Stan

I'll have to take a closer look at mine - I don't remember seeing a
blade at all. I think it really just uncrimps the lid, sort of the
reverse of how the can is sealed in the cannery. I used to work in a
vegetable cannery fixing the electronic aspects of their equipment,
but I never paid much attention to how the sealers worked. I was too
busy with the mag detector that rejected the poorly sealed cans (and
way too many good cans, which is why I was busy with them - late 70s).

Joe

PinstripeSniper wrote:


And the "favorites set" is here
http://www.flickr.com/photos/greyloc...7604501657537/



At last, proof that duct tape CAN do anything!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/greyloc...7604501657537/



technomaNge
--

On Mon, 07 Dec 2009 21:33:35 -0600, the infamous technomaNge
scrawled the following:

PinstripeSniper wrote:


And the "favorites set" is here
http://www.flickr.com/photos/greyloc...7604501657537/



At last, proof that duct tape CAN do anything!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/greyloc...7604501657537/

Who needs duct tape when there are latex dresses around?
http://fwd4.me/7iv and http://fwd4.me/7iw
OMG!

--
To know what you prefer instead of humbly saying Amen
to what the world tells you you ought to prefer,
is to have kept your soul alive.
-- Robert Louis Stevenson

On Nov 30, 7:33 am, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 05:14:09 -0800 (PST), Jim Wilkins
wrote:



On Nov 29, 12:42 am, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


jsw

One of the finest trench weapons ever made, was the narrow bladed garden
or "sod" spade.

Gunner

Yep. Much more effective than trying to lock up their brains with
ludicrous winger conspiracy theories - ...

Andrew VK3BFA.

On Nov 29, 10:50 am, "John R. Carroll" wrote:
Jim Wilkins wrote:
On Nov 28, 5:54 pm, Wes wrote:

Outside of a RF reciever, most televisions don't work the same as
they did when I was a kid.

They did go digital recently.

Downconvert, digitize, the rest is software.

I'd be interested in hearing about that.
I've gone from 30 decent channels to six poor ones.

--
John R. Carroll

Sorta correct - theres a large lot of electronics (digital) devoted to
getting the software decoded digital signal onto the screen, either
LCD or plasma. Has to map and address the screen in an X-Y plane -
most of this is build into the panel at manufacture, so replacement is
costly . With plasmas, its the high power/high voltage driver boards
that die, with LCD its the back light inverters....haven't had a
chance to pull one of the newer LED backlight panels to pieces yet....

The real issue with digital TV's is you cannot look at the screen and
get some idea of where the fault is, unlike analogue. They either
work, or they don't. No schematics available, fix by board
replacement. Totally uneconomic (except as a "interesting problem") to
reverse engineer to component level.

But thats true of most modern goods, except for Old Farts like us who
will spend a day machining a 10c part to fix a $20 machine....its not
economic, but we do it becaause it annoys the hell out of us that
"spare parts" is nowadays an oxymoron.

And back in the Old Days - why, I remember when I had to walk 10 miles
to school, barefoot, through the snow with nothing but a pointy stick
to protect myself from wolves. And this was after I had got up at 5am
to milk the cows and do my chores, breaking ice in the well to draw up
water for my mother. And if I hadn't taken a bundle of firewood with
me for the school heater, I was whipped and made to go out in a raging
blizzard and find some.....

And you tell the young people this, and they don't believe you.

Andrew VK3BFA.

On Wed, 9 Dec 2009 23:41:31 -0800 (PST), Andrew VK3BFA
wrote:

On Nov 29, 10:50 am, "John R. Carroll" wrote:
Jim Wilkins wrote:
On Nov 28, 5:54 pm, Wes wrote:

Outside of a RF reciever, most televisions don't work the same as
they did when I was a kid.

They did go digital recently.

Downconvert, digitize, the rest is software.

I'd be interested in hearing about that.
I've gone from 30 decent channels to six poor ones.

--
John R. Carroll

Sorta correct - theres a large lot of electronics (digital) devoted to
getting the software decoded digital signal onto the screen, either
LCD or plasma. Has to map and address the screen in an X-Y plane -
most of this is build into the panel at manufacture, so replacement is
costly . With plasmas, its the high power/high voltage driver boards
that die, with LCD its the back light inverters....haven't had a
chance to pull one of the newer LED backlight panels to pieces yet....

The real issue with digital TV's is you cannot look at the screen and
get some idea of where the fault is, unlike analogue. They either
work, or they don't. No schematics available, fix by board
replacement. Totally uneconomic (except as a "interesting problem") to
reverse engineer to component level.

But thats true of most modern goods, except for Old Farts like us who
will spend a day machining a 10c part to fix a $20 machine....its not
economic, but we do it becaause it annoys the hell out of us that
"spare parts" is nowadays an oxymoron.

And back in the Old Days - why, I remember when I had to walk 10 miles
to school, barefoot, through the snow with nothing but a pointy stick
to protect myself from wolves. And this was after I had got up at 5am
to milk the cows and do my chores, breaking ice in the well to draw up
water for my mother. And if I hadn't taken a bundle of firewood with
me for the school heater, I was whipped and made to go out in a raging
blizzard and find some.....

And you tell the young people this, and they don't believe you.

Andrew VK3BFA.


You had me right up till the end - there's no wolves in Oz.

And they have a reason to not believe you when you get a critical
fact wrong, people start tugging on the other threads to find any
other loose ones - and soon the whole thing unravels. ;-)

Now then...

The Manufacturers of all electronics should be REQUIRED to release
full schematics into the public domain when the unit is out of
production and no longer supported, and the replacement circuit boards
are no longer available. Because old gear sometimes must be repaired
when there are no new replacements available for them, and you need
the old gear to read the old media.

When the museums and media conversion companies need to keep (for
example) old LaserDisc units, or 9-track computer tape drives, or
Colorado computer backup cart drives, or 4-track or 8-track carts, or
8" Floppies, or AMPEX 2" helical-scan videotape players, or 3/4"
open-reel videotape, or U-Matic or Betamax videotapes... And you are
fast running out of working units... THEN it pays to do component
level repairs.

And without the board schematics and the realignment procedures, and
the Super Seekrit conversion list of proprietary chip numbers to the
industry-standard chips they had relabeled, it can be almost
impossible to fix the unit - unless you were the engineer who built it
in the first place.

...AND you can remember what the hell you were thinking forty years
ago when you were building it, which can be the bigger problem.

-- Bruce --

On Dec 10, 8:18*pm, Bruce L. Bergman
wrote:


* You had me right up till the end - there's no wolves in Oz.

I should have said dingoes - I was using literary license to make it
readable in a different cultural context.....

* And they have a reason to not believe you when you get a critical
fact wrong, people start tugging on the other threads to find any
other loose ones - and soon the whole thing unravels. * ;-)

Spot the deliberate mistake....

* Now then...

Agreed - now, if we can get the World Government (sorry Gunner) to
legislate this, we would have a chance....

* ...AND you can remember what the hell you were thinking forty years
ago when you were building it, which can be the bigger problem.

Bloody Hell Bruce - I have trouble remembering what I did 6 months ago
- I open up a chassis, recognise it as something I have worked on
before, but.......its gone........never used to make notes as my
memory 20 years ago was fine - now, alas have to ask the nice lady in
the bank for my account numbers as I have a brain fart and cant
remember...

BUT - the REALLY NICE old gear had beautiful manuals , old HP , Tek
test gear, even till the 70's radio gear - again, its the Old Fart
syndrome, we remember (I think) when such things as manuals and spare
parts were routine. And if there was a problem, you contacted a
service engineer in the relevant company who would be only too willing
to assist....(now,its a call centre in India running a script on their
PC screen...)

Sometimes work in a local TV repair shop, 3rd world environment as the
margins are so slim - they have a Chinese tech, red hot. He is able to
ring up the Chinese factory and really pay out on them until they
email us the schematic we want....dont know what he says to them, but
its very impressive in spite of my not speaking any Chinese...

Andrew VK3BFA.

-- Bruce --