I had some bumbleheads doing some remodeling work awhile back, and
recently I smelled propane near an exterior, above-ground run of black
pipe they installed. Tested with soapy water, and sure enough one of
the joints at an elbow is leaking. Getting this run apart so that I
can get to the elbow joint will be a hassle. Is there any way to
repair this without disassembly? Perhaps a liquid pipe dope that I
could brush on, and would seep in well enough to seal the pinhole
leak?

Thanks,

Kelly

wrote:

I had some bumbleheads doing some remodeling work awhile back, and
recently I smelled propane near an exterior, above-ground run of black
pipe they installed. Tested with soapy water, and sure enough one of
the joints at an elbow is leaking. Getting this run apart so that I
can get to the elbow joint will be a hassle. Is there any way to
repair this without disassembly? Perhaps a liquid pipe dope that I
could brush on, and would seep in well enough to seal the pinhole
leak?

Thanks,

Kelly



Loctite. Bleed off pressure first.

disclaimer: you know this isn't the "proper" method :-)

(Wonder what else they did??)

wrote in message
oups.com...
I had some bumbleheads doing some remodeling work awhile back, and
recently I smelled propane near an exterior, above-ground run of black
pipe they installed. Tested with soapy water, and sure enough one of
the joints at an elbow is leaking. Getting this run apart so that I
can get to the elbow joint will be a hassle. Is there any way to
repair this without disassembly? Perhaps a liquid pipe dope that I
could brush on, and would seep in well enough to seal the pinhole
leak?

Thanks,

Kelly


Plastic welding may work.

wrote in message
oups.com...
I had some bumbleheads doing some remodeling work awhile back, and
recently I smelled propane near an exterior, above-ground run of black
pipe they installed. Tested with soapy water, and sure enough one of
the joints at an elbow is leaking. Getting this run apart so that I
can get to the elbow joint will be a hassle. Is there any way to
repair this without disassembly? Perhaps a liquid pipe dope that I
could brush on, and would seep in well enough to seal the pinhole
leak?

Thanks,

Kelly


I would not mess around I would redo it or have it done, it's not just a
simple water leak.

On Feb 17, 1:27 pm, Speedy Jim wrote:
wrote:
I had some bumbleheads doing some remodeling work awhile back, and
recently I smelled propane near an exterior, above-ground run of black
pipe they installed. Tested with soapy water, and sure enough one of
the joints at an elbow is leaking. Getting this run apart so that I
can get to the elbow joint will be a hassle. Is there any way to
repair this without disassembly? Perhaps a liquid pipe dope that I
could brush on, and would seep in well enough to seal the pinhole
leak?

Thanks,

Kelly

Loctite. Bleed off pressure first.

disclaimer: you know this isn't the "proper" method :-)

(Wonder what else they did??)

Kelly-


No "brush on" sealant that I am aware of that will solve this
problem

Your best bet (really the "right" way) for a good fix since this is an
above ground run.......

remove the bad joint & replace it using a union somewhere in the
system, that will allow everything to be tightened as needed...that
way you won't have to take "everything" apart.

Just near the leaking joint.

cheers
Bob

Jim-

I was having trouble getting my post to "go" while you where giving
your answer....which Loctite product are you suggesting?

On Feb 17, 1:27 pm, Speedy Jim wrote:
wrote:
I had some bumbleheads doing some remodeling work awhile back, and
recently I smelled propane near an exterior, above-ground run of black
pipe they installed. Tested with soapy water, and sure enough one of
the joints at an elbow is leaking. Getting this run apart so that I
can get to the elbow joint will be a hassle. Is there any way to
repair this without disassembly? Perhaps a liquid pipe dope that I
could brush on, and would seep in well enough to seal the pinhole
leak?

Thanks,

Kelly

Loctite. Bleed off pressure first.

disclaimer: you know this isn't the "proper" method :-)

(Wonder what else they did??)


Kelly-

No "brush on" sealant that I am aware of that will solve this
problem

Your best bet (really the "right" way) for a good fix since this is an
above ground run.......

remove the bad joint & replace it using a union somewhere in the
system, that will allow everything to be tightened as needed...that
way you won't have to take "everything" apart.

Just near the leaking joint.

cheers
Bob

Jim-

I was having trouble getting my post to "go" while you where giving
your answer....which Loctite product are you suggesting?

On Feb 17, 3:18 pm, wrote:
I had some bumbleheads doing some remodeling work awhile back, and
recently I smelled propane near an exterior, above-ground run of black
pipe they installed. Tested with soapy water, and sure enough one of
the joints at an elbow is leaking. Getting this run apart so that I
can get to the elbow joint will be a hassle. Is there any way to
repair this without disassembly? Perhaps a liquid pipe dope that I
could brush on, and would seep in well enough to seal the pinhole
leak?


If it were anything but a flammable, I'd consider it, but it's too
risky w/ the fuel line imo.

If it were me, if you don't want to do it yourself, I'd hire somebody
competent and send the bill to the bumbleheads. I guess strictly
speaking, they're owed a chance to make it right, but I'd be reluctant
to give them another chance since it is the propane line.

If it is a _major_ dissassembly to get there, while not ideal, could
cut the line and insert a union to put it back together -- while fewer
joints is better, I'd be more comfortable w/ two non-leaking joints
than one leaker w/ a patch...

On Feb 17, 3:50 pm, "dpb" wrote:
On Feb 17, 3:18 pm, wrote:

I had some bumbleheads doing some remodeling work awhile back, and
recently I smelled propane near an exterior, above-ground run of black
pipe they installed. Tested with soapy water, and sure enough one of
the joints at an elbow is leaking. Getting this run apart so that I
can get to the elbow joint will be a hassle. Is there any way to
repair this without disassembly? Perhaps a liquid pipe dope that I
could brush on, and would seep in well enough to seal the pinhole
leak?

If it were anything but a flammable, I'd consider it, but it's too
risky w/ the fuel line imo.

If it were me, if you don't want to do it yourself, I'd hire somebody
competent and send the bill to the bumbleheads. I guess strictly
speaking, they're owed a chance to make it right, but I'd be reluctant
to give them another chance since it is the propane line.

If it is a _major_ dissassembly to get there, while not ideal, could
cut the line and insert a union to put it back together -- while fewer
joints is better, I'd be more comfortable w/ two non-leaking joints
than one leaker w/ a patch...

And, of course, you should really do a pressure test after the repair
before putting the line back into service...

This might be a good time to mention my fondness
for J.B.Weld, but it would mean some really good
surface prep, and having the line shut down for at
least 24 hours

On Feb 17, 4:27 pm, Speedy Jim wrote:
wrote:
I had some bumbleheads doing some remodeling work awhile back, and
recently I smelled propane near an exterior, above-ground run of black
pipe they installed. Tested with soapy water, and sure enough one of
the joints at an elbow is leaking. Getting this run apart so that I
can get to the elbow joint will be a hassle. Is there any way to
repair this without disassembly? Perhaps a liquid pipe dope that I
could brush on, and would seep in well enough to seal the pinhole
leak?

Thanks,

Kelly

Loctite. Bleed off pressure first.

disclaimer: you know this isn't the "proper" method :-)

(Wonder what else they did??)

wrote in message
oups.com...
I had some bumbleheads doing some remodeling work awhile back, and
recently I smelled propane near an exterior, above-ground run of black
pipe they installed. Tested with soapy water, and sure enough one of
the joints at an elbow is leaking. Getting this run apart so that I
can get to the elbow joint will be a hassle. Is there any way to
repair this without disassembly? Perhaps a liquid pipe dope that I
could brush on, and would seep in well enough to seal the pinhole
leak?

Sometimes you just have to do the job right. Sorry, no good shortcuts,
especially with gas. You must get the threads to close up, not use a
filler.

On Feb 17, 1:27 pm, Speedy Jim wrote:
wrote:
Perhaps a liquid pipe dope that I
could brush on, and would seep in well enough to seal the pinhole
leak?

Thanks,

Kelly

Loctite. Bleed off pressure first.

disclaimer: you know this isn't the "proper" method :-)

Yeah, I know. Seeing as it is only a 'pinhole' leak, I thought I'd
check to see if there was a product certified for this purpose.
Sounds like there isn't. I'll give the loctite some consideration,
but will probably go with breaking it apart and putting in a union.

(Wonder what else they did?

Don't even get me started. My favorite was the 1/2" copper water line
which they bent - without benefit of a bender - about 20 degrees to
get it around something. It crimped considerably, and they wanted to
leave it like that, arguing that not only did it meet code, but it
also met the standards of 'good workmanship' which the contract
specified. I ended up cutting it out and repairing it myself, as I
refused to have the wall closed up with that in it. Or the standard
'duct tape' (which doesn't meet code, at least here) that they used
to tape up some HVAC duct work, and then when I protested treated me
like *I* was the idiot for not knowing that "That's what duct tape is
for - ducts!".

Thanks (everyone) for the recommendations,

Kelly

Indeed, I see the Loctite remedy as a possibility
http://www.loctite.us/int_henkel/loctite_us/index.cfm?
pageid=19&layout=4&productline=OEM4000
But I find a second layer of protection to be nice. Such as
J.B.Weld.
But to keep it from niggling at the back of your mind,
redoing those joints correctly is going to do a lot for your
mental wellbeing. Gonna be a while before you trust someone
else to do a job, isn't it?

Loctite could well do it for you, though.

On Feb 17, 7:39 pm, wrote:

Yeah, I know. Seeing as it is only a 'pinhole' leak, I thought I'd
check to see if there was a product certified for this purpose.
Sounds like there isn't. I'll give the loctite some consideration,
but will probably go with breaking it apart and putting in a union.

BobK207 wrote:
remove the bad joint & replace it using a union somewhere in the
system, that will allow everything to be tightened as needed...that
way you won't have to take "everything" apart.

Union couplings should be used only in situations where the pipe would
need to be opened for service. Otherwise use a solid pipe coupling with
left hand thread on one side.

Sure hate those extra-long URLs. After pasting the second line
of the site on, we get a portion of their product line that reads

Loctite® Liquid Thread Sealants seal and secure metal
pipes and fittings, filling the space between threaded metal parts,
and hardening to prevent leakage. Designed for low and high
pressure applications, liquid thread sealants seal instantly
for low pressure testing. When fully cured, they seal to the
burst strength of most piping systems.

Tonight, on a Mythbusters sequence, they had a propane setup
with a leak. They used a vacuum to draw Crazyglue into the joint,
then finished the seal with "Engine Epoxy". They can't show
brand names, but it was J.B.Weld that they were using.

On Feb 17, 9:16 pm, "Michael B" wrote:
Indeed, I see the Loctite remedy as a possibilityhttp://www.loctite.us/int_henkel/loctite_us/index.cfm?
pageid=19&layout=4&productline=OEM4000
But I find a second layer of protection to be nice. Such as
J.B.Weld.
But to keep it from niggling at the back of your mind,
redoing those joints correctly is going to do a lot for your
mental wellbeing. Gonna be a while before you trust someone
else to do a job, isn't it?

Loctite could well do it for you, though.

On Feb 17, 7:39 pm, wrote:

Yeah, I know. Seeing as it is only a 'pinhole' leak, I thought I'd
check to see if there was a product certified for this purpose.
Sounds like there isn't. I'll give the loctite some consideration,
but will probably go with breaking it apart and putting in a union.

On Feb 17, 6:16 pm, Bob wrote:
BobK207 wrote:
remove the bad joint & replace it using a union somewhere in the
system, that will allow everything to be tightened as needed...that
way you won't have to take "everything" apart.

Union couplings should be used only in situations where the pipe would
need to be opened for service. Otherwise use a solid pipe coupling with
left hand thread on one side.

Otherwise use a solid pipe coupling with left hand thread on one side.

Since this special coupling has left hand thread on one side, the end
of the mating pipe must have left hand thread as well.

Sounds like all this left hand / right hand stuff would be more work
than taking the whole thing apart.

Since I can't see the installation from here, I suggested adding a
union ....since the area in question is above ground & accessible.

Using that left hand / right hand coupling sounds like a good way to
booby trap some poor guy years from now. esp since the work is not
covered up.

Union couplings should be used only in situations where the pipe would
need to be opened for service

Cite?

I've a fair amount of gas line work done & they always seem to put in
a few unions along the way.

cheers
Bob

On Feb 17, 6:16 pm, "Michael B" wrote:
Indeed, I see the Loctite remedy as a possibilityhttp://www.loctite.us/int_henkel/loctite_us/index.cfm?
pageid=19&layout=4&productline=OEM4000
But I find a second layer of protection to be nice. Such as
J.B.Weld.
But to keep it from niggling at the back of your mind,
redoing those joints correctly is going to do a lot for your
mental wellbeing. Gonna be a while before you trust someone
else to do a job, isn't it?

Loctite could well do it for you, though.

On Feb 17, 7:39 pm, wrote:

Yeah, I know. Seeing as it is only a 'pinhole' leak, I thought I'd
check to see if there was a product certified for this purpose.
Sounds like there isn't. I'll give the loctite some consideration,
but will probably go with breaking it apart and putting in a union.

The Loctite product 579 is meant to be applied prior to assembly to
clean & dry threads. Parts are to be assembled & torqued, low
strength seal achieved immediately, high strength in 24 hrs.

I doubt this stuff will work "after the fact" unless there is a method
to draw the material into the thread plus any contamination might
effect cure.

cheers
Bob

And, I suppose the external thread of the existing pipe has a
left hand thread?

NOT!

This (below) is one really off the mark writing.

--

Christopher A. Young
You can't shout down a troll.
You have to starve them.
..

"Bob" wrote in message
. net...
:
: Union couplings should be used only in situations where the
pipe would
: need to be opened for service. Otherwise use a solid pipe
coupling with
: left hand thread on one side.

One answer is to call the bumbleheads back, and ask them to redo
the job. Of course, this might not work any better the second
time.

I know of no after the assembly sealant. Wish I did, I coulda
used it myself a few times.

At this point, the repair is considerable work. Dissemble the
pipe from the union to where the leak is. It's also possible to
take the elbow out with a sawzall, and dissemble some pipe.
Replace a length of pipe with two shorter pieces, and another
union.

--

Christopher A. Young
You can't shout down a troll.
You have to starve them.
..

wrote in message
oups.com...
: I had some bumbleheads doing some remodeling work awhile back,
and
: recently I smelled propane near an exterior, above-ground run
of black
: pipe they installed. Tested with soapy water, and sure enough
one of
: the joints at an elbow is leaking. Getting this run apart so
that I
: can get to the elbow joint will be a hassle. Is there any way
to
: repair this without disassembly? Perhaps a liquid pipe dope
that I
: could brush on, and would seep in well enough to seal the
pinhole
: leak?
:
: Thanks,
:
: Kelly
:

As far as I know, there is NO such thing as a left hand pipe thread or
fitting. It was a troll posting that. Not to mention, EVEN if there were
such a thing, both ends would surely not tighten up at the same time.

--
Steve Barker

"BobK207" wrote in message
oups.com...

Since this special coupling has left hand thread on one side, the end
of the mating pipe must have left hand thread as well.

Sounds like all this left hand / right hand stuff would be more work
than taking the whole thing apart.

Since I can't see the installation from here, I suggested adding a
union ....since the area in question is above ground & accessible.

Using that left hand / right hand coupling sounds like a good way to
booby trap some poor guy years from now. esp since the work is not
covered up.

Union couplings should be used only in situations where the pipe
would
need to be opened for service

Cite?

I've a fair amount of gas line work done & they always seem to put in
a few unions along the way.

cheers
Bob

Steve Barker wrote:

As far as I know, there is NO such thing as a left hand pipe thread or
fitting. It was a troll posting that. Not to mention, EVEN if there were
such a thing, both ends would surely not tighten up at the same time.



L/R couplings are in use today and trace origins to the very
earliest days.

http://www.plumbingsupply.com/leftright.html

In article ,
Stormin Mormon wrote:
And, I suppose the external thread of the existing pipe has a
left hand thread?

NOT!

This (below) is one really off the mark writing.


Better stick to locksmithing, you don't know something til you KNOW it.



--
Often wrong, never in doubt.

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf.lonestar.org

On Feb 18, 8:29 am, "Steve Barker"
wrote:
As far as I know, there is NO such thing as a left hand pipe thread or
fitting. It was a troll posting that. Not to mention, EVEN if there were
such a thing, both ends would surely not tighten up at the same time.

--
Steve Barker

"BobK207" wrote in message

oups.com...



Since this special coupling has left hand thread on one side, the end
of the mating pipe must have left hand thread as well.

Sounds like all this left hand / right hand stuff would be more work
than taking the whole thing apart.

Since I can't see the installation from here, I suggested adding a
union ....since the area in question is above ground & accessible.

Using that left hand / right hand coupling sounds like a good way to
booby trap some poor guy years from now. esp since the work is not
covered up.

Union couplings should be used only in situations where the pipe
would
need to be opened for service

Cite?

I've a fair amount of gas line work done & they always seem to put in
a few unions along the way.

cheers
Bob

Steve-

I thought the left / right coupling was a troll myself.....but then I
remembered a situation where an old plumber suggested one YEARS
ago......they went with a union cuz' they had the parts & pipe tools
on site AND the union was going to be accessible. For hidden work
you are required to use tapered threads only & thus would need a L/R
coupling.


I checked on www.mcmaster.com and they do indeed sell them.

"If mcmaster doesn't have it, you probably don't need it"

cheers
Bob

Well I stand corrected then. That's the most ridiculous thing I've ever
heard of. When a union would be so much better, why would you bother with
searching out and procuring and using a morphidite like that?

--
Steve Barker


"Speedy Jim" wrote in message
et...


L/R couplings are in use today and trace origins to the very earliest
days.

http://www.plumbingsupply.com/leftright.html

If it weren't accessible, you wouldn't be able to install the L/R......


--
Steve Barker



"BobK207" wrote in message
oups.com...

I thought the left / right coupling was a troll myself.....but then I
remembered a situation where an old plumber suggested one YEARS
ago......they went with a union cuz' they had the parts & pipe tools
on site AND the union was going to be accessible. For hidden work
you are required to use tapered threads only & thus would need a L/R
coupling.


I checked on www.mcmaster.com and they do indeed sell them.

"If mcmaster doesn't have it, you probably don't need it"

cheers
Bob

"Steve Barker" wrote in message
...
If it weren't accessible, you wouldn't be able to install the L/R......


The term "accessible" has a slightly different use in building. Anything is
accessible with the right hammer, but normally, hidden joint between walls,
under floors, etc cannot be joined with a union. It may be accessible
during construction, but not after the room is finished.

Well, I can't imagine there being a use for the L/R system in new
construction. It would be only in a repair. And if that is the case, you'd
just take it apart at the "accessible" union, and take apart backwards to
the problem area.

--
Steve Barker



"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
. net...
The term "accessible" has a slightly different use in building. Anything
is accessible with the right hammer, but normally, hidden joint between
walls, under floors, etc cannot be joined with a union. It may be
accessible during construction, but not after the room is finished.

"Steve Barker" wrote in message
...
Well, I can't imagine there being a use for the L/R system in new
construction. It would be only in a repair. And if that is the case,
you'd just take it apart at the "accessible" union, and take apart
backwards to the problem area.


Right about the new construction, but in the case of a repair, it can still
be a very long run, with many turns, to the union. Why break 15 joints if
you can break three and get the job done?

In article ,
Steve Barker wrote:
Well, I can't imagine there being a use for the L/R system in new
construction. It would be only in a repair. And if that is the case, you'd
just take it apart at the "accessible" union, and take apart backwards to
the problem area.

--
Steve Barker

They probably do find their widest use in repairs, whatever the case,
there is sufficient demand for them that the manufacturers continue
to produce them and supply them at resonable prices.

To the OP, if you decide to use one of these make sure that all the
other threaded fittings on both sieds are tight beforehand, and use a
long pipe wrench on the LH thread side to keep from loosening any
exisiting joints. As you tighten the repair fitting it will want
to loosen any RH threaded joints connected in line with the LH thread
repair fitting.


--
Often wrong, never in doubt.

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf.lonestar.org

Because the same bumbleheads did the rest of the joints, too.

On Feb 18, 3:07 pm, "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote:


Right about the new construction, but in the case of a repair, it can still
be a very long run, with many turns, to the union. Why break 15 joints if
you can break three and get the job done?

I hear ya.

--
Steve Barker


"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
...

"Steve Barker" wrote in message
...
Well, I can't imagine there being a use for the L/R system in new
construction. It would be only in a repair. And if that is the case,
you'd just take it apart at the "accessible" union, and take apart
backwards to the problem area.


Right about the new construction, but in the case of a repair, it can
still be a very long run, with many turns, to the union. Why break 15
joints if you can break three and get the job done?

I doubt this stuff will work "after the fact" unless there is a method
to draw the material into the thread plus any contamination might
effect cure.

Gas lines aren't under much pressure. I suspect that the "right stuff"
cold seal it even without turning off the gas. If you could turn off the
gas even chewing gum might work.

If you could draw a slight vacuum ...

I am surprised that we got this far into this thread and nobody has
pointed out pipe dope and teflon tape is there as a lubricant, not a
sealant. It allows you to get the pipe tight enough for a good metal
to metal seal.

That's not quite true.

The pipe dope permits elbows to be positioned at any position in that "last
turn" without leakage.

A question on sealing gas pipe was posted and to this I say:

Of course ,if you can weld, black pipe is the easiest stuff to weld you
ever saw. Arc,mig,tig even oxy/acetylene will do nicely.
Welded gas line is common in europe.

H.R.