On Mon, 29 Mar 2021 14:23:34 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

wrote in message ...

On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 02:00:34 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

My shop was all but completely outfitted about 15 years before I retired.
What I saw in my woodworkers club was guys retiring and then trying to
build
a shop, buy all the tools, and buy wood. Guess what... it was basically
too
late for many of them. They didn't have the discretionary income or the
skills to do much of anything. After seeing that happen numerous times I
decided to just do it!

Exactly. Right now I have plenty of money and no time. Shortly, I'll
have plenty of time and no money. ;-) The problem is that SWMBO will
have an infinite honeydo list.

I was going to retire a year ago but SWMBO had other ideas. That
timer ran out in October so I can leave at any time. Work is
interesting now so told the boss I'd finish the project I'm working
on. It's easy work. Covid has everyone working from home and he's in
Detroit anyway. We're on a phone call twice a week. I can deal with
such micro-management. ;-)

I think these are the last stationary tools that I'll need. I didn't
think I needed a jointer but looking at the lumber I've seen around, I
think it's going to be a must. The last, and not completely
necessary, stationary tools will be the DC.

I've used my shop as much for home renovation/improvement projects as I have
for fine woodworking projects. In fact, those home renovation/improvement
projects were often where I discovered I needed bigger and more powerful
tools. The upside of the home renovation/improvement projects make for
better justification for buying tools than do hobby woodworking projects.
;~)

Sure but it's hard to "justify" a $2500 tool for a remodel job. It's
easier to call it a hobby where no justification is needed (or
possible). ;-)

That said, my Festool track saw has seen more use as a home
maintenance tool as it has anything else.

wrote in message ...

On Mon, 29 Mar 2021 14:23:34 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

I've used my shop as much for home renovation/improvement projects as I
have
for fine woodworking projects. In fact, those home renovation/improvement
projects were often where I discovered I needed bigger and more powerful
tools. The upside of the home renovation/improvement projects make for
better justification for buying tools than do hobby woodworking projects.
;~)

Sure but it's hard to "justify" a $2500 tool for a remodel job. It's
easier to call it a hobby where no justification is needed (or
possible). ;-)

That said, my Festool track saw has seen more use as a home
maintenance tool as it has anything else.

Sounds like your pitch (to your significant other and/or yourself) needs
some work.... Frame it in terms of "I cannot do this job without that tool"
and things go much better. ;~)

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
...

On Monday, March 29, 2021 at 2:23:50 PM UTC-4, John Grossbohlin wrote:
wrote in message ...

It's hard for SWMBO to argue the need for new tools when it's often her
that
suggest that I build something for the kids.

That's a win!

On Tue, 30 Mar 2021 22:20:40 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

wrote in message ...

On Mon, 29 Mar 2021 14:23:34 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

I've used my shop as much for home renovation/improvement projects as I
have
for fine woodworking projects. In fact, those home renovation/improvement
projects were often where I discovered I needed bigger and more powerful
tools. The upside of the home renovation/improvement projects make for
better justification for buying tools than do hobby woodworking projects.
;~)

Sure but it's hard to "justify" a $2500 tool for a remodel job. It's
easier to call it a hobby where no justification is needed (or
possible). ;-)

That said, my Festool track saw has seen more use as a home
maintenance tool as it has anything else.

Sounds like your pitch (to your significant other and/or yourself) needs
some work.... Frame it in terms of "I cannot do this job without that tool"
and things go much better. ;~)

Well, moons ago I used that plan (justified more to myself than
SWMBO). I generally ended up tools that didn't work to my
satisfaction. I moved from that to waiting until I could afford the
tool I really wanted. Now I can afford it. Next year I'll have time
to use it. ;-)

I was intending to retire earlier this year but I agreed to at least
finish the project I'm working on, so it'll probably be September.
Covid forced work-from-home has made it really easy.

Seriously, the track saw has been the best power tool I've bought. I
didn't believe Leon, several years ago, but I use my table saw a lot
less than I once did. The track saw is almost always out.

wrote in message ...

On Tue, 30 Mar 2021 22:20:40 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

Sounds like your pitch (to your significant other and/or yourself) needs
some work.... Frame it in terms of "I cannot do this job without that
tool"
and things go much better. ;~)

Well, moons ago I used that plan (justified more to myself than
SWMBO). I generally ended up tools that didn't work to my
satisfaction. I moved from that to waiting until I could afford the
tool I really wanted. Now I can afford it. Next year I'll have time
to use it. ;-)

I was intending to retire earlier this year but I agreed to at least
finish the project I'm working on, so it'll probably be September.
Covid forced work-from-home has made it really easy.

Seriously, the track saw has been the best power tool I've bought. I
didn't believe Leon, several years ago, but I use my table saw a lot
less than I once did. The track saw is almost always out.

I seldom use sheet goods so I haven't felt a need for a track saw... and
when I do it's something like 1/2" CDX where a hand guided circular saw is
accurate enough for the job.

My shaper is my least used stationary tool but when I need it I need it.

The retirement decision is a tough one. Putting things in the context of all
my friends, siblings, and other family members who didn't make it past age
62 changed my view. I've also been talking to a lot of my friends about it.
Universally they, and I, went out or plan to go out sooner than we thought
we would even five years ago. One spent years planning his retirement from
the business world and his run for congress. He is well connected,
financed, and likely would have won. When all was said and done he decided
that he'd done enough public service, retired, and is taking time for he and
his wife instead. Me... I've cut way down on my public service and am
focusing on myself, family and my close friends instead.

On Wed, 31 Mar 2021 18:05:44 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

wrote in message ...

On Tue, 30 Mar 2021 22:20:40 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

Sounds like your pitch (to your significant other and/or yourself) needs
some work.... Frame it in terms of "I cannot do this job without that
tool"
and things go much better. ;~)

Well, moons ago I used that plan (justified more to myself than
SWMBO). I generally ended up tools that didn't work to my
satisfaction. I moved from that to waiting until I could afford the
tool I really wanted. Now I can afford it. Next year I'll have time
to use it. ;-)

I was intending to retire earlier this year but I agreed to at least
finish the project I'm working on, so it'll probably be September.
Covid forced work-from-home has made it really easy.

Seriously, the track saw has been the best power tool I've bought. I
didn't believe Leon, several years ago, but I use my table saw a lot
less than I once did. The track saw is almost always out.

I seldom use sheet goods so I haven't felt a need for a track saw... and
when I do it's something like 1/2" CDX where a hand guided circular saw is
accurate enough for the job.

You don't make furniture out of CDX? I guess you're no Ikea.

Sheet goods are probably 90% of what I do, so...

My shaper is my least used stationary tool but when I need it I need it.

I think a router table will do everything I need to do.

The retirement decision is a tough one. Putting things in the context of all
my friends, siblings, and other family members who didn't make it past age
62 changed my view. I've also been talking to a lot of my friends about it.
Universally they, and I, went out or plan to go out sooner than we thought
we would even five years ago. One spent years planning his retirement from
the business world and his run for congress. He is well connected,
financed, and likely would have won. When all was said and done he decided
that he'd done enough public service, retired, and is taking time for he and
his wife instead. Me... I've cut way down on my public service and am
focusing on myself, family and my close friends instead.

It isn't easy. After fifty years working, it's scary. I should be in
good shape, barring hyperinflation (everyone in Washington seems hard
at work on it though), I should be fine. It's a big decision with no
way back. My boss was talking about dropping to two days per week but
hasn't said anything in some time. I think the business isn't ready
for contractors yet. They got rid of almost all of them a year ago.

wrote in message ...

On Wed, 31 Mar 2021 18:05:44 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:


The retirement decision is a tough one. Putting things in the context of
all
my friends, siblings, and other family members who didn't make it past age
62 changed my view. I've also been talking to a lot of my friends about
it.
Universally they, and I, went out or plan to go out sooner than we thought
we would even five years ago. One spent years planning his retirement from
the business world and his run for congress. He is well connected,
financed, and likely would have won. When all was said and done he decided
that he'd done enough public service, retired, and is taking time for he
and
his wife instead. Me... I've cut way down on my public service and am
focusing on myself, family and my close friends instead.

It isn't easy. After fifty years working, it's scary. I should be in
good shape, barring hyperinflation (everyone in Washington seems hard
at work on it though), I should be fine. It's a big decision with no
way back. My boss was talking about dropping to two days per week but
hasn't said anything in some time. I think the business isn't ready
for contractors yet. They got rid of almost all of them a year ago.

Yes it is scary... being frugal and staying healthy so you don't outlive
your income is important and challenging. Let us hope we all succeed at
that...

On 3/12/2021 4:28 PM, wrote:

Laguna finally came out with their new line of jointers. The higher
end 8" helical jointer looks nice but at $2750, I think it's out of my
range. Interestingly, all of the Laguna jointers are parallogram.
There are no more dovetail jointers in their lineup. They have 54
cutters, like Powermatic.

The lower end 8" jointer is very similar (1.5HP vs 1.75HP WOW!) but
only has 20 cutters and goes for $2000. 20 cutters, really? There is
a picture of the cutter head. It looks like a kid missing half its
teeth. https://lagunatools.com/classic/jointers/jx8-eco/ Click on
the plus sign on the safety cover.

It's very different than either the Jet or Powermatic so it's a tough
call.



So! Now you can get a 100th Anniversary Powermatic.

Comes in Black with Gold highlights!

When sexy is a consideration, this might be it! ;~)

On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 00:45:33 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

wrote in message ...

On Wed, 31 Mar 2021 18:05:44 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:


The retirement decision is a tough one. Putting things in the context of
all
my friends, siblings, and other family members who didn't make it past age
62 changed my view. I've also been talking to a lot of my friends about
it.
Universally they, and I, went out or plan to go out sooner than we thought
we would even five years ago. One spent years planning his retirement from
the business world and his run for congress. He is well connected,
financed, and likely would have won. When all was said and done he decided
that he'd done enough public service, retired, and is taking time for he
and
his wife instead. Me... I've cut way down on my public service and am
focusing on myself, family and my close friends instead.

It isn't easy. After fifty years working, it's scary. I should be in
good shape, barring hyperinflation (everyone in Washington seems hard
at work on it though), I should be fine. It's a big decision with no
way back. My boss was talking about dropping to two days per week but
hasn't said anything in some time. I think the business isn't ready
for contractors yet. They got rid of almost all of them a year ago.

Yes it is scary... being frugal and staying healthy so you don't outlive
your income is important and challenging. Let us hope we all succeed at
that...

OTOH, I don't expect to live forever. There is something to living
well. I think we'll be fine, in fact all things considered I figure
we'll have about a $5K lower income and that'll be all but made up by
the state tax reduction (elimination) on retirement income.

On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 09:25:32 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:

On 3/12/2021 4:28 PM, wrote:

Laguna finally came out with their new line of jointers. The higher
end 8" helical jointer looks nice but at $2750, I think it's out of my
range. Interestingly, all of the Laguna jointers are parallogram.
There are no more dovetail jointers in their lineup. They have 54
cutters, like Powermatic.

The lower end 8" jointer is very similar (1.5HP vs 1.75HP WOW!) but
only has 20 cutters and goes for $2000. 20 cutters, really? There is
a picture of the cutter head. It looks like a kid missing half its
teeth. https://lagunatools.com/classic/jointers/jx8-eco/ Click on
the plus sign on the safety cover.

It's very different than either the Jet or Powermatic so it's a tough
call.



So! Now you can get a 100th Anniversary Powermatic.

Comes in Black with Gold highlights!

When sexy is a consideration, this might be it! ;~)

It's not quite as ugly as the 99th anniversary Powermatic. There
isn't an 8" model, either. So, it's either wait, wait, or wait.

wrote in message ...

On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 00:45:33 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:


Yes it is scary... being frugal and staying healthy so you don't outlive
your income is important and challenging. Let us hope we all succeed at
that...

OTOH, I don't expect to live forever. There is something to living
well. I think we'll be fine, in fact all things considered I figure
we'll have about a $5K lower income and that'll be all but made up by
the state tax reduction (elimination) on retirement income.

As long as inflation stays moderate we will probably be OK. With all the
deductions for insurance, savings, retirement plan, and commuting costs
going away I'm ahead for now. I'll have to reassess every year... I haven't
figured out how to predict the future so I cannot do it now!

On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 22:45:43 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

wrote in message ...

On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 00:45:33 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:


Yes it is scary... being frugal and staying healthy so you don't outlive
your income is important and challenging. Let us hope we all succeed at
that...

OTOH, I don't expect to live forever. There is something to living
well. I think we'll be fine, in fact all things considered I figure
we'll have about a $5K lower income and that'll be all but made up by
the state tax reduction (elimination) on retirement income.

As long as inflation stays moderate we will probably be OK. With all the
deductions for insurance, savings, retirement plan, and commuting costs
going away I'm ahead for now. I'll have to reassess every year... I haven't
figured out how to predict the future so I cannot do it now!

Well, insurance is still there. That can be expensive. My drugs,
alone, are a fortune. List is around $1K/mo. They're relatively cheap
now because of rebate cards but that all goes away with Medicare. The
drug plans (Part-D) aren't all that great. I still have a lot to
figure out about Medicare. It's almost like it was designed by
politicians.

On Friday, April 2, 2021 at 11:53:47 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 22:45:43 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

wrote in message ...

On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 00:45:33 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:


Yes it is scary... being frugal and staying healthy so you don't outlive
your income is important and challenging. Let us hope we all succeed at
that...

OTOH, I don't expect to live forever. There is something to living
well. I think we'll be fine, in fact all things considered I figure
we'll have about a $5K lower income and that'll be all but made up by
the state tax reduction (elimination) on retirement income.

As long as inflation stays moderate we will probably be OK. With all the
deductions for insurance, savings, retirement plan, and commuting costs
going away I'm ahead for now. I'll have to reassess every year... I haven't
figured out how to predict the future so I cannot do it now!
Well, insurance is still there. That can be expensive. My drugs,
alone, are a fortune. List is around $1K/mo. They're relatively cheap
now because of rebate cards but that all goes away with Medicare. The
drug plans (Part-D) aren't all that great. I still have a lot to
figure out about Medicare. It's almost like it was designed by
politicians.

Ive been talking with 2 different Medicare €œbrokers€�. One is
an independent, the other works for my current insurer. Im
currently covered by SWMBOs plan with her employer. Its better
than my companys offering.

They have been very helpful in comparing her 2 adult coverage
plan vs. her dropping to single and me going full Medicare. It looks
like we could save around $2K in premiums if I sign up for Plan B.
Now its just a matter of figuring out how much the co-pays and
other items will eat into (or eat up) that savings under the various
Advantage plans, Part D, etc. An exact match of her coverage would
almost be a wash cost wise but we dont need everything that her
plan covers by default.

My shoulder surgery was just about free under SWMBOs plan and
Im pretty sure Ill need the other one done next year. We need to
decide on the best way to get that covered, her plan or Medicare.

On 4/2/2021 9:45 PM, John Grossbohlin wrote:
wrote in message ...

On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 00:45:33 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:


Yes it is scary... being frugal and staying healthy so you don't outlive
your income is important and challenging.Â* Let us hope we all succeed at
that...

OTOH, I don't expect to live forever.Â* There is something to living
well.Â* I think we'll be fine, in fact all things considered I figure
we'll have about a $5K lower income and that'll be all but made up by
the state tax reduction (elimination) on retirement income.

As long as inflation stays moderate we will probably be OK. With all the
deductions for insurance, savings, retirement plan, and commuting costs
going away I'm ahead for now. I'll have to reassess every year... I
haven't figured out how to predict the future so I cannot do it now!

Inflation staying moderate is not likely. With covid and the government
giving out money to everyone increased inflation is likely to follow.
Why the government is giving out money to every one I'll never know.

On 4/2/2021 10:53 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 22:45:43 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

wrote in message ...

On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 00:45:33 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:


Yes it is scary... being frugal and staying healthy so you don't outlive
your income is important and challenging. Let us hope we all succeed at
that...

OTOH, I don't expect to live forever. There is something to living
well. I think we'll be fine, in fact all things considered I figure
we'll have about a $5K lower income and that'll be all but made up by
the state tax reduction (elimination) on retirement income.

As long as inflation stays moderate we will probably be OK. With all the
deductions for insurance, savings, retirement plan, and commuting costs
going away I'm ahead for now. I'll have to reassess every year... I haven't
figured out how to predict the future so I cannot do it now!

Well, insurance is still there. That can be expensive. My drugs,
alone, are a fortune. List is around $1K/mo. They're relatively cheap
now because of rebate cards but that all goes away with Medicare. The
drug plans (Part-D) aren't all that great. I still have a lot to
figure out about Medicare. It's almost like it was designed by
politicians.


My wife's retirement insurance pays 100% for her, 50% for me. My cost
of insurance went down when I went onto Medicare, and of course that
almost made up the difference in the reduction. I'm about $1000 better
off per year.

On Saturday, April 3, 2021 at 12:26:03 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 4/2/2021 10:53 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 22:45:43 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

wrote in message ...

On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 00:45:33 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:


Yes it is scary... being frugal and staying healthy so you don't outlive
your income is important and challenging. Let us hope we all succeed at
that...

OTOH, I don't expect to live forever. There is something to living
well. I think we'll be fine, in fact all things considered I figure
we'll have about a $5K lower income and that'll be all but made up by
the state tax reduction (elimination) on retirement income.

As long as inflation stays moderate we will probably be OK. With all the
deductions for insurance, savings, retirement plan, and commuting costs
going away I'm ahead for now. I'll have to reassess every year... I haven't
figured out how to predict the future so I cannot do it now!

Well, insurance is still there. That can be expensive. My drugs,
alone, are a fortune. List is around $1K/mo. They're relatively cheap
now because of rebate cards but that all goes away with Medicare. The
drug plans (Part-D) aren't all that great. I still have a lot to
figure out about Medicare. It's almost like it was designed by
politicians.

My wife's retirement insurance pays 100% for her, 50% for me. My cost
of insurance went down when I went onto Medicare, and of course that
almost made up the difference in the reduction. I'm about $1000 better
off per year.

For comparable coverage, including expected co-pays, total maximum out-
of-pocket costs, in-network vs. out-of-network coverage, etc?

That's what we're working on now. e.g. we plan to travel more, increasing
the risk that I'll need medical care while away from home. We need to look
at which plans have decent out-of-network coverage so we don't get
hammered if I fall into the Grand Canyon or contract malaria in Africa.

With my luck, I'll get injured/sick just enough not to require hospitalization. ;-)

On the other hand, if I can avoid paying for substance abuse care and suicide
intervention, that would be nice.

On Sat, 3 Apr 2021 07:02:11 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Friday, April 2, 2021 at 11:53:47 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 22:45:43 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

wrote in message ...

On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 00:45:33 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:


Yes it is scary... being frugal and staying healthy so you don't outlive
your income is important and challenging. Let us hope we all succeed at
that...

OTOH, I don't expect to live forever. There is something to living
well. I think we'll be fine, in fact all things considered I figure
we'll have about a $5K lower income and that'll be all but made up by
the state tax reduction (elimination) on retirement income.

As long as inflation stays moderate we will probably be OK. With all the
deductions for insurance, savings, retirement plan, and commuting costs
going away I'm ahead for now. I'll have to reassess every year... I haven't
figured out how to predict the future so I cannot do it now!
Well, insurance is still there. That can be expensive. My drugs,
alone, are a fortune. List is around $1K/mo. They're relatively cheap
now because of rebate cards but that all goes away with Medicare. The
drug plans (Part-D) aren't all that great. I still have a lot to
figure out about Medicare. It's almost like it was designed by
politicians.

I’ve been talking with 2 different Medicare “brokers”. One is
an independent, the other works for my current insurer. I’m
currently covered by SWMBO’s plan with her employer. It’s better
than my company’s offering.

I'd certainly go for an independent broker. It's a very complicated
system and you could easily be led into a "non optimal" situation. The
differences are huge and do depend on where you live.

My former employer will kick in some ($3K per year, IIRC) towards MC
but I think I have to go trough their broker. I have to get that done
soon so that I can plan better.

They have been very helpful in comparing her 2 adult coverage
plan vs. her dropping to single and me going full Medicare. It looks
like we could save around $2K in premiums if I sign up for Plan B.
Now it’s just a matter of figuring out how much the co-pays and
other items will eat into (or eat up) that savings under the various
Advantage plans, Part D, etc. An exact match of her coverage would
almost be a wash cost wise but we don’t need everything that her
plan covers by default.

Medigap Plan-B isn't great at all (check out the differences for
yourself). There are a lot of situations that it doesn't cover.
Perhaps not all are important but some are. Plan-G is a much better
plan and can even be cheaper for me (al this stuff is zip-code
dependent). Medicare-D really sucks. That donut-hole is big enough
to drive a Suez killer through.


My shoulder surgery was just about free under SWMBO’s plan and
I’m pretty sure I’ll need the other one done next year. We need to
decide on the best way to get that covered, her plan or Medicare.

My GABG cost me less than $1000 (of $250K), and that was only because
I had two trips to the ER ($250 each). My pacemaker cost me nothing
out of pocket. I pay about $2K a year for coverage for the two of us.
My employer's benefits are fantastic. It's a (very well known)
Japanese mega-company, so tend to take care of employees.

On Sat, 3 Apr 2021 11:23:31 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:

On 4/2/2021 9:45 PM, John Grossbohlin wrote:
wrote in message ...

On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 00:45:33 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:


Yes it is scary... being frugal and staying healthy so you don't outlive
your income is important and challenging.* Let us hope we all succeed at
that...

OTOH, I don't expect to live forever.* There is something to living
well.* I think we'll be fine, in fact all things considered I figure
we'll have about a $5K lower income and that'll be all but made up by
the state tax reduction (elimination) on retirement income.

As long as inflation stays moderate we will probably be OK. With all the
deductions for insurance, savings, retirement plan, and commuting costs
going away I'm ahead for now. I'll have to reassess every year... I
haven't figured out how to predict the future so I cannot do it now!

Inflation staying moderate is not likely. With covid and the government
giving out money to everyone increased inflation is likely to follow.
Why the government is giving out money to every one I'll never know.

Oh, that's easy. To buy votes. As soon as people figure out that
they can give themselves money out of the treasury, the country dies.
We're well into that. A cross between China and Venezuela is what
they want us to be.

wrote in message ...

On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 22:45:43 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

As long as inflation stays moderate we will probably be OK. With all the
deductions for insurance, savings, retirement plan, and commuting costs
going away I'm ahead for now. I'll have to reassess every year... I
haven't
figured out how to predict the future so I cannot do it now!

Well, insurance is still there. That can be expensive. My drugs,
alone, are a fortune. List is around $1K/mo. They're relatively cheap
now because of rebate cards but that all goes away with Medicare. The
drug plans (Part-D) aren't all that great. I still have a lot to
figure out about Medicare. It's almost like it was designed by
politicians.

The insurance situation certainly varies across people. For someone who is
healthy and doesn't take maintenance meds a free basic Managed Medicare plan
that includes pharmacy can suffice for a long time. Later on if the health
situation changes the plan can be changed during open enrollment. For
someone with chronic health problems who takes multiple maintenance drugs it
can get real expensive for sure.

Have you looked into the Managed Medicare plans? Some give you the
opportunity to have premiums rebated through various programs.

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
...

For comparable coverage, including expected co-pays, total maximum out-
of-pocket costs, in-network vs. out-of-network coverage, etc?

That's what we're working on now. e.g. we plan to travel more, increasing
the risk that I'll need medical care while away from home. We need to look
at which plans have decent out-of-network coverage so we don't get
hammered if I fall into the Grand Canyon or contract malaria in Africa.

With my luck, I'll get injured/sick just enough not to require
hospitalization. ;-)

On the other hand, if I can avoid paying for substance abuse care and
suicide
intervention, that would be nice.

A plan with a national network is handy if you do a lot of domestic travel.
That doesn't mean you have to go with someone like United Health Care as
some regional plans have national network options (they have contracts with
big players) and some actually have direct contracted providers in other
states. For example, a NYC regional plan had a sizable network in FL as they
had a lot of snow birds as members.

If you're going to Africa buying a plan through Global Rescue might make
sense. ;~)

On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 22:33:48 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

wrote in message ...

On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 22:45:43 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

As long as inflation stays moderate we will probably be OK. With all the
deductions for insurance, savings, retirement plan, and commuting costs
going away I'm ahead for now. I'll have to reassess every year... I
haven't
figured out how to predict the future so I cannot do it now!

Well, insurance is still there. That can be expensive. My drugs,
alone, are a fortune. List is around $1K/mo. They're relatively cheap
now because of rebate cards but that all goes away with Medicare. The
drug plans (Part-D) aren't all that great. I still have a lot to
figure out about Medicare. It's almost like it was designed by
politicians.

The insurance situation certainly varies across people. For someone who is
healthy and doesn't take maintenance meds a free basic Managed Medicare plan
that includes pharmacy can suffice for a long time. Later on if the health
situation changes the plan can be changed during open enrollment. For
someone with chronic health problems who takes multiple maintenance drugs it
can get real expensive for sure.

I have a couple (three?) of drugs that are $1000 to $1500 for 90days.
Now, I have discount cards that pay much of the cost that my insurance
doesn't cover. For one, the cost is $1500/90 days, my co-pay is $120,
and it costs me $30 out of pocket. With Medicare all of that goes
away. Medicare Part-D helps until the donut-hole, which for me is
about March. Then it's going to cost about $5K for the next quarter.
My choices get real, fast.

Have you looked into the Managed Medicare plans? Some give you the
opportunity to have premiums rebated through various programs.

I'm certainly not interested in an HMO. Not a chance. I am
considering a PPO Advantage plan but, again, that only works if I
never plan on moving. I'm in my employer's PPO now but while I'm
working I would take that wherever they would move me.

The problem with Medicare is that the decision is pretty much a one
time thing. Sure you "can change at any time" but the fine print says
"underwriting may be necessary". IOW, forget it.

On Monday, April 5, 2021 at 11:45:21 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 22:33:48 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

wrote in message ...

On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 22:45:43 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

As long as inflation stays moderate we will probably be OK. With all the
deductions for insurance, savings, retirement plan, and commuting costs
going away I'm ahead for now. I'll have to reassess every year... I
haven't
figured out how to predict the future so I cannot do it now!

Well, insurance is still there. That can be expensive. My drugs,
alone, are a fortune. List is around $1K/mo. They're relatively cheap
now because of rebate cards but that all goes away with Medicare. The
drug plans (Part-D) aren't all that great. I still have a lot to
figure out about Medicare. It's almost like it was designed by
politicians.

The insurance situation certainly varies across people. For someone who is
healthy and doesn't take maintenance meds a free basic Managed Medicare plan
that includes pharmacy can suffice for a long time. Later on if the health
situation changes the plan can be changed during open enrollment. For
someone with chronic health problems who takes multiple maintenance drugs it
can get real expensive for sure.
I have a couple (three?) of drugs that are $1000 to $1500 for 90days.
Now, I have discount cards that pay much of the cost that my insurance
doesn't cover. For one, the cost is $1500/90 days, my co-pay is $120,
and it costs me $30 out of pocket. With Medicare all of that goes
away. Medicare Part-D helps until the donut-hole, which for me is
about March. Then it's going to cost about $5K for the next quarter.
My choices get real, fast.

Have you looked into the Managed Medicare plans? Some give you the
opportunity to have premiums rebated through various programs.

I'm certainly not interested in an HMO. Not a chance. I am
considering a PPO Advantage plan but, again, that only works if I
never plan on moving. I'm in my employer's PPO now but while I'm
working I would take that wherever they would move me.

The problem with Medicare is that the decision is pretty much a one
time thing. Sure you "can change at any time" but the fine print says
"underwriting may be necessary". IOW, forget it.

Why do you feel that a blanket CYA statement that uses the word "may"
is actually a "forget it" clause?

Lots of contracts have verbiage that protects one party or the other against
that one-off case that just doesn't fit the norm. All it does is give them an out
under certain, usually limited, circumstances.

Have you actually been told - by someone official - that you can't make changes
over the years? Any stats as to what percentage of change requests end up being
denied by an underwriter?

I know people that use Medicare plan brokers who hold seminars before every
open enrollment period - for their existing clients - presenting the options available
for the upcoming year. Why would they do that if everyone is simply going to be
told "forget it"?

On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 23:26:16 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Monday, April 5, 2021 at 11:45:21 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 22:33:48 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

wrote in message ...

On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 22:45:43 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

As long as inflation stays moderate we will probably be OK. With all the
deductions for insurance, savings, retirement plan, and commuting costs
going away I'm ahead for now. I'll have to reassess every year... I
haven't
figured out how to predict the future so I cannot do it now!

Well, insurance is still there. That can be expensive. My drugs,
alone, are a fortune. List is around $1K/mo. They're relatively cheap
now because of rebate cards but that all goes away with Medicare. The
drug plans (Part-D) aren't all that great. I still have a lot to
figure out about Medicare. It's almost like it was designed by
politicians.

The insurance situation certainly varies across people. For someone who is
healthy and doesn't take maintenance meds a free basic Managed Medicare plan
that includes pharmacy can suffice for a long time. Later on if the health
situation changes the plan can be changed during open enrollment. For
someone with chronic health problems who takes multiple maintenance drugs it
can get real expensive for sure.
I have a couple (three?) of drugs that are $1000 to $1500 for 90days.
Now, I have discount cards that pay much of the cost that my insurance
doesn't cover. For one, the cost is $1500/90 days, my co-pay is $120,
and it costs me $30 out of pocket. With Medicare all of that goes
away. Medicare Part-D helps until the donut-hole, which for me is
about March. Then it's going to cost about $5K for the next quarter.
My choices get real, fast.

Have you looked into the Managed Medicare plans? Some give you the
opportunity to have premiums rebated through various programs.

I'm certainly not interested in an HMO. Not a chance. I am
considering a PPO Advantage plan but, again, that only works if I
never plan on moving. I'm in my employer's PPO now but while I'm
working I would take that wherever they would move me.

The problem with Medicare is that the decision is pretty much a one
time thing. Sure you "can change at any time" but the fine print says
"underwriting may be necessary". IOW, forget it.

Why do you feel that a blanket CYA statement that uses the word "may"
is actually a "forget it" clause?

It may (or not) require underwriting. "Forget it" means that there is
no way to get underwritten if you have any health issues. Insurance
companies aren't in the business to lose money.

Lots of contracts have verbiage that protects one party or the other against
that one-off case that just doesn't fit the norm. All it does is give them an out
under certain, usually limited, circumstances.

No, it gives them a choice of writing a policy, or not. Their choice.

Have you actually been told - by someone official - that you can't make changes
over the years? Any stats as to what percentage of change requests end up being
denied by an underwriter?

I know others in similar circumstances. I know the payouts that my
current insurance has made. The other insurance companies know it
too.

I know people that use Medicare plan brokers who hold seminars before every
open enrollment period - for their existing clients - presenting the options available
for the upcoming year. Why would they do that if everyone is simply going to be
told "forget it"?

Advantage and Medigap are very different. Advantage plans are "managed
healthcare" options with features and costs pretty much decided by the
insurance companies. The insurance company gets a chunk of money from
the Feds and manages your healthcare with that money. You may pay
additional, or not. That's primarily what the brokers sift through.
Which of the _many_ plans is best for you. You are limited to doctors
and facilities and med costs vary. The brokers go through your list
of doctors, meds, and excess costs and figure out which is best for
you.

Medigap is a whole different kettle. There are only a dozen Medigap
plans (labeled A through N with some holes and options). All plans
(pools, really) with the same letter are exactly the same. The only
difference between insurers is the price. One price for everyone in
the plan/pool. Once in the pool, you can't be denied coverage IN THAT
pool and everyone pays the same price. In theory, you can change
plans during the enrolment period but it is subject to underwriting.
You're entering a new pool of insured so if your history is worse than
that of the rest of the pool, you aren't getting in. The better
plans, of course, have the least risk so are more choosy. Going to a
lesser plan probably isn't an issue but a better one is more difficult
because those wanting to upgrade tend to be those needing better
coverage. The better plans cover everything, for any doctor/hospital
that takes any Medicare patients. I know several people who travel to
the best specialists in the country for surgery, for instance. They
can't be denied coverage.

Drugs aren't covered under Medigap so a Medicare Part-D policy is
needed. This is where the "donut hole" comes in. Part-D only pays up
to a cap, then you're on your own until you've paid your annual
maximum for healthcare for the year. In the meantime, you're on your
own, paying out of pocket for everything. Manufacturer's discount
cards aren't allowed so for that one drug, I'd be out that $500/mo.
I'm on three with similar costs. These aren't exotic drugs, either.
Many are in this situation.

This is only the basics. The minutiae is far more complicated. It's
almost like the US government put it all together. THAT'S why plan
brokers are needed. ...just as enrolled agents, accountants, and tax
lawyers are needed.

On Tue, 06 Apr 2021 15:11:27 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 23:26:16 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Monday, April 5, 2021 at 11:45:21 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 22:33:48 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

wrote in message ...

On Fri, 2 Apr 2021 22:45:43 -0400, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

As long as inflation stays moderate we will probably be OK. With all the
deductions for insurance, savings, retirement plan, and commuting costs
going away I'm ahead for now. I'll have to reassess every year... I
haven't
figured out how to predict the future so I cannot do it now!

Well, insurance is still there. That can be expensive. My drugs,
alone, are a fortune. List is around $1K/mo. They're relatively cheap
now because of rebate cards but that all goes away with Medicare. The
drug plans (Part-D) aren't all that great. I still have a lot to
figure out about Medicare. It's almost like it was designed by
politicians.

The insurance situation certainly varies across people. For someone who is
healthy and doesn't take maintenance meds a free basic Managed Medicare plan
that includes pharmacy can suffice for a long time. Later on if the health
situation changes the plan can be changed during open enrollment. For
someone with chronic health problems who takes multiple maintenance drugs it
can get real expensive for sure.
I have a couple (three?) of drugs that are $1000 to $1500 for 90days.
Now, I have discount cards that pay much of the cost that my insurance
doesn't cover. For one, the cost is $1500/90 days, my co-pay is $120,
and it costs me $30 out of pocket. With Medicare all of that goes
away. Medicare Part-D helps until the donut-hole, which for me is
about March. Then it's going to cost about $5K for the next quarter.
My choices get real, fast.

Have you looked into the Managed Medicare plans? Some give you the
opportunity to have premiums rebated through various programs.

I'm certainly not interested in an HMO. Not a chance. I am
considering a PPO Advantage plan but, again, that only works if I
never plan on moving. I'm in my employer's PPO now but while I'm
working I would take that wherever they would move me.

The problem with Medicare is that the decision is pretty much a one
time thing. Sure you "can change at any time" but the fine print says
"underwriting may be necessary". IOW, forget it.

Why do you feel that a blanket CYA statement that uses the word "may"
is actually a "forget it" clause?

It may (or not) require underwriting. "Forget it" means that there is
no way to get underwritten if you have any health issues. Insurance
companies aren't in the business to lose money.

Lots of contracts have verbiage that protects one party or the other against
that one-off case that just doesn't fit the norm. All it does is give them an out
under certain, usually limited, circumstances.

No, it gives them a choice of writing a policy, or not. Their choice.

Have you actually been told - by someone official - that you can't make changes
over the years? Any stats as to what percentage of change requests end up being
denied by an underwriter?

I know others in similar circumstances. I know the payouts that my
current insurance has made. The other insurance companies know it
too.

I know people that use Medicare plan brokers who hold seminars before every
open enrollment period - for their existing clients - presenting the options available
for the upcoming year. Why would they do that if everyone is simply going to be
told "forget it"?

Advantage and Medigap are very different. Advantage plans are "managed
healthcare" options with features and costs pretty much decided by the
insurance companies. The insurance company gets a chunk of money from
the Feds and manages your healthcare with that money. You may pay
additional, or not. That's primarily what the brokers sift through.
Which of the _many_ plans is best for you. You are limited to doctors
and facilities and med costs vary. The brokers go through your list
of doctors, meds, and excess costs and figure out which is best for
you.

Medigap is a whole different kettle. There are only a dozen Medigap
plans (labeled A through N with some holes and options). All plans
(pools, really) with the same letter are exactly the same. The only
difference between insurers is the price. One price for everyone in
the plan/pool. Once in the pool, you can't be denied coverage IN THAT
pool and everyone pays the same price. In theory, you can change
plans during the enrolment period but it is subject to underwriting.
You're entering a new pool of insured so if your history is worse than
that of the rest of the pool, you aren't getting in. The better
plans, of course, have the least risk so are more choosy. Going to a
lesser plan probably isn't an issue but a better one is more difficult
because those wanting to upgrade tend to be those needing better
coverage. The better plans cover everything, for any doctor/hospital
that takes any Medicare patients. I know several people who travel to
the best specialists in the country for surgery, for instance. They
can't be denied coverage.

Drugs aren't covered under Medigap so a Medicare Part-D policy is
needed. This is where the "donut hole" comes in. Part-D only pays up
to a cap, then you're on your own until you've paid your annual
maximum for healthcare for the year. In the meantime, you're on your
own, paying out of pocket for everything. Manufacturer's discount
cards aren't allowed so for that one drug, I'd be out that $500/mo.
I'm on three with similar costs. These aren't exotic drugs, either.
Many are in this situation.

This is only the basics. The minutiae is far more complicated. It's
almost like the US government put it all together. THAT'S why plan
brokers are needed. ...just as enrolled agents, accountants, and tax
lawyers are needed.

I forgot to add, that all of this (plan availability, cost, insurance
company, and coverage) varies by zip code. It really is a huge mess.

writes:
On Tue, 06 Apr 2021 15:11:27 -0400, wrote:


I forgot to add, that all of this (plan availability, cost, insurance
company, and coverage) varies by zip code. It really is a huge mess.

Indeed. A single pool, single payer system with mandatory enrollment
for all seems far easier to manage, far better outcomes and better
for the mental and physical health of retirees. No holes, there aren't 51 million
different plans, no hidden bills and universal coverage within the
entire country.

On Tue, 06 Apr 2021 19:26:22 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

writes:
On Tue, 06 Apr 2021 15:11:27 -0400, wrote:


I forgot to add, that all of this (plan availability, cost, insurance
company, and coverage) varies by zip code. It really is a huge mess.

Indeed. A single pool, single payer system with mandatory enrollment
for all seems far easier to manage, far better outcomes and better
for the mental and physical health of retirees. No holes, there aren't 51 million
different plans, no hidden bills and universal coverage within the
entire country.

Not buying it. Our government would screw up a wet dream. NO chance
I want a takeover of healthcare or even insurance. They gave us
Medicare. What makes you think they'll do any better with a plan for
"everyone" (except them). Look at the VA, a few years back. No
thanks! It's bad enough now.

Pessimist: "Well, it can't get any worse."
Optimist: "Oh, yes it can!"
- Madeleine Urban

writes:
On Tue, 06 Apr 2021 19:26:22 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

writes:
On Tue, 06 Apr 2021 15:11:27 -0400, wrote:


I forgot to add, that all of this (plan availability, cost, insurance
company, and coverage) varies by zip code. It really is a huge mess.

Indeed. A single pool, single payer system with mandatory enrollment
for all seems far easier to manage, far better outcomes and better
for the mental and physical health of retirees. No holes, there aren't 51 million
different plans, no hidden bills and universal coverage within the
entire country.

Not buying it. Our government would screw up a wet dream. NO chance
I want a takeover of healthcare or even insurance. They gave us
Medicare.

Medicare was just fine until the Republicans started dismantling
it a couple decades ago. Leading to the current mess.

Universal health care works quite well in Canada, the UK,
Down Under, and in many other countries; I don't see why
it can't work here as well. Can't be worse than the current
system.

On Wed, 07 Apr 2021 14:01:48 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

writes:
On Tue, 06 Apr 2021 19:26:22 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

writes:
On Tue, 06 Apr 2021 15:11:27 -0400, wrote:


I forgot to add, that all of this (plan availability, cost, insurance
company, and coverage) varies by zip code. It really is a huge mess.

Indeed. A single pool, single payer system with mandatory enrollment
for all seems far easier to manage, far better outcomes and better
for the mental and physical health of retirees. No holes, there aren't 51 million
different plans, no hidden bills and universal coverage within the
entire country.

Not buying it. Our government would screw up a wet dream. NO chance
I want a takeover of healthcare or even insurance. They gave us
Medicare.

Medicare was just fine until the Republicans started dismantling
it a couple decades ago. Leading to the current mess.

Oh, horse****. It was a mess from day one. It's not Medicare that's
the problem, idiot. It's government and everyone of you socialists
who think it's the answer to all that ales us. It's *not*.

Universal health care works quite well in Canada, the UK,
Down Under, and in many other countries; I don't see why
it can't work here as well. Can't be worse than the current
system.

They don't have the corruption to the level of the US congress, which
just got massively worse, BTW.

Now stuff it, lefty.

writes:
On Wed, 07 Apr 2021 14:01:48 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

writes:
On Tue, 06 Apr 2021 19:26:22 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

writes:
On Tue, 06 Apr 2021 15:11:27 -0400, wrote:


I forgot to add, that all of this (plan availability, cost, insurance
company, and coverage) varies by zip code. It really is a huge mess.

Indeed. A single pool, single payer system with mandatory enrollment
for all seems far easier to manage, far better outcomes and better
for the mental and physical health of retirees. No holes, there aren't 51 million
different plans, no hidden bills and universal coverage within the
entire country.

Not buying it. Our government would screw up a wet dream. NO chance
I want a takeover of healthcare or even insurance. They gave us
Medicare.

Medicare was just fine until the Republicans started dismantling
it a couple decades ago. Leading to the current mess.

Oh, horse****. It was a mess from day one. It's not Medicare that's
the problem, idiot. It's government and everyone of you socialists
who think it's the answer to all that ales us. It's *not*.

Universal health care works quite well in Canada, the UK,
Down Under, and in many other countries; I don't see why
it can't work here as well. Can't be worse than the current
system.

They don't have the corruption to the level of the US congress, which
just got massively worse, BTW.

You have a pretty active imagination.

And you clearly don't understand the meaning of the term 'socialist'
which has zero to do with a single-payer insurance pool.

But that's par for the course, it seems, for trump supporters.

wrote:

On Wed, 07 Apr 2021 14:01:48 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

Medicare was just fine until the Republicans started dismantling
it a couple decades ago. Leading to the current mess.

Oh, horse****. It was a mess from day one. It's not Medicare that's
the problem, idiot. It's government and everyone of you socialists
who think it's the answer to all that ales us. It's *not*.

+10²

"Fascism in its purest form cannot be implemented without universal healthcare." -Hitler

https://video.twimg.com/ext_tw_video...oqOYmSVxTn.mp4

LOL

On 4/7/2021 1:38 PM, Spalted Walt wrote:
wrote:

On Wed, 07 Apr 2021 14:01:48 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

Medicare was just fine until the Republicans started dismantling
it a couple decades ago. Leading to the current mess.

Oh, horse****. It was a mess from day one. It's not Medicare that's
the problem, idiot. It's government and everyone of you socialists
who think it's the answer to all that ales us. It's *not*.

+10²

"Fascism in its purest form cannot be implemented without universal healthcare." -Hitler

https://video.twimg.com/ext_tw_video...oqOYmSVxTn.mp4

LOL



Have you noticed that the Democratic leaders always go with to as I say,
not as I do? They live under different rules. And they know what is
best for you. They don't want you to worry about a thing including a
safe and sound voting system. The more ignorant the voter the more
likely he or she will follow the shepherds lead. The Democratic voters
mostly remind me of cattle in the field waiting on some one to feed them
and lead them to the slaughter house.

On Wed, 07 Apr 2021 17:55:36 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

writes:
On Wed, 07 Apr 2021 14:01:48 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

writes:
On Tue, 06 Apr 2021 19:26:22 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

writes:
On Tue, 06 Apr 2021 15:11:27 -0400, wrote:


I forgot to add, that all of this (plan availability, cost, insurance
company, and coverage) varies by zip code. It really is a huge mess.

Indeed. A single pool, single payer system with mandatory enrollment
for all seems far easier to manage, far better outcomes and better
for the mental and physical health of retirees. No holes, there aren't 51 million
different plans, no hidden bills and universal coverage within the
entire country.

Not buying it. Our government would screw up a wet dream. NO chance
I want a takeover of healthcare or even insurance. They gave us
Medicare.

Medicare was just fine until the Republicans started dismantling
it a couple decades ago. Leading to the current mess.

Oh, horse****. It was a mess from day one. It's not Medicare that's
the problem, idiot. It's government and everyone of you socialists
who think it's the answer to all that ales us. It's *not*.

Universal health care works quite well in Canada, the UK,
Down Under, and in many other countries; I don't see why
it can't work here as well. Can't be worse than the current
system.

They don't have the corruption to the level of the US congress, which
just got massively worse, BTW.

You have a pretty active imagination.

And you clearly don't understand the meaning of the term 'socialist'
which has zero to do with a single-payer insurance pool.

But that's par for the course, it seems, for trump supporters.

Like all lefties, you're simply a liar. Nothing new here.

On Wednesday, April 7, 2021 at 9:22:43 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Wed, 07 Apr 2021 17:55:36 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

writes:
On Wed, 07 Apr 2021 14:01:48 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

writes:
On Tue, 06 Apr 2021 19:26:22 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

writes:
On Tue, 06 Apr 2021 15:11:27 -0400, wrote:


I forgot to add, that all of this (plan availability, cost, insurance
company, and coverage) varies by zip code. It really is a huge mess..

Indeed. A single pool, single payer system with mandatory enrollment
for all seems far easier to manage, far better outcomes and better
for the mental and physical health of retirees. No holes, there aren't 51 million
different plans, no hidden bills and universal coverage within the
entire country.

Not buying it. Our government would screw up a wet dream. NO chance
I want a takeover of healthcare or even insurance. They gave us
Medicare.

Medicare was just fine until the Republicans started dismantling
it a couple decades ago. Leading to the current mess.

Oh, horse****. It was a mess from day one. It's not Medicare that's
the problem, idiot. It's government and everyone of you socialists
who think it's the answer to all that ales us. It's *not*.

Universal health care works quite well in Canada, the UK,
Down Under, and in many other countries; I don't see why
it can't work here as well. Can't be worse than the current
system.

They don't have the corruption to the level of the US congress, which
just got massively worse, BTW.

You have a pretty active imagination.

And you clearly don't understand the meaning of the term 'socialist'
which has zero to do with a single-payer insurance pool.

But that's par for the course, it seems, for trump supporters.
Like all lefties, you're simply a liar. Nothing new here.

This is really weird.

My newsreader says Im reading rec.woodworking but it seems
like Im reading alt.home.repair. Strange. Must be a bug.

On 4/7/2021 9:01 AM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
Snip



Medicare was just fine until the Republicans started dismantling
it a couple decades ago. Leading to the current mess.

Universal health care works quite well in Canada, the UK,
Down Under, and in many other countries; I don't see why
it can't work here as well. Can't be worse than the current
system.





According to an update posted to the CDC'S travel notices page on April
2, the agency has listed Canada as a Level 4 health risk due to the
infection high rate of more than 100 new cases per 100,000 people over
the past 28 days. The advisory warns: "Because of the current situation
in Canada, even fully vaccinated travelers may be at risk for getting
and spreading COVID-19 variants and should avoid all travel to Canada."

I'm not sure if this would be an endorsement for health care in Canada.

Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet writes:
On 4/7/2021 9:01 AM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
Snip



Medicare was just fine until the Republicans started dismantling
it a couple decades ago. Leading to the current mess.

Universal health care works quite well in Canada, the UK,
Down Under, and in many other countries; I don't see why
it can't work here as well. Can't be worse than the current
system.





According to an update posted to the CDC'S travel notices page on April
2, the agency has listed Canada as a Level 4 health risk due to the
infection high rate of more than 100 new cases per 100,000 people over
the past 28 days. The advisory warns: "Because of the current situation
in Canada, even fully vaccinated travelers may be at risk for getting
and spreading COVID-19 variants and should avoid all travel to Canada."

I'm not sure if this would be an endorsement for health care in Canada.

I don't see anything there related to health care in Canada. They
have ignorant rednecks that won't mask just like we do.

On 4/8/2021 11:40 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Wednesday, April 7, 2021 at 9:22:43 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Wed, 07 Apr 2021 17:55:36 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

writes:
On Wed, 07 Apr 2021 14:01:48 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:



[SNIP]

You have a pretty active imagination.

And you clearly don't understand the meaning of the term 'socialist'
which has zero to do with a single-payer insurance pool.

But that's par for the course, it seems, for trump supporters.
Like all lefties, you're simply a liar. Nothing new here.

This is really weird.

My newsreader says Im reading rec.woodworking but it seems
like Im reading alt.home.repair. Strange. Must be a bug.


No problem, DerbyDad. Just wait un til the Demorats get around to their
Medicare single-payer system. You'll likely wait 8 to 10 months to read
about all this stuff but it will be mixed in articles on gardening and
fairy tales. LOL!

On 4/8/2021 3:07 PM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet writes:
On 4/7/2021 9:01 AM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
Snip



Medicare was just fine until the Republicans started dismantling
it a couple decades ago. Leading to the current mess.

Universal health care works quite well in Canada, the UK,
Down Under, and in many other countries; I don't see why
it can't work here as well. Can't be worse than the current
system.





According to an update posted to the CDC'S travel notices page on April
2, the agency has listed Canada as a Level 4 health risk due to the
infection high rate of more than 100 new cases per 100,000 people over
the past 28 days. The advisory warns: "Because of the current situation
in Canada, even fully vaccinated travelers may be at risk for getting
and spreading COVID-19 variants and should avoid all travel to Canada."

I'm not sure if this would be an endorsement for health care in Canada.

I don't see anything there related to health care in Canada. They
have ignorant rednecks that won't mask just like we do.



Every country has theirs. :~)

But I would think a better health system would have a better inoculation
ratio, easier to get inoculated, therefore fewer infections.

BUT! being inoculated does not prevent you from contaminating some one
else. It just means you personally will probably not get sick when you
are exposed again.

On 4/8/2021 5:13 PM, Leon wrote:
On 4/8/2021 3:07 PM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet writes:
On 4/7/2021 9:01 AM, Scott Lurndal wrote:

[SNIP]


I don't see anything there related to health care in Canada.Â* They
have ignorant rednecks that won't mask just like we do.



Every country has theirs.Â* :~)

But I would think a better health system would have a better inoculation
ratio, easier to get inoculated, therefore fewer infections.

BUT! being inoculated does not prevent you from contaminating some one
else.Â* It just means you personally will probably not get sick when you
are exposed again.

Actually, Leon, there was a study just report over the weekend or early
this week claiming that if you're fully inoculated with the Covid-19
vaccine you are highly unlikely to be a carrier of the virus.
Personally, I'm following the masking and washing guidelines until a lot
more time has passed. Take it all with a grain of salt.

If Universal Health care is so great in Canada, why do our neighbors to
the north continue to come to the States for treatment. Might the
average (most recent I found) 20.9 weeks between the time their Canadian
GP refers them to a specialist and when the specialist sees them have
something to do with it? The last two occasions where I was referred to
a specialist it was 3 weeks and 1 day respectively.

On Thu, 8 Apr 2021 09:40:29 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Wednesday, April 7, 2021 at 9:22:43 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Wed, 07 Apr 2021 17:55:36 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

writes:
On Wed, 07 Apr 2021 14:01:48 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

writes:
On Tue, 06 Apr 2021 19:26:22 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

writes:
On Tue, 06 Apr 2021 15:11:27 -0400, wrote:


I forgot to add, that all of this (plan availability, cost, insurance
company, and coverage) varies by zip code. It really is a huge mess.

Indeed. A single pool, single payer system with mandatory enrollment
for all seems far easier to manage, far better outcomes and better
for the mental and physical health of retirees. No holes, there aren't 51 million
different plans, no hidden bills and universal coverage within the
entire country.

Not buying it. Our government would screw up a wet dream. NO chance
I want a takeover of healthcare or even insurance. They gave us
Medicare.

Medicare was just fine until the Republicans started dismantling
it a couple decades ago. Leading to the current mess.

Oh, horse****. It was a mess from day one. It's not Medicare that's
the problem, idiot. It's government and everyone of you socialists
who think it's the answer to all that ales us. It's *not*.

Universal health care works quite well in Canada, the UK,
Down Under, and in many other countries; I don't see why
it can't work here as well. Can't be worse than the current
system.

They don't have the corruption to the level of the US congress, which
just got massively worse, BTW.

You have a pretty active imagination.

And you clearly don't understand the meaning of the term 'socialist'
which has zero to do with a single-payer insurance pool.

But that's par for the course, it seems, for trump supporters.
Like all lefties, you're simply a liar. Nothing new here.

This is really weird.

My newsreader says I’m reading rec.woodworking but it seems
like I’m reading alt.home.repair. Strange. Must be a bug.

Termites

hOn Thu, 8 Apr 2021 17:28:02 -0500, Unquestionably Confused
wrote:

On 4/8/2021 5:13 PM, Leon wrote:
On 4/8/2021 3:07 PM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet writes:
On 4/7/2021 9:01 AM, Scott Lurndal wrote:

[SNIP]


I don't see anything there related to health care in Canada.* They
have ignorant rednecks that won't mask just like we do.



Every country has theirs.* :~)

But I would think a better health system would have a better inoculation
ratio, easier to get inoculated, therefore fewer infections.

BUT! being inoculated does not prevent you from contaminating some one
else.* It just means you personally will probably not get sick when you
are exposed again.

Actually, Leon, there was a study just report over the weekend or early
this week claiming that if you're fully inoculated with the Covid-19
vaccine you are highly unlikely to be a carrier of the virus.
Personally, I'm following the masking and washing guidelines until a lot
more time has passed. Take it all with a grain of salt.

I never did. Pretty much Everything opened up here last June/July.
Before that we used curbside service at restaurants and inside dining
since. I would never have worn a mask if businesses didn't require
it. ...and I see fools driving down the road, alone, wearing masks.
It's really too funny.

If Universal Health care is so great in Canada, why do our neighbors to
the north continue to come to the States for treatment. Might the
average (most recent I found) 20.9 weeks between the time their Canadian
GP refers them to a specialist and when the specialist sees them have
something to do with it? The last two occasions where I was referred to
a specialist it was 3 weeks and 1 day respectively.

Having healthcare insurance is not the same has having health care.