Larry Jaques wrote in
:

Win or lose, it -will- raise the price of tools from Ryobi in the
future. The judge and jury on that one ought to be horsewhipped.
If anything, the contractor and Osorio were equally to blame, not the
sawmaker. I hope the appeal reverses it completely.
****ES ME OFF, IT DOES!

I tried to find out the state of any appeal from the appeals court verdict,
but only found that some law firm is seeking additional plaintiffs
http://www.schmidtlaw.com/table-saw-...awsuit-osorio/

--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid

Well said!

-------
"Swingman" wrote in message
...

As an employer, I'd take your $72k for 8 incidents any day over a jury
award of $1.5 million for each incident ... $12,000,000, or over 1300
times the price.

Don't forget to count the heart attack your wife has, after, and the gas and
time off work your family will spend visiting the old fool. What does your
hospital charge to park for 1/2 hour? $10, $15 each visit?

People always use the "mind your won business" excuse but it becomes many
people's business when this **** happens.

------------
"Dave" wrote in message ...
Ultimately, there's those injuries that can't be surgically repaired
which means permanent disfigurement and injury which may cause
permanent loss of or change of employment.

Then, there's the cost of the lawsuits and likelihood of large cash
pay outs.

Finally, there's all the pain and anguish such an injury will cause.
Ultimately, there really isn't any set amount of money you can apply
to that.

Your 'cheap at 50 times the price' is just a pittance of the real
total cost.

Perfect!!!!

-----------
"Larry Blanchard" wrote in message ...
I take *your* point :-).

--------------
On Tue, 24 Jan 2012 10:56:15 -0500, Jack wrote:

Nobody said anything about ALL caps. Mike told YOU there was no reason
for *you* to use caps to make _your_ point. I say caps are a fine way
to emphasize text to make /your/ point, just as -you- did in [your]
message.

Jack wrote:


How about THIS Mike. Someone *kills* you for using too many capital
letters. Your wife sells your Tsaw to some clown on Craigslist. He
chops off his arm because your saw is not "UL" compliant and has no
guard, no riving knife, no SS tech.

Of course he sues your widowed wife for $12000000000000 dollars
because of her negligence to have readily available safety crap
installed before selling you the damned beast!!!!!!! He claims he is
having trouble whacking off with one hand, big a dick as he is. Your
widow refuses to give him a hand, ergo the large $suit.

He wins, hand down...


No case Jack. She is not required to sell him a UL approved saw, or even
one with all of the equipment or parts.

--

-Mike-

Drew Lawson wrote:


What if flying unicorns poop rainbows? Then what?


Then, the skys are going to look an awful lot like they did in the 60's...

--

-Mike-

On 1/24/2012 5:10 PM, Dave wrote:
On Tue, 24 Jan 2012 10:39:17 -0500, wrote:
As an individual user with 50 years of no incidents under my belt, I'll
take 3 new pickup trucks over $72,000 wasted in false trips.

Just one question Jack. How will you show your face here if you chop
one of your fingers off?

I'd feel about the same as you would feel if you get in a car wreck and
are not wearing a NASCAR approved crash helmet, and kill the few
existing brain cells in your noggin that you could have [saved] with a
very, very small investment.

How will you ever live down the shame?

No shame. I run my shaper, router table and table saw w/o a power feeder
and I'm well over the maximum safe age to be doing that stuff with all
these dangerous machines. It would be something like a rock climber
falling off his roof cleaning the leaves out of the gutter after he is
too old to climb rocks. I'm still climbing, and consider it a
challenge. I quit riding murder cycles when I thought the risk
surpassed the fun. I haven't got there yet with my wood working
pleasure, and while it may not be the safest hobby on earth, it works
for me, and almost NO woodworkers die from saw accidents, while a
zillion or more folks kill themselves on murder cycles.

Sorry, that's two questions. Feel free to answer one or both.

I felt free to ignore you completely, but for some dumb reason chose to
waste some time on you.

On 1/24/2012 5:55 PM, Leon wrote:
On 1/24/2012 4:24 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 24 Jan 2012 12:04:36 -0500, wrote:

On 1/23/2012 2:59 PM, Leon wrote:

Let's just simplify it a bit. Anyone buying a NEW legal table saw IN
THE US would be forced to buy a SawStop.

No you could buy any brand you wanted, it would not have to be SawStop.

Oh, it WOULD be Saw-Stop, one way or the other, because they'd sue
the ass of anyone infringing on their iron-clad bogus patent. It wuld
be SS supplied, or SS Licensed

Oh, I did not realize that you had inside information on SawStop.

Did you think SS was pushing this legislation because they were worried
about Leon whacking off a fing-ee?

On 1/25/2012 7:17 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jack wrote:

How about THIS Mike. Someone *kills* you for using too many capital
letters. Your wife sells your Tsaw to some clown on Craigslist. He
chops off his arm because your saw is not "UL" compliant and has no
guard, no riving knife, no SS tech.

Of course he sues your widowed wife for $12000000000000 dollars
because of her negligence to have readily available safety crap
installed before selling you the damned beast!!!!!!! He claims he is
having trouble whacking off with one hand, big a dick as he is. Your
widow refuses to give him a hand, ergo the large $suit.

He wins, hand down...

No case Jack. She is not required to sell him a UL approved saw, or even
one with all of the equipment or parts.

Ryobi was not *required* to sell Tsaws with SS tech either. They still
got ****ed out of a $gazillion.

Jack wrote:
On 1/25/2012 7:17 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jack wrote:

How about THIS Mike. Someone *kills* you for using too many capital
letters. Your wife sells your Tsaw to some clown on Craigslist. He
chops off his arm because your saw is not "UL" compliant and has no
guard, no riving knife, no SS tech.

Of course he sues your widowed wife for $12000000000000 dollars
because of her negligence to have readily available safety crap
installed before selling you the damned beast!!!!!!! He claims he
is having trouble whacking off with one hand, big a dick as he is.
Your widow refuses to give him a hand, ergo the large $suit.

He wins, hand down...

No case Jack. She is not required to sell him a UL approved saw, or
even one with all of the equipment or parts.

Ryobi was not *required* to sell Tsaws with SS tech either. They still
got ****ed out of a $gazillion.

Yeahbut, they are a manufacturer.

--

-Mike-

On Wed, 25 Jan 2012 23:24:37 -0500, Jack wrote:
Just one question Jack. How will you show your face here if you chop
one of your fingers off?

I'd feel about the same as you would feel if you get in a car wreck and
are not wearing a NASCAR approved crash helmet, and kill the few

The big difference, is that I wouldn't have been spouting my mouth off
beforehand, about how it's never going to happen to me.

That's the big difference between you and me. You flaunt your
arrogance and "it will never happen to me" attitude with every line
of text you post. That kind of presumed 'specialness' makes people
watch you for your inevitable screwup.

On 1/26/2012 9:04 PM, Dave wrote:
On Wed, 25 Jan 2012 23:24:37 -0500, wrote:
Just one question Jack. How will you show your face here if you chop
one of your fingers off?

I'd feel about the same as you would feel if you get in a car wreck and
are not wearing a NASCAR approved crash helmet, and kill the few

The big difference, is that I wouldn't have been spouting my mouth off
beforehand, about how it's never going to happen to me.

That's the big difference between you and me. You flaunt your
arrogance and "it will never happen to me" attitude with every line
of text you post. That kind of presumed 'specialness' makes people
watch you for your inevitable screwup.

Not to worry, masters of the universe tend to not divulge problems when
they happen so as far as we know they may or may not have any digits
right now. LOL



About 25 years ago when I worked in an automobile dealership we had a
loud mouth, had an answer for everything know it all, been there done
that, had it better, had it worse, et., 22 year old mechanic. You know
the type? ;~)

Anyway another mechanic had a technical difficulty with lowering a
vehicle down from an above ground lift. Oddly the lift arm on one side
began lowering before the other and they became racked, no pun intended.
The lift would neither lower or raise until the weight was removed
from the lower side. The big mouth mechanic mentioned no less that 10
ways to resolve the situation, none of which were used. I called our
wrecker in to lift one end of the vehicle enough to relieve the tension
on the lower rack and long story short the car came down with out mayhem.
Immediately and almost at the top of his voice the loud mouth mechanic
started taking credit for the resolution repeating how it all went down
to all of us that were there, like we could not comprehend what just
happened.

During his yammering he turned around to go back to his stall and but
kept looking back at us. The moment he turned his head to watch where
he was going he walked squarely into another lift arm which resulted in
a nice red knot on his fore head. He did shut up for a moment. LOL
Weeks later as he was retelling the story to some one that did not
witness his accomplishment, he left out the detail of his close
encounter with the adjacent lift.

On Fri, 27 Jan 2012 07:12:57 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 1/26/2012 9:04 PM, Dave wrote:
On Wed, 25 Jan 2012 23:24:37 -0500, wrote:
Just one question Jack. How will you show your face here if you chop
one of your fingers off?

I'd feel about the same as you would feel if you get in a car wreck and
are not wearing a NASCAR approved crash helmet, and kill the few

The big difference, is that I wouldn't have been spouting my mouth off
beforehand, about how it's never going to happen to me.

That's the big difference between you and me. You flaunt your
arrogance and "it will never happen to me" attitude with every line
of text you post. That kind of presumed 'specialness' makes people
watch you for your inevitable screwup.

Not to worry, masters of the universe tend to not divulge problems when
they happen so as far as we know they may or may not have any digits
right now. LOL



About 25 years ago when I worked in an automobile dealership we had a
loud mouth, had an answer for everything know it all, been there done
that, had it better, had it worse, et., 22 year old mechanic. You know
the type? ;~)

Anyway another mechanic had a technical difficulty with lowering a
vehicle down from an above ground lift. Oddly the lift arm on one side
began lowering before the other and they became racked, no pun intended.
The lift would neither lower or raise until the weight was removed
from the lower side. The big mouth mechanic mentioned no less that 10
ways to resolve the situation, none of which were used. I called our
wrecker in to lift one end of the vehicle enough to relieve the tension
on the lower rack and long story short the car came down with out mayhem.
Immediately and almost at the top of his voice the loud mouth mechanic
started taking credit for the resolution repeating how it all went down
to all of us that were there, like we could not comprehend what just
happened.

During his yammering he turned around to go back to his stall and but
kept looking back at us. The moment he turned his head to watch where
he was going he walked squarely into another lift arm which resulted in
a nice red knot on his fore head. He did shut up for a moment. LOL
Weeks later as he was retelling the story to some one that did not
witness his accomplishment, he left out the detail of his close
encounter with the adjacent lift.

g Which is when someone should have reached over and thumped him
with a thumb/middlefinger thwack, right on the knot, saying "Forgot
something!"

--
Creativity can solve almost any problem. The creative act,
the defeat of habit by originality, overcomes everything.
-- George Lois

On 1/27/2012 7:58 AM, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Fri, 27 Jan 2012 07:12:57 -0600, Leonlcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

During his yammering he turned around to go back to his stall and but
kept looking back at us. The moment he turned his head to watch where
he was going he walked squarely into another lift arm which resulted in
a nice red knot on his fore head. \

g Which is when someone should have reached over and thumped him
with a thumb/middlefinger thwack, right on the knot, saying "Forgot
something!"

Which is, in fact, precisely what his parents failed to do in his
formative years.

It's endemic to the particular culture ...

--
www.eWoodShop.com
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)
http://gplus.to/eWoodShop

Don't you guys have some trees to scale?


------------
"Swingman" wrote in message
...

On 1/27/2012 7:58 AM, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Fri, 27 Jan 2012 07:12:57 -0600, Leonlcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

During his yammering he turned around to go back to his stall and
but
kept looking back at us. The moment he turned his head to watch
where
he was going he walked squarely into another lift arm which resulted
in
a nice red knot on his fore head. \

g Which is when someone should have reached over and thumped him
with a thumb/middlefinger thwack, right on the knot, saying "Forgot
something!"

Which is, in fact, precisely what his parents failed to do in his
formative years.

It's endemic to the particular culture ...

--
www.eWoodShop.com
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)
http://gplus.to/eWoodShop

On 1/26/2012 10:04 PM, Dave wrote:
On Wed, 25 Jan 2012 23:24:37 -0500, wrote:
Just one question Jack. How will you show your face here if you chop
one of your fingers off?

I'd feel about the same as you would feel if you get in a car wreck and
are not wearing a NASCAR approved crash helmet, and kill the few

The big difference, is that I wouldn't have been spouting my mouth off
beforehand, about how it's never going to happen to me.

See, this is a big reason I know better than to ever reply to your
stupid posts.

I never once spouted my mouth off about it NEVER going to happen to me.
In fact, dumb ass, I said several times that at my age, the chances are
greater than ever.

That's the big difference between you and me.

Yeah, you have no brain cells that deserve protection from a NASCAR
approved crash helmet.

You flaunt your
arrogance and "it will never happen to me" attitude with every line
of text you post. That kind of presumed 'specialness' makes people
watch you for your inevitable screwup.

Idiot!

--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

On 1/27/2012 8:12 AM, Leon wrote:
On 1/26/2012 9:04 PM, Dave wrote:
On Wed, 25 Jan 2012 23:24:37 -0500, wrote:
Just one question Jack. How will you show your face here if you chop
one of your fingers off?

I'd feel about the same as you would feel if you get in a car wreck and
are not wearing a NASCAR approved crash helmet, and kill the few

The big difference, is that I wouldn't have been spouting my mouth off
beforehand, about how it's never going to happen to me.

That's the big difference between you and me. You flaunt your
arrogance and "it will never happen to me" attitude with every line
of text you post. That kind of presumed 'specialness' makes people
watch you for your inevitable screwup.

Not to worry, masters of the universe tend to not divulge problems when
they happen so as far as we know they may or may not have any digits
right now. LOL

So, do you wear a NASCAR approved crash helmet when you ride in a car,
or do you think you are master of the universe, completely ignoring the
thousands and thousands and thousands of deaths and injuries that could
be prevented/minimized with just a simple preventive measure.

About 25 years ago when I worked in an automobile dealership we had a
loud mouth, had an answer for everything know it all, been there done
that, had it better, had it worse, et., 22 year old mechanic. You know
the type? ;~)

Yeah, the type that if the government doesn't force them to wear a
NASCAR approved crash helmet when riding in a car, they won't wear one,
because they think they are masters of the universe.

I assume you ran out and bought a SS to make sure you keep all your
fingers, right, or are you a master?

--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 14:47:31 -0500, Jack wrote:
I assume you ran out and bought a SS to make sure you keep all your
fingers, right, or are you a master?

We all know you're a pretty smart guy Jack. The only problem is your
arrogance overrides your intelligence every time you post. You're
damned if anybody is going to force you into doing anything. The only
problem is that your mistakes are likely to cause others money and
time to fix them.

On Mon, 23 Jan 2012 20:52:34 -0500, Dave wrote:

On Mon, 23 Jan 2012 14:18:38 -0500, wrote:
Let's just simplify it a bit. Anyone buying a NEW legal table saw IN
THE US would be forced to buy a SawStop.
There's always someone willing to sell non-compliant equipment off the
back of a truck, or to represent it as "used", or to bring
non-compliant equipment in from, say, Mexico. Or China.

Or Canada (such as General Tools which produces a quality table saw).
But, it's almost a foregone conclusion that Canadian insurance
companies would soon follow the same path of requirements.

One comment about General Tools though. My personal experience with
them is that they're pretty quick to incorporate new ideas and
technology with their products. I'm willing to wager they'd soon
invent their own type of safety technology, negating the need to
license a SawStop device. I think the rest of the table saw companies
in the US would be pretty quick to do the same.

It couldn't be any sort of electronic proximity sensing, or really any active
technology, or it would infringe on SawStop's patent. That patent is pretty
damned air-tight.

On Mon, 23 Jan 2012 14:19:40 -0500, Bill wrote:

On 1/23/2012 12:02 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:

$100 table saws? And you find those exactly where on the Sears web site?
Just what are you really asking?

I didn't know whether retailers were allowed to sell saws that are Not
UL approved. That's what I was really asking.

UL is a private company and has no official standing. UL is only one of
several companies that "lists" equipment.

Also, I was surprised to see $100 TSs that had riving knifes... Here is one.

http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_1...block Type=G2

I am Not shopping for one of these however!

On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 20:01:58 -0500, "
It couldn't be any sort of electronic proximity sensing, or really any active
technology, or it would infringe on SawStop's patent. That patent is pretty
damned air-tight.

Maybe not, but the drive to save money is pretty universal. I imagine
most saw builders are working on the safety issue as we speak. I agree
it's difficult to find a competing technology or we'd have seen it by
now. Doesn't matter, I believe it's just a matter of time.

I can imagine some type of beam of light that recognizes tissue and
disengages the saw when that beam is broken. Something will appear, I
have no doubt.

Dave wrote:
On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 20:01:58 -0500, "
It couldn't be any sort of electronic proximity sensing, or really
any active technology, or it would infringe on SawStop's patent.
That patent is pretty damned air-tight.

Maybe not, but the drive to save money is pretty universal. I imagine
most saw builders are working on the safety issue as we speak. I agree
it's difficult to find a competing technology or we'd have seen it by
now. Doesn't matter, I believe it's just a matter of time.

I can imagine some type of beam of light that recognizes tissue and
disengages the saw when that beam is broken. Something will appear, I
have no doubt.

All of the table saw manufacturers are indeed working on an competing
solution. I don't recall where I saw it but you could probably find
documentation of that fact with a google search. I don't know if it is the
legal issues of patent infringement, or what is hold them up, but they are
not sitting back and doing nothing. It remains to be seen whether or not
Gass' patent (with all of its restrictions) will stand up under court
scrutiny.

--

-Mike-

In article ,
Dave wrote:
On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 20:01:58 -0500, "
It couldn't be any sort of electronic proximity sensing, or really any active
technology, or it would infringe on SawStop's patent. That patent is pretty
damned air-tight.

Maybe not, but the drive to save money is pretty universal. I imagine
most saw builders are working on the safety issue as we speak. I agree
it's difficult to find a competing technology or we'd have seen it by
now. Doesn't matter, I believe it's just a matter of time.

I can imagine some type of beam of light that recognizes tissue and
disengages the saw when that beam is broken. Something will appear, I
have no doubt.

You know, I'm reading this right now on a laptop with a touchpad. I put
my finger on the touchpad, move it around, and of course the mouse cursor
on the screen reacts normally. I try using a piece of wood in the touchpad,
a few different types of plastic, and even a piece of metal, and nothing
happens. I wonder if there's something useable there as an alternative
to whatever Gass has patented?


--
Often wrong, never in doubt.

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar. org

Larry W wrote:
In ,
wrote:
On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 20:01:58 -0500, "
It couldn't be any sort of electronic proximity sensing, or really any active
technology, or it would infringe on SawStop's patent. That patent is pretty
damned air-tight.

Maybe not, but the drive to save money is pretty universal. I imagine
most saw builders are working on the safety issue as we speak. I agree
it's difficult to find a competing technology or we'd have seen it by
now. Doesn't matter, I believe it's just a matter of time.

I can imagine some type of beam of light that recognizes tissue and
disengages the saw when that beam is broken. Something will appear, I
have no doubt.

You know, I'm reading this right now on a laptop with a touchpad. I put
my finger on the touchpad, move it around, and of course the mouse cursor
on the screen reacts normally. I try using a piece of wood in the touchpad,
a few different types of plastic, and even a piece of metal, and nothing
happens. I wonder if there's something useable there as an alternative
to whatever Gass has patented?



Nice idea, it could detect if a finger were on the table near the blade.
Unfortunately, most accidents seem to happen in direct contact with the
blade--in midair. Using an electrical circuit to detect contact seems
to be practically unavoidable--the best way to mechanically stop the
blade probably has not been discovered yet. I believe SS's "powder
charges" have expiration dates (not long ones..lol).

On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 23:07:49 -0500, Bill wrote:
Nice idea, it could detect if a finger were on the table near the blade.
Unfortunately, most accidents seem to happen in direct contact with the
blade--in midair. Using an electrical circuit to detect contact seems
to be practically unavoidable

That's why I suggested some type of beam of light being broken as a
stop mechanism. Sort of like the mechanism of an automatic door
opener. It detects movement and operates. All that would remain is for
it to distinguish between flesh and ignore wood/everything else.

Light beam won't cut it (pun intended)
Even the colour of flesh is close to wood.

I find it hard to believe this thing can detect a dry skinned finger from
wet wood without false triggering.

His information stats the thing reacts in 5 milliseconds...maybe the
electronics but after spending a lifetime of calibrating speeds on
electronic and mechanical relays I doubt that chunk of metal hardly starts
to move in less then 20 milliseconds.


------------
"Dave" wrote in message news That's why I suggested some type of beam of light being broken as a
stop mechanism. Sort of like the mechanism of an automatic door
opener. It detects movement and operates. All that would remain is for
it to distinguish between flesh and ignore wood/everything else.

On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 20:36:54 -0500, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:

Dave wrote:
On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 20:01:58 -0500, "
It couldn't be any sort of electronic proximity sensing, or really
any active technology, or it would infringe on SawStop's patent.
That patent is pretty damned air-tight.

Maybe not, but the drive to save money is pretty universal. I imagine
most saw builders are working on the safety issue as we speak. I agree
it's difficult to find a competing technology or we'd have seen it by
now. Doesn't matter, I believe it's just a matter of time.

I can imagine some type of beam of light that recognizes tissue and
disengages the saw when that beam is broken. Something will appear, I
have no doubt.

All of the table saw manufacturers are indeed working on an competing
solution. I don't recall where I saw it but you could probably find
documentation of that fact with a google search. I don't know if it is the
legal issues of patent infringement, or what is hold them up, but they are
not sitting back and doing nothing. It remains to be seen whether or not
Gass' patent (with all of its restrictions) will stand up under court
scrutiny.
It is my beleif that the patent protection given products like this
is too wide and comprehensive. Whether the courts will come to the
same conclusion is another question - and how long it will take them,
still another. By the time it is all said and done, it might be
cheaper to pay the guys fot their licence, fai business practices be
damned. - and end up NOT having an even better product on the market.

On 01/28/2012 06:23 PM, Dave wrote:
On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 20:01:58 -0500, "
It couldn't be any sort of electronic proximity sensing, or really any active
technology, or it would infringe on SawStop's patent. That patent is pretty
damned air-tight.

Maybe not, but the drive to save money is pretty universal. I imagine
most saw builders are working on the safety issue as we speak. I agree
it's difficult to find a competing technology or we'd have seen it by
now. Doesn't matter, I believe it's just a matter of time.

I can imagine some type of beam of light that recognizes tissue and
disengages the saw when that beam is broken. Something will appear, I
have no doubt.

Sounds like a job for Red Green.


--
"Socialism is a philosophy of failure,the creed of ignorance, and the
gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery"
-Winston Churchill

On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 20:23:20 -0500, Dave wrote:

On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 20:01:58 -0500, "
It couldn't be any sort of electronic proximity sensing, or really any active
technology, or it would infringe on SawStop's patent. That patent is pretty
damned air-tight.

Maybe not, but the drive to save money is pretty universal. I imagine
most saw builders are working on the safety issue as we speak. I agree
it's difficult to find a competing technology or we'd have seen it by
now. Doesn't matter, I believe it's just a matter of time.

If it involves electronics sensing human flesh or retracting the blade when
flesh is sensed, no technology will get around the SS patent. It really is
that air-tight.

I can imagine some type of beam of light that recognizes tissue and
disengages the saw when that beam is broken. Something will appear, I
have no doubt.

Nope. Not good enough. The patent covers any active system.

On Sun, 29 Jan 2012 03:25:21 +0000 (UTC),
(Larry W) wrote:

In article ,
Dave wrote:
On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 20:01:58 -0500, "
It couldn't be any sort of electronic proximity sensing, or really any active
technology, or it would infringe on SawStop's patent. That patent is pretty
damned air-tight.

Maybe not, but the drive to save money is pretty universal. I imagine
most saw builders are working on the safety issue as we speak. I agree
it's difficult to find a competing technology or we'd have seen it by
now. Doesn't matter, I believe it's just a matter of time.

I can imagine some type of beam of light that recognizes tissue and
disengages the saw when that beam is broken. Something will appear, I
have no doubt.

You know, I'm reading this right now on a laptop with a touchpad. I put
my finger on the touchpad, move it around, and of course the mouse cursor
on the screen reacts normally. I try using a piece of wood in the touchpad,
a few different types of plastic, and even a piece of metal, and nothing
happens. I wonder if there's something useable there as an alternative
to whatever Gass has patented?

That *IS* the essence of Gass' patent. Using that (capacitive) information to
trigger the stop event (well, the other half is what happens after - both ends
are covered).

On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 22:29:31 -0700, Doug Winterburn
wrote:

I can imagine some type of beam of light that recognizes tissue and
disengages the saw when that beam is broken. Something will appear, I
have no doubt.

Sounds like a job for Red Green.

No, I think MacGyver is the man for this job. Give him a piece of
string and a bottle top and in three minutes. Voilà! Gass is out of
business.

On Sun, 29 Jan 2012 00:27:09 -0500, wrote:

On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 20:36:54 -0500, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:

Dave wrote:
On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 20:01:58 -0500, "
It couldn't be any sort of electronic proximity sensing, or really
any active technology, or it would infringe on SawStop's patent.
That patent is pretty damned air-tight.

Maybe not, but the drive to save money is pretty universal. I imagine
most saw builders are working on the safety issue as we speak. I agree
it's difficult to find a competing technology or we'd have seen it by
now. Doesn't matter, I believe it's just a matter of time.

I can imagine some type of beam of light that recognizes tissue and
disengages the saw when that beam is broken. Something will appear, I
have no doubt.

All of the table saw manufacturers are indeed working on an competing
solution. I don't recall where I saw it but you could probably find
documentation of that fact with a google search. I don't know if it is the
legal issues of patent infringement, or what is hold them up, but they are
not sitting back and doing nothing. It remains to be seen whether or not
Gass' patent (with all of its restrictions) will stand up under court
scrutiny.
It is my beleif that the patent protection given products like this
is too wide and comprehensive.

The evil drones sucked up over seventy five patents on this saw
mechanism. THAT should never been allowed to happen.



Whether the courts will come to the
same conclusion is another question - and how long it will take them,
still another. By the time it is all said and done, it might be
cheaper to pay the guys fot their licence, fai business practices be
damned. - and end up NOT having an even better product on the market.

No, NEVER make crime pay. What ****es me off most is that they A)
Pretended that they wanted to save fingers.
B) Pretended that it was "for the children".
and
C) Went behind our backs to the regulators to get it forced down our
throats when nobody wanted to pay their outrageous fees for a product
which would have been a sure sell to go onto every saw worldwide in
under a year.

when they could have simply asked mfgrs for a nominal fee plus a buck
or two royalty on each mechanism and all partners involved would have
been rolling in millions by now with more coming in for decades. Are
these guys just greedy effers? You tell me.

--
The most decisive actions of our life - I mean those that are most
likely to decide the whole course of our future - are, more often
than not, unconsidered.
-- Andre Gide

Larry W wrote:


You know, I'm reading this right now on a laptop with a touchpad. I
put
my finger on the touchpad, move it around, and of course the mouse
cursor on the screen reacts normally. I try using a piece of wood in
the touchpad, a few different types of plastic, and even a piece of
metal, and nothing happens. I wonder if there's something useable
there as an alternative
to whatever Gass has patented?

The way that your touchpad works Larry, is related to the way Gass'
technology works - capacitance. So, he's closer to your touchpad than you
realize.

--

-Mike-

My brother sat beside that guy, MacGyver, on a plane in Cal once. He
couldn't figure out how to latch the seat belt together.


-------------
"Dave" wrote in message
...
No, I think MacGyver is the man for this job. Give him a piece of
string and a bottle top and in three minutes. Voilà! Gass is out of
business.

On 1/28/2012 9:25 PM, Larry W wrote:
In ,
wrote:
On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 20:01:58 -0500, "
It couldn't be any sort of electronic proximity sensing, or really any active
technology, or it would infringe on SawStop's patent. That patent is pretty
damned air-tight.

Maybe not, but the drive to save money is pretty universal. I imagine
most saw builders are working on the safety issue as we speak. I agree
it's difficult to find a competing technology or we'd have seen it by
now. Doesn't matter, I believe it's just a matter of time.

I can imagine some type of beam of light that recognizes tissue and
disengages the saw when that beam is broken. Something will appear, I
have no doubt.

You know, I'm reading this right now on a laptop with a touchpad. I put
my finger on the touchpad, move it around, and of course the mouse cursor
on the screen reacts normally. I try using a piece of wood in the touchpad,
a few different types of plastic, and even a piece of metal, and nothing
happens. I wonder if there's something useable there as an alternative
to whatever Gass has patented?



It could be a special glove. and yes we have hashed the horror of the
blade grabbing the glove and pulling you whole body in to the saw
through the zero clearance insert. Although I proved that myth wrong
many years ago by pushing a glove into a saw blade and the saw cut
cleanly through the glove with out mayhem. The glove sences the blade
and sends a signal to stop the saw.

On 1/29/2012 8:47 AM, Leon wrote:
On 1/28/2012 9:25 PM, Larry W wrote:
In ,
wrote:
On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 20:01:58 -0500, "
It couldn't be any sort of electronic proximity sensing, or really
any active
technology, or it would infringe on SawStop's patent. That patent is
pretty
damned air-tight.

Maybe not, but the drive to save money is pretty universal. I imagine
most saw builders are working on the safety issue as we speak. I agree
it's difficult to find a competing technology or we'd have seen it by
now. Doesn't matter, I believe it's just a matter of time.

I can imagine some type of beam of light that recognizes tissue and
disengages the saw when that beam is broken. Something will appear, I
have no doubt.

You know, I'm reading this right now on a laptop with a touchpad. I put
my finger on the touchpad, move it around, and of course the mouse cursor
on the screen reacts normally. I try using a piece of wood in the
touchpad,
a few different types of plastic, and even a piece of metal, and nothing
happens. I wonder if there's something useable there as an alternative
to whatever Gass has patented?



It could be a special glove. and yes we have hashed the horror of the
blade grabbing the glove and pulling you whole body in to the saw
through the zero clearance insert. Although I proved that myth wrong
many years ago by pushing a glove into a saw blade and the saw cut
cleanly through the glove with out mayhem. The glove sences the blade
and sends a signal to stop the saw.

Or simpler still protective micro chain mail gloves that simply cannot
be penetrated by a saw blade.

On 1/29/2012 9:47 AM, Leon wrote:

It could be a special glove. and yes we have hashed the horror of the
blade grabbing the glove and pulling you whole body in to the saw
through the zero clearance insert. Although I proved that myth wrong
many years ago by pushing a glove into a saw blade and the saw cut
cleanly through the glove with out mayhem. The glove sences the blade
and sends a signal to stop the saw.

How about a steel glove made with high quality Chinese steel that you
could wear along with your positive pressure face mask, ear muffs, steel
boots and flack jacket. By the time you get suited up to make a saw
cut, it'd be break time, or more likely, old guys like me would have
forgotten what we were doing and gone on to some other dangerous chore.

For dumb asses like Dave that refuse to wear a NASCAR approved crash
helmet when in a car w/o a government mandate, the gloves could have air
tight patented sensors that would prevent your riving knifed, blade
guarded, saw stop protected saw from even turning on. That should make
us safe enough for the socialized medicine hacks tired of paying us for
all the fingers we scatter about the work shop floors of America.

--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

(Larry W) wrote in
:


You know, I'm reading this right now on a laptop with a touchpad. I
put my finger on the touchpad, move it around, and of course the mouse
cursor on the screen reacts normally. I try using a piece of wood in
the touchpad, a few different types of plastic, and even a piece of
metal, and nothing happens. I wonder if there's something useable
there as an alternative to whatever Gass has patented?


A computer with a video camera could watch you as you make the cut. It
would "know" what the saw looked like and a piece of wood, but anything
too close to the blade would set it off.

It's another method, but not something I think would really work.
There's just too much information to process to prevent false trips and
ensure real ones. Anyone ever played with the Xbox Kinect?

Puckdropper
--
Make it to fit, don't make it fit.

On Sun, 29 Jan 2012 10:15:28 -0500, Jack wrote:
For dumb asses like Dave that refuse to wear a NASCAR approved crash
helmet when in a car w/o a government mandate, the gloves could have air
tight patented sensors that would prevent your riving knifed, blade
guarded, saw stop protected saw from even turning on. That should make
us safe enough for the socialized medicine hacks tired of paying us for
all the fingers we scatter about the work shop floors of America.

You like being an ass don't you Jack? You're quite the joke.

On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 23:07:49 -0500, Bill wrote:

I believe SS's "powder charges"
have expiration dates (not long ones..lol).

The trigger is a quick blow fusible link restraining a spring. The
spring might eventually lose its oomph but I suspect that would take a
while.

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw