Simple. Call the power company and mention that just maybe someone
is stealing power. Can they have a guy come out and check out this funny
connection.....

Await the experts.

martin

Bill wrote:
"Bill" wrote in message
...

I'm updatiing my description. It's dark outside and drizzling. Both meters
are moving.


There's a meter on the back of the house (behind the main panel) and
another one on a pole 40 ft from the house. Below the meter on the pole
is a small box (15A), attached by conduit, to the bottom of the meter--no
more than a 3/8" gap betweeen them.
A much longer piece of conduit (3/4"-1") comes out of the bottom of the side
of the box and goes up into the back of the "transformer".

It's concievable that the meter is my neighbors as we both have power lines
from the same pole, in which case maybe it's his box (but it still doesn't
make sense that the conduit goes back up into back of the transformer).

My wife, who is pretty clever, and suggested turning it off to find out what
its for! : )

I think it's possible that my shut off in inside that 2'x2'x2.5' box I
mentioned earlier, it's unlocked and would be easily reachable with a
ladder. Another conceivable place is inside my meter's box--which has a
special clip on it. I'm not going tampering with either, so I have no needs
for any warnings! : ) Maybe I'll turn the small box off sometime though,
just to see what happens....

Bill

Can the transformer be driving lights on the power poles ? Street lights ?
Just a thought.

I'd have the power company come out.

Martin

Bill wrote:
Mike Marlow wrote:

There's a meter on the back of the house (behind the main panel) and
another one on a pole 40 ft from the house. Below the meter on the
pole is a small box (15A), attached by conduit, to the bottom of the
meter--no more than a 3/8" gap betweeen them.
A much longer piece of conduit (3/4"-1" in diameter) comes out of the
bottom of the side of the box and goes up into the back of the
"transformer".

A meter pole would often have a disconnect connected to the meter, at
the pole. This was/is common in trailer hookups. I'm not sure about
the (15A) statement you make. What do you mean by (15A)?

Sorry, all I mean by 15A is that the small (6"x6") box attached directly
below the meter on the pole has a single C'breaker inside marked 15A.
I've been describing it so much, I got sloppy.


It strkes me as odd that
that there would be a 15 Amp disconnect directly off a meter. The
conduit going back to the transformer could just have a ground running
in it.

I think it's possible that my shut off in inside that 2'x2'x2.5' box
I mentioned earlier, it's unlocked and would be easily reachable with
a ladder. Another conceivable place is inside my meter's box--which
has a special clip on it.

Unless you have a disconnect installed after your meter, you have no
disconnect. Disconnects are common for meter poles, and but they are
not necessary for a standard residential hookup. Your disconnect (in
normal circumstances) is the main breaker in your panel. The meter
head serves as the disconnect for most home wiring.

Thank you for this information. Just curious, would I be likely to see a
C'breaker inside the 2'x2'x2.5' humming steel box with a number
coinciding with the "service number" on my meter? Although this box
wouldn't be reachable without a short ladder, it's latch is not locked.


Those of you who have been following this thread may find another true
story amusing: About 2 dozen years back when I worked on Fort Sill, OK
(home of the "Field Artillery School"), I was walking between buildings
as I did everyday and I picked up a small thing on the ground that
looked like a condenser (from a lawnmower), and it had 2 metal wires
coming from it. I gave it a close exam realized it wasn't a condenser
and untwisted the two wires (for saftety) and put it in my pocket and
went about my work for the morning. When I got back to my office, I
called the ordinant office and they came to visit me with "shields",
facemasks, gloves, a great big can...geeze...I told them I carried it
around it my pocket all morning--I wasn't skeered! It was sitting on my
desk and I told them I wold be happy to pick it up for them! It was a
"practice blast" used for simulating real blasts in the field, for
training. They told me not to pick up anything else I found! ; )

Bill

On Tue, 23 Mar 2010 12:53:10 -0400, Bill
wrote:

Mike M wrote:
On Mon, 22 Mar 2010 23:56:03 -0400, "Bill"
wrote:

"Bill" wrote in message
...


Bill

It sounds like if its your neighbors meter they might be using a
current transformer for the meter instead of running the load thru it.
I'm in a different local so not familiar with utilities where you are.
Normal practice would be to locate it where it enters the premise but
it would explain the 3;/4" pipe. Only other thing I could think of
would be street lights.

Thanks for your reply. The explanation you provided in your first
sentence above seems the most believable. It seems strange that it
would have a 15A breaker though, huh.

Thanks,
Bill


Mike M

They may have tapped off the main lugs and used the small breakers to
protect the wires in the 3/4" pipe.

Mike M

Mike M.

Here's a link to some pics of the "Two Meter Problem".
BTW, Neighbor has his own meter at his house.


http://web.newsguy.com/MySite/

Bill

On 3/24/2010 4:21 AM, Bill wrote:
Mike M.

Here's a link to some pics of the "Two Meter Problem".
BTW, Neighbor has his own meter at his house.


http://web.newsguy.com/MySite/

This appears to be some kind of cable or telephone equipment box, on
it's own meter, a not uncommon piece of equipment, and a perfectly
legitimate installation.

I would not worry about it as it does not appear to have anything to do
with the service to your house.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On 3/24/2010 6:12 AM, Swingman wrote:

This appears to be some kind of cable or telephone equipment box, on
it's own meter, a not uncommon piece of equipment, and a perfectly
legitimate installation.

I would not worry about it as it does not appear to have anything to do
with the service to your house.

Meant to add that it is probably a power supply, or battery backup
system, either for your cable company or telephone company. Do you have
fiber optic in your area? Probably powering a node somewhere close by.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 05:21:51 -0400, "Bill"
wrote:

Mike M.

Here's a link to some pics of the "Two Meter Problem".
BTW, Neighbor has his own meter at his house.


http://web.newsguy.com/MySite/

Bill

Xformer is on pole and your service comes in overhead so I'll go with
what swingman said. Doesn't look like anything the electric utility
would do as they wouldn't have a meter for their own equipment and it
doesn't look as big as I thought you described. If you don't get a
bill for it as in more then one bill or meter number on your bill its
not being charged to you.

Mike M

"Swingman" wrote in message
...
On 3/24/2010 6:12 AM, Swingman wrote:

This appears to be some kind of cable or telephone equipment box, on
it's own meter, a not uncommon piece of equipment, and a perfectly
legitimate installation.

I would not worry about it as it does not appear to have anything to do
with the service to your house.

Meant to add that it is probably a power supply, or battery backup system,
either for your cable company or telephone company.

All that is inside the small box (that I can see) is a 15A C'breaker.

We do have cable in our area. The little box appears quite old.
Maybe I'll flip the switch and see if the cable goes out .

Thank you for your suggestions!
Bill



Do you have
fiber optic in your area? Probably powering a node somewhere close by.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

"Mike M" wrote in message
...

On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 05:21:51 -0400, "Bill"
wrote:

Mike M.

Here's a link to some pics of the "Two Meter Problem".
BTW, Neighbor has his own meter at his house.


http://web.newsguy.com/MySite/

Bill

Xformer is on pole and your service comes in overhead so I'll go with
what swingman said. Doesn't look like anything the electric utility
would do as they wouldn't have a meter for their own equipment and it
doesn't look as big as I thought you described. If you don't get a
bill for it as in more then one bill or meter number on your bill its
not being charged to you.

No, it's not being charged to me, but it IS an electrical company meter.
When I registered for the electrical service at the house, I became
a shareholder of some special "cooperative corporation". Maybe the
corporation leases from
another entity, or something like that. As it happens, I found out yeterday
that there is an annual meeting of the
electrical corporation next month--with a drawing for some pretty big prizes
(it must be hard
to get people to go!). Maybe I can pick up more info there.

Thanks again!
Bill



Mike M

"Swingman" wrote in message
...
On 3/24/2010 4:21 AM, Bill wrote:
Mike M.

Here's a link to some pics of the "Two Meter Problem".
BTW, Neighbor has his own meter at his house.


http://web.newsguy.com/MySite/

This appears to be some kind of cable or telephone equipment box, on it's
own meter, a not uncommon piece of equipment, and a perfectly legitimate
installation.

Can anyone suggest, then, why the conduit from the box might possibly have a
reason lead into the back
of the "transformer" above? If so, I'll try to put this one to rest! : )

BTW, does the "transformer" convert XXXv to 240v or something like that that
I can (sort of) understand?

Bill



I would not worry about it as it does not appear to have anything to do
with the service to your house.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

Bill wrote:
....

When I registered for the electrical service at the house, I became
a shareholder of some special "cooperative corporation". ...

That 'some special "cooperative corporation"' is your rural electric
co-operative _association_, a member-owned entity.

In most rural areas there wasn't a high-enough population density that
the public or private utilities gave a rat's patootie about so didn't
get access to public power until folks in those areas joined together
and formed local cooperatives to do so. Areas such as yours, while now
in residential subdivisions, were out of areas served otherwise and many
are still being served by the co-ops.

As an example, I mentioned earlier that folks were part of organizing
our local REC; they began collecting signatures/commitments in earnest
in late 1945 when it became clear that V-J Day couldn't be _too_ far
away. From that time it wasn't until 1948 we finally got power to the
farmstead/house. (Up until then, used the old Delco wind-powered
generator and a bank of storage batteries in the house basement (these
were 32 VDC systems) and a small backup gasoline-powered generator.

There are still areas in even more rural areas where such systems are
widespread enough still that one can find appliances built for them.
Weyburn, SK, is one that still had a co-op store when I was last there
about 5 years ago or so.

....
... As it happens, I found out yeterday that there is an annual meeting of the
electrical corporation next month--with a drawing for some pretty big prizes
(it must be hard to get people to go!). Maybe I can pick up more info there.

Again, it's a _co-operative_, not a "corporation".

Since it is a co-operative, it is customer-owned and important to have
enough folks to show up for the annual meetings to have a quorum and
thereby save the expense of having special ballots, etc., to confirm
your new board of directors (who will be other customers from the
various service regions) and other annual business. My IN geography
isn't good enough to guess which one might be the one serving you; that
undoubtedly also depends on which side of the city you're on; it's
unlikely one local co-op has all the surrounding service territory in
each direction.

As the city-fication of these formerly almost all rural co-ops
continues, it is, indeed, generally harder to get the suburban members
involved as they don't have a clue as to what it took to actually get
power to serve them as will many of the older members whose folks or
grandparents were, like mine, the ones who "made it happen".

Again, that's not a personal dig, simply that it is so that the folks
moving into these subdivisions such as yours are almost all urban and
simply think of the power-co as being a necessary evil that "just is".
The idea of having actually created one's own utility is just a totally
foreign concept to them and they tend to be totally disinterested as
long as the lights come on when they flip a switch.

/Warning-Anothergeezerstoryahead
Not only did we have no electric power until REA reached us, up until I
was in HS in the 60s we maintained our own telephone lines up to within
1/2-mi of town which was the closest interconnection point to the Bell
lines and service.

Many other areas had to do the similar thing as the REC's in order to
have any phone service at all--they formed local telephone co-ops, many
of which are still the local service providers in this general area.

Anothergeezerstoryfinished (and I promise I'll stop)/

--

On 3/24/2010 12:35 PM, Bill wrote:
wrote in message
...
On 3/24/2010 4:21 AM, Bill wrote:
Mike M.

Here's a link to some pics of the "Two Meter Problem".
BTW, Neighbor has his own meter at his house.


http://web.newsguy.com/MySite/

This appears to be some kind of cable or telephone equipment box, on it's
own meter, a not uncommon piece of equipment, and a perfectly legitimate
installation.

Can anyone suggest, then, why the conduit from the box might possibly have a
reason lead into the back
of the "transformer" above? If so, I'll try to put this one to rest! : )

It may just look that way from the ground. However, you can indeed feed
a transformer on the pole both ways ... see below.

I kind of doubt that is what is happening here, but you never know.

BTW, does the "transformer" convert XXXv to 240v or something like that that
I can (sort of) understand?

It is a step down transformer, and it takes the high voltage of the
overhead transmission lines (likely 12,000v in most USA locales) and
steps it down to the 120v feeding your house's main service panel.

The step down/up ratio depends upon the number of windings in the
transformer.

That same transformer can also work in the opposite direction ... it can
be fed 120v and put 12,000 volt back in the transmission line.

This is the major reason why, when feeding a house panel from a backup
generator during a power outage, that a cut off is required. Otherwise
you could be putting 12000 volts into a down line while someone is
trying to fix it ... something the electric company frowns on.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On 3/24/2010 12:23 PM, Bill wrote:
wrote in message
...
On 3/24/2010 6:12 AM, Swingman wrote:

This appears to be some kind of cable or telephone equipment box, on
it's own meter, a not uncommon piece of equipment, and a perfectly
legitimate installation.

I would not worry about it as it does not appear to have anything to do
with the service to your house.

Meant to add that it is probably a power supply, or battery backup system,
either for your cable company or telephone company.

All that is inside the small box (that I can see) is a 15A C'breaker.

We do have cable in our area. The little box appears quite old.
Maybe I'll flip the switch and see if the cable goes out .

I would suggest not doing that ... it would like shooting yourself in
the foot.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

Swingman wrote:
On 3/24/2010 12:23 PM, Bill wrote:
wrote in message
...
On 3/24/2010 6:12 AM, Swingman wrote:

This appears to be some kind of cable or telephone equipment box, on
it's own meter, a not uncommon piece of equipment, and a perfectly
legitimate installation.

I would not worry about it as it does not appear to have anything to do
with the service to your house.

Meant to add that it is probably a power supply, or battery backup
system,
either for your cable company or telephone company.

All that is inside the small box (that I can see) is a 15A C'breaker.

We do have cable in our area. The little box appears quite old.
Maybe I'll flip the switch and see if the cable goes out .

I would suggest not doing that ... it would like shooting yourself in
the foot.

Certainly agree if he doesn't know what it actually does...if it is some
sort of a cable-co setup that appears it might be, it's surely doing
more than just his one drop...

I'd still wonder if it's actually not just abandoned in place meself,
but perhaps not...the pitchurs are too dark and lack all the pertinents
sections to tell what's actually hooked to what and where, precisely...

--

dpb wrote:
Swingman wrote:
On 3/24/2010 12:23 PM, Bill wrote:
wrote in message
...
On 3/24/2010 6:12 AM, Swingman wrote:

This appears to be some kind of cable or telephone equipment box,
on it's own meter, a not uncommon piece of equipment, and a
perfectly legitimate installation.

I would not worry about it as it does not appear to have anything
to do with the service to your house.

Meant to add that it is probably a power supply, or battery backup
system,
either for your cable company or telephone company.

All that is inside the small box (that I can see) is a 15A
C'breaker. We do have cable in our area. The little box appears quite
old.
Maybe I'll flip the switch and see if the cable goes out .

I would suggest not doing that ... it would like shooting yourself in
the foot.

Certainly agree if he doesn't know what it actually does...if it is
some sort of a cable-co setup that appears it might be, it's surely
doing more than just his one drop...

I'd still wonder if it's actually not just abandoned in place meself,
but perhaps not...the pitchurs are too dark and lack all the
pertinents sections to tell what's actually hooked to what and where,
precisely...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QBDrRl7d5ZA

dpb wrote:
....

Since it is a co-operative, it is customer-owned and important to have
enough folks to show up for the annual meetings ...

OBTW...

If yours is anything like all others with which have any connection or
contact (and that's quite a number w/ length of association thru folks
and continued since returning to the home place and serving on board),
it'll be from a fairly major to perhaps the premier social event of the
year for the long-term members. The more the number of rural members as
opposed to the residential customers the higher on the scale that will
be, undoubtedly...

--

"dpb" wrote in message
...
dpb wrote:
...

Since it is a co-operative, it is customer-owned and important to have
enough folks to show up for the annual meetings ...

OBTW...

If yours is anything like all others with which have any connection or
contact (and that's quite a number w/ length of association thru folks and
continued since returning to the home place and serving on board), it'll
be from a fairly major to perhaps the premier social event of the year for
the long-term members. The more the number of rural members as opposed to
the residential customers the higher on the scale that will be,
undoubtedly...




dpb,

Thank you for filling me in regarding many of the details of my "electrical
cooperative"!
I understood the intent, but I didn't have the perspective. Two surrounding
cities are fighting over the right to tax our area. I don't know a lot
about the details but
I know I have to pay a 3rd party to pick up our garbage--and I think it's
cheaper that
way too. My property taxes are currently "very reasonable".

I'll try to make it to the annual meeting of my electrical cooperative: the
"premier social event" --O'boy!

Best,
Bill

Bill wrote:
....

Thank you for filling me in regarding many of the details of my "electrical
cooperative"!
I understood the intent, but I didn't have the perspective. ...

I'll try to make it to the annual meeting of my electrical cooperative: the
"premier social event" --O'boy!

Glad to...as you can easily tell, I've a very close connection w/ the
concept in general and particular local co-op in particular. While in
general I think much of what "gummit" does is an absolute failure or
totally misguided, the establishment of the Rural Electrification
Administration (REA) by FDR was pivotal and successful mostly because it
only provided opportunity for locals to accomplish something rather than
trying to decide and do it for them.

Here's a link to the NRECA (the national association of REC's) that has
a brief history...

http://www.nreca.org/AboutUs/Co-op101/CoopHistory.htm

I hope you do go and have an enjoyable evening as well as learn and
participate in your co-op's business as well as get to meet a at least
some of what remain of the old codgers who must have been instrumental
in getting yours to where it is currently...they'll undoubtedly be a lot
of comparing of weather, crops, cattle prices, etc., etc., etc., ...

There are quite a number that we only see at these meetings any longer
as they don't get around as much any longer and since the service area
is nearly 175 miles from one end to another and our place is well
towards the western end, it's quite far enough that just don't "drop in
while passing by"...

--

On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 19:29:15 -0400, "Bill"
wrote:


"dpb" wrote in message
...
dpb wrote:
...

Since it is a co-operative, it is customer-owned and important to have
enough folks to show up for the annual meetings ...

OBTW...

If yours is anything like all others with which have any connection or
contact (and that's quite a number w/ length of association thru folks and
continued since returning to the home place and serving on board), it'll
be from a fairly major to perhaps the premier social event of the year for
the long-term members. The more the number of rural members as opposed to
the residential customers the higher on the scale that will be,
undoubtedly...




dpb,

Thank you for filling me in regarding many of the details of my "electrical
cooperative"!
I understood the intent, but I didn't have the perspective. Two surrounding
cities are fighting over the right to tax our area. I don't know a lot
about the details but
I know I have to pay a 3rd party to pick up our garbage--and I think it's
cheaper that
way too. My property taxes are currently "very reasonable".

I'll try to make it to the annual meeting of my electrical cooperative: the
"premier social event" --O'boy!

Best,
Bill

Bill I think this is a case of turning a mole hill into a mountain.
If its not being billed to you forget it and go back to building your
shop. If you'd paid an electrician a few hours to come out you
probably would have been ahead of the game already with a contract to
finish what you weren't sure of doing for your shop.

Mike M

Bill wrote:

The next time I do the wiring I'll probably hire a contractor--it would be
too much like going to the same vacation-spot twice...

Sorry about that exaggeration. I really didn't mean that. The rest I
was quite sincere about.

Bill

"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message
...
Dedicate at least three (3), 1P-20A circuits for lighting.

I read that it's better to use 15A circuits for lighting since the wire in
lighting fixtures is comparatively fine, such wiring may get screwed up by
the time the C'Breaker switches off.

I also read one shouldn't buy the cheapest flourescent lighting fixtures one
can find as they tend to have cheap ballasters.



Finally, buy a 10-2 with ground, 25 ft long molded cord set, chop off the
receptacle end and rewire with an extra deep, 2 gang box wired with a pair
of receptacles. It becomes your "go to" extension cord.

This sounds good.

Is this what you mean?

http://www.globalindustrial.com/p/el....campaignId=WZ

It's hard to tell if these are up to the task of being dragged around" on a
concrete floor.



Lew

"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message
...

Lew


Thanks for your reply Lew.