I need to get some kind of interior finish on my shop walls now that they're
insulated, and I can't come up with a better idea than drywall. I'm going
to do this myself, probably with a helper who will probably know less about
hanging drywall than I do (which isn't much...the white side faces out,
right? ;-). Anyway, it appears that the recommended way to do this is to do
the ceiling first, then hang the walls with the drywall parallel to the
floor starting at the ceiling and working down. However, to get this thing
going, I'd rather do the walls first. Then I would run the electric surface
mounted on the drywall. At some later date, I would drywall the ceiling.
My main question is: how big of a deal is doing the ceiling after the walls?
Also, it would be way easier in my mind to hang the drywall vertically
(parallel to the studs) rather than horizontally. For this application,
would it be OK? I'm open to any other constructive comments regarding this
plan.

todd

"todd" wrote in message
...
I need to get some kind of interior finish on my shop walls now that
they're
insulated, and I can't come up with a better idea than drywall. I'm going
to do this myself, probably with a helper who will probably know less
about
hanging drywall than I do (which isn't much...the white side faces out,
right? ;-). Anyway, it appears that the recommended way to do this is to
do
the ceiling first, then hang the walls with the drywall parallel to the
floor starting at the ceiling and working down. However, to get this
thing
going, I'd rather do the walls first. Then I would run the electric
surface
mounted on the drywall. At some later date, I would drywall the ceiling.
My main question is: how big of a deal is doing the ceiling after the
walls?

I think it would be no problem. Just be sure to leave yourself a gap of the
right size.

Also, it would be way easier in my mind to hang the drywall vertically
(parallel to the studs) rather than horizontally. For this application,
would it be OK? I'm open to any other constructive comments regarding
this
plan.

How tall are you? If you hang horizontally, you have the big easy seam 4
feet off the ground and do not need to go up and down the ladder as much
when taping. You can also use 12 footers easier and potentially elimate
another seam or two.

"Roger Shoaf" wrote in message
...

"todd" wrote in message
My main question is: how big of a deal is doing the ceiling after the
walls?

I think it would be no problem. Just be sure to leave yourself a gap of
the
right size.

I couldn't just do the walls all the way up and start the ceiling "inside"
the drywall on the walls?

Also, it would be way easier in my mind to hang the drywall vertically
(parallel to the studs) rather than horizontally. For this application,
would it be OK? I'm open to any other constructive comments regarding
this
plan.

How tall are you? If you hang horizontally, you have the big easy seam 4
feet off the ground and do not need to go up and down the ladder as much
when taping. You can also use 12 footers easier and potentially elimate
another seam or two.

I'm of average height and I also forgot to mention that these are 10-foot
walls. So, either way, somebody's getting on a ladder to tape, I imagine.
It still might be better to do it perpendicular to the studs, though. I'm
less worried about which way the walls go than I am putting the ceiling off
for now.

thanks for your response.

todd

"todd" wrote:

I need to get some kind of interior finish on my shop walls now that
they're
insulated, and I can't come up with a better idea than drywall.
I'm going
to do this myself,.............

Let me play the devil's advocate for a moment.

Ever consider using T&G siding.

Relatively low cost, you won't punch holes thru it, and you can pretty
much hang anything you want, anywhere you want.

Be a good idea to rough in the electrical under the siding under the
wall covering, whatever you use.

BTW, not my idea, NYW had project building a workshop in a garage that
used it.

YMMV.

Lew

"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message
.net...
"todd" wrote:

I need to get some kind of interior finish on my shop walls now that
they're
insulated, and I can't come up with a better idea than drywall.
I'm going
to do this myself,.............

Let me play the devil's advocate for a moment.

Ever consider using T&G siding.

Relatively low cost, you won't punch holes thru it, and you can pretty
much hang anything you want, anywhere you want.

Be a good idea to rough in the electrical under the siding under the wall
covering, whatever you use.

BTW, not my idea, NYW had project building a workshop in a garage that
used it.

YMMV.

Lew

I hadn't considered T&G siding. I had considered plywood, though. The
siding would be a sight easier for me to deal with compared to the drywall.
I imagine it's at least double the material cost of drywall, but if I factor
in hiring out the drywall hanging like SWMBO wants to do, I might come out
ahead.

Although I didn't highlight it, I'm curious to get people's input on the
electrical. One thing to keep in mind is that here in the Chicago area,
I've got to run everything in metal conduit, so running wire inside the
walls isn't quite as easy as drilling some holes and pulling romex through.
I've read archive posts where people found it acceptable to surface mount in
a shop situation.

thanks for your input,

todd

On Jun 25, 1:38 am, "todd" wrote:
"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message


"here in the Chicago area"

Are you doing a "commercial" shop? In most areas I am familiar
with, ROMEX is acceptable for "home" applications and conduit is
required for "commerical" applications. If you are building a "home"
shop and haven't asked Code Enforcement, it might be worth asking.

Having said that, it is certainly easier to la conduit outside of
finished walls than to run it through studs - although there is a more
flexible variety than the steel now a days - but CODE RULES if you are
to be INSPECTED. If at all possible, route your wiring behind the
walls. You may be able to pass inspection with that flexible spiral
bound cable which can be easily routed through stud walls.

I ran duplex outlets around the perimeter with a steady and a switched
circuit all around the shop. You can wire the tp two outlets switched
or just the top left (be consistent so you will remember which is
switched!) This allowed me to leave all those transformer things
plugged in 24/7 but able to switch them off when I left the shop.
Saves on electricity and fire hazards. I ran 12/4 (Red, White, Black
and Bare) but I didn't invite the inspector - hell, I told no one.

As to the wall surfaces, T-111 is a good idea but OSB works as well -
smoother surface - and is cheaper than drywall in our area. It can
take a screw - don't think it will hold one as well as solid wood but
no facts to back that up. And, as the fellow said about the T-111, it
will take more punishment than drywall. If your studs are 16" O.C. you
should be able to hang the boards vertically easier than horizontally
and use a two foot section along the bottom horizontally. I used joint
compoud on my OSB seams and texture on the walls and ceiling and it
worked out nicely.

Ceiling goes up FIRST **. And, don't discount its value up there.
Primed, then painted with a Bright White, it will provide double the
illumination (well, I just made that up- again, no facts or research,
just opinion) with any given wattage and LIGHT IS important in a
shop. Esp as you age in place. Ten foot ceiling height. I'm impressed.
As the intensity of the light diminishes inversley with the square of
the distance, I may have been experiencing a much greater illumination
boost from my bright white ceilings than you can achieve. But it will
make a difference

** At least that is the way all the pros I've watched do the job.
Partly because, I suspect it is easier to hide the inevitable gaps
that occur when positioning ten foot long, four foot wide sheets of
anything overhead in a structure "nominally square."



.net...



"todd" wrote:

I need to get some kind of interior finish on my shop walls now that
they're
insulated, and I can't come up with a better idea than drywall.
I'm going
to do this myself,.............

Let me play the devil's advocate for a moment.

Ever consider using T&G siding.

Relatively low cost, you won't punch holes thru it, and you can pretty
much hang anything you want, anywhere you want.

Be a good idea to rough in the electrical under the siding under the wall
covering, whatever you use.

BTW, not my idea, NYW had project building a workshop in a garage that
used it.

YMMV.

Lew

I hadn't considered T&G siding. I had considered plywood, though. The
siding would be a sight easier for me to deal with compared to the drywall.
I imagine it's at least double the material cost of drywall, but if I factor
in hiring out the drywall hanging like SWMBO wants to do, I might come out
ahead.

Although I didn't highlight it, I'm curious to get people's input on the
electrical. One thing to keep in mind is that here in the Chicago area,
I've got to run everything in metal conduit, so running wire inside the
walls isn't quite as easy as drilling some holes and pulling romex through.
I've read archive posts where people found it acceptable to surface mount in
a shop situation.

thanks for your input,

todd

My 2 cents.

I echo what Lew said. Plywood, T&G, even wafer board. We did our garage in drywall a few years
ago, stuck in a bunch of circuits in, etc, for all the power tools. We even air conditioned it, so
it is actually a shop, not a garage.Only vehicles ever in it were during the hurricane a couple of
years ago (stacking power tools to make enough room was NOT fun).

Drywall was a mistake. I will have some sort of solid siding for the next (and last) shop. This
will be the ultimate shop, as I intend to spend my retirement in it. The cost will be a bit more
than with drywall, but since I expect to use it for another 20 years, it will be worth it. Nothing
fancy, but someplace with all the wiring hidden, and white painted ply or T&G or wafer board so I
can hang something where ever I darn well please. I do this with the current shop, but sometimes it
entails head scratching and finding the darn stud sensor.

Regards,
Roy


On Sun, 24 Jun 2007 23:05:08 -0500, "todd" wrote:

I need to get some kind of interior finish on my shop walls now that they're
insulated, and I can't come up with a better idea than drywall. I'm going
to do this myself, probably with a helper who will probably know less about
hanging drywall than I do (which isn't much...the white side faces out,
right? ;-). Anyway, it appears that the recommended way to do this is to do
the ceiling first, then hang the walls with the drywall parallel to the
floor starting at the ceiling and working down. However, to get this thing
going, I'd rather do the walls first. Then I would run the electric surface
mounted on the drywall. At some later date, I would drywall the ceiling.
My main question is: how big of a deal is doing the ceiling after the walls?
Also, it would be way easier in my mind to hang the drywall vertically
(parallel to the studs) rather than horizontally. For this application,
would it be OK? I'm open to any other constructive comments regarding this
plan.

todd

todd wrote:

"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message
.net...
"todd" wrote:

I need to get some kind of interior finish on my shop walls now that
they're
insulated, and I can't come up with a better idea than drywall.
I'm going
to do this myself,.............

Let me play the devil's advocate for a moment.

Ever consider using T&G siding.

Relatively low cost, you won't punch holes thru it, and you can pretty
much hang anything you want, anywhere you want.

Be a good idea to rough in the electrical under the siding under the wall
covering, whatever you use.

BTW, not my idea, NYW had project building a workshop in a garage that
used it.

YMMV.

Lew

I hadn't considered T&G siding. I had considered plywood, though. The
siding would be a sight easier for me to deal with compared to the drywall.
I imagine it's at least double the material cost of drywall, but if I factor
in hiring out the drywall hanging like SWMBO wants to do, I might come out
ahead.

Put up something you can screw into whatever you do. My shop is a
concrete sectional garage. This means concrete panels bolted together
make the walls. The centre of the panels are very thin, only the edges
have any thickness and the inside edge around the panels is bevelled. To
hang anything I had to rip strips of ply to the right angle (I don't
have a tablesaw), laminate them together, drill them for the bolts and
bolt them in place using longer bolts. Then I screwed 18mm ply onto
them. So far the wall above my bench and the end wall above the bench
are done. Means I have two wall cabinets on the end wall now and some
saws are hung up by shaped blocks through the hole in the handle.

Don't do drywall, think finding studs every time you want to hang
something.

Peter
--
Add my middle initial to email me. It has become attached to a country
www.the-brights.net

Roy wrote in
:

*snip*


Drywall was a mistake. I will have some sort of solid siding for the
next (and last) shop. This will be the ultimate shop, as I intend to
spend my retirement in it. The cost will be a bit more than with
drywall, but since I expect to use it for another 20 years, it will be
worth it. Nothing fancy, but someplace with all the wiring hidden,
and white painted ply or T&G or wafer board so I can hang something
where ever I darn well please. I do this with the current shop, but
sometimes it entails head scratching and finding the darn stud sensor.

Regards,
Roy

If I was hanging things on a regular basis, I'd probably find a couple
studs and discretely mark their location on the wall. (Up near the
cieling or down near the floor. Just a 1/2" line on each side of the
stud gives you something to go off of, especially if you know your stud
spacing's consistent.)

Wonder if we could get an issue of some magazine like "Better Homes and
Gardens" to publish a room where blue chalk lines 16 inch on center are
part of the decor. :-)

Puckdropper
--
Wise is the man who attempts to answer his question before asking it.

To email me directly, send a message to puckdropper (at) fastmail.fm

"Hoosierpopi" wrote in message
oups.com...
On Jun 25, 1:38 am, "todd" wrote:
"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message


"here in the Chicago area"

Are you doing a "commercial" shop? In most areas I am familiar
with, ROMEX is acceptable for "home" applications and conduit is
required for "commerical" applications. If you are building a "home"
shop and haven't asked Code Enforcement, it might be worth asking.

Let's just say that the Chicago area isn't like most areas you're familiar
with ;-). Romex is not code for any interior home applications that I'm
aware of around here. The garage/shop was built last year along with a
major addition to the house, and was inspected, including the electrical.

Having said that, it is certainly easier to la conduit outside of
finished walls than to run it through studs - although there is a more
flexible variety than the steel now a days - but CODE RULES if you are
to be INSPECTED. If at all possible, route your wiring behind the
walls. You may be able to pass inspection with that flexible spiral
bound cable which can be easily routed through stud walls.

Except for certain (short) applications, BX or Greenfield is not allowed.
Certainly not as a replacement for conduit in a long run.

I ran duplex outlets around the perimeter with a steady and a switched
circuit all around the shop. You can wire the tp two outlets switched
or just the top left (be consistent so you will remember which is
switched!) This allowed me to leave all those transformer things
plugged in 24/7 but able to switch them off when I left the shop.
Saves on electricity and fire hazards. I ran 12/4 (Red, White, Black
and Bare) but I didn't invite the inspector - hell, I told no one.

I don't plan on having this inspected, but I do plan on doing it per local
code.

thanks,

todd

In article , todd
wrote:

I need to get some kind of interior finish on my shop walls now that they're
insulated, and I can't come up with a better idea than drywall.

I'm in the process of finishing up my new shop. At the suggestion of a
local contractor (cousin through marriage), I covered the interior
walls with OSB (oriented strand board) smooth side out.

The 7/16" OSB was about half the price of 1/2" drywall at the local
borg. With a little care, the seams tend to disappear after painting.
For the one or two seams that were a little stubborn, a some paintable
caulk before painting took care of them.

Well, that's what worked for me, anyway. The added benefit is that I
don't have to worry about poking boards through the drywall.


Joe

aka 10x

I don't know what all the fuss about drywall is. Every shop I have had was
drywall and the next one will be too. No problems hanging anything on the
walls since the invention of the stud sensor. I have a couple friends that
put up wafer board. It took tons of primer to seal it, and the glues and
resin still sneak through in places. Plus drywall is a bit quieter than
wafer board. It seems to me their shops echo the noise off the walls more
than mine,
Greg

On Sun, 24 Jun 2007 23:05:08 -0500, "todd" wrote:

I need to get some kind of interior finish on my shop walls now that they're
insulated, and I can't come up with a better idea than drywall. I'm going
to do this myself, probably with a helper who will probably know less about
hanging drywall than I do (which isn't much...the white side faces out,
right? ;-). Anyway, it appears that the recommended way to do this is to do
the ceiling first, then hang the walls with the drywall parallel to the
floor starting at the ceiling and working down. However, to get this thing
going, I'd rather do the walls first. Then I would run the electric surface
mounted on the drywall. At some later date, I would drywall the ceiling.
My main question is: how big of a deal is doing the ceiling after the walls?
Also, it would be way easier in my mind to hang the drywall vertically
(parallel to the studs) rather than horizontally. For this application,
would it be OK? I'm open to any other constructive comments regarding this
plan.

todd



I did my shop with drywall. Since it was not an occupied space and
separate from the main house, I used 3/8" drywall all around to make
the job a little easier. However, check your codes, mine allowed it.

Ceiling first so that you don't have to match up to any crooked walls
and probably takes movement without cracking better. Make a couple of
T-bars, or rent a lift.

Horizontal actually easier, in my opinion, you can rig some step on
lifts to close the seams, simple levers on blocks, although they sell
or rent some devices that do that. I like working that horizontal
seam four foot high, easier than working a lot of top to bottom seams.

Why would you not put the electrical in first?

The drywall was primarily to seal the insulation. After finished I
installed a bunch of framed sections of perf board to hang stuff on.
The drywall has held up well, despite my propensity to swing boards
and tools into it. Haven't punched any holes yet.

This from an individual who hates floating drywall but can do it when
necessary.

Frank

"todd" wrote on 24 Jun 2007 in group
rec.woodworking:

I need to get some kind of interior finish on my shop walls now that
they're insulated, and I can't come up with a better idea than
drywall. I'm going to do this myself, probably with a helper who
will probably know less about hanging drywall than I do (which isn't
much...the white side faces out, right? ;-). Anyway, it appears that
the recommended way to do this is to do the ceiling first, then hang
the walls with the drywall parallel to the floor starting at the
ceiling and working down. However, to get this thing going, I'd
rather do the walls first. Then I would run the electric surface
mounted on the drywall. At some later date, I would drywall the
ceiling. My main question is: how big of a deal is doing the ceiling
after the walls? Also, it would be way easier in my mind to hang the
drywall vertically (parallel to the studs) rather than horizontally.
For this application, would it be OK? I'm open to any other
constructive comments regarding this plan.

Pegboard is light, easy to handle, and convenient. If you need to get
behind it, you just remove the mounting screws.
--
Steve B.
New Life Home Improvement

Last time I did the walls in my shop I used OSB. Fairly cheap but provided a
lot of wall space without having to look for studs when hanging things up.
run your wire on the outside in a conduit and it should be a snap.

Thom

"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message
.net...
"todd" wrote:

I need to get some kind of interior finish on my shop walls now that
they're
insulated, and I can't come up with a better idea than drywall.
I'm going
to do this myself,.............

Let me play the devil's advocate for a moment.

Ever consider using T&G siding.

Relatively low cost, you won't punch holes thru it, and you can pretty
much hang anything you want, anywhere you want.

Be a good idea to rough in the electrical under the siding under the
wall covering, whatever you use.

BTW, not my idea, NYW had project building a workshop in a garage that
used it.

YMMV.

Lew

I'm with Greg.

I have drywall and I like having a "finished" space to work in. I *know*
that my studs as 16" O/C because I put them there. They are easy to find
because they are on one side or the other of every outlet... thre wraps of
the knuckles and I know exactly where a stud is.

-Steve


"Greg O" wrote in message
...
I don't know what all the fuss about drywall is. Every shop I have had was
drywall and the next one will be too. No problems hanging anything on the
walls since the invention of the stud sensor. I have a couple friends that
put up wafer board. It took tons of primer to seal it, and the glues and
resin still sneak through in places. Plus drywall is a bit quieter than
wafer board. It seems to me their shops echo the noise off the walls more
than mine,
Greg



--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

I'd stick with drywall. If you do poke something through it, it is
easy to patch. Also provides more fire protection than OSB. Also less
flamable surface to catch on fire to begin with.
Take the time and do the electrical first. That way it won't be in
the way when you want to hang cabinets, etc.
Horizontal on the walls is better, IMHO.
Just to make things a little more complicated, some people use double
thick drywall. The outer sheet is glued to the inner sheet so there are
no fasteners.
I'd do the ceiling first. I get the feeling that you want to get
the walls done so you can move in sooner. That means you'd have to
move out to do the ceiling.

Pete Stanaitis
---------------------------

todd wrote:

I need to get some kind of interior finish on my shop walls now that they're
insulated, and I can't come up with a better idea than drywall. I'm going
to do this myself, probably with a helper who will probably know less about
hanging drywall than I do (which isn't much...the white side faces out,
right? ;-). Anyway, it appears that the recommended way to do this is to do
the ceiling first, then hang the walls with the drywall parallel to the
floor starting at the ceiling and working down. However, to get this thing
going, I'd rather do the walls first. Then I would run the electric surface
mounted on the drywall. At some later date, I would drywall the ceiling.
My main question is: how big of a deal is doing the ceiling after the walls?
Also, it would be way easier in my mind to hang the drywall vertically
(parallel to the studs) rather than horizontally. For this application,
would it be OK? I'm open to any other constructive comments regarding this
plan.

todd

Hi Todd,

I need to get some kind of interior finish on my shop walls
now that they're insulated

As other's have mentioned, your options are basically drywall, plywood,
or T&G boards.

I wouldn't suggest pegboard over bare insulation, since there would be
lots of holes leaving the flammable vapor barrier exposed. I doubt it
would meet code if you ever had the house inspected (for selling, or
whatever).

The nice thing about drywall is it's forgiving. If your cuts are less
than perfect, or your walls are out of square, you can fix it all up
during the taping stage. It's also a lot easier to fix later if you need
to cut a hole and patch it later, or if you relocate some shelving and
need to patch the screw holes left behind. Regardless of what you
install, you WILL damage it at some point, so repairs are something to
consider.

I used T&G for many of our ceilings, more for the appearance than the
strength or durability. It's less likely to be damaged on the ceiling
than it would be on the walls. However, you might want to check your
local codes. Many areas require a layer of drywall under T&G paneling, so
you might just be doubling your costs.

Also, keep in mind you can cut holes for electrical boxes or to fit
around beams or other projections easily in drywall. Just a utility knife
and/or a handheld drywall saw. If your measurements are off by a 1/4" or
so, you can patch it up during the taping stage. With T&G and plywood,
you'll have to be a lot more precise with your measurements and cuts. A
"mistake" will be there forever, or you'll have to recut a new sheet.

As for hanging things on the wall, most items like shelves or cabinets
will span more than a couple of stud bays anyway. Just use a studfinder
to locate the stud to screw the item to the wall. For smaller items
(sawhorses, extension cord reels, etc.) I like to make "racks" (kind of
like custom made coat hangers) and screw the rack to the wall, then hang
my items on the rack.

I'm going to do this myself, probably with a helper who will
probably know less about hanging drywall than I do (which isn't
much...the white side faces out, right? ;-).

My wife and I drywalled our 24x28 garage, as well as all of the walls in
our house. It's really not that hard once you've hung a few sheets. I
prefer screws over nails, every 6" around the edges, and every 12" in the
middle of the sheets (into the studs, of course).

Oh, and some drywall is white on both sides... Put the side with the
tapered edges out.

If you're installing more than a few sheets, I recommend contacting a
drywall supplier and have them deliver. Drywall is heavy and they can
deliver it right into the room you're working on. Sure beats loading it
onto the cart at the home center, loading it in the truck in the parking
lot, and unloading it when you get home. Unless you want the exercise,
save your strength for hanging the drywall. You can usually get lower
prices by buying in volume too.

the recommended way to do this is to do the ceiling first,
then hang the walls

I've done it both ways and haven't noticed much difference. The theory is
the wall sheets help support the ceiling sheets. But with a 24'x28'
ceiling, there are lots of edges that aren't supported by the walls. I
think the more important issue is proper backing. Before you hang the
walls or the ceilings, install blocking anywhere you think you'll need to
screw up a sheet of drywall (or nail T&G, or plywood).

it would be way easier in my mind to hang the drywall vertically

We hung ALL of our drywall vertically. I personally think it results in a
stronger installation, since all drywall edges are supported by studs and
top/bottom plates. It makes taping a little more interesting, climbing up
and down the ladder, but we hung 14' sheets vertically in our house and
it wasn't that big of a deal. Climb the ladder, tape the upper half, then
come down and tape the lower half. You have to climb up to hit all the
nail holes and the corner joints around the ceiling anyway, so it's not
that much difference.

The primary advantage of the horizontal approach is it results in less
"waviness" as you look across a long stretch of wall. You also don't end
up with any seam bumps when hanging cabinets or shelving. But like I
said, we did all our sheets vertically, and didn't notice problems with
either of those issues.

I would run the electric surface mounted on the drywall.

It would be better to run the electrical in the wall, as any exposed
conduit is going to collect dust, get in the way of installing cabinets
and whatnot, and be more vulnerable to damage. But, since you've already
insulated, it may be too late to consider that.

You mentioned you are required to have conduit in your area. Is PVC
conduit allowed? It's easy to work with, and non-conductive. You could
install the conduit in the walls now, and put the actual wiring in later
when time and money allows.

how big of a deal is doing the ceiling after the walls?

With proper backing for the sheet edges, no big deal at all.

(parallel to the studs) rather than horizontally.

Not a problem at all.

Have fun!

Anthony

Find a source for 3/8" roughsaw plywood siding. It goes
by the name "roughtex" in some circles. This makes an
excellent and tough wall for a shop.

You can paint it, but it looks find left natural.

T&G pine is also another method but it's slower to
install.

I would surface mount ALL electrical in conduit.
I used plastic conduit and stranded wire. Much easier
to deal with and it goes up quick.


todd wrote:

I need to get some kind of interior finish on my shop walls now that they're
insulated, and I can't come up with a better idea than drywall.

On Sun, 24 Jun 2007 23:38:35 -0500, "todd" wrote:

"Roger Shoaf" wrote in message
...

"todd" wrote in message
My main question is: how big of a deal is doing the ceiling after the
walls?

I think it would be no problem. Just be sure to leave yourself a gap of
the
right size.

I couldn't just do the walls all the way up and start the ceiling "inside"
the drywall on the walls?

Also, it would be way easier in my mind to hang the drywall vertically
(parallel to the studs) rather than horizontally. For this application,
would it be OK? I'm open to any other constructive comments regarding
this
plan.

How tall are you? If you hang horizontally, you have the big easy seam 4
feet off the ground and do not need to go up and down the ladder as much
when taping. You can also use 12 footers easier and potentially elimate
another seam or two.

I'm of average height and I also forgot to mention that these are 10-foot
walls. So, either way, somebody's getting on a ladder to tape, I imagine.
It still might be better to do it perpendicular to the studs, though. I'm
less worried about which way the walls go than I am putting the ceiling off
for now.

I'm pretty sure you can do both of what you are describing (walls
before ceiling, and vertical installation). The pros don't install
boards vertically because it is faster the other way and because you
get a better finish. Vertical edges are harder to feather than
horizontal edges. Unless your mudding job is perfect, the repeated
vertical edges every four feet will be visible through your finish,
and tend to be more distracting than a single edge four feet from the
floor.

The pros also hang the ceiling first, then butt the walls up to it
because it is possible (provided your ceiling joists are perfectly
level) to get perfect seams at the ceiling without stressing the
sheet. You will find it very hard to put the last sheet in without
leaving a gap of 1/4" or so if you hang the walls first.

HOWEVER, as any amateur who has ever hung drywall can tell you, enough
mud and enough sanding will fix all of these problems. You might get
cracks in the finish someday. So what? It's your shop, not your
dining room. You will almost certainly put a six-foot piece of walnut
through the wall someday, as well. That is why they made patching
compound.

That said, I would still recommend horizontal installation, because it
means you have to do less taping and muding. Taping sucks and should
be avoided at all costs.

Good luck with your upgrades.

- Ken



thanks for your response.

todd

You might need to use drywall for fire resistance. It's not
a great idea to have shop walls that are flammable.

todd wrote:

I hadn't considered T&G siding. I had considered plywood, though. The
siding would be a sight easier for me to deal with compared to the drywall.
I imagine it's at least double the material cost of drywall, but if I factor
in hiring out the drywall hanging like SWMBO wants to do, I might come out
ahead.

Although I didn't highlight it, I'm curious to get people's input on the
electrical. One thing to keep in mind is that here in the Chicago area,
I've got to run everything in metal conduit, so running wire inside the
walls isn't quite as easy as drilling some holes and pulling romex through.
I've read archive posts where people found it acceptable to surface mount in
a shop situation.

thanks for your input,

todd

Mike Berger wrote:
You might need to use drywall for fire resistance. It's not
a great idea to have shop walls that are flammable.

Some of the nicest hobby, educational, and small pro shops have T&G wood
walls and hardwood floors.

todd wrote:

Although I didn't highlight it, I'm curious to get people's input on
the electrical. One thing to keep in mind is that here in the Chicago
area, I've got to run everything in metal conduit, so running wire
inside the walls isn't quite as easy as drilling some holes and
pulling romex through.

Ah yes, the infamous Chicago code.

You can run BX in the walls. It is flexible, metal armored cable.

Ability to run conduit not required.

Yes it is more expensive than romex, but you are only talking about
one room.

Buy it by the full box, from an electrical supply house.

Buying cut lengths of wire is a good way to go broke in a hurry.

Try working up a total electrical package (BX cable, boxes, wiring
devices, etc) and giving it to an electrical supply house.

Might get a package price.

Lew


Lew

On Jun 25, 12:00 pm, Lew Hodgett wrote:
todd wrote:

Although I didn't highlight it, I'm curious to get people's input on
the electrical. One thing to keep in mind is that here in the Chicago
area, I've got to run everything in metal conduit, so running wire
inside the walls isn't quite as easy as drilling some holes and
pulling romex through.

Ah yes, the infamous Chicago code.

You can run BX in the walls. It is flexible, metal armored cable.

Ability to run conduit not required.

Yes it is more expensive than romex, but you are only talking about
one room.

Buy it by the full box, from an electrical supply house.

Buying cut lengths of wire is a good way to go broke in a hurry.

Try working up a total electrical package (BX cable, boxes, wiring
devices, etc) and giving it to an electrical supply house.

Might get a package price.

Lew

Lew

Per our local amendment: "All new interior electrical installations
shall be piped in rigid or EMT or (minimum) 1/2" Greenfield whips up
to 6'0" as needed. (BX armored cable is not permitted).".

So, no replacing the bulk of the conduit with Greenfield or any other
flexible conduit.

Todd,

I put up drywall, but that is your call. I suggest that for lighting,
be sure and consider track lights over where you think your tools will
be. If you add more power tools you can add to your tracks and put
light exactly where you want it. I used halogens over the work bench
and finally I could read my dimensions even in winter when it was dark
outside.

I also suggest you do the ceiling first. I like the idea of OSB. I
used drywall and used pegboard liberally. I hate having to look for a
tool and know I have it but can't find it.

Bill in New Mexico

That doesn't mean it's a good idea. The owners of those nice
shops are asking for trouble.

B A R R Y wrote:
Mike Berger wrote:
You might need to use drywall for fire resistance. It's not
a great idea to have shop walls that are flammable.

Some of the nicest hobby, educational, and small pro shops have T&G wood
walls and hardwood floors.

wrote:

Per our local amendment: "All new interior electrical installations
shall be piped in rigid or EMT or (minimum) 1/2" Greenfield whips up
to 6'0" as needed. (BX armored cable is not permitted).".

So, no replacing the bulk of the conduit with Greenfield or any other
flexible conduit.


The ghost of Hogan is still alive and well I see.

Got any buddies that are in the electrical business?

Lew

Mike Berger wrote:
That doesn't mean it's a good idea. The owners of those nice
shops are asking for trouble.

Even Norm has wooden shop walls. G

Seriously, though... Finishing area walls would probably be best
covered with fireproof material. Even a relatively clean shop is going
to have shavings, scraps, dust, and stored stock. Possibly enough fuel
to make the actual wall covering irrelevant during an unattended fire.

I'll agree that it's not work losing sleep over. If the hazards of a
wood wall covering bothers you more than drywall, than drywall it should be.

"Ken McIsaac" wrote in message
...

That said, I would still recommend horizontal installation, because it
means you have to do less taping and muding. Taping sucks and should
be avoided at all costs.


I generally run my sheets vertically to avoid the butt joints that come with
laying it horizontally. Seams are going to be there no matter what - you
can't put two pieces of sheet together without seams. Edge seams at least,
finish easier than butt joints.

--

-Mike-

Mike Berger wrote:
You might need to use drywall for fire resistance. It's not
a great idea to have shop walls that are flammable.
....

That's being paranoid to a fault. In a frame building, the wall surface
itself is pretty immaterial.

If one is really concerned w/ a fire hazard in a shop, the most
important areas are a fire-resistant storage area for flammables and
passive sprinkler systems plus detection systems ideally connected to
local responder.

--

On Jun 24, 9:05 pm, "todd" wrote:
... I can't come up with a better idea than drywall. Then I would
run the electric surface mounted on the drywall.

Gee, your code calls for EMT inside walls of a finished area?
Anywhere else, it's considered fire-safe to put sheetrock over
Romex.

Anyway, drywall is good except for load-bearing mounts, so consider
a couple of rails of wood or other trim horizontally at (for instance)
bench and eye height. You could use Unistrut/Superstrut channel
for this, too (and it'd be a handy way to clamp your surface
electrical boxes). When you want to mount a heavy item to
the wall (pegboard o'hammers!) just clamp into the
unistrut or screw into the (clearly visible) wood rail.

Also, since you have high ceilings, consider putting a couple of
sturdy boxes on the ceiling, with dangling sockets-on-a-cable.
When some new tool goes into the center of the shop, this lets
you plug it in without any tripwires on the shop floor. Twistlock
sockets are preferred. I've seen some areas with island
workstations connected this way, it's neat!

whit3rd wrote:


Gee, your code calls for EMT inside walls of a finished area?
Anywhere else, it's considered fire-safe to put sheetrock over
Romex.


The NEC applies everywhere except Chicago, where what is known as
"Hogan's code" is in effect.

If you supply equipment to Chicago, you factor "Hogan's code" into the
price.

At least that's what used to be the case.

Lew

In article .com,
bill wrote:

Todd,

I put up drywall, but that is your call. I suggest that for lighting,
be sure and consider track lights over where you think your tools will
be. If you add more power tools you can add to your tracks and put
light exactly where you want it. I used halogens over the work bench
and finally I could read my dimensions even in winter when it was dark
outside.

I also suggest you do the ceiling first. I like the idea of OSB. I
used drywall and used pegboard liberally. I hate having to look for a
tool and know I have it but can't find it.

Bill in New Mexico

I found a reasonable source for slatwall on craigslist and will be using
that to surface my shop when it gets finished in a couple of months.
It's normally exorbitant when compared to drywall. With the craigslist
deal it was merely expensive.

"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message
.net...
whit3rd wrote:


Gee, your code calls for EMT inside walls of a finished area?
Anywhere else, it's considered fire-safe to put sheetrock over
Romex.


The NEC applies everywhere except Chicago, where what is known as "Hogan's
code" is in effect.

If you supply equipment to Chicago, you factor "Hogan's code" into the
price.

At least that's what used to be the case.

Lew

To be honest, I've never heard it referred to as "Hogan's code", but from
other discussions I've read here and elsewhere, the residential electrical
code around here has to be just about the most strict in the country. I've
always assumed the rules are in place to protect union electricians. Every
time I see a home improvement show where people are running Romex, I think
"yeah, that would be easier".

todd

todd wrote:


To be honest, I've never heard it referred to as "Hogan's code",
but from
other discussions I've read here and elsewhere, the residential
electrical
code around here has to be just about the most strict in the
country. I've
always assumed the rules are in place to protect union
electricians. Every
time I see a home improvement show where people are running Romex,
I think
"yeah, that would be easier".


You may not have heard of Hogan. More than 30 years ago he was chief
electrical inspector for the City of Chicago.

Among other things, he would not permit molded case c'bkrs
(100A-1200A) to be used in panelboards, everything had to be switch
and fuse which meant 600A max.

Gives a whole new meaning to electrical distribution design.

I had customers who sold equipment with large electrical motor control
panels to Chicago area customers.

Most of those control panels would not meet Hogans without a complete
redesign which just wasn't work it.

The solution was "The Bull", AKA the UL bullseye.

Use all UL listed devices, then bring in an electrician from a UL
listed control panel builder, pay him $100 to connect one wire and
then attach the UL Bullseye.

All very legal and it solved a problem since Hogan accepted UL listed
equipment.

At the time the whole process seemed so "Chicago", pay the graft and
get the job done.


Lew

"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message
k.net...

At the time the whole process seemed so "Chicago", pay the graft and get
the job done.


Lew

Don't worry, Lew. They've cleaned all of that up. No more shady stuff like
that in the city anymore. Riiiiight.

todd

todd wrote:


Don't worry, Lew. They've cleaned all of that up. No more shady
stuff like
that in the city anymore. Riiiiight.

And if you think I believe that, we should get together and talk about
some swampland over in Arizona.

As the used car dealers in Florida used to say, "Son, step right in
and let me show you a couple of clean northern cars we just got".


Lew

"Scott Zrubek" wrote

I found a reasonable source for slatwall on craigslist and will be using
that to surface my shop when it gets finished in a couple of months.
It's normally exorbitant when compared to drywall. With the craigslist
deal it was merely expensive.

Slatwall??

Isn't that stuff the ultimate dustcatcher?

Ken,

I would still recommend horizontal installation

Unless your drywall sheets are long enough to span from one side of the
room to the other, you'll end up with non-tapered butt joints somewhere
along the wall. These are MUCH harder to tape and hide without a visible
bulge. By hanging the sheet vertically, you always have tapered edges where
sheets meet up, making the taping job a lot easier.

Anthony

HerHusband writes:
Ken,

I would still recommend horizontal installation

Unless your drywall sheets are long enough to span from one side of the
room to the other, you'll end up with non-tapered butt joints somewhere
along the wall. These are MUCH harder to tape and hide without a visible
bulge. By hanging the sheet vertically, you always have tapered edges where
sheets meet up, making the taping job a lot easier.

Anthony

A sureform tool makes a quick taper on the butt-ends before you hang
the sheets if needed. Score the paper and a few quick swipes of the tool. Useful
also when patching.

scott