In article , Doctor Evil
writes

I know lots of tradesmen, I come in contact with them regularly and many
swear by Kress (Wickes). The woodworkers and kitchen fitters tend top go for
Makita, DeWalt and Trend. They are a frightened to change from those makes
even though many will tell you they have to get them repaired more often
than what they would like too.

This depends where you are situated though John, the tradesmen around
here have not even heard of Wickes (the nearest one is about 40 miles
away) and I have certainly not seen Kress on the sites that I visit
--
David

Kaiser wrote:
Why do you keep changing my name, one minute its Mr Cheese, then Mt Cheese
and now Mr Chesse?


His spelling is "unique" ( maybe it changes with the weather?).

Regards
Capitol

In article ,
Doctor Evil wrote:
The tosh continues....

BMC - basically the amalgamation between
Austin and the Nuffield group
took place in the early '50s.

So you have no idea about history - as everything else? And I thought you
could at least do a search.

Get a life.

--
*To be intoxicated is to feel sophisticated, but not be able to say it.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

wrote in message
...
In article , Doctor Evil
writes

I know lots of tradesmen, I come in contact with them regularly and many
swear by Kress (Wickes). The woodworkers and kitchen fitters tend top go
for
Makita, DeWalt and Trend. They are a frightened to change from those
makes
even though many will tell you they have to get them repaired more often
than what they would like too.

This depends where you are situated though John, the tradesmen around
here have not even heard of Wickes (the nearest one is about 40 miles
away) and I have certainly not seen Kress on the sites that I visit

Bertie, I saw one maintenance plumber with a cheapo grey PP battery drill.
He did the problems on new homes after hand over. The walls were all
lightweight block, so a powerful hammer he didn't need. He was delighted
with it as it cost only few quid and did the job well.

Kress were sold by BMJ Power who went belly up. They were also B&D dealers
who did service on a number of makes, inc Bosch if I recall. They had
outlets all over the country. Kress in the UK is now limited to Wickes
re-badges, unless someone else has come in with a dealership. I know Kress
were looking for a UK dealer for the Kress brand. They have a great
swivelling chuck drill that converts to an angle drill, but not available in
the UK as Kress are dealerless.
http://www.kress-elektrik.de/en/prod...?categorie=443

They shift so much stuff through Wickes it is probably not worth getting
involved with another dealer who might go belly up too. The sheds rule. The
sheds saw off BMJ Power, who had some great guaranteed re-conn deals of
Kress, Bosch, DeWalt, etc. I still have a 25 year old re-con B&D hammer
drill from BMJ that is still going.



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"Capitol" wrote in message
...


Kaiser wrote:
Why do you keep changing my name, one minute its Mr Cheese, then Mt
Cheese
and now Mr Chesse?


His spelling is "unique"

No, my spelling is cheese not unique.



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John Rumm wrote:

The greater the inertia of the projectile, the more energy you are
likely to lose at the point of impact (noise, heat, vibration,
deformation of the components etc), and the less forward velocity you
will impart on it. The more vibration etc, the more energy dissipated
into the operator which is both inefficient and fatiguing.


The reasoning is a bit cockeyed here. The reason you don't want a drill
chuck, is because the drill chuck mechanism cannot handle the high
impact loads without the jaws of the chuck slipping and the chuck
mechanism being damaged. The energy imparted to the tip of the drill bit
in a normal chuck, will to a first approximation, be the same. This is
why SDS drill chucks are specifically barred from impact usage.

Regards
Capitol

In article .com,
wrote:
Dave,

Andy may be better informed about some things than John. It doesn't
mean he's always right, it doesn't mean he should never be criticised,
and it doesn't give him the right to hector others in that
condescending way.

Mike - do a Google on these two. The resident fool - Adam, IMM, Dr Evil
etc - real name John - trys to be top dog on everything in this group and
fails miserably. He *claims* to be a pro and therefore better than all
others, but fails at nearly every jump. Which is sad, because he has a
fairly comprehensive knowledge of many central heating products gleaned
from extensive web site and advertising research. Ie, he reads and quotes
catalogues. In that, he is a pro. Pity he couldn't just stick to that, as
he'd have the respect of others for this application.

But when others give chapter and verse on practical applications of
products of which he has absolutely no clue, he resorts to insults. With
the language of an idiot.

A quick search will give you the full story - if you have some basic
knowledge.

--
*I didn't fight my way to the top of the food chain to be a vegetarian.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Mark wrote:
The more difficult - ie harder types of concrete or masonry will
laugh at a hammer drill and masonry bit - you need SDS.

Hmm perhaps you would like to explain to anyone still interested in this
thread from a technical point of view, why this is so ?

I'd go back to watching Playschool if I were you.

--
*OK, who stopped payment on my reality check?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Doctor Evil wrote:

The tosh continues....

BMC - basically the amalgamation between
Austin and the Nuffield group
took place in the early '50s.

More tosh...

So you have no idea about history - as everything else? And I thought you
could at least do a search.

...and more tosh again....

Get a life.

...sad isn't it.. Very sad.



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Andy wrote;
Panasonic has very good battery technology which may be important if
the maximum activity between charges is the primary consideration.
On
the other hand, the motor control is not quite as good as that of
Makita. Therefore, on balance, I prefer Makita's offering, but it is
not based on price.

What a ****! Does this make the slightest bit of difference to anyone!

Do you spell anal retentive with a hyphen or not?

Dave

Capitol wrote:

The reasoning is a bit cockeyed here. The reason you don't want a
drill chuck, is because the drill chuck mechanism cannot handle the high
impact loads without the jaws of the chuck slipping and the chuck
mechanism being damaged. The energy imparted to the tip of the drill bit
in a normal chuck, will to a first approximation, be the same. This is
why SDS drill chucks are specifically barred from impact usage.

This is very true, I was not attempting to suggest you _could_ even use
a conventional chuck, for just the reasons you cite.

However if you could and were to increase the effective mass of the bit
by a factor of (at least) five, you will also increase energy losses at
the point of transfer. You are going to get those losses at some point
in the system, so better they are at the drill to wall interface.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 3 Mar 2005 15:56:44 -0800, "Magician"
wrote:

Andy wrote;
Panasonic has very good battery technology which may be important if
the maximum activity between charges is the primary consideration.
On
the other hand, the motor control is not quite as good as that of
Makita. Therefore, on balance, I prefer Makita's offering, but it is
not based on price.

What a ****!

You certainly seem to be, when you make remarks like that......


Does this make the slightest bit of difference to anyone!

To somebody selecting between these two manufacturers it might well.




--

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

In article . com,
Magician writes
Andy wrote;
Panasonic has very good battery technology which may be important if
the maximum activity between charges is the primary consideration.
On
the other hand, the motor control is not quite as good as that of
Makita. Therefore, on balance, I prefer Makita's offering, but it is
not based on price.

What a ****! Does this make the slightest bit of difference to anyone!

Obviously not to you, which says it all really...
--
David

In article , Doctor Evil
writes

wrote in message
.. .
In article , Doctor Evil
writes

I know lots of tradesmen, I come in contact with them regularly and many
swear by Kress (Wickes). The woodworkers and kitchen fitters tend top go
for
Makita, DeWalt and Trend. They are a frightened to change from those
makes
even though many will tell you they have to get them repaired more often
than what they would like too.

This depends where you are situated though John, the tradesmen around
here have not even heard of Wickes (the nearest one is about 40 miles
away) and I have certainly not seen Kress on the sites that I visit

Bertie, I saw one maintenance plumber with a cheapo grey PP battery drill.
He did the problems on new homes after hand over. The walls were all
lightweight block, so a powerful hammer he didn't need. He was delighted
with it as it cost only few quid and did the job well.

I thought this was the case, you are talking about plumbers who probably
aren't that bothered about the power tools that they use at all, they
probably think more about the tools specific to plumbing like benders,
cutters etc than they do about a drill. The trades that depend on decent
power tools to give accuracy, performance and reliability will pay out
more and get quality gear.


Kress were sold by BMJ Power who went belly up. They were also B&D dealers
who did service on a number of makes, inc Bosch if I recall. They had
outlets all over the country. Kress in the UK is now limited to Wickes
re-badges, unless someone else has come in with a dealership. I know Kress
were looking for a UK dealer for the Kress brand. They have a great
swivelling chuck drill that converts to an angle drill, but not available in
the UK as Kress are dealerless.
http://www.kress-elektrik.de/en/prod...?categorie=443

They shift so much stuff through Wickes it is probably not worth getting
involved with another dealer who might go belly up too. The sheds rule. The
sheds saw off BMJ Power, who had some great guaranteed re-conn deals of
Kress, Bosch, DeWalt, etc. I still have a 25 year old re-con B&D hammer
drill from BMJ that is still going.

I suspect Kress just did a deal with Wickes (as I did in the past)
--
David

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On 3 Mar 2005 15:56:44 -0800, "Magician"
wrote:

Andy wrote;
Panasonic has very good battery technology which may be important if
the maximum activity between charges is the primary consideration.
On
the other hand, the motor control is not quite as good as that of
Makita. Therefore, on balance, I prefer Makita's offering, but it is
not based on price.

What a ****!

You certainly seem to be, when you make remarks like that......

Of course you would know all about that.


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wrote in message
...
In article , Doctor Evil
writes

wrote in message
.. .
In article , Doctor Evil
writes

I know lots of tradesmen, I come in contact with them regularly and
many
swear by Kress (Wickes). The woodworkers and kitchen fitters tend top
go
for
Makita, DeWalt and Trend. They are a frightened to change from those
makes
even though many will tell you they have to get them repaired more
often
than what they would like too.

This depends where you are situated though John, the tradesmen around
here have not even heard of Wickes (the nearest one is about 40 miles
away) and I have certainly not seen Kress on the sites that I visit

Bertie, I saw one maintenance plumber with a cheapo grey PP battery
drill.
He did the problems on new homes after hand over. The walls were all
lightweight block, so a powerful hammer he didn't need. He was delighted
with it as it cost only few quid and did the job well.

I thought this was the case, you are talking
about plumbers who probably
aren't that bothered about the power tools
that they use at all, they probably think more
about the tools specific to plumbing like benders,
cutters etc than they do about a drill. The trades
that depend on decent power tools to give
accuracy, performance and reliability will pay out
more and get quality gear.

Plumbers who work in existing homes care about power tools as it makes life
far easier for them. They are forever drilling holes, large and small. On
sites the large holes are done for them for the flues, as the brickkies
leave a sleeve in the wall. They need to drill paramount boards and block,
to mount rads and clips which doesn't even need a hammer dill.

This particular maintenance plumber bought the cheapo afer his expensive
DeWalt packed up. He had an Hitachi core drill. He knew he didn't need a
light drill that can be heavily used and abused day in day out and bought
this cheapy for a few quid. If he did required that level of performance he
would have to go out buy a drill that can handle that level of usage. Wise
man.



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Nobody seems to have considered the fact that tradesmen abuse tools, so pro
ranges are partly designed with this in mind.
There is a middle ground where you can spend bugger all on the tool but look
after it, and spend some of the money you've saved on new bits etc. Giving
the tool less work to do, rather than using it less often, can be a good
compromise.
I recently watched somebody burn a drill out (and lay himself out with a bad
back for several days) all for the sake of a £2 masonry bit. I suspect I
could have drilled those holes with a 9V cordless and a bit that wasn't
totally rounded off at the tip.
I agree with Andy that good tools are easier and more rewarding to use, but
I'm also a great believer in having, for example, 2 or 3 drills on the go at
once. That way you don't spend half the time looking for bits, and the
workload is spread between the tools.

"Stuart Noble" wrote in message
...

I'm also a great believer in having,
for example, 2 or 3 drills on the go at
once. That way you don't spend half
the time looking for bits, and the
workload is spread between the tools.

That is what I do. Having three £200 drills is very expensive. I find these
quick change chucks for drivers and drills very handy and can save having
two on the go and just one.



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On 3 Mar 2005 03:37:15 -0800, (timegoesby)
wrote:

wrote in message
oups.com...


snip great post

If only more of IMM's posts were like that he wouldn't get so much
stick.

He's sometimes a very good source of ideas and information but not
advice, as he often recommmends his ideas to be best in all
circumstances to the point of absurdity. Then when people disagree he
drags them into an argument with his trademark childish abuse.

The only reason he changed his name is because he lost his
individual.net account for all the snip drivel type abuse, for that
he's only got himself to blame.

cheers,
Pete

In article ,
Mark wrote:
So the criteria of a SDS chuck in itself Is irrelevant, otherwise we
would never been able to drill a hole in hard masonry before its
invention.

DIY wise, you used a Rawltool and a heavy hammer

Obviously (before im corrected) if you increase the percussion energy
beyond a certain point, a drill bit in a 3jaw chuck will slip and
rotate, but SDS does not define the suitability of the drill for the job.

In practice, it does.

--
*Oh, what a tangled website we weave when first we practice *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Tony Bryer wrote:
BMC - basically the amalgamation between Austin and the Nuffield
group took place in the early '50s.

Manufacturing yes. Dealerships no.

snip

I'm not arguing that point as you're right. Just trying to correct IMM's
usual inaccurate account of history.

--
*Some people are only alive because it is illegal to kill.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Doctor Evil wrote:
Not at all. You buy the tool to suit the job. Buying a £100 Makita to
sit in the cupboard all year is a really silly idea.

As is buying any cordless drill for this - because when you take it out to
use it the battery will be flat. Better to have a 10 quid mains drill and
an extension lying around - you'll be up and running to drill that once a
year hole much quicker.

An other example of John not understanding DIY.

--
*Xerox and Wurlitzer will merge to market reproductive organs.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Doctor Evil wrote:
BMC - basically the amalgamation between
Austin and the Nuffield group
took place in the early '50s.

More tosh...

Ok, prat. Give chapter and verse on the formation of BMC. As if...

--
*Eschew obfuscation *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Doctor Evil wrote:
This particular maintenance plumber bought the cheapo afer his expensive
DeWalt packed up. He had an Hitachi core drill. He knew he didn't need a
light drill that can be heavily used and abused day in day out and
bought this cheapy for a few quid. If he did required that level of
performance he would have to go out buy a drill that can handle that
level of usage. Wise man.

You must work in an industry where time and efficiency just don't matter.
But of course we knew that, since you don't work in any industry at all.

Over the past few weeks we've had many freelance chippies on a 'film'
location, and not one has arrived with anything other than a pro quality
cordless drill. With Makita being the favourite.
Of course, they have to earn their living by their work - not by quoting
maker's specs gleaned from websites. Go figure.

--
*Nostalgia isn't what is used to be.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Doctor Evil wrote:
BMC - basically the amalgamation between
Austin and the Nuffield group
took place in the early '50s.

More tosh...

Ok, prat. Give chapter and verse on the formation of BMC. As if...

Richard, who cares it was crap and rightly disappeared.


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"Pete C" wrote in message
...
On 3 Mar 2005 03:37:15 -0800, (timegoesby)
wrote:

wrote in message
oups.com...


snip great post

If only more of IMM's posts were like that he wouldn't get so much
stick.

That wasn't IMMs post. Have you been taking Plowman pills?

He's sometimes a very good source of ideas and information but not
advice, as he often recommmends his ideas to be best in all
circumstances to the point of absurdity.

His ideas are the best. He said so.

Then when people disagree he
drags them into an argument with
his trademark childish abuse.

You can't allow loonies suggest nonsense.

The only reason he changed his name
is because he ......

.....is now Doctor Evil. Cor! Can't you see that.



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"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Tony Bryer wrote:
BMC - basically the amalgamation between Austin and the Nuffield
group took place in the early '50s.

Manufacturing yes. Dealerships no.

snip

I'm not arguing that point as you're right. Just trying to correct IMM's
usual inaccurate account of history.

Doctor Evil knows more about history than anyone else.


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In article ,
Doctor Evil wrote:
BMC - basically the amalgamation between
Austin and the Nuffield group
took place in the early '50s.

More tosh...

Ok, prat. Give chapter and verse on the formation of BMC. As if...

Richard, who cares it was crap and rightly disappeared.

Wonder who Richard is, John?

But you brought up BMC. Merely trying to put the record straight for
anyone who is interested. Which tends to have to happen with most of your
posts. Strange, really, considering they are just regurgitations of
websites. Perhaps you need to read them more carefully.

--
*Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Doctor Evil wrote:
The only reason he changed his name
is because he ......

....is now Doctor Evil. Cor! Can't you see that.

Strange that you're the only regular poster on here who needs to morph
every few years? Changing identities has long been a habit of the criminal
classes. What have you been up to?

--
*Why do the two "sanction"s (noun and verb) mean opposites?*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Doctor Evil wrote:
I'm not arguing that point as you're right. Just trying to correct
IMM's usual inaccurate account of history.

Doctor Evil knows more about history than anyone else.

Thought you might have turned over a new leaf with your new identity?
Otherwise, why bother?

Hint. To think you know more about *anything* than anyone else makes you
some sort of fanatic. So nothing has changed.

--
*How many roads must a man travel down before he admits he is lost?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Doctor Evil wrote:
BMC - basically the amalgamation between
Austin and the Nuffield group
took place in the early '50s.

More tosh...

Ok, prat. Give chapter and verse on the formation of BMC. As if...

Richard, who cares it was crap and rightly disappeared.

Wonder who Richard is, John?

Mr Cranium, you must stop this.



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"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Doctor Evil wrote:
The only reason he changed his name
is because he ......

....is now Doctor Evil. Cor! Can't you see that.

Strange that you're the only regular poster on here who needs to morph
every few years? Changing identities has long been a habit of the criminal
classes. What have you been up to?

Cor! It is obvious I am an secret agent and I have to keep the IMM identity
secure.


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"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Doctor Evil wrote:
I'm not arguing that point as you're right. Just trying to correct
IMM's usual inaccurate account of history.

Doctor Evil knows more about history than anyone else.

Thought you might have turned over a new leaf with your new identity?
Otherwise, why bother?

Hint. To think you know more about *anything* than anyone else makes you
some sort of fanatic. So nothing has changed.

No. I have fanatics following me, called fans for short.



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