wrote:
On Jun 8, 10:28 am, wrote:
'Varnish Makers and Painter's' naptha is the only way
I've found for removing baked-on grease from metal surfaces:http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarest...t-thinners/vm-...

It's disappeared from the shelves at all the hardware stores in
my area. Some now carry a 'substitute' product in gallon cans,
but I don't want to spend over 20 bucks and then have to drive
it to Hazmat Disposal if it works as well as do most
'substitutes'.

What's a practical alternative? Gasoline?

Thanks!

--Winston

At a guess, you're in CA and CARB has struck yet again at the VOC
chimera. Gasoline isn't a substitute for paint prep, even the
leadless stuff you get these days has additives. Also a lot more
hazardous to use as a solvent.

Used to watch my father clean carburetor parts in straight
gasoline with a lit cigarette dangling from his mouth.

Amazing.

In other, less controlled areas of the
country, V.M.& P. naptha is on the hardware store shelves, although
not as cheap as it used to be before the present oil-supply
manipulations. If there are any left out there, you might see what
the body shop suppliers sell for paint prep. Probably water-based,
but it might do a job of degreasing. For cooking greases, lye-based
cleaners work, assuming no aluminum in the area. I get dollar store
oven cleaner to clean off the stainless parts of the grill. Just need
to let it set more the longer the stuff has been cooked on. For wheel
bearing grease and the like, it's already soap, lye won't do much for
that and you'll need some kind of solvent. Finding one in CA that
CARB hasn't banned will be the trick.

Indeed. Thanks, Stan.

--Winston

Pete C. wrote:

Rich Grise wrote:

Winston wrote:
PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

(...)

Coleman fuel AKA white gas

Forgive my faux pas.

I didn't mention that I wasn't able to locate this stuff
under any of it's synonyms, either.
White Spirit
Coleman Fuel
White Gas (I remember when that was available at the *gas station*.
Etc etc.

"White gas" was just unleaded, which they all have now, but before
I tried gasoline, and if you really really can't find any lighter
fluid, I'd try acetone or MEK (Methyl-ethyl ketone).

Ah! I shall add acetone to the list. 'Still have some of that,
though naptha is *much* gentler.

Good Luck!
Rich

"White gas", is similar to unleaded, but a bit more refined and without
the additives in unleaded highway gas.

Naptha is volatile as all getout.
Has a different aroma than eu de unleaded.
Must be the additives.

--Winston

Doug White wrote:

(...)

I've had very good luck with "lacquer thinner" from a paint store.

That was about the first solvent I tried.
It's terrific on 'wet' grease but the baked - on stuff
reacts as if I was using plain water. Nada.

Lots of folks have mentioned lighter fluid, and that works very well,

Indeed it does.

but it's a bit less agressive than lacquer thinner.

It's less aggressive in a good way, and 'way more aggressive
in a good way, in a way.

Your problem may be that California has banned almost any volatile
solvent known to man. They are know to cause brain damage in
politicians. Ooops, too late...

Solvent: If it was effective, it would be illegal.

--Winston

"Winston" wrote in message
...
Ed Huntress wrote:

FWIW, as a purple cleaner, oven cleaner, and gasoline user, I'd try them
in
that order, unless you don't mind the gasoline fumes, in which case that
would be second.

I mix my own oven cleaner for cleaning my charcoal grill but it's a
bugger
to get straight lye these days. The only over-the-counter retail source
I've
seen identified by others is Roebic Crystal Drain Cleaner, which I buy
from
Lowe's at $11.00 for two poundsouch!! It's now $1.98 for two pounds
online, under different names, but then I pay $10 shipping. d8-(

I do buy 20 pounds or so at a time online once in a while. You want 100%
sodium hydroxide crystals or pellets; mix 20% with water by weight; dump
in
some diatomaceous earth to make it stick a little to the grill. You can
use
potassium hydroxide but it's more expensive.

Mix 40% for cleaning drains, and stand back...At 40%, it's like thin
syrup.

Copied to disk and printed.

Thanks again Ed!

--Winston

You're welcome. Pencil this in: To the 20% plus d. earth formula, add enough
fumed silica to make soup, and use it to strip paint. Whole houses. I did my
whole porch with it.

It's slow with latex paints -- like, two days -- but fairly quick with
alkyd/oil/varnish. And it's cheap, with no methylene chloride fumes.
Neutralize with a dilute oxalic acid mix before painting. This stripper
treatment is used in historic-house restorations.

--
Ed Huntress

Ed Huntress wrote:
wrote in message
...
Pete C. wrote:
Winston wrote:
Pete C. wrote:
Winston wrote:
Pete C. wrote:
(...)

Camp stove / lantern fuel might be a viable substitute that would be
better than highway gasoline.
I agree. It's unobtainium here in SF Bay Area.
Thanks!
Time to move to the free world...
They have *weather* in the free world. (Shudder).

Dunno, I like it here in Texas, particularly the weather. I've been to
SF a few times and it's certainly had "weather" when I've been there.

+1

It's warm here now.

It was 97 F a few hours ago here. Tomorrow, 100 F.

It feels like Texas, without the armadillos.

72 F and 48 % RH for most of the day.
I *love* this place!

--Winston

Ed Huntress wrote:
"CaveLamb" wrote in message
...
Pete C. wrote:
Winston wrote:
Pete C. wrote:
Winston wrote:
Pete C. wrote:
(...)

Camp stove / lantern fuel might be a viable substitute that would be
better than highway gasoline.
I agree. It's unobtainium here in SF Bay Area.
Thanks!
Time to move to the free world...
They have *weather* in the free world. (Shudder).
Dunno, I like it here in Texas, particularly the weather. I've been to
SF a few times and it's certainly had "weather" when I've been there.
+1

It's warm here now.

It was 97 F a few hours ago here. Tomorrow, 100 F.

It feels like Texas, without the armadillos.


Yeah.
They are cute, specially curled up with a Lone Star Long Neck,
but they aren't exactly cuddly...

We hit 99 for the first time this year early last week.
Last year we had three 99 degree days in June, all in the last ten days.
Looks like Global Warming (tm) is back!
Maybe it's just Texas Warming?

When I went to work in Delaware (early '80s) it was Christmas time.
Six feet of snow on the ground, and me just up from Dallas.
Burrrr. I spent the first couple of weeks after work in a hot bath!

Then spring came - for a week.

Then it went to 100 degrees and 100 percent humidity.
Might as well have been in Houston!

Strangest things, NOBODY had air conditioning!


--

Richard Lamb
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~sv_temptress

Gunner Asch wrote:
On Wed, 08 Jun 2011 11:48:16 -0500, "Pete
wrote:

(...)

Camp stove / lantern fuel might be a viable substitute that would be
better than highway gasoline.

Coleman fuel is high quality naptha..just a heads up.

Yup.

'Can't buy it for love nor money, though.

--Winston

Rich Grise wrote:
Winston wrote:

'Varnish Makers and Painter's' naptha is the only way
I've found for removing baked-on grease from metal surfaces:

http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarest...er-618030.aspx

It's disappeared from the shelves at all the hardware stores in
my area. Some now carry a 'substitute' product in gallon cans,
but I don't want to spend over 20 bucks and then have to drive
it to Hazmat Disposal if it works as well as do most
'substitutes'.

What's a practical alternative? Gasoline?

Ronsonol or Zippo lighter fluid. It's almost pure naphtha - it will
even get gum out of hair.

It's great stuff.

I advise ya'all to stock up before you get hit with the
same wave of regulation.

--Winston

Ed Huntress wrote:
"Winston" wrote in message
...
Ed Huntress wrote:

FWIW, as a purple cleaner, oven cleaner, and gasoline user, I'd try them
in
that order, unless you don't mind the gasoline fumes, in which case that
would be second.

I mix my own oven cleaner for cleaning my charcoal grill but it's a
bugger
to get straight lye these days. The only over-the-counter retail source
I've
seen identified by others is Roebic Crystal Drain Cleaner, which I buy
from
Lowe's at $11.00 for two poundsouch!! It's now $1.98 for two pounds
online, under different names, but then I pay $10 shipping. d8-(

I do buy 20 pounds or so at a time online once in a while. You want 100%
sodium hydroxide crystals or pellets; mix 20% with water by weight; dump
in
some diatomaceous earth to make it stick a little to the grill. You can
use
potassium hydroxide but it's more expensive.

Mix 40% for cleaning drains, and stand back...At 40%, it's like thin
syrup.
Copied to disk and printed.

Thanks again Ed!

--Winston

You're welcome. Pencil this in: To the 20% plus d. earth formula, add enough
fumed silica to make soup, and use it to strip paint. Whole houses. I did my
whole porch with it.

It's slow with latex paints -- like, two days -- but fairly quick with
alkyd/oil/varnish. And it's cheap, with no methylene chloride fumes.
Neutralize with a dilute oxalic acid mix before painting. This stripper
treatment is used in historic-house restorations.



I'll give that a try, Ed.
It's got to be better, cheaper, and safer than that junk I used last time!


--

Richard Lamb
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~sv_temptress

Ed Huntress wrote:
wrote in message
...

(...)

Copied to disk and printed.

Thanks again Ed!

--Winston

You're welcome. Pencil this in: To the 20% plus d. earth formula, add enough
fumed silica to make soup, and use it to strip paint. Whole houses. I did my
whole porch with it.

It's slow with latex paints -- like, two days -- but fairly quick with
alkyd/oil/varnish. And it's cheap, with no methylene chloride fumes.
Neutralize with a dilute oxalic acid mix before painting. This stripper
treatment is used in historic-house restorations.

Cool! Thanks again, again.

--Winston

On Jun 8, 12:28*pm, Winston wrote:
'Varnish Makers and Painter's' naptha is the only way
I've found for removing baked-on grease from metal surfaces:http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarest...t-thinners/vm-...

It's disappeared from the shelves at all the hardware stores in
my area. *Some now carry a 'substitute' product in gallon cans,
but I don't want to spend over 20 bucks and then have to drive
it to Hazmat Disposal if it works as well as do most
'substitutes'.

What's a practical alternative? *Gasoline?

Thanks!

--Winston

I would try some of that citrus based solvent. Lockheed down in
Sunnyvale went to using that from trich. It is not very fast but does
not evaporate rapidly. Lockheed had some trouble with the citrus
solvent softening cured epoxy about 12 hours after using the citrus
based solvent.

Dan

wrote:

(...)

I would try some of that citrus based solvent. Lockheed down in
Sunnyvale went to using that from trich. It is not very fast but does
not evaporate rapidly. Lockheed had some trouble with the citrus
solvent softening cured epoxy about 12 hours after using the citrus
based solvent.

Cool!

I will give that a try. Thanks!

--Winston

I'd be thinking kerosene, instead of gasoline. Kero
evaporates more slowly, and much less flammable. Sorry you
aren't finding naptha as camp stove fuel. I'd be tempted to
buy a gallon of camp stove fuel and try it out, as
degreaser. Might be just relabelled.

Purple degreaser can be found at HVAC / R supply houses,
under brand names like Alkli Foam, or Nu Brite. Hydroxide
and some soap. Usual precautions, gloves, safety goggles,
etc. If it gets on skin, it turns oil to soap, makes the
skin slippery. A splash of diluted vinegar makes your skin
feel normal again.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Winston" wrote in message
...
Pete C. wrote:

(....)

I've used the purple degreaser to remove years of grease
buildup from a
Hobart mixer, and buildup on baking sheets and waffle
irons. The purple
stuff is lye based and will dissolve bodies if the need
arises.

That is the best recommendation I've ever seen!

OK, Purple cleaner and Oven cleaner are next to try.

Thanks!

--Winston

Dunno what your term *grease* means.. but if you're referring to a cooking
area or pans with vegetable oil and/or meat fat spatter that's formed a
plastic-like build-up, then a couple of things will work fairly
effortlessly.

Automotive solvents or household ammonia will break the film loose. Naptha
may also be available in a solvent used as an autobody refinishing prep
cleaner known as "wax and grease remover" from an automotive refinishing
supplier.

Carb cleaners may still contain the xylene or toluene solvents that will
effectively dissolve cooking residues.

Either of the automotive solvents will work more easily if used in the way
described for ammonia. Extreme caution should be exercised for the solvents'
use, to prevent ignition.

Household ammonia will lift off the residue if the ammonia is kept wet on
the cooking residue, which can be accomplished by wetting paper towels and
applying them to the surface (or pan edges to the paper towels) then
covering the area with plastic to keep the area wet. Then just let the
ammonia work for an extended time.

I think I may have heard of brake fluid being used the same way, but that
might have been for some other compound.. silicone caulking, maybe.

--
WB
..........


"Winston" wrote in message
...
'Varnish Makers and Painter's' naptha is the only way
I've found for removing baked-on grease from metal surfaces:
http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarest...er-618030.aspx

It's disappeared from the shelves at all the hardware stores in
my area. Some now carry a 'substitute' product in gallon cans,
but I don't want to spend over 20 bucks and then have to drive
it to Hazmat Disposal if it works as well as do most
'substitutes'.

What's a practical alternative? Gasoline?

Thanks!

--Winston

On Wed, 08 Jun 2011 09:28:30 -0700, Winston
wrote:

'Varnish Makers and Painter's' naptha is the only way
I've found for removing baked-on grease from metal surfaces:
http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarest...er-618030.aspx

It's disappeared from the shelves at all the hardware stores in
my area. Some now carry a 'substitute' product in gallon cans,
but I don't want to spend over 20 bucks and then have to drive
it to Hazmat Disposal if it works as well as do most
'substitutes'.

What's a practical alternative? Gasoline?

Isn't a $3 can of spray-on oven cleaner the least expensive solution?

--
Fleas can be taught nearly anything that a Congressman can.
-- Mark Twain

On Wed, 08 Jun 2011 09:28:30 -0700, Winston
wrote:

'Varnish Makers and Painter's' naptha is the only way
I've found for removing baked-on grease from metal surfaces:
http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarest...er-618030.aspx

It's disappeared from the shelves at all the hardware stores in
my area. Some now carry a 'substitute' product in gallon cans,
but I don't want to spend over 20 bucks and then have to drive
it to Hazmat Disposal if it works as well as do most
'substitutes'.

I hear ya. New, Improved, Substitute, Odorless, Green mineral spirits
absolutely suck the big one.


What's a practical alternative? Gasoline?

Oops, I forgot to address this. Gasoline is the only cleaner I've
ever heard of igniting and immolating the user. I would never
recommend using gas to clean anything. Too volatile, stinky, toxic,
etc.

--
Fleas can be taught nearly anything that a Congressman can.
-- Mark Twain

On Wed, 08 Jun 2011 11:33:43 -0700, Winston
wrote:

Pete C. wrote:

anorton wrote:

wrote in message
...
'Varnish Makers and Painter's' naptha is the only way
I've found for removing baked-on grease from metal surfaces:
http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarest...er-618030.aspx

It's disappeared from the shelves at all the hardware stores in
my area. Some now carry a 'substitute' product in gallon cans,
but I don't want to spend over 20 bucks and then have to drive
it to Hazmat Disposal if it works as well as do most
'substitutes'.

What's a practical alternative? Gasoline?

Thanks!

--Winston

Lighter fluid is (or at least used to be) mainly naptha. Gasoline has
longer chain molecules than naptha, but you could try it.

Camp stove / lantern fuel might be a viable substitute that would be
better than highway gasoline.

I agree. It's unobtainium here in SF Bay Area.

Oh, I forgot. You live in -no VOC- city, don't you?

When I had my smog license in CA, the NOX standards were a lower
number than was obtainable from ambient air on the coast with an
offshore breeze on a GOOD day. Inland, the shrubs doubled that, even
without any vehicular traffic.

Don't you love the CARB and CAL-EPA?

--
Fleas can be taught nearly anything that a Congressman can.
-- Mark Twain

Ed Huntress wrote:

"Pete C." wrote in message
ster.com...

Ed Huntress wrote:

"Winston" wrote in message
...
Ed Huntress wrote:

(...)

I bought some just a few years ago at Home Depot. I'd also try a big
paint
store. Have you looked for Coleman Fuel at a chain sporting goods
store?
Target has it here.

Apparently, it just evaporated locally.
My local sporting goods store lists only shoes, sleeping bags
and LED lanterns under the 'Coleman' brand. Perhaps
it is worth a drive out there for some face time.

I get nothing but 'deer in the headlights' looks when I ask about
'naptha' at the same darned stores where I used to buy gallons of
the stuff for ~$7.00 then ~$9.00 then ~ $14.95.
Even the Pro paint store clerks now act like they never sold the
stuff! What the heck?

However, as a solvent, it's pretty close to gasoline.

Purple cleaner, oven cleaner, gasoline are next to try.

Thanks, Ed.

--Winston

FWIW, as a purple cleaner, oven cleaner, and gasoline user, I'd try them
in
that order, unless you don't mind the gasoline fumes, in which case that
would be second.

I mix my own oven cleaner for cleaning my charcoal grill but it's a
bugger
to get straight lye these days. The only over-the-counter retail source
I've
seen identified by others is Roebic Crystal Drain Cleaner, which I buy
from
Lowe's at $11.00 for two pounds ouch!! It's now $1.98 for two pounds
online, under different names, but then I pay $10 shipping. d8-(

I do buy 20 pounds or so at a time online once in a while. You want 100%
sodium hydroxide crystals or pellets; mix 20% with water by weight; dump
in
some diatomaceous earth to make it stick a little to the grill. You can
use
potassium hydroxide but it's more expensive.

Mix 40% for cleaning drains, and stand back...At 40%, it's like thin
syrup.

I chase after lye now and then for anodizing prep. For cleaning a grill
or smoker, my preference is a pressure washer. A pressure washer works
quite well with just water and if you really need to you can feed some
purple on the chemical feed after doing a pre-wash, let that work a bit
and then post-wash to remove the remaining residue. I don't generally
find the degreaser is necessary.

That sounds good. Sometimes I wish I had one of those washers.

You don't need an exotic one, a basic $400 one from Northern Tool with a
Honda GC engine will do nicely, which is what I have. It's also great
for cleaning driveways, patios, vehicles, the brick house and most
anything else.

Wild_Bill wrote:
Dunno what your term *grease* means.. but if you're referring to a
cooking area or pans with vegetable oil and/or meat fat spatter that's
formed a plastic-like build-up

Yup. That's the stuff.

, then a couple of things will work fairly
effortlessly.

Automotive solvents or household ammonia will break the film loose.
Naptha may also be available in a solvent used as an autobody
refinishing prep cleaner known as "wax and grease remover" from an
automotive refinishing supplier.

Not here, any more. Sigh.

Carb cleaners may still contain the xylene or toluene solvents that will
effectively dissolve cooking residues.

Either of the automotive solvents will work more easily if used in the
way described for ammonia. Extreme caution should be exercised for the
solvents' use, to prevent ignition.

Household ammonia will lift off the residue if the ammonia is kept wet
on the cooking residue, which can be accomplished by wetting paper
towels and applying them to the surface (or pan edges to the paper
towels) then covering the area with plastic to keep the area wet. Then
just let the ammonia work for an extended time.

I think I may have heard of brake fluid being used the same way, but
that might have been for some other compound.. silicone caulking, maybe.


Cool!

Thanks!

--Winston

Larry Jaques wrote:

(...)

Isn't a $3 can of spray-on oven cleaner the least expensive solution?

That is on the list to try.

--Winston

Winston wrote:

Ed Huntress wrote:
wrote in message
...
Pete C. wrote:
Winston wrote:
Pete C. wrote:
Winston wrote:
Pete C. wrote:
(...)

Camp stove / lantern fuel might be a viable substitute that would be
better than highway gasoline.
I agree. It's unobtainium here in SF Bay Area.
Thanks!
Time to move to the free world...
They have *weather* in the free world. (Shudder).

Dunno, I like it here in Texas, particularly the weather. I've been to
SF a few times and it's certainly had "weather" when I've been there.

+1

It's warm here now.

It was 97 F a few hours ago here. Tomorrow, 100 F.

It feels like Texas, without the armadillos.

72 F and 48 % RH for most of the day.
I *love* this place!

--Winston

88F and 46% here now at 7:48pm, 14 MPH breeze, hammock weather

Larry Jaques wrote:

(...)

I hear ya. New, Improved, Substitute, Odorless, Green mineral spirits
absolutely suck the big one.


I'd risk say 6.00 on a quart to test it. I'm not buying a gallon though.

What's a practical alternative? Gasoline?

Oops, I forgot to address this. Gasoline is the only cleaner I've
ever heard of igniting and immolating the user. I would never
recommend using gas to clean anything. Too volatile, stinky, toxic,
etc.

Heh! My dad thought gasoline was the cat's pajamas for
cleaning stuff (while smoking).

Amazing.

--Winston

Stormin Mormon wrote:

I'd be thinking kerosene, instead of gasoline. Kero
evaporates more slowly, and much less flammable. Sorry you
aren't finding naptha as camp stove fuel. I'd be tempted to
buy a gallon of camp stove fuel and try it out, as
degreaser. Might be just relabelled.

Purple degreaser can be found at HVAC / R supply houses,
under brand names like Alkli Foam, or Nu Brite. Hydroxide
and some soap. Usual precautions, gloves, safety goggles,
etc. If it gets on skin, it turns oil to soap, makes the
skin slippery. A splash of diluted vinegar makes your skin
feel normal again.

I get the Zep brand purple degreaser in 5 gal pails at 'Depot. Actually,
the last time I needed some specialty Zep product it seems 'Depot
couldn't get it and I ended up buying it direct from Zep and picking it
up at a Zep facility not too far away to save shipping costs.

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Wed, 08 Jun 2011 11:33:43 -0700,
wrote:

Pete C. wrote:

anorton wrote:

wrote in message
...
'Varnish Makers and Painter's' naptha is the only way
I've found for removing baked-on grease from metal surfaces:
http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarest...er-618030.aspx

It's disappeared from the shelves at all the hardware stores in
my area. Some now carry a 'substitute' product in gallon cans,
but I don't want to spend over 20 bucks and then have to drive
it to Hazmat Disposal if it works as well as do most
'substitutes'.

What's a practical alternative? Gasoline?

Thanks!

--Winston

Lighter fluid is (or at least used to be) mainly naptha. Gasoline has
longer chain molecules than naptha, but you could try it.

Camp stove / lantern fuel might be a viable substitute that would be
better than highway gasoline.

I agree. It's unobtainium here in SF Bay Area.

Oh, I forgot. You live in -no VOC- city, don't you?

In a couple minutes of Googling, I didn't see citation of any law
regarding VOCs in my area. Wierd.

When I had my smog license in CA, the NOX standards were a lower
number than was obtainable from ambient air on the coast with an
offshore breeze on a GOOD day. Inland, the shrubs doubled that, even
without any vehicular traffic.

Don't you love the CARB and CAL-EPA?

I really like how the air has 'cleaned up' since the '70s, when
it got so bad at times that my eyes would swell shut.

Now we get only occasional stenches from the release of
I.C. processing gasses. It's much better, overall.

I guess I shouldn't moan too loudly.

Oh Well!

--Winston

On Wed, 08 Jun 2011 11:32:40 -0700, Winston
wrote:

PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

(...)

Coleman fuel AKA white gas

Forgive my faux pas.

I didn't mention that I wasn't able to locate this stuff
under any of it's synonyms, either.
White Spirit
Coleman Fuel
White Gas (I remember when that was available at the *gas station*.
Etc etc.

Thanks!

--Winston

You cant find lantern fuel at Walmart????



The current Democratic party has lost its ideological basis for
existence.
- It is NOT fiscally responsible.
- It is NOT ethically honorable.
- It has started wars based on lies.
- It does not support the well-being of americans - only billionaires.
- It has suppresed constitutional guaranteed liberties.
- It has foisted a liar as president upon America.
- It has violated US national sovereignty in trade treaties.
- It has refused to enforce the national borders.

....It no longer has valid reasons to exist.
Lorad474

Winston wrote:
here in SF Bay Area.
Thanks!

--Winston

Right there is your basic problem. :-)
...lew...

Winston wrote:
They have *weather* in the free world. (Shudder).



--Winston
But they have Earth Quakes in SF. :-)
...lew...

On Wed, 08 Jun 2011 16:36:14 -0700, Winston
wrote:

Rich Grise wrote:
Winston wrote:

'Varnish Makers and Painter's' naptha is the only way
I've found for removing baked-on grease from metal surfaces:

http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarest...er-618030.aspx

It's disappeared from the shelves at all the hardware stores in
my area. Some now carry a 'substitute' product in gallon cans,
but I don't want to spend over 20 bucks and then have to drive
it to Hazmat Disposal if it works as well as do most
'substitutes'.

What's a practical alternative? Gasoline?

Ronsonol or Zippo lighter fluid. It's almost pure naphtha - it will
even get gum out of hair.

It's great stuff.

I advise ya'all to stock up before you get hit with the
same wave of regulation.

Holy ****, Batman! $41 a QUART?
http://www.nextag.com/coleman-fuel/compare-html
Or $48 a gallon from Coleman.

--
Fleas can be taught nearly anything that a Congressman can.
-- Mark Twain

"CaveLamb" wrote in message
m...
Ed Huntress wrote:
"Winston" wrote in message
...
Ed Huntress wrote:

FWIW, as a purple cleaner, oven cleaner, and gasoline user, I'd try
them in
that order, unless you don't mind the gasoline fumes, in which case
that
would be second.

I mix my own oven cleaner for cleaning my charcoal grill but it's a
bugger
to get straight lye these days. The only over-the-counter retail source
I've
seen identified by others is Roebic Crystal Drain Cleaner, which I buy
from
Lowe's at $11.00 for two poundsouch!! It's now $1.98 for two pounds
online, under different names, but then I pay $10 shipping. d8-(

I do buy 20 pounds or so at a time online once in a while. You want
100%
sodium hydroxide crystals or pellets; mix 20% with water by weight;
dump in
some diatomaceous earth to make it stick a little to the grill. You can
use
potassium hydroxide but it's more expensive.

Mix 40% for cleaning drains, and stand back...At 40%, it's like thin
syrup.
Copied to disk and printed.

Thanks again Ed!

--Winston

You're welcome. Pencil this in: To the 20% plus d. earth formula, add
enough fumed silica to make soup, and use it to strip paint. Whole
houses. I did my whole porch with it.

It's slow with latex paints -- like, two days -- but fairly quick with
alkyd/oil/varnish. And it's cheap, with no methylene chloride fumes.
Neutralize with a dilute oxalic acid mix before painting. This stripper
treatment is used in historic-house restorations.



I'll give that a try, Ed.
It's got to be better, cheaper, and safer than that junk I used last time!

Just protect yourself well. When you're stripping a big area, it's hard to
keep that soup off of you, and it burns. Also, try any synthetic paint
brushes you use with it before getting into a big project -- or maybe you
can find an expert who will tell you what kinds not to use. I wound up with
a handle and no bristles once. d8-)

When I'm buying quantities of sodium hydroxide, I buy from
www.essentialdepot.com. They've always given me good service.

--
Ed Huntress



--

Richard Lamb
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~sv_temptress

On Wed, 08 Jun 2011 17:49:46 -0700, Winston
wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:

(...)

I hear ya. New, Improved, Substitute, Odorless, Green mineral spirits
absolutely suck the big one.


I'd risk say 6.00 on a quart to test it. I'm not buying a gallon though.

What's a practical alternative? Gasoline?

Oops, I forgot to address this. Gasoline is the only cleaner I've
ever heard of igniting and immolating the user. I would never
recommend using gas to clean anything. Too volatile, stinky, toxic,
etc.

Heh! My dad thought gasoline was the cat's pajamas for
cleaning stuff (while smoking).

Amazing.

He was damned lucky. 3 in a week in LV: http://goo.gl/uRuJc

--
Fleas can be taught nearly anything that a Congressman can.
-- Mark Twain

On Wed, 08 Jun 2011 18:01:48 -0700, Winston
wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Wed, 08 Jun 2011 11:33:43 -0700,
wrote:

Pete C. wrote:

anorton wrote:

wrote in message
...
'Varnish Makers and Painter's' naptha is the only way
I've found for removing baked-on grease from metal surfaces:
http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarest...er-618030.aspx

It's disappeared from the shelves at all the hardware stores in
my area. Some now carry a 'substitute' product in gallon cans,
but I don't want to spend over 20 bucks and then have to drive
it to Hazmat Disposal if it works as well as do most
'substitutes'.

What's a practical alternative? Gasoline?

Thanks!

--Winston

Lighter fluid is (or at least used to be) mainly naptha. Gasoline has
longer chain molecules than naptha, but you could try it.

Camp stove / lantern fuel might be a viable substitute that would be
better than highway gasoline.

I agree. It's unobtainium here in SF Bay Area.

Oh, I forgot. You live in -no VOC- city, don't you?

In a couple minutes of Googling, I didn't see citation of any law
regarding VOCs in my area. Wierd.

My couple minutes gave me this: http://goo.gl/7Pj6b
and this: http://www.arb.ca.gov/maps/maps.htm

My smog license expired in '83, so I've forgotten most of what I knew.
Also, CA is a different entity today than it was back then.


When I had my smog license in CA, the NOX standards were a lower
number than was obtainable from ambient air on the coast with an
offshore breeze on a GOOD day. Inland, the shrubs doubled that, even
without any vehicular traffic.

Don't you love the CARB and CAL-EPA?

I really like how the air has 'cleaned up' since the '70s, when
it got so bad at times that my eyes would swell shut.

I was amazed at how little brown haze remained over HelL.A. when I
worked there a decade ago with a buddy. We'd drive up over the hill
into Orange County and see only a bit of brown. When my parents and I
flew out to Glendale in the 60s, it was DARK brown.

I'll bet over half of that would have been gone anyway, without CA
extra strict regs, just from replacing older, worn-out cars.


Now we get only occasional stenches from the release of
I.C. processing gasses. It's much better, overall.

I guess I shouldn't moan too loudly.

Oh Well!

--Winston

--
Fleas can be taught nearly anything that a Congressman can.
-- Mark Twain

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Wed, 08 Jun 2011 16:36:14 -0700,
wrote:

Rich Grise wrote:
Winston wrote:

'Varnish Makers and Painter's' naptha is the only way
I've found for removing baked-on grease from metal surfaces:

http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarest...er-618030.aspx

It's disappeared from the shelves at all the hardware stores in
my area. Some now carry a 'substitute' product in gallon cans,
but I don't want to spend over 20 bucks and then have to drive
it to Hazmat Disposal if it works as well as do most
'substitutes'.

What's a practical alternative? Gasoline?

Ronsonol or Zippo lighter fluid. It's almost pure naphtha - it will
even get gum out of hair.

It's great stuff.

I advise ya'all to stock up before you get hit with the
same wave of regulation.

Holy ****, Batman! $41 a QUART?
http://www.nextag.com/coleman-fuel/compare-html
Or $48 a gallon from Coleman.

Heh!

That site shows *me* exactly zero citations for
the actual fuel itself. Plenty lanterns and stoves
but no fuel. Interesting, no?

--Winston

Pete C. wrote:

88F and 46% here now at 7:48pm, 14 MPH breeze, hammock weather

Yessir.

--Winston

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Wed, 08 Jun 2011 17:49:46 -0700,
wrote:

(...)

Heh! My dad thought gasoline was the cat's pajamas for
cleaning stuff (while smoking).

Amazing.

He was damned lucky. 3 in a week in LV: http://goo.gl/uRuJc

OUCH!

--Winston

On Wed, 08 Jun 2011 09:28:30 -0700, Winston
wrote:

'Varnish Makers and Painter's' naptha is the only way
I've found for removing baked-on grease from metal surfaces:
http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarest...er-618030.aspx

It's disappeared from the shelves at all the hardware stores in
my area. Some now carry a 'substitute' product in gallon cans,
but I don't want to spend over 20 bucks and then have to drive
it to Hazmat Disposal if it works as well as do most
'substitutes'.

What's a practical alternative? Gasoline?


Coleman fuel smells the same to me.

RWL

Pete C. wrote:

Stormin Mormon wrote:

I'd be thinking kerosene, instead of gasoline. Kero
evaporates more slowly, and much less flammable. Sorry you
aren't finding naptha as camp stove fuel. I'd be tempted to
buy a gallon of camp stove fuel and try it out, as
degreaser. Might be just relabelled.

Purple degreaser can be found at HVAC / R supply houses,
under brand names like Alkli Foam, or Nu Brite. Hydroxide
and some soap. Usual precautions, gloves, safety goggles,
etc. If it gets on skin, it turns oil to soap, makes the
skin slippery. A splash of diluted vinegar makes your skin
feel normal again.

I get the Zep brand purple degreaser in 5 gal pails at 'Depot. Actually,
the last time I needed some specialty Zep product it seems 'Depot
couldn't get it and I ended up buying it direct from Zep and picking it
up at a Zep facility not too far away to save shipping costs.

Prompted by this, I tried 'Zep green':
http://www.amazon.com/Zep-32Oz-Clean.../dp/B003K1ZWG8

It works nearly as well as naptha!

I'm still going to check out the others but this is a very
cool discovery.

Thanks!

--Winston

On Wed, 08 Jun 2011 09:28:30 -0700, Winston
wrote:

'Varnish Makers and Painter's' naptha is the only way
I've found for removing baked-on grease from metal surfaces:
http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarest...er-618030.aspx


Someone recommended spray on oven cleaner and I tried it recently. It
worked faster than the purple cleaner. Spray it on and start wiping.

RWL

Winston wrote:
Pete C. wrote:
Camp stove / lantern fuel might be a viable substitute that would be
better than highway gasoline.

I agree. It's unobtainium here in SF Bay Area.
Thanks!

Try REI, they sell white gas for backpacking stoves.

http://www.rei.com/search?query=white+gas

Jon

I use oven cleaner to remove baked on grease.

Come to think about it, this is what oven cleaner is supposed to do:
removing baked on grease.

Just do not breathe that stuff.

i

On 2011-06-09, Winston wrote:
Pete C. wrote:

Stormin Mormon wrote:

I'd be thinking kerosene, instead of gasoline. Kero
evaporates more slowly, and much less flammable. Sorry you
aren't finding naptha as camp stove fuel. I'd be tempted to
buy a gallon of camp stove fuel and try it out, as
degreaser. Might be just relabelled.

Purple degreaser can be found at HVAC / R supply houses,
under brand names like Alkli Foam, or Nu Brite. Hydroxide
and some soap. Usual precautions, gloves, safety goggles,
etc. If it gets on skin, it turns oil to soap, makes the
skin slippery. A splash of diluted vinegar makes your skin
feel normal again.

I get the Zep brand purple degreaser in 5 gal pails at 'Depot. Actually,
the last time I needed some specialty Zep product it seems 'Depot
couldn't get it and I ended up buying it direct from Zep and picking it
up at a Zep facility not too far away to save shipping costs.

Prompted by this, I tried 'Zep green':
http://www.amazon.com/Zep-32Oz-Clean.../dp/B003K1ZWG8

It works nearly as well as naptha!

I'm still going to check out the others but this is a very
cool discovery.

Thanks!

--Winston

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Wed, 08 Jun 2011 18:01:48 -0700,
wrote:

(...)

In a couple minutes of Googling, I didn't see citation of any law
regarding VOCs in my area. Wierd.

My couple minutes gave me this: http://goo.gl/7Pj6b
Not a mention of VOCs Hmm. The Statutory Record for
1999-2008 showed nothing pertinent for search terms
'volatile' or 'organic' or 'solvent'.

http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/pdf/Statut...d1999-2008.pdf

and this: http://www.arb.ca.gov/maps/maps.htm

Nothing really stuck out.
There is a citation about one of naptha's disguises:
Stoddard Solvent. They indicate that it is an irritant,
but no prohibition regarding same.

Naptha has a listing he
http://www.arb.ca.gov/db/solvents/all_cmpds.htm
But no mention of an issue with the stuff.

Mentions elsewhere on the site, but still no citations
of law.

Curious.



(...)
I was amazed at how little brown haze remained over HelL.A. when I
worked there a decade ago with a buddy. We'd drive up over the hill
into Orange County and see only a bit of brown. When my parents and I
flew out to Glendale in the 60s, it was DARK brown.

Yup. My most pronounced memory of my first drive into LA was
that dark brown smog. This'd be like 1975 or so. Sick.

I remember a dark brown blanket covering Santa Clara Valley
back in the 70's, too. Twas depressing.

--Winston