I have a 60 amp circuit with a single outlet (I believe an L5-50) that
I use for my welder. I want to add a second outlet to this circuit so
that I don't have to keep unplugging/plugging when I want to use
another welder. I won't be using both welders at the same time. The
conductors are 6 gauge. Normally I would use some wire nuts but I
can't find any that are rated to hold three 6 gauge conductors. The
home centers in my area have big blue wire nuts that can only hold two
6 gauge wires. They also have split bolts. Can I use these? Do I
just strip the middle of one wire and the end of the other wire, then
insert them into the split bolt? Then wrap with electrical tape? I'm
a bit leery of a 208V, 60A circuit insulated with electrical tape. Is
shrink tube any safer? Finding a shrink tube with diameter greater
than the length of the split bolt might be tricky. Are these split
bolts only intended for ground conductors?

I would add another circuit except my panel is completely full.

Any ideas? Thanks.

Albert we:
I have a 60 amp circuit with a single outlet (I believe an L5-50) that
I use for my welder. I want to add a second outlet to this circuit so
that I don't have to keep unplugging/plugging when I want to use
another welder. I won't be using both welders at the same time. The
conductors are 6 gauge. Normally I would use some wire nuts but I
can't find any that are rated to hold three 6 gauge conductors. The
home centers in my area have big blue wire nuts that can only hold two
6 gauge wires. They also have split bolts. Can I use these? Do I
just strip the middle of one wire and the end of the other wire, then
insert them into the split bolt? Then wrap with electrical tape? I'm
a bit leery of a 208V, 60A circuit insulated with electrical tape. Is
shrink tube any safer? Finding a shrink tube with diameter greater
than the length of the split bolt might be tricky. Are these split
bolts only intended for ground conductors?

I would add another circuit except my panel is completely full.

Any ideas? Thanks.



You could do it that way. Just use lots of tape to get the proper
insulation thickness. Or, in the alternative, you could take one of
your esisting breaker and run a sub=panel from it. That way you have
room for future expansion.

Jim Chandler

A more suitable device would be a "terminal block". Some are made to
accept several wires and keep them in using a push-down setscrew. I
have some in my "stuff pile", they are not hard to find.

i

On 2007-11-12, Albert wrote:
I have a 60 amp circuit with a single outlet (I believe an L5-50) that
I use for my welder. I want to add a second outlet to this circuit so
that I don't have to keep unplugging/plugging when I want to use
another welder. I won't be using both welders at the same time. The
conductors are 6 gauge. Normally I would use some wire nuts but I
can't find any that are rated to hold three 6 gauge conductors. The
home centers in my area have big blue wire nuts that can only hold two
6 gauge wires. They also have split bolts. Can I use these? Do I
just strip the middle of one wire and the end of the other wire, then
insert them into the split bolt? Then wrap with electrical tape? I'm
a bit leery of a 208V, 60A circuit insulated with electrical tape. Is
shrink tube any safer? Finding a shrink tube with diameter greater
than the length of the split bolt might be tricky. Are these split
bolts only intended for ground conductors?

I would add another circuit except my panel is completely full.

Any ideas? Thanks.

On Mon, 12 Nov 2007 04:28:46 -0000, Albert wrote:

I have a 60 amp circuit with a single outlet (I believe an L5-50) that
I use for my welder. I want to add a second outlet to this circuit so
that I don't have to keep unplugging/plugging when I want to use
another welder. I won't be using both welders at the same time. The
conductors are 6 gauge. Normally I would use some wire nuts but I
can't find any that are rated to hold three 6 gauge conductors. The
home centers in my area have big blue wire nuts that can only hold two
6 gauge wires. They also have split bolts. Can I use these? Do I
just strip the middle of one wire and the end of the other wire, then
insert them into the split bolt? Then wrap with electrical tape? I'm
a bit leery of a 208V, 60A circuit insulated with electrical tape. Is
shrink tube any safer? Finding a shrink tube with diameter greater
than the length of the split bolt might be tricky. Are these split
bolts only intended for ground conductors?

I would add another circuit except my panel is completely full.

Any ideas? Thanks.


That will work fine. Id put in a sub panel with a breaker for each
welder..shrug..but thats just me.

Electrical tape is just fine. Wrap well with multiple layers.

Gunner

Political Correctness is a doctrine fostered by a delusional,
illogical liberal minority, and rabidly promoted by an
unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the
proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

You can also get self vulcanizing tape specifically made for high
voltage splices. Get it at an electrical store, no HD or Lowes.
then wrap that with lots of electrical tape.

This stuff


" Scotch® 23 Rubber Splicing Tape is a highly conformable, self-fusing
Ethylene Propylene Rubber (EPR) based high-insulating voltage tape.
Scotch® 23 has a "snakeskin" liner that is easily removed as the tape
is applied. "

Dan wrote:

You can also get self vulcanizing tape specifically made for high
voltage splices. Get it at an electrical store, no HD or Lowes.
then wrap that with lots of electrical tape.

This stuff

" Scotch® 23 Rubber Splicing Tape is a highly conformable, self-fusing
Ethylene Propylene Rubber (EPR) based high-insulating voltage tape.
Scotch® 23 has a "snakeskin" liner that is easily removed as the tape
is applied. "

Nice stuff, but 208V isn't remotely close to "high voltage", and indeed
I expect it's 120/208 Y service so it is only 120V to ground. Heck,
120/208V is less then the normal 120/240V in residences. Regular quality
electrical tape like 3M's Super 33+ is quite sufficient.

On Nov 12, 9:22 am, "Pete C." wrote:
Dan wrote:

You can also get self vulcanizing tape specifically made for high
voltage splices. Get it at an electrical store, no HD or Lowes.
then wrap that with lots of electrical tape.


The good thing about using splicing tape is that it wears better.
For instance should he splice and the cable just kinda flops around
on the floor or against a brick wall, abrasion could "sandpaper"
through mere plain old electrical tape. However
it won't likely wear through splice tape.

When electricians make splices with those split bolts they use splice
tape and then a good layer of electrical tape.

If you want to get really fancy you could smear a little
antioxidizing grease on the bare wire before you tape.

On Mon, 12 Nov 2007 04:28:46 -0000, Albert wrote:

I have a 60 amp circuit with a single outlet (I believe an L5-50) that
I use for my welder. I want to add a second outlet to this circuit so
that I don't have to keep unplugging/plugging when I want to use
another welder. I won't be using both welders at the same time. The
conductors are 6 gauge. Normally I would use some wire nuts but I
can't find any that are rated to hold three 6 gauge conductors. The
home centers in my area have big blue wire nuts that can only hold two
6 gauge wires. They also have split bolts. Can I use these? Do I
just strip the middle of one wire and the end of the other wire, then
insert them into the split bolt? Then wrap with electrical tape? I'm
a bit leery of a 208V, 60A circuit insulated with electrical tape. Is
shrink tube any safer? Finding a shrink tube with diameter greater
than the length of the split bolt might be tricky. Are these split
bolts only intended for ground conductors?

The split bolts are the way to go. The best way to insulate them is to
wrap with splicing tape, which is thick, rubbery and self-vulcanizing,
then cover that with vinyl electrical tape. Make sure the split bolts
are compatible with your wire (aluminum or copper). Wire brush the
wire and use de-ox goo if it is aluminum.

You should also be aware that a multi-outlet circuit greater than 50A
in a residential setting is *not* code compliant.

--
Ned Simmons

And one other thing, there is a torque value for the split bolt and it
is important to torque it.

On Nov 12, 4:28 am, Albert wrote:
I have a 60 amp circuit with a single outlet (I believe an L5-50) that
I use for my welder. I want to add a second outlet to this circuit so
that I don't have to keep unplugging/plugging when I want to use
another welder. I won't be using both welders at the same time. The
conductors are 6 gauge. Normally I would use some wire nuts but I
can't find any that are rated to hold three 6 gauge conductors. The
home centers in my area have big blue wire nuts that can only hold two
6 gauge wires. They also have split bolts. Can I use these? Do I
just strip the middle of one wire and the end of the other wire, then
insert them into the split bolt? Then wrap with electrical tape? I'm
a bit leery of a 208V, 60A circuit insulated with electrical tape. Is
shrink tube any safer? Finding a shrink tube with diameter greater
than the length of the split bolt might be tricky. Are these split
bolts only intended for ground conductors?

I would add another circuit except my panel is completely full.

Any ideas? Thanks.

I have used electrical tape and then over wrapped with glass tape for
a bit more abrasion resistance.

Dan

"Ned Simmons" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 12 Nov 2007 04:28:46 -0000, Albert wrote:

I have a 60 amp circuit with a single outlet (I believe an L5-50) that
I use for my welder. I want to add a second outlet to this circuit so
that I don't have to keep unplugging/plugging when I want to use
another welder. I won't be using both welders at the same time. The
conductors are 6 gauge. Normally I would use some wire nuts but I
can't find any that are rated to hold three 6 gauge conductors. The
home centers in my area have big blue wire nuts that can only hold two
6 gauge wires. They also have split bolts. Can I use these? Do I
just strip the middle of one wire and the end of the other wire, then
insert them into the split bolt? Then wrap with electrical tape? I'm
a bit leery of a 208V, 60A circuit insulated with electrical tape. Is
shrink tube any safer? Finding a shrink tube with diameter greater
than the length of the split bolt might be tricky. Are these split
bolts only intended for ground conductors?

The split bolts are the way to go. The best way to insulate them is to
wrap with splicing tape, which is thick, rubbery and self-vulcanizing,
then cover that with vinyl electrical tape.

Yes. When it is done properly the splicing tape melds into a rubber cocoon
around the split-bolt. When you wrap the vinyl tape around that the last
pass should be without tension, if you keep stretching the tape as you apply
it will have a tendency to unwrap.

Albert wrote:

I have a 60 amp circuit with a single outlet (I believe an L5-50) that
I use for my welder. I want to add a second outlet to this circuit so
that I don't have to keep unplugging/plugging when I want to use
another welder. I won't be using both welders at the same time. The
conductors are 6 gauge. Normally I would use some wire nuts but I
can't find any that are rated to hold three 6 gauge conductors. The
home centers in my area have big blue wire nuts that can only hold two
6 gauge wires. They also have split bolts. Can I use these? Do I
just strip the middle of one wire and the end of the other wire, then
insert them into the split bolt? Then wrap with electrical tape? I'm
a bit leery of a 208V, 60A circuit insulated with electrical tape. Is
shrink tube any safer? Finding a shrink tube with diameter greater
than the length of the split bolt might be tricky. Are these split
bolts only intended for ground conductors?

I would add another circuit except my panel is completely full.

Any ideas? Thanks.



Put the first layer of vinyl electrical tape upside down with the sticky
side up. If you ever want to add or open the splice you will know why.
Then use splicing tape to build up the insulation to three times the
thickness of the present insulation on the wires. Make sure you have no
sharp wire ends that will pierce the insulation. A final layer of vinyl
tape on top of the splicing tape will keep the splicing tape from
sticking to everything else in the box. The split nuts should be
torqued to the proper value. Also let them sit a while and torque them
again. The copper tends to cold flow and retorquing can save you some
headaches down the road. The split nuts are rated for a certain wire
size and number of wires. The rating is stamped or molded on the split nut.

John

"Ned Simmons" wrote in message
...
You should also be aware that a multi-outlet circuit greater than 50A
in a residential setting is *not* code compliant.

--
Ned Simmons

Can you point me to the section of code that says this??

Thanks

William....

On Tue, 13 Nov 2007 11:12:34 -0600, "William"
wrote:


"Ned Simmons" wrote in message
.. .
You should also be aware that a multi-outlet circuit greater than 50A
in a residential setting is *not* code compliant.

--
Ned Simmons

Can you point me to the section of code that says this??


Section 210.3, at least as of the 2002 edition. My emphasis added:

*************
210.3 Rating. Branch circuits recognized by this article
shall be rated in accordance with the maximum permitted
ampere rating or setting of the overcurrent device. The rating
for **other than individual branch circuits** shall be 15, 20,
30, 40, and 50 amperes. snip

Exception: Multioutlet branch circuits greater than 50 amperes
shall be permitted to supply nonlighting outlet loads
on industrial premises where conditions of maintenance
and supervision ensure that only qualified persons service
the equipment.
**************

BTW, I'm not sure how they get away with posting this, but here's
NFPA70 2002 in pdf format.
http://www.getphillips.com/electric/NEC2002.PDF


--
Ned Simmons

On Tue, 13 Nov 2007 12:53:51 -0500, Ned Simmons wrote:

On Tue, 13 Nov 2007 11:12:34 -0600, "William"
wrote:


"Ned Simmons" wrote in message
. ..
You should also be aware that a multi-outlet circuit greater than 50A
in a residential setting is *not* code compliant.

--
Ned Simmons

Can you point me to the section of code that says this??


Section 210.3, at least as of the 2002 edition. My emphasis added:

*************
210.3 Rating. Branch circuits recognized by this article
shall be rated in accordance with the maximum permitted
ampere rating or setting of the overcurrent device. The rating
for **other than individual branch circuits** shall be 15, 20,
30, 40, and 50 amperes. snip

Exception: Multioutlet branch circuits greater than 50 amperes
shall be permitted to supply nonlighting outlet loads
on industrial premises where conditions of maintenance
and supervision ensure that only qualified persons service
the equipment.
**************


Not my code, but I would have thought that one would have a reasonable
argument for an intelligent user of a home shop that is read up on the codes
to be sufficiently qualified to be able to service and operate equipment that
they have installed in that shop. Maybe not...

Mark Rand
RTFM

Ned Simmons wrote:
...
BTW, I'm not sure how they get away with posting this, but here's
NFPA70 2002 in pdf format. ...

Maybe because it's 2 revisions old, now that the '08 is out. Bob

"Mark Rand" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 13 Nov 2007 12:53:51 -0500, Ned Simmons wrote:

On Tue, 13 Nov 2007 11:12:34 -0600, "William"
wrote:


"Ned Simmons" wrote in message
...
You should also be aware that a multi-outlet circuit greater than 50A
in a residential setting is *not* code compliant.

--
Ned Simmons

Can you point me to the section of code that says this??


Section 210.3, at least as of the 2002 edition. My emphasis added:

*************
210.3 Rating. Branch circuits recognized by this article
shall be rated in accordance with the maximum permitted
ampere rating or setting of the overcurrent device. The rating
for **other than individual branch circuits** shall be 15, 20,
30, 40, and 50 amperes. snip

Exception: Multioutlet branch circuits greater than 50 amperes
shall be permitted to supply nonlighting outlet loads
on industrial premises where conditions of maintenance
and supervision ensure that only qualified persons service
the equipment.
**************


Not my code, but I would have thought that one would have a reasonable
argument for an intelligent user of a home shop that is read up on the
codes
to be sufficiently qualified to be able to service and operate equipment
that
they have installed in that shop. Maybe not...

Mark Rand
RTFM

But even the most qualified user of a home shop would not make the typical
home shop an "industrial premise".

you could, of course wire it the way you want, put in the big breaker and if
you ever get a hint of an inspection, put in a 30 amp breaker for the
inspection, then change back - nothing says you can't use oversized wire


"
Exception: Multioutlet branch circuits greater than 50 amperes
shall be permitted to supply nonlighting outlet loads
on industrial premises where conditions of maintenance
and supervision ensure that only qualified persons service
the equipment.
**************


Not my code, but I would have thought that one would have a reasonable
argument for an intelligent user of a home shop that is read up on the
codes
to be sufficiently qualified to be able to service and operate equipment
that
they have installed in that shop. Maybe not...

Mark Rand
RTFM

But even the most qualified user of a home shop would not make the typical
home shop an "industrial premise".




--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

On Tue, 13 Nov 2007 22:51:49 +0000, Mark Rand
wrote:

Not my code, but I would have thought that one would have a reasonable
argument for an intelligent user of a home shop that is read up on the codes
to be sufficiently qualified to be able to service and operate equipment that
they have installed in that shop. Maybe not...

I'm reasonable, you're reasonable, and most likely the OP is
reasonable. But given a choice between reason and the plain language
of the code, the electrical inspector will go with the code. That's
the blessing and curse of bright-line regulations.

--
Ned Simmons

On Wed, 14 Nov 2007 09:54:39 -0500, Ned Simmons wrote:

On Tue, 13 Nov 2007 22:51:49 +0000, Mark Rand
wrote:

Not my code, but I would have thought that one would have a reasonable
argument for an intelligent user of a home shop that is read up on the codes
to be sufficiently qualified to be able to service and operate equipment that
they have installed in that shop. Maybe not...

I'm reasonable, you're reasonable, and most likely the OP is
reasonable. But given a choice between reason and the plain language
of the code, the electrical inspector will go with the code. That's
the blessing and curse of bright-line regulations.


Biggest problem I get is that some of the neighbours and some of the local
planning (zoning) officers think that my workshop looks a bit industrial. Must
be for business use, no one would have several lathes, surface grinder,
milling machines etc. if it wasn't for business, would they? This would lead
to expensive conflict with the council, fines and probable demolition of the
workshop.

My explanation to all who ask is that one could make a small fortune with the
kit that I have in the workshop, but only if one started with a large fortune!


Mark Rand
RTFM

On Wed, 14 Nov 2007 21:29:00 +0000, Mark Rand
wrote:



Biggest problem I get is that some of the neighbours and some of the local
planning (zoning) officers think that my workshop looks a bit industrial. Must
be for business use, no one would have several lathes, surface grinder,
milling machines etc. if it wasn't for business, would they? This would lead
to expensive conflict with the council, fines and probable demolition of the
workshop.

As the chair of my town's volunteer zoning board of appeals, a matter
close to my heart. We're the folks who get to look like pricks when,
because of the very limited discretion we have in interpreting the
codes, we have to deny someone's perfectly reasonable request for a
variance or relief from a decision of the codes enforcement officer.

But your shop would probably pass muster here, even if it were a
commercial enterprise.

--
Ned Simmons

Thanks everyone for your replies! I ended up using the split bolts
and some 3M Super 33 tape. I didn't feel like making another trip to
the home center for the splicing tape but will pick some up for next
time. I saw some terminal blocks at McMaster Carr but didn't think
they would fit in my junction boxes.

My shop is in an industrial building so I think I'll be ok with the
NEC with regards to multiple outlets in a greater than 50A circuit.
But I never knew this wasn't allowed in a home. Good to know.

I fully agree that my 208Y (120V relative to ground) isn't exactly
high voltage. But I like to pretend it is, and I'm still scared of
it.

I own a 2002 NEC handbook (ie. codebook plus lots of pictures and text
for laymen like me). It is good but I have a hard time searching
through it. That PDF is sure going to make keyword searches easy.
Thank you very much for posting the link. Regardless of whether
Phillips is right or not in putting that file on their web page, I
still saved a copy for my own use.

Thanks again!

On Nov 15, 4:48 pm, Albert wrote:
Thanks everyone for your replies! I ended up using the split bolts
and some 3M Super 33 tape. I didn't feel like making another trip to
the home center for the splicing tape but will pick some up for next
time. I saw some terminal blocks at McMaster Carr but didn't think
they would fit in my junction boxes.

My shop is in an industrial building so I think I'll be ok with the
NEC with regards to multiple outlets in a greater than 50A circuit.
But I never knew this wasn't allowed in a home. Good to know.

I fully agree that my 208Y (120V relative to ground) isn't exactly
high voltage. But I like to pretend it is, and I'm still scared of
it.

I own a 2002 NEC handbook (ie. codebook plus lots of pictures and text
for laymen like me). It is good but I have a hard time searching
through it. That PDF is sure going to make keyword searches easy.
Thank you very much for posting the link. Regardless of whether
Phillips is right or not in putting that file on their web page, I
still saved a copy for my own use.

Thanks again!

An electrician friend explained the wiring codes to me thus.....

"it doesn't matter if your a nuclear scientist who designs and builds
power stations and is perfectly capable of wiring something up - YOU
know how you've done it, what the circuit will bear, and if you splice
extra outlets onto a run, YOU will know NOT to overload it. Thats fine
as far as it goes.

BUT - eventually, someone else will live in that property, they will
have no knowledge of what you have done, what loading precautions to
take. So, inadvertently, you have provided a potentially dangerous
installation....

This is why there are standards codes...."


Andrew VK3BFA.

Albert wrote:

Thanks everyone for your replies! I ended up using the split bolts
and some 3M Super 33 tape. I didn't feel like making another trip to
the home center for the splicing tape but will pick some up for next
time. I saw some terminal blocks at McMaster Carr but didn't think
they would fit in my junction boxes.

My shop is in an industrial building so I think I'll be ok with the
NEC with regards to multiple outlets in a greater than 50A circuit.
But I never knew this wasn't allowed in a home. Good to know.

I fully agree that my 208Y (120V relative to ground) isn't exactly
high voltage. But I like to pretend it is, and I'm still scared of
it.

I own a 2002 NEC handbook (ie. codebook plus lots of pictures and text
for laymen like me). It is good but I have a hard time searching
through it. That PDF is sure going to make keyword searches easy.
Thank you very much for posting the link. Regardless of whether
Phillips is right or not in putting that file on their web page, I
still saved a copy for my own use.

Thanks again!

One of the most important things is grounding. Without a good ground on
the machines you could easily be killed by having the machine itself
being electrified by leakage or a direct short to the frame of the
machine. You should always double check the grounding or bonding of
the machine to the incoming ground.

John

On Thu, 15 Nov 2007 01:39:47 -0800 (PST), wrote:



An electrician friend explained the wiring codes to me thus.....

"it doesn't matter if your a nuclear scientist who designs and builds
power stations and is perfectly capable of wiring something up - YOU
know how you've done it, what the circuit will bear, and if you splice
extra outlets onto a run, YOU will know NOT to overload it. Thats fine
as far as it goes.

BUT - eventually, someone else will live in that property, they will
have no knowledge of what you have done, what loading precautions to
take. So, inadvertently, you have provided a potentially dangerous
installation....

This is why there are standards codes...."


Andrew VK3BFA.


Actually, I find that one hard to understand... The protection on the circuit
(fuse, MCB etc) should be rated to protect the components in the circuit.
Therefore how can one create a dangerous situation by overloading it?


Mark Rand
RTFM

"Mark Rand" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 15 Nov 2007 01:39:47 -0800 (PST), wrote:



An electrician friend explained the wiring codes to me thus.....

"it doesn't matter if your a nuclear scientist who designs and builds
power stations and is perfectly capable of wiring something up - YOU
know how you've done it, what the circuit will bear, and if you splice
extra outlets onto a run, YOU will know NOT to overload it. Thats fine
as far as it goes.

BUT - eventually, someone else will live in that property, they will
have no knowledge of what you have done, what loading precautions to
take. So, inadvertently, you have provided a potentially dangerous
installation....

This is why there are standards codes...."


Andrew VK3BFA.


Actually, I find that one hard to understand... The protection on the
circuit
(fuse, MCB etc) should be rated to protect the components in the circuit.
Therefore how can one create a dangerous situation by overloading it?


Mark Rand
RTFM

You're assuming that the overcurrent device is going to operate flawlessly
at some future point. Good design and practice minimizes the chances that
the circuit will be loaded beyond its capacity. Multiple safety factors are
built in, and much of the code is written due to actual incidents reported
to the NFPA.

On Tue, 13 Nov 2007 22:09:35 -0800, "William Noble"
wrote:

you could, of course wire it the way you want, put in the big breaker and if
you ever get a hint of an inspection, put in a 30 amp breaker for the
inspection, then change back - nothing says you can't use oversized wire


Oversize wire is OK, 50A receps on a 30A breaker are not.

--
Ned Simmons

GatherNoMoss wrote:

On Nov 12, 9:22 am, "Pete C." wrote:

Dan wrote:


You can also get self vulcanizing tape specifically made for high
voltage splices. Get it at an electrical store, no HD or Lowes.
then wrap that with lots of electrical tape.



The good thing about using splicing tape is that it wears better.
For instance should he splice and the cable just kinda flops around
on the floor or against a brick wall, abrasion could "sandpaper"
through mere plain old electrical tape. However
it won't likely wear through splice tape.


When I first started learning about this sort of stuff we used "rubber
tape" first and then covered that with black cloth adhesive "friction
tape" to handle any abrasion.

Vinyl tape wasn't invented yet. G

Jeff

--
Jeffry Wisnia
(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)
The speed of light is 1.98*10^14 fathoms per fortnight.

Jeff Wisnia wrote:

When I first started learning about this sort of stuff we used "rubber
tape" first and then covered that with black cloth adhesive "friction
tape" to handle any abrasion.

Vinyl tape wasn't invented yet. G

Jeff

Yes and Western Union splices soldered, "T" taps on runs for drops.
All sort of things the current crop of electricians would't know
of. :-)
...lew...

"Lew Hartswick" wrote in message
...
Jeff Wisnia wrote:

When I first started learning about this sort of stuff we used "rubber
tape" first and then covered that with black cloth adhesive "friction
tape" to handle any abrasion.

Vinyl tape wasn't invented yet. G

Jeff

Yes and Western Union splices soldered, "T" taps on runs for drops.
All sort of things the current crop of electricians would't know
of. :-)
...lew...
We used to pigtail the ceiling box connections pointed downward, flux, and
then solder with a swiveling solder pot heated on a pump-up gasoline
blowtorch. Let cool, rubber tape and friction tape. Installed lots of
turn-key switch lampholders on green drop wire and a lot of pull-chains. No
wall switches, only one or two receptacles, typically for refrigerator and
electric iron. Radios, etc, powered from ceiling light by screw-in adapter.
Worst was boring holes and cutting ceiling box holes in heart pine with a
keyhole saw while standing on a rickety ladder. The "good old days" when REA
was extending lines in rural areas (late '40s).

Don Young

On Nov 18, 10:30 am, Mark Rand wrote:
On Thu, 15 Nov 2007 01:39:47 -0800 (PST), wrote:

An electrician friend explained the wiring codes to me thus.....

"it doesn't matter if your a nuclear scientist who designs and builds
power stations and is perfectly capable of wiring something up - YOU
know how you've done it, what the circuit will bear, and if you splice
extra outlets onto a run, YOU will know NOT to overload it. Thats fine
as far as it goes.

BUT - eventually, someone else will live in that property, they will
have no knowledge of what you have done, what loading precautions to
take. So, inadvertently, you have provided a potentially dangerous
installation....

This is why there are standards codes...."

Andrew VK3BFA.

Actually, I find that one hard to understand... The protection on the circuit
(fuse, MCB etc) should be rated to protect the components in the circuit.
Therefore how can one create a dangerous situation by overloading it?

Mark Rand
RTFM

Your quite correct. The fuses etc "should" be rated to disconnect in a
fault situation. How many dodgy fuse holders have you found in your
life, with wrong size wire, or copper wire, nails, bolts, etc etc.

You cant fully compensate for idiots - all you can hope to do is
statistically reduce their influence. Hence, published lowest common
denominator standards......

BTW - fuses have been banned here in OZ for new domestic installations
for the above reasons, as well as the highly variable nature of fusing
current in so called "fuse wire".....

And I don't really care if people kill themselves, or burn their house
down playing at far beyond their competency (it even should be
encouraged, if they haven't had a chance to breed yet...) - what I
do care about is me being affected by their negligence.

And to cope with this, I got a vague recollection that houses here
have to have their wiring inspected and certified by a qualified,
registered electrician before they are sold (not sure about this,
anyone in OZ know for sure?)

Andrew VK3BFA.

Yep - just bought a roll of 'rubber' tape and a roll of Fiberglass.
Both 3-M and good products.

Waterproof a connection and the fiberglass is high temp stuff for oven/stove...

I was in the process of building a rod oven but got a nice kitchen oven
that was just the ticket - bench top - and temp control.
'Very large toaster oven' that was discarded when someone overflowed cheese
in it and left a messy oven. I cooked it outside for a while - still
smells a bit.

The Kitchen stove electric Calrod elements will now likely be made into
a powercoat oven. There I'll use the Fiberglass to put some protection
over the insulation tape.

Martin

Martin H. Eastburn
@ home at Lions' Lair with our computer lionslair at consolidated dot net
TSRA, Life; NRA LOH & Patron Member, Golden Eagle, Patriot's Medal.
NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder
IHMSA and NRA Metallic Silhouette maker & member.
http://lufkinced.com/


Jeff Wisnia wrote:
GatherNoMoss wrote:

On Nov 12, 9:22 am, "Pete C." wrote:

Dan wrote:


You can also get self vulcanizing tape specifically made for high
voltage splices. Get it at an electrical store, no HD or Lowes.
then wrap that with lots of electrical tape.



The good thing about using splicing tape is that it wears better.
For instance should he splice and the cable just kinda flops around
on the floor or against a brick wall, abrasion could "sandpaper"
through mere plain old electrical tape. However
it won't likely wear through splice tape.


When I first started learning about this sort of stuff we used "rubber
tape" first and then covered that with black cloth adhesive "friction
tape" to handle any abrasion.

Vinyl tape wasn't invented yet. G

Jeff


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There are a lot of places around still without power line power. REA did
a great job that is for sure - have friends that got power in the 50's.
There are ranches here that have to generate it as there isn't enough
wind to have a water well much less an electric one.

Martin

Martin H. Eastburn
@ home at Lions' Lair with our computer lionslair at consolidated dot net
TSRA, Life; NRA LOH & Patron Member, Golden Eagle, Patriot's Medal.
NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder
IHMSA and NRA Metallic Silhouette maker & member.
http://lufkinced.com/


Don Young wrote:
"Lew Hartswick" wrote in message
...
Jeff Wisnia wrote:
When I first started learning about this sort of stuff we used "rubber
tape" first and then covered that with black cloth adhesive "friction
tape" to handle any abrasion.

Vinyl tape wasn't invented yet. G

Jeff

Yes and Western Union splices soldered, "T" taps on runs for drops.
All sort of things the current crop of electricians would't know
of. :-)
...lew...
We used to pigtail the ceiling box connections pointed downward, flux, and
then solder with a swiveling solder pot heated on a pump-up gasoline
blowtorch. Let cool, rubber tape and friction tape. Installed lots of
turn-key switch lampholders on green drop wire and a lot of pull-chains. No
wall switches, only one or two receptacles, typically for refrigerator and
electric iron. Radios, etc, powered from ceiling light by screw-in adapter.
Worst was boring holes and cutting ceiling box holes in heart pine with a
keyhole saw while standing on a rickety ladder. The "good old days" when REA
was extending lines in rural areas (late '40s).

Don Young



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