Howdy, anyone here have any experience with Compact Fluorescent light
bulbs? My wife just had an Oprah moment and is singing their praises.

http://www.servicelighting.com/catal...s-fluorescents

I'm sure that there is an energy saving, not sure about the type of light -
if its annoying to anyone etc.

Thanks...

"BE" wrote in message
...
Howdy, anyone here have any experience with Compact Fluorescent light
bulbs? My wife just had an Oprah moment and is singing their praises.

http://www.servicelighting.com/catal...s-fluorescents

I'm sure that there is an energy saving, not sure about the type of
light - if its annoying to anyone etc.

Thanks...


Sort of a cold light, but lamp shades tend to warm it a bit. And, if you
have any digital timers for outdoor lights, check the instructions
carefully. Some timers will self-destruct with compact fluorescents.

I recently replaced a few of my incandescents with the compact
fluorescent type and they put out the same amount of light. At first
glance, the light appears to be more "yellow" than white, but I've
gotten used to it after a day or two. The good thing is that it isn't
the harsh "hard-white" light that's typically associated with
fluorescents. No noticeable flicker that some fluorescents can do too.
If the ratings on the bulb and EPA website are to be believed, it has
the same light output as a 60W bulb, but only requires 14W to do so.
So, it's a roughly a 60% savings per bulb.

"louie" wrote in message
oups.com...
I recently replaced a few of my incandescents with the compact
fluorescent type and they put out the same amount of light. At first
glance, the light appears to be more "yellow" than white, but I've
gotten used to it after a day or two. The good thing is that it isn't
the harsh "hard-white" light that's typically associated with
fluorescents. No noticeable flicker that some fluorescents can do too.
If the ratings on the bulb and EPA website are to be believed, it has
the same light output as a 60W bulb, but only requires 14W to do so.
So, it's a roughly a 60% savings per bulb.


Mine have a cold color. What brand are you using?

BE,

I have used them for several years, indoors and outdoors. When
installed indoors they take less than a second to come on. They start
at about 80% brightness but reach full brightness in a minute or two.
Outside it takes longer to reach full brightness when cold. I love
them. They use a lot less electricity and last years.

Stretch

On Thu, 27 Oct 2005 17:04:38 -0400, "BE" wrote:

Howdy, anyone here have any experience with Compact Fluorescent light
bulbs? My wife just had an Oprah moment and is singing their praises.

http://www.servicelighting.com/catal...s-fluorescents

I'm sure that there is an energy saving, not sure about the type of light -
if its annoying to anyone etc.

Thanks...

Do not install them in a wet environment ( bathroom) or installed
upside down, or inside a globe. The electronic get too hot and will
brun themselves out. I have them in my outdoor lights and they work
great. Also through out the house.

Tom

"BE" wrote in message
...
Howdy, anyone here have any experience with Compact Fluorescent light
bulbs? My wife just had an Oprah moment and is singing their praises.
http://www.servicelighting.com/catalog_product_list.cfm?cat_num=020203&link_c=lig ht-bulbs-fluorescents
I'm sure that there is an energy saving, not sure about the type of
light - if its annoying to anyone etc.

Three years ago we changed about 40 bulbs throughout the house with compact
fluorescents, and only one has burnt out. The lights are instant-on, do not
flicker, are a pleasing yellow-white light, and take less than 1/4 the juice
to run, vs incandescents, so payout at two dollars a whack (common on-sale
price) is impressively short.. You get the drift . . . .we've become total
fans.
Please be aware on the website you post, the prices shown at service
lighting are outrageous. We pay about 2 bucks a bulb or less, when you get
six packs, say, at Home Depot. Our local ACE hardware sells the same models
for 6-8 bucks per bulb. Don't get it.
Also, be aware that the "covered" bulbs have less light output, and heat up
more. We always get the exposed spiral shaped compacts - the covered ones
only for exterior exposed areas.

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...

"louie" wrote in message
oups.com...
I recently replaced a few of my incandescents with the compact
fluorescent type and they put out the same amount of light. At first
glance, the light appears to be more "yellow" than white, but I've
gotten used to it after a day or two. The good thing is that it isn't
the harsh "hard-white" light that's typically associated with
fluorescents. No noticeable flicker that some fluorescents can do too.
If the ratings on the bulb and EPA website are to be believed, it has
the same light output as a 60W bulb, but only requires 14W to do so.
So, it's a roughly a 60% savings per bulb.


Mine have a cold color. What brand are you using?

Yes, that's a good question. Do brands matter? Westinghouse, Panasonic,
Sylvania, TCP etc.?

Trekking Tom wrote:

Do not install them in a wet environment ( bathroom) or installed
upside down, or inside a globe. The electronic get too hot and will
brun themselves out. I have them in my outdoor lights and they work
great. Also through out the house.

?

I've had them in my bathrooms and upside down for three years with no
problems, and the CFL FAQ at
http://www.ci.fort-collins.co.us/uti...ng-faq.php#use
says only this:

"Are there any locations where CFL bulbs are NOT recommended?

CFL bulbs are not the best choice for:

* fixtures controlled by standard dimming controls;
* fixtures controlled by certain types of electronic timers or
photo-sensors;
* tightly enclosed light fixtures, where heat from the lamp can be
trapped (leading to early bulb failure); and
* fixtures needing tight beam control (e.g. to highlight artwork)."

And GE's site he
http://www.gelighting.com/na/home_li...t.htm#enclosed
says only:

"Can I use a compact fluorescent light bulb in an enclosed light
fixture?

Compact fluorescent light bulbs may generally be used in enclosed
fixtures as long as the enclosed fixture is not recessed. Totally
enclosed recessed fixtures (for example, a ceiling can light with a
cover over the bulb) create temperatures that are too high to allow the
use of a compact fluorescent bulb."


So... I'm not sure where you're getting the no-bathrooms and
no-upside-down parts.

--
Jennifer

I have not had luck... I keep wanting them to work so I keep trying
them.. but none seem to last more than 6 months in my applications all
over the house. Regular bulbs at my house also tend to have a very
short life... may be flaky power supply (although I can think of no
reason for that.. I live in a suburb, and have never known of any
problems with our power supply) or my personal theory, my rough and
tumble kids tend to literally shake the house when they roughhouse...
so I am wondering if that leads to shortened lamp life (that may
explain fillament, but would excessive vibration effect the CF bulbs?)

"BE" wrote in message
...
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...

"louie" wrote in message
oups.com...
I recently replaced a few of my incandescents with the compact
fluorescent type and they put out the same amount of light. At first
glance, the light appears to be more "yellow" than white, but I've
gotten used to it after a day or two. The good thing is that it isn't
the harsh "hard-white" light that's typically associated with
fluorescents. No noticeable flicker that some fluorescents can do too.
If the ratings on the bulb and EPA website are to be believed, it has
the same light output as a 60W bulb, but only requires 14W to do so.
So, it's a roughly a 60% savings per bulb.


Mine have a cold color. What brand are you using?

Yes, that's a good question. Do brands matter? Westinghouse, Panasonic,
Sylvania, TCP etc.?


I would expect brand and price (in the same store of the same brand) to
matter in respect to color and reliability. The major brands you listed are
probably similar in reliability (color?) but there are also plenty of off
brands especially at the lower price end. I get them for about $1 per bulb
because the power company discounts them (according to sticker on the
package) but these are not always in stock.

the compact flourescents are measured in kelvin, where for example
2700K gives you the soft warm incandescent-like color. higher numbers
give you the cool white.
we now avoid the dollar store bulbs with premature burnout.
the next step in our future will be LED's. right now the replacement
bulbs are pricey and not really ready for the home market.
i predict a big future for the 3 watt and 5 watt luxeon bulbs now in
flashlights.
oudoor seasonal lighting and hallways indoors: since last year we have
been using 100 bulbs to the string use only one watt total LED
christmas lights from a wholesale club at $9.99 a string of 100 in
either christmas colors or white. yes that's only 1 watt of ac for
100 led bulbs, but they appear faint or out in daylight when used
outdoors. the newer brighter style of a brighter LED in limited supply
at walmart gives a more satisfying illumination for a few watts of ac
per 100 bulbs. we are using the new white string at a shadowy outdoor
entranceway for additional illumination to find the door key.
search also for reading at
http://www.energystar.gov/
we are looking forward to using this free software to convert and
compare our electricity KWH to natural gas therms.
http://www.joshmadison.com/software/convert/

My first batch of CFLs lasted 10 years. Some bulbs are still going strong.

They used to be ridiculously expensive. Recently stocked up at Albertsons a
3 bulbs for $ 1.00 (26/100 Watts). Threw out all incandescents except a few
to use with dimmers.

At the prices shown at servicelighting.com it would seemingly take a hundred
years to see a measurable monetary benefit.

--
Walter
www.rationality.net
-
"BE" wrote in message
...
Howdy, anyone here have any experience with Compact Fluorescent light
bulbs? My wife just had an Oprah moment and is singing their praises.

http://www.servicelighting.com/catal...s-fluorescents

I'm sure that there is an energy saving, not sure about the type of
light - if its annoying to anyone etc.

Thanks...

In article ,
Doug Kanter wrote:

Sort of a cold light, but lamp shades tend to warm it a bit. And, if you
have any digital timers for outdoor lights, check the instructions
carefully. Some timers will self-destruct with compact fluorescents.

And most CFs will self destruct if used with a photo control.

--
Rich Greenberg Marietta, GA, USA richgr atsign panix.com + 1 770 321 6507
Eastern time. N6LRT I speak for myself & my dogs only. VM'er since CP-67
Canines:Val, Red & Shasta (RIP),Red, husky Owner:Chinook-L
Atlanta Siberian Husky Rescue. www.panix.com/~richgr/ Asst Owner:Sibernet-L

In article .com,
Jack wrote:
I have not had luck... I keep wanting them to work so I keep trying
them.. but none seem to last more than 6 months in my applications all
over the house. Regular bulbs at my house also tend to have a very
short life... may be flaky power supply (although I can think of no
reason for that.. I live in a suburb, and have never known of any
problems with our power supply) or my personal theory, my rough and
tumble kids tend to literally shake the house when they roughhouse...
so I am wondering if that leads to shortened lamp life (that may
explain fillament, but would excessive vibration effect the CF bulbs?)

Ask your local power company to check your voltage to see if it is
higher than normal.

When I first moved into my present house, bulbs were burning out quite
rapidly. The power company sent someone to check, and told me "no
problem found". But strangely enough, from then on bulbs lasted a lot
longer.

--
Rich Greenberg Marietta, GA, USA richgr atsign panix.com + 1 770 321 6507
Eastern time. N6LRT I speak for myself & my dogs only. VM'er since CP-67
Canines:Val, Red & Shasta (RIP),Red, husky Owner:Chinook-L
Atlanta Siberian Husky Rescue. www.panix.com/~richgr/ Asst Owner:Sibernet-L

My TI solar calculator won't work with these bulbs. Wrong wavelength. So I
use double fixtures, one incandescent, one CFL and the calculator works ok.

Bob


"Walter R." wrote in message
...
My first batch of CFLs lasted 10 years. Some bulbs are still going strong.

They used to be ridiculously expensive. Recently stocked up at Albertsons
a 3 bulbs for $ 1.00 (26/100 Watts). Threw out all incandescents except a
few to use with dimmers.

At the prices shown at servicelighting.com it would seemingly take a
hundred years to see a measurable monetary benefit.

--
Walter
www.rationality.net
-
"BE" wrote in message
...
Howdy, anyone here have any experience with Compact Fluorescent light
bulbs? My wife just had an Oprah moment and is singing their praises.

http://www.servicelighting.com/catal...s-fluorescents

I'm sure that there is an energy saving, not sure about the type of
light - if its annoying to anyone etc.

Thanks...

On 27 Oct 2005 14:51:34 -0700, "Jennifer" wrote:

* fixtures controlled by certain types of electronic timers or
photo-sensors;

I'm using one with an electric timer, not an electronic one.

But I thought both were either totally off or totally on. I don't see
how they could damage the bulb. The electric one at least just has a
mechanical switch controlled by a moving wheel.

(Of course it's only been 2 weeks, one cycle per day.)

Remove NOPSAM to email me. Please let
me know if you have posted also.

On Thu, 27 Oct 2005 14:44:42 -0700, "Roger Taylor"
wrote:


Three years ago we changed about 40 bulbs throughout the house with compact
fluorescents, and only one has burnt out. The lights are instant-on, do not
flicker, are a pleasing yellow-white light,

I got a couple at a surplus store for 2 dollars a piece. I think they
were the previous generation.

Then two for a dollar each at a dollar store. Again, I think a
previous generation.

They have a blue white light. I wouldn't use them by themselves,
because I think the frequency range is too narrow. Of course I'm
thinking of other fluorescent lights that, for example, make someone
look ugly when that is the only light. Incandescent lights have a
wide range of frequencies.

So I use one in a big room with an incandescnent light in the other
fixture.

- the covered ones
only for exterior exposed areas.

I found one that looks like a floodlight in the trash. The glass was
broken, but I could just unscrew the whole cover and there was a
regular coiled CF bulb underneath.


Remove NOPSAM to email me. Please let
me know if you have posted also.

I'm using one with an electric timer, not an electronic one.

But I thought both were either totally off or totally on. I don't see
how they could damage the bulb. The electric one at least just has a
mechanical switch controlled by a moving wheel.

That's fine. What you want to avoid is anything where the power switching
is done electronically like with a triac. Even that would probably be ok
if you could be sure that it passed the full waveform when on but unless
you put a scope on it you may not know. Light dimmers fall into this
category...their dimming action is due to not passing the full waveform.

Some but not all photoelectric switches work this way. I have one like
that and it was notable for turning a lamp (regular incandescant) on and
off gradually--as daylight changed--it dimmed the bulb up or down. I
recently replaced it with one that was full on / full off with an internal
relay. I suppose there may be some electronic timers designed specifically
for incandescents lights that work the same way. But if the electronics
drives a relay to do the actual switching, or certainly an
electromechanical timer, will be just fine.

On 27-Oct-2005, "Walter R." wrote:

Threw out all incandescents except a few
to use with dimmers.

You can get dimmable CFLs at many big box reno stores like Home Depot.

Mike

On 27-Oct-2005, "BE" wrote:

Yes, that's a good question. Do brands matter? Westinghouse, Panasonic,
Sylvania, TCP etc.?

You can get different colour CFLs from a single manufacturer. Basically,
some give you the choice of whether you want a colder or warmer colour.
Philips, for example, sells soft white and daylight versions.

You can also get instant-on, dimmable, pot light replacements and others.
Some electronic ballast versions can handle temperatures down to -29C
and are suitable for outdoor use.

There are many types and different features available. If you're close
to a few big box reno stores, a visit and some reading of the fine print
on the packaging can tell you a lot. Google as well.

Mike

wrote:

PS. I have one in my barn that is on 24/7. It uses 9 watts. Just a
dim light for my horses to see where they are at night. That uses 216
watts per day...

You mean 9 watts of power x 24 hours = 216 Wh, ie 0.216 kWh of energy.

(one of these days I am going to put a light sensor on that thing
so it turns off during the day).

A motion detector with incandescent bulbs might use less energy.

Nick

Doug Kanter wrote:

Mine have a cold color. What brand are you using?


I think they're TCP. They are the spiral tube type. Sold in a 6-pack
at that "Walmart of home improvement stores" ... Home Depot. I've not
noticed any need for the bulb to warm up when first turned on - seems
to be almost instantaneous. I'm sold on it. I'll be changing every
bulb in the overhead lighting to these except, as I mentioned any
specialty bulbs like vanity lighting and decorative bulbs.

wrote:

(one of these days I am going to put a light sensor on that thing
so it turns off during the day).

A motion detector with incandescent bulbs might use less energy.

That would totally drive the horses bonkers...

It doesn't bother ours. Then again, they are used to low-flying airplanes.

What I need is a photocell, but it MUST be outside to work...

You might look into X10 motion detector fixtures. Ours can send
a signal at dawn and dusk. Perhaps some gadget can integrate that
to inhibit an indoor X10 light during the day.

Nick

"Steve Kraus" wrote in message
nk.net...
I'm using one with an electric timer, not an electronic one.

But I thought both were either totally off or totally on. I don't see
how they could damage the bulb. The electric one at least just has a
mechanical switch controlled by a moving wheel.

That's fine. What you want to avoid is anything where the power switching
is done electronically like with a triac. Even that would probably be ok
if you could be sure that it passed the full waveform when on but unless
you put a scope on it you may not know. Light dimmers fall into this
category...their dimming action is due to not passing the full waveform.

Some but not all photoelectric switches work this way. I have one like
that and it was notable for turning a lamp (regular incandescant) on and
off gradually--as daylight changed--it dimmed the bulb up or down. I
recently replaced it with one that was full on / full off with an internal
relay. I suppose there may be some electronic timers designed
specifically
for incandescents lights that work the same way. But if the electronics
drives a relay to do the actual switching, or certainly an
electromechanical timer, will be just fine.

That last sentence if dubious, although well intended. Intermatic makes a
digital timer which uses a small relay to actually switch the light. The
package says it's OK to use with compact fluorescent bulbs, but I had 3 of
these timers go bad on me. The company said the relay was just too small for
don't recall this part blah blah blah, and they wouldn't have it modified
and ready for sale until next year. They ended up sending me a different
model whose final switching stage is non-mechanical, and I'm back to using
an incandescent bulb for my porch. If I had the time, I'd run a line to the
cellar and install the old-style timer - the kind in the grey metal box with
a wheel inside.

Anyway, you have to check the instructions that come with a timer, and even
then, it still may not work.

On Fri, 28 Oct 2005 04:20:25 GMT, Steve Kraus
wrote:

I'm using one with an electric timer, not an electronic one.

But I thought both were either totally off or totally on. I don't see
how they could damage the bulb. The electric one at least just has a
mechanical switch controlled by a moving wheel.

That's fine. What you want to avoid is anything where the power switching
is done electronically like with a triac. Even that would probably be ok
if you could be sure that it passed the full waveform when on but unless
you put a scope on it you may not know. Light dimmers fall into this
category...their dimming action is due to not passing the full waveform.

Thanks. I didn't know about the triac stuff etc. I guess I've never
had one.

Some but not all photoelectric switches work this way. I have one like
that and it was notable for turning a lamp (regular incandescant) on and
off gradually--as daylight changed--it dimmed the bulb up or down. I
recently replaced it with one that was full on / full off with an internal
relay. I suppose there may be some electronic timers designed specifically
for incandescents lights that work the same way. But if the electronics
drives a relay to do the actual switching, or certainly an
electromechanical timer, will be just fine.


Remove NOPSAM to email me. Please let
me know if you have posted also.

"Roger Taylor" wrote in message
. ..

"BE" wrote in message
...
Howdy, anyone here have any experience with Compact Fluorescent light
bulbs? My wife just had an Oprah moment and is singing their praises.
http://www.servicelighting.com/catalog_product_list.cfm?cat_num=020203&link_c=lig ht-bulbs-fluorescents
I'm sure that there is an energy saving, not sure about the type of
light - if its annoying to anyone etc.

Three years ago we changed about 40 bulbs throughout the house with
compact fluorescents, and only one has burnt out. The lights are
instant-on, do not flicker, are a pleasing yellow-white light, and take
less than 1/4 the juice to run, vs incandescents, so payout at two dollars
a whack (common on-sale price) is impressively short.. You get the drift
. . . .we've become total fans.
Please be aware on the website you post, the prices shown at service
lighting are outrageous. We pay about 2 bucks a bulb or less, when you get
six packs, say, at Home Depot. Our local ACE hardware sells the same
models for 6-8 bucks per bulb. Don't get it.
Also, be aware that the "covered" bulbs have less light output, and heat
up more. We always get the exposed spiral shaped compacts - the covered
ones only for exterior exposed areas.

There is one other thing to be aware of. Equivalent CF bulbs are quite a
bit longer than their incandescent equivalents. This makes them impractical
for wall sconces, because the tip of the bulp pokes out through the top (or
bottom) of the sconces. Other than that, they work well.

Call your electric company. The last time our power company had a sale on
them, they cost a dollar apiece, and if you bought ten of a given wattage
they tossed in two extras. I haven't tried any outside yet, but I'll give
it a shot the next time a bulb goes. I did try one in a motion light once,
and it flickered like a candle and never acheived full brightness.

I've been using them since they first came out, probably almost two
decades ago.

They save a lot of electricity-- they use what, 1/6 of the electricity?
Here in NY that's significant.

I haven't noticed any color difference-- perhaps an artist might notice
the difference but I have a friend who is an artist and he's never said
anything about the lighting in my house.

They last a LOT longer, so even at $6 a bulb (more than they cost now)
they saved money-- both on lifespan and on electricity. And I don't
think electricity is going to get cheaper over time...

The previous generation of bulb took a few seconds to get started, got
dimmer over time (but LONG after a regular bulb would have burned out
and been replaced several times-- I still have a couple of the first
generation bulbs in my basement because I'm too lazy to replace them,
and they're 15+ years old), didn't work well in the cold and were
bigger than regular bulbs.

The current generation is about the same size, the color seems okay
(maybe comparing the two you could tell the difference but you probably
wouldn't notice if someone just switched your lights without telling
you) and aren't too expensive. They also seem okay in the cold-- I put
a one in my outdoor motion detector light and it's okay (it does take a
second or two to get started when it's below 30 degrees; that's why the
other bulb is incandescent). The only issue is that they won't work
with dimmers or with switches such as X-10 that allow remote-control of
lighting and can sense when lights are on/off.

Oh, they also don't produce nearly as much heat-- so in the summertime
they'll also save on air conditioning costs (and if you're thinking
that in winter the heat isn't so bad, well, okay, they'll save you a
BIT less money because heat is good, but the price you're paying for
that bit of electric heat is quite high).

Shaun Eli
www.BrainChampagne.com
Brain Champagne: Clever Comedy for the Smarter Audience (sm) and a
thrifty person

"k" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Roger Taylor" wrote in message
. ..

"BE" wrote in message
...
Howdy, anyone here have any experience with Compact Fluorescent light
bulbs? My wife just had an Oprah moment and is singing their praises.
http://www.servicelighting.com/catalog_product_list.cfm?cat_num=020203&link_c=lig ht-bulbs-fluorescents
I'm sure that there is an energy saving, not sure about the type of
light - if its annoying to anyone etc.

Three years ago we changed about 40 bulbs throughout the house with
compact fluorescents, and only one has burnt out. The lights are
instant-on, do not flicker, are a pleasing yellow-white light, and take
less than 1/4 the juice to run, vs incandescents, so payout at two
dollars a whack (common on-sale price) is impressively short.. You get
the drift . . . .we've become total fans.

SNIP

In my experience, they work very well and are much improved compared to 3-5
years ago. Buy the "Energy Star" labeled versions. Those types have gone
through an evaluation process to make sure that they meet life, light output
and color standards.

Look at the lighting fixtures at www.lightingfortomorrow.com for some ideas
about new lighting fixtures that are designed to use CFLs.

TKM

"k" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Roger Taylor" wrote in message
. ..

"BE" wrote in message
...
Howdy, anyone here have any experience with Compact Fluorescent light
bulbs? My wife just had an Oprah moment and is singing their praises.
http://www.servicelighting.com/catalog_product_list.cfm?cat_num=020203&link_c=lig ht-bulbs-fluorescents
I'm sure that there is an energy saving, not sure about the type of
light - if its annoying to anyone etc.

Three years ago we changed about 40 bulbs throughout the house with
compact fluorescents, and only one has burnt out. The lights are
instant-on, do not flicker, are a pleasing yellow-white light, and take
less than 1/4 the juice to run, vs incandescents, so payout at two
dollars a whack (common on-sale price) is impressively short.. You get
the drift . . . .we've become total fans.
Please be aware on the website you post, the prices shown at service
lighting are outrageous. We pay about 2 bucks a bulb or less, when you
get six packs, say, at Home Depot. Our local ACE hardware sells the same
models for 6-8 bucks per bulb. Don't get it.
Also, be aware that the "covered" bulbs have less light output, and heat
up more. We always get the exposed spiral shaped compacts - the covered
ones only for exterior exposed areas.

SNIP

In my experience, they work very well and are much improved compared to 3-5
years ago. Buy the "Energy Star" labeled versions. Those types have gone
through an evaluation process to make sure that they meet life, light output
and color standards.

Look at the lighting fixtures at www.lightingfortomorrow.com for some ideas
about new lighting fixtures that are designed to use CFLs.

TKM

TKM wrote:

"k" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Roger Taylor" wrote in message
m...

"BE" wrote in message
...

Howdy, anyone here have any experience with Compact Fluorescent light
bulbs? My wife just had an Oprah moment and is singing their praises.
http://www.servicelighting.com/catalog_product_list.cfm?cat_num=020203&link_c=lig ht-bulbs-fluorescents
I'm sure that there is an energy saving, not sure about the type of
light - if its annoying to anyone etc.

Three years ago we changed about 40 bulbs throughout the house with
compact fluorescents, and only one has burnt out. The lights are
instant-on, do not flicker, are a pleasing yellow-white light, and take
less than 1/4 the juice to run, vs incandescents, so payout at two
dollars a whack (common on-sale price) is impressively short.. You get
the drift . . . .we've become total fans.
Please be aware on the website you post, the prices shown at service
lighting are outrageous. We pay about 2 bucks a bulb or less, when you
get six packs, say, at Home Depot. Our local ACE hardware sells the same
models for 6-8 bucks per bulb. Don't get it.
Also, be aware that the "covered" bulbs have less light output, and heat
up more. We always get the exposed spiral shaped compacts - the covered
ones only for exterior exposed areas.


SNIP

In my experience, they work very well and are much improved compared to 3-5
years ago. Buy the "Energy Star" labeled versions. Those types have gone
through an evaluation process to make sure that they meet life, light output
and color standards.

Look at the lighting fixtures at www.lightingfortomorrow.com for some ideas
about new lighting fixtures that are designed to use CFLs.

TKM



i found that topbulb.com has a nice supply and varieties, at least a
year ago. they have a high kelvin rating for natural or white
light(which i prefer, i do not like the yellow light).

On 29-Oct-2005, "TKM" wrote:

Look at the lighting fixtures at www.lightingfortomorrow.com for some ideas
about new lighting fixtures that are designed to use CFLs.

Interesting - but the designs can't use the screw-in CFLs (which are easy to
find in stores) but must use pin-type CFLs which are a tad harder to find.

I guess they are trying to prevent folks from buying the fixtures and then
screwing in a standard incandescent bulb.

Mike

"Michael Daly" wrote in message
...

On 29-Oct-2005, "TKM" wrote:

Look at the lighting fixtures at www.lightingfortomorrow.com for some
ideas
about new lighting fixtures that are designed to use CFLs.

Interesting - but the designs can't use the screw-in CFLs (which are easy
to
find in stores) but must use pin-type CFLs which are a tad harder to find.

I guess they are trying to prevent folks from buying the fixtures and then
screwing in a standard incandescent bulb.

Mike

That's right. If you install a light fixture designed only for CFLs, then
it should not accept lamps with screw bases since then incandescent lamps
could be substituted and the fixture may not be designed to safely take the
higher heat.

Also, some electric utilities pay rebates for installing energy-efficient
CFL fixtures. They typically won't rebate a fixture that can be retrofitted
with incandescent bulbs.

Energy Star approved CFL fixtures require that the proper CFL lamp now be
packed with the fixture. Maybe by the time that lamp burns out, (typically
10,000 hours) pin-base CFLs will be easier to find.

TKM

On 30-Oct-2005, "TKM" wrote:

Energy Star approved CFL fixtures require that the proper CFL lamp now be
packed with the fixture. Maybe by the time that lamp burns out, (typically
10,000 hours) pin-base CFLs will be easier to find.

I know that you can get almost any pin-type CFL (including some really bright
ones like equivalent to 150W incandescent) at electrical suppliers (those that
usually deal with contractors and large-building maintenance companies). But
it's a lot easier to deal with the more common big-box reno stores.

It's about time that we can get fixtures specifically designed for CFLs. I've
been annoyed for years that many standard fixtures don't fit the screw-in CFLs
very well - they either assume the base is small close to the threaded part
and don't clear the ballast or don't provide clearance for taller CFLs.

Mike

Michael Daly wrote:
On 30-Oct-2005, "TKM" wrote:


Energy Star approved CFL fixtures require that the proper CFL lamp now be
packed with the fixture. Maybe by the time that lamp burns out, (typically
10,000 hours) pin-base CFLs will be easier to find.


I know that you can get almost any pin-type CFL (including some really bright
ones like equivalent to 150W incandescent) at electrical suppliers (those that
usually deal with contractors and large-building maintenance companies). But
it's a lot easier to deal with the more common big-box reno stores.

It's about time that we can get fixtures specifically designed for CFLs. I've
been annoyed for years that many standard fixtures don't fit the screw-in CFLs
very well - they either assume the base is small close to the threaded part
and don't clear the ballast or don't provide clearance for taller CFLs.

Mike

I just replaced one of those "7-year" CFL bulbs (44W). It failed after
only 18 months, but what the heck, I only paid $2 for it at one of HD's
sidewalk sales. Out of curiosity, I pulled the base apart to see what
the Chinese put into these things. There were eight, hand-soldered wires
from the four tubes that ended on a round electronic ballast circuit
board. The board has four coils/transformers, nine capacitors, a few
resistors, and two transistors. All of the components were average
quality, and I can see now why these ballasts fail at high temperatures.
These parts were never intended for use at extreme temperatures, and
even a little moisture from condensation would short something out if
the lamp were started cold.

It would make sense to put more money into the quality of the ballast
electronics and use pin-type, replaceable lamps instead of the
throw-away crappola currently used in the screw-base CFL bulbs.

On 30-Oct-2005, Tim Killian wrote:

It would make sense to put more money into the quality of the ballast
electronics and use pin-type, replaceable lamps instead of the
throw-away crappola currently used in the screw-base CFL bulbs.

Absolutely true, but a tad pricey if all you want is to replace the
bulb in a lamp. If you are remodeling a house/room, doing it with
pin type certainly makes sense.

Mike

Michael Daly wrote:
On 30-Oct-2005, Tim Killian wrote:


It would make sense to put more money into the quality of the ballast
electronics and use pin-type, replaceable lamps instead of the
throw-away crappola currently used in the screw-base CFL bulbs.


Absolutely true, but a tad pricey if all you want is to replace the
bulb in a lamp. If you are remodeling a house/room, doing it with
pin type certainly makes sense.

Mike

Another issue I see with the screw-in CFLs is the way heat is
dissipated. As long as the bulb is above the base, heat from the ballast
circuit board will rise up and away from the components. Mounted in any
other position, heat will soak the circuit board and could cause to
premature failure. The circuit board I took out had one, large
electrolytic capacitor mounted on long leads to put it toward the base
end of the lamp. These capacitors tend to dry out and become useless if
they're exposed to heat, and that's probably why the Chinese tried to
locate it away from the other components on the board. Overall, quite a
kludge -- I'm surprised UL approves these things.

Brands matter a lot, both in terms of actual lumen output and in
terms of bulb life. Lights of America is the biggest offender, at
least based upon my direct experiences, those of friends, and the
testers at Consumers' Union (ie, Consumer Reports).

The folks at LOA are aware that the word is getting out about
the poor quality of their products, so they have resorted to marketing
many of their products under pseudonyms. Check the back of the
package on many low cost off-brands and you are likely to read
that the manufacturer is actually LOA.


All brands of bulbs start off dim & yellow, especially in cold applications
such as garages or outdoors. But I've been extremely happy with
them once they warm up.

We buy the 60w and 100w equivalents at Sam's Club in 6 packs,
and we purchase the bigger, 200w equivalents at Walmart. We've
got some of the extremely low power lights and I believe those were
bought at Sam's Club in 3 packs.

I believe that the most recent 6 packs of 100w equivalents that we
purchased at Sam's Club cost $15.50, give or take a few cents. I'm
also fairly certain that the 200w equivalents are $8.88 each at Walmart.

Unfortunately, the purchase price per watt tends to be disproportionately
high for both the low output lights and the high output lights. For many
of our table lamps we have been able to install one or more "Y" adapters
so that we can install multiple 100w equivalent bulbs.

Full spectrum bulbs are also more expensive at all output levels, but
some folks that I know feel that the natural light is worth the extra cost.
The bulbs are reported to be very effective in treating season depression
in some people, but I've also heard that large doses of vitamin D are
equally effective.

In addition to the savings in direct energy consumption, there are other
advantages to the CFs. One is the fact that they produce a lot less heat,
which is important for those of us who run the AC much of the year.

Another advantage is the fact that lamp sockets and wiring last a lot longer
since the fixture is carrying about 75% less current.

One warning: The CFs emit a considerable amount of stray RF noise,
so nearby electronics such as radios may be negatively impacted. I don't
have a wireless LAN setup, but I would imagine that CFs could cause
interference for some folks' wireless Internet systems at home.

Good luck,
Gideon

============================

BE wrote
Yes, that's a good question. Do brands matter? Westinghouse, Panasonic,
Sylvania, TCP etc.?

We had problems with installation orientation when we first purchased
Lights of America bulbs. Some burned out in just a few hours use
upside down. We've had no problems with any other brand.

Gideon

==============

Trekking Tom wrote
Do not install them in a wet environment ( bathroom) or installed
upside down, or inside a globe. The electronic get too hot and will
brun themselves out. I have them in my outdoor lights and they work
great. Also through out the house.

I agree that fixtures should be more "CF friendly." But I should point out
that we've had good luck with some "unfriendly" fixtures by purchasing
socket extenders, which are very easy to find and rather inexpensive.

Gideon

=================

Michael Daly wrote

It's about time that we can get fixtures specifically designed for CFLs. I've
been annoyed for years that many standard fixtures don't fit the screw-in CFLs
very well - they either assume the base is small close to the threaded part
and don't clear the ballast or don't provide clearance for taller CFLs.

Mike