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Old August 21st 11, 01:10 AM posted to rec.woodworking
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Default Hole spacing

Doug Miller wrote:
In article , "dadiOH"
wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:

Then remeasure. You will find that:
- your block is 152mm long.


- you want a 6mm border at each end.


No he doesn't, he wants 1/4" and 6mm doesn't equal that. Close but
no cigar, so much for metric unless you can measure 6.35mm on that
tape


Do you *really* think that 0.35 millimeters (less than 14 thousandths
of an inch) is going to be noticeable? Or are you just trying to be
argumentative?

Had enough of that from SWMBO this past week, don't need it from you
too.


Just pointing out that metric isn't the be-all and end-all

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Old August 21st 11, 01:41 AM posted to rec.woodworking
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Default Hole spacing

On Sat, 20 Aug 2011 10:46:19 -0700, Paul wrote:

My math skills are non existent beyond basic math, and I'm trying to
figure out how to space holes evenly along a center line in an area.
Let's say I have a rectulanglar block, 6" long ,less 1/4" on each end
for a border and I want to evenly space 6- 3/4" holes. How do you figure
that?


No math required - just arithmetic :-).

If you want a 1/4" border at each end, the center of each of the end
holes has to be 5/8" (1/4" + 3/8") from its end.

That leaves 4 3/4" between those 2 holes. In that space you have to put
4 more holes with 5 spaces between holes. 4 3/4" divided by 5 gives a
spacing of just over 15/16" (4.75 / 5 = 0.95).

Since that doesn't come out even, you need to take the slop (1/16") and
redistribute it to each end. So instead of the centers of the end holes
being 5/8" from the end, they should be 21/32" from the end.

Or you could just ignore the slop and have one space be 1/16" wider than
the others :-).

I hope you're aware that those holes are only going to have 3/16" of wood
between each pair.


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Old August 21st 11, 01:48 AM posted to rec.woodworking
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On Sat, 20 Aug 2011 20:53:17 +0000, Doug Miller wrote:

No he doesn't, he wants 1/4" and 6mm doesn't equal that. Close but no
cigar, so much for metric unless you can measure 6.35mm on that tape


Do you *really* think that 0.35 millimeters (less than 14 thousandths of
an inch) is going to be noticeable? Or are you just trying to be
argumentative?


I bought some wood taps and dies once to make some wooden vise screws. I
used a 1" dowel (yes it was 1") for the screw. I cut threads in it and
the hole to receive it with no problem. But the screw wouldn't fit.

Turns out the tap and die were 25mm, not 1" (25.4). So yes, it can make
a difference.

I got a fresh dowel and turned it down to 25mm or a little less.

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw
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Old August 21st 11, 02:02 AM posted to rec.woodworking
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Default Hole spacing

On Saturday, August 20, 2011 3:41:49 PM UTC-7, Mike Marlow wrote:
whit3rd wrote:
On Saturday, August 20, 2011 10:46:19 AM UTC-7, Paul wrote:
My math skills are non existent beyond basic math, and I'm trying to
figure out how to space [6] holes evenly


First, locate hole #1 and #6 (mark the centers on the work). Then
connect those centers with a line.

Draw a second line through #1, and mark off six equal spacings on that
second line (any spacing that comes out evenly on your ruler
will do). Adjust a bevel so that one arm is on the secondary
line, and the other arm connects #6 secondary to #6-actual.
Then with that bevel set, trace from the other marks on the secondary
line to the original line.


I hope the OP could follow that - cause I sure couldn't...


It's the compass-and-straightedge method to evenly divide a line
segment: make a second line that is measured off into N equal
bits, connect the Nth mark on second line to the end of the primary
line segment to make a triangle, then (using a bevel in this case
to replicate the angle) by simlar triangles, construct the equally
spaced points on the original line segment. It doesn't really need
any ruler at all (dividers can make equal-size divisions).
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Old August 21st 11, 03:21 AM posted to rec.woodworking
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Default Hole spacing

In article , "dadiOH" wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:
In article , "dadiOH"
wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:

Then remeasure. You will find that:
- your block is 152mm long.

- you want a 6mm border at each end.

No he doesn't, he wants 1/4" and 6mm doesn't equal that. Close but
no cigar, so much for metric unless you can measure 6.35mm on that
tape


Do you *really* think that 0.35 millimeters (less than 14 thousandths
of an inch) is going to be noticeable? Or are you just trying to be
argumentative?

Had enough of that from SWMBO this past week, don't need it from you
too.


Just pointing out that metric isn't the be-all and end-all

No, but it sure makes the calculations a LOT easier. Reduces the risk of
error, too, because you're always adding either integers or decimals -- not
mixed fractions.


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Old August 21st 11, 03:23 AM posted to rec.woodworking
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Default Hole spacing

In article , Larry Blanchard wrote:
On Sat, 20 Aug 2011 20:53:17 +0000, Doug Miller wrote:

No he doesn't, he wants 1/4" and 6mm doesn't equal that. Close but no
cigar, so much for metric unless you can measure 6.35mm on that tape


Do you *really* think that 0.35 millimeters (less than 14 thousandths of
an inch) is going to be noticeable? Or are you just trying to be
argumentative?


I bought some wood taps and dies once to make some wooden vise screws. I
used a 1" dowel (yes it was 1") for the screw. I cut threads in it and
the hole to receive it with no problem. But the screw wouldn't fit.

Turns out the tap and die were 25mm, not 1" (25.4). So yes, it can make
a difference.

I got a fresh dowel and turned it down to 25mm or a little less.

Totally different context. When you're talking about fitting a shaft into a
hole, tolerances of 0.005" or less can be critical. When you're talking about
a border around something, the difference between 1/4" and 6mm is unlikely to
be important to anyone, or indeed even noticeable.
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Old August 21st 11, 04:46 AM posted to rec.woodworking
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Default Hole spacing

On 2011-08-20 13:46:19 -0400, "Paul" said:

a rectulanglar block, 6" long ,less 1/4" on each end for a border and I
want to evenly space 6- 3/4" holes


Here's a way to do it by only actually measuring two points. The rest
is mechaincal division.

SInce you're spacing 3/4' holes within 5 1/2 inches, you've already
defined a 1/4" border on each end. The radius of your hole is 3/8".
Thus, the centerpoint of each outer hole is 5/8" from the edge. Mark
those points.

Now, draw a line though each point, parallel to the ends of the board.
Since you're marking the center points of 4 holes and using the center
point of the other outer hole as your terminus, choose a number easily
divisible by five (like, oh, 7.5 or 10). Lay the zero point of your
ruler on one line. Swing the ruler until your chosen number lies on the
other line you've already drawn.

Then, just mark the correct divisions (1 1/2, 3... or 2,4, 6...) and
you've marked the center points for the other four holes. Draw lines
through those points and parallel to the ends crossing your center
line, and you're done.

You can, of course, tell people how brutal the math was in calculating
those points... but if you wanted to add the same dimension (x2)
outside your row of holes as between each hole, the math is more than I
want to deal with.


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Old August 21st 11, 04:57 AM posted to rec.woodworking
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Default Hole spacing

whit3rd wrote in
.
com:

First, locate hole #1 and #6 (mark the centers on the work). Then
connect those centers with a line.

Draw a second line through #1, and mark off six equal spacings on
that second line (any spacing that comes out evenly on your ruler
will do). Adjust a bevel so that one arm is on the secondary
line, and the other arm connects #6 secondary to #6-actual.
Then with that bevel set, trace from the other marks on the
secondary line to the original line.


I hope the OP could follow that - cause I sure couldn't...


It's the compass-and-straightedge method to evenly divide a line
segment: make a second line that is measured off into N equal
bits, connect the Nth mark on second line to the end of the primary
line segment to make a triangle, then (using a bevel in this case
to replicate the angle) by simlar triangles, construct the equally
spaced points on the original line segment. It doesn't really need
any ruler at all (dividers can make equal-size divisions).


An interesting method. Here's the first hit for a webpage describing
the method: http://www.mathopenref.com/constdividesegment.html

Sometimes geometry is much easier than algebra.

I apologize in advance if the flash app at the top is something
undesired. I don't have flash installed on my system so I can't see it.

Puckdropper
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Old August 21st 11, 05:41 AM posted to rec.woodworking
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Default Hole spacing

On Aug 20, 1:46*pm, "Paul" wrote:
My math skills are non existent beyond basic math, and I'm trying to figure
out how to space holes evenly along a center line in an area. Let's say I
have a rectulanglar block, 6" long ,less 1/4" on each end for a border and I
want to evenly space 6- 3/4" holes. How do you figure that? My
daughter-in-law says you can do that in one of those cheap home design
programs. That would be ideal for me. Anyone use one of those programs that
knows if they can be used for that? Thanks.


Equal divisions on a line using a ruler held at an angle. No
calculation required.
http://www.tpub.com/math1/19.htm
and
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYiDDjpWsuk

Online calculators:
http://www.virginiarailingandgates.com/calculations.asp

There's an app for that:
http://www.gabrioconstruction.com/BalusterPro/Home.html

R
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Old August 21st 11, 12:44 PM posted to rec.woodworking
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Default Hole spacing

On 08/20/2011 01:46 PM, Paul wrote:
My math skills are non existent beyond basic math, and I'm trying to
figure out how to space holes evenly along a center line in an area.
Let's say I have a rectulanglar block, 6" long ,less 1/4" on each end
for a border and I want to evenly space 6- 3/4" holes. How do you figure
that? My daughter-in-law says you can do that in one of those cheap home
design programs. That would be ideal for me. Anyone use one of those
programs that knows if they can be used for that? Thanks.


You don't need math:

Set the ruler (or tape measure) on a diagonal across the piece so that
the 6" mark is even with one end the 0" is on the other end. Mark off 1"
increments on the diagonal. You can also use even multiples of the
spaces needed, say 30" and mark off every 2" for 15 spaces.

John


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