I got a look as some of their tools today. While they do seem quality
tools and have some nice features I don't see anything that to me
justifies the cost. Can anyone with experience with the tools tell me
why they cost 2-4X what a good quality tool cost?

ron

Hello Ron,
My only experience in comparing tools was the Festool sanders (Rotex
and Delta shape oscilating sanders) to some other brands that I've
owned or demo'd. I was impressed with the little amount of dust the
Festool left behind and the minimal vibration I encountered. The
sanders felt very stabile and the finish they left was better than I
was ever able to obtain in my prior attempts at sanding. I'm sure
there is a lot of subjectivity in my opinion but I used to hate the
sanding part of my woodworking projects and now I enjoy hooking up my
two festool sanders to their vacuum and spending an evening sanding.

Altough I also bought a Domino, I never had any experience with a
biscuit type joiner but the Domino made it all look so easy (and it
is!) and I'm pleased with the my purchase.

Do I think they are worth 2 to 4 times the cost of other tools?
"Yes", if you can afford it and "Yes", if it makes you feel better
using it. Or "No", if you think you can do just as well with a
modestly priced tool.
Marc

On Feb 20, 9:45*pm, r payne wrote:
I got a look as some of their tools today. *While they do seem quality
tools and have some nice features I don't see anything that to me
justifies the cost. *Can anyone with experience with the tools tell me
why they cost 2-4X what a good quality tool cost?

ron

"r payne" wrote:

I got a look as some of their tools today. While they do seem
quality
tools and have some nice features I don't see anything that to me
justifies the cost. Can anyone with experience with the tools tell
me
why they cost 2-4X what a good quality tool cost?

They are German.

Much as that sounds strictly like a smart ass comment, it is designed
to convey a message.

In our everyday life, we represent some German companies selling their
products here in the US.

Almost always, they are higher priced than their competitors.

Getting that first order is often a challenge.

However, once a customer uses a product, recognises the engineering
content, the cost becomes much less of an issue.

I have not used any Festool products, but the above probably applies.

That said, you have to make the decision whether they are a worthwill
investment for your application.

Have fun.

Lew

"r payne" wrote in message
...
I got a look as some of their tools today. While they do seem quality
tools and have some nice features I don't see anything that to me
justifies the cost. Can anyone with experience with the tools tell me
why they cost 2-4X what a good quality tool cost?

ron


I have their CT 22 vacuum, the Domino, and the 125 Rotex sander. Why pay
more? Test drive one.

For me the vacuum is, most of all, QUIET. ;~) It mates with almost every
Festool tool flawlessly and rolls around beautifully. The Domino is, well a
one of a kind tool. The Domino was initially why I bought a Festool tool.
the vacuum was pretty much necessary and I did not want to listen to the
typical shop vac any more. Robatoy has always tooted his whistle about his
Rotex sanders and I was ready to retire my dust spewing 18 year old PC right
angle ROS. The Rotex runs circles around the PC and sucks up 99% of all the
dust with the vac.

Put your hands on one and demo the tool and you should see why the price is
higher. 3 year warranty, 30 day money back guarantee IIRC. Cases that are
stackable and latch on to each other. Detachable power cords that can be
left with the vac and used on other Festool tools. Oddly, I have come to
like the Festool pricing policy. Your local dealer will be the cheapest
place to buy the tool because every one has to sell the tool for the price
that Festool suggests. I cannot say that I have ever heard of anyone
bitching about a Festool tool. I will add that I find the Festool sand
paper to not be far out of line with the competition. For the Rubin 5" H&L
disks you pay $19.50 for 50 disks. Dust extraction is so good that the disk
lasts longer and so far they do not get clogged up. You have to rely on
seeing progress slow down to know when to change out the paper. The paper
typically looks brand new after use.

If money is tight or you are going to be an occasional user the Festool may
not be right for you. If money is not an issue rest assured that you will
enjoy the experience of owning and using one. With the 30 day money back
guarantee you have little to risk.

BTY the less expensive ETS125 ROS sander can be held in place and guided
with a very light tough of your finger centered on the top. $165.00. If
you buy a vac at the same time most all tools offer a discount on the combo.

.......and to follow up on what Leon said about the vacuum, I also use
it in conjunction with my Porter Cable 7&1/4 circular saw , my Makita
10 inch CMS and my Leigh dovetail jig dust collector system. (Brand
names mentioned to let you know that the vac hooks up easily to a lot
of different tools- no bragging attempted.) Unlike my older shop vacs
the remote start and small diameter hose are a perfect combo with
these two non-Festool tools. Plus, the clean up is so easy too. The
bags come with their own closure and you can really fill them up
before there is any noticeable loss of performance.
And did I mention in a previous post that my wife loves vaccuming the
house with the CT-22? I may have to buy another one, damnit! (No
smiley face icon but you get my drift.)
Marc (who has no affiliation with
Festool, its dealers, or Tyra Banks but would enjoy any preferential
dealings from any of them in the future.)

"marc rosen" wrote in message
...
......and to follow up on what Leon said about the vacuum, I also use
it in conjunction with my Porter Cable 7&1/4 circular saw , my Makita
10 inch CMS and my Leigh dovetail jig dust collector system. (Brand
names mentioned to let you know that the vac hooks up easily to a lot
of different tools- no bragging attempted.) Unlike my older shop vacs
the remote start and small diameter hose are a perfect combo with
these two non-Festool tools. Plus, the clean up is so easy too. The
bags come with their own closure and you can really fill them up
before there is any noticeable loss of performance.
And did I mention in a previous post that my wife loves vaccuming the
house with the CT-22? I may have to buy another one, damnit! (No
smiley face icon but you get my drift.)
Marc (who has no affiliation with
Festool, its dealers, or Tyra Banks but would enjoy any preferential
dealings from any of them in the future.)


Works great with the Kreg pocket hole jig also.

Ron,

If the 2-4X the cost of a good quality tool wasn't enough for you, here's a
heads up on the upcoming Festool price increase. This, according to a recent
message from McFeely's.

http://www.mcfeelys.com/info/festool-alert.htm

You may want to look at some of the closeout items that appear at times when
new products are introduced. I picked up a PS-2 jigsaw that way and am very
pleased with it. Very smooth cuts and easy to use.

Peter.

"r payne" wrote in message
...
I got a look as some of their tools today. While they do seem quality
tools and have some nice features I don't see anything that to me
justifies the cost. Can anyone with experience with the tools tell me
why they cost 2-4X what a good quality tool cost?

ron

On Feb 21, 8:21*am, "Leon" wrote:
"marc rosen" wrote in message

...



......and to follow up on what Leon said about the vacuum, I also use
it in conjunction with my Porter Cable 7&1/4 circular saw , my Makita
10 inch CMS and my Leigh dovetail jig dust collector system. *(Brand
names mentioned to let you know that the vac hooks up easily to a lot
of different tools- no bragging attempted.) Unlike my older shop vacs
the remote start and small diameter hose are a perfect combo with
these two non-Festool tools. Plus, the clean up is so easy too. *The
bags come with their own closure and you can really fill them up
before there is any noticeable loss of performance.
And did I mention in a previous post that my wife loves vaccuming the
house with the CT-22? *I may have to buy another one, damnit! (No
smiley face icon but you get my drift.)
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * *Marc (who has no affiliation with
Festool, its dealers, or Tyra Banks but would enjoy any preferential
dealings from any of them in the future.)

Works great with the Kreg pocket hole jig also.

Yup, that's when the auto-start really shines.

On Feb 20, 10:29 pm, "Lew Hodgett" wrote:


However, once a customer uses a product, recognises the engineering
content, the cost becomes much less of an issue.

I have not used any Festool products, but the above probably applies.

Just got some, but no time yet to do much. The engineering is obvious,
from the get-go. Results? Later for that, but I expect nothing
marginal and much excellence. We shall see.

"Charlie Self" wrote in message
...
On Feb 20, 10:29 pm, "Lew Hodgett" wrote:


However, once a customer uses a product, recognises the engineering
content, the cost becomes much less of an issue.

I have not used any Festool products, but the above probably applies.

Just got some, but no time yet to do much. The engineering is obvious,
from the get-go. Results? Later for that, but I expect nothing
marginal and much excellence. We shall see.



Charlie, what tool/tools in particular did you get?

My point, if I have one, is once you go beyond some price for a given thing you
are no longer paying for an increase in quality. As a carpenter I've used
Bosch, Makita, DeWalt, Ryobi, Rigid, Craftsman, Porter Cable and others. Some
are better than others and in general the better once cost some more. But from
what I've seen there is not enough improvement in Festool to justify costing so
much more than what else is out there. That is why I asked for opinions from
those who have used them.

ron

Peter Bogiatzidis wrote:

Ron,

If the 2-4X the cost of a good quality tool wasn't enough for you, here's a
heads up on the upcoming Festool price increase. This, according to a recent
message from McFeely's.

http://www.mcfeelys.com/info/festool-alert.htm

You may want to look at some of the closeout items that appear at times when
new products are introduced. I picked up a PS-2 jigsaw that way and am very
pleased with it. Very smooth cuts and easy to use.

Peter.

"r payne" wrote in message
...
I got a look as some of their tools today. While they do seem quality
tools and have some nice features I don't see anything that to me
justifies the cost. Can anyone with experience with the tools tell me
why they cost 2-4X what a good quality tool cost?

ron

"r payne" wrote in message
...
My point, if I have one, is once you go beyond some price for a given
thing you
are no longer paying for an increase in quality. As a carpenter I've used
Bosch, Makita, DeWalt, Ryobi, Rigid, Craftsman, Porter Cable and others.
Some
are better than others and in general the better once cost some more. But
from
what I've seen there is not enough improvement in Festool to justify
costing so
much more than what else is out there. That is why I asked for opinions
from
those who have used them.

Well the Festool line of tools are not what I could consider "carpenter
tools". Carpenters generally don't require the precision unless they are
getting into built in cabinets. With the Festool line one could get closer
to furniture grade wood working and maybe with out the need or a TS or RAS.
The way you are speaking it seems that you have not actually used a Festool
tool. For the most part Festool is not so much the single tool as much as
it is a system that permits sawing, sanding, or routing inside someone's
home. In addition to the perceived limited increase in quality that you
mention the tools tend to out perform as well.

Please quit talking about the virtues of Festool as I am extra poor this
year.

cm


"Leon" wrote in message
t...

"Charlie Self" wrote in message
...
On Feb 20, 10:29 pm, "Lew Hodgett" wrote:


However, once a customer uses a product, recognises the engineering
content, the cost becomes much less of an issue.

I have not used any Festool products, but the above probably applies.

Just got some, but no time yet to do much. The engineering is obvious,
from the get-go. Results? Later for that, but I expect nothing
marginal and much excellence. We shall see.



Charlie, what tool/tools in particular did you get?

Leon wrote:

"r payne" wrote in message
...
My point, if I have one, is once you go beyond some price for a given
thing you
are no longer paying for an increase in quality. As a carpenter I've used
Bosch, Makita, DeWalt, Ryobi, Rigid, Craftsman, Porter Cable and others.
Some
are better than others and in general the better once cost some more. But
from
what I've seen there is not enough improvement in Festool to justify
costing so
much more than what else is out there. That is why I asked for opinions
from
those who have used them.

Well the Festool line of tools are not what I could consider "carpenter
tools". Carpenters generally don't require the precision unless they are
getting into built in cabinets. With the Festool line one could get closer
to furniture grade wood working and maybe with out the need or a TS or RAS.
The way you are speaking it seems that you have not actually used a Festool
tool. For the most part Festool is not so much the single tool as much as
it is a system that permits sawing, sanding, or routing inside someone's
home. In addition to the perceived limited increase in quality that you
mention the tools tend to out perform as well.

I thought I said I had not used them. And I have done built in cabinets and
worked on million dollar houses. In my experience a top quality blade and good
straight edge makes more difference than brand of tool if there is a minimum
level of quality. Bosch, Rigid, Makita, Porter Cable and DeWalt generally meet
that minimum quality. Older Craftsman do as well. The rest is the skill of the
user and I don't see any improvement short of a panel saw that will compensate
for that.

I'm not trying to run down Festool even if it may seem that way, I'm just trying
to understand the expense of the tool, is there that much bang for the buck?

ron

"r payne" wrote in message
...

Snip



I'm not trying to run down Festool even if it may seem that way, I'm just
trying
to understand the expense of the tool, is there that much bang for the
buck?

ron


You have received many answers to question about bang for you buck. Those
of us that own the tool feel that the price is justified. You apparently
are still having a hard time understanding the value through questions and
answers. I'll suggest once again that you put your hands on one an try it
out. There is a 30 money back guarantee so the risk is minimal. Go to
your local dealer for a hands on demonstration.

On Feb 22, 12:13*am, r payne wrote:
Leon wrote:
"r payne" wrote in message
...
My point, if I have one, is once you go beyond some price for a given
thing you
are no longer paying for an increase in quality. *As a carpenter I've used
Bosch, Makita, DeWalt, Ryobi, Rigid, Craftsman, Porter Cable and others.
Some
are better than others and in general the better once cost some more. *But
from
what I've seen there is not enough improvement in Festool to justify
costing so
much more than what else is out there. *That is why I asked for opinions
from
those who have used them.

Well the Festool line of tools are not what I could consider "carpenter
tools". *Carpenters generally don't require the precision unless they are
getting into built in cabinets. *With the Festool line one could get closer
to furniture grade wood working and maybe with out the need or a TS or RAS.
The way you are speaking it seems that you have not actually used a Festool
tool. *For the most part Festool is not so much the single tool as much as
it is a system that permits sawing, sanding, or routing inside someone's
home. *In addition to the perceived limited increase in quality that you
mention the tools tend to out perform as well.

I thought I said I had not used them. *And I have done built in cabinets and
worked on million dollar houses. *In my experience a top quality blade and good
straight edge makes more difference than brand of tool if there is a minimum
level of quality. *Bosch, Rigid, Makita, Porter Cable and DeWalt generally meet
that minimum quality. *Older Craftsman do as well. *The rest is the skill of the
user and I don't see any improvement short of a panel saw that will compensate
for that.

I'm not trying to run down Festool even if it may seem that way, I'm just trying
to understand the expense of the tool, is there that much bang for the buck?

ron

The quality increase, relative to dollars spent, seems to be
exponential.
Is a Festool worth the money? Absolutely.
It all has to do with what a tool is worth to you. If you have the
damn thing in your hands all day, and you want consistent and reliable
results, what is an extra couple of hundred dollars over the life-time
of the tool?

Having said that (Strunk & White roll over in their graves every time
somebody say that, btw) I don't believe that ALL Festool tools are
worth their premium. The Bosch jigsaw comes to mind, so do misc.
cordless drills/drivers. Nice, but too rich for my blood.
Plunge saws and sanders, and even that # 2000 router, well, there
simply isn't anything that compares.

On Feb 21, 11:13*pm, r payne wrote:
Leon wrote:
"r payne" wrote in message
...
My point, if I have one, is once you go beyond some price for a given
thing you
are no longer paying for an increase in quality. *As a carpenter I've used
Bosch, Makita, DeWalt, Ryobi, Rigid, Craftsman, Porter Cable and others.
Some
are better than others and in general the better once cost some more. *But
from
what I've seen there is not enough improvement in Festool to justify
costing so
much more than what else is out there. *That is why I asked for opinions
from
those who have used them.

Well the Festool line of tools are not what I could consider "carpenter
tools". *Carpenters generally don't require the precision unless they are
getting into built in cabinets. *With the Festool line one could get closer
to furniture grade wood working and maybe with out the need or a TS or RAS.
The way you are speaking it seems that you have not actually used a Festool
tool. *For the most part Festool is not so much the single tool as much as
it is a system that permits sawing, sanding, or routing inside someone's
home. *In addition to the perceived limited increase in quality that you
mention the tools tend to out perform as well.

I thought I said I had not used them. *And I have done built in cabinets and
worked on million dollar houses. *In my experience a top quality blade and good
straight edge makes more difference than brand of tool if there is a minimum
level of quality. *Bosch, Rigid, Makita, Porter Cable and DeWalt generally meet
that minimum quality. *Older Craftsman do as well. *The rest is the skill of the
user and I don't see any improvement short of a panel saw that will compensate
for that.

You seem to be missing the obvious point of what makes Festool
different. A Bosch, DeWalt, Porter Cable, Makita, Milwaukee, Hitachi,
Skil, Sears, Black&Decker, etc. circular saw all look alike and act
alike. They are all interchangeable. Spray paint them all the same
color and you cannot tell one from the other. If you put the Festool
circular saw next to the ones above, and it is different. It looks
different. Its used differently. It handles differently. Its still
callled a circular saw but that is about its only thing in common with
the above list of saws. It comes with a guide and is built to use
that guide. It comes ready for dust collection. It has soft start
motor. It has electronics that keep the rpm constant. It has various
speed levels for different blades and material being cut. It has a
pluge mechanism to make blind cuts. None of the saws in the list
above have these features. Some of the other Festool tools have
similar amounts of difference from their common namesake tools from
the manufacturers you listed. Some Festool are very similar to the
general tools and have very little feature differences. The saws and
Domino are probably the most different tools.

Festool has dealers all over the US. You'll have to try one to know
if its worth it.





I'm not trying to run down Festool even if it may seem that way, I'm just trying
to understand the expense of the tool, is there that much bang for the buck?

ron- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

wrote:
If you put the Festool
circular saw next to the ones above, and it is different. It looks
different. Its used differently. It handles differently. Its still
callled a circular saw but that is about its only thing in common with
the above list of saws. It comes with a guide and is built to use
that guide. It comes ready for dust collection. It has soft start
motor. It has electronics that keep the rpm constant. It has various
speed levels for different blades and material being cut. It has a
pluge mechanism to make blind cuts. None of the saws in the list
above have these features.

Just thought I'd point out that Makita and DeWalt now have plunge saws
with guide rails. However, they're priced close to Festool.

Chris

"Chris Friesen" wrote in message
...
wrote:
If you put the Festool
circular saw next to the ones above, and it is different. It looks
different. Its used differently. It handles differently. Its still
callled a circular saw but that is about its only thing in common with
the above list of saws. It comes with a guide and is built to use
that guide. It comes ready for dust collection. It has soft start
motor. It has electronics that keep the rpm constant. It has various
speed levels for different blades and material being cut. It has a
pluge mechanism to make blind cuts. None of the saws in the list
above have these features.

Just thought I'd point out that Makita and DeWalt now have plunge saws
with guide rails. However, they're priced close to Festool.


Add PC to the list but like the other 2 it is not yet available to all.
IIRC Europe have them but they are not yet available in the US.

On Feb 21, 5:06 pm, "Leon" wrote:
"Charlie Self" wrote in message

...

On Feb 20, 10:29 pm, "Lew Hodgett" wrote:

However, once a customer uses a product, recognises the engineering
content, the cost becomes much less of an issue.

I have not used any Festool products, but the above probably applies.

Just got some, but no time yet to do much. The engineering is obvious,
from the get-go. Results? Later for that, but I expect nothing
marginal and much excellence. We shall see.

Charlie, what tool/tools in particular did you get?

Lessee. I can't get to the vac at the moment, but there's a PSB 300EQ+
jigsaw, an ETS 150/3 EQ+ ROS, and a TS 55 EQ+ circular saw.

"Charlie Self" wrote in message
...
On Feb 21, 5:06 pm, "Leon" wrote:
"Charlie Self" wrote in message

...

On Feb 20, 10:29 pm, "Lew Hodgett" wrote:

However, once a customer uses a product, recognises the engineering
content, the cost becomes much less of an issue.

I have not used any Festool products, but the above probably applies.

Just got some, but no time yet to do much. The engineering is obvious,
from the get-go. Results? Later for that, but I expect nothing
marginal and much excellence. We shall see.

Charlie, what tool/tools in particular did you get?

Lessee. I can't get to the vac at the moment, but there's a PSB 300EQ+
jigsaw, an ETS 150/3 EQ+ ROS, and a TS 55 EQ+ circular saw.

Ok, that really sucks! ;~) No Domino???? LOL
If you don't mind me asking, is this group of tools for a review? I would
really be interested in your thoughts on the Circle Saw when ever you get
around to it. Of course if you are doing this as a review and for hire/pay
I would be interested in knowing the publication the review would be
appearing in.
Enjoy the tools.

"CM" wrote in message
...
Please quit talking about the virtues of Festool as I am extra poor this
year.

cm

I have recently learned to appreciate the ability to let my imagination
become my reality on items that I cannot afford. It helps in knowing that
if I study the item to death and learn all of its details that it only costs
me my time. The plus side to not actually making the purchase is that I can
imagine making another purchase immediately. LOL
In our spare time my wife and I enjoy looking at homes that uh... are way
out of our league. We can imagine what it would be like to own such a home
but when the reality sets in from the point of view of payments, taxes,
insurance, etc we can imagine another home with out having to sell. ;~)

With all this Festool talk I started looking at the sanders, I have a TS75,
Domino & ct32. I agree worth it if you can afford it, very happy, but on the
sanders there is an awful lot of sandpaper to choose from. For woodworking
which ones do you use?

"Chris" wrote in message
...
With all this Festool talk I started looking at the sanders, I have a
TS75, Domino & ct32. I agree worth it if you can afford it, very happy,
but on the sanders there is an awful lot of sandpaper to choose from. For
woodworking which ones do you use?

Yes there are a lot of sand papers to choose from. Keep in mind that
Festool builds these sanders to be used in other professions also. Auto
body, renovation, painting, solid surfaces, etc. Each of those types of
work require different typed of abrasives. Fortunately, for regular wood
working, sanding on bare wood, you can simply choose the Rubin sand paper in
the grits of your choice. Rubin paper starts at 24 and goes through 180
grit. If you need a finer grit you can use the Brilliant in grits 220
through 400.

99.99% of the time I stop at 180 grit so the Rubin paper is all I need. I
initially purchased 120, 150, and 180. As effective as the Rotex sander is
I will probably seldom use the 120 grit. In the aggressive mode the 150 in
pretty darn fast. With the smaller less aggressive ROS sanders the 120 or
lower may be a better choice to start out with.

" wrote:

SNIP

It comes with a guide and is built to use
that guide. It comes ready for dust collection. It has soft start
motor. It has electronics that keep the rpm constant. It has various
speed levels for different blades and material being cut. It has a
pluge mechanism to make blind cuts.

SNIP

Now we are getting to the nuts and bolts. This is what I was looking for.

ron

"marc rosen" wrote in message
...
Hey Leon,
My paper selection is 80, 120, 240 and 320 and I stop at 240 for most
of my projects but for some I will go to 320 (with either sander;
Rotex RO 150 E+ or the DTS 400). I thought about bridging the gap
between 120 and 240 but I don't really see the need.
I also bought a small pack of 400 but this is so rarely used on wood.
My other hobby is windsurfing and I have a few boards to repair from
last season (epoxy outer skin over carbon fiber) so I plan to try out
my sanders on them when it gets time to make the repairs. The 400
will get used at that time.
Marc


I have only seldom used 80 and for the life of me I cannot remember why I
bought that pack. It was for the old PC right angle ROS. I do recall that
it works great for setting down on a 3M Scotch Brite pad to buff my TS top.
;~)
The first time I used my Rotex I was sanding 1.5" wide Poplar edging
attached to 3/4" thick MDF. The Poplar was a bit thicker than the MDF but
the Poplar sanded down even with the MDF almost instantly using 180 grit.

"r payne" wrote in message
...


" wrote:

SNIP

It comes with a guide and is built to use
that guide. It comes ready for dust collection. It has soft start
motor. It has electronics that keep the rpm constant. It has various
speed levels for different blades and material being cut. It has a
pluge mechanism to make blind cuts.

SNIP

Now we are getting to the nuts and bolts. This is what I was looking
for.


Wee geez r payne. Be more specific. Most any tool can be had that is ready
with dust collection, soft start, ESC and or variable speed.

Might I add the stunning black color highlighted by the green knobs and
switches. ;~)

Just kidding. Really, these tools don't leave any features out that I can
think of. If there is a particular tool that you want to know about it may
be easier to answer your questions. Most every Festool has 1 or more unique
features that stand out from the competition.

OK, now I am ordering you to take a couple of hours off and look at the
array of tools that you dealer will have. It is eye candy galore and you
will be saying geeeee, those are cool features. ;~)

Leon wrote:

"r payne" wrote in message
...


" wrote:

SNIP

It comes with a guide and is built to use
that guide. It comes ready for dust collection. It has soft start
motor. It has electronics that keep the rpm constant. It has various
speed levels for different blades and material being cut. It has a
pluge mechanism to make blind cuts.

SNIP

Now we are getting to the nuts and bolts. This is what I was looking
for.

Wee geez r payne. Be more specific. Most any tool can be had that is ready
with dust collection, soft start, ESC and or variable speed.

Might I add the stunning black color highlighted by the green knobs and
switches. ;~)

Just kidding. Really, these tools don't leave any features out that I can
think of. If there is a particular tool that you want to know about it may
be easier to answer your questions. Most every Festool has 1 or more unique
features that stand out from the competition.

OK, now I am ordering you to take a couple of hours off and look at the
array of tools that you dealer will have. It is eye candy galore and you
will be saying geeeee, those are cool features. ;~)

There is one dealer in town, all other dealers would take most of a day to drive
and visit. I was there for a bit just before i started this thread, but after
standing in front of the display and handling the tools for maybe 20 minutes all
I could say was "they have some nice features but I don't see twice the cost".
And during all that time no one came over to answer any questions I may have or
offer a demo. From what has been posted there may be some new innovations and
new innovations always cost more. So I think I'll wait a couple of years and
see what happens in the market. Although I sounds like what I would try to
design if I was to build one.

ron

"marc rosen" wrote in message

I thought about bridging the gap
between 120 and 240 but I don't really see the need.

Interesting ... Must be something to do with the Rotex because I've never
been able to get away with that big a gap when 'running through the grits'?

I've seen Leon's Rotex in action, was suitably envious, but it's sinfully
rich for my poor boy blood ... at least until I get this last kid out of
college, which could mean that I'll have to go back to hand sanding through
all the grits

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 12/14/07
KarlC@ (the obvious)

Thx for all the info on the paper, so I'm thinking of the 150 FEQ Dual Mode
Sander, it comes with a soft pad, why would I need a hard one? Any other
thoughts on other accessories I should consider with this one? Or do you
prefer a different sander ? Thx for all the feedback.

r payne wrote:

Leon wrote:

"r payne" wrote in message
...

" wrote:

SNIP

It comes with a guide and is built to use
that guide. It comes ready for dust collection. It has soft start
motor. It has electronics that keep the rpm constant. It has various
speed levels for different blades and material being cut. It has a
pluge mechanism to make blind cuts.
SNIP
Now we are getting to the nuts and bolts. This is what I was looking
for.
Wee geez r payne. Be more specific. Most any tool can be had that is ready
with dust collection, soft start, ESC and or variable speed.

Might I add the stunning black color highlighted by the green knobs and
switches. ;~)

Just kidding. Really, these tools don't leave any features out that I can
think of. If there is a particular tool that you want to know about it may
be easier to answer your questions. Most every Festool has 1 or more unique
features that stand out from the competition.

OK, now I am ordering you to take a couple of hours off and look at the
array of tools that you dealer will have. It is eye candy galore and you
will be saying geeeee, those are cool features. ;~)

There is one dealer in town, all other dealers would take most of a day to drive
and visit. I was there for a bit just before i started this thread, but after
standing in front of the display and handling the tools for maybe 20 minutes all
I could say was "they have some nice features but I don't see twice the cost".
And during all that time no one came over to answer any questions I may have or
offer a demo. From what has been posted there may be some new innovations and
new innovations always cost more. So I think I'll wait a couple of years and
see what happens in the market. Although I sounds like what I would try to
design if I was to build one.

ron


It's interesting isn't it? When I first
saw the Festools advertised, I thought,
oh how pretty and didn't give them a
second thought. I wasn't even aware of
the price differential until a few guys
in here started talking about them.

Other than price, I never heard a
contrary word about any Festool that
was under discussion. Now, they seem to
be well on their way to establishing
industry standards at the high-end,
replacing what most people had faith in
for years: DeWalt and PC.

I really don't have the cash to drop
down on even one of these beauties and I
don't think my skill level warrants one,
but what impresses me the most is the
reviews that have been on the Wreck by
some craftsmen that are very hard to
please; Swing, Leon, charlieb, etc. That
brand is now fixed in my mind as
something to attain to

--

Tanus

www.home.mycybernet.net/~waugh/shop/

"Chris" wrote in message
...
Thx for all the info on the paper, so I'm thinking of the 150 FEQ Dual
Mode Sander, it comes with a soft pad, why would I need a hard one? Any
other thoughts on other accessories I should consider with this one? Or do
you prefer a different sander ? Thx for all the feedback.


What is a FEQ 150 sander? I did not see it on the Festool web site.


The soft pad is good for most all general sanding. The hard pad would be
good/better for sanding narrow surfaces that are considerably smaller than
the pad itself such as the edge of a board or sanding past the edge of a
flat surface. The harder pad helps to prevent rounding the edges.

My late wife and I use to do the house thing also during the annual Parade
of Homes and pick a Saturday and go and look at nothing but 1,000,000 dollar
homes and in New Mexico that is one hell of a home. I also spend way to
much time researching and admiring tools I may never be able to buy.
Festool got my attention on the decibel rating of the vac alone and as soon
as I find a way to sell one of the grandkids a Domino and that will adorn my
poor old shop.


--
Mike
Watch for the bounce.
If ya didn't see it, ya didn't feel it.
If ya see it, it didn't go off.
Old Air Force Munitions Saying
IYAAYAS
"Leon" wrote in message
...

"CM" wrote in message
...
Please quit talking about the virtues of Festool as I am extra poor this
year.

cm

I have recently learned to appreciate the ability to let my imagination
become my reality on items that I cannot afford. It helps in knowing that
if I study the item to death and learn all of its details that it only
costs me my time. The plus side to not actually making the purchase is
that I can imagine making another purchase immediately. LOL
In our spare time my wife and I enjoy looking at homes that uh... are way
out of our league. We can imagine what it would be like to own such a
home but when the reality sets in from the point of view of payments,
taxes, insurance, etc we can imagine another home with out having to sell.
;~)

On Sat, 23 Feb 2008 04:18:16 +0000, r payne wrote:

I was there for a bit just before i started this thread, but after
standing in front of the display and handling the tools for maybe 20 minutes all
I could say was "they have some nice features but I don't see twice the cost".
And during all that time no one came over to answer any questions I may have or
offer a demo.

That bothers me. I hope it wasn't a Woodcraft store. I can assure you
that wouldn't happen in the Woodcraft where I work. We've got some
employees who are so sold on Festool that they get positively gleeful at
the opportunity to show them off :-).

r payne wrote:
....
I could say was "they have some nice features but I don't see twice the cost".
....

Amazing what some judicious upscale pretentiousness can do in a
marketing campaign isn't it???

--

"Leon" wrote in message
. net...

"Chris" wrote in message
...
Thx for all the info on the paper, so I'm thinking of the 150 FEQ Dual
Mode Sander, it comes with a soft pad, why would I need a hard one? Any
other thoughts on other accessories I should consider with this one? Or
do you prefer a different sander ? Thx for all the feedback.


What is a FEQ 150 sander? I did not see it on the Festool web site.

Have a look here;

http://www.mcfeelys.com/product/5715...al-Mode-Sander

Larry Blanchard wrote:

On Sat, 23 Feb 2008 04:18:16 +0000, r payne wrote:

I was there for a bit just before i started this thread, but after
standing in front of the display and handling the tools for maybe 20 minutes all
I could say was "they have some nice features but I don't see twice the cost".
And during all that time no one came over to answer any questions I may have or
offer a demo.

That bothers me. I hope it wasn't a Woodcraft store. I can assure you
that wouldn't happen in the Woodcraft where I work. We've got some
employees who are so sold on Festool that they get positively gleeful at
the opportunity to show them off :-).

No it wasn't Woodcraft. I wish there was a Woodcraft store close enought to go to.
This one is a local store owned by a fellow I've had some other dealings with and even
though it is the closest thing to a woodworking tool store less than an hours drive,
it wouldn't bother me if it was gone.


ron

"Larry Blanchard" wrote in message
news
On Sat, 23 Feb 2008 04:18:16 +0000, r payne wrote:

I was there for a bit just before i started this thread, but after
standing in front of the display and handling the tools for maybe 20
minutes all
I could say was "they have some nice features but I don't see twice the
cost".
And during all that time no one came over to answer any questions I may
have or
offer a demo.

That bothers me. I hope it wasn't a Woodcraft store. I can assure you
that wouldn't happen in the Woodcraft where I work. We've got some
employees who are so sold on Festool that they get positively gleeful at
the opportunity to show them off :-).


LOL, I have a brand new Woodcraft store near me that has the full array of
Festool equipment. Every time I mention Festool they direct me to the
display and start showing me the Domino. I have to remind them that I have
had a Domino longer than their store has been existence. And then they
kinda frown.

On Sat, 23 Feb 2008 11:13:13 -0600, dpb wrote:

Amazing what some judicious upscale pretentiousness can do in a
marketing campaign isn't it???

That really isn't true with most Festool items.

Even though I think Systainers are overpriced, every Festool _tool_
I've tried really has been far above the competition. The guys who
use them all day long for a living, and were nice enough to let me, a
part timer try them, also learned of them on job sites where someone
let them try them. There is a 30 day, no questions asked satisfaction
guarantee on Festool products.

In the flying community, Bose communication headsets often draw the
same comments from folks who haven't used them. Hype! Pretentious! A
$1000 headset? etc... Bose also offers a 30 day guarantee. While
most folks with a musical ear will agree that Bose stereo equipment is
typically over-hyped and overpriced, I don't know of a pilot who's
ever returned a Bose aviation headset after actually flying with it
for the 30 day trial. I can say the same for Festool.

Next time you need a tool, try Festool. On the other hand, use any
other brand of tool for 30 days, as you normally would, and try to
return it. G

The good news is that markets aren't static. Festool will seriously
change the handheld power tool world, just as the cordless drill, the
biscuit joiner, and the nail gun did. Mark my words!

Bonehenge (B A R R Y) wrote:
On Sat, 23 Feb 2008 11:13:13 -0600, dpb wrote:

Amazing what some judicious upscale pretentiousness can do in a
marketing campaign isn't it???

That really isn't true with most Festool items.

Even though I think Systainers are overpriced, every Festool _tool_
I've tried really has been far above the competition. ...

You notice I didn't say the tool wasn't a good tool...

I _still_ think they're overpriced, though, and that their marketing
plays into the elitist club thing. W/ sufficient markup on individual
tools, they don't need the tremendous volume. Great for them if they
can continue to make it work.

--