Not really. :-) It's a Herb Circle that SWMBO wants me to build. It's
an outdoor herb garden made with 12 slightly tapered 3' redwood 2x12
planks buried in a 12' circle flush with the ground. She found the
design in a gardening magazine.

The magazine article says, "To prevent cupping and warping score the
bottom of each plank with several 1/8" cuts using a circular saw."

My question is, does this really work?

TIA, Vince

--
Vince Heuring To email, remove the Vince.

Vince Heuring wrote:
Not really. :-) It's a Herb Circle that SWMBO wants me to build. It's
an outdoor herb garden made with 12 slightly tapered 3' redwood 2x12
planks buried in a 12' circle flush with the ground. She found the
design in a gardening magazine.

The magazine article says, "To prevent cupping and warping score the
bottom of each plank with several 1/8" cuts using a circular saw."

My question is, does this really work?

Sure! And it decreases the friction when they slide against the
metal in the ground. Just remember to lap them to .0001. %-)

Dave in Fairfax
--
Dave Leader
reply-to doesn't work
use:
daveldr at att dot net
American Association of Woodturners
http://www.woodturner.org
Capital Area Woodturners
http://www.capwoodturners.org/
PATINA
http://www.Patinatools.org/

Vince Heuring wrote in
om:



Not really. :-) It's a Herb Circle that SWMBO wants me to build.
It's an outdoor herb garden made with 12 slightly tapered 3' redwood
2x12 planks buried in a 12' circle flush with the ground. She found
the design in a gardening magazine.

The magazine article says, "To prevent cupping and warping score the
bottom of each plank with several 1/8" cuts using a circular saw."

My question is, does this really work?

TIA, Vince


She should read the old Mother Earth News articles, and plant in
recycled tires painted white... :-)

The last time I priced all heart redwood 2x12's, I about choked. And
it's a 90 minute drive from here to the Redwood Empire, at least
according to the highway signs, so freight isn't the problem. And
redwood sapwood doesn't have the rot resistance for which one seeks
redwood in the first place.

The redwood is going to last about ten years or so, at least in my
raised bed gardens. It's going to cup anyway, pretty much whatever you
do. I mean, one side is dry, and the other is buried in dirt that you
get wet three times a week, minimum. My advice is to price the redwood,
then ask your wife if she wants the garden that badly. Proceed
according to your best judgement.

Those precast concrete cobblestones make a nice herb garden.

Patriarch

On Mon, 16 May 2005 18:13:44 -0600, Vince Heuring
wrote:

Not really. :-) It's a Herb Circle that SWMBO wants me to build. It's
an outdoor herb garden made with 12 slightly tapered 3' redwood 2x12
planks buried in a 12' circle flush with the ground. She found the
design in a gardening magazine.

I have to agree with Patriarch here. Build it out of something
cheaper like paving stones or something. Even 2x12 spf will last many
years and you can just build another when it starts to go.

I learned my lesson building a compost bin for my wife. I thought
treated would get chemicals in the compost and pine or fir wouldn't
last..... ah ha, redwood. I ordered out some 2x4 and some 1x8 and
built a pretty nice bin with two hinged lids and fronts that slide out
for shoveling and everyone was happy. Then, the material bill came.
I had built the most expensive compost bin known to man! Ten years
later, it's still out there and every spring I get reminded of how
much it cost!
When it finally falls apart, I'm buying her a roll of chicken wire.:-)

Mike O.

Mike wrote:


Ten years
later, it's still out there and every spring I get reminded of how
much it cost!

Amortized over 10 years, it's probably the lowest cost compost bin on
the planet, especially if you use your current labor rate, which is
based on your years of experience building quality compost bins, to
build a replacementG.

Lew

Vince Heuring wrote:

I have to agree with Patriarch here. Build it out of something
cheaper like paving stones or something.

snip

SFWIW, one of the recent This Old House episodes covered using cobble
stones imbedded in concrete to construct an herb garden.

Think it will be around a while.

Lew

On Tue, 17 May 2005 04:11:35 GMT, Lew Hodgett
wrote:

Not easy for building compost tumblers though....

SFWIW, one of the recent This Old House episodes covered using cobble
stones imbedded in concrete to construct an herb garden.

Think it will be around a while.

Lew

On Mon, 16 May 2005 22:13:11 -0500, the inscrutable Patriarch
spake:

Vince Heuring wrote in
news:160520051813441341%VinceHeuring@dimensional. com:



Not really. :-) It's a Herb Circle that SWMBO wants me to build.
It's an outdoor herb garden made with 12 slightly tapered 3' redwood
2x12 planks buried in a 12' circle flush with the ground. She found
the design in a gardening magazine.

The magazine article says, "To prevent cupping and warping score the
bottom of each plank with several 1/8" cuts using a circular saw."

My question is, does this really work?

TIA, Vince


She should read the old Mother Earth News articles, and plant in
recycled tires painted white... :-)

I find it hard to believe that MEN would publish something like that,
given all the chemicals which leach out of the old tires.


The last time I priced all heart redwood 2x12's, I about choked. And

Yeah, take your portable defib to the lumber yard for large decking
lumber. You'll need it.


it's a 90 minute drive from here to the Redwood Empire, at least
according to the highway signs, so freight isn't the problem. And
redwood sapwood doesn't have the rot resistance for which one seeks
redwood in the first place.

It's not as bad up here as it was in CA.


The redwood is going to last about ten years or so, at least in my
raised bed gardens. It's going to cup anyway, pretty much whatever you
do. I mean, one side is dry, and the other is buried in dirt that you
get wet three times a week, minimum. My advice is to price the redwood,
then ask your wife if she wants the garden that badly. Proceed
according to your best judgement.

Excellent idea. Also, rebarred concrete block makes a nice platform.
Use a green concrete stain on it to blend it into the landscape once
it's up and filled.


Those precast concrete cobblestones make a nice herb garden.

I just plant my basil in the ground-level garden with the rest of the
goodies. My tenbuhten will have cantaloupe, buttercrunch lettuce,
spaghetti squash, radishes, carrots, basil, broccoli, green beans,
Oregon sugar pod peas, cabbage, and okra, all from seed. I picked up a
packet of "mixed herbs" free at the home improvement store in town a
couple weeks ago. It contains dill (ick), sweet marjoram, summer
savory, and Italian basil, so I might give it a couple square feet,
too. I'll till tomorrow and put last year's drip irrigation back into
use again. What a difference in plant growth and lack of weeds!


------------------------------------------
Do the voices in my head bother you?
------------------------------------------
http://diversify.com Full-Service Web Development

In article 6,
says...
She should read the old Mother Earth News articles, and plant in
recycled tires painted white... :-)

Gee. MON must have taken tips from my long deceased mother. She planted
tires back in the '30s and '40s. Of course, come to think of it, so did
everyone else in the neighborhood :-).

--
BNSF = Build Now, Seep Forever

Mike wrote in news:uvoi819tou7ja4tr3m46lov4epcq8qr5ci@
4ax.com:
snip
I learned my lesson building a compost bin for my wife. I thought
treated would get chemicals in the compost and pine or fir wouldn't
last..... ah ha, redwood. I ordered out some 2x4 and some 1x8 and
built a pretty nice bin with two hinged lids and fronts that slide out
for shoveling and everyone was happy. Then, the material bill came.
I had built the most expensive compost bin known to man! Ten years
later, it's still out there and every spring I get reminded of how
much it cost!

My compost bin has a concrete block back wall, and recycled redwood side
boards. I'm fortunate that 'fast composting' works well here, though.
Even a modest output of shavings from the planer or lathe seems to fill it
up quickly.

Lew's right. Think of it in terms of labor invested ten years ago, when
you were younger & stronger. The returns are that you don't have to
rebuild any time soon.

Patriarch

Larry Jaques wrote in
:

snip
She should read the old Mother Earth News articles, and plant in
recycled tires painted white... :-)

I find it hard to believe that MEN would publish something like that,
given all the chemicals which leach out of the old tires.


I didn't say it was smart, just that it was published in a known rag back
then. Lotsa stupid stuff said & done in the Seventies.

Patriarch

Patriarch wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote in
:

snip
She should read the old Mother Earth News articles, and plant in
recycled tires painted white... :-)

I find it hard to believe that MEN would publish something like that,
given all the chemicals which leach out of the old tires.


I didn't say it was smart, just that it was published in a known rag back
then. Lotsa stupid stuff said & done in the Seventies.

Other than being butt-ugly, I'd be real surprise to find a significant
problem if simply were washed thoroughly initially. Many large tires
were used as the rim for cattle water tanks for a while--they don't get
bent easily as do metal ones. They became less popular mostly because
they're just too heavy to move around.

On Tue, 17 May 2005 14:21:03 -0500, Patriarch wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote in
:

snip
She should read the old Mother Earth News articles, and plant in
recycled tires painted white... :-)

I find it hard to believe that MEN would publish something like that,
given all the chemicals which leach out of the old tires.

I didn't say it was smart, just that it was published in a known rag back
then. Lotsa stupid stuff said & done in the Seventies.

Thing about the tires - if they're leaching, why are they used for
retaining walls in Golden Gate Park, Larry?

Dave Hinz wrote in
:

On Tue, 17 May 2005 14:21:03 -0500, Patriarch
wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote in
:

snip
She should read the old Mother Earth News articles, and plant in
recycled tires painted white... :-)

I find it hard to believe that MEN would publish something like
that, given all the chemicals which leach out of the old tires.

I didn't say it was smart, just that it was published in a known rag
back then. Lotsa stupid stuff said & done in the Seventies.

Thing about the tires - if they're leaching, why are they used for
retaining walls in Golden Gate Park, Larry?


So you're telling us they are completely safe, and the tire disposal fee
and hazardous waste disposal fee and the rest of the handling taxes imposed
here in California are bogus? Who would have thought?

I guess you just can't trust politicians these days... ;-)

Patriarch

"Patriarch" wrote in message =
. 97.136...
| Dave Hinz wrote in
| :=20
|=20
| On Tue, 17 May 2005 14:21:03 -0500, Patriarch
| wrote:=20
| Larry Jaques wrote in=20
| :
|
| snip
| She should read the old Mother Earth News articles, and plant in
| recycled tires painted white... :-)=20
| =20
| I find it hard to believe that MEN would publish something like
| that, given all the chemicals which leach out of the old tires.
|
| I didn't say it was smart, just that it was published in a known =
rag
| back then. Lotsa stupid stuff said & done in the Seventies.
| =20
| Thing about the tires - if they're leaching, why are they used for
| retaining walls in Golden Gate Park, Larry?
| =20
|=20
| So you're telling us they are completely safe, and the tire disposal =
fee=20
| and hazardous waste disposal fee and the rest of the handling taxes =
imposed=20
| here in California are bogus? Who would have thought?
|=20
| I guess you just can't trust politicians these days... ;-)
|=20
| Patriarch

Yep. We had the same kind of "Tire Tax" up here.
When the local government lifted the tax -=20
we never found what the did with the money raised -=20
we still had the same, but larger, tire piles.
--=20
PDQ

Patriarch wrote:
Dave Hinz wrote in
:


On Tue, 17 May 2005 14:21:03 -0500, Patriarch
wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote in
:

snip

She should read the old Mother Earth News articles, and plant in
recycled tires painted white... :-)

I find it hard to believe that MEN would publish something like
that, given all the chemicals which leach out of the old tires.

I didn't say it was smart, just that it was published in a known rag
back then. Lotsa stupid stuff said & done in the Seventies.

Thing about the tires - if they're leaching, why are they used for
retaining walls in Golden Gate Park, Larry?



So you're telling us they are completely safe, and the tire disposal fee
and hazardous waste disposal fee and the rest of the handling taxes imposed
here in California are bogus? Who would have thought?

I guess you just can't trust politicians these days... ;-)


There are many compelling reasons to regulate the management and
disposal of waste tires, including concerns for public health, because
of the breeding of disease carrying mosquitos, the potential for fire
hazards, as well as the expense of cleaning up after tire fires. For
these and other reasons, many states concluded that throwing waste tires
into stockpiles presented environmental and public health concerns, and
that burying them in a landfill consumed valuable landfill space and
wasted a resource.

It's not because of leaching at all.

--
Odinn
RCOS #7

"The more I study religions the more I am convinced that man never
worshipped anything but himself." -- Sir Richard Francis Burton

Reeky's unofficial homepage ... http://www.reeky.org
'03 FLHTI ........... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/ElectraGlide
'97 VN1500D ......... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/VulcanClassic
Atlanta Biker Net ... http://www.atlantabiker.net
Vulcan Riders Assoc . http://www.vulcanriders.org

rot13 to reply

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

cantaloupe, buttercrunch lettuce,
spaghetti squash, radishes, carrots, basil, broccoli, green beans,
Oregon sugar pod peas, cabbage, and okra

The chocolate bar I bought at the health food store had all that in
it....

On Tue, 17 May 2005 14:21:03 -0500, the inscrutable Patriarch
spake:

Larry Jaques wrote in
:

snip
She should read the old Mother Earth News articles, and plant in
recycled tires painted white... :-)

I find it hard to believe that MEN would publish something like that,
given all the chemicals which leach out of the old tires.


I didn't say it was smart, just that it was published in a known rag back
then. Lotsa stupid stuff said & done in the Seventies.

Oh, yeah. Everyone was still "coming down" from the Sixties.


------------------------------------------
Do the voices in my head bother you?
------------------------------------------
http://diversify.com Full-Service Web Development

On Tue, 17 May 2005 04:07:38 GMT, Lew Hodgett
wrote:

Amortized over 10 years, it's probably the lowest cost compost bin on
the planet, especially if you use your current labor rate, which is
based on your years of experience building quality compost bins, to
build a replacementG.

When someone asks "How much did it cost to build that?" and I tell
them.....this weird look comes across their face.
It's that "Your out of your freakin mind!" look.g
Nobody else ever wanted me to build em one.

Mike O.

Mike wrote in news:5mtk81hij3ll4ctpqlqal171juf619k75a@
4ax.com:

On Tue, 17 May 2005 04:07:38 GMT, Lew Hodgett
wrote:

Amortized over 10 years, it's probably the lowest cost compost bin on
the planet, especially if you use your current labor rate, which is
based on your years of experience building quality compost bins, to
build a replacementG.

When someone asks "How much did it cost to build that?" and I tell
them.....this weird look comes across their face.
It's that "Your out of your freakin mind!" look.g
Nobody else ever wanted me to build em one.

Mike O.


Then whatever number you gave them was a 'good number'.

I have a $3500 (materials only) garden shed that gets the same sort of
response. Why does a garden shed _need_ a leaded glass entry door? :-)

Patriarch

On Tue, 17 May 2005 16:49:23 -0500, the inscrutable Patriarch
spake:

Dave Hinz wrote in
:

On Tue, 17 May 2005 14:21:03 -0500, Patriarch
wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote in
:

Thing about the tires - if they're leaching, why are they used for
retaining walls in Golden Gate Park, Larry?

Dave, I have you twit filtered so I no longer put up with your crap.
(That means no reply is necessary, got it?)


So you're telling us they are completely safe, and the tire disposal fee
and hazardous waste disposal fee and the rest of the handling taxes imposed
here in California are bogus? Who would have thought?

Here's irony for ya:
http://www.motherearthnews.com/libra.../Green_Gazette
Scroll down to "Gardeners: Tread Lightly:"
Tires are made from hydrocarbons which are known to be carcinogenic,
so why take a chance?


I guess you just can't trust politicians these days... ;-)

Ya think?


------------------------------------------
Do the voices in my head bother you?
------------------------------------------
http://diversify.com Full-Service Web Development

On Tue, 17 May 2005 18:01:51 -0400, the inscrutable "PDQ"
spake:


"Patriarch" wrote in message

| So you're telling us they are completely safe, and the tire disposal fee
| and hazardous waste disposal fee and the rest of the handling taxes imposed
| here in California are bogus? Who would have thought?


Yep. We had the same kind of "Tire Tax" up here.
When the local government lifted the tax -
we never found what the did with the money raised -
we still had the same, but larger, tire piles.

I think Arizona, NM, and Nevada are all recycling them into their
roadways. Ditto the red roofing tiles. They're crushed and mixed
into the roadbed. Some NV roads (US395 from CA to LV) are pink as
a result.


------------------------------------------
Do the voices in my head bother you?
------------------------------------------
http://diversify.com Full-Service Web Development

On Tue, 17 May 2005 19:11:05 -0400, the inscrutable Robatoy
spake:

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

cantaloupe, buttercrunch lettuce,
spaghetti squash, radishes, carrots, basil, broccoli, green beans,
Oregon sugar pod peas, cabbage, and okra

The chocolate bar I bought at the health food store had all that in
it....

urk That was no chocolate bar, son.

Ever look at one of those power or health bar thingies? Crikey,
there's so much sugar in one of them it puts me into sugar shock just
looking at it. What misnomers!


------------------------------------------
Do the voices in my head bother you?
------------------------------------------
http://diversify.com Full-Service Web Development

On Tue, 17 May 2005 19:25:13 -0500, Patriarch
wrote:


Then whatever number you gave them was a 'good number'.

LOL... Good point!

I have a $3500 (materials only) garden shed that gets the same sort of
response. Why does a garden shed _need_ a leaded glass entry door? :-)

You did that on purpose?? g

Mike O.

On Tue, 17 May 2005 16:49:23 -0500, Patriarch wrote:
Dave Hinz wrote in
:

Thing about the tires - if they're leaching, why are they used for
retaining walls in Golden Gate Park, Larry?

So you're telling us they are completely safe, and the tire disposal fee
and hazardous waste disposal fee and the rest of the handling taxes imposed
here in California are bogus? Who would have thought?

Um, I'm not telling anyone anything other than those tire walls are
there. Draw your own conclusions, but I figure if they have 'em in SF
of all places, then the're probably not as bad as the alarmists would
make them out to be.

I guess you just can't trust politicians these days... ;-)

Agreed there.

On Tue, 17 May 2005 18:26:38 -0700, Larry Jaques novalidaddress@di wrote:
On Tue, 17 May 2005 16:49:23 -0500, the inscrutable Patriarch
spake:

Dave Hinz wrote in
:

Thing about the tires - if they're leaching, why are they used for
retaining walls in Golden Gate Park, Larry?

Dave, I have you twit filtered so I no longer put up with your crap.
(That means no reply is necessary, got it?)

Then don't snipe at me from behind your killfile. Intellectual
cowardice is beneath you, I would have thought.

So you're telling us they are completely safe, and the tire disposal fee
and hazardous waste disposal fee and the rest of the handling taxes imposed
here in California are bogus? Who would have thought?

Here's irony for ya:
http://www.motherearthnews.com/libra.../Green_Gazette
Scroll down to "Gardeners: Tread Lightly:"
Tires are made from hydrocarbons which are known to be carcinogenic,
so why take a chance?

Fuzzy science. How...unexpected. So, why are those tires there,
Larry?

Patriarch wrote:

Dave Hinz wrote in
:

On Tue, 17 May 2005 14:21:03 -0500, Patriarch
wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote in
:

snip
She should read the old Mother Earth News articles, and plant in
recycled tires painted white... :-)

I find it hard to believe that MEN would publish something like
that, given all the chemicals which leach out of the old tires.

I didn't say it was smart, just that it was published in a known rag
back then. Lotsa stupid stuff said & done in the Seventies.

Thing about the tires - if they're leaching, why are they used for
retaining walls in Golden Gate Park, Larry?


So you're telling us they are completely safe, and the tire disposal fee
and hazardous waste disposal fee and the rest of the handling taxes imposed
here in California are bogus? Who would have thought?

I guess you just can't trust politicians these days... ;-)

I wouldn't say anything is "completely" safe under all circumstances,
but the chemical hazard from tire-"leaching" is pretty far down for
ordinary water chemistry.

The primary problem/cost w/ disposal of tires is the volume required in
landfills and the problem of large piles occasionally getting lit. The
disposal fees are an attempt to have some revenues to provide mechanisms
to counter this. How efeective they are seems to depend on
jursidiction--here they're using it to subside recycling and it seems to
work reasonably well.

Larry Jaques wrote:
....
Tires are made from hydrocarbons which are known to be carcinogenic,
so why take a chance?
....

There's the difference between the form of the hydrocarbon...there has
to be a signficant pathway for exposure.

"Duane Bozarth" wrote in message
...
Patriarch wrote:

Dave Hinz wrote in
:

On Tue, 17 May 2005 14:21:03 -0500, Patriarch
wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote in
:

snip
She should read the old Mother Earth News articles, and plant in
recycled tires painted white... :-)

I find it hard to believe that MEN would publish something like
that, given all the chemicals which leach out of the old tires.

I didn't say it was smart, just that it was published in a known rag
back then. Lotsa stupid stuff said & done in the Seventies.

Thing about the tires - if they're leaching, why are they used for
retaining walls in Golden Gate Park, Larry?


So you're telling us they are completely safe, and the tire disposal fee
and hazardous waste disposal fee and the rest of the handling taxes
imposed
here in California are bogus? Who would have thought?

I guess you just can't trust politicians these days... ;-)

I wouldn't say anything is "completely" safe under all circumstances,
but the chemical hazard from tire-"leaching" is pretty far down for
ordinary water chemistry.

The primary problem/cost w/ disposal of tires is the volume required in
landfills and the problem of large piles occasionally getting lit. The
disposal fees are an attempt to have some revenues to provide mechanisms
to counter this. How efeective they are seems to depend on
jursidiction--here they're using it to subside recycling and it seems to
work reasonably well.

Reminds me of a scam I read about years ago. Seem that there was a city who
required a fee to dispose of the itres. A new firm showed up with trucks and
began to take care of this business. All the former folks were glad to get
rid of the business because it was not profitable. This new firm did well at
this for a year or two. Then they vanished.

An investigation discovered that they had collected millions of dollars. And
deposited all the tires in a big, old warehouse they had rented. Leaving the
warehouse owner with a big sized disposal problem.

Lee Michaels wrote:
....
Reminds me of a scam I read about years ago. Seem that there was a city who
required a fee to dispose of the itres. A new firm showed up with trucks and
began to take care of this business. All the former folks were glad to get
rid of the business because it was not profitable. This new firm did well at
this for a year or two. Then they vanished.

An investigation discovered that they had collected millions of dollars. And
deposited all the tires in a big, old warehouse they had rented. Leaving the
warehouse owner with a big sized disposal problem.

Alway possible if oversight not maintained...here it is State-controlled
and has been in place for something approaching 20 years now. Don't
know of any significant problems to date.

Mike wrote in news:cbcl811gig6gpehnaetuac4gtghkhmhk3t@
4ax.com:

On Tue, 17 May 2005 19:25:13 -0500, Patriarch
wrote:


Then whatever number you gave them was a 'good number'.

LOL... Good point!

I have a $3500 (materials only) garden shed that gets the same sort of
response. Why does a garden shed _need_ a leaded glass entry door? :-)

You did that on purpose?? g


The door set was on closeout at the Borg. I thought it was $99, and it was
on the cart, with a couple of other things, (OK, the stack was 4' high).
The pricing was wrong, but we worked it out, and I took it anyway.

Another name for these little houses in the garden is 'garden folly'.
Seems apt.

But there is space in the garage shop for power tools that was previously
occupied by stuff now stored in a respectable outbuilding. And since it
can be seen from the back street, and isn't, in the strictest of
interpretations, properly sited, I had to make it 'nice'. The city has no
complaints, because it was 'done nicely'.

But to be able to honestly answer folks who ask what it would cost for me
to make them one, when I really don't want to, is priceless.

Patriarch