I found a freshly cut willow crotch. It is about 2' long. The single end
is about 18" diameter, the double ends about 12" each. A picture of it is
at http://www.frontiernet.net/~toller/willow.jpg
I have some questions.

1) Is this even worthwhile; is willow worth turning?
2) If so, what would my goal be, in terms of a turning block. How would I
cut it for best use
3) Lifting it into the trunk I strained my back, so I won't be doing
anything with it very soon. I have coated the three exposed ends. Is that
adequate, or should I do something else? (If willow isn't worth turning, I
suppose I should toss it...) If necessary, I can get my son to cut it up,
but he won't be happy about it.

Thanks

"Toller" wrote in message
news
I found a freshly cut willow crotch. It is about 2' long. The single end
is about 18" diameter, the double ends about 12" each. A picture of it is
at http://www.frontiernet.net/~toller/willow.jpg
I have some questions.

1) Is this even worthwhile; is willow worth turning?
2) If so, what would my goal be, in terms of a turning block. How would I
cut it for best use
3) Lifting it into the trunk I strained my back, so I won't be doing
anything with it very soon. I have coated the three exposed ends. Is
that adequate, or should I do something else? (If willow isn't worth
turning, I suppose I should toss it...) If necessary, I can get my son to
cut it up, but he won't be happy about it.

Willow's worth turning, though it might seem it's not initially. It'll be
fuzzy and uncooperative when wet, improve vastly when dry. See Darrell's
site for a look at crotch cuts. http://www.aroundthewoods.com/

Shows nice shimmer, is almost impossible to crack when drying, though
leaving convoluted grain areas a bit thick is a good idea anyway.

Hello Toller,

Answer to your first question, willow is not a very spectacular wood
to turn. It is a bit soft and stringy; however, a crotch piece such as
you have may produce some nice grain patterns making it worthwhile to
turn.

Depending upon the size of your lathe, assuming at least a 14 or 16
inch swing, the best bet would be to split it one the pith of the
large piece and hopefully through the pith of the two branches. Then
take out a circle centered on the crotch if possible. If would be good
if you could at least get it split to get rid of the pith, but it
would be best to split it and then rough turn it as far as
preservation goes.

That is what sons are for--to help out ol' dad when he becomes stove
up for some reason. Get him to cut it for you.

Hope this helps.

Fred Holder
http://www.fholder.com

On Jun 14, 8:31 am, "Toller" wrote:
I found a freshly cut willow crotch. It is about 2' long. The single end
is about 18" diameter, the double ends about 12" each. A picture of it is
athttp://www.frontiernet.net/~toller/willow.jpg
I have some questions.

1) Is this even worthwhile; is willow worth turning?
2) If so, what would my goal be, in terms of a turning block. How would I
cut it for best use
3) Lifting it into the trunk I strained my back, so I won't be doing
anything with it very soon. I have coated the three exposed ends. Is that
adequate, or should I do something else? (If willow isn't worth turning, I
suppose I should toss it...) If necessary, I can get my son to cut it up,
but he won't be happy about it.

Thanks

"George" wrote in message
. net...

"Toller" wrote in message
news
I found a freshly cut willow crotch. It is about 2' long. The single end
is about 18" diameter, the double ends about 12" each. A picture of it is
at http://www.frontiernet.net/~toller/willow.jpg
I have some questions.

1) Is this even worthwhile; is willow worth turning?
2) If so, what would my goal be, in terms of a turning block. How would
I cut it for best use
3) Lifting it into the trunk I strained my back, so I won't be doing
anything with it very soon. I have coated the three exposed ends. Is
that adequate, or should I do something else? (If willow isn't worth
turning, I suppose I should toss it...) If necessary, I can get my son
to cut it up, but he won't be happy about it.

Willow's worth turning, though it might seem it's not initially. It'll be
fuzzy and uncooperative when wet, improve vastly when dry. See Darrell's
site for a look at crotch cuts. http://www.aroundthewoods.com/

Shows nice shimmer, is almost impossible to crack when drying, though
leaving convoluted grain areas a bit thick is a good idea anyway.
Very good, thanks.

"Fred Holder" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hello Toller,

Answer to your first question, willow is not a very spectacular wood
to turn. It is a bit soft and stringy; however, a crotch piece such as
you have may produce some nice grain patterns making it worthwhile to
turn.

Depending upon the size of your lathe, assuming at least a 14 or 16
inch swing, the best bet would be to split it one the pith of the
large piece and hopefully through the pith of the two branches. Then
take out a circle centered on the crotch if possible. If would be good
if you could at least get it split to get rid of the pith, but it
would be best to split it and then rough turn it as far as
preservation goes.

That is what sons are for--to help out ol' dad when he becomes stove
up for some reason. Get him to cut it for you.

Split it with wedges? I was thinking I was going to have to saw it in half
as crotches tend not to split very well.

On Jun 14, 9:46 am, "Toller" wrote:
"Fred Holder" wrote in message

oups.com...

Hello Toller,

Answer to your first question, willow is not a very spectacular wood
to turn. It is a bit soft and stringy; however, a crotch piece such as
you have may produce some nice grain patterns making it worthwhile to
turn.

Depending upon the size of your lathe, assuming at least a 14 or 16
inch swing, the best bet would be to split it one the pith of the
large piece and hopefully through the pith of the two branches. Then
take out a circle centered on the crotch if possible. If would be good
if you could at least get it split to get rid of the pith, but it
would be best to split it and then rough turn it as far as
preservation goes.

That is what sons are for--to help out ol' dad when he becomes stove
up for some reason. Get him to cut it for you.

Split it with wedges? I was thinking I was going to have to saw it in half
as crotches tend not to split very well.


Sorry Toller,

I don't split turning wood with wedges, I use a chain saw. I should
have said saw it to remove the pith. A poor choice of words on my
part.

Fred Holder
http://www.fholder.com

My recommendation is to at least rough out the willow ASAP. In my
experience willow deteriorates rapidly and within a month of cutting turns
to mush. The wood is bland in can be fuzzy as others have noted. I like to
use the fuzziness as an advantage. After turning the wood I don't bother
sanding but use a steel brush on the wood while it is turning. This really
brings out the fuzz and when the wood is dry the fuzz is still soft. Always
amazes people who pick up something that's wood and it feels like a towel.
Hope this helps.
Tony Manella
ndd1"at"prolog.net (remove "at")
http://home.ptd.net/~ndd1/
Lehigh Valley Woodturners


"Toller" wrote in message
news
I found a freshly cut willow crotch. It is about 2' long. The single end
is about 18" diameter, the double ends about 12" each. A picture of it is
at http://www.frontiernet.net/~toller/willow.jpg
I have some questions.

1) Is this even worthwhile; is willow worth turning?
2) If so, what would my goal be, in terms of a turning block. How would I
cut it for best use
3) Lifting it into the trunk I strained my back, so I won't be doing
anything with it very soon. I have coated the three exposed ends. Is
that adequate, or should I do something else? (If willow isn't worth
turning, I suppose I should toss it...) If necessary, I can get my son to
cut it up, but he won't be happy about it.

Thanks

"TonyM" tonym.le"at"comcast.net wrote:


My recommendation is to at least rough out the willow ASAP. In my
experience willow deteriorates rapidly and within a month of cutting
turns to mush. The wood is bland in can be fuzzy as others have
noted. I like to use the fuzziness as an advantage. After turning
the wood I don't bother sanding but use a steel brush on the wood
while it is turning. This really brings out the fuzz and when the
wood is dry the fuzz is still soft. Always amazes people who pick up
something that's wood and it feels like a towel. Hope this helps.
Tony Manella
ndd1"at"prolog.net (remove "at")
http://home.ptd.net/~ndd1/
Lehigh Valley Woodturners

How do you finish it? Any time I've turned willow it comes out looking
muddy

Well, I cut the crotch in half and made one side into a bowl blank. Sadly
it is rather smaller than I intended due to a wimpy bandsaw, an inability to
read a ruler, and somehow getting it on the lathe cockeyed; but I have a
lovely 8" diameter rough cut bowl.

Only the end grain came out fuzzy, so I don't see that leaving it fuzzy
makes much sense; though maybe the condition will be more widespread when it
is dry.
The colors are great; going from nearly to black to nearly white, all
swirled together.

Tomorrow I will try to tackle the other half. Hopefully I learned something
from the first half.
Thanks.


"Toller" wrote in message
news
I found a freshly cut willow crotch. It is about 2' long. The single end
is about 18" diameter, the double ends about 12" each. A picture of it is
at http://www.frontiernet.net/~toller/willow.jpg
I have some questions.

1) Is this even worthwhile; is willow worth turning?
2) If so, what would my goal be, in terms of a turning block. How would I
cut it for best use
3) Lifting it into the trunk I strained my back, so I won't be doing
anything with it very soon. I have coated the three exposed ends. Is
that adequate, or should I do something else? (If willow isn't worth
turning, I suppose I should toss it...) If necessary, I can get my son to
cut it up, but he won't be happy about it.

Thanks

None. Any finish would make the fuzzy wood stiff. It also keeps its blonde
color this way. If you wanted the texture without the feel you could use
Krylon Matte Finish, which keeps the natural color on most woods.

"Lobby Dosser" wrote in message
news:ceEci.45$jb5.10@trndny09...
"TonyM" tonym.le"at"comcast.net wrote:


My recommendation is to at least rough out the willow ASAP. In my
experience willow deteriorates rapidly and within a month of cutting
turns to mush. The wood is bland in can be fuzzy as others have
noted. I like to use the fuzziness as an advantage. After turning
the wood I don't bother sanding but use a steel brush on the wood
while it is turning. This really brings out the fuzz and when the
wood is dry the fuzz is still soft. Always amazes people who pick up
something that's wood and it feels like a towel. Hope this helps.
Tony Manella
ndd1"at"prolog.net (remove "at")
http://home.ptd.net/~ndd1/
Lehigh Valley Woodturners

How do you finish it? Any time I've turned willow it comes out looking
muddy

Toller wrote:
Well, I cut the crotch in half and made one side into a bowl blank. Sadly
it is rather smaller than I intended due to a wimpy bandsaw, an inability to
read a ruler, and somehow getting it on the lathe cockeyed; but I have a
lovely 8" diameter rough cut bowl.

Only the end grain came out fuzzy, so I don't see that leaving it fuzzy
makes much sense; though maybe the condition will be more widespread when it
is dry.
The colors are great; going from nearly to black to nearly white, all
swirled together.

Tomorrow I will try to tackle the other half. Hopefully I learned something
from the first half.
Thanks.


Did you get wet? The first piece of willow I ever turned spat at me and
left a mark on the wall behind it. ;-)

The grain spacing was wild ... about 1/2" between annual rings!

Yours sounds like it might be spalted. If so, would you post a pic on
abpw when you get done and drop us a line to let us know it's there? I'm
probably not the only one who'd like to see the final result.

Bill


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"BillinDetroit" wrote in message
...
Toller wrote:
Well, I cut the crotch in half and made one side into a bowl blank.
Sadly it is rather smaller than I intended due to a wimpy bandsaw, an
inability to read a ruler, and somehow getting it on the lathe cockeyed;
but I have a lovely 8" diameter rough cut bowl.

Only the end grain came out fuzzy, so I don't see that leaving it fuzzy
makes much sense; though maybe the condition will be more widespread when
it is dry.
The colors are great; going from nearly to black to nearly white, all
swirled together.

Tomorrow I will try to tackle the other half. Hopefully I learned
something from the first half.
Thanks.


Did you get wet? The first piece of willow I ever turned spat at me and
left a mark on the wall behind it. ;-)

Very wet experience

The grain spacing was wild ... about 1/2" between annual rings!

Yours sounds like it might be spalted. If so, would you post a pic on abpw
when you get done and drop us a line to let us know it's there? I'm
probably not the only one who'd like to see the final result.

My ISP doesn't do abpw, but the rough bowls are at
http://www.frontiernet.net/~toller/bowls.jpg

I didn't get the trunk cut down the center, so one is much bigger than the
other. The big one is rather rougher than I hoped; I think I will wind up
losing the top inch or two.
You can't tell from this, but the grain on the saw cut pieces is quite
interesting.

Toller wrote:
My ISP doesn't do abpw, but the rough bowls are at
http://www.frontiernet.net/~toller/bowls.jpg

I didn't get the trunk cut down the center, so one is much bigger than the
other. The big one is rather rougher than I hoped; I think I will wind up
losing the top inch or two.
You can't tell from this, but the grain on the saw cut pieces is quite
interesting.

The grain coloration on the larger one is really nice. Is the wood so
soft that the tearout is unavoidable?

Bill


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"BillinDetroit" wrote in message
...
Toller wrote:
My ISP doesn't do abpw, but the rough bowls are at
http://www.frontiernet.net/~toller/bowls.jpg

I didn't get the trunk cut down the center, so one is much bigger than
the other. The big one is rather rougher than I hoped; I think I will
wind up losing the top inch or two.
You can't tell from this, but the grain on the saw cut pieces is quite
interesting. The grain coloration on the larger one is really nice. Is
the wood so
soft that the tearout is unavoidable?

It seemed to be; no matter what I did it tore.
I am hoping it will behave differently when dry. It is ususally worse when
dry, but maybe willow is different.

Toller wrote:

It seemed to be; no matter what I did it tore.
I am hoping it will behave differently when dry. It is ususally worse when
dry, but maybe willow is different.


Have you considered a drench with thin CA?

I buy (and sell) thin CA by the pint for this precise use. It soaks into
the punky parts and leaves them hard enough to work. (Allow a few hours
for the interior stuff to set up.) If finishing with gloss poly, it
seems invisible. Also good for stiffening up thin-walled sections.

Just a thought ... that larger vessel looks promising.

Bill


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"BillinDetroit" wrote in message
...
Toller wrote:

It seemed to be; no matter what I did it tore.
I am hoping it will behave differently when dry. It is ususally worse
when dry, but maybe willow is different.

Have you considered a drench with thin CA?

I buy (and sell) thin CA by the pint for this precise use. It soaks into
the punky parts and leaves them hard enough to work. (Allow a few hours
for the interior stuff to set up.) If finishing with gloss poly, it seems
invisible. Also good for stiffening up thin-walled sections.

Just a thought ... that larger vessel looks promising.

I didn't know you could do that. It doesn't get too hard?

"Toller" wrote in message
...

"BillinDetroit" wrote in message
...
Toller wrote:

It seemed to be; no matter what I did it tore.
I am hoping it will behave differently when dry. It is ususally worse
when dry, but maybe willow is different.

Have you considered a drench with thin CA?

I buy (and sell) thin CA by the pint for this precise use. It soaks into
the punky parts and leaves them hard enough to work. (Allow a few hours
for the interior stuff to set up.) If finishing with gloss poly, it seems
invisible. Also good for stiffening up thin-walled sections.

Just a thought ... that larger vessel looks promising.

I didn't know you could do that. It doesn't get too hard?


Willow and the whole family of cottonwoods and true poplars has very soft
interlocked fiber. Turns much better when it's dry, because it stays to be
cut rather than presses down, bends up or tears. Don't hack at it to "make
the shavings fly," cut it in thin shavings with broad bevel support so they
slide out of the way. Since it is so soft you can get heel bruises even on
the dry wood, another reason not to press, pry and dig with the tool. Even
setting up with water will leave you some sanding to remove the compressed
areas. Of course that's easier on soft, even textured wood like willow, so
there's some silver there.

It also sucks water like a sponge. It'll do the same with CA, so you've
been warned. Unless you want stained areas, don't spread it.

Toller wrote:

I didn't know you could do that. It doesn't get too hard?

Hard as woodpecker lips. Like George said, too, an uneven application
will tend to look blotchy. I find that using polyurethane for my finish
coat tends to conceal the CA -- probably because the poly is also
absorbed into the wood. But that's just a guess. I DO know that a
straight oil finish (no varnish) looks pretty bad but I have gotten good
results with poly over CA on a number of items.

Hmm ... might even just keep turning until it's fully roughed in and
then fill the voids with Inlace (which I do NOT sell) or epoxy with a
metal powder added.

When you look at things from the perspective of "how do I take advantage
of this situation" ... doors start to open.

Bill


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Hi Toller, sorry for rolling into this thread so late, but I've been
busy.

I have turned some willow with good success, but mind you not all
willow is the same, however I would in a blunt kind of way say that
your turning skill does need some improvement ;-*)))

Yes willow is soft, but it hangs together pretty good, you do need to
approach the wood more careful than most harder woods, CUT from small
to large on the outside, a conventional ground bowl gouge would CUT
better IMO, a spindle gouge if used correctly could be used also,
also you could try the thinned white glue and water approach, it would
stiffen the fibers and harden the wood some.

Submerge the wood in a water/glue soup for a day or two then drip or
towel dry, place in a brown paper bag and let dry, after which you can
carefully finish turn, the glue will penetrate only a little ways
though, so keep that in mind if you do this.

Here's a link to my photo-albums, there are at least a few pictures of
willow turnings in those, and a few more kind of woods, peruse if you
like it.
http://homepage.mac.com/l.vanderloo/PhotoAlbum28.html

Have fun and take care
Leo Van Der Loo

On Jun 19, 11:13 am, "Toller" wrote:
"BillinDetroit" wrote in message

...



Toller wrote:
Well, I cut the crotch in half and made one side into a bowl blank.
Sadly it is rather smaller than I intended due to a wimpy bandsaw, an
inability to read a ruler, and somehow getting it on the lathe cockeyed;
but I have a lovely 8" diameter rough cut bowl.

Only the end grain came out fuzzy, so I don't see that leaving it fuzzy
makes much sense; though maybe the condition will be more widespread when
it is dry.
The colors are great; going from nearly to black to nearly white, all
swirled together.

Tomorrow I will try to tackle the other half. Hopefully I learned
something from the first half.
Thanks.

wrote in message
oups.com...
Hi Toller, sorry for rolling into this thread so late, but I've been
busy.

I have turned some willow with good success, but mind you not all
willow is the same, however I would in a blunt kind of way say that
your turning skill does need some improvement ;-*)))

I won't disagree with you there, but this is just the rough cut; I will have
a chance to clean it up once it is dry.
The wood towards the center was much more subject to tear out than the rest.
you will note that the small bowl, and the bottom of the large bowl are
okay.
I didn't get my cut in the right place, so the top of the big bowl is the
center of the log.