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Default Long telescopic ladders?

(I'm re-sending this because whist Agent says it has been sent, I
can't see it on the ng. Sorry if it's a duplicate).

I would like to be able to get up to the gutters / soffits on this two
story Victorian cottage and don't currently have a suitable ladder.

This wouldn't be for any extended work, just replacing the lamp in
floodlight that covers the back garden or removing debris from the
gutters etc.

I like the idea of the telescopic ladders from a storage / portability
POV but I have only ever footed a 3.2m one but I'm assuming I'd be
looking at something quite a bit longer to reach such heights
(probably 5+m)?

It looks like I can do those sorts of things I need with a ladder from
the guidance he

https://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg455.pdf

.... and I would be able to secure the ladder appropriately so the
question is really around the practicability feasibility of telescopic
ladders of that sort of length? I'm guessing they wouldn't make them
if no one bought them and from the specs I've seen they could easily
support my weight etc ('ladder max load 150kg' etc).

I really wouldn't be using such regularly but would just like to be
able to myself if required (or send tree climbing daughter up there
whilst I foot it etc). ;-)

What does the panel think, advice on makes / models etc please?

Cheers, T i m
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Default Long telescopic ladders?

On 20/11/2020 12:14, T i m wrote:
(I'm re-sending this because whist Agent says it has been sent, I
can't see it on the ng. Sorry if it's a duplicate).

I would like to be able to get up to the gutters / soffits on this two
story Victorian cottage and don't currently have a suitable ladder.

This wouldn't be for any extended work, just replacing the lamp in
floodlight that covers the back garden or removing debris from the
gutters etc.

I like the idea of the telescopic ladders from a storage / portability
POV but I have only ever footed a 3.2m one but I'm assuming I'd be
looking at something quite a bit longer to reach such heights
(probably 5+m)?

It looks like I can do those sorts of things I need with a ladder from
the guidance he

https://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg455.pdf

... and I would be able to secure the ladder appropriately so the
question is really around the practicability feasibility of telescopic
ladders of that sort of length? I'm guessing they wouldn't make them
if no one bought them and from the specs I've seen they could easily
support my weight etc ('ladder max load 150kg' etc).

I really wouldn't be using such regularly but would just like to be
able to myself if required (or send tree climbing daughter up there
whilst I foot it etc). ;-)

What does the panel think, advice on makes / models etc please?

Cheers, T i m

It is showing 3 times for me.
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Default Long telescopic ladders?

On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 12:32:01 +0000, RobH wrote:

On 20/11/2020 12:14, T i m wrote:
(I'm re-sending this because whist Agent says it has been sent, I
can't see it on the ng. Sorry if it's a duplicate).

snip

It is showing 3 times for me.


Thanks Rob.

The first posting (last night) didn't (and still hasn't) appeared.

I re-sent it this morning, still no-show here.

I copied and pasted the content into a new message and it appeared as
normal?

I do sometimes (rarely) find it doesn't send (or retrieve the headers
or a message) but goes / receives ok when I re-try.

Cheers, T i m


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Default Long telescopic ladders?

On 20/11/2020 12:14, T i m wrote:
(I'm re-sending this because whist Agent says it has been sent, I
can't see it on the ng. Sorry if it's a duplicate).

I would like to be able to get up to the gutters / soffits on this two
story Victorian cottage and don't currently have a suitable ladder.

This wouldn't be for any extended work, just replacing the lamp in
floodlight that covers the back garden or removing debris from the
gutters etc.

I like the idea of the telescopic ladders from a storage / portability
POV but I have only ever footed a 3.2m one but I'm assuming I'd be
looking at something quite a bit longer to reach such heights
(probably 5+m)?

It looks like I can do those sorts of things I need with a ladder from
the guidance he

https://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg455.pdf

... and I would be able to secure the ladder appropriately so the
question is really around the practicability feasibility of telescopic
ladders of that sort of length? I'm guessing they wouldn't make them
if no one bought them and from the specs I've seen they could easily
support my weight etc ('ladder max load 150kg' etc).

I really wouldn't be using such regularly but would just like to be
able to myself if required (or send tree climbing daughter up there
whilst I foot it etc). ;-)

What does the panel think, advice on makes / models etc please?

Cheers, T i m

bloody newbies
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Default Long telescopic ladders?

On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 12:54:47 +0000, "Jim GM4DHJ ..."
wrote:

snip

What does the panel think, advice on makes / models etc please?



bloody newbies


So, Jimmy, when you ask a serious question here and people take the
**** out of you you throw your toys out the pram?

Hypocrisy?

Cheers, T i m


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Default Long telescopic ladders?

On Friday, 20 November 2020 at 13:00:31 UTC, T i m wrote:
On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 12:54:47 +0000, "Jim GM4DHJ ..."
wrote:

snip
What does the panel think, advice on makes / models etc please?



bloody newbies


So, Jimmy, when you ask a serious question here and people take the
**** out of you you throw your toys out the pram?

Hypocrisy?

Cheers, T i m

I have seen 6.2m telescopic ladders on eBay for £19.00 but you got to ask yourself just how good they are when the likes of Screwfix are selling 3m+ types between £100 & £150. I really would not like to find out when 6m above the ground. I have a 3.6m one which is more than adequate to reach everything I need to on our bungalow but it is heavy and difficult to manoeuvre I can only imagine how awkward a version nearly twice mine would be to carry, extend and manoeuvre.

Richard
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Default Long telescopic ladders?

On 20/11/2020 13:21, Tricky Dicky wrote:
On Friday, 20 November 2020 at 13:00:31 UTC, T i m wrote:
On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 12:54:47 +0000, "Jim GM4DHJ ..."
wrote:

snip
What does the panel think, advice on makes / models etc please?



bloody newbies


So, Jimmy, when you ask a serious question here and people take the
**** out of you you throw your toys out the pram?

Hypocrisy?

Cheers, T i m

I have seen 6.2m telescopic ladders on eBay for £19.00 but you got to ask yourself just how good they are when the likes of Screwfix are selling 3m+ types between £100 & £150. I really would not like to find out when 6m above the ground. I have a 3.6m one which is more than adequate to reach everything I need to on our bungalow but it is heavy and difficult to manoeuvre I can only imagine how awkward a version nearly twice mine would be to carry, extend and manoeuvre.


My son gave me a 250 GB memory card that he had bought on ebay for £2. I
stuck it in the phone and it worked for a while before becoming corrupt
and being thrown away. I appreciate that you'd notice if your 6m ladder
were really only 1m, but there's bound to be a safety issue at that price.




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Default Long telescopic ladders?

On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 05:21:02 -0800 (PST), Tricky Dicky
wrote:

snip

I have seen 6.2m telescopic ladders on eBay for 19.00


Well, they build pretty high buildings using bamboo scaffolding but
....

but you got to ask yourself just how good they are when the likes of Screwfix are selling 3m+ types between 100 & 150.


Well quite. ;-(

I really would not like to find out when 6m above the ground.


Me neither. Mind you, it's not heights that kill people, it's normally
the ground! ;-(

I have a 3.6m one which is more than adequate to reach everything I need to on our bungalow but it is heavy and difficult to manoeuvre I can only imagine how awkward a version nearly twice mine would be to carry, extend and manoeuvre.


It seems they do vary in weight quite a bit and not always directly
related to their length.

It may well be one of those things where they are generally an asset
up to 3.x m but after that they (as you say) become overly heavy and
unwieldy, or no less so than a std 2 or 3 piece ally ladder that could
be much cheaper, lighter and more comfortable in use?

It's just not so easy to store ...

Cheers, T i m


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Default Long telescopic ladders?

On 20/11/2020 13:00, T i m wrote:
On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 12:54:47 +0000, "Jim GM4DHJ ..."
wrote:

snip

What does the panel think, advice on makes / models etc please?



bloody newbies


So, Jimmy, when you ask a serious question here and people take the
**** out of you you throw your toys out the pram?

Hypocrisy?

Cheers, T i m

totly
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Default Long telescopic ladders?

On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 14:04:28 +0000, GB
wrote:
snip

I have seen 6.2m telescopic ladders on eBay for 19.00 but you got to ask yourself just how good they are when the likes of Screwfix are selling 3m+ types between 100 & 150.


snip

My son gave me a 250 GB memory card that he had bought on ebay for 2. I
stuck it in the phone and it worked for a while before becoming corrupt
and being thrown away. I appreciate that you'd notice if your 6m ladder
were really only 1m, but there's bound to be a safety issue at that price.


Whilst I agree in general and that sometimes the 'devil can be in the
detail' (like catches and material and build quality, rather than core
design) there are many many instances where you see the *exact same*
thing sold in the UK for loads more than it is even elsewhere in the
UK, suggesting that price alone can't always be a clear indicator of
the quality of such things.

But yes, the chances are a 19 ladder from China wouldn't compare
equally with a 200 one sold in the UK and whilst the 19 one might
actually work, the issue could be 'for how long' or 'how reliably',
especially if you push it to it's limits.

Cheers, T i m


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On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 14:35:52 +0000, "Jim GM4DHJ ..."
wrote:

snip

totly


Ok, how we have that sorted, what practical advice can you offer with
all your years of experience?

And see if you can put as much effort into your reply as you did when
complaining that you weren't being taken seriously (assuming you
actually have any experience of such ladders of course)? ;-)

Cheers, T i m
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Lightening this up, when I was younger and could see there were many optical
illusion pictures around. One was the impossible waterfall, as I'm sure you
have all seen where they all join up and all appear to go downward.
There was another of a one sided ladder that curved and had a twist, so
that the little cartoon men could not only climb forever but never find the
other side.
The old obvious loop. One sided bit of paper etc.
Brain breaking stuff.
Brian

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Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"T i m" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 14:35:52 +0000, "Jim GM4DHJ ..."
wrote:

snip

totly


Ok, how we have that sorted, what practical advice can you offer with
all your years of experience?

And see if you can put as much effort into your reply as you did when
complaining that you weren't being taken seriously (assuming you
actually have any experience of such ladders of course)? ;-)

Cheers, T i m



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On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 15:08:27 -0000, "Brian Gaff \(Sofa\)"
wrote:

Lightening this up, when I was younger and could see there were many optical
illusion pictures around. One was the impossible waterfall, as I'm sure you
have all seen where they all join up and all appear to go downward.
There was another of a one sided ladder that curved and had a twist, so
that the little cartoon men could not only climb forever but never find the
other side.


And the 'Penrose stairs' (on the subject of steps).

I bet many who live on the upper floors of flats knows just how much
of an illusion it isn't, especially when the lift is out of action.
;-)

Cheers, T i m
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On 20/11/2020 14:37, T i m wrote:

Whilst I agree in general and that sometimes the 'devil can be in the
detail' (like catches and material and build quality, rather than core
design) there are many many instances where you see the *exact same*
thing sold in the UK for loads more than it is even elsewhere in the
UK, suggesting that price alone can't always be a clear indicator of
the quality of such things.


Price has little to do with quality. It is determined by the 'what the
market will stand' principle. People will always charge what they can get.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-54115646

Bill
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On 20/11/2020 15:08, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
Lightening this up, when I was younger and could see there were many optical
illusion pictures around. One was the impossible waterfall, as I'm sure you
have all seen where they all join up and all appear to go downward.
There was another of a one sided ladder that curved and had a twist, so
that the little cartoon men could not only climb forever but never find the
other side.
The old obvious loop. One sided bit of paper etc.
Brain breaking stuff.
Brian

Mobius?

Bill


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Default Long telescopic ladders?

On 20/11/2020 15:33, williamwright wrote:
On 20/11/2020 15:08, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
Lightening this up, when I was younger and could see there were many
optical
illusion pictures around. One was the impossible waterfall, as I'm
sure you
have all seen where they all join up and all appear to go downward.
There was another of a one sided ladder that curved and had a twist, so
that the little cartoon men could not only climb forever but never
find the
other side.
The old obvious loop. One sided bit of paper etc.
Brain breaking stuff.
Brian

Mobius?


Q. Why did the chicken cross the Moebius Strip?

A. To get to the same side !


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Default Long telescopic ladders?

On 20/11/2020 14:37, T i m wrote:
On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 14:04:28 +0000, GB
wrote:
snip

I have seen 6.2m telescopic ladders on eBay for £19.00 but you got to ask yourself just how good they are when the likes of Screwfix are selling 3m+ types between £100 & £150.


snip

My son gave me a 250 GB memory card that he had bought on ebay for £2. I
stuck it in the phone and it worked for a while before becoming corrupt
and being thrown away. I appreciate that you'd notice if your 6m ladder
were really only 1m, but there's bound to be a safety issue at that price.


Whilst I agree in general and that sometimes the 'devil can be in the
detail' (like catches and material and build quality, rather than core
design) there are many many instances where you see the *exact same*
thing sold in the UK for loads more than it is even elsewhere in the
UK, suggesting that price alone can't always be a clear indicator of
the quality of such things.

But yes, the chances are a £19 ladder from China wouldn't compare
equally with a £200 one sold in the UK and whilst the £19 one might
actually work, the issue could be 'for how long' or 'how reliably',
especially if you push it to it's limits.




I don't hold with the phrase "You get what you pay for." That's often
not the case. I would rephrase it: "You don't get what you don't pay for."

In this case, that means you can't get a safe 6m telescopic ladder.



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On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 15:31:25 +0000, williamwright
wrote:

On 20/11/2020 14:37, T i m wrote:

Whilst I agree in general and that sometimes the 'devil can be in the
detail' (like catches and material and build quality, rather than core
design) there are many many instances where you see the *exact same*
thing sold in the UK for loads more than it is even elsewhere in the
UK, suggesting that price alone can't always be a clear indicator of
the quality of such things.


Price has little to do with quality.


Often, especially these days.

It is determined by the 'what the
market will stand' principle.


Often (especially these days) but not always.

People will always charge what they can get.


'Some people' might, others have morals / ethics and be happy to
provide (good) value for money.

I have probably done hundreds of jobs in my time for others where I
could very easily have charged (and was generally offered) money to do
so but refused, preferring to work on the 'What goes round, comes
round' idea.

That's not that I couldn't have made use of the extra cash of course,
but as long as I could live reasonably comfortably that was all I
*needed*.

So, I'd get called out by an elderly neighbour because their TV /
video had 'gone wrong' and I'd pop along (often there and then) and
sort it out for them (for nowt).

That's what being a good neighbour is all about eh?

Cheers, T i m

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Default Long telescopic ladders?

T i m wrote:
(I'm re-sending this because whist Agent says it has been sent, I
can't see it on the ng. Sorry if it's a duplicate).

I would like to be able to get up to the gutters / soffits on this two
story Victorian cottage and don't currently have a suitable ladder.

This wouldn't be for any extended work, just replacing the lamp in
floodlight that covers the back garden or removing debris from the
gutters etc.

I like the idea of the telescopic ladders from a storage / portability
POV but I have only ever footed a 3.2m one but I'm assuming I'd be
looking at something quite a bit longer to reach such heights
(probably 5+m)?

It looks like I can do those sorts of things I need with a ladder from
the guidance he

https://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg455.pdf

... and I would be able to secure the ladder appropriately so the
question is really around the practicability feasibility of telescopic
ladders of that sort of length? I'm guessing they wouldn't make them
if no one bought them and from the specs I've seen they could easily
support my weight etc ('ladder max load 150kg' etc).

I really wouldn't be using such regularly but would just like to be
able to myself if required (or send tree climbing daughter up there
whilst I foot it etc). ;-)

What does the panel think, advice on makes / models etc please?

Cheers, T i m


First time I saw one was perhaps 20 years back when I had a survey done on
a place I was looking at buying and the surveyor produced one from the back
of his car. I was very worried at first in case it collapsed he was on the
heavy side and I doubt I could lift him up. But it took his weight and I
asked to try it. It was very steady it had a bar at the bottom increasing
the footprint to about double width. His extended and folded in the middle
so you could have a long ladder or a set of steps. Since then Ive seen
several surveyors with then. Aldi had one on offer recently for about £80.
Personally unless I needed something telescopic I would avoid but I
suspect they are safe unless you are really heavy. Certainly a lady would
probably be ok as they tend to be lighter. Go for on with the bar /
extended foot thing for stability.

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On 20 Nov 2020 at 14:44:25 GMT, "T i m" wrote:

On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 14:35:52 +0000, "Jim GM4DHJ ..."
wrote:

snip

totly


Ok, how we have that sorted, what practical advice can you offer with
all your years of experience?

And see if you can put as much effort into your reply as you did when
complaining that you weren't being taken seriously (assuming you
actually have any experience of such ladders of course)? ;-)

Cheers, T i m


Actually he has already told you he thinks telescopic ladders are a Bad Thing.
Albeit with no detail or justification. I must admit from my very limited
experience I don't think I'd like to use one longer than about 3m.

--
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On 20 Nov 2020 23:40:46 GMT, Roger Hayter wrote:

On 20 Nov 2020 at 14:44:25 GMT, "T i m" wrote:

On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 14:35:52 +0000, "Jim GM4DHJ ..."
wrote:

snip

totly


Ok, how we have that sorted, what practical advice can you offer with
all your years of experience?

And see if you can put as much effort into your reply as you did when
complaining that you weren't being taken seriously (assuming you
actually have any experience of such ladders of course)? ;-)


Actually he has already told you he thinks telescopic ladders are a Bad Thing.


Well yes (I had already got that). ;-)

Albeit with no detail or justification.


Quite, hence why I pushed him to see if he could / would expand on it
at all. AFAIK, his justification for his potentially 'out of touch' /
'outmoded' comment was down to a bad experience with him using one
horizontally as a gangplank, pushing his barrow load of stolen bricks?
;-(

I must admit from my very limited
experience I don't think I'd like to use one longer than about 3m.


I think it's one of those things where if you *knew* you were safe (it
wasn't going to fail, simply because it was telescopic, even if you
took liberties with it) then you would just treat it like the tool it
was supposed to be.

Like working 1,000 (not 30) feet up using bamboo scaffolding. ;-)

Cheers, T i m


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A ladder is the most dangerous DIY tool I have,
I'd get a normal ladder
where all the parts are visible
and build a special storage area for it

[george]

ps time i got my ladders indoors for the winter mehthinks

On Friday, November 20, 2020 at 12:14:47 PM UTC, T i m wrote:
(I'm re-sending this because whist Agent says it has been sent, I
can't see it on the ng. Sorry if it's a duplicate).

I would like to be able to get up to the gutters / soffits on this two
story Victorian cottage and don't currently have a suitable ladder.

This wouldn't be for any extended work, just replacing the lamp in
floodlight that covers the back garden or removing debris from the
gutters etc.

I like the idea of the telescopic ladders from a storage / portability
POV but I have only ever footed a 3.2m one but I'm assuming I'd be
looking at something quite a bit longer to reach such heights
(probably 5+m)?

It looks like I can do those sorts of things I need with a ladder from
the guidance he

https://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg455.pdf

... and I would be able to secure the ladder appropriately so the
question is really around the practicability feasibility of telescopic
ladders of that sort of length? I'm guessing they wouldn't make them
if no one bought them and from the specs I've seen they could easily
support my weight etc ('ladder max load 150kg' etc).

I really wouldn't be using such regularly but would just like to be
able to myself if required (or send tree climbing daughter up there
whilst I foot it etc). ;-)

What does the panel think, advice on makes / models etc please?

Cheers, T i m

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On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 01:54:08 -0800 (PST), George Miles
wrote:

A ladder is the most dangerous DIY tool I have,


They certainly can be, like many things in fact if you aren't careful
and respect them.

I'd get a normal ladder
where all the parts are visible


I agree there is some comfort in being able to see it all and why I
wouldn't buy a second hand telescopic one.

and build a special storage area for it


And that's the thing ...

[george]

ps time i got my ladders indoors for the winter mehthinks


I have one boat on the landing so there is no room for the ladders.
;-)

Cheers, T i m
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On 20/11/2020 12:32, RobH wrote:

It is showing 3 times for me.


+1
I wonder if the multitude of answers have also been "lost"?

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On 20/11/2020 13:21, Tricky Dicky wrote:
On Friday, 20 November 2020 at 13:00:31 UTC, T i m wrote:
On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 12:54:47 +0000, "Jim GM4DHJ ..."
wrote:

snip
What does the panel think, advice on makes / models etc please?



bloody newbies


So, Jimmy, when you ask a serious question here and people take the
**** out of you you throw your toys out the pram?

Hypocrisy?

Cheers, T i m

I have seen 6.2m telescopic ladders on eBay for £19.00 but you got to ask yourself just how good they are when the likes of Screwfix are selling 3m+ types between £100 & £150. I really would not like to find out when 6m above the ground. I have a 3.6m one which is more than adequate to reach everything I need to on our bungalow but it is heavy and difficult to manoeuvre I can only imagine how awkward a version nearly twice mine would be to carry, extend and manoeuvre.


I wonder how narrow some of the rungs would be with a longer telescopic
ladder? The top rungs would be OK because of the narrowness of the side
rails but for the lower rungs the side rail has to accommodate all the
other side rails inside of it.

With my 3.Xm telescopic ladder and wearing fairly wide safety shoes that
climbing down I tend to start touching the side rail and have to adjust
my position which can be a PITA when carrying something down.

As other have commented the better quality telescopic ladders are not
particularly light and a 6m to 10m may be quite heavy if it is not to
flex too much when using it.

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On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 11:48:35 +0000, alan_m
wrote:

On 20/11/2020 12:32, RobH wrote:

It is showing 3 times for me.


+1
I wonder if the multitude of answers have also been "lost"?


Not to the ones I've replied to in this thread but I still can't see
any others? ;-(

Maybe I'll fire up TB on ES and see if I can see them that way.

Cheers, T i m
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On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 11:58:13 +0000, alan_m
wrote:

snip

I wonder how narrow some of the rungs would be with a longer telescopic
ladder? The top rungs would be OK because of the narrowness of the side
rails but for the lower rungs the side rail has to accommodate all the
other side rails inside of it.


I would assume (but don't know) that they would make the longer
ladders slightly wider (at the base) to accommodate that?

With my 3.Xm telescopic ladder and wearing fairly wide safety shoes that
climbing down I tend to start touching the side rail and have to adjust
my position which can be a PITA when carrying something down.


Understood.

As other have commented the better quality telescopic ladders are not
particularly light and a 6m to 10m may be quite heavy if it is not to
flex too much when using it.


I think 'flex' is one of those things you would get (or have to get)
used to and learn it's 'par for the course', compared with a rigid
ladder. Like stepping out onto glass floored viewing platform at the
top of a tower or skyscraper and trusting that it's not going to crack
and you fall though.

Flex on a telescopic might be like flex with a reed rather than the
stiffness of an oak tree etc.

Cheers, T i m

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On 21/11/2020 17:46, T i m wrote:

Like stepping out onto glass floored viewing platform at the
top of a tower or skyscraper and trusting that it's not going to crack
and you fall though.


Unless designed to crack
https://youtu.be/5e8P1UMUQhk


Flex on a telescopic might be like flex with a reed rather than the
stiffness of an oak tree etc.


But is it flexing because you and your load are too heavy for it. They
seem to only give the static load not any dynamic load figures. Is
climbing and descending a ladder a static load?


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I was balancing on the top rungs to paint windows and finials
so I bought a new ladder a few months ago
10.63m Werner from Wickes.
https://www.wickes.co.uk/Werner-Prof...adder/p/193899

Its a bit too heavy for me to put up alone.

And I have a standoff for the top to clean gutters etc
https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_f...d+off&_sacat=0

I also throw a rope down over the roof
with a loop i put my arm through
so I can tarzan away if something fails.

And I tie the top of the ladder as soon as i can.

I think UK statistics have more deaths from ladders than chainsaws and anglegrinders!

george



On Friday, November 20, 2020 at 12:14:47 PM UTC, T i m wrote:
(I'm re-sending this because whist Agent says it has been sent, I
can't see it on the ng. Sorry if it's a duplicate).

I would like to be able to get up to the gutters / soffits on this two
story Victorian cottage and don't currently have a suitable ladder.

This wouldn't be for any extended work, just replacing the lamp in
floodlight that covers the back garden or removing debris from the
gutters etc.

I like the idea of the telescopic ladders from a storage / portability
POV but I have only ever footed a 3.2m one but I'm assuming I'd be
looking at something quite a bit longer to reach such heights
(probably 5+m)?

It looks like I can do those sorts of things I need with a ladder from
the guidance he

https://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg455.pdf

... and I would be able to secure the ladder appropriately so the
question is really around the practicability feasibility of telescopic
ladders of that sort of length? I'm guessing they wouldn't make them
if no one bought them and from the specs I've seen they could easily
support my weight etc ('ladder max load 150kg' etc).

I really wouldn't be using such regularly but would just like to be
able to myself if required (or send tree climbing daughter up there
whilst I foot it etc). ;-)

What does the panel think, advice on makes / models etc please?

Cheers, T i m

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On 21/11/2020 17:57, alan_m wrote:

Unless designed to crack
https://youtu.be/5e8P1UMUQhk


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9_f3GldYGg


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On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 17:57:16 +0000, alan_m
wrote:

On 21/11/2020 17:46, T i m wrote:

Like stepping out onto glass floored viewing platform at the
top of a tower or skyscraper and trusting that it's not going to crack
and you fall though.


Unless designed to crack
https://youtu.be/5e8P1UMUQhk


;-)


Flex on a telescopic might be like flex with a reed rather than the
stiffness of an oak tree etc.


But is it flexing because you and your load are too heavy for it.


Yup, that's the question that will be answered over time and use.

They
seem to only give the static load not any dynamic load figures. Is
climbing and descending a ladder a static load?


Good question, however, if they are rated as '150kg max load' you can
be fairly sure that won't be close to the failure point and in the
worst case of usage (eg, lower than 70 degrees or with someone
'bouncing' on it).

If they were a real / practical 'death trap', I'm guessing we would
have seen the on Watchdog. ;-)

Or might it be a case of 'Dead men don't talk'?

Cheers, T i m



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On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 10:02:14 -0800 (PST), George Miles
wrote:

I was balancing on the top rungs to paint windows and finials
so I bought a new ladder a few months ago
10.63m Werner from Wickes.
https://www.wickes.co.uk/Werner-Prof...adder/p/193899


Woah, that's a long ladder.

Its a bit too heavy for me to put up alone.


I'm not surprised!

And I have a standoff for the top to clean gutters etc
https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_f...d+off&_sacat=0


I was thinking of getting something like that as well.

I also throw a rope down over the roof
with a loop i put my arm through
so I can tarzan away if something fails.


Or rip you arm off before you hit the ground. ;-(

And I tie the top of the ladder as soon as i can.


Good idea.

I think UK statistics have more deaths from ladders than chainsaws and anglegrinders!


I wouldn't be surprised. The thing is, they might not look dangerous,
angle grinders and chainsaws typically do.


Cheers, T i m
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On 20/11/2020 16:19, T i m wrote:

Price has little to do with quality.


Often, especially these days.

It is determined by the 'what the
market will stand' principle.


Often (especially these days) but not always.


Always when there are shareholders. No-one is going to stand up in a
board meeting and advocate a policy that reduces profits.


People will always charge what they can get.


'Some people' might, others have morals / ethics and be happy to
provide (good) value for money.


I'm talking about businesses. The only ethic is, 'maximise profits'.


I have probably done hundreds of jobs in my time for others where I
could very easily have charged (and was generally offered) money to do
so but refused, preferring to work on the 'What goes round, comes
round' idea.

That's not that I couldn't have made use of the extra cash of course,
but as long as I could live reasonably comfortably that was all I
*needed*.


Ah now, leaving aside my point below, some people have the attitude that
you display, whist others think, "There might be a rainy day ahead. I
need to maximise my income and save." When my wife became gravely ill I
was 62 and planned to retire at 66 or 67. But because I'd grabbed at
every cent for years I was able to retire and look after her.


So, I'd get called out by an elderly neighbour because their TV /
video had 'gone wrong' and I'd pop along (often there and then) and
sort it out for them (for nowt).

That's what being a good neighbour is all about eh?


Yes of course, but you're confusing 'society' with 'business'.
Cheers, T i m


Bill
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On 21/11/2020 17:46, T i m wrote:
I think 'flex' is one of those things you would get (or have to get)
used to


The problem is, the top of the ladder gets dangerously steep when
there's too much flexing. You can't beat a good strong ladder. It wants
to feel like you're climbing a staircase.

Bill
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On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 20:18:22 +0000, williamwright
wrote:

On 20/11/2020 16:19, T i m wrote:

Price has little to do with quality.


Often, especially these days.

It is determined by the 'what the
market will stand' principle.


Often (especially these days) but not always.


Always when there are shareholders.


Only the mercenary ones that seem feature in your world.

No-one is going to stand up in a
board meeting and advocate a policy that reduces profits.


It depends why the profits might become reduced. There are many modern
/ progressive companies who have shareholders specifically because of
their green or human rights considerations.


People will always charge what they can get.


'Some people' might, others have morals / ethics and be happy to
provide (good) value for money.


I'm talking about businesses.


As am I.

The only ethic is, 'maximise profits'.


See above, 'in your world'.


I have probably done hundreds of jobs in my time for others where I
could very easily have charged (and was generally offered) money to do
so but refused, preferring to work on the 'What goes round, comes
round' idea.

That's not that I couldn't have made use of the extra cash of course,
but as long as I could live reasonably comfortably that was all I
*needed*.


Ah now, leaving aside my point below, some people have the attitude that
you display, whist others think, "There might be a rainy day ahead. I
need to maximise my income and save."


Yup, and there is nothing wrong with that ... and it can be done
whilst not fleecing anyone.

When my wife became gravely ill I
was 62 and planned to retire at 66 or 67. But because I'd grabbed at
every cent for years I was able to retire and look after her.


That worked out well for you both then at least.


So, I'd get called out by an elderly neighbour because their TV /
video had 'gone wrong' and I'd pop along (often there and then) and
sort it out for them (for nowt).

That's what being a good neighbour is all about eh?


Yes of course, but you're confusing 'society' with 'business'.


I'm not. I never volunteered for overtime or any extra work because I
valued my home / personal life. I wasn't / am-not unique in that.
However, if it was required that I work long / late I would but I
generally swapped that extra time for time off.

For some people, *and businesses* money isn't the most important
thing. Of course it *is* important, in that they need to cover their
costs, pay wages and invest in their future, it'd just many have good
ethics as well.

Cheers, T i m


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On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 20:22:26 +0000, williamwright
wrote:

On 21/11/2020 17:46, T i m wrote:
I think 'flex' is one of those things you would get (or have to get)
used to


The problem is, the top of the ladder gets dangerously steep when
there's too much flexing.


Sure, but I don't think they are made of rubber. Watching my
not-exactly-lightweight mate working on his CCTV camera at about 3m on
his telescopic ladder and I can't remember seeing it flex much at all?

You can't beat a good strong ladder.


Till you want to get it *in* the back of your hire van or in a lift?
;-(

It wants
to feel like you're climbing a staircase.


Oh, sure, but what if you don't have the storage options for a 'real'
ladder ... or enough of a predictable need but still have a
(especially domestic) need?

Could (and this is back to the $100 question) a 'good' 5m telescopic
ladder give me useable access to a gutter 5m off the ground?

Cheers, T i m
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On 21/11/2020 21:54, T i m wrote:

Could (and this is back to the $100 question) a 'good' 5m telescopic
ladder give me useable access to a gutter 5m off the ground?



No, you need a ladder longer than 5m to reach 5m unless you intend to
rig your ladders in the same way as Fred Dibnah. In addition, and as
mentioned previously, for gutter work (clearing gutters) you need a
ladder to extend beyond the gutter level by maybe 0.6m.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F04dGK1_wYA


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On 21/11/2020 21:21, T i m wrote:
On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 20:18:22 +0000, williamwright
wrote:


It is determined by the 'what the
market will stand' principle.

Often (especially these days) but not always.


Always when there are shareholders.


Only the mercenary ones that seem feature in your world.


Now now! That's a bit harsh! I can only speak as I find. There is some
genuine philanthropy in business I grant you, but there is far more
virtue signaling, publicity gaining, tax avoidance, and green-washing.


No-one is going to stand up in a
board meeting and advocate a policy that reduces profits.


It depends why the profits might become reduced. There are many modern
/ progressive companies who have shareholders specifically because of
their green or human rights considerations.


See above. Public relations.

That's not that I couldn't have made use of the extra cash of course,
but as long as I could live reasonably comfortably that was all I
*needed*.


Ah now, leaving aside my point below, some people have the attitude that
you display, whist others think, "There might be a rainy day ahead. I
need to maximise my income and save."


Yup, and there is nothing wrong with that ... and it can be done
whilst not fleecing anyone.


Of course it can. That's what I did. And I paid my taxes. And I did
freebies for hospices and dogs' homes.


For some people, *and businesses* money isn't the most important
thing. Of course it *is* important, in that they need to cover their
costs, pay wages and invest in their future, it'd just many have good
ethics as well.


Can't beat my ethics Tim. I think you're falling into the trap of
thinking that only people with your mindset can be ethical.

Bill

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On 21/11/2020 18:45, T i m wrote:

They
seem to only give the static load not any dynamic load figures. Is
climbing and descending a ladder a static load?


Good question, however, if they are rated as '150kg max load' you can
be fairly sure that won't be close to the failure point and in the
worst case of usage (eg, lower than 70 degrees or with someone
'bouncing' on it).


Never mind the theory. Any ladder that you plan to use, place it fully
extended horizontally on the ground, supported only at the ends by saw
horses or piles of beer crates or whatever. Climb onto the midpoint
carrying any likely load. If it takes that it's OK. That was my periodic
test of ladders for all my years of using them.

Bill
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On 21/11/2020 21:54, T i m wrote:

The problem is, the top of the ladder gets dangerously steep when
there's too much flexing.


Sure, but I don't think they are made of rubber. Watching my
not-exactly-lightweight mate working on his CCTV camera at about 3m on
his telescopic ladder and I can't remember seeing it flex much at all?


Well that means it's alright then, assuming he had it at a sensible angle.

Incidentally, most 'ladder guides' suggest angles that are too steep.
That's because they worry about the ladder sagging. But a decent ladder
can be put at more of an angle, which is very much safer.


You can't beat a good strong ladder.


Till you want to get it *in* the back of your hire van or in a lift?
;-(


Like I said, I have two telescopic ladder for restricted access situations.


It wants
to feel like you're climbing a staircase.


Oh, sure, but what if you don't have the storage options for a 'real'
ladder ... or enough of a predictable need but still have a
(especially domestic) need?


Surely you can find somewhere for a triple that extends to six metres?
You can stand such a thing up in the corner of a room, and a domestic
quality one would be fine for you, and they don't weigh much, and you
can remove one section and it gives you a really useful double, and
there's no hidden 'works' and catches that can fail.


Could (and this is back to the $100 question) a 'good' 5m telescopic
ladder give me useable access to a gutter 5m off the ground?


No because you need a ladder that extends well above the work height,
and you need one that won't flap about like a big girl's blouse, or
suddenly collapse due to a catch not latching properly.

Tim, all I'm trying to do is advise you from experience, in the hope
that you don't break your bloody neck. If you want to be stubborn about
it that's fine, but don't expect me to visit you in the spinal
rehabilitation centre.

Bill

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