"We need to upgrade your electricity and gas meters to our new self-
reading smart meters.
Why are we changing your meters?
We need to install smart meters into all of our customers' homes as part
of a government led nationwide upgrade programme. The good news is they
have great benefits for you:
€¢No need to provide meter readings, they're sent to us automatically
€¢No more estimated bills1
€¢See how much energy you're using and what it's costing you, with a
helpful in-home display.
"

However I can ring up and tell them that I don't want one. :-)

I wonder how many neighbours will go onto smart metering?

Having had the knee jerk "No Way!!!" response, I am wondering if there is
a major down side if the meter is SMETS 2 compatible.

Do all power companies support SMETS 2 meters and use them if you switch
suppliers?

The only minor benefit I can see at the moment is monitoring of gas usage
as I already have a free clamp on meter from EON for the electricity.

Cheers



Dave R

--
AMD FX-6300 in GA-990X-Gaming SLI-CF running Windows 7 Pro x64

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

On Tue, 12 Jun 2018 12:02:43 +0000, Huge wrote:

On 2018-06-12, David wrote:
"We need to upgrade your electricity and gas meters to our new self-
reading smart meters.
Why are we changing your meters?
We need to install smart meters into all of our customers' homes as part
of a government led nationwide upgrade programme. The good news is they
have great benefits for you:
•No need to provide meter readings, they're sent to us automatically
•No more estimated bills1
•See how much energy you're using and what it's costing you, with a
helpful in-home display.
"

However I can ring up and tell them that I don't want one. :-)

I wonder how many neighbours will go onto smart metering?

Having had the knee jerk "No Way!!!" response, I am wondering if there
is a major down side if the meter is SMETS 2 compatible.

Do all power companies support SMETS 2 meters and use them if you switch
suppliers?

The only minor benefit I can see at the moment is monitoring of gas
usage as I already have a free clamp on meter from EON for the
electricity.

You should always look at these things from the PoV of;

- What happens if it goes wrong?
- What happens if it's hacked/compromised? - What benefits accrue to the
people trying to "sell" this to me? - What happens if it's abused?

rather then from the PoV of the minimal benefits that accrue to you.

Smart meters - 5 points:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHQT16jBFEw

--
Microsoft has EU in its grip:-

The Microsoft cyber attack | DW Documentary
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wGLS2rSQPQ

On 12/06/18 12:40, David wrote:
"We need to upgrade your electricity and gas meters to our new self-
reading smart meters.
Why are we changing your meters?
We need to install smart meters into all of our customers' homes as part
of a government led nationwide upgrade programme. The good news is they
have great benefits for you:
€¢No need to provide meter readings, they're sent to us automatically
€¢No more estimated bills1
€¢See how much energy you're using and what it's costing you, with a
helpful in-home display.
"

However I can ring up and tell them that I don't want one. :-)

I wonder how many neighbours will go onto smart metering?

Having had the knee jerk "No Way!!!" response, I am wondering if there is
a major down side if the meter is SMETS 2 compatible.

Do all power companies support SMETS 2 meters and use them if you switch
suppliers?

The only minor benefit I can see at the moment is monitoring of gas usage
as I already have a free clamp on meter from EON for the electricity.

Cheers



I was under the impression that they haven't yet started rolling out the
series 2 meters so the necessity for change in the future and current
incompatibility between certain suppliers is still at issue(BICBW)

Nick

On 12/06/2018 13:18, Nick Odell wrote:
On 12/06/18 12:40, David wrote:
"We need to upgrade your electricity and gas meters to our new self-
reading smart meters.
Why are we changing your meters?
We need to install smart meters into all of our customers' homes as part
of a government led nationwide upgrade programme. The good news is they
have great benefits for you:
€¢No need to provide meter readings, they're sent to us automatically
€¢No more estimated bills1
€¢See how much energy you're using and what it's costing you, with a
helpful in-home display.
"

However I can ring up and tell them that I don't want one. :-)

I wonder how many neighbours will go onto smart metering?

Having had the knee jerk "No Way!!!" response, I am wondering if there is
a major down side if the meter is SMETS 2 compatible.

Do all power companies support SMETS 2 meters and use them if you switch
suppliers?

The only minor benefit I can see at the moment is monitoring of gas usage
as I already have a free clamp on meter from EON for the electricity.

Cheers



I was under the impression that they haven't yet started rolling out the
series 2 meters so the necessity for change in the future and current
incompatibility between certain suppliers is still at issue(BICBW)

Nick
Eon keep pestering me to have a smart meter. They cannot understand that
they attempted to fit one "eons" ago, and fail;ed. it was too far from
their useless base to work. However they keep pestering me.

On 12/06/2018 13:10, Martin Barclay wrote:


Smart meters - 5 points:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHQT16jBFEw


Well that's pretty much BS.

Smart meters save you money even if you don't have one as they don't
need an army of readers to go out and read them.

They can save you money as some companies are now offering different
tariffs to customers with smart meters as they can give free days or
variable tariffs. If your lifestyle fits one of these tariffs you save
money if it doesn't, well neither does the one you are on.

As for data mining, well just what can you tell from a meter reading
every few minutes? Answer not a lot. Is it worth anything, well to them
as buyers of energy yes, to anyone else probably not.

On 12/06/2018 13:43, Broadback wrote:

Eon keep pestering me to have a smart meter. They cannot understand that
they attempted to fit one "eons" ago, and fail;ed. it was too far from
their useless base to work. However they keep pestering me.

Maybe the mobile phone network has been upgraded?
If the smart meter doesn't work then the O2 network signal is weak.

Martin Barclay was thinking very hard :
On Tue, 12 Jun 2018 12:02:43 +0000, Huge wrote:

Smart meters - 5 points:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHQT16jBFEw

Which contains mostly bull****, technobabble.

They don't transmit low frequency they transmit on UHF to the indoor
unit. Once per day they transmit on the mobile phone channel, to send
the data. The risk is several orders of magnitude less to the customer,
than using a mobile phone next to the head.

I have never heard of an SM being hacked, to monitor their usage, nor
anyones gas or power being turned off by a hacker. There are much
easier methods of finding out if a home is unoccupied, than trying to
hack into a meter anyway.

The one thing he got right, was that you can still refuse to have an
SM.

On 12/06/2018 14:20, dennis@home wrote:
Smart meters save you money even if you don't have one as they don't
need an army of readers to go out and read them.

Then that 'saving' is for the company, NOT the consumer.

I send an accurate electric meter reading every three months
when EDF send me an email requesting it. My balance is updated
immediately and I can pay immediately or wait 2 days to get
an actual electronic bill and then pay it.

However, if I was on direct debits (sic) then i would be
paying an *estimated* amount every month, whereas I actually
pay the proper balance in FULL, and yet derive none of the
financial bribes for DD.

Since most people on DD ended up in credit it is easy to see
why the energy companies preferred DD's.

On 12/06/2018 14:39, Andrew wrote:
On 12/06/2018 14:20, dennis@home wrote:
Smart meters save you money even if you don't have one as they don't
need an army of readers to go out and read them.

Then that 'saving' is for the company, NOT the consumer.

I send an accurate electric meter reading every three months
when EDF send me an email requesting it. My balance is updated
immediately and I can pay immediately or wait 2 days to get
an actual electronic bill and then pay it.

However, if I was on direct debits (sic) then i would be
paying an *estimated* amount every month, whereas I actually
pay the proper balance in FULL, and yet derive none of the
financial bribes for DD.

Since most people on DD ended up in credit it is easy to see
why the energy companies preferred DD's.


We have had smart meters for 5+ years. We have never been in credit by
more than about £75. With the interest rates over that period, the loss
of income to us is trivial. It is dwarfed by the discounts/lower
tariffs offered for monthly DDs.



--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

On Tuesday, 12 June 2018 14:20:17 UTC+1, dennis@home wrote:
On 12/06/2018 13:10, Martin Barclay wrote:


Smart meters - 5 points:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHQT16jBFEw


Well that's pretty much BS.

Smart meters save you money even if you don't have one as they don't
need an army of readers to go out and read them.

How does that save me money ?


They can save you money as some companies are now offering different
tariffs to customers with smart meters as they can give free days or
variable tariffs. If your lifestyle fits one of these tariffs you save
money if it doesn't, well neither does the one you are on.

you assume smart meters are here to save YOU and teh customer money ?

It's not you know it's for larger company profits.

How many on here have been given a discount if they have a smartmeter installed ?




As for data mining, well just what can you tell from a meter reading
every few minutes? Answer not a lot.

I can.


Is it worth anything, well to them
as buyers of energy yes, to anyone else probably not.

I know when my immersion heater comes on and off.

In article , dennis@home
wrote:
On 12/06/2018 13:43, Broadback wrote:

Eon keep pestering me to have a smart meter. They cannot understand
that they attempted to fit one "eons" ago, and fail;ed. it was too far
from their useless base to work. However they keep pestering me.

Maybe the mobile phone network has been upgraded? If the smart meter
doesn't work then the O2 network signal is weak.

I don't think they use a mobile phone network. They have their own.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On 12/06/2018 15:03, charles wrote:
In article , dennis@home
wrote:
On 12/06/2018 13:43, Broadback wrote:

Eon keep pestering me to have a smart meter. They cannot understand
that they attempted to fit one "eons" ago, and fail;ed. it was too far
from their useless base to work. However they keep pestering me.

Maybe the mobile phone network has been upgraded? If the smart meter
doesn't work then the O2 network signal is weak.

I don't think they use a mobile phone network. They have their own.

I have no problems with my mobile phone, so that cannot be the case.
Just p*ss poor equipment.

On Tue, 12 Jun 2018 14:34:12 +0100, Harry Bloomfield wrote:

Martin Barclay was thinking very hard :
On Tue, 12 Jun 2018 12:02:43 +0000, Huge wrote:

Smart meters - 5 points:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHQT16jBFEw

Which contains mostly bull****, technobabble.

They don't transmit low frequency they transmit on UHF to the indoor unit.
Once per day they transmit on the mobile phone channel, to send the data.
The risk is several orders of magnitude less to the customer, than using a
mobile phone next to the head.

I have never heard of an SM being hacked, to monitor their usage, nor
anyones gas or power being turned off by a hacker. There are much easier
methods of finding out if a home is unoccupied, than trying to hack into a
meter anyway.

The one thing he got right, was that you can still refuse to have an SM.

Smart electricity meters can be dangerously insecure, warns expert.
https://www.theguardian.com/technolo...secure-hackers

https://boingboing.net/2016/12/31/yo...ery-secur.html

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/1...y_reserachers/


--
Microsoft has EU in its grip:-

The Microsoft cyber attack | DW Documentary
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wGLS2rSQPQ

Martin Barclay pretended :
https://www.theguardian.com/technolo...secure-hackers

Well, if its in the press, it must be right and must be believed - not.

Does anyone seriously believe any of this? Has there ever been a
single, reliably reported incident of any of this actually happening? I
guess not, but it helps to sell newspapers.

€œHe can do billing fraud, setting your bill to whatever he likes €¦ The
scary thing is if you think about the power they have over your
electricity. He will have power over all of your smart devices
connected to the electricity. This will have more severe consequences:
imagine you woke up to find youd been robbed by a burglar who didnt
have to break in.

€œBut even if you dont have smart devices, you are still at risk. An
attacker who controls the meter also controls the meters software,
allowing him to cause it to literally explode.€�

charles was thinking very hard :
I don't think they use a mobile phone network. They have their own.

They use the nomal mobile phone network, when there is surplus capacity
on the network, after midnight.

whisky-dave wrote :
How does that save me money ?

It avoids them having to employ a little man to drive around in his
van, collecting meter readings. It is greener that burning fuel driving
around to collect them.

For you, there is no immediate benefit, but all of these things help
reduce running costs and long term we will see some benefits.

On 12/06/18 15:03, charles wrote:
In article , dennis@home
wrote:
On 12/06/2018 13:43, Broadback wrote:

Eon keep pestering me to have a smart meter. They cannot understand
that they attempted to fit one "eons" ago, and fail;ed. it was too far
from their useless base to work. However they keep pestering me.

Maybe the mobile phone network has been upgraded? If the smart meter
doesn't work then the O2 network signal is weak.

I don't think they use a mobile phone network. They have their own.

They use the mobile phone network. They do not have their own


--
If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will
eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such
time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic
and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally
important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for
the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the
truth is the greatest enemy of the State.

Joseph Goebbels

In article ,
Harry Bloomfield wrote:
charles was thinking very hard :
I don't think they use a mobile phone network. They have their own.

They use the nomal mobile phone network, when there is surplus capacity
on the network, after midnight.


It's a wonder it works here, then.

Charles

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On Tue, 12 Jun 2018 16:27:31 +0100, Harry Bloomfield stuck his fingers in
his ears & chanted "La, la, la, la, la, la.


--
Microsoft has EU in its grip:-

The Microsoft cyber attack | DW Documentary
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wGLS2rSQPQ

On 12/06/2018 14:39, Andrew wrote:
On 12/06/2018 14:20, dennis@home wrote:
Smart meters save you money even if you don't have one as they don't
need an army of readers to go out and read them.

Then that 'saving' is for the company, NOT the consumer.

The consumer pays for all the costs of a business!


I send an accurate electric meter reading every three months
when EDF send me an email requesting it. My balance is updated
immediately and I can pay immediately or wait 2 days to get
an actual electronic bill and then pay it.

However, if I was on direct debits (sic) then i would be
paying an *estimated* amount every month, whereas I actually
pay the proper balance in FULL, and yet derive none of the
financial bribes for DD.

Since most people on DD ended up in credit it is easy to see
why the energy companies preferred DD's.


They like to know they are getting money to spend rather than risk you
not paying when the bill arrives and them having to borrow to cover your
debt and pay the collectors, etc.

The actual rate of interest they can earn on your cash is quite low
compared to the costs if you don't pay.

Maybe you could get a better deal by paying 3 months in advance? Or how
about a smart meter and paying daily or by the unit?

On 12/06/18 14:39, Andrew wrote:
On 12/06/2018 14:20, dennis@home wrote:
Smart meters save you money even if you don't have one as they don't
need an army of readers to go out and read them.

Then that 'saving' is for the company, NOT the consumer.

I send an accurate electric meter reading every three months
when EDF send me an email requesting it. My balance is updated
immediately and I can pay immediately or wait 2 days to get
an actual electronic bill and then pay it.

However, if I was on direct debits (sic) then i would be
paying an *estimated* amount every month, whereas I actually
pay the proper balance in FULL, and yet derive none of the
financial bribes for DD.

Since most people on DD ended up in credit it is easy to see
why the energy companies preferred DD's.

+1

It is even more obvious that it is a fiddle to benefit the utility
companies as this sort of "direct debit" is effectively nothing more
than a standing order. Yet the companies will not allow you the reduced
tariff associated with direct debit by accepting a standing order
instead. All that is needed is a balancing payment once a year - either
debit or credit - so you only pay for the energy you actually use.

Of course, it doesn't matter if you overpay by £10 a month does it? You
don't really don't miss interest on that £10 as the interest rates are
so low. Now multiply that by a million for the total number of customers
the company has, and that £10 million can generate a nice amount of
interest for them.

But surely the companies don't set up monthly fixed DDs for smart meter
customers, do they? I assumed they would simply deduct the correct
amount from your account each month as they have an accurate energy use
reading.

--

Jeff

On 12/06/2018 14:49, Robin wrote:
On 12/06/2018 14:39, Andrew wrote:
On 12/06/2018 14:20, dennis@home wrote:
Smart meters save you money even if you don't have one as they don't
need an army of readers to go out and read them.

Then that 'saving' is for the company, NOT the consumer.

I send an accurate electric meter reading every three months
when EDF send me an email requesting it. My balance is updated
immediately and I can pay immediately or wait 2 days to get
an actual electronic bill and then pay it.

However, if I was on direct debits (sic) then i would be
paying an *estimated* amount every month, whereas I actually
pay the proper balance in FULL, and yet derive none of the
financial bribes for DD.

Since most people on DD ended up in credit it is easy to see
why the energy companies preferred DD's.


We have had smart meters for 5+ years.Â* We have never been in credit by
more than about £75.Â* With the interest rates over that period, the loss
of income to us is trivial.Â* It is dwarfed by the discounts/lower
tariffs offered for monthly DDs.


You can change them anyway so you don't run up credit.

The problem with all of this is that are they absolutely sure this time that
they are unhackable and reliable on all tarrifs?
Also if anyone in your area has a blind resident, make sure they ask for
one of the talking remote units that offgen told me are readily available
but EDF say they cannot buy.
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"David" wrote in message
...
"We need to upgrade your electricity and gas meters to our new self-
reading smart meters.
Why are we changing your meters?
We need to install smart meters into all of our customers' homes as part
of a government led nationwide upgrade programme. The good news is they
have great benefits for you:
.No need to provide meter readings, they're sent to us automatically
.No more estimated bills1
.See how much energy you're using and what it's costing you, with a
helpful in-home display.
"

However I can ring up and tell them that I don't want one. :-)

I wonder how many neighbours will go onto smart metering?

Having had the knee jerk "No Way!!!" response, I am wondering if there is
a major down side if the meter is SMETS 2 compatible.

Do all power companies support SMETS 2 meters and use them if you switch
suppliers?

The only minor benefit I can see at the moment is monitoring of gas usage
as I already have a free clamp on meter from EON for the electricity.

Cheers



Dave R

--
AMD FX-6300 in GA-990X-Gaming SLI-CF running Windows 7 Pro x64

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

On Tuesday, June 12, 2018 at 4:34:28 PM UTC+1, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
whisky-dave wrote :
How does that save me money ?

It avoids them having to employ a little man to drive around in his
van, collecting meter readings. It is greener that burning fuel driving
around to collect them.

For you, there is no immediate benefit, but all of these things help
reduce running costs and long term we will see some benefits.

My arse. Or do you still believe in 'trickle-down' economics?

On 12/06/2018 14:53, whisky-dave wrote:
On Tuesday, 12 June 2018 14:20:17 UTC+1, dennis@home wrote:
On 12/06/2018 13:10, Martin Barclay wrote:


Smart meters - 5 points:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHQT16jBFEw


Well that's pretty much BS.

Smart meters save you money even if you don't have one as they don't
need an army of readers to go out and read them.

How does that save me money ?


They can save you money as some companies are now offering different
tariffs to customers with smart meters as they can give free days or
variable tariffs. If your lifestyle fits one of these tariffs you save
money if it doesn't, well neither does the one you are on.

you assume smart meters are here to save YOU and teh customer money ?

It's not you know it's for larger company profits.

How many on here have been given a discount if they have a smartmeter installed ?

How many have switched to a smart meter tariff?

As for data mining, well just what can you tell from a meter reading
every few minutes? Answer not a lot.

I can.

You can't.



Is it worth anything, well to them
as buyers of energy yes, to anyone else probably not.

I know when my immersion heater comes on and off.



What you don't have a stat so it comes on and off by the clock, that's
just stupid.
Oh its you.

Yes they told me that they were not bothered if i did not have one as their
main target were dual fuel users. So what happens if you are a dual fuel
user and suddenly want to buy gas from another company?



Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Huge" wrote in message
...
On 2018-06-12, David wrote:
"We need to upgrade your electricity and gas meters to our new self-
reading smart meters.
Why are we changing your meters?
We need to install smart meters into all of our customers' homes as part
of a government led nationwide upgrade programme. The good news is they
have great benefits for you:
.No need to provide meter readings, they're sent to us automatically
.No more estimated bills1
.See how much energy you're using and what it's costing you, with a
helpful in-home display.
"

However I can ring up and tell them that I don't want one. :-)

I wonder how many neighbours will go onto smart metering?

Having had the knee jerk "No Way!!!" response, I am wondering if there is
a major down side if the meter is SMETS 2 compatible.

Do all power companies support SMETS 2 meters and use them if you switch
suppliers?

The only minor benefit I can see at the moment is monitoring of gas usage
as I already have a free clamp on meter from EON for the electricity.

You should always look at these things from the PoV of;

- What happens if it goes wrong?
- What happens if it's hacked/compromised?
- What benefits accrue to the people trying to "sell" this to me?
- What happens if it's abused?

rather then from the PoV of the minimal benefits that accrue to you.



--
Today is Pungenday, the 17th day of Confusion in the YOLD 3184
Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn.

On 12/06/2018 16:27, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
Martin Barclay pretended :
https://www.theguardian.com/technolo...secure-hackers


Well, if its in the press, it must be right and must be believed - not.

Does anyone seriously believe any of this? Has there ever been a single,
reliably reported incident of any of this actually happening? I guess
not, but it helps to sell newspapers.

€œHe can do billing fraud, setting your bill to whatever he likes €¦ The
scary thing is if you think about the power they have over your
electricity. He will have power over all of your smart devices connected
to the electricity. This will have more severe consequences: imagine you
woke up to find youd been robbed by a burglar who didnt have to break in.

€œBut even if you dont have smart devices, you are still at risk. An
attacker who controls the meter also controls the meters software,
allowing him to cause it to literally explode.€�


Someone should ask the idiot which physical device in a smart meter can
be made to explode using software, he won't know. H e has seen too many
hollywood movies where things explode when a hacker does something.

Long gone are the days when setting the wrong refresh rate could
overload a monitor which was about the only household item you could get
to "explode".

On 12/06/2018 15:03, charles wrote:
In article , dennis@home
wrote:
On 12/06/2018 13:43, Broadback wrote:

Eon keep pestering me to have a smart meter. They cannot understand
that they attempted to fit one "eons" ago, and fail;ed. it was too far
from their useless base to work. However they keep pestering me.

Maybe the mobile phone network has been upgraded? If the smart meter
doesn't work then the O2 network signal is weak.

I don't think they use a mobile phone network. They have their own.

The EoN meter I have uses the mobile network. There is no reason to
install another network and there aren't any bandwidth licenses
available for them to use anyway.

On 12/06/2018 16:29, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
charles was thinking very hard :
I don't think they use a mobile phone network. They have their own.

They use the nomal mobile phone network, when there is surplus capacity
on the network, after midnight.

You have all these people saying how easy it is to hack a smart meter
when they don't even know how they are connected. It makes you wonder
about the education in the UK.

On 12/06/2018 17:12, Jeff Layman wrote:

But surely the companies don't set up monthly fixed DDs for smart meter
customers, do they? I assumed they would simply deduct the correct
amount from your account each month as they have an accurate energy use
reading.


You appear to be ignoring or discounting the fact that many people
(perhaps on lower incomes than you or with less interest in advance
budgeting) like to pay the same every month rather than (usually)
significantly less in summer and more in winter.

--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

dennis@home wrote
Martin Barclay wrote

Smart meters - 5 points:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHQT16jBFEw

Well that's pretty much BS.

Smart meters save you money even if you don't have one as they don't need
an army of readers to go out and read them.

And are more convenient if you read the meter yourself currently.

They can save you money as some companies are now offering different
tariffs to customers with smart meters as they can give free days or
variable tariffs. If your lifestyle fits one of these tariffs you save
money if it doesn't, well neither does the one you are on.

As for data mining, well just what can you tell from a meter reading every
few minutes? Answer not a lot. Is it worth anything, well to them as
buyers of energy yes,

Not really, because they can see that in the gross load figures.

Unless they believe that their customers are atypical or something.

to anyone else probably not.

And I couldn’t care less what data mining they do anyway.

Those that supply my mobile and landline services have
always been able to do that and I choose to pay for
anything that I buy electronically because that is much
more convenient than using cash with all except garage
sales and I couldn’t care less that they know what I buy.

In fact both our major supermarket chains give me
a subset of their specials by email based on what
I have bought and that is more convenient that
combing thru the entire specials brochure every week.

Jeff Layman pretended :
Of course, it doesn't matter if you overpay by £10 a month does it? You don't
really don't miss interest on that £10 as the interest rates are so low. Now
multiply that by a million for the total number of customers the company has,
and that £10 million can generate a nice amount of interest for them.

Of course there is at least one company, which pays you interest on any
over payment. More than the interest you would get from the best bank
account.

Robin expressed precisely :
You appear to be ignoring or discounting the fact that many people (perhaps
on lower incomes than you or with less interest in advance budgeting) like to
pay the same every month rather than (usually) significantly less in summer
and more in winter.

I am not one of those, but I find it simpler to know what can expect to
have to fork out each month. As we are still at the beginning of the
warmer, low consumption period, I am in slight energy debt - around
£150 at the last check I made. I don't think any company will be
gaining by the fixed direct debit method of paying, it balances out
over a year.

Martin Barclay used his keyboard to write :
On Tue, 12 Jun 2018 16:27:31 +0100, Harry Bloomfield stuck his fingers in
his ears & chanted "La, la, la, la, la, la.

Are you an adult?

Andrew wrote
dennis@home wrote

Smart meters save you money even if you don't have one as they don't need
an army of readers to go out and read them.

Then that 'saving' is for the company, NOT the consumer.

Its for the consumer too because they can make the same profit with
a lower consumer charge if they don’t have to pay those meter readers.

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 12 June 2018 14:20:17 UTC+1, dennis@home wrote:
On 12/06/2018 13:10, Martin Barclay wrote:


Smart meters - 5 points:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHQT16jBFEw


Well that's pretty much BS.

Smart meters save you money even if you don't have one as they don't
need an army of readers to go out and read them.

How does that save me money ?

They can sell the electricity and gas too you cheaper when
they dont have to pay that army of meter readers, stupid.

They can save you money as some companies are now offering different
tariffs to customers with smart meters as they can give free days or
variable tariffs. If your lifestyle fits one of these tariffs you save
money if it doesn't, well neither does the one you are on.

you assume smart meters are here to save YOU and teh customer money ?

It isnt an assumption, its a fact.

It's not you know it's for larger company profits.

Even sillier than you usually manage in a very
aggressively competitive market like that.

How many on here have been given a discount
if they have a smartmeter installed ?

Plenty get a discount with time of use tariffs
that are only possible with a smart meter.

As for data mining, well just what can you tell from
a meter reading every few minutes? Answer not a lot.

I can.

Bull**** with anything thats any use
to the electricity or gas supplier.

Is it worth anything, well to them as buyers
of energy yes, to anyone else probably not.

I know when my immersion heater comes on and off.

Fat lot of use that is.

"charles" wrote in message
...
In article , dennis@home
wrote:
On 12/06/2018 13:43, Broadback wrote:

Eon keep pestering me to have a smart meter. They cannot understand
that they attempted to fit one "eons" ago, and fail;ed. it was too far
from their useless base to work. However they keep pestering me.

Maybe the mobile phone network has been upgraded? If the smart meter
doesn't work then the O2 network signal is weak.

I don't think they use a mobile phone network.

Corse they do.

They have their own.

That would be insanely expensive for each supplier to do.

Brian Gaff wrote

The problem with all of this is that are they absolutely sure this time
that they are unhackable

Why is that so crucial ?

and reliable on all tariffs?

No reason why they shouldn’t be and that’s a back office
function anyway, not what happens in the meter itself.

Also if anyone in your area has a blind resident, make sure they ask for
one of the talking remote units that offgen told me are readily available
but EDF say they cannot buy.

Why would most care about what the meter reads when
most don’t bother to read their meter with stupid meters.

And that’s the remote anyway, not the meter itself, so even
if it isnt currently available, it will be sometime later.

And presumably most blind people don’t live alone anyway.

"David" wrote in message
...
"We need to upgrade your electricity and gas meters to our new self-
reading smart meters.
Why are we changing your meters?
We need to install smart meters into all of our customers' homes as part
of a government led nationwide upgrade programme. The good news is they
have great benefits for you:
.No need to provide meter readings, they're sent to us automatically
.No more estimated bills1
.See how much energy you're using and what it's costing you, with a
helpful in-home display.
"

However I can ring up and tell them that I don't want one. :-)

I wonder how many neighbours will go onto smart metering?

Having had the knee jerk "No Way!!!" response, I am wondering if there is
a major down side if the meter is SMETS 2 compatible.

Do all power companies support SMETS 2 meters and use them if you switch
suppliers?

The only minor benefit I can see at the moment is monitoring of gas usage
as I already have a free clamp on meter from EON for the electricity.

Cheers



Dave R

--
AMD FX-6300 in GA-990X-Gaming SLI-CF running Windows 7 Pro x64

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"Halmyre" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, June 12, 2018 at 4:34:28 PM UTC+1, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
whisky-dave wrote :
How does that save me money ?

It avoids them having to employ a little man to drive around in his
van, collecting meter readings. It is greener that burning fuel driving
around to collect them.

For you, there is no immediate benefit, but all of these things help
reduce running costs and long term we will see some benefits.

My arse. Or do you still believe in 'trickle-down' economics?

Nothing to do with trickle down economics.

With such an aggressively competitive market, reduced
costs will inevitably see the most competitive able to
offer cheaper electricity and gas prices to the consumers.

"dennis@home" wrote in message
...
On 12/06/2018 16:29, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
charles was thinking very hard :
I don't think they use a mobile phone network. They have their own.

They use the nomal mobile phone network, when there is surplus capacity
on the network, after midnight.

You have all these people saying how easy it is to hack a smart meter when
they don't even know how they are connected. It makes you wonder about the
education in the UK.

Nothing to do with education, the problem is ear to ear dog ****.

Cant even manage to work out that if the supplier doesn't
have to pay for a horde of meter readers, that they can
sell you the electricity and gas at lower prices.

Same with those who field the calls from people who
read their own meter and call with the meter reading.