In article ,
Bert Coules wrote:
Dave Plowman wrote:

How many radio channels do you regularly listen to?

That's a very good point. Certainly no more than three or four
regularly.

Think that's the same with most. Maybe even less.

And FreeView tuners are cheap as chips.

Are you suggesting one Freeview tuner for each radio station?
Yes.
It would be
necessary to split (and perhaps amplify) the incoming aerial signal, but I
imagine that could be done.

Beauty of FreeView tuners is they all have an aerial in and out. Unlike
most FM or DAB receivers. And most will already have a decent TV aerial -
and usually fed to more than one room.

I could feed each tuner to a different input on a central amp, then the
individual room controls would only need to work on the amp in order to
change both channel (ie input) and volume.

It's slightly messy and rather depends on the control system, but it
would surely work. Thanks.

I've distributed all 5 circuits round the house using cheap telephone
cable. Then pick up the wanted one - via a switch - to a local amp and
speakers. Lets you adjust volume and say tone controls for those speakers
easily. Unlike a 100v line system.

It's not going to cost pennies, but once done and done right lasts pretty
well for ever. Same as installing adequate sockets at re-wire time rather
than plodding along with extension leads.

--
*Bigamy is having one wife too many - monogamy is the same

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
John Rumm wrote:
On 02/09/2016 16:36, Bert Coules wrote:
Owain wrote:

Doesn't provide channel changing though.

That does seem to be a stumbling point. If I put a DAB tuner with its
own amp in a central location, and then find a way to feed the output
of the amp to four or five different rooms (if such a way exists) then
I would need control over the tuner (up/down through preset channels)
and the amp (volume only) from each room. I don't know if that can be
done.

Would you be happy to use a smart phone or tablet to do the controlling?

For an out of the box solution you could look at the Sonos speakers.
They do a very good job of keeping in sync while streaming to multiple
speakers over a mixture of ethernet and wifi.

Would you guarantee sync over this? Ie two speakers with the same signal
not giving an annoying echo if heard at the same time? That's the beauty
of analogue - very difficult to introduce such a delay. Even two FreeView
TVs - or two DAB radios, all tuned to the same station will produce this
annoying echo.

--
*I didn't like my beard at first. Then it grew on me.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman wrote:

Beauty of FreeView tuners is they all have an aerial in and out.

Ah, so they could be daisy-chained and only the first one in the chain would
need to be connected to an aerial? That would be good.

Then pick up the wanted one - via a switch - to a local amp and
speakers.

I was hoping to avoid the need for local amps, but (as I've just said in a
different post) the drawback with just one central amp is that each room
would have the selected sound playing at the same time. That's not really
ideal.

Bert

In article ,
Bert Coules wrote:
Dave,

I've just seen a possible drawback to the multiple-tuners approach.

Given this setup: tuners -- amp - speaker distribution hub --
separate rooms

then using individual remotes to switch between tuners (and therefore
radio channels) would work, but I wouldn't have individual-room control
over the volume: the output would be audible in every location
simultaneously. That's not really ideal.

Bert

I have an amp in each place needed. 'Separates' aren't much in fashion
these days and can be picked up cheaply - even free.

--
*The statement above is false

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Bert Coules wrote:
Dave Plowman wrote:

Beauty of FreeView tuners is they all have an aerial in and out.

Ah, so they could be daisy-chained and only the first one in the chain
would need to be connected to an aerial? That would be good.

Yes - most of these seem to have some gain, so daisy chain fine.

Then pick up the wanted one - via a switch - to a local amp and
speakers.

I was hoping to avoid the need for local amps, but (as I've just said in
a different post) the drawback with just one central amp is that each
room would have the selected sound playing at the same time. That's
not really ideal.

It does all sound a fiddle, but once done works brilliantly. I first went
for it due to poor FM reception in this part of London. Portable radios
faded and farted. The basis of it is getting on for 40 years old. Only
major change is FreeView rather than FM tuners.

--
*Money isn't everything, but it sure keeps the kids in touch *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman wrote:

I have an amp in each place needed. 'Separates' aren't much in fashion
these days and can be picked up cheaply - even free.

It's not the cost so much as the space needed and the extra clutter of
cabling and the like which I was hoping to avoid.

Actually, I've just discovered the perfect piece of kit which will do
exactly what I want, but it's very pricey and seem only to be available from
the USA:

https://www.amazon.com/ATNDLA6-6-Roo.../dp/B00R3HKBHU

And I would need extra remotes...

Bert

I've now found this kit by the US company Monoprice:

http://tinyurl.com/j5dy6he

or in full:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AKm...?v=0AKmFXPnGRw

That's a YouTube link. Ideally for my purposes this is an audio amp as well
as a six-zone speaker distributor, and it comes with very neat wall-mounted
remotes which allow switching of input source, output zone and volume -
everything I'm after.

It's a pity that it's only available from the US since that pushes the price
up, but the kit gets some very enthusiastic user reviews and the company,
which was new to me, seems to be a respected one.

So problem solved, I think. Many thanks to everyone for the thoughts and
suggestions.

Bert

On Friday, 2 September 2016 17:51:09 UTC+1, Bert Coules wrote:
Given this setup: tuners -- amp - speaker distribution hub --
separate rooms
then using individual remotes to switch between tuners (and therefore radio
channels) would work, but I wouldn't have individual-room control over the
volume: the output would be audible in every location simultaneously.
That's not really ideal.

You can use speaker volume controls. It's better and easier if you used 100V speakers - multi channels of 100V speaker level audio were carried on a multicore cable to passive bedhead units with a vol control (multi tap attenuator) and channel selector in hotels and hospitals - but you could do it with low impedance (8 ohm) audio. The drawback with low imp is that adjusting one speaker can affect the others.

If you want to distribute at line level and have local amps then you could also distribute say a 24 volt power feed along with the signal wires.

100V attenuators
http://www.canford.co.uk/Products/58...tainless-steel
https://www.cybermarket.co.uk/shop/p...e-1022992.html

low imedance vol control
https://www.amazon.co.uk/B-TECH-BT93.../dp/B000Q4V3OM

Owain

Owain, thanks for that. As you might now have seen from my previous post
I've found a US kit which answers all my needs.

Bert

On Fri, 02 Sep 2016 11:25:38 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

On 02/09/16 11:11, Tim Watts wrote:
On 02/09/16 09:30, Bert Coules wrote:
I've searched around for the answer to this but haven't found it as yet:
is there any regulation concerning placing a small wall-mounted 12V TV
set in a kitchen?

I have a blank area above a draining board, partly protected from
splashes and steam by a 6" deep shelf which runs the length of that
wall. It seems like the obvious place to mount a smallish TV, say 17"
or so. There are specially-designed water- and steam-proof sets
intended for bathrooms but would one of them be overkill for a kitchen?
Is there any reason why I shouldn't use a conventional set?

Many thanks.






Might be OK as there is not really that much steam emitted from a sink,
other than when you drain boiling water into it.
Try dumping a pan of water down the sink and see where the steam cloud
goes.

I've had two kitchens with TVS so far. Mount high up LCDs beat CRTs for
safety .

Nevermind safety, a TV won't last so long if it's damp all the time. Put it somewhere dry or get a damp proof one if it's not much more expensive.

--
What do you call a dwarf who throws the discus?
A compact disc player.

In article , James Wilkinson
wrote:
On Fri, 02 Sep 2016 11:25:38 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

On 02/09/16 11:11, Tim Watts wrote:
On 02/09/16 09:30, Bert Coules wrote:
I've searched around for the answer to this but haven't found it as
yet: is there any regulation concerning placing a small wall-mounted
12V TV set in a kitchen?

I have a blank area above a draining board, partly protected from
splashes and steam by a 6" deep shelf which runs the length of that
wall. It seems like the obvious place to mount a smallish TV, say
17" or so. There are specially-designed water- and steam-proof sets
intended for bathrooms but would one of them be overkill for a
kitchen? Is there any reason why I shouldn't use a conventional set?

Many thanks.






Might be OK as there is not really that much steam emitted from a
sink, other than when you drain boiling water into it. Try dumping a
pan of water down the sink and see where the steam cloud goes.

I've had two kitchens with TVS so far. Mount high up LCDs beat CRTs for
safety .

Nevermind safety, a TV won't last so long if it's damp all the time. Put
it somewhere dry or get a damp proof one if it's not much more expensive.

we've had a tv in our kitchen for years -but it isn't over the sink.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Bert Coules wrote:
I've searched around for the answer to this but haven't found it as yet:
is there any regulation concerning placing a small wall-mounted 12V TV
set in a kitchen?

I have a blank area above a draining board, partly protected from
splashes and steam by a 6" deep shelf which runs the length of that
wall. It seems like the obvious place to mount a smallish TV, say 17"
or so. There are specially-designed water- and steam-proof sets
intended for bathrooms but would one of them be overkill for a kitchen?
Is there any reason why I shouldn't use a conventional set?

I'd look for one with an external power supply. That converts 240v to the
low volts for the set, and have that out of the danger area. I'd not
really like the possibility of someone operating a mains switch with wet
hands while touching a good ground like a metal sink.

Or site it so high it can't be touched at all.

Or get real radical and use the remote to turn it off and on, you dinosaur.

I have an LV in my kitchen that has such a power supply - but it's not
sited where you could touch it while working at the sink anyway.

Brian Gaff wrote

I'd imagine it depends on whether you make a lot of splashes and steam in
that area. To me I've never liked mains powered radios and tvs in
kitchens,

But we do have a vast array of mains powered appliances used in the
kitchen now. And plenty of places allow combined kitchen laundrys too.

but to be fair none of my friends have ever electrocuted themselves

Don’t recall any examples of anyone much country wide having done that
either.

or damaged the equipment. If you do do this though you might want to see
if that area does get damp at any time before deciding and route all
cables well away from the sink.

I've got plenty of appliances including two microwaves and
two dishwashers close to the sink and the freezer too.

Back in the day we used to have an old 13 inch trinitron set and it was
often used in a bathroom. One day when the push buttons broke I had need
to get inside and was amazed that the main chassis had spots of rust and
pealing plating on it, so obviously condensation did it no good at all,
but it never actually went wrong in a major way even then.

"Bert Coules" wrote in message
...
I've searched around for the answer to this but haven't found it as yet:
is there any regulation concerning placing a small wall-mounted 12V TV
set in a kitchen?

I have a blank area above a draining board, partly protected from
splashes and steam by a 6" deep shelf which runs the length of that wall.
It seems like the obvious place to mount a smallish TV, say 17" or so.
There are specially-designed water- and steam-proof sets intended for
bathrooms but would one of them be overkill for a kitchen? Is there any
reason why I shouldn't use a conventional set?

Many thanks.

James Wilkinson wrote:

Never mind safety, a TV won't last so long
if it's damp all the time. Put it somewhere dry...

I don't believe that anything in my kitchen is damp all the time, and a
substantial number of items in the room never get damp at all. I don't see
that a TV would be exceptional in that regard,

In article ,
wrote:
You can use speaker volume controls. It's better and easier if you used
100V speakers - multi channels of 100V speaker level audio were carried
on a multicore cable to passive bedhead units with a vol control (multi
tap attenuator) and channel selector in hotels and hospitals - but you
could do it with low impedance (8 ohm) audio. The drawback with low imp
is that adjusting one speaker can affect the others.

100v line may be convenient for some things, but is never better. Decent
transformers ain't cheap. Maybe OK is just using very efficient speakers -
but most would be considering ordinary domestic speakers of one sort or
another.
Other thing is with less than perfect speakers, an individual amp can
apply bass boost etc to help them along, as well as setting the volume.
With one amp and 100v line, you could only do this if all the speakers are
the same.

If you want to distribute at line level and have local amps then you
could also distribute say a 24 volt power feed along with the signal
wires.

Beauty of my system is being able to use cheap and small cable. Running
enough low volt DC for a power amp would require heavier cable. And is
getting complicated.

--
*IF YOU TRY TO FAIL, AND SUCCEED, WHICH HAVE YOU DONE?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Sat, 03 Sep 2016 00:07:42 +0100, Bert Coules wrote:

James Wilkinson wrote:

Never mind safety, a TV won't last so long
if it's damp all the time. Put it somewhere dry...

I don't believe that anything in my kitchen is damp all the time, and a
substantial number of items in the room never get damp at all. I don't see
that a TV would be exceptional in that regard,

Well not all the time, but very damp for some of the time. 100% humidity. If you read the instructions on most electronic appliances, they say not to go over about 90%. Condensation on the circuit boards they don't like much.

--
Bumper sticker seen on a B-2 Stealth Bomber:
"IF YOU CAN READ THIS, THEN WE WASTED 50 BILLION BUCKS."

On Fri, 02 Sep 2016 21:51:59 +0100, charles wrote:

In article , James Wilkinson
wrote:
On Fri, 02 Sep 2016 11:25:38 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

On 02/09/16 11:11, Tim Watts wrote:
On 02/09/16 09:30, Bert Coules wrote:
I've searched around for the answer to this but haven't found it as
yet: is there any regulation concerning placing a small wall-mounted
12V TV set in a kitchen?

I have a blank area above a draining board, partly protected from
splashes and steam by a 6" deep shelf which runs the length of that
wall. It seems like the obvious place to mount a smallish TV, say
17" or so. There are specially-designed water- and steam-proof sets
intended for bathrooms but would one of them be overkill for a
kitchen? Is there any reason why I shouldn't use a conventional set?

Many thanks.






Might be OK as there is not really that much steam emitted from a
sink, other than when you drain boiling water into it. Try dumping a
pan of water down the sink and see where the steam cloud goes.

I've had two kitchens with TVS so far. Mount high up LCDs beat CRTs for
safety .

Nevermind safety, a TV won't last so long if it's damp all the time. Put
it somewhere dry or get a damp proof one if it's not much more expensive.

we've had a tv in our kitchen for years -but it isn't over the sink.

Do you ever have four pans boiling and the room full of steam? I guess if you have a decent extractor hood over the cooker and always use it you'd be fine.

--
REALITY.EXE corrupt. Reboot universe (Y/N)?

"Bert Coules" wrote in message
o.uk...
The Natural Philosopher wrote:

My pragmatic advice there would be 'if you want to watch it, rip it' and
then its done for good and you can keep the originals as backup.

Thanks. It would certainly free a good deal of shelf space and I can see
the convenience, but I'm still slightly dubious about the long-term
reliability of hard drives.

In that case all you have to do is duplicate the hard drive so
if one dies, you just replace it and copy from the surviving one.

Tapes - that's a BIG job. can really only be done in real time. Replace
with CD/DVD wherever possible

Alas that's quite impossible with my collection, virtually none of which
consists of commercial recordings. But as I said, I would like to do
this, as and when time permits.

What would be the simplest way to achieve that?
I'm not sure.

For simplicity, I rather like Dave Plowman's idea of using several tuners,
each permanently set to a particular channel. If all are connected to a
single amp, then the individual room remotes only need to be able to
control the amp in order to change both channel and volume.

IMO it makes more sense to go the other route, a set of remotes that
all control the one device that selects what you want to listen to not
hard to do with a decent modern tuner type device.

On 02/09/2016 17:34, Bert Coules wrote:
John Rumm wrote:

CDs are easy...

Thanks for this, and the DVD-ripping advice.

There are plenty of Raspberry Pi based streamer projects that can do
this kind of stuff...

I'll investigate that, thanks again.
Bert


You might want to take a quick look at:

http://usa.yamaha.com/products/audio-visual/musiccast/

I bought a Musiccast amplifier as a neat way to serve music, but the
network audio options look pretty comprehensive. Dependent on a smart
device to control it all though.

--
Cheers, Rob

James Wilkinson wrote:

Well not all the time, but very damp for some
of the time. 100% humidity.

That rather depends, surely, on how you use your kitchen. There's rarely
any humidity at all in mine.

Bert

On 03/09/2016 09:00, Bert Coules wrote:
James Wilkinson wrote:

Well not all the time, but very damp for some
of the time. 100% humidity.

That rather depends, surely, on how you use your kitchen. There's
rarely any humidity at all in mine.

Bert

Same here.

"James Wilkinson" wrote in message
news
On Fri, 02 Sep 2016 21:51:59 +0100, charles
wrote:

In article , James Wilkinson
wrote:
On Fri, 02 Sep 2016 11:25:38 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

On 02/09/16 11:11, Tim Watts wrote:
On 02/09/16 09:30, Bert Coules wrote:
I've searched around for the answer to this but haven't found it as
yet: is there any regulation concerning placing a small wall-mounted
12V TV set in a kitchen?

I have a blank area above a draining board, partly protected from
splashes and steam by a 6" deep shelf which runs the length of that
wall. It seems like the obvious place to mount a smallish TV, say
17" or so. There are specially-designed water- and steam-proof sets
intended for bathrooms but would one of them be overkill for a
kitchen? Is there any reason why I shouldn't use a conventional set?

Many thanks.






Might be OK as there is not really that much steam emitted from a
sink, other than when you drain boiling water into it. Try dumping a
pan of water down the sink and see where the steam cloud goes.

I've had two kitchens with TVS so far. Mount high up LCDs beat CRTs
for
safety .

Nevermind safety, a TV won't last so long if it's damp all the time.
Put
it somewhere dry or get a damp proof one if it's not much more
expensive.

we've had a tv in our kitchen for years -but it isn't over the sink.

Do you ever have four pans boiling and the room full of steam?

Nope, never. The most I ever have is a massive great 36L stockpot that I
use to make the marmalade in boiling and that doesn't come even close
to filling the room with steam even if I haven't turned the exhaust fan on.

I guess if you have a decent extractor hood over the cooker and always use
it you'd be fine.

And he'll be fine even if he doesn't do that. I have a laptop
in the kitchen and it has never had any problems at all and
neither have any of the other electrical appliances either.

Rod Speed wrote:

I guess if you have a decent extractor hood
over the cooker and always use it you'd be fine.

And he'll be fine even if he doesn't do that.

Quite. This image of a kitchen almost permanently filled with bubbling
liquids and billowing steam is something I simply don't recognise, outside
of Victorian-era below-stairs photographs.

Bert

RJH wrote:

You might want to take a quick look at:
http://usa.yamaha.com/products/audio-visual/musiccast/

Thanks; I'll investigate.

Bert

On Friday, 2 September 2016 15:13:36 UTC+1, Bert Coules wrote:
I'd like to be able to walk into any room and select what I hear and the
volume I hear it at from a control (wall mounted, maybe?) in that room.

This chap looks like he's doing something interesting:

http://hazymat.co.uk/2015/04/multi-room-audio-options/

GPIO controlled so an arduino / raspi could be linked in?

Owain

In article ,
Huge wrote:
On 2016-09-02, Bert Coules wrote:
Dave Plowman wrote:

I have an amp in each place needed. 'Separates' aren't much in fashion
these days and can be picked up cheaply - even free.

It's not the cost so much as the space needed and the extra clutter of
cabling and the like which I was hoping to avoid.

Actually, I've just discovered the perfect piece of kit which will do
exactly what I want, but it's very pricey and seem only to be
available from the USA:

https://www.amazon.com/ATNDLA6-6-Roo.../dp/B00R3HKBHU

$1100!!!!

I'm sure there are lots of ready made solutions - at a price. Mine does
exactly what I wanted it to, and didn't cost a fortune. But then I did
build the custom bits myself. And if you do design and build something
yourself it is usually easy to extend it later if needed. Unlike a
commercial solution which will be obsolete quickly.

--
*Vegetarians taste great*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Huge" wrote:

$1100!

It's available for a good deal less than that.

Bert

Dave Plowman wrote:

I'm sure there are lots of ready made solutions - at a price.

Surprisingly, that doesn't appear to be the case. So far I've found only
one, the Monoprice package I mentioned earlier.

And perhaps I should apologise for saying this on a group that's ostensibly
devoted to DIY but I wouldn't object to paying for a commercial product that
could do the job, especially if I couldn't achieve as neat and efficient a
method myself.

Bert

In article ,
Bert Coules wrote:
Dave Plowman wrote:

I'm sure there are lots of ready made solutions - at a price.

Surprisingly, that doesn't appear to be the case. So far I've found
only one, the Monoprice package I mentioned earlier.

And perhaps I should apologise for saying this on a group that's
ostensibly devoted to DIY but I wouldn't object to paying for a
commercial product that could do the job, especially if I couldn't
achieve as neat and efficient a method myself.

I've looked at a few out of interest over the years and some do pretty
well what I want. But involve using *only* their products like amps etc
linked to their controllers.

Of course many will want and pay for some sort of wireless solution.
Simply for the convenience of this - regardless of the actual performance.
Exactly the same as wireless doorbells. ;-)

--
*If I agreed with you, we'd both be wrong.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Sat, 03 Sep 2016 10:48:10 +0100, Rod Speed wrote:



"James Wilkinson" wrote in message
news
On Fri, 02 Sep 2016 21:51:59 +0100, charles
wrote:

In article , James Wilkinson
wrote:
On Fri, 02 Sep 2016 11:25:38 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

On 02/09/16 11:11, Tim Watts wrote:
On 02/09/16 09:30, Bert Coules wrote:
I've searched around for the answer to this but haven't found it as
yet: is there any regulation concerning placing a small wall-mounted
12V TV set in a kitchen?

I have a blank area above a draining board, partly protected from
splashes and steam by a 6" deep shelf which runs the length of that
wall. It seems like the obvious place to mount a smallish TV, say
17" or so. There are specially-designed water- and steam-proof sets
intended for bathrooms but would one of them be overkill for a
kitchen? Is there any reason why I shouldn't use a conventional set?

Many thanks.






Might be OK as there is not really that much steam emitted from a
sink, other than when you drain boiling water into it. Try dumping a
pan of water down the sink and see where the steam cloud goes.

I've had two kitchens with TVS so far. Mount high up LCDs beat CRTs
for
safety .

Nevermind safety, a TV won't last so long if it's damp all the time.
Put
it somewhere dry or get a damp proof one if it's not much more
expensive.

we've had a tv in our kitchen for years -but it isn't over the sink.

Do you ever have four pans boiling and the room full of steam?

Nope, never. The most I ever have is a massive great 36L stockpot that I
use to make the marmalade in boiling and that doesn't come even close
to filling the room with steam even if I haven't turned the exhaust fan on.

I've often known families of 4 have all the hobs in use.

I guess if you have a decent extractor hood over the cooker and always use
it you'd be fine.

And he'll be fine even if he doesn't do that. I have a laptop
in the kitchen and it has never had any problems at all and
neither have any of the other electrical appliances either.

Then why does electronics have warnings about high humidity?

--
The chance of a piece of bread falling down on its buttered side is directly proportional to the cost of the carpet.

On Sat, 03 Sep 2016 09:00:06 +0100, Bert Coules wrote:

James Wilkinson wrote:

Well not all the time, but very damp for some
of the time. 100% humidity.

That rather depends, surely, on how you use your kitchen. There's rarely
any humidity at all in mine.

Some people use many pans when making something fancy and boiling stuff seperately.

--
I wouldn't need to manage my anger if people could learn to manage their stupidity.

Dave Plowman wrote:

Of course many will want and pay
for some sort of wireless solution.

On the whole I would always prefer a wired connection to a wireless one. As
with putting one's CDs and DVDs onto hard disk, bringing in an extra layer
of technology seems to me to be a good way of increasing the chances of
something going wrong.

Bert

James Wilkinson wrote:

Some people use many pans...

"Some people", exactly. Not all. And, these days, I rather suspect, fewer
and fewer. Personally, I rarely cook anything from scratch, fancy or
otherwise.

Bert

James Wilkinson wrote:

Then why does electronics have warnings about high humidity?

A non sequitur. "Kitchen" does not automatically equate to "humidity".

Bert

On Sat, 03 Sep 2016 15:44:32 +0100, Bert Coules wrote:

James Wilkinson wrote:

Then why does electronics have warnings about high humidity?

A non sequitur. "Kitchen" does not automatically equate to "humidity".

Kitchen normally has steam.

--
If a man is standing in the middle of the forest speaking and there is no woman around to hear him, is he still wrong?

On Sat, 03 Sep 2016 15:42:30 +0100, Bert Coules wrote:

James Wilkinson wrote:

Some people use many pans...

"Some people", exactly. Not all. And, these days, I rather suspect, fewer
and fewer. Personally, I rarely cook anything from scratch, fancy or
otherwise.

Yes I am lazy also, but a lot of people cook properly.

--
John Montagu: "Sir, I do not know whether you will die on the gallows or of the pox."
Samuel Foote: "That will depend my lord, on whether I embrace your lordship's principles or your mistress."

On 03/09/2016 15:53, James Wilkinson wrote:
On Sat, 03 Sep 2016 15:44:32 +0100, Bert Coules
wrote:

James Wilkinson wrote:

Then why does electronics have warnings about high humidity?

A non sequitur. "Kitchen" does not automatically equate to "humidity".

Kitchen normally has steam.

We've had a hi-fi unit in our kitchen for at least 12 years with no
problem....and we cook steamy things regularly. We just open the windows
slightly whilst cooking.

On 03/09/16 15:42, Bert Coules wrote:
James Wilkinson wrote:

Some people use many pans...

"Some people", exactly. Not all. And, these days, I rather suspect,
fewer and fewer. Personally, I rarely cook anything from scratch, fancy
or otherwise.

Bert

Oh I do, but its rare to have more than 2 rings on the go.



--
"I am inclined to tell the truth and dislike people who lie consistently.
This makes me unfit for the company of people of a Left persuasion, and
all women"

On 02/09/16 09:30, Bert Coules wrote:
I've searched around for the answer to this but haven't found it as yet:
is there any regulation concerning placing a small wall-mounted 12V TV
set in a kitchen?

I have a blank area above a draining board, partly protected from
splashes and steam by a 6" deep shelf which runs the length of that
wall. It seems like the obvious place to mount a smallish TV, say 17"
or so. There are specially-designed water- and steam-proof sets
intended for bathrooms but would one of them be overkill for a kitchen?
Is there any reason why I shouldn't use a conventional set?

Go custom.

Pull one apart and mount it either in the door of a microwave or fridge.

Hell, go touch sensitive and make it a computer monitor with a skype
webcam. Stare at someone longingly while waiting for the pasta to cook.

(Nope, they might think ya weird, sickening for something. Er, Food...)

--
Adrian C

On Sat, 03 Sep 2016 16:10:05 +0100, Bod wrote:

On 03/09/2016 15:53, James Wilkinson wrote:
On Sat, 03 Sep 2016 15:44:32 +0100, Bert Coules
wrote:

James Wilkinson wrote:

Then why does electronics have warnings about high humidity?

A non sequitur. "Kitchen" does not automatically equate to "humidity".

Kitchen normally has steam.

We've had a hi-fi unit in our kitchen for at least 12 years with no
problem....and we cook steamy things regularly. We just open the windows
slightly whilst cooking.

I wouldn't risk a laptop though. But expensive and presumably more sensitive inside.

Hi-fis you can get for free on freecycle. That's where I got this 200W RMS one.

--
The British government is going to impose a 40% tax on Aspirin.
"Why" you ask?
Well, primarily because it's white and it works.