Is that banned from securing your property at the back ie along backyard
wall?

Had a break-in today and all me tools nearly went,they only got away with
camera as I must have disturbed them? whilst letting myself in.

TIA

In article ,
George wrote:
Is that banned from securing your property at the back ie along backyard
wall?

Had a break-in today and all me tools nearly went,they only got away with
camera as I must have disturbed them? whilst letting myself in.

I see it on high fences etc so it can't be banned. But I'd guess your wall
would have to be higher than a person could reach before it was considered
safe for this use. Sticking it on top of a 5 ft wall might be considered
as a danger to others.

--
*According to my calculations, the problem doesn't exist.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
George wrote:
Is that banned from securing your property at the back ie along backyard
wall?

Had a break-in today and all me tools nearly went,they only got away
with
camera as I must have disturbed them? whilst letting myself in.

I see it on high fences etc so it can't be banned. But I'd guess your wall
would have to be higher than a person could reach before it was considered
safe for this use. Sticking it on top of a 5 ft wall might be considered
as a danger to others.

--
*According to my calculations, the problem doesn't exist.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Wall is about 7' or just over?

On 1 Nov, 23:15, "George" wrote:
Is that banned from securing your property at the back ie along backyard
wall?

Had a break-in today and all me tools nearly went,they only got away with
camera as I must have disturbed them? whilst letting myself in.

TIA

No it is not banned.

You owe a duty of care to anyone entering your land (even intruders)
and if they are injured then they may have a claim against you. Their
business and intentions on your land, the location of the wire, and
any warning signs would all be considered. Whether an intruder cuts
themselves on razor wire, barbed wire, a rose bush or a splinter from
the fence is all the same.

In any case, your house insurance would normally cover you from any
such civil claims.

Put the wire up, and fix some warning signs in a prominent place.

dg

"George" wrote in message
.uk...
Is that banned from securing your property at the back ie along backyard
wall?

Had a break-in today and all me tools nearly went,they only got away with
camera as I must have disturbed them? whilst letting myself in.

TIA


I have it along the inside edge of a high wall. It can't be reached unless
someone climbs where they shouldn't. Combined with the sticky black paint
it's very effective. I found hand prints and part of a jacket one morning.
I am considering plugging the razor wire in to the mains next.
Burglars deserve everything they get.

"dg" wrote in message
ups.com...
On 1 Nov, 23:15, "George" wrote:
Is that banned from securing your property at the back ie along backyard
wall?

Had a break-in today and all me tools nearly went,they only got away with
camera as I must have disturbed them? whilst letting myself in.

TIA

No it is not banned.

You owe a duty of care to anyone entering your land (even intruders)
and if they are injured then they may have a claim against you. Their
business and intentions on your land, the location of the wire, and
any warning signs would all be considered. Whether an intruder cuts
themselves on razor wire, barbed wire, a rose bush or a splinter from
the fence is all the same.

In any case, your house insurance would normally cover you from any
such civil claims.


So would the smackhead/scumbag getting a good kicking. Burglars have NO
rights, don't forget that.
The CPS and Probation Service think criminals have rights unfortunately and
the victim is always put last. The more they do wrong, the more they are
rewarded. Ask a burglar not to do it again politely and he will laugh, give
him a good kicking and he will understand that.
Put the wire up, I doubt you will get any complaints!


Put the wire up, and fix some warning signs in a prominent place.

dg

"john" wrote in message
...

"George" wrote in message
.uk...
Is that banned from securing your property at the back ie along backyard
wall?

Had a break-in today and all me tools nearly went,they only got away
with
camera as I must have disturbed them? whilst letting myself in.

TIA


I have it along the inside edge of a high wall. It can't be reached
unless
someone climbs where they shouldn't. Combined with the sticky black paint
it's very effective. I found hand prints and part of a jacket one
morning.
I am considering plugging the razor wire in to the mains next.
Burglars deserve everything they get.




Have you been burgaled in the past? reason being if you have how efficiant
were the finger print COS plods?

On Fri, 2 Nov 2007 00:21:46 -0000, "john"
wrote:


"dg" wrote in message
oups.com...
On 1 Nov, 23:15, "George" wrote:
Is that banned from securing your property at the back ie along backyard
wall?

Had a break-in today and all me tools nearly went,they only got away with
camera as I must have disturbed them? whilst letting myself in.

TIA

No it is not banned.

You owe a duty of care to anyone entering your land (even intruders)
and if they are injured then they may have a claim against you. Their
business and intentions on your land, the location of the wire, and
any warning signs would all be considered. Whether an intruder cuts
themselves on razor wire, barbed wire, a rose bush or a splinter from
the fence is all the same.

In any case, your house insurance would normally cover you from any
such civil claims.


So would the smackhead/scumbag getting a good kicking. Burglars have NO
rights, don't forget that.
The CPS and Probation Service think criminals have rights unfortunately and
the victim is always put last. The more they do wrong, the more they are
rewarded. Ask a burglar not to do it again politely and he will laugh, give
him a good kicking and he will understand that.
Put the wire up, I doubt you will get any complaints!


The laws that give them rights are trespass laws, dating back to times
when joe common couldn't really go anywhere much without trespassing.
The laws made sense then - with property ownership so widespread and
common now, I would say it's time the laws were changed so that anyone
who has criminal intent has no right to duty of care.

Wall is about 7' or just over?

The Highways Act gives the highway authority (which may be the council)
powers over barbed etc wire on land adjoining a highway. I think the
practice on that is to accept it if it is over 2.4m. Whether they
would take action if it is a bit lower is another matter: I think it
depends on whether it is likely to cause injury to users of the highway.
And IIRC the onus wd be on them to serve a notice requiring its removal.
It used to count in your favour if you put up signs warning people. But
I don't know how many languages you would have to use these days. (Are
you in Wales?)

Perhaps a word with your local crime reduction officer?
--
Robin

On Nov 2, 12:23 am, "George" wrote:

reason being if you have how efficiant were the finger print COS plods?

They are as efficient as anyone who can take fingerprints and access a
police computer. But whether they want to spend their allocated
expenses for the year doing that sort of thing is another guess
entirely.

On 2 Nov, 00:21, "john" wrote:
"dg" wrote in message

ups.com...





On 1 Nov, 23:15, "George" wrote:
Is that banned from securing your property at the back ie along backyard
wall?

Had a break-in today and all me tools nearly went,they only got away with
camera as I must have disturbed them? whilst letting myself in.

TIA

No it is not banned.

You owe a duty of care to anyone entering your land (even intruders)
and if they are injured then they may have a claim against you. Their
business and intentions on your land, the location of the wire, and
any warning signs would all be considered. Whether an intruder cuts
themselves on razor wire, barbed wire, a rose bush or a splinter from
the fence is all the same.

In any case, your house insurance would normally cover you from any
such civil claims.

So would the smackhead/scumbag getting a good kicking. Burglars have NO
rights, don't forget that.
The CPS and Probation Service think criminals have rights unfortunately and
the victim is always put last. The more they do wrong, the more they are
rewarded. Ask a burglar not to do it again politely and he will laugh, give
him a good kicking and he will understand that.
Put the wire up, I doubt you will get any complaints!



Put the wire up, and fix some warning signs in a prominent place.

dg- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Yes, any burglar deserves a kicking. Tip - afterwards take the body
and dump it on someone elses land

But don't confuse the civil and criminal courts. A clued up burglar
will most likely win a claim for damages in the civil court if the
landowner is proved negligent. But for the same incident, no criminal
offence may have been committed, so the Police and CPS would not be
involved.

dg

On 2 Nov, 00:17, "john" wrote:
"George" wrote in message

.uk... Is that banned from securing your property at the back ie along backyard
wall?

I have it along the inside edge of a high wall. It can't be reached unless
someone climbs where they shouldn't. .....

snip

Burglars deserve everything they get.

True for burglars etc, but what about little johnny who has just
kicked his football over? The law should protect children who often do
things without thinking, and without the same malicious intent as a
burglar.

dg

George wrote:
"john" wrote in message
...
"George" wrote in message
.uk...
Is that banned from securing your property at the back ie along backyard
wall?

Had a break-in today and all me tools nearly went,they only got away
with
camera as I must have disturbed them? whilst letting myself in.

TIA


I have it along the inside edge of a high wall. It can't be reached
unless
someone climbs where they shouldn't. Combined with the sticky black paint
it's very effective. I found hand prints and part of a jacket one
morning.
I am considering plugging the razor wire in to the mains next.
Burglars deserve everything they get.




Have you been burgaled in the past? reason being if you have how efficiant
were the finger print COS plods?


They are Ok.

It's the *average* plod that is moronic, lazy ad tied up in paperwork.

I'll state the obvious, since no-one else has...
o If you annoy/injure a burglar - he may take revenge
---- vandalism of car, house, you, family
---- bricks to arson to put it bluntly
o If you discourage a burglar - they choose an easier target
---- a determined thief WILL get past anything
---- break-&-enter, with a gun, to take car keys

My suggestion would be "plastic wire/spikes" plus anti-climb
paint because they truly utterly hate the grease-paints etc. A
notice to the effect that anti-climb paint is in use discourages.

Then ensure locks are up to scratch, plus visible ideally.
(I mean patio doors with drop-down or slide-over beam).

Then security PIR - although there are 2 schools of thought re
they provide a deterrant or they provide sharp shadow places
to hide and turn off once someone stops moving vs always-on.

UV spray markers are another idea, personal & fitted.
Never seen a fitted one, but it would be useful - next time they
go past appropriate lighting they glow & it takes time to get off.

Most obviously have tools where they are not visible and sheds
that basically have minimal windows re making entry harder.

Wire that cuts has the advantage of leaving DNA, but that is
likely to occur with most methods of entry. Make sure the
backdoor can not be kicked in if even remotely secluded,
and realise uPVC windows are not exactly strong things.

Not difficult to rig an alarm to dial a phone, or for a mobile
to be wired to turn on things internally or turn a car off etc.
Just avoid the temptation to link it to a large quantity of TNT.

Now I wonder if a rail gun would come under Part P...
--
DB.

"Dorothy Bradbury" wrote in message

My suggestion would be "plastic wire/spikes" plus anti-climb
paint because they truly utterly hate the grease-paints etc. A
notice to the effect that anti-climb paint is in use discourages.

Then ensure locks are up to scratch, plus visible ideally.
(I mean patio doors with drop-down or slide-over beam).

Then security PIR - although there are 2 schools of thought re
they provide a deterrant or they provide sharp shadow places
to hide and turn off once someone stops moving vs always-on.

UV spray markers are another idea, personal & fitted.
Never seen a fitted one, but it would be useful - next time they
go past appropriate lighting they glow & it takes time to get off.

Most obviously have tools where they are not visible and sheds
that basically have minimal windows re making entry harder.

Wire that cuts has the advantage of leaving DNA, but that is
likely to occur with most methods of entry. Make sure the
backdoor can not be kicked in if even remotely secluded,
and realise uPVC windows are not exactly strong things.

Not difficult to rig an alarm to dial a phone, or for a mobile
to be wired to turn on things internally or turn a car off etc.
Just avoid the temptation to link it to a large quantity of TNT.

Now I wonder if a rail gun would come under Part P...
--
DB.



Nah! I've superpassed the razor wire and installed recorded message on a
looped dictaphone connected up to a louder hailer which are both connected
to the passive infared at the back,when set off it emits quite loudly....GET
OUT OF MY DAMN PROPERTY YOU PIECE OF ****.
However the neighbours cat is a pain in the backside for prowling at night.
:-)

"George" wrote in message
.uk...
Is that banned from securing your property at the back ie along backyard
wall?

Had a break-in today and all me tools nearly went,they only got away with
camera as I must have disturbed them? whilst letting myself in.

Plant a load of hawthorne and lay a hedge. You'll be cursing for weeks after
at all the thorns that got through your leather gloves, so burglars will
hardly like it .

"dg" wrote in message
oups.com...
On 2 Nov, 00:17, "john" wrote:
"George" wrote in message

.uk... Is that banned
from securing your property at the back ie along backyard
wall?

I have it along the inside edge of a high wall. It can't be reached
unless
someone climbs where they shouldn't. .....

snip

Burglars deserve everything they get.

True for burglars etc, but what about little johnny who has just
kicked his football over? The law should protect children who often do
things without thinking, and without the same malicious intent as a
burglar.

TBH the way it's going to work is razor wire that's obvious on the top of a
fence or wall is not going to get you in court. Dig a hole on your side of
the wall and fill it with razor wire, and it probably will.

"Owain" wrote in message
...
George wrote:
Nah! I've superpassed the razor wire and installed recorded message on a
looped dictaphone connected up to a louder hailer which are both
connected
to the passive infared at the back,when set off it emits quite
loudly....GET
OUT OF MY DAMN PROPERTY YOU PIECE OF ****.

Might Sir be interested in the ES-4 (ESp2250) from Klaxon Signals? The
124dB(A) at 30m output should be ample for all except the largest of
gardens.

However the neighbours cat is a pain in the backside for prowling at
night.
:-)

Record some cat hiss noises on the tape. They'll soon get used to the
idea that the PA system is another cat and theyr'e trespassing on its
territory.

Owain


People turn a blind eye to the everyday sound of an alarm sounding off so a
voice over signal will definatly draw attention particulary if
its...HELP,RAPE,RAPE,I'M BEING RAPED...or summat that get the curtains
twitching. ;-)

"Owain" wrote in message
...
George wrote:
Nah! I've superpassed the razor wire and installed recorded message on a
looped dictaphone connected up to a louder hailer which are both
connected
to the passive infared at the back,when set off it emits quite
loudly....GET
OUT OF MY DAMN PROPERTY YOU PIECE OF ****.

Might Sir be interested in the ES-4 (ESp2250) from Klaxon Signals? The
124dB(A) at 30m output should be ample for all except the largest of
gardens.

However the neighbours cat is a pain in the backside for prowling at
night.
:-)

Record some cat hiss noises on the tape. They'll soon get used to the
idea that the PA system is another cat and theyr'e trespassing on its
territory.

Owain


People turn a blind eye to the everyday sound of an alarm sounding off so a
voice over signal will definatly draw attention particulary if
its...HELP,RAPE,RAPE,I'M BEING RAPED...or summat that get the curtains
twitching. ;-)

On 2007-11-02 14:26:59 +0000, "George" said:

Nah! I've superpassed the razor wire and installed recorded message on a
looped dictaphone connected up to a louder hailer which are both connected
to the passive infared at the back,when set off it emits quite loudly....GET
OUT OF MY DAMN PROPERTY YOU PIECE OF ****.

That's no way to greet the postman.....

In article ,
john wrote:
So would the smackhead/scumbag getting a good kicking. Burglars have NO
rights, don't forget that.

Are you related to dribble? Just because you say something doesn't make it
true. The day all rights are withdrawn from criminals is the day
civilisation ceases.

The CPS and Probation Service think criminals have rights unfortunately
and the victim is always put last.

The CPS and Probation service only deal with criminals. Not victims.

The more they do wrong, the more they are rewarded.

It would be silly to ask of proof of this, I suppose.

Ask a burglar not to do it again politely and he will laugh, give him a
good kicking and he will understand that.

So you assume you are a stronger individual than any burglar - or do you
think having right on your side will protect you? For many they might well
be the one getting the kicking instead if they tackle a burglar.

Put the wire up, I doubt you will get any complaints!

I suppose anti-climb paint doesn't fit into your ideal of retribution on
anyone who dares climb your garden wall - regardless of reason?

--
*Happiness is seeing your mother-in-law on a milk carton

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Owain wrote:


I've been told that people ignore "RAPE" as they don't want to get
involved or assume it's some drunk tart having a tiff with her
boyfriend. "FIRE" on the other hand usually provokes interest.


There was a song, about 40 years ago, about a man who fell into a vat of
chocolate, and was in danger of drowning. He yelled "FIRE!". When
asked about it after his rescue, he said more people would pay
attention, than if he yelled 'chocolate'........

On 2007-11-02 20:17:03 +0000, S Viemeister said:

Owain wrote:


I've been told that people ignore "RAPE" as they don't want to get
involved or assume it's some drunk tart having a tiff with her
boyfriend. "FIRE" on the other hand usually provokes interest.


There was a song, about 40 years ago, about a man who fell into a vat
of chocolate, and was in danger of drowning. He yelled "FIRE!". When
asked about it after his rescue, he said more people would pay
attention, than if he yelled 'chocolate'........

.... and if it had been at Hershey, he'd be lying as well :-)

Andy Hall wrote:

On 2007-11-02 20:17:03 +0000, S Viemeister
said:

Owain wrote:


I've been told that people ignore "RAPE" as they don't want to get
involved or assume it's some drunk tart having a tiff with her
boyfriend. "FIRE" on the other hand usually provokes interest.


There was a song, about 40 years ago, about a man who fell into a vat
of chocolate, and was in danger of drowning. He yelled "FIRE!". When
asked about it after his rescue, he said more people would pay
attention, than if he yelled 'chocolate'........


... and if it had been at Hershey, he'd be lying as well :-)



You've been there, too, I take it!

On 2007-11-03 00:46:01 +0000, S Viemeister said:

Andy Hall wrote:

On 2007-11-02 20:17:03 +0000, S Viemeister said:

Owain wrote:


I've been told that people ignore "RAPE" as they don't want to get
involved or assume it's some drunk tart having a tiff with her
boyfriend. "FIRE" on the other hand usually provokes interest.


There was a song, about 40 years ago, about a man who fell into a vat
of chocolate, and was in danger of drowning. He yelled "FIRE!". When
asked about it after his rescue, he said more people would pay
attention, than if he yelled 'chocolate'........


... and if it had been at Hershey, he'd be lying as well :-)



You've been there, too, I take it!

No. Just tasted the stuff.

Hershey is to Cadbury as Cadbury is to Lindt as Lindt is to Godiva as
Godiva is to Pierre Marcolini.

Only one and a bit of those makes chocolate.

Andy Hall wrote:

Hershey is to Cadbury as Cadbury is to Lindt as Lindt is to Godiva as
Godiva is to Pierre Marcolini.

Only one and a bit of those makes chocolate.


I'm not familiar with Pierre Marcolini - where is it available, and
what's it like?

On 2007-11-03 01:33:45 +0000, S Viemeister said:

Andy Hall wrote:

Hershey is to Cadbury as Cadbury is to Lindt as Lindt is to Godiva as
Godiva is to Pierre Marcolini.

Only one and a bit of those makes chocolate.


I'm not familiar with Pierre Marcolini - where is it available, and
what's it like?

http://www.marcolini.be/EN/accueil.html

A visit to one of the shops is rather like a visit to a fine jeweller's.

Andy Hall wrote:
said:
I'm not familiar with Pierre Marcolini - where is it available, and
what's it like?


http://www.marcolini.be/EN/accueil.html

A visit to one of the shops is rather like a visit to a fine jeweller's.


Perhaps I should start saving up for a chocolate splurge.

On 2007-11-03 02:01:00 +0000, S Viemeister said:

Andy Hall wrote:
said:
I'm not familiar with Pierre Marcolini - where is it available, and
what's it like?


http://www.marcolini.be/EN/accueil.html

A visit to one of the shops is rather like a visit to a fine jeweller's.


Perhaps I should start saving up for a chocolate splurge.

I'm afraid that a large box costs well into double digit Euros but not three.

It's about the only reason to go to Brussels apart from la Tarterie de
Pierre which is across the square (Grand Sablon) from the Marcolini
store.

On 2007-11-03 09:52:16 +0000, Huge said:

On 2007-11-03, Andy Hall wrote:
On 2007-11-03 02:01:00 +0000, S Viemeister said:

Andy Hall wrote:
said:
I'm not familiar with Pierre Marcolini - where is it available, and
what's it like?


http://www.marcolini.be/EN/accueil.html

A visit to one of the shops is rather like a visit to a fine jeweller's.


Perhaps I should start saving up for a chocolate splurge.

I'm afraid that a large box costs well into double digit Euros but not three.

It's about the only reason to go to Brussels apart from la Tarterie de
Pierre which is across the square (Grand Sablon) from the Marcolini
store.

Oh, watching the son et lumiere from the Golden Boot while drinking their Irish
Coffee and eating Brandy snaps is a pretty good reason, too. (Assuming the
Golden Boot is still there and they still do the son et lumiere, that is.)

As in the one in the Grand Place?

Possibly, but after that, Brussels is starting to run out a bit, isn't
it really?

On 2007-11-03 12:10:22 +0000, Huge said:

Oh, there's nice beer, good restaurants (even if I did break a tooth on the
moules), frites with mayonnaise.

It's certainly not the nastiest place I ever worked. That's reserved for
Aulnay-sous-Bois, north of Paris, with the only hotel (a Novotel)
jammed between
the cement works and the Citroen factory. I last saw it mentioned on the news
last year as its residents attempted to burn it to the ground; a commendable
wish, I must say.

If you are reduced to staying in a Novotel, then that says it all.

On Sat, 03 Nov 2007 09:05:33 +0000, Andy Hall wrote:

On 2007-11-03 02:01:00 +0000, S Viemeister said:

Andy Hall wrote:
said:
I'm not familiar with Pierre Marcolini - where is it available, and
what's it like?


http://www.marcolini.be/EN/accueil.html

A visit to one of the shops is rather like a visit to a fine jeweller's.


Perhaps I should start saving up for a chocolate splurge.

I'm afraid that a large box costs well into double digit Euros but not three.

It's about the only reason to go to Brussels apart from la Tarterie de
Pierre which is across the square (Grand Sablon) from the Marcolini
store.

I am amused as to what may be on offer at the Tartery. Alas I expect it's
not as good as it sounds.


--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html

On 2007-11-03 19:51:05 +0000, Ed Sirett said:

On Sat, 03 Nov 2007 09:05:33 +0000, Andy Hall wrote:

On 2007-11-03 02:01:00 +0000, S Viemeister said:

Andy Hall wrote:
said:
I'm not familiar with Pierre Marcolini - where is it available, and
what's it like?


http://www.marcolini.be/EN/accueil.html

A visit to one of the shops is rather like a visit to a fine jeweller's.


Perhaps I should start saving up for a chocolate splurge.

I'm afraid that a large box costs well into double digit Euros but not three.

It's about the only reason to go to Brussels apart from la Tarterie de
Pierre which is across the square (Grand Sablon) from the Marcolini
store.

I am amused as to what may be on offer at the Tartery. Alas I expect it's
not as good as it sounds.

Tarts, flans, pastries, etc. made on the premises with fresh
ingredients. There are a lot of wenches in the shop as well.....

Huge wrote:
On 2007-11-03, Andy Hall wrote:
On 2007-11-03 09:52:16 +0000, Huge said:

On 2007-11-03, Andy Hall wrote:
On 2007-11-03 02:01:00 +0000, S Viemeister
said:

Andy Hall wrote:
said:
I'm not familiar with Pierre Marcolini - where is it available,
and what's it like?


http://www.marcolini.be/EN/accueil.html

A visit to one of the shops is rather like a visit to a fine
jeweller's.


Perhaps I should start saving up for a chocolate splurge.

I'm afraid that a large box costs well into double digit Euros but
not three.

It's about the only reason to go to Brussels apart from la
Tarterie de
Pierre which is across the square (Grand Sablon) from the Marcolini
store.

Oh, watching the son et lumiere from the Golden Boot while drinking
their Irish Coffee and eating Brandy snaps is a pretty good reason,
too. (Assuming the Golden Boot is still there and they still do the
son et lumiere, that is.)

As in the one in the Grand Place?

Yes, sorry, I forgot to add that bit.

Possibly, but after that, Brussels is starting to run out a bit,
isn't it really?

Oh, there's nice beer, good restaurants (even if I did break a tooth
on the moules), frites with mayonnaise.

You don't eat the shells!


snip

On 2007-11-03 14:07:35 +0000, Owain said:

Andy Hall wrote:
It's about the only reason to go to Brussels apart from la Tarterie de
Pierre which is across the square (Grand Sablon) from the Marcolini
store.
Oh, watching the son et lumiere from the Golden Boot while drinking
their Irish Coffee and eating Brandy snaps is a pretty good reason,
too. (Assuming the Golden Boot is still there and they still do the
son et lumiere, that is.)
As in the one in the Grand Place?
Possibly, but after that, Brussels is starting to run out a bit, isn't
it really?

What were you expecting, hordes of wildebeeste...

You can't expect Brussels to compete with someweher thriving and
metropolitan like, um, Birmingham.

Owain

Actually Birmingham is far more exciting, even if they do have a
speech impediment.

Andy Hall wrote:

If you are reduced to staying in a Novotel, then that says it all.

I have fond memories of going to the computer shows at the one in
Hammersmith when I was a kid.... however even then I could not imagine
wanting to stay in one!

--
Cheers,

John.

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On 2007-11-08 04:36:12 +0000, John Rumm said:

Andy Hall wrote:

If you are reduced to staying in a Novotel, then that says it all.

I have fond memories of going to the computer shows at the one in
Hammersmith when I was a kid.... however even then I could not imagine
wanting to stay in one!

That particular one is spectacularly bad. I think it's probably its
position in relation to central London and also a a large conference
hotel of about 600 rooms that saves its bacon. Even so, at a best
unrestricted rate of £110, it isn't cheap either. There are much
better places for about the same.

Generically, airport hotels and those close to railway stations are
almost always bad, regardless of who they are. I've never worked out
quite why, but pretty much always eliminate them unless there's no
choice.

On 8 Nov, 05:31, Andy Hall wrote:

Generically, airport hotels and those close to railway stations are
almost always bad, regardless of who they are. I've never worked out
quite why, but pretty much always eliminate them unless there's no
choice.

It is because they are competing successfully on location alone and
not quality.

Mathew

On 2007-11-08 12:31:21 +0000, Mathew Newton said:

On 8 Nov, 05:31, Andy Hall wrote:

Generically, airport hotels and those close to railway stations are
almost always bad, regardless of who they are. I've never worked out
quite why, but pretty much always eliminate them unless there's no
choice.

It is because they are competing successfully on location alone and
not quality.

Mathew

Indeed.

It's the same basis under which certain Best Western properties just
about creep into 4* ratings. They do the barest minimum to tick the
boxes

On 2007-11-08 14:33:13 +0000, Huge said:

On 2007-11-08, Andy Hall wrote:
On 2007-11-08 12:31:21 +0000, Mathew Newton said:

On 8 Nov, 05:31, Andy Hall wrote:

Generically, airport hotels and those close to railway stations are
almost always bad, regardless of who they are. I've never worked out
quite why, but pretty much always eliminate them unless there's no
choice.

It is because they are competing successfully on location alone and
not quality.

Mathew

Indeed.

It's the same basis under which certain Best Western properties just
about creep into 4* ratings. They do the barest minimum to tick the
boxes

Don't all hotels do this?

I used to think that, but not so much now. Best Western I think is
noticably bad. Other groups, I think that there is more of an effort
on service.

For example, Radisson is generally what it says on the tin, as is
Hilton and Holiday Inn with a few notable exceptions.

Those that are groups with brands at different price points and styles
have reasonable consistency - e.g. Accor, Starwood for each brand.
Sometimes the knowledge of that is useful, especially when looking at
a new destination without having prior knowledge. For example,
Radisson has free internet connection and it almost always works well.
Sofitel is usually good standard - there are excellent ones as in
Amsterdam and appalling ones as in Vienna and Madrid. These get
added to the 'never again'' list.


They game the system so as to get the maximum number
of stars. IME, this has very little to do with the quality of the hotel.


Smaller individual hotel groups with just a few or even one are very
often a good bet, but can be a risk in that there is no comparison.

Up to a point, Tripadvisor can be useful. However, one has to ignore
reviews by holidaymakers who don't use hotels regularly and will accept
anything, and Harry and Martha from Duluth who really should have
stayed at home.


(BTW, we used to stay in the Novotel in Aulnay because it was close to the
office. I used to put off booking a room until the last minute in the hope it
would be full, so I could stay in Porte de Bagnolet - still a Novotel, but you
can get into Paris on the Metro.)

Last minute bookings can often be useful.