As anyone who shoots knows, it has become pretty hard to get .22 ammo.
Especially CB shorts and longs. And then when you do find some it is
of limited amount and exorbitant cost. So as I was trying to fall
asleep after waking from a hot flash in the middle of the night it
occurred to me that I could make my own .22 centerfire brass, cast my
own bullets, and use off the shelf primers. Checking yesterday for
primer availability I found several sellers with small pistol primers
in stock at less than $30.00 per 1000. That's less than 3 cents per
primer, about what I used to pay before this ammo buying panic and
subsequent gouging started. This morning I examined the bolt on my
Remington model 514 and determined it would be pretty easy to make a
new bolt for centerfire ammo. And most of the parts from the existing
could be used in the new one. I would need to machine cases from solid
brass, but I have a lathe with a bar feed setup that could make them
really fast. Each case would require two operations so I could run the
second operation while the lathe was doing the first operation. I have
never really reloaded ammo before though I did reload a few rounds 45
years ago when a friend's dad showed me how his reloading setup
worked. He let me load a few rounds but I may as well have never done
it before because it was so long ago. But from reading about it online
it appears that spent brass cases can usually be used 4 or 5 times,
and some times even more depending on how light or heavy the load is.
I have lots of pure lead and making a mold would be pretty easy. But
would a machined case be as durable as a formed case? And since the
smallest primers I can find are .175" O.D. and .22 brass is .224" O.D.
there would only be a .0245 wall thickness between the primer and the
case outside. Then again, since the case is trapped in the chamber
maybe that's not a problem. And I would be using black powder or
black powder substitute, not smokeless powder, since my aim is to make
low power quiet ammo for target practice. I have a small revolver and
two rifles that I could convert to centerfire without too much work.
So, am I nut to consider this?
Thanks,
Eric

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 12:08:12 -0700, wrote:

As anyone who shoots knows, it has become pretty hard to get .22 ammo.
Especially CB shorts and longs. And then when you do find some it is
of limited amount and exorbitant cost. So as I was trying to fall
asleep after waking from a hot flash in the middle of the night it
occurred to me that I could make my own .22 centerfire brass, cast my
own bullets, and use off the shelf primers. Checking yesterday for
primer availability I found several sellers with small pistol primers
in stock at less than $30.00 per 1000. That's less than 3 cents per
primer, about what I used to pay before this ammo buying panic and
subsequent gouging started. This morning I examined the bolt on my
Remington model 514 and determined it would be pretty easy to make a
new bolt for centerfire ammo. And most of the parts from the existing
could be used in the new one. I would need to machine cases from solid
brass, but I have a lathe with a bar feed setup that could make them
really fast. Each case would require two operations so I could run the
second operation while the lathe was doing the first operation. I have
never really reloaded ammo before though I did reload a few rounds 45
years ago when a friend's dad showed me how his reloading setup
worked. He let me load a few rounds but I may as well have never done
it before because it was so long ago. But from reading about it online
it appears that spent brass cases can usually be used 4 or 5 times,
and some times even more depending on how light or heavy the load is.
I have lots of pure lead and making a mold would be pretty easy. But
would a machined case be as durable as a formed case? And since the
smallest primers I can find are .175" O.D. and .22 brass is .224" O.D.
there would only be a .0245 wall thickness between the primer and the
case outside. Then again, since the case is trapped in the chamber
maybe that's not a problem. And I would be using black powder or
black powder substitute, not smokeless powder, since my aim is to make
low power quiet ammo for target practice. I have a small revolver and
two rifles that I could convert to centerfire without too much work.
So, am I nut to consider this?
Thanks,
Eric

You probably will get a flood of responses, so I'll pipe up once and
then retreat. g

1) John Browning designed the .25 ACP around the smallest-diameter
cartridge (base diameter .278 in.) that he felt would be safe with a
small-pistol primer. The cartridge is semi-rimmed; tricky but not
impossible to extract with a simple extractor.

2) Performance is similar to a .22 LR; slightly better in very short
barrels, slightly less in longer barrels.

3) Machined brass is not as strong as formed brass, so you need
thicker walls if you machine it. 'Better to use existing commercial
brass.

4) If you get fancy and decide to neck it down to .22, watch out.
You'd be getting into some tricky engineering territory, where
pressures build up in a hurry, depending on what powder you use.

5) Black powder is a mess in small calibers. My friend built a .28
cal. muzzleloader years ago, when Douglas still made the barrels, and
had to swab the bore after every shot, because of bore fouling. The
experts here can give you better suggestions but more likely you'd
want to use a pinch of Red Dot or something similar and more modern (I
use Red Dot in my light loads).

6) With very light loads, the brass can go on and on for a very long
time. However, if you go *really* light, you're going to have big
variations in velocity, and can even wind up with bullets that lodge
in the barrel. Don't go too light.

Back around 1990 I designed a wildcat based on the .32 S&W long,
necked down to .20 cal. That's when I learned about pressures and thin
pistol brass. I made a cherry for it on my lathe but I never finished
the gun, which was to be built on a replica Farquharson falling-block
action that I still have. When I learned about how much potential
trouble I was buying myself I backed out.

Unless you want a new, very involved hobby, stay away from designing
wildcats. .22 rimfire can't be that hard to get. Some cartridge makers
stopped making longs years ago because they're unbalanced and
generally give poor accuracy. If you want quiet, buy some classy .22
LR match ammo. You can watch the bullet go downrange and you may have
to look to see if the gun fired. g But it will drive tacks in a good
target gun.

--
Ed Huntress

wrote in message ...


So, am I nut to consider this?


Maybe? but there is a easier way. Just reload the 22lr yourself.

http://22lrreloader.com/




Robert

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 12:08:12 -0700, wrote:

As anyone who shoots knows, it has become pretty hard to get .22 ammo.
Especially CB shorts and longs. And then when you do find some it is
of limited amount and exorbitant cost. So as I was trying to fall
asleep after waking from a hot flash in the middle of the night it
occurred to me that I could make my own .22 centerfire brass, cast my
own bullets, and use off the shelf primers. Checking yesterday for
primer availability I found several sellers with small pistol primers
in stock at less than $30.00 per 1000. That's less than 3 cents per
primer, about what I used to pay before this ammo buying panic and
subsequent gouging started. This morning I examined the bolt on my
Remington model 514 and determined it would be pretty easy to make a
new bolt for centerfire ammo. And most of the parts from the existing
could be used in the new one. I would need to machine cases from solid
brass, but I have a lathe with a bar feed setup that could make them
really fast. Each case would require two operations so I could run the
second operation while the lathe was doing the first operation. I have
never really reloaded ammo before though I did reload a few rounds 45
years ago when a friend's dad showed me how his reloading setup
worked. He let me load a few rounds but I may as well have never done
it before because it was so long ago. But from reading about it online
it appears that spent brass cases can usually be used 4 or 5 times,
and some times even more depending on how light or heavy the load is.
I have lots of pure lead and making a mold would be pretty easy. But
would a machined case be as durable as a formed case? And since the
smallest primers I can find are .175" O.D. and .22 brass is .224" O.D.
there would only be a .0245 wall thickness between the primer and the
case outside. Then again, since the case is trapped in the chamber
maybe that's not a problem. And I would be using black powder or
black powder substitute, not smokeless powder, since my aim is to make
low power quiet ammo for target practice. I have a small revolver and
two rifles that I could convert to centerfire without too much work.
So, am I nut to consider this?
Thanks,
Eric

Personally, I wouldn't mess with a 514. And .22's are finally
starting to come down in price here in Texas.

If you can do the work to change the bolt to centerfire, could you
consider building a chamber reamer for a wildcat? Maybe base a
pipsqueak (Ha! good name) on the .25 auto necked down. That'd be a
pain in the ass to load for sure. But at least the brass exists.

Pete Keillor

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...


You probably will get a flood of responses, so I'll pipe up once and
then retreat. g



----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

22 ccm

http://www.loaddata.com/members/sear...loading%20Data

This already gives you the load data. The ability to modify your gun to this
cartridge is your only problem.


Robert

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 16:18:05 -0400, "Robert"
wrote:

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
.. .


You probably will get a flood of responses, so I'll pipe up once and
then retreat. g



----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

22 ccm

http://www.loaddata.com/members/sear...loading%20Data

This already gives you the load data. The ability to modify your gun to this
cartridge is your only problem.


Robert
Thanks for the link Robert. I could modify my rifles for this
cartridge but I want to shoot CB shorts or longs. These rounds are
much less powerful than the CCM rounds.
Eric

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 14:45:50 -0500, Pete Keillor
wrote:

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 12:08:12 -0700, wrote:

As anyone who shoots knows, it has become pretty hard to get .22 ammo.
Especially CB shorts and longs. And then when you do find some it is
of limited amount and exorbitant cost. So as I was trying to fall
asleep after waking from a hot flash in the middle of the night it
occurred to me that I could make my own .22 centerfire brass, cast my
own bullets, and use off the shelf primers. Checking yesterday for
primer availability I found several sellers with small pistol primers
in stock at less than $30.00 per 1000. That's less than 3 cents per
primer, about what I used to pay before this ammo buying panic and
subsequent gouging started. This morning I examined the bolt on my
Remington model 514 and determined it would be pretty easy to make a
new bolt for centerfire ammo. And most of the parts from the existing
could be used in the new one. I would need to machine cases from solid
brass, but I have a lathe with a bar feed setup that could make them
really fast. Each case would require two operations so I could run the
second operation while the lathe was doing the first operation. I have
never really reloaded ammo before though I did reload a few rounds 45
years ago when a friend's dad showed me how his reloading setup
worked. He let me load a few rounds but I may as well have never done
it before because it was so long ago. But from reading about it online
it appears that spent brass cases can usually be used 4 or 5 times,
and some times even more depending on how light or heavy the load is.
I have lots of pure lead and making a mold would be pretty easy. But
would a machined case be as durable as a formed case? And since the
smallest primers I can find are .175" O.D. and .22 brass is .224" O.D.
there would only be a .0245 wall thickness between the primer and the
case outside. Then again, since the case is trapped in the chamber
maybe that's not a problem. And I would be using black powder or
black powder substitute, not smokeless powder, since my aim is to make
low power quiet ammo for target practice. I have a small revolver and
two rifles that I could convert to centerfire without too much work.
So, am I nut to consider this?
Thanks,
Eric

Personally, I wouldn't mess with a 514. And .22's are finally
starting to come down in price here in Texas.

If you can do the work to change the bolt to centerfire, could you
consider building a chamber reamer for a wildcat? Maybe base a
pipsqueak (Ha! good name) on the .25 auto necked down. That'd be a
pain in the ass to load for sure. But at least the brass exists.

Pete Keillor
Greetings Pete,
If I was to do this I want to be able to convert my rifle back to
rimfire if they ever come back down in price. I still have not been
able to find CB shorts or longs available here in WA. Every time I
check any of the local stores they are sold out. And mail order
sources aren't doing so well either. I sure hope you are right about
prices finally coming down. There was absolutely NO reason for the
price of .22 rounds to increase by a factor of 10 practically
overnight.
Eric

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 15:42:31 -0400, "Robert"
wrote:

wrote in message ...


So, am I nut to consider this?


Maybe? but there is a easier way. Just reload the 22lr yourself.

http://22lrreloader.com/




Robert
I looked at that device. Maybe if I was a prepper. But scraping the
white stuff off of strike anywhere matches to make priming compound is
a pretty lame way to re-load .22s. Besides, if this method becomes
popular then strike anywhere matches will probably cost 20 bucks a
box.
Eric

On Friday, August 28, 2015 at 5:27:28 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 14:45:50 -0500, Pete Keillor
wrote:

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 12:08:12 -0700, wrote:

As anyone who shoots knows, it has become pretty hard to get .22 ammo.
Especially CB shorts and longs. And then when you do find some it is
of limited amount and exorbitant cost. So as I was trying to fall
asleep after waking from a hot flash in the middle of the night it
occurred to me that I could make my own .22 centerfire brass, cast my
own bullets, and use off the shelf primers. Checking yesterday for
primer availability I found several sellers with small pistol primers
in stock at less than $30.00 per 1000. That's less than 3 cents per
primer, about what I used to pay before this ammo buying panic and
subsequent gouging started. This morning I examined the bolt on my
Remington model 514 and determined it would be pretty easy to make a
new bolt for centerfire ammo. And most of the parts from the existing
could be used in the new one. I would need to machine cases from solid
brass, but I have a lathe with a bar feed setup that could make them
really fast. Each case would require two operations so I could run the
second operation while the lathe was doing the first operation. I have
never really reloaded ammo before though I did reload a few rounds 45
years ago when a friend's dad showed me how his reloading setup
worked. He let me load a few rounds but I may as well have never done
it before because it was so long ago. But from reading about it online
it appears that spent brass cases can usually be used 4 or 5 times,
and some times even more depending on how light or heavy the load is.
I have lots of pure lead and making a mold would be pretty easy. But
would a machined case be as durable as a formed case? And since the
smallest primers I can find are .175" O.D. and .22 brass is .224" O.D.
there would only be a .0245 wall thickness between the primer and the
case outside. Then again, since the case is trapped in the chamber
maybe that's not a problem. And I would be using black powder or
black powder substitute, not smokeless powder, since my aim is to make
low power quiet ammo for target practice. I have a small revolver and
two rifles that I could convert to centerfire without too much work.
So, am I nut to consider this?
Thanks,
Eric

Personally, I wouldn't mess with a 514. And .22's are finally
starting to come down in price here in Texas.

If you can do the work to change the bolt to centerfire, could you
consider building a chamber reamer for a wildcat? Maybe base a
pipsqueak (Ha! good name) on the .25 auto necked down. That'd be a
pain in the ass to load for sure. But at least the brass exists.

Pete Keillor
Greetings Pete,
If I was to do this I want to be able to convert my rifle back to
rimfire if they ever come back down in price. I still have not been
able to find CB shorts or longs available here in WA. Every time I
check any of the local stores they are sold out. And mail order
sources aren't doing so well either. I sure hope you are right about
prices finally coming down. There was absolutely NO reason for the
price of .22 rounds to increase by a factor of 10 practically
overnight.
Eric

Don't you have gun shows there? I see CB shorts at all the gun shows. I was looking for regular .22 short and accidentally bought 200 extra CB shorts

On Friday, August 28, 2015 at 5:27:28 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 14:45:50 -0500, Pete Keillor
wrote:

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 12:08:12 -0700, wrote:

As anyone who shoots knows, it has become pretty hard to get .22 ammo.
Especially CB shorts and longs. And then when you do find some it is
of limited amount and exorbitant cost. So as I was trying to fall
asleep after waking from a hot flash in the middle of the night it
occurred to me that I could make my own .22 centerfire brass, cast my
own bullets, and use off the shelf primers. Checking yesterday for
primer availability I found several sellers with small pistol primers
in stock at less than $30.00 per 1000. That's less than 3 cents per
primer, about what I used to pay before this ammo buying panic and
subsequent gouging started. This morning I examined the bolt on my
Remington model 514 and determined it would be pretty easy to make a
new bolt for centerfire ammo. And most of the parts from the existing
could be used in the new one. I would need to machine cases from solid
brass, but I have a lathe with a bar feed setup that could make them
really fast. Each case would require two operations so I could run the
second operation while the lathe was doing the first operation. I have
never really reloaded ammo before though I did reload a few rounds 45
years ago when a friend's dad showed me how his reloading setup
worked. He let me load a few rounds but I may as well have never done
it before because it was so long ago. But from reading about it online
it appears that spent brass cases can usually be used 4 or 5 times,
and some times even more depending on how light or heavy the load is.
I have lots of pure lead and making a mold would be pretty easy. But
would a machined case be as durable as a formed case? And since the
smallest primers I can find are .175" O.D. and .22 brass is .224" O.D.
there would only be a .0245 wall thickness between the primer and the
case outside. Then again, since the case is trapped in the chamber
maybe that's not a problem. And I would be using black powder or
black powder substitute, not smokeless powder, since my aim is to make
low power quiet ammo for target practice. I have a small revolver and
two rifles that I could convert to centerfire without too much work.
So, am I nut to consider this?
Thanks,
Eric

Personally, I wouldn't mess with a 514. And .22's are finally
starting to come down in price here in Texas.

If you can do the work to change the bolt to centerfire, could you
consider building a chamber reamer for a wildcat? Maybe base a
pipsqueak (Ha! good name) on the .25 auto necked down. That'd be a
pain in the ass to load for sure. But at least the brass exists.

Pete Keillor
Greetings Pete,
I sure hope you are right about
prices finally coming down. There was absolutely NO reason for the
price of .22 rounds to increase by a factor of 10 practically
overnight.
Eric

I see .22LR becoming more plentiful, but the price appears to be the same at ~$.10/round. Some of the manufacturers are playing games with box quantities to make it look like it's cheaper, but it still comes on to 10 cents a round "on sale".

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 17:34:32 -0700 (PDT), Rex
wrote:

On Friday, August 28, 2015 at 5:27:28 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 14:45:50 -0500, Pete Keillor
wrote:

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 12:08:12 -0700, wrote:

As anyone who shoots knows, it has become pretty hard to get .22 ammo.
Especially CB shorts and longs. And then when you do find some it is
of limited amount and exorbitant cost. So as I was trying to fall
asleep after waking from a hot flash in the middle of the night it
occurred to me that I could make my own .22 centerfire brass, cast my
own bullets, and use off the shelf primers. Checking yesterday for
primer availability I found several sellers with small pistol primers
in stock at less than $30.00 per 1000. That's less than 3 cents per
primer, about what I used to pay before this ammo buying panic and
subsequent gouging started. This morning I examined the bolt on my
Remington model 514 and determined it would be pretty easy to make a
new bolt for centerfire ammo. And most of the parts from the existing
could be used in the new one. I would need to machine cases from solid
brass, but I have a lathe with a bar feed setup that could make them
really fast. Each case would require two operations so I could run the
second operation while the lathe was doing the first operation. I have
never really reloaded ammo before though I did reload a few rounds 45
years ago when a friend's dad showed me how his reloading setup
worked. He let me load a few rounds but I may as well have never done
it before because it was so long ago. But from reading about it online
it appears that spent brass cases can usually be used 4 or 5 times,
and some times even more depending on how light or heavy the load is.
I have lots of pure lead and making a mold would be pretty easy. But
would a machined case be as durable as a formed case? And since the
smallest primers I can find are .175" O.D. and .22 brass is .224" O.D.
there would only be a .0245 wall thickness between the primer and the
case outside. Then again, since the case is trapped in the chamber
maybe that's not a problem. And I would be using black powder or
black powder substitute, not smokeless powder, since my aim is to make
low power quiet ammo for target practice. I have a small revolver and
two rifles that I could convert to centerfire without too much work.
So, am I nut to consider this?
Thanks,
Eric

Personally, I wouldn't mess with a 514. And .22's are finally
starting to come down in price here in Texas.

If you can do the work to change the bolt to centerfire, could you
consider building a chamber reamer for a wildcat? Maybe base a
pipsqueak (Ha! good name) on the .25 auto necked down. That'd be a
pain in the ass to load for sure. But at least the brass exists.

Pete Keillor
Greetings Pete,
I sure hope you are right about
prices finally coming down. There was absolutely NO reason for the
price of .22 rounds to increase by a factor of 10 practically
overnight.
Eric

I see .22LR becoming more plentiful, but the price appears to be the same at ~$.10/round. Some of the manufacturers are playing games with box quantities to make it look like it's cheaper, but it still comes on to 10 cents a round "on sale".

..22 ammo has not gotten any cheaper or more available here on Whidbey
Island or on the mainland north of Seattle. I haven't checked any gun
shows though. I think there is one every weekend at the fairgrounds in
Monroe but to get there requires $16 bucks on ferry tickets and then
driving about 40 miles one way. I'll have to ask around and see if
anyone I know is going there soon. The online availability is poor. I
checked today and practically everybody is out of CB shorts or longs
and most are out of the long rifle rounds too.
Eric

On Friday, August 28, 2015 at 3:07:30 PM UTC-4, wrote:

So, am I nut to consider this?
Thanks,
Eric

I think you are nuts to consider this. Have you considered buying a pellet rifle? It would have most of the featues you want. Low cost, low noise, and ammo available.

Prices are coming down on .22 ammo, but I do not see any CB caps.

Dan

wrote:
On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 15:42:31 -0400, "Robert"
wrote:

wrote in message ...


So, am I nut to consider this?


Maybe? but there is a easier way. Just reload the 22lr yourself.

http://22lrreloader.com/




Robert
I looked at that device. Maybe if I was a prepper. But scraping the
white stuff off of strike anywhere matches to make priming compound is
a pretty lame way to re-load .22s. Besides, if this method becomes
popular then strike anywhere matches will probably cost 20 bucks a
box.
Eric

Eric , you didn't look at the link . They have priming compound ... and I
considered buying some for the making of percussion caps for my muzzle
loader . But I think I'll try the toy caps I bought first . The compound is
only 20 bucks for enough for 1,000 (2,000 ?) rimfire cartridges , probably
yield about the same for caps .

--
Snag

In article ,
wrote:

As anyone who shoots knows, it has become pretty hard to get .22 ammo.
Especially CB shorts and longs.
....
So, am I nut to consider this?

I'd suggest using an airgun until (if ever) the price becomes reasonable
again. Hard to beat for low-power, low-cost-to-shoot, especially if you
stick to spring guns or "pump it your dang self" guns rather than CO2.
There are some good (and terrible) options out there, and room for
"building a better mousetrap" too.

--
Cats, coffee, chocolate...vices to live by
Please don't feed the trolls. Killfile and ignore them so they will go away.

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 12:08:12 -0700, wrote:

As anyone who shoots knows, it has become pretty hard to get .22 ammo.
Especially CB shorts and longs. And then when you do find some it is
of limited amount and exorbitant cost. So as I was trying to fall
asleep after waking from a hot flash in the middle of the night it
occurred to me that I could make my own .22 centerfire brass, cast my
own bullets, and use off the shelf primers. Checking yesterday for
primer availability I found several sellers with small pistol primers
in stock at less than $30.00 per 1000. That's less than 3 cents per
primer, about what I used to pay before this ammo buying panic and
subsequent gouging started. This morning I examined the bolt on my
Remington model 514 and determined it would be pretty easy to make a
new bolt for centerfire ammo. And most of the parts from the existing
could be used in the new one. I would need to machine cases from solid
brass, but I have a lathe with a bar feed setup that could make them
really fast. Each case would require two operations so I could run the
second operation while the lathe was doing the first operation. I have
never really reloaded ammo before though I did reload a few rounds 45
years ago when a friend's dad showed me how his reloading setup
worked. He let me load a few rounds but I may as well have never done
it before because it was so long ago. But from reading about it online
it appears that spent brass cases can usually be used 4 or 5 times,
and some times even more depending on how light or heavy the load is.
I have lots of pure lead and making a mold would be pretty easy. But
would a machined case be as durable as a formed case? And since the
smallest primers I can find are .175" O.D. and .22 brass is .224" O.D.
there would only be a .0245 wall thickness between the primer and the
case outside. Then again, since the case is trapped in the chamber
maybe that's not a problem. And I would be using black powder or
black powder substitute, not smokeless powder, since my aim is to make
low power quiet ammo for target practice. I have a small revolver and
two rifles that I could convert to centerfire without too much work.
So, am I nut to consider this?
Thanks,
Eric

Case design aside, I believe that the fast draw folks used to use only
a normal case with (I think) a large pistol or rifle primer and a wax
"bullet". So something of the sort is doable. But whether it is worth
the effort is another story.
--
cheers,

John B.

On 8/28/2015 6:23 PM, wrote:
Robert
Thanks for the link Robert. I could modify my rifles for this
cartridge but I want to shoot CB shorts or longs. These rounds are
much less powerful than the CCM rounds.
Eric



Could be loaded down to whatever you want. Just don't use a slow powder.

On 8/28/2015 6:28 PM, wrote:
Greetings Pete,
If I was to do this I want to be able to convert my rifle back to
rimfire if they ever come back down in price. I still have not been
able to find CB shorts or longs available here in WA. Every time I
check any of the local stores they are sold out. And mail order
sources aren't doing so well either. I sure hope you are right about
prices finally coming down. There was absolutely NO reason for the
price of .22 rounds to increase by a factor of 10 practically
overnight.
Eric



It sounds like a really good pellet gun would fit your requirements.

Tom Gardner wrote:
On 8/28/2015 6:23 PM, wrote:
Robert
Thanks for the link Robert. I could modify my rifles for this
cartridge but I want to shoot CB shorts or longs. These rounds are
much less powerful than the CCM rounds.
Eric



Could be loaded down to whatever you want. Just don't use a slow
powder.

Really . Odd how a slow powder can act when loaded light . "Pressure
excursions" can be deadly .

--
Snag

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 15:42:31 -0400, "Robert"
wrote:

wrote in message ...


So, am I nut to consider this?


Maybe? but there is a easier way. Just reload the 22lr yourself.

http://22lrreloader.com/

Dey's proud o' dat, ain't dey?

--
The mind is like a parachute. It doesn't work until it's opened.
--Frank Zappa

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 15:30:57 -0700, wrote:

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 15:42:31 -0400, "Robert"
wrote:

wrote in message ...


So, am I nut to consider this?

Absolutely, but nothing we didn't already know. gd&r

I've looked monthly for going on 3 years now and haven't found a brick
in stock anywhere locally. And I don't want to shoot up my last
brick, so I'm not shooting .22 any more. sigh


Maybe? but there is a easier way. Just reload the 22lr yourself.

http://22lrreloader.com/


Robert
I looked at that device. Maybe if I was a prepper. But scraping the
white stuff off of strike anywhere matches to make priming compound is
a pretty lame way to re-load .22s. Besides, if this method becomes
popular then strike anywhere matches will probably cost 20 bucks a
box.

They're like dinosaur teeth any more. Very hard to find, and pricy,
as you said. Uckin' fattorneys.

--
The mind is like a parachute. It doesn't work until it's opened.
--Frank Zappa

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 18:02:52 -0700, wrote:

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 17:34:32 -0700 (PDT), Rex
wrote:
I see .22LR becoming more plentiful, but the price appears to be the same at ~$.10/round. Some of the manufacturers are playing games with box quantities to make it look like it's cheaper, but it still comes on to 10 cents a round "on sale".

.22 ammo has not gotten any cheaper or more available here on Whidbey
Island or on the mainland north of Seattle. I haven't checked any gun
shows though. I think there is one every weekend at the fairgrounds in
Monroe but to get there requires $16 bucks on ferry tickets and then
driving about 40 miles one way. I'll have to ask around and see if
anyone I know is going there soon. The online availability is poor. I
checked today and practically everybody is out of CB shorts or longs
and most are out of the long rifle rounds too.

Ammo mfgrs in the USA alone are making 4.2 billion rounds a year.
CCI makes 4 million rounds per day.

Where the hell are they all going, ferchrissake? Preppers couldn't buy
up that many every day for years on end, as it has been going,
especially at 3-5x the normal price. This is just nuts.

--
The mind is like a parachute. It doesn't work until it's opened.
--Frank Zappa

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 23:37:01 -0400
Tom Gardner wrote:

snip
It sounds like a really good pellet gun would fit your requirements.

I was thinking the same thing. Something like this Browning Leverage:

http://www.pyramydair.com/s/m/Browni...ifle/2456/4928

It's kind of rough around the edges but from reading the reviews it is
quite nice after a little elbow grease and know-how here and there.
It would give Eric something to tinker with right out of the box ;-)

I hear sales have increased for pellet guns after the ammo shortage...

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

Before I started modifying my rifle, hand making brass and reloading 22 cb
caps, I would try gluing a piece of #f buckshot on the end of a gray 22cal
ramset load.

Paul K. Dickman


wrote in message
...
As anyone who shoots knows, it has become pretty hard to get .22 ammo.
Especially CB shorts and longs. And then when you do find some it is
of limited amount and exorbitant cost. So as I was trying to fall
asleep after waking from a hot flash in the middle of the night it
occurred to me that I could make my own .22 centerfire brass, cast my
own bullets, and use off the shelf primers. Checking yesterday for
primer availability I found several sellers with small pistol primers
in stock at less than $30.00 per 1000. That's less than 3 cents per
primer, about what I used to pay before this ammo buying panic and
subsequent gouging started. This morning I examined the bolt on my
Remington model 514 and determined it would be pretty easy to make a
new bolt for centerfire ammo. And most of the parts from the existing
could be used in the new one. I would need to machine cases from solid
brass, but I have a lathe with a bar feed setup that could make them
really fast. Each case would require two operations so I could run the
second operation while the lathe was doing the first operation. I have
never really reloaded ammo before though I did reload a few rounds 45
years ago when a friend's dad showed me how his reloading setup
worked. He let me load a few rounds but I may as well have never done
it before because it was so long ago. But from reading about it online
it appears that spent brass cases can usually be used 4 or 5 times,
and some times even more depending on how light or heavy the load is.
I have lots of pure lead and making a mold would be pretty easy. But
would a machined case be as durable as a formed case? And since the
smallest primers I can find are .175" O.D. and .22 brass is .224" O.D.
there would only be a .0245 wall thickness between the primer and the
case outside. Then again, since the case is trapped in the chamber
maybe that's not a problem. And I would be using black powder or
black powder substitute, not smokeless powder, since my aim is to make
low power quiet ammo for target practice. I have a small revolver and
two rifles that I could convert to centerfire without too much work.
So, am I nut to consider this?
Thanks,
Eric

On 8/28/2015 11:50 PM, Terry Coombs wrote:
Tom Gardner wrote:
On 8/28/2015 6:23 PM, wrote:
Robert
Thanks for the link Robert. I could modify my rifles for this
cartridge but I want to shoot CB shorts or longs. These rounds are
much less powerful than the CCM rounds.
Eric



Could be loaded down to whatever you want. Just don't use a slow
powder.

Really . Odd how a slow powder can act when loaded light . "Pressure
excursions" can be deadly .


Funny how nobody has figured out "detonation" or has been able to
reproduce it under controlled conditions. I use fast powders for most
all my handgun loads. I just bought 3 new powders so I can explore
magnum loads.

On 8/29/2015 12:28 AM, Larry Jaques wrote:
I've looked monthly for going on 3 years now and haven't found a brick
in stock anywhere locally. And I don't want to shoot up my last
brick, so I'm not shooting .22 any more. sigh




I win on this one, I still have 10 bricks that I got on sale for $15
each. But, it's still cheaper to shoot centerfire for me. Primer=2
cents, cast bullet=nothing and powder is almost nothing. The only
expense is time and I can easily load 300/hr. I've been going through
1k rounds/month again, mostly .38 DEWC.

On 2015-08-28, wrote:
As anyone who shoots knows, it has become pretty hard to get .22 ammo.
Especially CB shorts and longs. And then when you do find some it is
of limited amount and exorbitant cost. So as I was trying to fall
asleep after waking from a hot flash in the middle of the night it
occurred to me that I could make my own .22 centerfire brass, cast my
own bullets, and use off the shelf primers. Checking yesterday for
primer availability I found several sellers with small pistol primers
in stock at less than $30.00 per 1000. That's less than 3 cents per
primer, about what I used to pay before this ammo buying panic and
subsequent gouging started. This morning I examined the bolt on my
Remington model 514 and determined it would be pretty easy to make a
new bolt for centerfire ammo. And most of the parts from the existing
could be used in the new one.

My S&W .22 Jet will fire either centerfire .22 Jet cartridges
(.357 magnum necked down to .22) *or* .22 rimfire, either with a
swap-out of cylinder or with adaptor sleeves in the standard .22 Jet
cylinder. It does this with a pair of firing pins, and a switchable
striker in the hammer, so no modification needed there.

The mods to a Ruger .22 target would be fairly simple, but you
would want to set up a catcher for the brass so you *could* reload it
before someone stepped on it.

I would need to machine cases from solid
brass, but I have a lathe with a bar feed setup that could make them
really fast. Each case would require two operations so I could run the
second operation while the lathe was doing the first operation. I have
never really reloaded ammo before though I did reload a few rounds 45
years ago when a friend's dad showed me how his reloading setup
worked. He let me load a few rounds but I may as well have never done
it before because it was so long ago. But from reading about it online
it appears that spent brass cases can usually be used 4 or 5 times,
and some times even more depending on how light or heavy the load is.

Even a .22 LR would be very light by comparison with the .22
Jet, and would probably get something like 20 or more reloads. Consider
just how lightweight the .22 rimfire cartridges are. The case comes
back as a cylinder, bulges out and folds back in to make the back,
providing a crushable space for the rimfire primer compound to lurk in
and be triggered by the firing pin.

I have lots of pure lead and making a mold would be pretty easy. But
would a machined case be as durable as a formed case?

Far more durable than a .22 rimfire case, I would expect.

And since the
smallest primers I can find are .175" O.D. and .22 brass is .224" O.D.
there would only be a .0245 wall thickness between the primer and the
case outside.

Consider that while the OD of the primer is 0.175", the case
needs to reduce the through hole diameter to something quite a bit
smaller to support the anvil built into the primer.

Then again, since the case is trapped in the chamber
maybe that's not a problem.

The thickness of the base required to properly support the
primer should make something a lot stronger than the .22 rimfire case,
so I would not worry -- even with smokeless up to a full .22 LR load,
and you are going to be a lot milder.

And I would be using black powder or
black powder substitute, not smokeless powder, since my aim is to make
low power quiet ammo for target practice. I have a small revolver and
two rifles that I could convert to centerfire without too much work.
So, am I nut to consider this?

An interesting project.

Normal cartridges (except for the rimfire ones) are normally
made by cutting out a disc of brass, then deep drawing the walls while
the base is clamped in position until you get a cylindrical shape, then
the normal sizing operations for tapered cases. And the rim is turned
as necessary, and the primer pocket swaged (harder than if machined from
the brass. There are certainly a number of annealing steps during the
forming, of course. But for the strength loads you are planning,
machined cases will certainly be strong enough.

Shoot enough, and you will want an automatic screw machine to
produce them. :-)

Good Luck,
DoN.

--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: | (KV4PH) Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On 2015-08-28, Robert wrote:
wrote in message ...


So, am I nut to consider this?


Maybe? but there is a easier way. Just reload the 22lr yourself.

http://22lrreloader.com/

Interesting. Looks as though it has mold cavities for both the
standard .22 LR bullet and the smaller "CB" bullets, so it might be a
good choice for the original poster.

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: | (KV4PH) Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 12:08:12 -0700, wrote:

As anyone who shoots knows, it has become pretty hard to get .22 ammo.
Especially CB shorts and longs. And then when you do find some it is
of limited amount and exorbitant cost. So as I was trying to fall
asleep after waking from a hot flash in the middle of the night it
occurred to me that I could make my own .22 centerfire brass, cast my
own bullets, and use off the shelf primers. Checking yesterday for
primer availability I found several sellers with small pistol primers
in stock at less than $30.00 per 1000. That's less than 3 cents per
primer, about what I used to pay before this ammo buying panic and
subsequent gouging started. This morning I examined the bolt on my
Remington model 514 and determined it would be pretty easy to make a
new bolt for centerfire ammo. And most of the parts from the existing
could be used in the new one. I would need to machine cases from solid
brass, but I have a lathe with a bar feed setup that could make them
really fast. Each case would require two operations so I could run the
second operation while the lathe was doing the first operation. I have
never really reloaded ammo before though I did reload a few rounds 45
years ago when a friend's dad showed me how his reloading setup
worked. He let me load a few rounds but I may as well have never done
it before because it was so long ago. But from reading about it online
it appears that spent brass cases can usually be used 4 or 5 times,
and some times even more depending on how light or heavy the load is.
I have lots of pure lead and making a mold would be pretty easy. But
would a machined case be as durable as a formed case? And since the
smallest primers I can find are .175" O.D. and .22 brass is .224" O.D.
there would only be a .0245 wall thickness between the primer and the
case outside. Then again, since the case is trapped in the chamber
maybe that's not a problem. And I would be using black powder or
black powder substitute, not smokeless powder, since my aim is to make
low power quiet ammo for target practice. I have a small revolver and
two rifles that I could convert to centerfire without too much work.
So, am I nut to consider this?
Thanks,
Eric

Entirely possible..
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallery_gun

Though to be fair..Id use something a bit larger... 222 or .222 Mag,
or .223/5.56, 22-250 and simply make a set of cartridges that have a
tiny powder capacity and then simply push in a .22 pellet from an
airgun. Use a large shotgun primer all by itself and it will launch
that 22 pellet over 800 fps

Know anybody with a CNC lathe? turn out the cartridges from any sort
of bar stock, steel, brass, bronze, even aluminum. Its not rocket
science. They only need to fit in the neck and the base
area..everything else could be undersized with no issue.

Gunner

On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 17:21:35 -0400, Tom Gardner
wrote:

On 8/29/2015 12:28 AM, Larry Jaques wrote:
I've looked monthly for going on 3 years now and haven't found a brick
in stock anywhere locally. And I don't want to shoot up my last
brick, so I'm not shooting .22 any more. sigh




I win on this one, I still have 10 bricks that I got on sale for $15
each. But, it's still cheaper to shoot centerfire for me. Primer=2
cents, cast bullet=nothing and powder is almost nothing. The only
expense is time and I can easily load 300/hr. I've been going through
1k rounds/month again, mostly .38 DEWC.

Ive got more than 3 cases of 22lr in the magazine. But its still
cheaper to shoot .45 auto than it is to buy new 22lr

I got home at 3:30 AM this morning from LA and had to be at the range
60 miles away at 8am for my CCW requal (ever 2 yrs here) and was
groggily pulling out ammo from my ready supply..and discovered I was
down to 1 box of old Aguila 45 ACP, 40 rds of 357..and zero 38
specials..and 200 rds of 9mm. GACK!!
So I took the .41 Mag Mod 57 and qualified with it. Its been 2 yrs
since I shot a combat course with it...so this time..sigh...I came in
second (by 2 points) rather than the usual 1st with the 45s.

I had to relearn its DA trigger all over again which took almost 8
rds...embaressing. Got a source for a smooth Mod 57 trigger?

I need brass as well. No idea where the ammo I shot came from...but
over half the cases split in the body of the cartridge. Brass had
started to decay badly and they werent loaded very warm. I recall
buying a couple hundred rounds years ago at a gun show..I think this
was the ammo. All my good stuff is in 100 packs that I reloaded 2 yrs
ago. I should have brought one of those...shrug.
41 Mag is not very common these days....

Chuckle..all the 40s and the 9s and the 45s...no one out there had
ever seen a .41 except the rangemaster and he carries a cutdown Mod
29...we chatted like lost brothers with the kiddies ooohing and awing
over our revolvers...laugh!



Gunner

On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 23:31:05 -0400, Tom Gardner
wrote:

On 8/28/2015 6:23 PM, wrote:
Robert
Thanks for the link Robert. I could modify my rifles for this
cartridge but I want to shoot CB shorts or longs. These rounds are
much less powerful than the CCM rounds.
Eric



Could be loaded down to whatever you want. Just don't use a slow powder.

Bullseye would be my choice. 1 or so grains

On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 17:14:57 -0400, Tom Gardner
wrote:

On 8/28/2015 11:50 PM, Terry Coombs wrote:
Tom Gardner wrote:
On 8/28/2015 6:23 PM, wrote:
Robert
Thanks for the link Robert. I could modify my rifles for this
cartridge but I want to shoot CB shorts or longs. These rounds are
much less powerful than the CCM rounds.
Eric



Could be loaded down to whatever you want. Just don't use a slow
powder.

Really . Odd how a slow powder can act when loaded light . "Pressure
excursions" can be deadly .


Funny how nobody has figured out "detonation" or has been able to
reproduce it under controlled conditions. I use fast powders for most
all my handgun loads. I just bought 3 new powders so I can explore
magnum loads.

Let me know your favorite for the 41 using a cast 210gr SWC

I loaded my plinkers using 7grs Unique as thats my most versitile
powder but looking for something cheaper when bought by the 8lb keg

Gunner

"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 12:08:12 -0700, wrote:


Entirely possible..
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallery_gun

Though to be fair..Id use something a bit larger... 222 or .222 Mag,
or .223/5.56, 22-250 and simply make a set of cartridges that have a
tiny powder capacity and then simply push in a .22 pellet from an
airgun. Use a large shotgun primer all by itself and it will launch
that 22 pellet over 800 fps

Know anybody with a CNC lathe? turn out the cartridges from any sort
of bar stock, steel, brass, bronze, even aluminum. Its not rocket
science. They only need to fit in the neck and the base
area..everything else could be undersized with no issue.

Gunner

Has anyone actually tried nail gun cartridges in a rifle?

On 8/30/2015 3:23 AM, Gunner Asch wrote:
I need brass as well. No idea where the ammo I shot came from...but
over half the cases split in the body of the cartridge. Brass had
started to decay badly and they werent loaded very warm. I recall
buying a couple hundred rounds years ago at a gun show..I think this
was the ammo. All my good stuff is in 100 packs that I reloaded 2 yrs
ago. I should have brought one of those...shrug.
41 Mag is not very common these days....

Chuckle..all the 40s and the 9s and the 45s...no one out there had
ever seen a .41 except the rangemaster and he carries a cutdown Mod
29...we chatted like lost brothers with the kiddies ooohing and awing
over our revolvers...laugh!



Gunner


I bought 500 all new Starline brass for my .41. I did a Wolfe spring
kit and it's exactly like my 29. I have yet to really explore the 57.
I'm looking for a 28 6" Nickle preferred, for $500.

On Sun, 30 Aug 2015 15:03:07 -0400, Tom Gardner
wrote:

On 8/30/2015 3:23 AM, Gunner Asch wrote:
I need brass as well. No idea where the ammo I shot came from...but
over half the cases split in the body of the cartridge. Brass had
started to decay badly and they werent loaded very warm. I recall
buying a couple hundred rounds years ago at a gun show..I think this
was the ammo. All my good stuff is in 100 packs that I reloaded 2 yrs
ago. I should have brought one of those...shrug.
41 Mag is not very common these days....

Chuckle..all the 40s and the 9s and the 45s...no one out there had
ever seen a .41 except the rangemaster and he carries a cutdown Mod
29...we chatted like lost brothers with the kiddies ooohing and awing
over our revolvers...laugh!



Gunner


I bought 500 all new Starline brass for my .41. I did a Wolfe spring
kit and it's exactly like my 29. I have yet to really explore the 57.
I'm looking for a 28 6" Nickle preferred, for $500.

You want a 28-2 or a 28-3?

I run across them occasionally for about $400 or so. Since the sprint
towards self loaders...many revolvers are getting left up in the
closet.
Id go with a 28-2 (pinned and recessed) but only because I like those
features.

Ill see what I can find.

Gunner, who was at the time of reading this...cleaning his 38-44
Outdoorsman.

On 8/30/2015 3:59 PM, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Sun, 30 Aug 2015 15:03:07 -0400, Tom Gardner
wrote:

On 8/30/2015 3:23 AM, Gunner Asch wrote:
I need brass as well. No idea where the ammo I shot came from...but
over half the cases split in the body of the cartridge. Brass had
started to decay badly and they werent loaded very warm. I recall
buying a couple hundred rounds years ago at a gun show..I think this
was the ammo. All my good stuff is in 100 packs that I reloaded 2 yrs
ago. I should have brought one of those...shrug.
41 Mag is not very common these days....

Chuckle..all the 40s and the 9s and the 45s...no one out there had
ever seen a .41 except the rangemaster and he carries a cutdown Mod
29...we chatted like lost brothers with the kiddies ooohing and awing
over our revolvers...laugh!



Gunner


I bought 500 all new Starline brass for my .41. I did a Wolfe spring
kit and it's exactly like my 29. I have yet to really explore the 57.
I'm looking for a 28 6" Nickle preferred, for $500.

You want a 28-2 or a 28-3?

I run across them occasionally for about $400 or so. Since the sprint
towards self loaders...many revolvers are getting left up in the
closet.
Id go with a 28-2 (pinned and recessed) but only because I like those
features.

Ill see what I can find.

Gunner, who was at the time of reading this...cleaning his 38-44
Outdoorsman.




Cool! I like those features too, shows craftsmanship. I like those
N-frames. What's the best way to handle it, I have an FFL guy here, I
can fund you however you want.

On Mon, 31 Aug 2015 07:19:05 -0400, Tom Gardner
wrote:

On 8/30/2015 3:59 PM, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Sun, 30 Aug 2015 15:03:07 -0400, Tom Gardner
wrote:

On 8/30/2015 3:23 AM, Gunner Asch wrote:
I need brass as well. No idea where the ammo I shot came from...but
over half the cases split in the body of the cartridge. Brass had
started to decay badly and they werent loaded very warm. I recall
buying a couple hundred rounds years ago at a gun show..I think this
was the ammo. All my good stuff is in 100 packs that I reloaded 2 yrs
ago. I should have brought one of those...shrug.
41 Mag is not very common these days....

Chuckle..all the 40s and the 9s and the 45s...no one out there had
ever seen a .41 except the rangemaster and he carries a cutdown Mod
29...we chatted like lost brothers with the kiddies ooohing and awing
over our revolvers...laugh!



Gunner


I bought 500 all new Starline brass for my .41. I did a Wolfe spring
kit and it's exactly like my 29. I have yet to really explore the 57.
I'm looking for a 28 6" Nickle preferred, for $500.

You want a 28-2 or a 28-3?

I run across them occasionally for about $400 or so. Since the sprint
towards self loaders...many revolvers are getting left up in the
closet.
Id go with a 28-2 (pinned and recessed) but only because I like those
features.

Ill see what I can find.

Gunner, who was at the time of reading this...cleaning his 38-44
Outdoorsman.




Cool! I like those features too, shows craftsmanship. I like those
N-frames. What's the best way to handle it, I have an FFL guy here, I
can fund you however you want.

Ill find one, give you the name of the seller, have him deal with your
FFL.

Gunner

On 8/30/2015 3:32 AM, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 17:14:57 -0400, Tom Gardner
wrote:

On 8/28/2015 11:50 PM, Terry Coombs wrote:
Tom Gardner wrote:
On 8/28/2015 6:23 PM, wrote:
Robert
Thanks for the link Robert. I could modify my rifles for this
cartridge but I want to shoot CB shorts or longs. These rounds are
much less powerful than the CCM rounds.
Eric



Could be loaded down to whatever you want. Just don't use a slow
powder.

Really . Odd how a slow powder can act when loaded light . "Pressure
excursions" can be deadly .


Funny how nobody has figured out "detonation" or has been able to
reproduce it under controlled conditions. I use fast powders for most
all my handgun loads. I just bought 3 new powders so I can explore
magnum loads.

Let me know your favorite for the 41 using a cast 210gr SWC

I loaded my plinkers using 7grs Unique as thats my most versitile
powder but looking for something cheaper when bought by the 8lb keg

Gunner


Unique is like gold and I can't find any. I got 800-x, H110 and Ba9.
http://www.vectan.fr/UK/range-of-powders

Look at the Nobel Sports powders, they sell in metric so a small bottle
is 1.1 lbs. I have high hopes. I have some questions, I will e-mail.

On 8/30/2015 3:27 AM, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 23:31:05 -0400, Tom Gardner
wrote:

On 8/28/2015 6:23 PM, wrote:
Robert
Thanks for the link Robert. I could modify my rifles for this
cartridge but I want to shoot CB shorts or longs. These rounds are
much less powerful than the CCM rounds.
Eric



Could be loaded down to whatever you want. Just don't use a slow powder.

Bullseye would be my choice. 1 or so grains


That's a LOT! (imho)

On 8/31/2015 2:17 PM, Gunner Asch wrote:
Cool! I like those features too, shows craftsmanship. I like those
N-frames. What's the best way to handle it, I have an FFL guy here, I
can fund you however you want.

Ill find one, give you the name of the seller, have him deal with your
FFL.

Gunner


I'll gladly send you a finder's fee, too bad no brushes.

On 8/29/2015 12:45 AM, Larry Jaques wrote:

Ammo mfgrs in the USA alone are making 4.2 billion rounds a year.
CCI makes 4 million rounds per day.

Where the hell are they all going, ferchrissake? Preppers couldn't buy
up that many every day for years on end, as it has been going,
especially at 3-5x the normal price. This is just nuts.

--
The mind is like a parachute. It doesn't work until it's opened.
--Frank Zappa


And you wouldn't think that .22LR is the first choice for prepers.
Wideners has what seems to be good prices...if you are unlucky enough to
have to buy ammo.

Even I am thinking pellet gun, I wonder if I can cast my own pellets
before they start selling for $0.10 ea.??? (Wait 'til they tax air!)