I have a casual acquaintance who I respect for one of his areas of
expertice. Besides that knowlege, he claims to have been "a machinist
for decades". He's of retirement age now.

Recently, he instructed a raw-beginner HSM on how to turn long tapers
using the compound and frequent re-chucking, and using a file for
dressing up the jaggies. When I suggested turning between centers and
offsetting the tailstock, he bristled, saying that it was
"impossible" to ever get the tailstock back on center again.

Later he made a comment to another fellow allowing that "owning a
lathe and a mill would only be a dream for me."

Can I presume this guy is NOT "a machinist"? G

Or is it possible that production-floor machine _operators_ call
themselves that?


LLoyd

Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
I have a casual acquaintance who I respect for one of his areas of
expertice. Besides that knowlege, he claims to have been "a machinist
for decades". He's of retirement age now.

Recently, he instructed a raw-beginner HSM on how to turn long tapers
using the compound and frequent re-chucking, and using a file for
dressing up the jaggies. When I suggested turning between centers and
offsetting the tailstock, he bristled, saying that it was
"impossible" to ever get the tailstock back on center again.

Later he made a comment to another fellow allowing that "owning a
lathe and a mill would only be a dream for me."

Can I presume this guy is NOT "a machinist"? G

Or is it possible that production-floor machine _operators_ call
themselves that?

Hell, I call myself an "engineer" and I've never made an engine, nor
have I operated one for money (if you discount driving a shop truck).

And I _do_ own a lathe, plus an excuse for a mill, but I only call
myself a "machinist wannabe". This in spite of the fact that I have no
fear of setting over the tailstock, nor of bringing it back into line
once I've done (you just get it until it eyeballs as straight, right? :-)

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

Do you need to implement control loops in software?
"Applied Control Theory for Embedded Systems" gives you just what it says.
See details at http://www.wescottdesign.com/actfes/actfes.html

LLoyd,

I'm very sure he didNOTt spend his decades running a manual lathe.
He could have spent that time on a turret lathe, milling machine or
grinders.
All would qualify as a machinist.

That said, now you know that his knowledge is not all encompassing,
check his suggestions.

I knew many machinists that don't own machines, to them it's a job.

Others enjoy the craft.

Dave J.
..

Lloyd,

He's not even a _operator_

He's a "tool changer"

--.- Dave


"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote in message
. 3.70...
I have a casual acquaintance who I respect for one of his areas of
expertice. Besides that knowlege, he claims to have been "a machinist
for decades". He's of retirement age now.

Recently, he instructed a raw-beginner HSM on how to turn long tapers
using the compound and frequent re-chucking, and using a file for
dressing up the jaggies. When I suggested turning between centers and
offsetting the tailstock, he bristled, saying that it was
"impossible" to ever get the tailstock back on center again.

Later he made a comment to another fellow allowing that "owning a
lathe and a mill would only be a dream for me."

Can I presume this guy is NOT "a machinist"? G

Or is it possible that production-floor machine _operators_ call
themselves that?


LLoyd

On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 12:53:49 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

I have a casual acquaintance who I respect for one of his areas of
expertice. Besides that knowlege, he claims to have been "a machinist
for decades". He's of retirement age now.

Recently, he instructed a raw-beginner HSM on how to turn long tapers
using the compound and frequent re-chucking, and using a file for
dressing up the jaggies. When I suggested turning between centers and
offsetting the tailstock, he bristled, saying that it was
"impossible" to ever get the tailstock back on center again.

Later he made a comment to another fellow allowing that "owning a
lathe and a mill would only be a dream for me."

Can I presume this guy is NOT "a machinist"? G

Or is it possible that production-floor machine _operators_ call
themselves that?


LLoyd

Ayup..sounds like a Boeing "Machinist" who came in to one of my
clients looking for a job as a Bridgeport machinist.

He didnt have a clue how to do anything other than the same 3-5 parts
he ran for his entire carreer at Boeing.

He didnt get the job....shrug


"Obama, raises taxes and kills babies. Sarah Palin - raises babies
and kills taxes." Pyotr Flipivich

Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:

When I suggested turning between centers and
offsetting the tailstock, he bristled, saying that it was
"impossible" to ever get the tailstock back on center again.

I have to laugh when I hear stuff like that. Who does he
think got that tailstock on center in the first place? A
human being. If one human can get it on center, another can
get it back on center.

Jon

Gunner Asch wrote:
On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 12:53:49 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

I have a casual acquaintance who I respect for one of his areas of
expertice. Besides that knowlege, he claims to have been "a machinist
for decades". He's of retirement age now.

Recently, he instructed a raw-beginner HSM on how to turn long tapers
using the compound and frequent re-chucking, and using a file for
dressing up the jaggies. When I suggested turning between centers and
offsetting the tailstock, he bristled, saying that it was
"impossible" to ever get the tailstock back on center again.

Later he made a comment to another fellow allowing that "owning a
lathe and a mill would only be a dream for me."

Can I presume this guy is NOT "a machinist"? G

Or is it possible that production-floor machine _operators_ call
themselves that?


LLoyd

Ayup..sounds like a Boeing "Machinist" who came in to one of my
clients looking for a job as a Bridgeport machinist.

He didnt have a clue how to do anything other than the same 3-5 parts
he ran for his entire carreer at Boeing.

He didnt get the job....shrug

I wonder if he came in with the attitude "I am an apprentice now" or if
he was looking for the same pay rate &c as he was getting.

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

Do you need to implement control loops in software?
"Applied Control Theory for Embedded Systems" gives you just what it says.
See details at http://www.wescottdesign.com/actfes/actfes.html

On 2008-09-15, Lloyd E. Sponenburgh lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
I have a casual acquaintance who I respect for one of his areas of
expertice. Besides that knowlege, he claims to have been "a machinist
for decades". He's of retirement age now.

Recently, he instructed a raw-beginner HSM on how to turn long tapers
using the compound and frequent re-chucking, and using a file for
dressing up the jaggies. When I suggested turning between centers and
offsetting the tailstock, he bristled, saying that it was
"impossible" to ever get the tailstock back on center again.

Hmm ... did you bother asking him why the lathe manufacturers
provide for tailstock offsetting?

And I can testify that it is not that difficult getting it back
on center.

Later he made a comment to another fellow allowing that "owning a
lathe and a mill would only be a dream for me."

Can I presume this guy is NOT "a machinist"? G

I think that *I* would not call him one.

Or is it possible that production-floor machine _operators_ call
themselves that?

That might be the case. Way back when, the operators *were*
machinists, but in todays world of CNC machines, there are specialists who
set up the machine, and the operators are only expected to load stock
and push buttons. Oh yes -- also to recognize when to push the panic
button to stop the machine when something goes wrong.

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

Was he in a union. in some union shops, any one operating a machine, even a
punch press, is a machinist.
gary


"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote in message
. 3.70...
I have a casual acquaintance who I respect for one of his areas of
expertice. Besides that knowlege, he claims to have been "a machinist
for decades". He's of retirement age now.

Recently, he instructed a raw-beginner HSM on how to turn long tapers
using the compound and frequent re-chucking, and using a file for
dressing up the jaggies. When I suggested turning between centers and
offsetting the tailstock, he bristled, saying that it was
"impossible" to ever get the tailstock back on center again.

Later he made a comment to another fellow allowing that "owning a
lathe and a mill would only be a dream for me."

Can I presume this guy is NOT "a machinist"? G

Or is it possible that production-floor machine _operators_ call
themselves that?


LLoyd

Tim Wescott wrote:

Ayup..sounds like a Boeing "Machinist" who came in to one of my
clients looking for a job as a Bridgeport machinist.

He didnt have a clue how to do anything other than the same 3-5
parts he ran for his entire carreer at Boeing.

He didnt get the job....shrug

I wonder if he came in with the attitude "I am an apprentice now"
or if he was looking for the same pay rate &c as he was getting.

When I worked at Briggs & Stratton, there were journeymen machinists
who knew how to run their machine, set it up for the several parts
they might run, and inspect those parts. Period. As it was a union
shop, they knew how to look busy while doing little. But what they did
do was done right, they knew better than to kill the goose.

David

I missed the Staff meeting, but the Memos showed that Gunner Asch
wrote on Mon, 15 Sep 2008 14:34:01 -0700
in rec.crafts.metalworking :
On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 12:53:49 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

I have a casual acquaintance who I respect for one of his areas of
expertice. Besides that knowlege, he claims to have been "a machinist
for decades". He's of retirement age now.

Recently, he instructed a raw-beginner HSM on how to turn long tapers
using the compound and frequent re-chucking, and using a file for
dressing up the jaggies. When I suggested turning between centers and
offsetting the tailstock, he bristled, saying that it was
"impossible" to ever get the tailstock back on center again.

Later he made a comment to another fellow allowing that "owning a
lathe and a mill would only be a dream for me."

Can I presume this guy is NOT "a machinist"? G

Or is it possible that production-floor machine _operators_ call
themselves that?

Ayup..sounds like a Boeing "Machinist" who came in to one of my
clients looking for a job as a Bridgeport machinist.

He didnt have a clue how to do anything other than the same 3-5 parts
he ran for his entire carreer at Boeing.

I just hired on at a new job, and yoikes! this isn't like the last
place! I mean holding a thousand tolerance? Well, strip my gears and
call me shiftless, I'm in like a porch climber! "Now this is
machining" and yeepers, am I "scared"!
But the guy training me started out by saying "When you get the
paperwork, ask yourself 'how is this job going to bite me in the ass.'
Not 'can' but 'How'." I learned that TiN coated taps run oversize.
Taught him what "theoretical thread depth" means (all that expensive
technical schooling finally was useful. Finally.)
I'm 'loving' it, I've half a block shorter commute, and a ten cent
raise. I can live with this.
--
pyotr filipivich
"I had just been through hell and must have looked like death warmed
over walking into the saloon, because when I asked the bartender
whether they served zombies he said, ‘Sure, what'll you have?'"
from I Hear America Swinging by Peter DeVries

I missed the Staff meeting, but the Memos showed that "Lloyd E.
Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote on Mon, 15 Sep 2008
12:53:49 -0500 in rec.crafts.metalworking :
I have a casual acquaintance who I respect for one of his areas of
expertice. Besides that knowlege, he claims to have been "a machinist
for decades". He's of retirement age now.

Recently, he instructed a raw-beginner HSM on how to turn long tapers
using the compound and frequent re-chucking, and using a file for
dressing up the jaggies. When I suggested turning between centers and
offsetting the tailstock, he bristled, saying that it was
"impossible" to ever get the tailstock back on center again.

Later he made a comment to another fellow allowing that "owning a
lathe and a mill would only be a dream for me."

Can I presume this guy is NOT "a machinist"? G

Or is it possible that production-floor machine _operators_ call
themselves that?

Or are called that, think they are that, and are really just
"button monkeys" Some of them may learn the trade, but ... well I'm
learning the "problems" which occur when all you've done for a set up
is put fixtures in predefined locations, load ,material and go.
This machining is really wild. I'm learning a lot, but I'm also
building the base of previous 'experience'.


pyotr
--
pyotr filipivich
"I had just been through hell and must have looked like death warmed
over walking into the saloon, because when I asked the bartender
whether they served zombies he said, ‘Sure, what'll you have?'"
from I Hear America Swinging by Peter DeVries

On 15 Sep 2008 22:45:38 GMT, "DoN. Nichols"
wrote:

Oh yes -- also to recognize when to push the panic
button to stop the machine when something goes wrong.


Nearly always AFTER something has gone wrong.

Thankfully!!!!

Gunner, Machine tool mechanic

"Obama, raises taxes and kills babies. Sarah Palin - raises babies
and kills taxes." Pyotr Flipivich

On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 18:47:00 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:

I missed the Staff meeting, but the Memos showed that "Lloyd E.
Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote on Mon, 15 Sep 2008
12:53:49 -0500 in rec.crafts.metalworking :
I have a casual acquaintance who I respect for one of his areas of
expertice. Besides that knowlege, he claims to have been "a machinist
for decades". He's of retirement age now.

Recently, he instructed a raw-beginner HSM on how to turn long tapers
using the compound and frequent re-chucking, and using a file for
dressing up the jaggies. When I suggested turning between centers and
offsetting the tailstock, he bristled, saying that it was
"impossible" to ever get the tailstock back on center again.

Later he made a comment to another fellow allowing that "owning a
lathe and a mill would only be a dream for me."

Can I presume this guy is NOT "a machinist"? G

Or is it possible that production-floor machine _operators_ call
themselves that?

Or are called that, think they are that, and are really just
"button monkeys" Some of them may learn the trade, but ... well I'm
learning the "problems" which occur when all you've done for a set up
is put fixtures in predefined locations, load ,material and go.
This machining is really wild. I'm learning a lot, but I'm also
building the base of previous 'experience'.


pyotr
When I worked as a manual cut off lathe operator in a tube factory, I
was classified as skilled labour, one step up from the floor sweeper.
My machine was set up by the shift lead hand but I was allowed to re
sharpen the cutter after receiving instruction.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

On Sep 15, 7:53*am, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
I have a casual acquaintance who I respect for one of his areas of
expertice. *Besides that knowlege, he claims to have been "a machinist
for decades". *He's of retirement age now.

Recently, he instructed a raw-beginner HSM on how to turn long tapers
using the compound and frequent re-chucking, and using a file for
dressing up the jaggies. *When I suggested turning between centers and
offsetting the tailstock, he bristled, saying that it was
"impossible" to ever get the tailstock back on center again.

Later he made a comment to another fellow allowing that "owning a
lathe and a mill would only be a dream for me."

Can I presume this guy is NOT "a machinist"? G

Or is it possible that production-floor machine _operators_ call
themselves that?

LLoyd

I never owned a lathe till this year. It's a Chinese one and I'm the
first one to put the tailstock on center. I'm pretty sure I'm not a
machinist.
Karl

On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 20:31:47 -0500, with neither quill nor qualm,
"David R.Birch" quickly quoth:

Tim Wescott wrote:

Ayup..sounds like a Boeing "Machinist" who came in to one of my
clients looking for a job as a Bridgeport machinist.

He didnt have a clue how to do anything other than the same 3-5
parts he ran for his entire carreer at Boeing.

He didnt get the job....shrug

I wonder if he came in with the attitude "I am an apprentice now"
or if he was looking for the same pay rate &c as he was getting.

When I worked at Briggs & Stratton, there were journeymen machinists
who knew how to run their machine, set it up for the several parts
they might run, and inspect those parts. Period. As it was a union
shop, they knew how to look busy while doing little. But what they did
do was done right, they knew better than to kill the goose.

Ah, a Briggs Boy. Maybe you can help. I inherited a free riding mower
with a blown engine. Are the 14.5 horse engines worth rebuilding, or
should I just replace it? The old owner said it made a very loud noise
and blew oil all over as it quit. He was working on a slope. I did a
quick visual and can't find any rods sticking out the case, but there
is no compression. So, do these beasties usually tear themselves to
shreds when they break, or are they pretty sturdy and inexpensive to
repair? I still have all my tools from my auto repair days.

Model 287707, Type 022701, Code 9502154A ('95 KGRO PowerPro T4315)

Thanks for any info you can impart.

--
Guard well within yourself that treasure, kindness. Know how to give without
hesitation, how to lose without regret, how to acquire without meanness.
-- George Sand

Larry Jaques wrote:
... Maybe you can help. I inherited a free riding mower
with a blown engine. Are the 14.5 horse engines worth rebuilding,...

See the recent (July) thread about Troy Bilt engine with similar problem
(OP: stryed).

--
Nota for President

Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
I have a casual acquaintance who I respect for one of his areas of
expertice. Besides that knowlege, he claims to have been "a machinist
for decades". He's of retirement age now.

Recently, he instructed a raw-beginner HSM on how to turn long tapers
using the compound and frequent re-chucking, and using a file for
dressing up the jaggies. When I suggested turning between centers and
offsetting the tailstock, he bristled, saying that it was
"impossible" to ever get the tailstock back on center again.

Well, I can understand not wanting to mess up the tailstock offset for a
one-shot deal, and also turning tapers or constant diameters on long
thin work is a royal pain, anyway. If you need an accurate diameter on
that sort of work, it is better to grind, even better if you have a
cylindrical grinder. Of course, not too many home shops have those.

And, of course, you CAN get the tailstock centered again, but it does
take a few minutes with measuring instruments to do it. A "real"
machinist who did frequent lathe work in a "real" shop would have known
exactly how to do this, and how long it will take to get it dead on and
KNOW that it is actually correct. A guy who dabbled in the shop, mostly
using just a drill press might know the general concept, but have no
idea how easy it is after you've done it a couple times. Without a dial
test indicator, preferably a tenth-reading one, it gets a lot harder,
like turning test bars and miking over and over.

Knowing the decimal equivalent of the threads in the tailstock setover
bolts is a good help, so if it is a 24 TPI thread, and you need to move
..004" then it is about 1/10th of a turn of the bolt.

I generally resist offsetting my tailstock, too, if it doesn't make a
big difference. On critical work, however, where an accurate taper can
actually be turned (something like a Morse or R-8 arbor, for instance)
then it is worth doing it right. (Of course, a taper attachment is even
better!)

Jon

Jon Elson fired this volley in news:B-
:

I generally resist offsetting my tailstock, too, if it doesn't make a
big difference. On critical work, however, where an accurate taper
can
actually be turned (something like a Morse or R-8 arbor, for instance)
then it is worth doing it right. (Of course, a taper attachment is
even
better!)

Oh, PSHAW, Jon!

To get the tailstock back to acceptable (cheap machining) center takes
only a swatch of shimstock and about 30 seconds.

To get it back to "tenths" takes only about three or four minutes using
a truing bar and taking a few tenths off each end. I've had my bar
since 1971, and still haven't worn it down to where it needs new bosses.

LLoyd

On 2008-09-16, Bob Engelhardt wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote:
... Maybe you can help. I inherited a free riding mower
with a blown engine. Are the 14.5 horse engines worth rebuilding,...

See the recent (July) thread about Troy Bilt engine with similar problem
(OP: stryed).

Speaking of Troy Built, does anyone know where to find one of
their sickle-bar walk-behind mowers near the Northern VA area? They
seem to have discontinued it -- considered it to be dangerous for some
funny reason -- and it seems to be the right thing for dealing with my
irregular terrain when the town gets nasty about mowing. :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On 16 Sep 2008 22:52:42 GMT, "DoN. Nichols"
wrote:

On 2008-09-16, Bob Engelhardt wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote:
... Maybe you can help. I inherited a free riding mower
with a blown engine. Are the 14.5 horse engines worth rebuilding,...

See the recent (July) thread about Troy Bilt engine with similar problem
(OP: stryed).

Speaking of Troy Built, does anyone know where to find one of
their sickle-bar walk-behind mowers near the Northern VA area? They
seem to have discontinued it -- considered it to be dangerous for some
funny reason -- and it seems to be the right thing for dealing with my
irregular terrain when the town gets nasty about mowing. :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.


http://www.bcsshop.com/sickle_bar_mower.htm
http://www.canns-bilco.com/store.asp?pid=19833
http://www.grasslandcorp.com/sickle_bar_mowers.html
http://www.equipmentlocator.com/asp/browse/con/4/loc/na-en/industry/ag/type/160

On 16 Sep 2008 22:52:42 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm, "DoN.
Nichols" quickly quoth:

On 2008-09-16, Bob Engelhardt wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote:
... Maybe you can help. I inherited a free riding mower
with a blown engine. Are the 14.5 horse engines worth rebuilding,...

See the recent (July) thread about Troy Bilt engine with similar problem
(OP: stryed).

Speaking of Troy Built, does anyone know where to find one of
their sickle-bar walk-behind mowers near the Northern VA area? They
seem to have discontinued it -- considered it to be dangerous for some
funny reason -- and it seems to be the right thing for dealing with my
irregular terrain when the town gets nasty about mowing. :-)

Look at the DR mower, DoN. They're very nice. You can buy a
self-propelled model but it's just as hard to work as the human
propelled model due to its smaller wheels.

--
Guard well within yourself that treasure, kindness. Know how to give without
hesitation, how to lose without regret, how to acquire without meanness.
-- George Sand

On 2008-09-17, Larry Jaques novalidaddress@di wrote:
On 16 Sep 2008 22:52:42 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm, "DoN.
Nichols" quickly quoth:

[ ... ]

Speaking of Troy Built, does anyone know where to find one of
their sickle-bar walk-behind mowers near the Northern VA area? They
seem to have discontinued it -- considered it to be dangerous for some
funny reason -- and it seems to be the right thing for dealing with my
irregular terrain when the town gets nasty about mowing. :-)

Look at the DR mower, DoN. They're very nice. You can buy a
self-propelled model but it's just as hard to work as the human
propelled model due to its smaller wheels.

I had not heard of DR before, and was not sure whether it was a
model or a brand, but Google took me right to their site.

They look nice (the field and brush mowers), until I get to the
price. $1,299.00 on sale for the smallest manual start model. What was
the price for the Troy-Bilt sickle bar mower?

DR's snow blower attachment looks nice too. Perhaps next year I
can afford it all.

Hmm ... perhaps you meant the trimmer/mower? That is a bit more
affordable.

No local sales offices, I see. Just web-based, or phone.

Thanks,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

Larry Jaques wrote:

Ah, a Briggs Boy. Maybe you can help. I inherited a free riding
mower with a blown engine. Are the 14.5 horse engines worth
rebuilding, or should I just replace it? The old owner said it made
a very loud noise and blew oil all over as it quit. He was working
on a slope. I did a quick visual and can't find any rods sticking
out the case, but there is no compression. So, do these beasties
usually tear themselves to shreds when they break, or are they
pretty sturdy and inexpensive to repair? I still have all my tools
from my auto repair days.

Model 287707, Type 022701, Code 9502154A ('95 KGRO PowerPro T4315)


Thanks for any info you can impart.

Sorry, no clue, I was a trucker, which meant I pushed around heavy
loads of parts. Neck size went up 2" in 6 months, waist fat was
converted to shoulder muscle.

Learned why I never wanted to be in a union shop again.

Saw guys working a lot less hard than I was for more money. Was told
they were "machinists". Went to MATC, got As, got lathe job, NOT at
B&S, now I push around a mouse as CNC programmer and IT guy.

David

I missed the Staff meeting, but the Memos showed that Gerald Miller
wrote on Tue, 16 Sep 2008 01:09:45 -0400 in
rec.crafts.metalworking :

Later he made a comment to another fellow allowing that "owning a
lathe and a mill would only be a dream for me."

Can I presume this guy is NOT "a machinist"? G

Or is it possible that production-floor machine _operators_ call
themselves that?

Or are called that, think they are that, and are really just
"button monkeys" Some of them may learn the trade, but ... well I'm
learning the "problems" which occur when all you've done for a set up
is put fixtures in predefined locations, load ,material and go.
This machining is really wild. I'm learning a lot, but I'm also
building the base of previous 'experience'.


pyotr
When I worked as a manual cut off lathe operator in a tube factory, I
was classified as skilled labour, one step up from the floor sweeper.
My machine was set up by the shift lead hand but I was allowed to re
sharpen the cutter after receiving instruction.

We all got to start somewhere.

I was the "setup guy" for the Robomills. I loved setting them up,
but it .. took a while for me to "settle into the production routine."
But I started as one of those who pushed buttons after "Roboman" set
them up, too.

Now, I'm "back" as the new guy, drinking from the fire hose with
new machines and new procedures. At least this time I had a new
notebook on day 1.


tschus
pyotr
--
pyotr filipivich
"I had just been through hell and must have looked like death warmed
over walking into the saloon, because when I asked the bartender
whether they served zombies he said, ‘Sure, what'll you have?'"
from I Hear America Swinging by Peter DeVries

On 17 Sep 2008 02:13:18 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm, "DoN.
Nichols" quickly quoth:

On 2008-09-17, Larry Jaques novalidaddress@di wrote:
On 16 Sep 2008 22:52:42 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm, "DoN.
Nichols" quickly quoth:

[ ... ]

Speaking of Troy Built, does anyone know where to find one of
their sickle-bar walk-behind mowers near the Northern VA area? They
seem to have discontinued it -- considered it to be dangerous for some
funny reason -- and it seems to be the right thing for dealing with my
irregular terrain when the town gets nasty about mowing. :-)

Look at the DR mower, DoN. They're very nice. You can buy a
self-propelled model but it's just as hard to work as the human
propelled model due to its smaller wheels.

I had not heard of DR before, and was not sure whether it was a
model or a brand, but Google took me right to their site.

They look nice (the field and brush mowers), until I get to the
price. $1,299.00 on sale for the smallest manual start model. What was
the price for the Troy-Bilt sickle bar mower?

Wow, they were $974 when my neighbor replaced his (stolen by his
worker) 3 years ago. They've definitely gone up. Crapsman puts one
out at under $300, but ya pays yer munny and ya takes yer chances with
them.

DR's snow blower attachment looks nice too. Perhaps next year I
can afford it all.

Check out their powerwagon, too. I'd love to have one of those for
some wheelbarrow jobs. http://tinyurl.com/5m696y Max 4.7mph.
http://www.bestchoice247.com/motoriz...ShoppingDotCom
The price for these things is assinine, though.


Hmm ... perhaps you meant the trimmer/mower? That is a bit more
affordable.

Oh, yeah, string trimmer on steroids. Look at the 8.25 Commercial.

--
Guard well within yourself that treasure, kindness. Know how to give without
hesitation, how to lose without regret, how to acquire without meanness.
-- George Sand

On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 22:05:36 -0500, with neither quill nor qualm,
"David R.Birch" quickly quoth:

Larry Jaques wrote:

Ah, a Briggs Boy. Maybe you can help. I inherited a free riding
mower with a blown engine. Are the 14.5 horse engines worth
rebuilding, or should I just replace it? The old owner said it made
a very loud noise and blew oil all over as it quit. He was working
on a slope. I did a quick visual and can't find any rods sticking
out the case, but there is no compression. So, do these beasties
usually tear themselves to shreds when they break, or are they
pretty sturdy and inexpensive to repair? I still have all my tools
from my auto repair days.

Model 287707, Type 022701, Code 9502154A ('95 KGRO PowerPro T4315)


Thanks for any info you can impart.

Sorry, no clue, I was a trucker, which meant I pushed around heavy
loads of parts. Neck size went up 2" in 6 months, waist fat was
converted to shoulder muscle.

Got it. Thanks anyway.


Learned why I never wanted to be in a union shop again.

Saw guys working a lot less hard than I was for more money. Was told
they were "machinists". Went to MATC,

http://www.google.com/search?q=matc Which MATC? g


got As, got lathe job, NOT at
B&S, now I push around a mouse as CNC programmer and IT guy.

I went to UTI for auto mechanics and ended up programming websites.
When it slowed down, I got my contractor's license and became blue
collar again. I now run both companies and almost stay afloat. sigh

--
Guard well within yourself that treasure, kindness. Know how to give without
hesitation, how to lose without regret, how to acquire without meanness.
-- George Sand

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 22:05:36 -0500, with neither quill nor qualm,
"David R.Birch" quickly quoth:

Larry Jaques wrote:

Ah, a Briggs Boy. Maybe you can help. I inherited a free riding
mower with a blown engine. Are the 14.5 horse engines worth
rebuilding, or should I just replace it? The old owner said it made
a very loud noise and blew oil all over as it quit. He was working
on a slope. I did a quick visual and can't find any rods sticking
out the case, but there is no compression. So, do these beasties
usually tear themselves to shreds when they break, or are they
pretty sturdy and inexpensive to repair? I still have all my tools
from my auto repair days.

Model 287707, Type 022701, Code 9502154A ('95 KGRO PowerPro T4315)


Thanks for any info you can impart.

Sorry, no clue, I was a trucker, which meant I pushed around heavy
loads of parts. Neck size went up 2" in 6 months, waist fat was
converted to shoulder muscle.

Got it. Thanks anyway.


Learned why I never wanted to be in a union shop again.

Saw guys working a lot less hard than I was for more money. Was told
they were "machinists". Went to MATC,

http://www.google.com/search?q=matc Which MATC? g

Milwaukee, the first hit...
Campuses in downtown Milwaukee, the south side of Milwaukee (near the
airport) and Mequon (ritzy northern suburb).

got As, got lathe job, NOT at
B&S, now I push around a mouse as CNC programmer and IT guy.

I went to UTI for auto mechanics and ended up programming websites.
When it slowed down, I got my contractor's license and became blue
collar again. I now run both companies and almost stay afloat. sigh

With new car sales in the dumpster, I'm having the best year ever.

--
Guard well within yourself that treasure, kindness. Know how to give without
hesitation, how to lose without regret, how to acquire without meanness.
-- George Sand

DoN. Nichols wrote:
On 2008-09-16, Bob Engelhardt wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote:
... Maybe you can help. I inherited a free riding mower
with a blown engine. Are the 14.5 horse engines worth rebuilding,...
See the recent (July) thread about Troy Bilt engine with similar problem
(OP: stryed).

Speaking of Troy Built, does anyone know where to find one of
their sickle-bar walk-behind mowers near the Northern VA area? They
seem to have discontinued it -- considered it to be dangerous for some
funny reason -- and it seems to be the right thing for dealing with my
irregular terrain when the town gets nasty about mowing. :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.


When MTD bought them out the sickle bars were dropped (along with many
other troy-bilt items) The main reason was lack of sales. The ONLY
Troy-Bilt item that had good sales levels were the tillers. That is one
of the primary reasons why they went under.

--
Steve W.
Near Cooperstown, New York

DoN. Nichols wrote:
On 2008-09-17, Larry Jaques novalidaddress@di wrote:
On 16 Sep 2008 22:52:42 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm, "DoN.
Nichols" quickly quoth:

[ ... ]

Speaking of Troy Built, does anyone know where to find one of
their sickle-bar walk-behind mowers near the Northern VA area? They
seem to have discontinued it -- considered it to be dangerous for some
funny reason -- and it seems to be the right thing for dealing with my
irregular terrain when the town gets nasty about mowing. :-)
Look at the DR mower, DoN. They're very nice. You can buy a
self-propelled model but it's just as hard to work as the human
propelled model due to its smaller wheels.

I had not heard of DR before, and was not sure whether it was a
model or a brand, but Google took me right to their site.

They look nice (the field and brush mowers), until I get to the
price. $1,299.00 on sale for the smallest manual start model. What was
the price for the Troy-Bilt sickle bar mower?

Low end model was just under 1K and the upper end unit was $1400.00


DR's snow blower attachment looks nice too. Perhaps next year I
can afford it all.

Hmm ... perhaps you meant the trimmer/mower? That is a bit more
affordable.

No local sales offices, I see. Just web-based, or phone.

Thanks,
DoN.



--
Steve W.
Near Cooperstown, New York

Larry Jaques wrote:
...
Check out their powerwagon, too. I'd love to have one of those for
some wheelbarrow jobs. ...

I too thought the DR powerwagon prices were ridiculous, so I built my own:
http://home.comcast.net/~bobengelhardt/wagon%20007.jpg

Got everything at the dump except for 1 stick of 1" square tube. Was a
lot of fun & it is very useful.

Bob
--
Nota for President

Larry Jaques wrote:
Look at the DR mower, DoN. They're very nice. You can buy a
self-propelled model but it's just as hard to work as the human
propelled model due to its smaller wheels.

I have an older DR mower. Very much older - one of the design
parameters looks to be: it had to be built with a bandsaw, drill press &
welder. It is self propelled, but single speed (the new ones are 3F &
1R, I think!). It has large wheels (16"?) & 8hp engine! Works very
well: it will run right through weeds & berry bushes 4' high. I've cut
down a 1" tree with it (since it couldn't push it over, I had to rear it
up to expose the blade).

Bob
--
Nota for President

Larry Jaques wrote:


Saw guys working a lot less hard than I was for more money. Was
told they were "machinists". Went to MATC,

http://www.google.com/search?q=matc Which MATC? g

www.matc.edu


got As, got lathe job, NOT at B&S, now I push around a mouse as
CNC programmer and IT guy.

I went to UTI for auto mechanics and ended up programming websites.
When it slowed down, I got my contractor's license and became blue
collar again. I now run both companies and almost stay afloat.
sigh

Been a manager, been a supervisor, not my bag. Let the boss handle the
aggravation as long as he keeps giving me raises, bonuses(boni?) and
extra paid days off at review time.

David

On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 20:35:38 -0400, the infamous Bob Engelhardt
scrolled the following:

Larry Jaques wrote:
...
Check out their powerwagon, too. I'd love to have one of those for
some wheelbarrow jobs. ...

I too thought the DR powerwagon prices were ridiculous, so I built my own:
http://home.comcast.net/~bobengelhardt/wagon%20007.jpg

Well done, sir! What's the power source and transmichigan? Top speed?


Got everything at the dump except for 1 stick of 1" square tube. Was a
lot of fun & it is very useful.

Excellent. Is that real PT plywood or just green paint on CDX?

--
Once we believe in ourselves, we can risk curiosity, wonder, spontaneous
delight, or any experience that reveals the human spirit.
--e e cummings

On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 20:50:18 -0400, Bob Engelhardt
wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:
Look at the DR mower, DoN. They're very nice. You can buy a
self-propelled model but it's just as hard to work as the human
propelled model due to its smaller wheels.

I have an older DR mower. Very much older - one of the design
parameters looks to be: it had to be built with a bandsaw, drill press &
welder. It is self propelled, but single speed (the new ones are 3F &
1R, I think!). It has large wheels (16"?) & 8hp engine! Works very
well: it will run right through weeds & berry bushes 4' high. I've cut
down a 1" tree with it (since it couldn't push it over, I had to rear it
up to expose the blade).

Bob

This sounds like the old Bachtold Brothers style. See (image
at bottom of the page):

http://employment.findlaw.com/defect.../12/04043.html

If your's looks like that, don't go pulling on the front-end


--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 20:35:38 -0400, the infamous Bob Engelhardt
scrolled the following:

I too thought the DR powerwagon prices were ridiculous, so I built my own:
http://home.comcast.net/~bobengelhardt/wagon%20007.jpg

Well done, sir! What's the power source and transmichigan? Top speed?


3-1/2hp lawnmower engine (plenty enough), transaxle from riding
lawnmower (3F, 1R); almost too fast to keep up with walking.

... Is that real PT plywood or just green paint on CDX?

CDX with Cuprinol (sp?) left over from 30 years ago before copper-based
was outlawed.



--
Nota for President

Leon Fisk wrote:
This sounds like the old Bachtold Brothers style. See (image
at bottom of the page):

http://employment.findlaw.com/defect.../12/04043.html

If your's looks like that, don't go pulling on the front-end



That's it exactly!

The blade "clutch" is a slack belt arrangement. The belt is tightened
by a lever pushing the deck away from the engine/wheels. So, yeah,
pulling on the deck, with the engine running, would be a Bad Idea.

Bob
--
Nota for President

On Thu, 18 Sep 2008 20:26:55 -0400, the infamous Bob Engelhardt
scrolled the following:

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 20:35:38 -0400, the infamous Bob Engelhardt
scrolled the following:

I too thought the DR powerwagon prices were ridiculous, so I built my own:
http://home.comcast.net/~bobengelhardt/wagon%20007.jpg

Well done, sir! What's the power source and transmichigan? Top speed?


3-1/2hp lawnmower engine (plenty enough), transaxle from riding
lawnmower (3F, 1R); almost too fast to keep up with walking.

Wow, interesting idea...


... Is that real PT plywood or just green paint on CDX?

CDX with Cuprinol (sp?) left over from 30 years ago before copper-based
was outlawed.

Don't you mean arsenic? We're still using copper, but with azole now
instead of arsenic.

--
Once we believe in ourselves, we can risk curiosity, wonder, spontaneous
delight, or any experience that reveals the human spirit.
--e e cummings

http://home.comcast.net/~bobengelhardt/wagon%20007.jpg

3-1/2hp lawnmower engine (plenty enough), transaxle from riding
lawnmower (3F, 1R); almost too fast to keep up with walking.

Did you seperated out the brake and clutch to the individual hand-
grips, or is one of them a dump release? Is the clutch set up for
"squeeze-to-disengage", or is it "hold-to-keep-moving" like a
snowblower?

Looks like a fun project, I might even have all the parts already... I
like the rear caster idea, I'd been thinking along other lines, but
yours is more compact.
--Glenn Lyford

wrote:
http://home.comcast.net/~bobengelhardt/wagon%20007.jpg

3-1/2hp lawnmower engine (plenty enough), transaxle from riding
lawnmower (3F, 1R); almost too fast to keep up with walking.

Did you seperated out the brake and clutch to the individual hand-
grips, or is one of them a dump release? Is the clutch set up for
"squeeze-to-disengage", or is it "hold-to-keep-moving" like a
snowblower?
...

There separate levers for the brake & clutch. "Dump" is another lever.
Squeeze to engage, with a latching mechanism.

Bob
--
Nota for President