Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work.

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  #91   Report Post  
Old April 14th 08, 05:40 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default $4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking

On Mon, 14 Apr 2008 02:46:56 GMT, Eregon wrote:

clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada wrote in
:

And when CEOs make billions for loosing 10s of billions of dollars you
KNOW the economy is in a HUGE world of hope.


"HOPE"? I don't THINK so!

"HURT" is much more like it!

Darn spell checker!!!!!!!
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  #92   Report Post  
Old April 14th 08, 05:42 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default $4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking

On Sun, 13 Apr 2008 19:37:38 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Sun, 13 Apr 2008 11:56:54 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm,
clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada quickly quoth:

On Sun, 13 Apr 2008 05:33:50 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Fri, 11 Apr 2008 21:49:13 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm,
clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada quickly quoth:


Even our highways are going into private hands - along with airports,
etc etc.

How is that working out for y'all?

Not well.
Deregulated electricity and gas gets all the swindlers into high
gear.
The
privatized highways (electronic toll) are billing vehicles that have
never been on them, and if your tolls are unpaid you can't get your
tags renewed. If you have a transponder the rates are reasonable. If
you don't you get hit with a no-transponder fee that makes occaisional
use expensive.


That sucks, bigtime.


The government isn't putting enough of our fuel taxes back into road
infrastructure maintenance and repairs.


Ditto here. I was on Pennsyltucky's tollways in '98 and they're even
worse, with much higher tolls.


At least they had enough brains not to allow our aerospace expertise
(developed at taxpayers expense) to be given away to the americans.
Second time in 50 years we stood to loose it all under a conservative
government - this time they had the balls to say NO to the USA. Canada
and the world lost the AVRO ARROW in 1958, and with that loss , the
vast majority of Canada's not inconsequential aerospace expertise.

All because the USA could not allow Canada to be or be seen as having
something better than the US.

Now the USA wanted RadarSat and full controll over the CanadArm and
it's new little brother space manipulator.


Well, good for them.


We will not be held to the role of "Hewers of wood and haulers of
water"

Not this time, anyway.


Bbbbut, you're all lumberjacks (and you're OK), aren't you?



All the lumberjacks are either east of the Ottawa valley or north of
ther 49th. The vast majority of us Canuks live south of the 49th in
central ontario.
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **
  #93   Report Post  
Old April 14th 08, 05:55 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default $4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking


"Bill" wrote in message
. 97.142...
Citizen Jimserac wrote in news:9aee4af6-228a-410b-
:

On Apr 14, 1:51 am, Gunner Asch wrote:

DINOSAUR POLITICS!

What a delightful characterization of
your position.

I will leave you with a sample of the depth of "strategy"
of our commander (sic) in chief:
"We've gotta stop them over there BEFORE they
come over here".

You don't have to be a liberal to see how STUPID
THAT is.

Citizen Jimserac


No, but you have to be a liberal to be stupid enough to make such a
statement.


How in your view is stopping them before they come over here and blow up
more stuff and kill more civilians a lack of depth in strategy?? If
someone tells me that they are going to kill my family and blow up my
house
I'm not going to wait until it happens, I'm going to make sure one way or
another it CAN'T happen.


Because there's nothing stopping them *now* from coming over here and
blowing up more stuff. And there are fewer trained people here now to stop
them. Our defensive resources are busy, over there.

Bill, the whole idea that we're "stopping them" over there, so they won't
come over here, may be the stupidist strategy idea in the history of the US.
The people we're stopping "over there" aren't the same people who would come
over here, in the first place. Fighting them over there just increases their
incentive to strike over here. And we're wasting our resources fighting
thousands of them over there, when what we really need to do is to protect
against perhaps dozens of them attacking over here. See 9/11 for reference.

--
Ed Huntress


  #94   Report Post  
Old April 14th 08, 06:12 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default $4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking

On Apr 13, 12:29*pm, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 21:56:59 -0700 (PDT), wrote:
On Apr 9, 5:27 am, Too_Many_Tools wrote:
Well it looks like we will definitely see $4 dollar gas this summer.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080408/...and;_ylt=Alg4Q....


Any thoughts as to how this will affect us HSMers in the shop?


I already find myself limiting the distance I will drive to view,
purchase and pickup machines and supplies for my shop.


TMT


Wow, $4 a gallon! - thats a really good price, where can I get some? -
here in OZ *its $5.30 a gallon, and climbing. Predicted to be $5.67 by
end of next week - something to do with the price of crude in
Singapore going up.) *Must be those pesky liberals again, making life
difficult for you guys...


(Gunner will respond with "proof" that this is so....)


Andrew VK3BFA.


Lefties will of course blame this on Bush.

Gunner

"[L]iberals are afraid to state what they truly believe in, for to do so
would result in even less votes than they currently receive. Their
methodology is to lie about their real agenda in the hopes of regaining
power, at which point they will do whatever they damn well please. The
problem is they have concealed and obfuscated for so long that, as a group,
they themselves are no longer sure of their goals. They are a collection of
wild-eyed splinter groups, all holding a grab-bag of dreams and wishes. Some
want a Socialist, secular-humanist state, others the repeal of the Second
Amendment. Some want same sex/different species marriage, others want voting
rights for trees, fish, coal and bugs. Some want cradle to grave care and
complete subservience to the government nanny state, others want a culture
that walks in lockstep and speaks only with intonations of political
correctness. I view the American liberals in much the same way I view the
competing factions of Islamic
fundamentalists. The latter hate each other to the core, and only join
forces to attack the US or Israel. The former hate themselves to the core,
and only join forces to attack George Bush and conservatives." --Ron Marr- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


And who is the current President?

If he won't take responsibility, let a Democrat do the job who
will. ;)

TMT
  #95   Report Post  
Old April 14th 08, 06:13 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default $4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking

On Apr 13, 12:33*pm, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Sun, 13 Apr 2008 16:12:20 GMT, Eregon wrote:
Too_Many_Tools wrote in news:1527e5cd-f350-40f7-
:


Expensive fuel causes everything to become more expensive.


You can thank the various governments (state & federal) for keeping it as
low as it has been for the past half-century. After all, they COULD have
imposed the high taxes that are common in Europe.


I suspect we are at the beginning of a extended period of
hyperinflation.


A repeat of the late 70's?


Closer to the early '80s when the question "How do the folks in Detroit get
15 adults into a VW Beetle?" was answered by "Easy - tell them it's headed
to Texas!"


Wages definitely are not rising.


Wages in many fields/areas were already hyperinflated.


This is/was the cause of much of the "Outsourcing" and the "Offshore
Relocation" mania of the last 2 decades that saw Union jobs replaced by
non-Union jobs.


When burger-flippers expect $10+ /hr. to ask "Do you want fries with
that?" you should already know that the economy is in a World of Hurt.


When Illegal Immigrants earn enough money to buy mid-range homes you should
already know that the economy is in a World of Hurt.


When Welfare pays better than working you should already know that the
economy is in a World of Hurt.


When the Democrat Party was bought by the Peoples' Republic of China over a
decade ago you should expected that the economy would be in a World of Hurt
as the US Standard of Living was brought down to PRC levels.


Well said

Gunner

"[L]iberals are afraid to state what they truly believe in, for to do so
would result in even less votes than they currently receive. Their
methodology is to lie about their real agenda in the hopes of regaining
power, at which point they will do whatever they damn well please. The
problem is they have concealed and obfuscated for so long that, as a group,
they themselves are no longer sure of their goals. They are a collection of
wild-eyed splinter groups, all holding a grab-bag of dreams and wishes. Some
want a Socialist, secular-humanist state, others the repeal of the Second
Amendment. Some want same sex/different species marriage, others want voting
rights for trees, fish, coal and bugs. Some want cradle to grave care and
complete subservience to the government nanny state, others want a culture
that walks in lockstep and speaks only with intonations of political
correctness. I view the American liberals in much the same way I view the
competing factions of Islamic
fundamentalists. The latter hate each other to the core, and only join
forces to attack the US or Israel. The former hate themselves to the core,
and only join forces to attack George Bush and conservatives." --Ron Marr- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


And what has the Republican Congress been doing for a decade or two in
the mean time?

TMT


  #96   Report Post  
Old April 14th 08, 06:14 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default $4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking

On Apr 13, 5:26*pm, clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada wrote:
On Sun, 13 Apr 2008 16:12:20 GMT, Eregon wrote:
Too_Many_Tools wrote in news:1527e5cd-f350-40f7-
:


Expensive fuel causes everything to become more expensive.


You can thank the various governments (state & federal) for keeping it as
low as it has been for the past half-century. After all, they COULD have
imposed the high taxes that are common in Europe.


I suspect we are at the beginning of a extended period of
hyperinflation.


A repeat of the late 70's?


Closer to the early '80s when the question "How do the folks in Detroit get
15 adults into a VW Beetle?" was answered by "Easy - tell them it's headed
to Texas!"


Wages definitely are not rising.


Wages in many fields/areas were already hyperinflated.


This is/was the cause of much of the "Outsourcing" and the "Offshore
Relocation" mania of the last 2 decades that saw Union jobs replaced by
non-Union jobs.


When burger-flippers expect $10+ /hr. to ask "Do you want fries with
that?" you should already know that the economy is in a World of Hurt.


When Illegal Immigrants earn enough money to buy mid-range homes you should
already know that the economy is in a World of Hurt.


When Welfare pays better than working you should already know that the
economy is in a World of Hurt.


When the Democrat Party was bought by the Peoples' Republic of China over a
decade ago you should expected that the economy would be in a World of Hurt
as the US Standard of Living was brought down to PRC levels.


And when CEOs make billions for loosing 10s of billions of dollars you
KNOW the economy is in a HUGE world of hope.
When CEOs start to settle for a reasonable level of pay companies can
afford to manufacture things here again, and workers can work for an
"honest" wage, and not see the extreme difference between what they
earn PRODUCING and what CEOs earn screwing things up.
** Posted fromhttp://www.teranews.com**- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


Make that losing hundreds of billions...

You are quite correct.

TMT
  #97   Report Post  
Old April 14th 08, 06:16 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default $4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking

On Apr 13, 8:46*pm, Eregon wrote:
clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada wrote :

And when CEOs make billions for loosing 10s of billions of dollars you
KNOW the economy is in a HUGE world of hope.


"HOPE"? I don't THINK so!

"HURT" is much more like it!

When CEOs start to settle for a reasonable level of pay companies can
afford to manufacture things here again, and workers can work for an
"honest" wage, and not see the extreme difference between what they
earn PRODUCING and what CEOs earn screwing things up.


CEOs are like Doctors in that they have to make all of their money in a
very short period.

CEOs are unlike Doctors in that they don't have irrationally-high Liability
Insurance payments that have to come out of their own pockets.

Still, a CEO is usually paid according to a Legal Contract between
him/herself and an employer. These contracts often have "Performance"
clauses based NOT on the profitability of the company but upon the revenues
and/or stock performance of the company.

The best-known high-dollar payouts have been the result of a CEO's firing
when the company had to buy-out the CEO's contract.

FWIW, most of the bitching I've seen about CEO payscales seems to come from
individuals who couldn't do a CEO's job and are simply jealous that THEY
couldn't collect that much money. evil grin


Incorrect.

If they were based on performance we would not see time and again CEOs
raping a company and taking a golden parachute worth tens/hundreds of
millions on their way out.

TMT
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Old April 14th 08, 06:17 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default $4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking

On Apr 14, 7:35*am, Citizen Jimserac wrote:
On Apr 14, 1:51 am, Gunner Asch wrote:

DINOSAUR POLITICS!

What a delightful characterization of
your position.

I will leave you with a sample of the depth of "strategy"
of our commander (sic) in chief:
"We've gotta stop them over there BEFORE they
come over here".

You don't have to be a liberal to see how STUPID
THAT is.

Citizen Jimserac


Hmmm..something that Gunner can think about as he pumps his +4 dollar
gas this summer..

TMT
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Old April 14th 08, 06:18 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default $4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking

On Apr 14, 10:25*am, Citizen Jimserac wrote:
On Apr 14, 11:01 am, Bill wrote:





Citizen Jimserac wrote in news:9aee4af6-228a-410b-
:


On Apr 14, 1:51 am, Gunner Asch wrote:


DINOSAUR POLITICS!


What a delightful characterization of
your position.


I will leave you with a sample of the depth of "strategy"
of our commander (sic) in chief:
"We've gotta stop them over there BEFORE they
come over here".


You don't have to be a liberal to see how STUPID
THAT is.


Citizen Jimserac


No, but you have to be a liberal to be stupid enough to make such a
statement.


How in your view is stopping them before they come over here and blow up
more stuff and kill more civilians a lack of depth in strategy?? *If
someone tells me that they are going to kill my family and blow up my house
I'm not going to wait until it happens, I'm going to make sure one way or
another it CAN'T happen.


Bill


BECAUSE WITH OUR OPEN BORDERS AND PORTS...
THEY'RE ALREADY HERE. * OBVIOUS.

Citizen Jimserac- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


Correct.

And those open borders are because of Bush.

TMT
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Old April 14th 08, 06:20 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default $4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking

On Apr 14, 9:01*am, Bill wrote:
Citizen Jimserac wrote in news:9aee4af6-228a-410b-
:





On Apr 14, 1:51 am, Gunner Asch wrote:


DINOSAUR POLITICS!


What a delightful characterization of
your position.


I will leave you with a sample of the depth of "strategy"
of our commander (sic) in chief:
"We've gotta stop them over there BEFORE they
come over here".


You don't have to be a liberal to see how STUPID
THAT is.


Citizen Jimserac


No, but you have to be a liberal to be stupid enough to make such a
statement.

How in your view is stopping them before they come over here and blow up
more stuff and kill more civilians a lack of depth in strategy?? *If
someone tells me that they are going to kill my family and blow up my house
I'm not going to wait until it happens, I'm going to make sure one way or
another it CAN'T happen.

Bill- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


So Bill...could you explain to us why our borders are wide open to
illegal aliens and terrorists because of Bush?

Take all the white space you need.

TMT


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