I'm doing some brass model building and the book that I am using as a
guide (by Gerald Wingrove) mentions hard and soft solder. What am I
looking for as far as differences? I suspect the "hard" solder has a
higher melting point (silver solder???) than the soft solder. The stuff
that I got at Radio Shack has this on the label:

Standard Rosin-Core Solder
60/40 (does this mean 60% lead/40% tin?)
..062 dia
8 oz.

I suppose that this is more a "soft" solder. What specs should I look
for in a "hard" solder.

Sorry for all the dumba** questions, but I gotta get this figured out.

Thanks

Mike

Hi, Mike.
Looks like you have all the correct answers, already.

The rosin core solder is really meant for electrical/electronic
assembly. Electronic components normally are coated with a thin solder
coat during manufacture, so when the user solders, the flux doesn't
have much work to do in cleaning the work.

I think you are wanting to solder brass that does not have a solder
coating. In this case, the flux has a really hard job of cleaning all
the surface of the brass. Oil from your hands, dust in the air, cooking
fumes and who knows what else, have put a very thin layer of
contanimation on your brass. The flux you use will have to dissolve
this contanimation and move it away from the solder, as you apply heat.
Solder will not adhere to the brass where any contanimation is living.

I think you need to find some acid core solder. When this is heated,
the flux decomposes into an acid that eats away the contanimation layer
and lets the solder make contact with the freshly exposed brass
surface. This type of solder used to be available in hardware plumbing
sections. Plumbing now is forced to use lead-free solder, so I don't
know if the flux is still acid or not. The lead-free solder will also
work for your "hard solder" needs.

In all cases, be prepared to wash your project with hot soap and water
and then rinse will. Any acid flux left on the brass will still be
active and will eventually turn the brass to a green color.

Are you using a soldering iron to make the joints for your project? The
hard solder will require a higher temperature than lead/tin solder.
Perhaps 40-50 degrees hotter. Depends on the solder. Your iron may not
be up to the job if it is designed for lead/tin solder.

Good luck on your project. Let us know how it works for you and what
you learn along the way!

Paul in Redmond, OR
mj wrote:
I'm doing some brass model building and the book that I am using as a
guide (by Gerald Wingrove) mentions hard and soft solder. What am I
looking for as far as differences? I suspect the "hard" solder has a
higher melting point (silver solder???) than the soft solder. The stuff
that I got at Radio Shack has this on the label:

Standard Rosin-Core Solder
60/40 (does this mean 60% lead/40% tin?)
.062 dia
8 oz.

I suppose that this is more a "soft" solder. What specs should I look
for in a "hard" solder.

Sorry for all the dumba** questions, but I gotta get this figured out.

Thanks

Mike

[Both the types Paul mentions in his reply below are actually variants of
soft solder, although one melts slightly above the other. While these can
work on brass to some extent, the joints will be weaker than those made with
hard solder. The melting points of these soft solders are all well under
800F, although there are intermediate types that will require hotter
temperatures. True hard solder is much different; it's also called silver
solder, (not to be confused with "silver bearing" solder which contains a
small amount of silver) and melts at temperatures ranging from ~1240 - 1365F
although the flow points are somewhat higher. Real silver solder is mostly
silver, and it's used by jewelers to make invisible joints in silver rings,
etc. (They also use gold solder, which is similar but based on gold
instead). Silver solder will work with brass, steel, copper and some (but
not all) other metals. It's too hot to melt with a soldering iron; you need
a torch to use it effectively. It's also important to have everything clean,
and to make the joints fit closely without any gaps, which this type of
solder won't fill. Use white paste flux (a different type than for soft
soldering) Handi-flux is one popular brand; your local welding store will
usually have some flux that will work - ask for "silver brazing" flux. To
get silver solder, look for a jeweler's supply company like Rio Grande,
Indian Jeweler's Supply, Alpha supply, etc.]

Andrew Werby
www.unitedartworks.com


wrote in message
oups.com...
Hi, Mike.
Looks like you have all the correct answers, already.

The rosin core solder is really meant for electrical/electronic
assembly. Electronic components normally are coated with a thin solder
coat during manufacture, so when the user solders, the flux doesn't
have much work to do in cleaning the work.

I think you are wanting to solder brass that does not have a solder
coating. In this case, the flux has a really hard job of cleaning all
the surface of the brass. Oil from your hands, dust in the air, cooking
fumes and who knows what else, have put a very thin layer of
contanimation on your brass. The flux you use will have to dissolve
this contanimation and move it away from the solder, as you apply heat.
Solder will not adhere to the brass where any contanimation is living.

I think you need to find some acid core solder. When this is heated,
the flux decomposes into an acid that eats away the contanimation layer
and lets the solder make contact with the freshly exposed brass
surface. This type of solder used to be available in hardware plumbing
sections. Plumbing now is forced to use lead-free solder, so I don't
know if the flux is still acid or not. The lead-free solder will also
work for your "hard solder" needs.

In all cases, be prepared to wash your project with hot soap and water
and then rinse will. Any acid flux left on the brass will still be
active and will eventually turn the brass to a green color.

Are you using a soldering iron to make the joints for your project? The
hard solder will require a higher temperature than lead/tin solder.
Perhaps 40-50 degrees hotter. Depends on the solder. Your iron may not
be up to the job if it is designed for lead/tin solder.

Good luck on your project. Let us know how it works for you and what
you learn along the way!

Paul in Redmond, OR
mj wrote:
I'm doing some brass model building and the book that I am using as a
guide (by Gerald Wingrove) mentions hard and soft solder. What am I
looking for as far as differences? I suspect the "hard" solder has a
higher melting point (silver solder???) than the soft solder. The stuff
that I got at Radio Shack has this on the label:

Standard Rosin-Core Solder
60/40 (does this mean 60% lead/40% tin?)
.062 dia
8 oz.

I suppose that this is more a "soft" solder. What specs should I look
for in a "hard" solder.

Sorry for all the dumba** questions, but I gotta get this figured out.

Thanks

Mike

Hi Paul,
I should have mentioned the tools...

For the most part, I am using a butane soldering torch. This one from
Micromark is pretty close to mine:

http://www.ares-server.com/Ares/Ares...oduct&ID=82559

I also have a mini torch that fits on the end of a propane bottle. I
don't use that one much because the butane one is a lot handier with
the auto light feature.

For whatever it is worth, I am using flux with the rosin core solder.

So..if I am reading this right, the solder that plumbers use for
soldering copper pipe is a "hard" solder, correct? Interesting. I more
pictured those sticks of silver solder as a hard solder.

Once I solder something with a "hard" solder, can I go back and add a
part by "soft" soldering it without the previous part coming loose
since I should use less heat with soft solder?

Take a look at my website for what I have gotten done so far on my
first model. Click on the pic of the mini-lathe on the homepage and
then the trailer on the next page:

www.angelfire.com/sd2/82crewcab/index.html

Mike

Hi Andrew,
I know what you are talking about for the silver solder. I used to get
this stuff for my dad at his radiator repair shop (many years ago). It
came in strips something like 6" long, 1/8" wide and maybe 1/16" or so
thick. Will my little butane torch melt this stuff? What about my
propane mini-torch? Or is this something for an O-X setup?

I am building the hitch for my model trailer. It is going to be about
10 pieces in the area of the size of a quarter. I tried milling this
out of a solid chunk of brass, but my experience level is not up to
that task. Too many cuts and angles. I am now going to try to mill the
main pieces out of flat brass and then silver solder the main pieces
together (four pieces). I will then use a soft solder as mentioned for
the detail pieces. If I get some time tonite, I'll post a picture of
the hitch on my website.

Strength is not an issue as this will be a static display model.

Thanks for all the advice so far!

Mike

The jewelers are the kings of solder, and that is where I have heard a
lot of references to hard and soft solder. They will use different
temperature solder to assemble complex pieces. They start with the
higher temperature solder, and finish with the lower temperature solder.
This reduces the risk that soldering one piece unsolders a piece
soldered earlier. In the extreme case they might weld some parts, which
is even higher temperature.

Hard and soft refer to melting temperature, as I understand it. The
various alloys have different melting points. The references below seem
to equate soft soldering to tin-lead, and hard soldering to silver
soldering.

http://www.rings-things.com/solder.htm

http://www.bhi.co.uk/hints/solder.htm

http://shorinternational.com/Solders.htm

http://www.fly-imaa.org/imaa/hfartic.../v11-1-48.html

http://www.lapidaryjournal.com/tech/1298tech.cfm

Note the the difference between soldering and brazing is the
temperature. The American Welding Society considers anything over 850 F
to be brazing, but not everyone adheres to that definition.

http://www.tinmantech.com/html/faq__...dering__te.php

Richard




mj wrote:

Hi Paul,
I should have mentioned the tools...

For the most part, I am using a butane soldering torch. This one from
Micromark is pretty close to mine:

http://www.ares-server.com/Ares/Ares...oduct&ID=82559

I also have a mini torch that fits on the end of a propane bottle. I
don't use that one much because the butane one is a lot handier with
the auto light feature.

For whatever it is worth, I am using flux with the rosin core solder.

So..if I am reading this right, the solder that plumbers use for
soldering copper pipe is a "hard" solder, correct? Interesting. I more
pictured those sticks of silver solder as a hard solder.

Once I solder something with a "hard" solder, can I go back and add a
part by "soft" soldering it without the previous part coming loose
since I should use less heat with soft solder?

Take a look at my website for what I have gotten done so far on my
first model. Click on the pic of the mini-lathe on the homepage and
then the trailer on the next page:

www.angelfire.com/sd2/82crewcab/index.html

Mike



--
http://www.fergusonsculpture.com
Sculptures in copper and other metals

WOW Richard! Thanks for all the links! I browsed through them and I got
most of everything answered. It appears that my butane torch is not
going to work for hard solder. My propane torch MIGHT work, otherwise I
will have to look at switching over to MAPP or to a small Ox/Acet
setup.
Thanks everyone!
Mike

In article .com, mj
writes
WOW Richard! Thanks for all the links! I browsed through them and I got
most of everything answered. It appears that my butane torch is not
going to work for hard solder. My propane torch MIGHT work, otherwise I
will have to look at switching over to MAPP or to a small Ox/Acet
setup.

I don't know much about MAPP, but I would think that Oxy/Acetylene would
be much too aggressive for brass (especially in the small sizes you're
discussing). You're likely to see your pride and joy disappear into a
puddle. Also remember that brass is "hot-short", that is to say that it
is extremely weak when very hot.

I use a propane torch for brass soldering and find it completely
acceptable.

--
Nigel

When the only tools you have are a Bridgeport, a CNC Taig Mill, a Colchester
and assorted other stuff, every problem looks like a steam engine.

According to mj :
Hi Andrew,
I know what you are talking about for the silver solder. I used to get
this stuff for my dad at his radiator repair shop (many years ago). It
came in strips something like 6" long, 1/8" wide and maybe 1/16" or so
thick. Will my little butane torch melt this stuff? What about my
propane mini-torch? Or is this something for an O-X setup?

How big is the mini-torch? The usual propane torch is a bit on
the low side for the silver soldering which I have tried, but replacing
the tank with a tank of MAAP gas makes a big difference.

You may also wish to build a structure of fire brick under and
around the workpiece, so your heat concentrates better.

I am building the hitch for my model trailer. It is going to be about
10 pieces in the area of the size of a quarter.

Hmm ... that is small. See my suggestion below.

I tried milling this
out of a solid chunk of brass, but my experience level is not up to
that task. Too many cuts and angles. I am now going to try to mill the
main pieces out of flat brass and then silver solder the main pieces
together (four pieces). I will then use a soft solder as mentioned for
the detail pieces. If I get some time tonite, I'll post a picture of
the hitch on my website.

Hmm ... I understand that silver solders are available in
various melting points, and that the standard practice is to use the
highest melting point for the first joint, then a lower one for the
next, and so on until complete, so you don't have problems with the
previous joint slipping when you are soldering the next one.

Good Luck,
DoN.
--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

I've always called soft solder the alloy that is used for electrical and
plumbing work, it has a melting range of 400 degrees F or so depending on
the ratio of the alloys components. Hard soldering uses silver solder (or
other alloys) with a melting range much higher, like 1250 degrees F or so,
again depending on the alloys component metals.

I recommend the book 'Soldering and Brazing' by Tubal Cain. It really does
a fine job explaining the why's and how's of what you are interested in.
The best help I got from the book was how to prepare the joints to be
soldered. He shows how to make an incredibly complex model, a boiler, using
13 different heats and several melting ranges of the silver solder.

Rosin core solder is intended for electrical work. You ought to get some
rosin flux (Radio Shack has this) and use this with your rosin core solder -
make sure that the parts are clean before you solder them. The 60/40 means
60%Tin and 40% Lead.

Roger

"mj" wrote in message
ups.com...
I'm doing some brass model building and the book that I am using as a
guide (by Gerald Wingrove) mentions hard and soft solder. What am I
looking for as far as differences? I suspect the "hard" solder has a
higher melting point (silver solder???) than the soft solder. The stuff
that I got at Radio Shack has this on the label:

Standard Rosin-Core Solder
60/40 (does this mean 60% lead/40% tin?)
.062 dia
8 oz.

I suppose that this is more a "soft" solder. What specs should I look
for in a "hard" solder.

On 1 Jan 2006 12:37:05 -0800, "mj" wrote:

I'm doing some brass model building and the book that I am using as a
guide (by Gerald Wingrove) mentions hard and soft solder. What am I
looking for as far as differences? I suspect the "hard" solder has a
higher melting point (silver solder???) than the soft solder.

Right.

The stuff that I got at Radio Shack has this on the label:

Standard Rosin-Core Solder
60/40 (does this mean 60% lead/40% tin?)

No: 60 tin, 40 lead.

I suppose that this is more a "soft" solder. What specs should I look
for in a "hard" solder.

Higher silver content will wet and flow better. In a cadmium-free
alloy I'd go with at least 45% silver and preferably 56%. I like
and use cadmium-bearing alloys because they work better, and I'm
careful about fumes. My go-to for nearly all silverbrazing is Harman
Handy Easyflo 45 or something very similar. A lot of
framebuilders (bicycles) use that material.

For fine work, Brownells offers some .030 wire and thin shimstock in
a cad-free 56% silversolder that works well but it won't color match
brass well.

A middle ground is a tin-silver solder like Harris Staybrite. 96 tin
4 silver. It's technically a soft solder, melts a bit higher than
tin/lead, but it's much stronger and wets brass beautifully. It's not
as strong as a "hard" silversolder, but strong enough for many
purposes. Also easier to use. You'll have more cleanup with a hard
solder because of the higher heat (1250 to 1400 deg F) and flux.

Jewellers use silversolders varying in melting temp from "hard" to
"easy" so they can make progressive joints. They start with hard,
then go to medium so they don't melt the previous joint, and so on.
A jeweller's supply place will have those materials.

On 1 Jan 2006 14:24:21 -0800, "mj" wrote:

Hi Andrew,
I know what you are talking about for the silver solder. I used to get
this stuff for my dad at his radiator repair shop (many years ago). It
came in strips something like 6" long, 1/8" wide and maybe 1/16" or so
thick. Will my little butane torch melt this stuff? What about my
propane mini-torch? Or is this something for an O-X setup?

I am building the hitch for my model trailer. It is going to be about
10 pieces in the area of the size of a quarter.

Oops! That says oxy/acetylene and Smith Lil' Torch in big red
letters. It is capable of pinhead-size flames. You need very
localized heat to silverbraze (or even soft-solder) stuff that close
together so you can get in, make the joint, get out and quench before
the neighboring joints even knew you were there.

Butane and propane can do silversoldering, but they're so slow they
heat everything in the region at about the same rate.

I'd use silversolder shimstock. Cut out a preform with sissors, put
it between the (fluxed) pieces to be joined. Heat quickly, rapidly
playing the tiny but hot flame over the joint, until the solder
melts, then get outta there and squirt it with a spraybottle of
water. Joints like this can be nearly invisible.

I am building the hitch for my model trailer. It is going to be about
10 pieces in the area of the size of a quarter.

Oops! That says oxy/acetylene and Smith Lil' Torch in big red
letters. It is capable of pinhead-size flames. You need very
localized heat to silverbraze (or even soft-solder) stuff that close
together so you can get in, make the joint, get out and quench before
the neighboring joints even knew you were there.

Forgive the pitch, but I happen to have a Little Torch for sale, that I
never got around to putting up on eBay. It is set up for O/A with hoses and
regulators. It has only three or four of the standard tips, but it also has
a very interesting double-ended tip, (seen at
http://www.littletorch.com/tips.html) which allows very quick heating of the
joint by surrounding it with flame from two opposite points. $195 plus
shipping from Austin. I'll throw in the rest of the roll of silver solder
and the flux that I purchased for brazing stainless rod. (I ended up with a
TIG welder which was more suited for what I was trying to do.)

On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 01:08:05 +0000, Nigel Eaton
wrote:

In article .com, mj
writes
WOW Richard! Thanks for all the links! I browsed through them and I got
most of everything answered. It appears that my butane torch is not
going to work for hard solder. My propane torch MIGHT work, otherwise I
will have to look at switching over to MAPP or to a small Ox/Acet
setup.

I don't know much about MAPP, but I would think that Oxy/Acetylene would
be much too aggressive for brass (especially in the small sizes you're
discussing). You're likely to see your pride and joy disappear into a
puddle. Also remember that brass is "hot-short", that is to say that it
is extremely weak when very hot.

I use a propane torch for brass soldering and find it completely
acceptable.

The temp at which brass gets hot-short is way far too hot for
silverbrazing. If you get it that hot yer screwed anyway because
you'll have long since "burned" the flux.

O/A works very well *especially* in the small sizes being discussed.
The key is to use a small enough torch and keep the flame constantly
in motion. Propane is OK for larger jobs, but a Lil' Torch affords
the pinpoint control required for silverbrazing small stuff close
together. That's why jewellers use them.

O/A works very well *especially* in the small sizes being discussed.
The key is to use a small enough torch and keep the flame constantly
in motion. Propane is OK for larger jobs, but a Lil' Torch affords
the pinpoint control required for silverbrazing small stuff close
together. That's why jewellers use them.

Forgive the pitch, but I happen to have a "Little Torch" outfit for sale,
that I just haven't gotten around to posting on eBay. It is their 23-2003
kit set up for O/A, including the hoses and regulators for the small "MC"
acetylene cylinder. Mine includes only three or four of the standard tips,
but also a twin flame tip, which allows for very quick heating of the joint
by surrounding it with flame from two directions. (see
http://www.littletorch.com/tips.html)

I am asking $195 plus shipping from Austin, TX, and I will throw in the rest
of the roll of silver solder and flux that I purchased to braze stainless
rod. (I ended up with a TIG welder more suited for my purposes.)

email me if interested - emmo at austin.rr.com

I apologize for the double posting - especially given that it was a sales
pitch...

On 1 Jan 2006 14:24:21 -0800, "mj" wrote:

I am building the hitch for my model trailer. It is going to be about
10 pieces in the area of the size of a quarter.

Another trick I forgot to mention: Heat Fence. This is some
putty-like goop that comes in a plastic jar. I found it at a
welding store. You put dabs of that on previous joints you want to
protect while making subsequent joints. It shields them from flame
and does some quenching of conducted heat if you go in, get it done
and get out quickly enough.

Wet rags would probably work as well but the goop is easier to place.

If you plan to do more of this sort of modelbuilding, I strongly
encourage you to consider getting a Little Torch O/A setup. The
smallest tanks you can get (MC acet, R oxy) are ample because the
Little Torch uses so little gas.

http://www.littletorch.com/

The kit with tips #2 thru #6 would do everything you want. The #2 is
too small for all but the finest work, the #6 can silverbraze 3/8"
brass rod.

These little torches can silverbraze (or weld) ant antlers. Everyone
I know that has one is delighted with it.

They can also run with oxy-propane and oxy-MAPP. I've tried that,
didn't like it. I get better precision control with a smaller hotter
pinpoint O/A flame. Go in, get it done, get out and quench.

Say something, Bob Swinney!

On Mon, 02 Jan 2006 05:33:48 GMT, "Emmo" wrote:

I am building the hitch for my model trailer. It is going to be about
10 pieces in the area of the size of a quarter.

Oops! That says oxy/acetylene and Smith Lil' Torch in big red
letters. It is capable of pinhead-size flames. You need very
localized heat to silverbraze (or even soft-solder) stuff that close
together so you can get in, make the joint, get out and quench before
the neighboring joints even knew you were there.

Forgive the pitch, but I happen to have a Little Torch for sale, that I
never got around to putting up on eBay. It is set up for O/A with hoses and
regulators. It has only three or four of the standard tips, but it also has
a very interesting double-ended tip, (seen at
http://www.littletorch.com/tips.html) which allows very quick heating of the
joint by surrounding it with flame from two opposite points. $195 plus
shipping from Austin. I'll throw in the rest of the roll of silver solder
and the flux that I purchased for brazing stainless rod. (I ended up with a
TIG welder which was more suited for what I was trying to do.)

That includes regulators and tanks, right?

mj wrote:

I'm doing some brass model building and the book that I am using as a
guide (by Gerald Wingrove) mentions hard and soft solder. What am I
looking for as far as differences? I suspect the "hard" solder has a
higher melting point (silver solder???) than the soft solder.

Right. By definition, a hard solder is a solder with a melting point
above 450°C. Wellknown hard solders are silver alloys and copper alloys.

The stuff that I got at Radio Shack has this on the label:

Standard Rosin-Core Solder
60/40 (does this mean 60% lead/40% tin?)

Right. And it is a soft solder.


Nick
--
Motor Modelle // Engine Models
http://www.motor-manufaktur.de
DIY-DRO - YADRO - Eigenbau-Digitalanzeige

Hi Emmo,
No problem...I've double posted too.

The Little Torch setup looks pretty cool. It is a little more money
than I want to throw at my hobby right now (especially after buying the
mill and tools). I am going to try my butane torch and propane torch
first. I am also attempting to build a resistance soldering unit (see
my other post just before this one) that centralizes the heat even
better.

Mike

Hi Don,
Thanks for all the info on this. I gotta admit, I am surprised with all
the responses and the info/links on this. There is plenty here for me
to sort through. The Little Torch setup looks pretty cool. I am
definately putting that I my "to purchase" list. I am also attempting
to build a resistance soldering unit out of a car battery charger (I
have another thread going on this one too). This, if I ever get it to
work correctly, will put a lot of heat in one very small location.

Mr. Brown (UPS) is supposed to be here on Tuesday and Wed with the rest
of my mill stuff (123 blocks, a vise and some parallels) and my flat
brass stock for the hitch. I am hoping to get started on this later
this week or early next.

Mike

On Mon, 02 Jan 2006 06:41:15 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm, "Emmo"
quickly quoth:

I apologize for the double posting - especially given that it was a sales
pitch...

Smith should be apologizing for not having any pricing or distributor
info on their site. Buncha Maroons! (Nogo with Mozilla 1.5 or IE6)

-
The only reason I would take up exercising is || http://diversify.com
so that I could hear heavy breathing again. || Programmed Websites

Yes, it does include the regulators, but no, it does not include the tanks.

"Don Foreman" wrote in message

That includes regulators and tanks, right?

Speaking on Mapp and brazing - I just today got a small TS4000 hand Mapp torch
at HDepot. Tried it out - Mapp gass and a new design torch - venturi air input.
THe flame was blue and hot. I easily brazed alloy 15 bronze onto sheet steel scrap.
So no oxy tank - and much lower cost. Takes a little more time and at a lower heat,
but was ample.

Martin

Martin Eastburn
@ home at Lions' Lair with our computer lionslair at consolidated dot net
NRA LOH & Endowment Member
NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder



Martin H. Eastburn wrote:
There are many low temp silver solders (hard) that a propane torch and
maybe
a propane with oxygen would be just fine.

I feel that MAPP should be held to the hottest tasks - as it really uses up
the oxygen just to be a flame.

Martin
Martin Eastburn
@ home at Lions' Lair with our computer lionslair at consolidated dot net
NRA LOH & Endowment Member
NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder



DoN. Nichols wrote:

According to mj :

Hi Andrew,
I know what you are talking about for the silver solder. I used to get
this stuff for my dad at his radiator repair shop (many years ago). It
came in strips something like 6" long, 1/8" wide and maybe 1/16" or so
thick. Will my little butane torch melt this stuff? What about my
propane mini-torch? Or is this something for an O-X setup?



How big is the mini-torch? The usual propane torch is a bit on
the low side for the silver soldering which I have tried, but replacing
the tank with a tank of MAAP gas makes a big difference.

You may also wish to build a structure of fire brick under and
around the workpiece, so your heat concentrates better.


I am building the hitch for my model trailer. It is going to be about
10 pieces in the area of the size of a quarter.



Hmm ... that is small. See my suggestion below.


I tried milling this
out of a solid chunk of brass, but my experience level is not up to
that task. Too many cuts and angles. I am now going to try to mill the
main pieces out of flat brass and then silver solder the main pieces
together (four pieces). I will then use a soft solder as mentioned for
the detail pieces. If I get some time tonite, I'll post a picture of
the hitch on my website.



Hmm ... I understand that silver solders are available in
various melting points, and that the standard practice is to use the
highest melting point for the first joint, then a lower one for the
next, and so on until complete, so you don't have problems with the
previous joint slipping when you are soldering the next one.

Good Luck,
DoN.


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Another book I found reasonable is "Soldering and Brazing" by Turpin
A "M.A.P. Technical" - ISBN 0853440980 Mine has 1.95 British Pounds.

Martin Eastburn
@ home at Lions' Lair with our computer lionslair at consolidated dot net
NRA LOH & Endowment Member
NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder



Roger Jones wrote:
I've always called soft solder the alloy that is used for electrical and
plumbing work, it has a melting range of 400 degrees F or so depending on
the ratio of the alloys components. Hard soldering uses silver solder (or
other alloys) with a melting range much higher, like 1250 degrees F or so,
again depending on the alloys component metals.

I recommend the book 'Soldering and Brazing' by Tubal Cain. It really does
a fine job explaining the why's and how's of what you are interested in.
The best help I got from the book was how to prepare the joints to be
soldered. He shows how to make an incredibly complex model, a boiler, using
13 different heats and several melting ranges of the silver solder.

Rosin core solder is intended for electrical work. You ought to get some
rosin flux (Radio Shack has this) and use this with your rosin core solder -
make sure that the parts are clean before you solder them. The 60/40 means
60%Tin and 40% Lead.

Roger

"mj" wrote in message
ups.com...

I'm doing some brass model building and the book that I am using as a
guide (by Gerald Wingrove) mentions hard and soft solder. What am I
looking for as far as differences? I suspect the "hard" solder has a
higher melting point (silver solder???) than the soft solder. The stuff
that I got at Radio Shack has this on the label:

Standard Rosin-Core Solder
60/40 (does this mean 60% lead/40% tin?)
.062 dia
8 oz.

I suppose that this is more a "soft" solder. What specs should I look
for in a "hard" solder.





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