On Jan 13, 9:46*am, Kurt Ullman wrote:
In article ,
(Doug Miller) wrote:

Your post is just another example of denier dishonesty - not showing
the whole picture.

And your post is just another example of global warming proponents'
dishonesty
- puffing up the evidence that supports your position, and discounting or
ignoring the evidence that opposes it.

* Another arguement against the likelihood that GW is man-made. The
addition of the word "denier" to the people who dare have a different
opinion. *That word has a specific taint to it after being linked to
holocaust. Thus, a GW denier is pretty much the same as a holocaust
denier. Generally when the proponents of something have to resort to
such linguistic folderal, you have to worry why the concept can't stand
on its own.

--
To find that place where the rats don't race
and the phones don't ring at all.
If once, you've slept on an island.
* * Scott Kirby "If once you've slept on an island"

If you care to research my posts over the years you will see that I am
not a AGWer. I think that it is a natural phenomenon but is being
added to by man.

Harry K

So, you post to usenet, and cause the death of 100,000
electrons for every usenet post made? Think of the planet,
man!

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Clot" wrote in message
...
Stormin Mormon wrote:
It boggles the mind that so many people think that aerosol
cans, air conditioners, and buring carbon has world wide
catastrophic effect on the planet. When people learn a bit
of humility, I will start considering their moronic posts.
Mankind doesn't control the planet.


I get really frustrated when my wife, (and kids) use those
products. None of
us need them and they sure do not benefit the planet.

Thanks for proving my point.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Harry K" wrote in message
...

Which has just _what_ to do with my comment? Did I say
_anything
about those things, about AGW? Unable to read for
comprehension are
you?

Harry K

What's it called, when you double sign your posts? Double
dribble?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote
in message ...

Don't worry, premature
postification happens to all men sooner or later. ROTFLMAO

TDD

TDD

Yes, please go on and on. You are making my point,
beautifully. Write more. A lot more.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"dgk" wrote in message
...
catastrophic effect on the planet. When people learn a bit
of humility, I will start considering their moronic posts.
Mankind doesn't control the planet.


We don't? We control as much of it as we can. We've cut down
95% of
the rainforests. We've decimated animal populations until
virtually
none of them live in their historical locales. We're in the
process of
emptying the seas of life. We're destroying the coral reefs.

Need go on?

Oh, you're in for it, now. The global warming people will
come out with more usenet posts. And as you know, each
usenet post results in the death of 100,000 electrons, which
can never be replaced.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote
in message ...
dgk wrote:

We don't? We control as much of it as we can. We've cut
down 95% of
the rainforests. We've decimated animal populations until
virtually
none of them live in their historical locales. We're in
the process of
emptying the seas of life. We're destroying the coral
reefs.

Need go on?

Who is "we"? I haven't cut down the first rainforest, I've
never
seen any around here, the same with coral reefs. The last
time
there were rainforests and coral reef around here was
millions
of years ago. I don't think my Cave Hillbilly ancestors were
around here back then. As far as emptying the seas of life,
I
have never caught and eaten THAT much fish. Decimating
animal
life? The only animal in jeopardy is the goofy little
Chihuahua
sitting in my lap right now because she won't behave.

TDD

In article , Harry K wrote:
On Jan 13, 9:35=A0am, (Doug Miller) wrote:
In article .=
com, Harry K wrote:

You might mention that that ice is "first year ice", there is almost
no "old ice" left up there. In 2008 or 2009 (didn't keep the cite) a
ice breakers made it all the way to the pole.

So one year in which the North Pole is free of ice is evidence in favor of
global warming, but one year (right now) with record-breaking cold weather is
not evidence against it. Riiiiiiiight.

The eveidence of decreasing ice is not a "one year" thing. I cited
that as proof of the North Polar ice cap thinning and decreasing as
has been proven over at least a couple of decades in spite of all the
denials of the evidence.

You've apparently missed the article that's been posted several times already
in this ng -- IIRC, in this thread -- citing concern over disappearing Arctic
ice -- in 1922.

You can't have it both ways: if a short-term condition is not evidence against
global warming, then a different short-term condition is not evidence for it
either.

And you totally miss that my cite is not a 'one year thing' but proof
of what has been happening.

No, it's not. It's a cite of something that happened _one_time_.

That has never been possible before.

Cite?

Typicl denialist tactic,

Typical leftist tactic: demonize your opponents.

ask someone to prove a negative. It is you
who have to prove the positive.

Wrong. The burden of proof is on the one who makes the claim. You made the
claim, you back it up. It's not up to me to disprove your claims, it's up to
you to prove them.


Also 3 common freighters made the trip West to East
across the top of Russia without the aid of ice breakers - again never
been possible before.

Cite? (In both cases, I don't mean cite proof that this happened -- I mean
cite proof that it's never been possible before.)

See above and study up on common logic used in debate. It is
impossibel to prove a negative.

You made the claims, you back them up. Or retract them. Your choice.

Your post is just another example of denier dishonesty - not showing
the whole picture.

And your post is just another example of global warming proponents' dishonesty
- puffing up the evidence that supports your position, and discounting or
ignoring the evidence that opposes it.

So show where I did any 'puffing up' or dishonest citing such as the
denialiest commonly do.

I already did, Harry: I pointed out that you're citing a one-time event as
"proof" of your position, but ignoring a different one-time event that
contradicts it.

In article , Harry K wrote:

If you care to research my posts over the years you will see that I am
not a AGWer. I think that it is a natural phenomenon but is being
added to by man.

Then you *are* an AGWer.

On Jan 13, 10:09*am, Harry K wrote:

Looks like another you are another who cannot distingquish between
weather and climate.

Spelling/grammar flames? *Can you not get any more juvenile.

BTW find the mispelling in the first sentence. *It was deliberate to
keep you amused.

Could I get extra credit for identifying the misspelled word in the
last paragraph as well? How about the punctuation error in the
second paragraph?

Sorry, I just can't help myself sometimes. I generally don't
bother about simple errors in Usenet postings, but this post
was like a red flag to a bull for me.

Cindy Hamilton

Harry K wrote:
On Jan 13, 7:42 am, The Daring Dufas
wrote:
Harry K wrote:
On Jan 12, 8:56 pm, The Daring Dufas
wrote:
Harry K wrote:
On Jan 12, 8:51 am, The Daring Dufas
wrote:
Harry K wrote:
On Jan 12, 5:28 am, dgk wrote:
On Mon, 11 Jan 2010 18:25:35 -0600, The Daring Dufas
wrote:
Stormin Mormon wrote:
Ahoy matey. Shiver me timbers.
Man, up north here in NY state, it's been some kind of
serious cold, also.
Good grief! We're just not used to it being so cold for
so long here in "The South". Our poor cousins down Florida
way are really having a hard time with farms for tropical
plants and animals. Conservation groups are picking up sea
turtles that wash up on the beach because they are paralyzed
by the cold. The unfortunate turtles are helpless and are
brought inside where it's warm so they can recover. The folks
who raise tropical fish have or are afraid of losing their
stock. Of course freezing weather is always bad for citrus
crops. Darn you Global Warming and you climate huggers.
TDD
I think we all learned that heat is energy. More heat in the climate
system means more energy which means more activity. That means more
extreme events - bigger storms, colder colds, hotter hots. That really
shouldn't be tough for a home repair group to understand, right?
You can argue that human activities aren't causing global warming but
it's pretty clear to most scientists that the earth IS warming. I also
don't see how people can look at what we've done to the earth and
decide that it couldn't change the climate.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
It boggles the mind that the deniers can look at what is happening at
the poles and glaciers world wide and still say there is no global
warming. When Glacier National Park once again _has_ glaciers (it
still does have some remnants of them), I will start considering their
moronic posts.
Harry K
Well Harry, when was your last trip to the polar regions? *snicker*
TDD- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
1955/56 stationed on St Lawrence Isle. Why? Granted that is not quite
the "polar regions" When was yours? Do you think that in order to
know about a region one has to go there? Something wrong with books?
The internet? Schools? Science areticles? Magazines?
Never underestimate the stupidity of a kook.
Harry K
That's why I asked, I've never been there but I spent some time in
the central equatorial Pacific when a once in a hundred year storm
hit and hurricanes were munching on Eastern Mexico and it snowed in
Los Angeles. All odd weather occurring within a 12 month period. It
followed me around, it seemed like everywhere I went, strange things
were happening to the atmosphere. Darn, I better call Art Bell's
replacement and let him know. *snicker*
Oh yea, "Internet" is capitalized but you can call it the "interweb"
and I hope you meant to write "science articles". Don't worry, premature
postification happens to all men sooner or later. ROTFLMAO
TDD
TDD- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Looks like another you are another who cannot distingquish between
weather and climate.
Spelling/grammar flames? Can you not get any more juvenile.
BTW find the mispelling in the first sentence. It was deliberate to
keep you amused.
Harry K
I do it all the time, try putting [sic] after a deliberate misspelling.
If you don't, I'll sic Art Bell on you. *snicker*

TDD- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

*snicker*??? And here I thought you couldn't get any more juvenile.
Silly me.

Harry K

Would you prefer *giggles* ? ROTFLMAO
I actually prefer the term: "sophomoric" *giggles*

TDD

Stormin Mormon wrote:
What's it called, when you double sign your posts? Double
dribble?


Usenet stuttering. *giggles*

TDD DD DD

All this global warming has addled your brain?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote
in message ...

*snicker*??? And here I thought you couldn't get any more
juvenile.
Silly me.

Harry K

Would you prefer *giggles* ? ROTFLMAO
I actually prefer the term: "sophomoric" *giggles*

TDD

Th-Th-That's O-O-Ok.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote
in message ...
Stormin Mormon wrote:
What's it called, when you double sign your posts? Double
dribble?


Usenet stuttering. *giggles*

TDD DD DD

Stormin Mormon wrote:
All this global warming has addled your brain?


I don't think it's affected my brain, I haven't tried to grab your
butt have I? See, no effect. I did try to eat Taco Belle, the tiny
black Chihuahua this morning but her daddy came home and she's in
the other room pestering him. My thumb is bigger than her whole snout.

TDD

In article ,
The Daring Dufas wrote:

I do it all the time, try putting [sic] after a deliberate misspelling.

You might want to look up the meaning of that notation, Dufas.

Smitty Two wrote:
In article ,
The Daring Dufas wrote:

I do it all the time, try putting [sic] after a deliberate misspelling.

You might want to look up the meaning of that notation, Dufas.

I have, have you? *giggles*

TDD

I wasn't sure if you were grabbing, when you came by in the
drunken stupor, and told me to get my fat a$$ out of your
way. I will admit, that I was blocking the entire doorway
and half the living room, but you didn't have to call me
fat. I mean, just cause I need an electric cable hoist to
get off the pot, doesn't mean I'm fat. Just cause I need a
license plate to cross the street, oh, dear. Now I'm going
to cry. I think I just farted, and killed the dog.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote
in message ...
Stormin Mormon wrote:
All this global warming has addled your brain?


I don't think it's affected my brain, I haven't tried to
grab your
butt have I? See, no effect. I did try to eat Taco Belle,
the tiny
black Chihuahua this morning but her daddy came home and
she's in
the other room pestering him. My thumb is bigger than her
whole snout.

TDD

In article , Malcolm Hoar wrote:
In article , Harry K wrote:

It boggles the mind that the deniers can look at what is happening at
the poles and glaciers world wide and still say there is no global
warming. When Glacier National Park once again _has_ glaciers (it
still does have some remnants of them), I will start considering their
moronic posts.

"According to the US National Snow and Ice Data Centre in Colorado, Arctic
summer sea ice has increased by 409,000 square miles, or 26 per cent, since
2007 – and even the most committed global warming activists do not dispute
this."

409,000 more square miles is a lot of freaking ice. How much do you
need?

Increase to 3rd lowest since they started keeping records in 1979. 2007
was the lowest and 2008 was 2nd lowest.

http://nsidc.org/news/press/20091005_minimumpr.html

However, a fair bit of the decreasing trend since NSIDC started tracking
this in 1979 appears to me to be due to the Atlantic Multidecadal
Oscillation. Not all of it was due to anthropogenic global warming.

- Don Klipstein )

You been whiffing that freon again, honeychile? You know
that gives you headaches in the mownin.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote
in message ...
Smitty Two wrote:
In article ,
The Daring Dufas wrote:

I do it all the time, try putting [sic] after a
deliberate misspelling.

You might want to look up the meaning of that notation,
Dufas.

I have, have you? *giggles*

TDD

Stormin Mormon wrote:
I wasn't sure if you were grabbing, when you came by in the
drunken stupor, and told me to get my fat a$$ out of your
way. I will admit, that I was blocking the entire doorway
and half the living room, but you didn't have to call me
fat. I mean, just cause I need an electric cable hoist to
get off the pot, doesn't mean I'm fat. Just cause I need a
license plate to cross the street, oh, dear. Now I'm going
to cry. I think I just farted, and killed the dog.


Believe it or not, I've never consumed an alcoholic beverage in
my life. I don't need drugs to be crazy. *giggles*

TDD

Stormin Mormon wrote:
You been whiffing that freon again, honeychile? You know
that gives you headaches in the mownin.


I think you mean "huffing", I use the whipped cream can, it
has nitrous oxide in it. *uncontrollable giggles*

TDD

The Daring Dufas wrote:
Stormin Mormon wrote:
What's it called, when you double sign your posts? Double dribble?


Usenet stuttering. *giggles*

TDD DD DD

I resemble that remark. I hang out here when watching TV, and if I have
scrolled back up to fix a typo, or add a forgotten thought, and
something in TV distracts me, sometimes my fingers add another sig and
press send before I remember I already signed it. (Never got around to
setting up an auto-sig, so I sign them manually every time....)

--
aem sends...

aemeijers wrote:
The Daring Dufas wrote:
Stormin Mormon wrote:
What's it called, when you double sign your posts? Double dribble?


Usenet stuttering. *giggles*

TDD DD DD

I resemble that remark. I hang out here when watching TV, and if I have
scrolled back up to fix a typo, or add a forgotten thought, and
something in TV distracts me, sometimes my fingers add another sig and
press send before I remember I already signed it. (Never got around to
setting up an auto-sig, so I sign them manually every time....)

--
aem sends...

I didn't believe I was going to start a monster thread with my crack
about the weather. Stranger things have happened.

TDD

In article ,
The Daring Dufas wrote:

Stormin Mormon wrote:
I wasn't sure if you were grabbing, when you came by in the
drunken stupor, and told me to get my fat a$$ out of your
way. I will admit, that I was blocking the entire doorway
and half the living room, but you didn't have to call me
fat. I mean, just cause I need an electric cable hoist to
get off the pot, doesn't mean I'm fat. Just cause I need a
license plate to cross the street, oh, dear. Now I'm going
to cry. I think I just farted, and killed the dog.


Believe it or not, I've never consumed an alcoholic beverage in
my life. I don't need drugs to be crazy. *giggles*

TDD

Some men are born crazy while some have crazy thrust upon them. Can I
assume that you are the former (g)??

--
To find that place where the rats don't race
and the phones don't ring at all.
If once, you've slept on an island.
Scott Kirby "If once you've slept on an island"

Kurt Ullman wrote:
In article ,
The Daring Dufas wrote:

Stormin Mormon wrote:
I wasn't sure if you were grabbing, when you came by in the
drunken stupor, and told me to get my fat a$$ out of your
way. I will admit, that I was blocking the entire doorway
and half the living room, but you didn't have to call me
fat. I mean, just cause I need an electric cable hoist to
get off the pot, doesn't mean I'm fat. Just cause I need a
license plate to cross the street, oh, dear. Now I'm going
to cry. I think I just farted, and killed the dog.

Believe it or not, I've never consumed an alcoholic beverage in
my life. I don't need drugs to be crazy. *giggles*

TDD

Some men are born crazy while some have crazy thrust upon them. Can I
assume that you are the former (g)??


Yep, it's definitely genetic. I come from a long line of crazies.
Ggu, my Cave Hillbilly ancestor was known for teasing dinosaurs,
he would yank their tails then run like hell. A Tyrannosaurus rex
once caught him but spit him out because Ggu had soaked his animal
skin clothing in jalapeño pepper juice.

TDD

Yes, it's possible. Some folks never see the interest in
alcohol.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote
in message ...

Believe it or not, I've never consumed an alcoholic beverage
in
my life. I don't need drugs to be crazy. *giggles*

TDD

Whiffing, stuffing, huffing, fluffing. Same general idea. As
cold as it is, wish someone would global warm us up a couple
degrees. Maybe if I go around and shoot some air
conditioners? Let some of that global warming gas out?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote
in message ...
Stormin Mormon wrote:
You been whiffing that freon again, honeychile? You know
that gives you headaches in the mownin.


I think you mean "huffing", I use the whipped cream can, it
has nitrous oxide in it. *uncontrollable giggles*

TDD

Happens more than you know.

Happens more than you know.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"aemeijers" wrote in message
...
The Daring Dufas wrote:
Stormin Mormon wrote:
What's it called, when you double sign your posts? Double
dribble?


Usenet stuttering. *giggles*

TDD DD DD

I resemble that remark. I hang out here when watching TV,
and if I have
scrolled back up to fix a typo, or add a forgotten thought,
and
something in TV distracts me, sometimes my fingers add
another sig and
press send before I remember I already signed it. (Never got
around to
setting up an auto-sig, so I sign them manually every
time....)

--
aem sends...

I could feel it, the moment I saw it. Sadly, usenet ain't
what it used to be.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote
in message ...

I didn't believe I was going to start a monster thread with
my crack
about the weather. Stranger things have happened.

TDD

"The Daring Dufas" wrote in message
...
This is supposed to be "The South", it's 15° F at 7:00 am
in Birmingham, AL. There are some valleys in the area that
I know are a lot colder. Darn Canadian imports, y'all just
had to stick that cold tongue out at us. I've heard it called
The Alberta Express. BRRRRRRRR!

TDD

You stupid dumb ****. Don't you know that nature is a balance, and for
warming to occur, cooling has to take place somewhere and in equal
proportions? Up to now, it has been a North Pole, South Pole, northern is
cooler, southern is warmer kind of thing, but the "modern" liberal
scientists of the Obama administration, following the lead of AlGore have
proven that all wrong. Ice caps melting, and Alabama becoming a new Yukon
Territory. Youse guys got any them white bears in Alabama yet? If this
keeps up and all their ice floes melt, they'll be headed to 'Bama shortly,
all with an Obama/ACORN bumper sticker on their butts.

Go figger.

Steve ;-)

"The Daring Dufas" wrote in message
...
The Daring Dufas wrote:
This is supposed to be "The South", it's 15° F at 7:00 am
in Birmingham, AL. There are some valleys in the area that
I know are a lot colder. Darn Canadian imports, y'all just
had to stick that cold tongue out at us. I've heard it called
The Alberta Express. BRRRRRRRR!

TDD

Darn it! It's 15°F again at 7:00am and it's making it hard to
work because this "Climate Change" is making all my joints and
every other old injury hurt like a futher mucker. It's messing
with my circulation and I don't like it! I even have to be extra
careful when I fuel up the van because of the static electricity.
GERRRRRRR! , BURRRRRRR! , Shiver!, Creak! and Bitch a lot!

TDD

I got back today from a Mexican Riviera Princess Cruise. RIGHT AFTER we
turned the corner at Cabo San Lucas at the little rock bridge there, we were
hit in the face with a cool north wind. It was terrible. Weather in Mexico
was in the seventies, and on the trip from Cabo to LA, it must have gotten
down in the fifties. All the whales looked like they were having a good
time in the ocean, and all the whales in the ship's pools didn't seem
affected by the cold wind either.

It was ruthless.

Steve

"dgk" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 11 Jan 2010 18:25:35 -0600, The Daring Dufas
wrote:

Stormin Mormon wrote:
Ahoy matey. Shiver me timbers.

Man, up north here in NY state, it's been some kind of
serious cold, also.


Good grief! We're just not used to it being so cold for
so long here in "The South". Our poor cousins down Florida
way are really having a hard time with farms for tropical
plants and animals. Conservation groups are picking up sea
turtles that wash up on the beach because they are paralyzed
by the cold. The unfortunate turtles are helpless and are
brought inside where it's warm so they can recover. The folks
who raise tropical fish have or are afraid of losing their
stock. Of course freezing weather is always bad for citrus
crops. Darn you Global Warming and you climate huggers.

TDD

I think we all learned that heat is energy. More heat in the climate
system means more energy which means more activity. That means more
extreme events - bigger storms, colder colds, hotter hots. That really
shouldn't be tough for a home repair group to understand, right?

You can argue that human activities aren't causing global warming but
it's pretty clear to most scientists that the earth IS warming. I also
don't see how people can look at what we've done to the earth and
decide that it couldn't change the climate.

I have found that math helps immensely. When I look at the math and the
standard, average, mean, abnormally high, and abnormally low temperatures
that have been kept for as long as they have been keeping them, we are .5
degrees warmer. I don't know about you, but if one is working milking a
government grant for global climate studies, .5 degrees is a BONANZA! WE
GET DOUBLE FUNDING FOR THE NEXT TEN YEARS. MAYBE TRIPLE IF WE COME UP WITH
SOME MATHEMATIC GYMNASTICS LIKE ALGORE!

Otherwise, it's pretty much like any other year.

Steve

Steve B wrote:
"The Daring Dufas" wrote in message
...
This is supposed to be "The South", it's 15° F at 7:00 am
in Birmingham, AL. There are some valleys in the area that
I know are a lot colder. Darn Canadian imports, y'all just
had to stick that cold tongue out at us. I've heard it called
The Alberta Express. BRRRRRRRR!

TDD

You stupid dumb ****. Don't you know that nature is a balance, and for
warming to occur, cooling has to take place somewhere and in equal
proportions? Up to now, it has been a North Pole, South Pole, northern is
cooler, southern is warmer kind of thing, but the "modern" liberal
scientists of the Obama administration, following the lead of AlGore have
proven that all wrong. Ice caps melting, and Alabama becoming a new Yukon
Territory. Youse guys got any them white bears in Alabama yet? If this
keeps up and all their ice floes melt, they'll be headed to 'Bama shortly,
all with an Obama/ACORN bumper sticker on their butts.

Go figger.

Steve ;-)



Oh I get it! It's a Yin/Yang thing, your Yin gets pushed and my Yang
gets yanked. I don't think I like getting my Yang yanked, it hurts.
A new bumper sticker: "Hey Yin, quit yanking my Yang!"

TDD

I think someone been pushing the Yin button in NY State.
Been a bit warmer than usual. Maybe Yang should quit pushing
me Yin?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote
in message ...

Oh I get it! It's a Yin/Yang thing, your Yin gets pushed and
my Yang
gets yanked. I don't think I like getting my Yang yanked, it
hurts.
A new bumper sticker: "Hey Yin, quit yanking my Yang!"

TDD

The weather guys got it right. My part of NY state has
gotten a couple inches of global warming that I have to
shovel off the driveway. And clear off the truck.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Tue, 19 Jan 2010 08:12:12 -0500, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

The weather guys got it right. My part of NY state has
gotten a couple inches of global warming that I have to
shovel off the driveway. And clear off the truck.

And things are quiet in Southern California as well.

On Jan 21, 10:27*am, dgk wrote:
On Tue, 19 Jan 2010 08:12:12 -0500, "Stormin Mormon"

wrote:
The weather guys got it right. My part of NY state has
gotten a couple inches of global warming that I have to
shovel off the driveway. And clear off the truck.

And things are quiet in Southern California as well.

Monster thread maybe; but proves people are concerned. Concerned but
not well informed maybe?

Whethr concerned enough to DO anything is anothr question.

But in some quiarters there is a sort of miasmic denial that anything
is happening to our planet's climate. Eh?

I guess we can all quote ups and downs to prove that there is/is-not
global climate change.

Some of the happenings can be explained by our ongoing human
stupidity.
e.g. cutting down (or burning off) all the trees and then wondering
why the hills slide down!
Living in earthquake zones; Haiti has 9 million people in a known one,
California has ??? in a known one, BC (Vancouver etc,.) has ???
Humans live where there are already water shortages and expect the
full range of Jacuzzis and swimming pools.
One lake or river dries up hundreds of miles away and we are back to
using the rain barrel. Oh; but it doesn't rain ..... !
Living near volcanoes!

They all sound like stupid places to live?

Humans live below normal sea level with inadequate dikes (Ask the
Dutch they've been 'recovering' land from the sea for generations)! We
put rivers and streams into pipes or viaducts and then wonder why when
it rains a bit more than usual we have floods. Duh!!!!

There won't be problems in every location every year but something
will happen, flood or drought, every 25, 50, 100 or even 300 years.
All except the last one are within one persons lifetime. My
grandfather used to talk about the San Francisco earthquake and had
'stereo-optican' pictures of it's aftermath. He passed on in the 1960s
and looks like I will around the 2015 mark? o within a couple of
lifetimes there have been enough 'events' that we all remember.

But; have had the privilege of living this long and in the one place
continuously for over 50 years. There HAS been a definite change in
our climate, along with all the newer modernities of life. Continuous
electricity, regular road snow plowing, double glazed window,
insulated homes, clothes washing machines, autos, TV, the inter-net,
self-pump gasoline, credit cards, school buses to schools with all the
facilities, automated banking, parking meters etc. etc. Good on us for
all these improvements, eh?

But even allowing for these 'conveniences' of life and increasing age,
it IS quite noticeable that the 'weather outside' is milder, less
snow, less snow shovelling, more slippery ice because temps are now
above freezing during the winter as much as they are below! Here, a
few days ago it was minus 11C (About 10 degrees F) with a wind chill
of minus 23C. Couple of days time it is fore casted to be plus 6 C
(About 42 degrees F)! And it's only the end of January at around 49
degrees North (North America).

So don't tell me the climate is not changing! I can still remember
someone getting out of a second storey bedroom window because the snow
was so deep and then digging down to the back door of the house (One
never left your snow shovel outside, them days!). Also school children
warned not to go near or touch the electric wires on the poles on
their way, by foot, to school, the snow was deep eh?

Maybe it's not yet proven beyond a shadow that ALL the change is due
to human activities/pollution? Personally I think much of it is.

And we sure are fast using up the planet's resources that were formed
into their present state over millions of years in a few short
hundreds of years; that certainly is not a 'BALANCING' of use with
nature!

Just for one stupid example; we take coal that was formed from wood
and other vegetation millions of years ago, locking up carbon and
other minerals back then and we burn it today (And since the onset of
the Industrial Revolution) to make say electrcity to make machines out
of say Aluminum, or steel, those machines then use (burn/spew-out)
other fossil products also formed millions of years ago storing among
other things energy from our sun, to propel themselves.

Don't sound too sensible to me; in a few thousand years those
'resources' could be all 'used up' and floating around in the planet's
atmosphere?

Ah yes. As someone once said 'Nothing is free'! Seems to be a basic
rule; of nature.

On Jan 21, 11:30*am, terry wrote:
On Jan 21, 10:27*am, dgk wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jan 2010 08:12:12 -0500, "Stormin Mormon"

wrote:
The weather guys got it right. My part of NY state has
gotten a couple inches of global warming that I have to
shovel off the driveway. And clear off the truck.

And things are quiet in Southern California as well.

Monster thread maybe; but proves people are concerned. Concerned but
not well informed maybe?

Whethr concerned enough to DO anything is anothr question.

But in some quiarters there is a sort of miasmic denial that anything
is happening to our planet's climate. Eh?

I guess we can all quote ups and downs to prove that there is/is-not
global climate change.

Some of the happenings can be explained by our ongoing human
stupidity.
e.g. cutting down (or burning off) all the trees and then wondering
why the hills slide down!
Living in earthquake zones; Haiti has 9 million people in a known one,
California has ??? in a known one, BC (Vancouver etc,.) has ???
Humans live where there are already water shortages and expect the
full range of Jacuzzis and swimming pools.
One lake or river dries up hundreds of miles away and we are back to
using the rain barrel. Oh; but it doesn't rain ..... !
Living near volcanoes!

They all sound like stupid places to live?

Humans live below normal sea level with inadequate dikes (Ask the
Dutch they've been 'recovering' land from the sea for generations)! We
put rivers and streams into pipes or viaducts and then wonder why when
it rains a bit more than usual we have floods. * * * Duh!!!!

There won't be problems in every location every year but something
will happen, flood or drought, every 25, 50, 100 or even 300 years.
All except the last one are within one persons lifetime. My
grandfather used to talk about the San Francisco earthquake and had
'stereo-optican' pictures of it's aftermath. He passed on in the 1960s
and looks like I will around the 2015 mark? o within a couple of
lifetimes there have been enough 'events' that we all remember.

But; have had the privilege of living this long and in the one place
continuously for over 50 years. There HAS been a definite change in
our climate, along with all the newer modernities of life. Continuous
electricity, regular road snow plowing, double glazed window,
insulated homes, clothes washing machines, autos, TV, the inter-net,
self-pump gasoline, credit cards, school buses to schools with all the
facilities, automated banking, parking meters etc. etc. Good on us for
all these improvements, eh?

But even allowing for these 'conveniences' of life and increasing age,
it IS quite noticeable that the 'weather outside' is milder, less
snow, less snow shovelling, more slippery ice because temps are now
above freezing during the winter as much as they are below! Here, a
few days ago it was minus 11C (About 10 degrees F) with a wind chill
of minus 23C. Couple of days time it is fore casted to be plus 6 C
(About 42 degrees F)! And it's only the end of January at around 49
degrees North (North America).

So don't tell me the climate is not changing! I can still remember
someone getting out of a second storey bedroom window because the snow
was so deep and then digging down to the back door of the house (One
never left your snow shovel outside, them days!). Also school children
warned not to go near or touch the electric wires on the poles on
their way, by foot, to school, the snow was deep eh?

Maybe it's not yet proven beyond a shadow that ALL the change is due
to human activities/pollution? Personally I think much of it is.

And we sure are fast using up the planet's resources that were formed
into their present state over millions of years in a few short
hundreds of years; that certainly is not a 'BALANCING' of use with
nature!

Just for one stupid example; we take coal that was formed from wood
and other vegetation millions of years ago, locking up carbon and
other minerals back then and we burn it today (And since the onset of
the Industrial Revolution) to make say electrcity to make machines out
of say Aluminum, or steel, those machines then use (burn/spew-out)
other fossil products also formed millions of years ago storing among
other things energy from our sun, to propel themselves.

Don't sound too sensible to me; in a few thousand years those
'resources' could be all 'used up' and floating around in the planet's
atmosphere?

Ah yes. As someone once said 'Nothing is free'! Seems to be a basic
rule; of nature.

It would be a shame if the threat of global warming was real.
Unfortunately the actions of those sounding the alarm have done more
to discredit it than those who don't believe in it.

Jimmie

On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 09:11:30 -0800 (PST), JIMMIE
wrote:

....
Don't sound too sensible to me; in a few thousand years those
'resources' could be all 'used up' and floating around in the planet's
atmosphere?

Ah yes. As someone once said 'Nothing is free'! Seems to be a basic
rule; of nature.

It would be a shame if the threat of global warming was real.
Unfortunately the actions of those sounding the alarm have done more
to discredit it than those who don't believe in it.

Jimmie

I think it is real. I'm not sure what actions you're talking about,
the leaked emails? I've read them; I don't see anybody lying about
anything. I've had some of my emails misinterpreted by people who
don't understand the references and that is pretty obviously what
happened with those emails.

Hopefully we manage to keep our planet hospitable for human life but
if not,we'll have proven ourselves too self-centered to be worth
caring about.

dgk wrote:

It would be a shame if the threat of global warming was real.
Unfortunately the actions of those sounding the alarm have done more
to discredit it than those who don't believe in it.

Jimmie

I think it is real. I'm not sure what actions you're talking about,
the leaked emails? I've read them; I don't see anybody lying about
anything. I've had some of my emails misinterpreted by people who
don't understand the references and that is pretty obviously what
happened with those emails.

Hopefully we manage to keep our planet hospitable for human life but
if not,we'll have proven ourselves too self-centered to be worth
caring about.

It will be far, far cheaper and easier to adapt to the changes, if any, than
to try to mitigate them.