For tying up mains leads on equipment, tight to the back of the chassis - is
the knotting process described anywhere on the www ?


--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/

In article ,
N Cook wrote:
For tying up mains leads on equipment, tight to the back of the chassis
- is the knotting process described anywhere on the www ?

Do you mean loom binding using waxed thread?

--
*Fax is stronger than fiction *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
N Cook wrote:
For tying up mains leads on equipment, tight to the back of the chassis
- is the knotting process described anywhere on the www ?


--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/


BTW, your sig sep ain't correct.

--
*Why is a boxing ring square?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

N Cook wrote:
For tying up mains leads on equipment, tight to the back of the chassis - is
the knotting process described anywhere on the www ?


It`s called a rubber band

Presuming you mean to get rid of excess length of cable when the gear is
installed. Don,t coil the cable, zigzag it.

Ron(UK)

Ron(UK) wrote:

Presuming you mean to get rid of excess length of cable when the gear is
installed. Don,t coil the cable, zigzag it.

I think what he means is something I was taught in electric shop in junior
high school (1967?) called an electrician's knot.

Here's a drawing of it:

http://www.mtechnologies.com/building/3-fig3.jpg

and a description:
http://www.mtechnologies.com/building/atoz3.htm

I've often cheated in places where the cable was already run and did not
want to cut it to tie the knot by taking a large nylon cable tie (aka
Tie-Wrap) and placing it around the wire inside the unit. Be sure
to leave some slack so that if the wire is pulled it stresses the
cable tie, not the wire.

Geoff.

You are right about coiling the wire, it will create a magnetic field.
The one exception to that rule is coax, it can be coiled.





--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel N3OWJ/4X1GM
IL Voice: (07)-7424-1667 Fax ONLY: 972-2-648-1443 U.S. Voice: 1-215-821-1838
Visit my 'blog at http://geoffstechno.livejournal.com/

Geoffrey S. Mendelson wrote:
Ron(UK) wrote:

Presuming you mean to get rid of excess length of cable when the gear is
installed. Don,t coil the cable, zigzag it.

I think what he means is something I was taught in electric shop in junior
high school (1967?) called an electrician's knot.

Here's a drawing of it:

http://www.mtechnologies.com/building/3-fig3.jpg

and a description:
http://www.mtechnologies.com/building/atoz3.htm

I've often cheated in places where the cable was already run and did not
want to cut it to tie the knot by taking a large nylon cable tie (aka
Tie-Wrap) and placing it around the wire inside the unit. Be sure
to leave some slack so that if the wire is pulled it stresses the
cable tie, not the wire.




If the OP meant to tie up the mains cable when transporting an item of
equipment, say a vcr or tv, then the usual way is to coil a good portion
of the cable closest to the appliance, then squeeze the coils together
and wind the rest of the cable around that so that it resembles a
hangmans noose. Then the outer loop of one coil is passed over the plug
top to secure it.

Or you could use a rubber band.


You are right about coiling the wire, it will create a magnetic field.
The one exception to that rule is coax, it can be coiled.


Careful now...



Ron(UK)

Ron(UK) wrote:
If the OP meant to tie up the mains cable when transporting an item of
equipment, say a vcr or tv, then the usual way is to coil a good portion
of the cable closest to the appliance, then squeeze the coils together
and wind the rest of the cable around that so that it resembles a
hangmans noose. Then the outer loop of one coil is passed over the plug
top to secure it.

That's the easiest way. I found that for items I do this with often,
such as a laptop power cord, the best thing are nylon strips with velcro
on them sold for lacing computer cables.

Geoff.
--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel N3OWJ/4X1GM
IL Voice: (07)-7424-1667 Fax ONLY: 972-2-648-1443 U.S. Voice: 1-215-821-1838
Visit my 'blog at http://geoffstechno.livejournal.com/

Geoffrey S. Mendelson wrote in message
...
Ron(UK) wrote:

Presuming you mean to get rid of excess length of cable when the gear is
installed. Don,t coil the cable, zigzag it.

I think what he means is something I was taught in electric shop in junior
high school (1967?) called an electrician's knot.

Here's a drawing of it:

http://www.mtechnologies.com/building/3-fig3.jpg

and a description:
http://www.mtechnologies.com/building/atoz3.htm

I've often cheated in places where the cable was already run and did not
want to cut it to tie the knot by taking a large nylon cable tie (aka
Tie-Wrap) and placing it around the wire inside the unit. Be sure
to leave some slack so that if the wire is pulled it stresses the
cable tie, not the wire.

Geoff.

You are right about coiling the wire, it will create a magnetic field.
The one exception to that rule is coax, it can be coiled.





--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel N3OWJ/4X1GM
IL Voice: (07)-7424-1667 Fax ONLY: 972-2-648-1443 U.S. Voice:
1-215-821-1838
Visit my 'blog at http://geoffstechno.livejournal.com/

Not that one.
For storing or just shelving unused equipment , so the mains cable was not
trailling about and no need for ties of any sort. All the cable is taken up
into the hank/knot leaving just the mains plug exposed and all tight up
against the back of the chassis.
The person who showed me years ago how to do it , went overboard.
It used to annoy me that the bunching was so close to the chassis and
bunched so tight you needed a screwdriver to open up the knot and there was
always a tight spiral of cable for 6 or so turns when undone that stayed
like that. I've long since forgotten how to do it.
I invented my own that did not deform the cable so much and easily undone
by myself or customers, but you cannot form it right up close to the
chassis.

--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/

In article ,
N Cook wrote:
Not that one. For storing or just shelving unused equipment , so the
mains cable was not trailling about and no need for ties of any sort.
All the cable is taken up into the hank/knot leaving just the mains plug
exposed and all tight up against the back of the chassis.

Ah - know what you mean now. Those old enough to remember rope washing
lines will remember they came like that too.

But plastic cable ties weren't around then. ;-)

--
*We are born naked, wet, and hungry. Then things get worse.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote in message
...
In article ,
N Cook wrote:
Not that one. For storing or just shelving unused equipment , so the
mains cable was not trailling about and no need for ties of any sort.
All the cable is taken up into the hank/knot leaving just the mains plug
exposed and all tight up against the back of the chassis.

Ah - know what you mean now. Those old enough to remember rope washing
lines will remember they came like that too.

But plastic cable ties weren't around then. ;-)

--
*We are born naked, wet, and hungry. Then things get worse.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.


The person who showed me was ex-services WW2 or 1950s sparky.
Yes really tight just like how plastic covered , corded washing lines arrive
packed, but with the plug and "noose" spiralling taken right up to the cable
entry point and not even any obvious starting point to undo it, let alone
being so tight. I remember the final move was really forcing a final loop
over or something.


--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/

N Cook wrote:


The person who showed me was ex-services WW2 or 1950s sparky.
Yes really tight just like how plastic covered , corded washing lines arrive
packed, but with the plug and "noose" spiralling taken right up to the cable
entry point and not even any obvious starting point to undo it, let alone
being so tight. I remember the final move was really forcing a final loop
over or something.



Yeah, as I said earlier, you take one loop over the plug top.

Ron(UK)

--
Lune Valley Audio
Public Address Systems
Hire Sales Maintenance
www.lunevalleyaudio.com

"N Cook" wrote in message
...
Geoffrey S. Mendelson wrote in message
...
Ron(UK) wrote:

Presuming you mean to get rid of excess length of cable when the gear
is
installed. Don,t coil the cable, zigzag it.

I think what he means is something I was taught in electric shop in
junior
high school (1967?) called an electrician's knot.

Here's a drawing of it:

http://www.mtechnologies.com/building/3-fig3.jpg

and a description:
http://www.mtechnologies.com/building/atoz3.htm

I've often cheated in places where the cable was already run and did not
want to cut it to tie the knot by taking a large nylon cable tie (aka
Tie-Wrap) and placing it around the wire inside the unit. Be sure
to leave some slack so that if the wire is pulled it stresses the
cable tie, not the wire.

Geoff.

You are right about coiling the wire, it will create a magnetic field.
The one exception to that rule is coax, it can be coiled.





--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel N3OWJ/4X1GM
IL Voice: (07)-7424-1667 Fax ONLY: 972-2-648-1443 U.S. Voice:
1-215-821-1838
Visit my 'blog at http://geoffstechno.livejournal.com/

Not that one.
For storing or just shelving unused equipment , so the mains cable was not
trailling about and no need for ties of any sort. All the cable is taken
up
into the hank/knot leaving just the mains plug exposed and all tight up
against the back of the chassis.
The person who showed me years ago how to do it , went overboard.
It used to annoy me that the bunching was so close to the chassis and
bunched so tight you needed a screwdriver to open up the knot and there
was
always a tight spiral of cable for 6 or so turns when undone that stayed
like that. I've long since forgotten how to do it.
I invented my own that did not deform the cable so much and easily undone
by myself or customers, but you cannot form it right up close to the
chassis.

--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/


Here's the one I was taught. Assuming that you are right handed. Zig-zag the
cable in your left hand, starting up close to the equipment, and making the
zig-zags about 8 inches. Make about 5 or 6 of them, which should have used
up about 1/2 to 2/3 of a 'normal' cable length. Stop zig-zagging when the
cable end, with plugtop, is away from you. Now take the remaining cable in
your right hand, holding it close to where the zig-zagged piece is hanging
out from your left fist, and take a single tightly pulled turn around the
end, winding away from yourself. As you complete that first turn, angle the
cable in towards your left hand, so that it crosses over the point where
that first turn started from. This locks the turn in place, and now you can
just go ahead and keep winding the spare cable around, feeding the
zig-zagged piece out of your fist, as you go. If you've judged it right (
years of practice ! ) You should get about 11/2 inches from the equipment
end of the zigzags, when you have about 6 or 8 inches of cable left. This
last piece of cable is formed into a squashed loop, and fed through the end
loops of the zig-zags. It is then pulled back over the zig-zag loops, and
finally, you pull on the plugtop, which pulls the last loop in nice and
tight. This method is the neatest I've ever seen, and NEVER comes undone on
its own, unlike attempts that I've seen many engineers make, to reproduce
something similar. Where they usually go wrong, is wrapping in the same
direction as they made the zig-zags, This fails to lock that first turn in
place, so the whole wrap becomes loose and sloppy. It's a lot easier to do
than describe, but if this is the standard old repairman's wrap that you
were looking for, I'm sure it will come right back to you as soon as you try
to follow this.

Arfa

"N Cook" wrote in message
...

Dave Plowman (News) wrote in message
...
In article ,
N Cook wrote:
Not that one. For storing or just shelving unused equipment , so the
mains cable was not trailling about and no need for ties of any sort.
All the cable is taken up into the hank/knot leaving just the mains
plug
exposed and all tight up against the back of the chassis.

Ah - know what you mean now. Those old enough to remember rope washing
lines will remember they came like that too.

But plastic cable ties weren't around then. ;-)

--
*We are born naked, wet, and hungry. Then things get worse.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.


The person who showed me was ex-services WW2 or 1950s sparky.
Yes really tight just like how plastic covered , corded washing lines
arrive
packed, but with the plug and "noose" spiralling taken right up to the
cable
entry point and not even any obvious starting point to undo it, let alone
being so tight. I remember the final move was really forcing a final loop
over or something.


--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/



I've sent you some pictures of a wrap in progress. I have sent them to the
same mail address that you post to this group from. If you don't get them,
mail me with a different address.

Arfa

Arfa Daily wrote in message
...

"N Cook" wrote in message
...

Dave Plowman (News) wrote in message
...
In article ,
N Cook wrote:
Not that one. For storing or just shelving unused equipment , so the
mains cable was not trailling about and no need for ties of any sort.
All the cable is taken up into the hank/knot leaving just the mains
plug
exposed and all tight up against the back of the chassis.

Ah - know what you mean now. Those old enough to remember rope washing
lines will remember they came like that too.

But plastic cable ties weren't around then. ;-)

--
*We are born naked, wet, and hungry. Then things get worse.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.


The person who showed me was ex-services WW2 or 1950s sparky.
Yes really tight just like how plastic covered , corded washing lines
arrive
packed, but with the plug and "noose" spiralling taken right up to the
cable
entry point and not even any obvious starting point to undo it, let
alone
being so tight. I remember the final move was really forcing a final
loop
over or something.


--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/



I've sent you some pictures of a wrap in progress. I have sent them to the
same mail address that you post to this group from. If you don't get them,
mail me with a different address.

Arfa



A first time for everything. Worked out how to access the email bit of
gazeta.pl, pointless looking at spam otherwise.
If it was you who uploaded 9M byte of file/s there it/they will be staying
there, no broadband here.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
--
*Why is a boxing ring square?
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -



and why is cargo send by ship and shipments by car/truck?

and why do you park on driveways and drive on parkways?

"Sofie" wrote in message
...
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
--

and why do you park on driveways and drive on parkways?


Depending on where you live, this actually makes "some" sense. You "can"
manuever in your driveway - but when you go out onto at least "some"
parkways - they're so jammed - they're more like parking lots.

"N Cook" wrote in message
...
Arfa Daily wrote in message
...

"N Cook" wrote in message
...

Dave Plowman (News) wrote in message
...
In article ,
N Cook wrote:
Not that one. For storing or just shelving unused equipment , so the
mains cable was not trailling about and no need for ties of any
sort.
All the cable is taken up into the hank/knot leaving just the mains
plug
exposed and all tight up against the back of the chassis.

Ah - know what you mean now. Those old enough to remember rope washing
lines will remember they came like that too.

But plastic cable ties weren't around then. ;-)

--
*We are born naked, wet, and hungry. Then things get worse.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.


The person who showed me was ex-services WW2 or 1950s sparky.
Yes really tight just like how plastic covered , corded washing lines
arrive
packed, but with the plug and "noose" spiralling taken right up to the
cable
entry point and not even any obvious starting point to undo it, let
alone
being so tight. I remember the final move was really forcing a final
loop
over or something.


--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/



I've sent you some pictures of a wrap in progress. I have sent them to
the
same mail address that you post to this group from. If you don't get
them,
mail me with a different address.

Arfa



A first time for everything. Worked out how to access the email bit of
gazeta.pl, pointless looking at spam otherwise.
If it was you who uploaded 9M byte of file/s there it/they will be staying
there, no broadband here.

That's a pity as the pictures showed exactly what you were asking. Just as a
matter of interest, if you are involved in commercial repairs, as you appear
to be from your postings, how on earth do you get by in this day and age of
service info only being available on-line in a majority of cases, without a
broadband connection ?? With a dialup connection to the internet, you are
walking with dinosaurs, as they say on the BBC ...

Arfa

"N Cook" wrote in message
...

For tying up mains leads on equipment, tight to the back of the chassis -
is
the knotting process described anywhere on the www ?

Search for the UL knot.

"Homer J Simpson" wrote in message
news:SgjOh.22140$__3.3034@edtnps90...

"N Cook" wrote in message
...

For tying up mains leads on equipment, tight to the back of the chassis -
is
the knotting process described anywhere on the www ?

Search for the UL knot.


If I'm reading him correctly Homey, that's not the knot (!) that he's
looking for. I sent him some pictures of the one he wants, but apparently,
no BB, so would take him about a week to d/l
9 meg of photos... I'll perhaps put the pics up on a website somewhere so
that he can see them, poor boy ... d;~}

Arfa

In article ,
Arfa Daily wrote:
If I'm reading him correctly Homey, that's not the knot (!) that he's
looking for. I sent him some pictures of the one he wants, but
apparently, no BB, so would take him about a week to d/l 9 meg of
photos... I'll perhaps put the pics up on a website somewhere so that
he can see them, poor boy ... d;~}

Still take as long to load. ;-)

--
*Change is inevitable, except from a vending machine.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Arfa Daily wrote in message
...

"Homer J Simpson" wrote in message
news:SgjOh.22140$__3.3034@edtnps90...

"N Cook" wrote in message
...

For tying up mains leads on equipment, tight to the back of the
chassis -
is
the knotting process described anywhere on the www ?

Search for the UL knot.


If I'm reading him correctly Homey, that's not the knot (!) that he's
looking for. I sent him some pictures of the one he wants, but apparently,
no BB, so would take him about a week to d/l
9 meg of photos... I'll perhaps put the pics up on a website somewhere so
that he can see them, poor boy ... d;~}

Arfa



What is the point of deliberately squandering bandwidth, oh I know, its
because you have broadband, whether filling "email" pipes or "www" pipes.
Assuming it was 9 x1Meg jpegs then 20% area reduction and 30% jpeg purity
would be far more than adequate for this graphics level purpose, so down to
about 30K each.
If anyone should want a high resolution version then that comes later, by
personal arrangement.

Why send, unsolicited/unconfirmed, to some un-notified email account fully
open to the full blast of spam, courtesy of usenet.


--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/

"N Cook" wrote in message
...
Arfa Daily wrote in message
...

"Homer J Simpson" wrote in message
news:SgjOh.22140$__3.3034@edtnps90...

"N Cook" wrote in message
...

For tying up mains leads on equipment, tight to the back of the
chassis -
is
the knotting process described anywhere on the www ?

Search for the UL knot.


If I'm reading him correctly Homey, that's not the knot (!) that he's
looking for. I sent him some pictures of the one he wants, but
apparently,
no BB, so would take him about a week to d/l
9 meg of photos... I'll perhaps put the pics up on a website somewhere so
that he can see them, poor boy ... d;~}

Arfa



What is the point of deliberately squandering bandwidth, oh I know, its
because you have broadband, whether filling "email" pipes or "www" pipes.
Assuming it was 9 x1Meg jpegs then 20% area reduction and 30% jpeg purity
would be far more than adequate for this graphics level purpose, so down
to
about 30K each.
If anyone should want a high resolution version then that comes later, by
personal arrangement.

Why send, unsolicited/unconfirmed, to some un-notified email account fully
open to the full blast of spam, courtesy of usenet.



Well pardon me for trying to help you. I won't be in the future. Your
response borders on ignorant ...

Tie your cables up with old rope if you prefer.

Arfa
--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...



Well pardon me for trying to help you. I won't be in the future. Your response
borders on ignorant ...

Tie your cables up with old rope if you prefer.

Arfa


You started out in this thread looking like a nice guy, trying to help. You sure
soiled your own image in a hurry.

Why immediately ridicule the original poster because he doesn't have or need a
high-speed internet connection? All anyone wants is that you share your pictures in
a way that is available to all, not just those with a high-speed internet, which BTW
still is NOT available everywhere. Even if everyone had a high-speed connection,
it's still inconsiderate to send images in any resolution form larger than they need
be.

Why don't you post your pictures to a site like Image Shack, which has options to
downsize them? This way everyone, not just the original poster can see what you are
talking about.

http://www.imageshack.us/

C'mon, be a good guy, there are enough jerks around here already.

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

Why send, unsolicited/unconfirmed, to some un-notified email account
fully
open to the full blast of spam, courtesy of usenet.

Well pardon me for trying to help you. I won't be in the future. Your
response borders on ignorant ...

Tie your cables up with old rope if you prefer.

Be fair. In foreign places, you sometimes have to pay by the kilobyte, so
short, small messages are preferred.

Arfa Daily wrote:
Well pardon me for trying to help you. I won't be in the future. Your
response borders on ignorant ...

IMHO, "ignorant" is emailing enormous images straight off a digital
camera when it would only take a few moments to resize them to a smaller
file. But a lot of people are ignorant of how to properly handle
digital photos, so I try not to hold it against them.

"David Brodbeck" wrote in message
t...
Arfa Daily wrote:
Well pardon me for trying to help you. I won't be in the future. Your
response borders on ignorant ...

IMHO, "ignorant" is emailing enormous images straight off a digital
camera when it would only take a few moments to resize them to a smaller
file. But a lot of people are ignorant of how to properly handle
digital photos, so I try not to hold it against them.

OK folks, here's the bottom line. His response caught me on a bad day. If
you are a regular on this group, you will know that I often go out of my way
to help anyone that has a query that I have a definite answer to, or in some
cases, what I consider to be a useful suggestion. When this person posted
his original question, it was clear that most of the American respondents,
were not quite understanding what it was that he was looking for, suggesting
various methods for strain relieving power cables, and locking them into the
unit, rather than just tidying existingly fitted cables so that nobody would
trip over them. Being from the same country and service background as this
poster, and I suspect of a similar age, I knew *exactly* the knot he was
referring to, so I posted a reply to him, attempting to describe, as best I
could, how it was done. This is not easy so, helpful little soul that I am,
I thought that I would take some pictures for him.

I then went to the trouble to post again, to tell him that I had taken some
pictures for him. Looking at the e-mail address that he had posted from,
although it did not appear to be via a UK based ISP, it never-the-less
appeared to be valid, with no obvious spam trap. However, just in case, I
made that additional post so that he knew to go and look.

Yes, you are right, I could have posted to a web based pictures site, so
that all could look, but I felt that this was a specific enough question
from the OP, that doing so would not be of any particular value to the group
as a whole.

Yes, you are right that I could also have taken the additional time to load
the pictures off the camera into some other program, and cropped them and
reduced their size, although individually, they are not actually
particularly large. However, the OP claims to be a professional repairer, so
it did not occur to me for one moment, that in this day and age, given that
almost all service information is only available for download off the 'net,
and given that many service manuals are at least several megs, and sometimes
several 10s of megs, he would not have a broadband connection for doing
this. I'm pretty sure that a town the size of Southampton does not lack for
a broadband service, unless he is located in some tiny village rural area,
some of which, I agree, still do not have a bb 'net connection service. I
took his subsequent reply - perhaps wrongly - of "no broadband here", to
mean that it was because he didn't *want* such a service, rather than that
it wasn't available.

My problem came after he replied to my efforts by asking why I was
"squandering bandwidth" - as if that actually matters in the grand scheme of
things - and sending " unsolicited mail to an un-notified e-mail account "
as though it was just unwanted spam.

Now if you think that my response to that was out of order, then that's your
opinion, and of course, you are very welcome to it. Maybe it *would* have
only taken a few more moments to resize them, but I resent you calling me
'ignorant' for not doing so. I also resent your suggestion that I do not
know how to "properly handle digital photos". Yes, I could have resized
them, but I have a busy life, and unlike many on here, a life outside of
newsgroups. As it happened, I was in a hurry when I responded to the
original query, as I had an appointment to keep, so did not have those few
moments available at that time.

All it was necessary for the OP to do, was to post a civil reply, or even
come back to me off-group, thanking me for my efforts, and stating that for
whatever reason, he did not have a broadband connection, and asking politely
if I would take the trouble to resend them, or post them elsewhere, or send
them to a different more valid e-mail address, in a smaller format. Instead,
his first reply was a very terse one, stating that if it was me that had
posted the files to him, then they were just going to stay there, and making
more references to spam.

I actually replied quite civily to that one, telling him that it was a pity
that he was not able to access them, as I was pretty sure that they showed
just what he wanted to know. I went on to ask him how he got by as a service
professional, without a bb connection. I asked this as an honest and genuine
question. The reference to "walking with dinosaurs" and the BBC, was an
in-UK tongue in cheek reference to a TV programme, and not intended to be
offensive in any way, as indicated by the winking face I put after it, and
I'm pretty sure would not have been taken as such by anyone in the UK.

So to Jim Menning, and you Mr Brodbeck, if all that makes me "not a good
guy", and one of "the jerks", then sobeit. All I did, as I always do, is
try to help the guy. All I wanted was a civil response. It was only after
the less than polite ( in my opinion ) responses that I received from the
OP, that I got annoyed.

But hey-ho. Bad day now over. Tomorrow's another day ...

Arfa

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...



So to Jim Menning, and you Mr Brodbeck, if all that makes me "not a good guy", and
one of "the jerks", then sobeit. All I did, as I always do, is try to help the
guy. All I wanted was a civil response. It was only after the less than polite ( in
my opinion ) responses that I received from the OP, that I got annoyed.

But hey-ho. Bad day now over. Tomorrow's another day ...

Arfa


I gave you the opportunity to prove you were a good guy, and not one of the jerks.

You made an unnecessary reference to "the Americans" in your response here. A more
proper statement would have been that other "well-intentioned responders" were
confused. Rather than drag nationalities into the equation, how about just clearing
up the confusion that you claim exists? Providing the pictures to a common location
could have enlightened all.

But the real bottom line here is: Did you follow up to make the pictures available?

Again, here's the challenge: Prove to us you are the "good guy" as you initially
appeared to be.

Thank you.

jim menning wrote:
"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...


So to Jim Menning, and you Mr Brodbeck, if all that makes me "not a good guy", and
one of "the jerks", then sobeit. All I did, as I always do, is try to help the
guy. All I wanted was a civil response. It was only after the less than polite ( in
my opinion ) responses that I received from the OP, that I got annoyed.

But hey-ho. Bad day now over. Tomorrow's another day ...

Arfa


I gave you the opportunity to prove you were a good guy, and not one of the jerks.

You made an unnecessary reference to "the Americans" in your response here. A more
proper statement would have been that other "well-intentioned responders" were
confused. Rather than drag nationalities into the equation, how about just clearing
up the confusion that you claim exists? Providing the pictures to a common location
could have enlightened all.

But the real bottom line here is: Did you follow up to make the pictures available?

Again, here's the challenge: Prove to us you are the "good guy" as you initially
appeared to be.

Thank you.




Aw geez, Jim. Give him a break. I know that he's responded in a
helpful manner to my requests in the past. His responses to others has
always been respectful and informative. He's a daily poster. He
apologized and explained in depth. What more do you really want?

jak

"jim menning" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...



So to Jim Menning, and you Mr Brodbeck, if all that makes me "not a good
guy", and one of "the jerks", then sobeit. All I did, as I always do, is
try to help the guy. All I wanted was a civil response. It was only after
the less than polite ( in my opinion ) responses that I received from the
OP, that I got annoyed.

But hey-ho. Bad day now over. Tomorrow's another day ...

Arfa


I gave you the opportunity to prove you were a good guy, and not one of
the jerks.

You made an unnecessary reference to "the Americans" in your response
here. A more proper statement would have been that other
"well-intentioned responders" were confused. Rather than drag
nationalities into the equation, how about just clearing up the confusion
that you claim exists? Providing the pictures to a common location could
have enlightened all.

But the real bottom line here is: Did you follow up to make the pictures
available?

Again, here's the challenge: Prove to us you are the "good guy" as you
initially appeared to be.

Thank you.


Please don't get going on the race issue. I see enough of that rubbish in
this country already.

Someone once made the observation that the UK and America are two countries
divided by a common language, and this would seem to be proving that. I
visit America frequently, and have done for many many years, so I am able to
speak and understand your variety of the language fluently, which is why I
understood that what this UK based poster was asking, was being
misunderstood, by more than one person from your side of the water.

The reference was not unnecessary to the explanation, and I can't understand
how you could possibly take offence at your countrymen being referred to by
the nationality that they are. So let's get that point totally straight,
right off. I have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING against Americans of any colour, creed,
political persuasion or whatever. I have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING against the way
that you speak the language. By making the reference in my previous posting,
I intended ABSOLUTELY NOTHING detrimental, to you, or any of your
countrymen. Are we clear on that one now ?

Here are the pictures. They are about 100k each now, and I make no apology
for that. If that is still too much to force down your piece of wet string
in less than an hour, that's not my problem.

Hope you all find it worth it. If any of this makes me not, "one of the good
guys", then I hesitate to think what you must make of some of the ones that
we get on here sometimes, who really aren't, and make a point of being
genuinely offensive ...

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...lt_320x240.jpg

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...rn_320x240.jpg

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...ce_320x240.jpg

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...ru_320x240.jpg

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...er_320x240.jpg

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...me_320x240.jpg

Arfa

"jakdedert" wrote in message
...
jim menning wrote:
"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...


So to Jim Menning, and you Mr Brodbeck, if all that makes me "not a good
guy", and one of "the jerks", then sobeit. All I did, as I always do,
is try to help the guy. All I wanted was a civil response. It was only
after the less than polite ( in my opinion ) responses that I received
from the OP, that I got annoyed.

But hey-ho. Bad day now over. Tomorrow's another day ...

Arfa


I gave you the opportunity to prove you were a good guy, and not one of
the jerks.

You made an unnecessary reference to "the Americans" in your response
here. A more proper statement would have been that other
"well-intentioned responders" were confused. Rather than drag
nationalities into the equation, how about just clearing up the confusion
that you claim exists? Providing the pictures to a common location could
have enlightened all.

But the real bottom line here is: Did you follow up to make the pictures
available?

Again, here's the challenge: Prove to us you are the "good guy" as you
initially appeared to be.

Thank you.




Aw geez, Jim. Give him a break. I know that he's responded in a helpful
manner to my requests in the past. His responses to others has always
been respectful and informative. He's a daily poster. He apologized and
explained in depth. What more do you really want?

jak


Thanks for the vote of confidence Jak. Appreciated.

Arfa

Arfa Daily wrote in message
...

"jim menning" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...





http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...lt_320x240.jpg

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...rn_320x240.jpg


http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...0place_320x240.
jpg

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...ru_320x240.jpg


http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...er_320x240.jpg

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...me_320x240.jpg

Arfa





Yes, thanks for that.
Certainly neat and a lot easier to undo than the form I was shown and neater
than the sloppy version I use, my initial lock requiring winding 2 turns and
then back over those 2 turns, so lumpy spiral rather than noose-like.

The one I was shown, the plug was right up against the mains inlet point and
the final loop went over the hanks at the extreme point away from the kit,
IIRC.
That final loop he really forced over the hanks , having to squash them all
at the same time with big fingers that he could probably use as Stilsons.
The only way to undo it, without breaking finger nails etc, was to wedge a
screw driver next that final turn to undo it all.

--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/

ps
Anyone know what any of these knots would be called?

"jakdedert" wrote in message
...
jim menning wrote:
"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...


So to Jim Menning, and you Mr Brodbeck, if all that makes me "not a good guy",
and one of "the jerks", then sobeit. All I did, as I always do, is try to help
the guy. All I wanted was a civil response. It was only after the less than
polite ( in my opinion ) responses that I received from the OP, that I got
annoyed.

But hey-ho. Bad day now over. Tomorrow's another day ...

Arfa


I gave you the opportunity to prove you were a good guy, and not one of the jerks.

You made an unnecessary reference to "the Americans" in your response here. A
more proper statement would have been that other "well-intentioned responders"
were confused. Rather than drag nationalities into the equation, how about just
clearing up the confusion that you claim exists? Providing the pictures to a
common location could have enlightened all.

But the real bottom line here is: Did you follow up to make the pictures
available?

Again, here's the challenge: Prove to us you are the "good guy" as you initially
appeared to be.

Thank you.




Aw geez, Jim. Give him a break. I know that he's responded in a helpful manner to
my requests in the past. His responses to others has always been respectful and
informative. He's a daily poster. He apologized and explained in depth. What
more do you really want?

jak


I don't feel I'm being too hard on him. I came into this thread after he had become
hostile, and I'm sure I'm not the only one who was curious to see his pictures to see
exactly what the original poster was asking about. Truthfully, I'd like to see how
his knot differs from the one I had pictured in my mind. And if so many others in
the thread were confused also, wouldn't it be helpful for him to share with all of
us? It's beneficial to all readers to see the outcome, otherwise all responses might
as well be done via email rather than even being discussed here.

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"jim menning" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...



So to Jim Menning, and you Mr Brodbeck, if all that makes me "not a good
guy", and one of "the jerks", then sobeit. All I did, as I always do, is
try to help the guy. All I wanted was a civil response. It was only after
the less than polite ( in my opinion ) responses that I received from the
OP, that I got annoyed.

But hey-ho. Bad day now over. Tomorrow's another day ...

Arfa


I gave you the opportunity to prove you were a good guy, and not one of
the jerks.

You made an unnecessary reference to "the Americans" in your response
here. A more proper statement would have been that other
"well-intentioned responders" were confused. Rather than drag
nationalities into the equation, how about just clearing up the confusion
that you claim exists? Providing the pictures to a common location could
have enlightened all.

But the real bottom line here is: Did you follow up to make the pictures
available?

Again, here's the challenge: Prove to us you are the "good guy" as you
initially appeared to be.

Thank you.


Please don't get going on the race issue. I see enough of that rubbish in
this country already.

"Race issue"? First, it was you the mentioned the nationality issue, now you bring
in theterm "race issue"? Where is all this coming from. What race issue?


Someone once made the observation that the UK and America are two countries
divided by a common language, and this would seem to be proving that. I
visit America frequently, and have done for many many years, so I am able to
speak and understand your variety of the language fluently, which is why I
understood that what this UK based poster was asking, was being
misunderstood, by more than one person from your side of the water.

The reference was not unnecessary to the explanation, and I can't understand
how you could possibly take offence at your countrymen being referred to by
the nationality that they are. So let's get that point totally straight,
right off. I have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING against Americans of any colour, creed,
political persuasion or whatever. I have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING against the way
that you speak the language. By making the reference in my previous posting,
I intended ABSOLUTELY NOTHING detrimental, to you, or any of your
countrymen. Are we clear on that one now ?

Again, it was only a couple of posters that were trying to help. Their confusion was
as helpful individuals, not as Americans. I see far too many people saying
"Americans this, Americans that" as though we are all one homogenous group. We are
like any other group, one of individuals, not all like-minded.


Here are the pictures. They are about 100k each now, and I make no apology for
that. If that is still too much to force down your piece of wet string in less than
an hour, that's not my problem.

Again a hostile tone from you. I have high-speed cable internet, not a "piece of wet
string". I think your attuitude here has not mellowed at all. You still proudly
display a chip on your shoulder.


Hope you all find it worth it. If any of this makes me not, "one of the good guys",
then I hesitate to think what you must make of some of the ones that we get on here
sometimes, who really aren't, and make a point of being genuinely offensive ...


Funny thing here. I interpreted the OP's question correctly as looking for a cord
wrapping procedure, not a "knot" as referred to in the subject line, and I had looked
for instructions for a similar kind of cord binding, although done customarily with
the plug at the far end from the equipment. I have never seen this done with the
knot at the equipment end, and so I have now been educated. And isn't thast what
this group is for? To share knowledge? It's a shame it's often times so difficult
to accomplish this.

Finally, thank you for posting the pictures to explain the mystery.

"jim menning" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"jim menning" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...



So to Jim Menning, and you Mr Brodbeck, if all that makes me "not a
good
guy", and one of "the jerks", then sobeit. All I did, as I always do,
is
try to help the guy. All I wanted was a civil response. It was only
after
the less than polite ( in my opinion ) responses that I received from
the
OP, that I got annoyed.

But hey-ho. Bad day now over. Tomorrow's another day ...

Arfa


I gave you the opportunity to prove you were a good guy, and not one of
the jerks.

You made an unnecessary reference to "the Americans" in your response
here. A more proper statement would have been that other
"well-intentioned responders" were confused. Rather than drag
nationalities into the equation, how about just clearing up the
confusion
that you claim exists? Providing the pictures to a common location
could
have enlightened all.

But the real bottom line here is: Did you follow up to make the
pictures
available?

Again, here's the challenge: Prove to us you are the "good guy" as you
initially appeared to be.

Thank you.


Please don't get going on the race issue. I see enough of that rubbish in
this country already.

"Race issue"? First, it was you the mentioned the nationality issue, now
you bring in theterm "race issue"? Where is all this coming from. What
race issue?


Someone once made the observation that the UK and America are two
countries
divided by a common language, and this would seem to be proving that. I
visit America frequently, and have done for many many years, so I am able
to
speak and understand your variety of the language fluently, which is why
I
understood that what this UK based poster was asking, was being
misunderstood, by more than one person from your side of the water.

The reference was not unnecessary to the explanation, and I can't
understand
how you could possibly take offence at your countrymen being referred to
by
the nationality that they are. So let's get that point totally straight,
right off. I have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING against Americans of any colour,
creed,
political persuasion or whatever. I have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING against the
way
that you speak the language. By making the reference in my previous
posting,
I intended ABSOLUTELY NOTHING detrimental, to you, or any of your
countrymen. Are we clear on that one now ?

Again, it was only a couple of posters that were trying to help. Their
confusion was as helpful individuals, not as Americans. I see far too
many people saying "Americans this, Americans that" as though we are all
one homogenous group. We are like any other group, one of individuals,
not all like-minded.


Here are the pictures. They are about 100k each now, and I make no
apology for that. If that is still too much to force down your piece of
wet string in less than an hour, that's not my problem.

Again a hostile tone from you. I have high-speed cable internet, not a
"piece of wet string". I think your attuitude here has not mellowed at
all. You still proudly display a chip on your shoulder.


Hope you all find it worth it. If any of this makes me not, "one of the
good guys", then I hesitate to think what you must make of some of the
ones that we get on here sometimes, who really aren't, and make a point
of being genuinely offensive ...


Funny thing here. I interpreted the OP's question correctly as looking
for a cord wrapping procedure, not a "knot" as referred to in the subject
line, and I had looked for instructions for a similar kind of cord
binding, although done customarily with the plug at the far end from the
equipment. I have never seen this done with the knot at the equipment
end, and so I have now been educated. And isn't thast what this group is
for? To share knowledge? It's a shame it's often times so difficult to
accomplish this.

Finally, thank you for posting the pictures to explain the mystery.


I am not going to reply further to your many points - which I think ideally
illustrate my contention of two countries separated by a common language -
as I see no benefit to the group in pursuing it further by so doing. The
pictures are now posted, in a form that you approve of, and you have now
viewed them, and seem happy to have done so, so that's good. The OP has now
viewed them also, and commented favourably.

I would point out that I have posted on this group for many years, and have
I believe, amply demonstrated my credentials over that time, as being what
*I* would consider to be one of the "good guys".

I have never actually seen you posting on here before, and know nothing
about you, so you will understand that I feel no obligation to justify
myself to you, further than I already have. That said, if you are new to
this group, I have no desire to get off on the wrong foot with you, and if
my mildly sarcastic banter has offended your - or indeed anyone elses -
sensibilities in some way, for that, at least, I apologise.

Arfa

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...


I have never actually seen you posting on here before, and know nothing about you,
so you will understand that I feel no obligation to justify myself to you, further
than I already have. That said, if you are new to this group, I have no desire to
get off on the wrong foot with you, and if my mildly sarcastic banter has offended
your - or indeed anyone elses - sensibilities in some way, for that, at least, I
apologise.

Arfa


Thanks for the pictures, explanations, and apology. I'd like to apologize to you
also for the way this turned into an argument from what should simply have been a
more cooperative and tolerant effort from both sides.

jim menning

"Not"

Sorry, couldn't help that one. :-)

WT


"N Cook" wrote in message
...
ps
Anyone know what any of these knots would be called?

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...lt_320x240.jpg

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...rn_320x240.jpg


http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...ace_320x240.jp

g

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...ru_320x240.jpg

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...er_320x240.jpg

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...me_320x240.jpg

Thanks so much for posting for the general public. I see it's a slight --
better -- modification on the technique I've used. I like the "push the loop
through" at the end rather than "push the plug through". In USA the plugs are
smaller, but still I like your method.

Thanks again,
--
John English

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

That said, if you are new to this group, I have no
desire to
get off on the wrong foot with you, and if my mildly sarcastic banter has
offended
your - or indeed anyone elses - sensibilities in some way, for that, at
least, I
apologise.

Arfa


Thanks for the pictures, explanations, and apology. I'd like to apologize
to you also for the way this turned into an argument from what should
simply have been a more cooperative and tolerant effort from both sides.

jim menning

Well done, both.
--
John English

John E. wrote:
http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...lt_320x240.jpg

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...rn_320x240.jpg


http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...ace_320x240.jp

g

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...ru_320x240.jpg

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...er_320x240.jpg

http://www.nbndesign.com/stuff/Wirew...me_320x240.jpg

Thanks so much for posting for the general public. I see it's a slight --
better -- modification on the technique I've used. I like the "push the loop
through" at the end rather than "push the plug through". In USA the plugs are
smaller, but still I like your method.

Thanks again,
That's the one I use as well, both for wrapping power cords and for
compact storage of many types of cables. It makes it simple to merely
grab both ends of the cord and just pull, in order to unwrap.

Lately, for certain cables that get wrapped and unwrapped frequently,
I've taken to doubling the cord back on itself, as many times as is
convenient, and tying a simple overhand knot in the entire loop. Much
quicker than the above, and doesn't leave that springy coil at the end.

jak